On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
there are very few players, if inserted into loves PF position, that couldve carried the timberwolves to the playoffs this season.
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
there are very few players, if inserted into loves PF position, that couldve carried the timberwolves to the playoffs this season.
I think this is the key point when comparing Love's superstar status to another guy who is regarded as elite but can't make the playoffs in Irving in Cleveland. There are certainly inefficiencies in Love's game, but he's still a top 10 player in the league (Irving isn't) so there's not much more to ask of him realistically and expect him to output that difference. Yes, they both have ugly team construction, but what would be more palatable from Love, 30-18 every game with better defense?
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
there are very few players, if inserted into loves PF position, that couldve carried the timberwolves to the playoffs this season.
I think this is the key point when comparing Love's superstar status to another guy who is regarded as elite but can't make the playoffs in Irving in Cleveland. There are certainly inefficiencies in Love's game, but he's still a top 10 player in the league (Irving isn't) so there's not much more to ask of him realistically and expect him to output that difference. Yes, they both have ugly team construction, but what would be more palatable from Love, 30-18 every game with better defense?
i wouldnt consider kyrie elite. the timberwolves just have to deal with being in the west
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
there are very few players, if inserted into loves PF position, that couldve carried the timberwolves to the playoffs this season.
I think this is the key point when comparing Love's superstar status to another guy who is regarded as elite but can't make the playoffs in Irving in Cleveland. There are certainly inefficiencies in Love's game, but he's still a top 10 player in the league (Irving isn't) so there's not much more to ask of him realistically and expect him to output that difference. Yes, they both have ugly team construction, but what would be more palatable from Love, 30-18 every game with better defense?
i wouldnt consider kyrie elite. the timberwolves just have to deal with being in the west
On February 15 2014 06:29 cLutZ wrote: Im just trying to look at the situation from a kind of scientific POV.
Something doesn't compute with both Adelman and Love being good, plus Rubio and Pekovic being good role players, and the team being what it is and has been.
I'm not sure Rubio and Pekovic are good. Rubio is so bad shooting the ball that he's being abandoned by defenders, and I don't think his defense is exceptional (I can't comment on that part, that's only based off what I've read). Pekovic is very good offensively, but he lacks the athleticism and tools to defend the rim on defense, which is really where the center position is and looks to be moving forward. Tying up all of that money in Kevin Martin isn't great either, and Love is shooting the three relatively poorly.
I'll give them a few years to remove the stain of Khan from their team before I judge them too harshly, but I don't know if Love is going to want to stick around that long.
The team is defiantly not constructed in a way that I would say is best for Kevin Love. But thats only half of an excuse. I think he should have dragged his team to the playoffs by now.
On the other hand, I have a much narrower definition of elite than many people, and have an admitted bias (well Im admitting it now at least) against playing PF the way Love does.
there are very few players, if inserted into loves PF position, that couldve carried the timberwolves to the playoffs this season.
I think this is the key point when comparing Love's superstar status to another guy who is regarded as elite but can't make the playoffs in Irving in Cleveland. There are certainly inefficiencies in Love's game, but he's still a top 10 player in the league (Irving isn't) so there's not much more to ask of him realistically and expect him to output that difference. Yes, they both have ugly team construction, but what would be more palatable from Love, 30-18 every game with better defense?
i wouldnt consider kyrie elite. the timberwolves just have to deal with being in the west
I don't either, but many do.
Who are these people? If he is elite, like there would be like 7 elite PGs. I dont think there are 7 elite players...
The really elite guys are those who have a significant effect on both sides of the ball. And TBH there are very few:
LBJ KD CP3 PG
I think there are a couple of bubble guys here like WB, Duncan and Dwight. Orlando Dwight certainly was but I'm not sure he's that same guy anymore. The one exception to my rule is probably Dirk but then again I don't think his D is as bad as made out. He's not D Lee .
K Love and Harden just still look too weak defensively to be considered elite. Harden especially.Their offense is amazing but if you give so much back on the defensive end are you really an elite player? I think those guys are fools gold if you think they're going to carry a team as #1 banana.
The problem with the Wolves is the roster sucks. Their top 3 is solid, with Love being an MVP level player but their good mostly gets undone by the bench and Kevin Martin.
Now Pek and Martin go down and its going to be interesting.
yea they cant protect the rim period. But they do enough (Rubio especially) that their DRTG is actually solid. They don't actually get killed as much as it appears but I don't know how sustainable it is. It's freaking hard to not foul, dominate the boards and turnovers and keep competing.
hopefully this won't be waiters and hardaway Jr's highlights of their careers. Drummond is a beast, out of all the UConn guys, had no idea he was gonna be this good.
On February 15 2014 13:03 zulu_nation8 wrote: hopefully this won't be waiters and hardaway Jr's highlights of their careers. Drummond is a beast, out of all the UConn guys, had no idea he was gonna be this good.
KD approves of the little Waiters vs Hardaway Jr's battle in the 2nd half
EPT
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