EPT2019 - 2020 Football Thread - Page 31
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28747 Posts
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KobraKay
Portugal4254 Posts
On August 18 2019 21:40 sharkie wrote: I am judging it neither by what goes in this topic or by the media. I talk to English fans, maybe you should do the same. English refs are all crap. No idea how Portugese ones are but to say English ones are good lol. Compared to portuguese ones, they are a godsend xD yet we have had several in international competitions. Nevertheless, I still dont agree with such a level of review by VAR. | ||
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Man City vs West Ham - Sterling flagged offside for the width of his T Shirt being offside Chelsea vs Liverpool Super Cup - Tammy Abraham is brought down by the keeper, ref gives pen, turns out there is very minimal contact and due to the VAR not having the right angle it couldn't do anything. Yet the tv broadcasters around the world had the right angle and confirmed it was very minimal contact. Chelsea vs Liverpool Penalties - The final penalty Adrian clearly has no feet on the line when he saves the final kick Wolves vs Leicester - Dendonker jumps up to head ball, misses it brushes off his arm, lands at his player he shoots and scores, goal ruled out for handball Chelsea vs Liverpool (again) - Ball is in the air, bicycle kick happens and it strikes Christensen on the arms, no penalty given. I mean that is just this season xD thats without that crazy penalty being given in the champs league final in which they confirmed in premier league like i said they would not give that as a pen via VAR. Grey area's in football need to be made black or white to completely fix VAR and the game. I agree it helps, no doubt but it also can cause even more questions. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18590 Posts
On August 18 2019 22:26 Pandemona wrote: Well they don't go down to 0 that is for sure, of course it helps but that wasn't the original point i made, i said the system isn't working perfectly and it isn't no where near perfect either. We have had this season 3 games where decisions being made are so very borderline or straight up different between games its crazy. Man City vs West Ham - Sterling flagged offside for the width of his T Shirt being offside Chelsea vs Liverpool Super Cup - Tammy Abraham is brought down by the keeper, ref gives pen, turns out there is very minimal contact and due to the VAR not having the right angle it couldn't do anything. Yet the tv broadcasters around the world had the right angle and confirmed it was very minimal contact. Chelsea vs Liverpool Penalties - The final penalty Adrian clearly has no feet on the line when he saves the final kick Wolves vs Leicester - Dendonker jumps up to head ball, misses it brushes off his arm, lands at his player he shoots and scores, goal ruled out for handball Chelsea vs Liverpool (again) - Ball is in the air, bicycle kick happens and it strikes Christensen on the arms, no penalty given. I mean that is just this season xD thats without that crazy penalty being given in the champs league final in which they confirmed in premier league like i said they would not give that as a pen via VAR. Grey area's in football need to be made black or white to completely fix VAR and the game. I agree it helps, no doubt but it also can cause even more questions. Out of these incidents, only the Sterling was really stupid. Wolves one was correct, even their manager was fine with the decision. So really just one stupid decision, How about you also list the mistakes VAR saved so far? Pretty sure the list is way longer than your list. Its always easy to only show one side of the argument | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
But lets see what happens throughout the rest of the season. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18590 Posts
On August 18 2019 22:49 Pandemona wrote: VAR in England has been used a couple of times in which it has caused more debate than it has fixed the decisions. I wouldn't be having this conversation otherwise would i lol. Season is only 2 matchdays old! But lets see what happens throughout the rest of the season. It's already fixed yesterday's match: the goal was ruled out correctly. That's already 2 correct decisions (the wolves one too) to your 1 bad one (the sterling). And I dont bother to look at the other matches. So even if thats all - thats already 100% more correct decisions than bad ones. And the season is only 2 matchdays old! Wow VAR really is the best VAR mistakes spark debates, VAR corrections dont, if a goal is ruled out correctly no one will ever talk about it. Thats the only reason we talk about VAR. Because people like to whine about stuff. Regard every topic humanity has ever talked about. The naysayers have always been louder than the supporters. We would still be working with stone tools if we hadnt progressed regardless of the negativity | ||
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Faruko
Chile34173 Posts
but that's not the issue with var tho, the problem is with the humans behind the game i would say that a big problem is that some situation look way different in high speed than in the replay, which might lead to questionable decisions, but more often than not is not about the decision itself being wrong but the magnitude of the decision (like a red card instead of a yellow because that slight touch at 20-30 km/h looks way harder in slow motion) | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8809 Posts
so in situations that he isnt 100% on and the significance of the call is too great, he checks var. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18590 Posts
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9771 Posts
On August 19 2019 02:23 sharkie wrote: god I will love watching chelsea this season, so lucky that they didnt lose today They seem to have no mental strength at all. Absolute fail. Maybe they need to get used to Lampard and it'll get better? | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
We were getting heavily overran in midfield with our lack of physicality. Kovacic should have came on earlier for mount!/Pulisic and go 4-3-3. They were ineffective because we couldn't control the game. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18590 Posts
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Faruko
Chile34173 Posts
while lampard/chelsea has Pedro/Giroud | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
On August 19 2019 02:53 sharkie wrote: Chelsea so far every game have been full throttle right from the start and then getting weaker. Dont blame it on the liverpool game if chelsea have done it in all 3 games. Its Lampard's fault if he forces/lets the team do that Is that any similar to how Klopp played the first season with Salah before they sorted out the defensive side? Basically play with crazy intensity for 60 or 70 minutes, hope you're up by 2 at that point and then hold onto it for your dear life for the remaining minutes. For Liverpool it sorta worked with the Mane, Salah and Firmino trio, but could be less viable if you haven't got such assets available. | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On August 18 2019 23:08 sharkie wrote: It's already fixed yesterday's match: the goal was ruled out correctly. That's already 2 correct decisions (the wolves one too) to your 1 bad one (the sterling). And I dont bother to look at the other matches. So even if thats all - thats already 100% more correct decisions than bad ones. And the season is only 2 matchdays old! Wow VAR really is the best VAR mistakes spark debates, VAR corrections dont, if a goal is ruled out correctly no one will ever talk about it. Thats the only reason we talk about VAR. Because people like to whine about stuff. Regard every topic humanity has ever talked about. The naysayers have always been louder than the supporters. We would still be working with stone tools if we hadnt progressed regardless of the negativity I have to say, hes 100% correct Pande. All of your arguments are feel arguments. What he is saying is fact. No system for officiating can be perfect. The purpose of using technology is to try to be as perfect as possible. Even if it is a 5 percent net gain in improved decisions (which its not, its significantly higher) then its worth it. Regarding the debates. Thats natural. When you have all of the additional information that the technology brings, the number of variables that go into a decision keep increasing. And naturally many will not be clear cut, debatable, subjective etc etc. And thats more of a problem with rules and their interpretation than a system that simply provides you more information to make the best decision possible. And even if that is indeed the case and you must make a controversial decision with as much information as possible rather than something based of the naked eye, particularly with the pace the game is played at now? And to repeat what he said. It is indeed true that there is no debate around the clearcut overturns because they are clear cut. If your going to debate the controversial situations you have to acknowledge the wins. What I would add is that if you dont do the above, its quite frankly a dishonest position to criticize the system from. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
On August 19 2019 02:53 sharkie wrote: Chelsea so far every game have been full throttle right from the start and then getting weaker. Dont blame it on the liverpool game if chelsea have done it in all 3 games. Its Lampard's fault if he forces/lets the team do that Well when we played Yanited and Liverpool it "worked" and we didn't die towards the end of the game. Yanited game we just switched off and went to shit lol, vs Liverpool we took them all the way to 120 minutes looking at times better than them through out the whole 120 minutes. Yesterday is the only game where we looked tired after 45 minutes. On August 20 2019 04:07 Rebs wrote: I have to say, hes 100% correct Pande. All of your arguments are feel arguments. What he is saying is fact. No system for officiating can be perfect. The purpose of using technology is to try to be as perfect as possible. Even if it is a 5 percent net gain in improved decisions (which its not, its significantly higher) then its worth it. Regarding the debates. Thats natural. When you have all of the additional information that the technology brings, the number of variables that go into a decision keep increasing. And naturally many will not be clear cut, debatable, subjective etc etc. And thats more of a problem with rules and their interpretation than a system that simply provides you more information to make the best decision possible. And even if that is indeed the case and you must make a controversial decision with as much information as possible rather than something based of the naked eye, particularly with the pace the game is played at now? And to repeat what he said. It is indeed true that there is no debate around the clearcut overturns because they are clear cut. If your going to debate the controversial situations you have to acknowledge the wins. What I would add is that if you dont do the above, its quite frankly a dishonest position to criticize the system from. I thought i was saying exactly what you just wrote....minus that it isn't a good thing to have even more grey areas than we had before because VAR ref A gives said handball and VAR ref b does not. Or the worse kinds where VAR "doesn't have the angle" to make a decision thus it stays with the on field decision. Offsides there was a post on reddit showing an image that depending on where the referee determines the ball being played denotes the offside line. ![[image loading]](https://i.redd.it/ol649tnsl7h31.jpg) | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
On August 20 2019 04:07 Rebs wrote: I have to say, hes 100% correct Pande. All of your arguments are feel arguments. What he is saying is fact. No system for officiating can be perfect. The purpose of using technology is to try to be as perfect as possible. Even if it is a 5 percent net gain in improved decisions (which its not, its significantly higher) then its worth it. Regarding the debates. Thats natural. When you have all of the additional information that the technology brings, the number of variables that go into a decision keep increasing. And naturally many will not be clear cut, debatable, subjective etc etc. And thats more of a problem with rules and their interpretation than a system that simply provides you more information to make the best decision possible. And even if that is indeed the case and you must make a controversial decision with as much information as possible rather than something based of the naked eye, particularly with the pace the game is played at now? And to repeat what he said. It is indeed true that there is no debate around the clearcut overturns because they are clear cut. If your going to debate the controversial situations you have to acknowledge the wins. What I would add is that if you dont do the above, its quite frankly a dishonest position to criticize the system from. I agree with this. I was super disappointed with VAR when it ruled out the last Man City goal for a handball, but the discussions here made me realize that ultimately the rules themselves are not always clear-cut and that VAR has done more good than bad the few times it's been used in PL. I'm also interested in the complete stats of its use in CL last year | ||
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