EPTFormula 1 Discussion - Page 124
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
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James781
3 Posts
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
On August 19 2022 09:07 James781 wrote: Alonso going to Aston so that Piastri wont have problems with teammate in Alpine. But if he want to sign contract with McLaren, Lando will destroy him 100%. ..? This is such a weird out of nowhere left-field comment. Alonso's motivation for the move has little to do with protecting Piastri. And Piastri is a new driver with zero F1 experience, he's going to get, quote, "destroyed" no matter where he goes. Ocon is no slouch either. In fact, not having the pressure of the expectations of needing to perform and beat your teammate in the first few years gives drivers more room to grow into themselves | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
On August 19 2022 17:07 Excludos wrote: Alonso's motivation for the move has little to do with protecting Piastri. And Piastri is a new driver with zero F1 experience, he's going to get, quote, "destroyed" no matter where he goes. Ocon is no slouch either. In fact, not having the pressure of the expectations of needing to perform and beat your teammate in the first few years gives drivers more room to grow into themselves Indeed. Everyone seems to forget that even drivers like Verstappen, Vettel, and others all had at least one full year at a low pressure junior team before making the jump to a bigger team. I've been seeing a lot of "oh but what about Hamilton? He jumped straight in at McLaren and competed with Alonso" but that was a different era where testing rules were completely different. Prior to starting in F1, Hamilton had likely done multiple seasons worth of kilometres in testing to get comfy with F1 cars since the rules allowed it. Piastri has done some F1 car testing with Alpine but it has always been older cars since that's all that is allowed now. He has never driven an F1 car designed under the new regulations, and the new cars are apparently a big adjustment to get used to. Given the current state of F1's media and fandom, if Piastri goes to somewhere like McLaren and gets trounced by Lando or makes high profile mistakes, he'll probably get eaten alive and attacked constantly. We all saw what happened with Albon at Red Bull when he was dumped in there as a rookie against a high performing driver. There's a good chance the same thing could happen to Piastri. And yeah, this is Alonso. Alonso only looks out for Alonso. Alonso also has a history of making bad career decisions and this seems like it has the potential to be yet another one of them. Watching him butt heads with Lawrence Stroll will be hilarious to watch from the sidelines though. | ||
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pebble444
Italy2503 Posts
here we go again; Spa is a great place to restart from the summer break | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
There's too much speculation about which seat he will get, dunno which source to trust, is there any official info about it? | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
On August 24 2022 06:43 FreakyDroid wrote: As someone who doesn't follow F2, F3 or upcoming drivers, the whole Piastri fiasco didn't sit well with me, it looked like a very unprofessional move from his side, regardless if it was premediated as some speculate or it was just an accident. In any case, expectations about his performance will be very high, which means he'll be under tremendous pressure and I hope he's got the chops to endure it all. There's too much speculation about which seat he will get, dunno which source to trust, is there any official info about it? Not sure why you think it was unprofessional of him, and not Alpine, who wanted to sideline him for two whole years after winning in F2, just so they could develop the car with Alonso instead (who they'd then promptly boot out as thanks, hence why Alonso also gave them the finger, and got out of there as soon as he could). It's all incredibly disrespectful, and they very much got the karma they deserved. Any driver is going to jump at the opportunity to actually drive in F1, rather than the vague promise of driving some years in the future. You can't just sit on your academy drivers and expect them to wait patiently for you to be ready for them, when other teams are willing to snap them up in a heartbeat. What we know is confirmed is that Alpine didn't register a contract with F1. So while Piastri might have broken his contract with Alpine Academy (and there will be court cases to determine payment in damages), as far as F1 goes, he's free to race with anyone. So even if Piastri loses the civil case, he's not forced to race for Alpine. As far as speculations go, there's no chance a freshman like him would just randomly cut off Alpine without having already signed a contract with a different team. We all know who the team is: McLaren, as they've all but officially confirmed it. What Zak, McLaren's team principal, has confirmed, is that they are looking to try to get a soft landing for Riccardo. This is why they haven't confirmed Piastri officially yet, as they want to ensure Riccardo's exit is done properly first. They don't want to do what Alpine did, and confirm Piastri is taking over Riccardo's seat, only for him to turn around and claim that he's not leaving. Who Riccardo is going to race for, or if at all, we can only guess. We don't really have any indication in any direction, other than the fact that Alpine really needs a seasoned driver, and he did really well with them before leaving last time. So that's what I would out my money on. | ||
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pebble444
Italy2503 Posts
Yes, not sure what game alpine was playing at. Why would you post on SM that you have a new driver and not even bother to call him and inform him. That’s not the way to start a new job, piastri did right to call them out. Anyway it backfired for them. Sure they might win the court case squeeze money out of him, but whatever team will take him on will pay that money out to alpine. A great driver is worth much more than a couple of millions, and to make a great driver you have to invest years and years in many young talents, because some will come through like piastri, Norris, russell, leclerc etc. but some will fall through the net. That is the point of academy drivers. You throw a bunch of money into it and hope some young star will pay dividends in the future. Quite embarrassing for alpine really too, apart from the memes. Mick Schumacher might end up driving for alpine, unless Gunter folds to Ferrari pressure and demands. They would love for him to prove himself more and have an excuse to put him in a Ferrari. Kinda hard for him to live up to his fathers name, considering how much he won and was dominant. I imagine ricciardo will take a break from F1. He seems to have lost momentum, doesn’ t and has never matched well with McLaren. He doesn’ t seem happy there either, i’ m sure he would rather a settlement. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
These things could mean literally nothing, of course. Every F1 team is forced to perform a certain number of FP sessions with non-F1 drivers, so it might just be filling a quota. If Mick isn't driving for Haas next year tho, my money is on either Williams, or no seat at all. We know Latifi isn't driving next year, but Zhou has done well enough that they are likely to be resigned, and Bottas is on a multi-year contract. Alpine has always claimed they want a seasoned driver for their second seat, to help develop the car, so chances are they wouldn't want Mick | ||
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
On August 24 2022 09:00 Excludos wrote: Not sure why you think it was unprofessional of him, and not Alpine, who wanted to sideline him for two whole years after winning in F2, just so they could develop the car with Alonso instead (who they'd then promptly boot out as thanks, hence why Alonso also gave them the finger, and got out of there as soon as he could). It's all incredibly disrespectful, and they very much got the karma they deserved. Any driver is going to jump at the opportunity to actually drive in F1, rather than the vague promise of driving some years in the future. You can't just sit on your academy drivers and expect them to wait patiently for you to be ready for them, when other teams are willing to snap them up in a heartbeat. Because he did it on twitter of all places without consulting Alpine, regardless if he had the right (legal, ethical or whatever right) to do it or not. The result of the whole fiasco is that both sides' public image was damaged to an extent. I view that as unprofessional behavior which could have been avoided. Obviously I don't know what's in the contract and who is right or wrong, its just that the way things unfolded was dumb. I read Ben Sulayem's statement that its up to CRB to decide (not sure if they have though). Even if Alpine [and I'm not claiming they were, I'm saying even if] didn't have the right to confirm his seat after Alonso's departure, he could have taken the high road and do it through proper legal channels without turning it into a drama. The result of all this is: everyone's got an opinion that's based on what they feel is right or wrong, one side is gonna side with Alpine the other with Piastri. For me it boils down to who is legally right and could this have been avoided. I think it could have been if Piastri conducted him self more professionally. Thanks for the answer though, I guess nothing is solidified yet when it comes to which seat he will get next year. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
On August 24 2022 21:31 FreakyDroid wrote: Because he did it on twitter of all places without consulting Alpine I'm confused about how you're getting this backwards. Alpine were the ones who released an official statement before consulting him, not the other way around. Imagine if tomorrow, Tesco releases a statement saying you are their newest employee. You'd immediately go "uhm..no, actually..". This is all on Alpine for acting unprofessional, not Piastri who were just reacting to the situation. They also forced his hand with this statement, because it would cause chaos among sponsors who'd think he'd be driving for Alpine, and not McLaren. He simply had to rebut it right away. Piastri's public image certainly isn't tarnished by this. In fact, most people are more hyped about him than ever due to his rather loud splash onto the scene. Alpine on the other hand has lost a lot of respect with most fans at this point. What they did was just not ok. You can't just randomly go around claiming drivers who haven't been signed yet (Remember, Piastri has never had any contract with Alpine F1 team, only Alpine Academy, who is a separate entity) | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
I'm not surprised but it's still sad to see. I hope Ricciardo ends up somewhere else because I don't believe he's actually lost it like some people are claiming. It's hard to look at his results in 2020 (5th in the championship in a midfield car. 3 podiums) then contrast them with early 2021 and see the immediate drop in form with McLaren and see it as anything other than a fundamental mismatch between the two. It's happened many times before where a driver and team just didn't work well together and this seems like a case of that. Hopefully he bounces back because when he's at his best he's one of the most exciting drivers on the grid. Wow Piastri better not fuck this up, huh? If he doesn't deliver it's going to be the biggest egg on face situation in F1 in years for both him and McLaren. edit: Chris Medland is saying Ricciardo had his contract bought out. If I remember right, this means Ricciardo got paid something like $20m. If that's the case, he could drive somewhere next year for free and still technically be one of the highest paid drivers on the grid. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
https://twitter.com/danielricciardo/status/1562444128629116928?t=hkQZJ-r3tlX0T3dFaxn0EA&s=19&fbclid=IwAR2WndTP87U305EJPkowYLlfODYnhxnSikwT-yz-o3VtXczgXKtxJ6DjV6o I think this means it's likely McLaren will confirm Piastri this weekend at Spa, barring any other contractual stuff that needs to be sorted out first | ||
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LennX
4572 Posts
I hope he is still in F1 next season though. Or he can win le mans / do indy during his off year if he cant get a seat. Alpine is unlikely to sign Schumacher but they are Alpine... | ||
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Lmui
Canada6223 Posts
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
On August 24 2022 22:10 Excludos wrote: I'm confused about how you're getting this backwards. Alpine were the ones who released an official statement before consulting him, not the other way around. Imagine if tomorrow, Tesco releases a statement saying you are their newest employee. You'd immediately go "uhm..no, actually..". This is all on Alpine for acting unprofessional, not Piastri who were just reacting to the situation. They also forced his hand with this statement, because it would cause chaos among sponsors who'd think he'd be driving for Alpine, and not McLaren. He simply had to rebut it right away. Piastri's public image certainly isn't tarnished by this. In fact, most people are more hyped about him than ever due to his rather loud splash onto the scene. Alpine on the other hand has lost a lot of respect with most fans at this point. What they did was just not ok. You can't just randomly go around claiming drivers who haven't been signed yet (Remember, Piastri has never had any contract with Alpine F1 team, only Alpine Academy, who is a separate entity) I am not, in fact I already explained why anticipating a question or a point being made in that direction. Maybe you skipped it or I worded it in a way thats not clear? On August 24 2022 06:43 FreakyDroid wrote:Even if Alpine [and I'm not claiming they were, I'm saying even if] didn't have the right to confirm his seat after Alonso's departure, he could have taken the high road and do it through proper legal channels without turning it into a drama. You dont know what is written in his agreement with Alpine or if there is a clause somewhere that can be used to keep him in Alpine (not academy) and neither do I. My whole point revolves around that actually: no one knows whats in the contracts and when such drama is released to the public who doesnt know shit and is quick to make a judgment, all you're left is team piastri vs team alpine, both sides arguing who is right or wrong based on speculation, misinformation and personal views. There's no objectivity there, only he said, she said, or my opinion is more valid than yours. Both public images are damaged by this of that I am sure, perhaps not in the eyes of spectators and fans, but sponsors (be it Alpine's or Piastri's personal sponsors) and some other teams are probably taking notes. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
On August 25 2022 02:16 FreakyDroid wrote: You dont know what is written in his agreement with Alpine or if there is a clause somewhere that can be used to keep him in Alpine (not academy) and neither do I. My whole point revolves around that actually: no one knows whats in the contracts and when such drama is released to the public who doesnt know shit and is quick to make a judgment, all you're left is team piastri vs team alpine, both sides arguing who is right or wrong based on speculation, misinformation and personal views. There's no objectivity there, only he said, she said, or my opinion is more valid than yours. Both public images are damaged by this of that I am sure, perhaps not in the eyes of spectators and fans, but sponsors (be it Alpine's or Piastri's personal sponsors) and some other teams are probably taking notes. You are mistaken on this. There is no contract registered with F1 officials, which means whatever contract Piastri might have had with Alpine is not legal. Piastri does have a contract with Alpine Academy, which we don't know the contents of, but as far as driving in F1, that doesn't matter. That is the objectivity you're looking for. Piastro does not have a legal contract to drive for Alpine, yet they made an official statement that he was driving for them. That's bonkers dumb, and forced his hand to immediate rebut it. Piastri's public image isn't damaged at all. Literally only you think this. As far as this situation and Alpine has been dumb af, he has been behaving professionally | ||
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
Piastri joined the Renault Sport Academy in January 2020, a reward after becoming Formula 3 champion in the same year. The Australian continued in the rebranded Alpine Academy and has been made official reserve driver for Alpine in 2022. https://www.planetf1.com/news/oscar-piastri-mclaren-substitute-option/ Seems like your info is wrong. But its kinda pointless, you're trying to prove who is right or wrong, when clearly you're just as misinformed as everyone else. I'm not pretending to know the contents of their legal agreements/contracts nor Im trying to prove which side is right because Im not qualified to do that, nor I have all the factual info to form an unbiased opinion. What I'm arguing is that Piastri handled the situation in a clownish way, a situation that could have been avoided even if Alpine's tweet was without merit. At that point, he had the ball in his court and instead of easing the situation, he decided that adding fire is the way to go without thinking of the repercussions on Alpine as a team, on their image or even his own, he just immaturely took it to twitter to argue his case. If that's what passes as professionalism in todays world, well maybe Im just too old. Whether he is right or wrong is of no concern to me, all Im saying is there are more civilized ways to solve a problem, even if he was/is right. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8278 Posts
On August 25 2022 05:49 FreakyDroid wrote: https://www.planetf1.com/news/oscar-piastri-mclaren-substitute-option/ Seems like your info is wrong. But its kinda pointless, you're trying to prove who is right or wrong, when clearly you're just as misinformed as everyone else. I'm not pretending to know the contents of their legal agreements/contracts nor Im trying to prove which side is right because Im not qualified to do that, nor I have all the factual info to form an unbiased opinion. What I'm arguing is that Piastri handled the situation in a clownish way, a situation that could have been avoided even if Alpine's tweet was without merit. At that point, he had the ball in his court and instead of easing the situation, he decided that adding fire is the way to go without thinking of the repercussions on Alpine as a team, on their image or even his own, he just immaturely took it to twitter to argue his case. If that's what passes as professionalism in todays world, well maybe Im just too old. Whether he is right or wrong is of no concern to me, all Im saying is there are more civilized ways to solve a problem, even if he was/is right. Not sure what you mean by "your info is wrong". There is no contract for Piastri to drive for Alpine. F1 confirmed it officially. Reserve driver != main driver, but I'd hope you'd understand that yourself | ||
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