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On February 18 2014 04:10 caleb3 wrote:
I think the Cup came out great. The bracket was indeed a bit awkward and it finished late for us Eurooeans but there's always room for improvemenrs. Can I ask though, why some of you want better verification? Is this aimed at any soecific person? Surely if admins allowed everybody to play the players are verified, no? It seems some ladies are insinuating that other Ladies of the Swarm are dudes which is a bit weird as I would have thought being a minority in eSports (and not in a bad way) you would stick together and support one another not accuse of lack of sportsmanship.
I believe the player in question is selendissc. Many players seem to think he/she is male.
This is the player's twitch
http://www.twitch.tv/selendissc
As quoted in his/her FAQs on channel:
"Who’s this talking guy? He’s my friend but he won’t be all the time with me on teamspeak. I like playing and listening to him In the same time so you can hear him quite often.
Why we can't hear you on stream? Just because i'm muted."
The streamer explains that you will never hear a female voice because she supposedly mutes herself. But you will hear a male voice occasionally because her "friend" likes to speak with her while she mutes herself. I can see why this would be strange and reason for suspicion.
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Well, I can understand, that someone isn't talking or putting her/his webcam on her/his stream. I'm myselft, not putting any of thoses two thing on my stream. Some people enjoy to talk, other can feel this disturbing while playing... or simply be a bit shy. Also, as i said in my own stream description, I wan't people to watch my stream for my gameplay, not for the player playing the game. I usually got 4/5 viewers, which isn't a lot, but that also mean, I have to improve if I want more people to watch my stream.
That said, about some girls players, including selendissc, there are many strange fact. First of all, she claim to be high master, which is something REALLY uncommon for girl player. I don't feel like it's impossible, i'm just saying, that this is strange, since it's a rare thing, that no one, never heard of her.
As caleb3 said, the female esport scene is really small, that also mean, almost every girl is known, at least a bit.
We (me and my teamate akane), investigated a bit on selendissc, and we found, that her picture on ESL and z33k doesn't match. Maybe, we're wrong, but that's what we feel. ( http://www.esl.eu/pl/player/7473766/ and : http://www.z33k.com/users/107558-selendissc )
Another strange fact, is that almost every master female player, are currently in a pro team or semi pro team. So, how is it possible, for someone who is potentially, the best ranked girl in the world after scarlett, to not be in a team?
So yes, i have doubt about her, because, most of the other girl I saw on the bracket are known, at least a bit, even for thoses who are diamond, or platinum. And I think a lot of people are wondering who is she.
She also declined the interview at the end of the game which actually made a lot of people think that this was suspicious.
Maybe, and hopefuly, we are wrong, but don't forget, thoses are online tournament. Yes female players are a minority in esport, but that also bring many bad people faking their identity, just because they see thoses female tournament, as an easy cashprice. Also I believe there are still some totally unknown female player, and i don't want them to feel upset after what I wrote, but they have to understand, including selendissc, that everyone want a "legit" online female only tournament.
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Basically selendis scooped $200 in a tournament he should not have even played in. Even Nerchio questioned selendis' gender. Nerchio from Poland probably knows more about the Polish sc2 scene and thus was able to question Selendis' playing in this tournament.
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She can't speak, because she is disabled and just can't, nerchio is a troll and idiot that enjoys making her feeling bad, and he will regret very soon, anyway you should think before making a judge about someone.
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Northern Ireland27471 Posts
Sorry but selendis appears to have something of a case to answer, those pics posted above look quite different to me.
It's unfortunate if they are legit but it comes with the territory of a 200 dollar prize tourney with a vastly lower level of competition
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Wow, this is really awesome! I'll be looking forward to these games. Hopefuly they'll put on a good show so this event will grow. We need more of this sort of thing in our community.
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If she's disabled how did the tournament administrators confirm her as a female? Why does she have to mute her voice on stream if she can't talk?
Another thing that bothers me is the fact that both finalists are girls that no one has ever heard of before. Does anyone know who Selendis or Mydarling is? How many tournaments have they played in before this one and how many people can vouch for them being females? Its just strange that not one but two totally unknown females emerges from this tournament in the finals beating out well known females such as MaddeLisk, QueenE, Flo, and Livibee
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@asdfghqwert - she does not mute herself. She is mute. It's a condition that makes you unable to speak. Bravo for insensivity, fail of the year and its not even the end of march... And Nerchio? Really? Show me one progamer that respects this joke of the person for the things he says. Before you waste your like searching I will save you the trouble. There's none.
@miyako As much as I respect your doubts, ask yourself this - how many pictures do you have that are not like one another? I'm a dude and I have loads 
To all. Instead going at her, questioning her gender, which is hurtful as hell btw, answer me this. Howcome there's no proof of her being a guy? Cause she ain't one. Just a bunch of jealous guys who she beats that use anything they can to get back at her as they have been shamed. And what bothers me the most is the fact that girls act in the same embarassing fashion. If you are a shy person who does not want to flash your cleavage nor be for whole internet to see you are a dude? And if you are disabled you are a dude even more? What is this "tits or gtfo" ? For the first time I'm embarrased to be a part of the Starcraft (not sc2 but sc in general) scene.
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On March 07 2014 07:00 caleb3 wrote:@asdfghqwert - she does not mute herself. She is mute. It's a condition that makes you unable to speak. Bravo for insensivity, fail of the year and its not even the end of march... And Nerchio? Really? Show me one progamer that respects this joke of the person for the things he says. Before you waste your like searching I will save you the trouble. There's none. @miyako As much as I respect your doubts, ask yourself this - how many pictures do you have that are not like one another? I'm a dude and I have loads To all. Instead going at her, questioning her gender, which is hurtful as hell btw, answer me this. Howcome there's no proof of her being a guy? Cause she ain't one. Just a bunch of jealous guys who she beats that use anything they can to get back at her as they have been shamed. And what bothers me the most is the fact that girls act in the same embarassing fashion. If you are a shy person who does not want to flash your cleavage nor be for whole internet to see you are a dude? And if you are disabled you are a dude even more? What is this "tits or gtfo" ? For the first time I'm embarrased to be a part of the Starcraft (not sc2 but sc in general) scene.
Not even going to point out how many times you contradict yourself in that post. Calling people out for insensitivity then going off on nerchio for no reason. Trollololo
Shes mute? That is extremely fishy. People should be questioning and getting real answers.
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@miyako As much as I respect your doubts, ask yourself this - how many pictures do you have that are not like one another? I'm a dude and I have loads
Well tbh, you don't often change your face. i've changed my hair color many time, and my hair cut, but unfortunatly (or not), i may not have enough money to change the form of my face..
My doubt, are not based on only 2 pictures, I posted some details in my previous post, like the fact that most of the master girls are known, and most of the best are known since a long time and they have not always been with thoses rank. People were able to follow their progression on SC2, from dia, to master, to midmaster, and for some to high master and GM.
I think that this shall not be "required" to be a famous female player, to have the right to participate in those tournament, but this sounds legitimate to me, to have doubt, about someone who is again, potentially the best female player after scarlett, whom no one never heard of her before this tournament, and who is sadly and unfortunatly muted.
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Northern Ireland27471 Posts
'Jealous guys that she beats' - Aye in all those non-female-only tournaments she's won aye?
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"Calling people out for insensitivity then going off on nerchio for no reason. Trollololo"
You want to tell me that Nerchio is a decent person who has shone in the past with his commendable behaviour and manners that struck the viewers as just and honourable? You are having a laugh, right? Nerchio's online presence is the most detested one in current SC2. Naniwa and Idra had style, Nerchio has only bad manners and if you ever seen his antics you would know that. That's a fact, not me contradicting myself mate, get your facts right. An you wanting anserws is what? Basically you want to look at a teenage girl on webcam? There are websites for that mate.
@miyako - don't get me wrong. Doubt is undestandable. But you can't possibly expect for everybody to live the limelight and flaunt themselves "I'm a girl, I'll stream with a camera". You get one girl that instead of showing herself of actually sat down and told herslef "Right, I'm gonna do this right, first game play, then showing myself off", which for some reason seems to be unacceptable, and she made it work, cause she has done better than the already established players, who as far as I can see, are stagnant in their progress as gamers. Imagine yourself mute, does that make you more or less out in the world? How many Korean players stream with a camera? They don't care. It's in their mentality (apart from Dragon ofc;) ) to go online, play some games, get those 2k viewers and call it a day. I don't see people goin"Taeja, when face cam?". I don't see a reason for this double standard.
@Wombat_NI - As a matter of fact she won the ESL Late Cup once. And enough polish scene got beaten by her to hold a grudge. Wouldn't you, should a chick kick your arse? It's funny how the first thing that comes to mind is "she beat me = she cannot be a girl" rather than "wow, impressive for a lassie".
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Northern Ireland27471 Posts
I very much disagree that that is the source of such suspicion, and the 'having 2 pictures that look very much like two different people' issue is bigger.
It's not like there isn't history of things like this occurring (see VeraLynn) and it is not inherently offensive to ask for some kind of proof of gender in a gender-specific tournament. If people are going around onto her stream and giving her grief and asking her to cam to prove she's a girl in that environment then I'd agree
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True as this might be, adolescent boys will jump on the "face cam" bandwagon for entirely different reasons. And to be quite frank, this is how this grief started - "You're a girl? Show face. Why Not? Ok, you're a dude then" - and winning this tournament did nothing to help it, it surely made things worse. When it comes to proof she sent her national ID, with a picture, to the organisers, who approved her for this gig. So what's the problem? Does she really have to record herself sitting in front of a camera, with no ability to speak, like a pet in a shop window to get everybody to back off? On a personal level, what would satisfy yourself?
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Northern Ireland27471 Posts
Sending a copy of her national ID with a picture to the organisers, which is information that for some reason hasn't been made clear in the last few pages and would have cleaned up this issue without the ugliness and accusations
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It would have also helped if the organisers took a stand here and advised the non-believers why was she admitted which, as you said Wombat, would have cleaned the issue. She sent it in, got approved and all is good, or should be at least but for some reason isn't. It's one thing having doubts and believeing her, or me for that matter, but why are people jumping to negative conclusions remains to elude me.
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You get one girl that instead of showing herself of actually sat down and told herslef "Right, I'm gonna do this right, first game play, then showing myself off"
well, I myself think the same way. But, tbh, no one is asking her to put her webcam on her stream or do such thing...
Sending a copy of her national ID with a picture to the organisers, which is information that for some reason hasn't been made clear in the last few pages and would have cleaned up this issue without the ugliness and accusations
Sorry, it's internet, everyone can ask her sister or any close friend to do this kind of thing. The fact that she's muted is really covenient in this case ( I don't want to sound harsh saying this, im not jealous or anything, if she's actually a female then it would be a great thing for the sc2 female progamming, but thoses coincidence are really suspicious. )
No one can vouch for her actually, because no one saw her offline, nor saw her on webcam, nor heard her voice.
All that people got as proof here, are some national ID, which can be easily faked, and, a photo which also can be taken by someone else.
As other people said before, even the "little voice chat" isn't enough.
I'm ok, in a regular case, this would have been "too much" I enjoy some privacy, and i'm a bit shy myself, so i can understand that something like a webcam speech + sending ID paper, etc would have been too much.
But this, is "not" a regular case. She is poping from nowhere, as one of the best female player, she is mute, so no one, can vouch for her voice, she don't want to use her webcam ( and again, I have nothing against this, but that doesnt help ). And indeed no one saw her offline before.
She don't HAVE to stream with her webcam if she don't want to. But instead of sending her ID to the organisers, she could have played like one game on webcam, with the webcam pointed toward her keyboard, in a private conversation with an admin for exemple.
Seriously, you keep acting, as if we were harassing her for no reason, and that she's victimized by people asking for proof.
But, this is not the case, I would be glad to give her my apologize if she gave any public reason to prove she's actually a female player. You probably gonna think "hey, but why would she prove anything to you?" then think about it, this is a competition, something which is public, plus this is a female only competition, people, player, viewers and organisers want it to be fair for everyone in it. Yes i can understand, that she's in a particular situation, but imo, this has to be cleared, with transparency.
By registering in a public female only event, she should have expected this kind of situation, and instead of feeling hurted by thoses comment, she should just prove us that we are worrying for nothing.
No one is asking her to show any kind of cleavage on webcam, or on twitch etc, but, at least if we could have some people who could vouch for her with some solid argument that would definitly solve the case.
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White knighting is so last year. Post proof. Enough said
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Netherlands6192 Posts
Agreed. It is a requirement to be a female player in this tournament. That means verification. Questioning someone's gender isn't hurtful - this is a legitimate reason to do so. It isn't about 'tits or gtfo'. If she didn't want to turn her webcam on for the general public she could at least have a private call with the organisers in which she could prove herself against her ID, and the organisers could back her up.
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Wow, so many butthurt boys in this thread. No wonder more women don't play this game.
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EPT
