On July 25-28, 2013, we will see the world’s best gamers gather in Shanghai, China to open the Intel Extreme Masters Season 8 at China’s most important game show ChinaJoy.
Here is your chance to qualify from Korea & Taiwan! The TWO best player from the region will qualify for Shanghai. You must advance through 2 stages to do so. See how below.
Restrictions
You must be located in Korea, Taiwan or Japan or having the nationality of these countries at the time of either Stage 1 or Stage 2 to be able to participate.
You must be at least 16 years of age by July 24th 2013 ( the date of the LAN event)
Hotel and flight cost are paid for in full by ESL.
Be well aware that China requires an up to date visa to enter the country.
In a Best of 3 map veto (removal and pick) system is used. The high seeded player(seeds can be found at round 1 on the grid page) decides who starts. Players take it in turn removing maps until only one remains in a best of 1 or until only 3 maps remain in a best of 3 or until 5 maps remain in a Best of 5. Then each player picks a map. Maps are played in order they are picked. The remaining map is played last.
I hope we can see players like Naniwa, Scarlett, Snute in this qualifier. I guess the players like Innovation, Mvp, Soulkey are already seeded in the stage 2, this actually may be tougher than the main tournament.
I love how this tourney is structured and run, but im kind of disappointed in these invites. you invite alive and revival while flash has to qualify thru stage 1?
On July 10 2013 13:08 Dragoonstorm7 wrote: I love how this tourney is structured and run, but im kind of disappointed in these invites. you invite alive and revival while flash has to qualify thru stage 1?
Players are seeded according to the WCS Rankings. We are aware it is not a perfect system and we are looking for ways to improve it for the next IEM event.
On July 10 2013 13:09 iLoveKT wrote: Anyone know why SKT/Woongjin players are not joining the qualifiers?
They are most likely saving their players for the Pro League playoffs and Finals.
On July 10 2013 18:25 Inimic wrote: This timezone business is nonsense. Are there rebroadcasts? Can't we have those as events on TL? I just can't stay up this late every single night.
G'night.
(30 mins to start too...)
VODs will be available right after the tournament which is listed on the TL events calendar
On July 10 2013 19:11 Wonderberg wrote: on duckvilles stream it says amongst notable players mvp shine. have they just listed the wrong shine or is mvp playing in the kespa qualifier?
On July 10 2013 20:11 darkscream wrote: Is there a bracket somewhere that doesn't look like crap? IEM's site nor liquipedia have it and the one linked in the OP has a clusterfuck layout
On July 10 2013 20:11 darkscream wrote: Is there a bracket somewhere that doesn't look like crap? IEM's site nor liquipedia have it and the one linked in the OP has a clusterfuck layout
usually esl requires people to upload the replays of the matches but i guess there will be an exception for kespa ^^ would love to get some replays of these guys though..
Innovation relentless bio-mine agression was so cool the first time I saw it. (He was probably not the first one to invent it, but it's the first time I remembered it)
The nice thing is that it is still cool to watch it when TY demolishes Burning. But I really feel it's unfair. You need such good control when you are Zerg just to be able to trade. When I play Zerg (diamond level), the only thing that works relatively well is to clench your butt and hold until ultralisks...
On July 10 2013 21:12 fezvez wrote: Innovation relentless bio-mine agression was so cool the first time I saw it. (He was probably not the first one to invent it, but it's the first time I remembered it)
The nice thing is that it is still cool to watch it when TY demolishes Burning. But I really feel it's unfair. You need such good control when you are Zerg just to be able to trade. When I play Zerg (diamond level), the only thing that works relatively well is to clench your butt and hold until ultralisks...
Yeah, kinda think the same way. One small misstep on the mines and the game is just lost and you can't possibly catch up. It's entertaining to watch, but REALLY frustrating to play against.
On July 10 2013 21:19 TriZ wrote: No innovation? Rooting for Flash then ! Too bad, Cure, TY and Flash in same group hope 2 of them get qualified.
Stork & CoCa for group B!!!
gogo Reality in group D
Group C is like 75% protoss or something :o
Carmac tweeted this yesterday:
Michal Blicharz @mbCARMAC 22h #IEM Shanghai KR qualifier signups: top 4 #IEM World Ch. [x], top 4 #WCS Korea [x], top 4 #WCS America [x], #WCS Europe winner Juergen [x].
So maybe Soulkey, sOs and Innovation will be seeded in stage 2.
Was Flash discouraged from dropping by the really nice defense by Puzzle at around 10-12 minutes? I don't recall him dropping once the big armies got up at all, even to attempt to deny the fourth.
On July 10 2013 21:37 HugzForL wrote: I feel good seeing Flash getting destroyed in the late game by protoss, i am not the only one.
As a terran player, go die in a hole /jk
i think he es a terran player too.... and feels good that he isn't the only one getting raped by protoss lategame, so why should he go die, he suffers the same fate as you ?
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Should have probably just pulled SCVs to bash Puzzle pre-Storm.
I guess so, but i think Flash doesn't like gambling like this. I think he felt pretty damn confident entering late game. He had like what, 20 ghosts, 20 vikings, plenty of MMM and a bit of hellbat mixed in. I think he was in a perfect spot. Guess not
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Flash's micro in the last engagement was pretty poor, he also lost quite a few vikings to stalker pick offs.
He lacked 30 needed supply in his army anyway with the drops ongoing. Losing Vikings here and there to Stakers is virtually unavoidable since they have free shots with Blink.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
That is the story of my TvP, and if Flash ends up the same as me, no wonder im like 40% win in tvp...
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Should have probably just pulled SCVs to bash Puzzle pre-Storm.
I guess so, but i think Flash doesn't like gambling like this. I think he felt pretty damn confident entering late game. He had like what, 20 ghosts, 20 vikings, plenty of MMM and a bit of hellbat mixed in. I think he was in a perfect spot. Guess not
sorry to get into your talk, but i think the only thing flash could've done better ( since his dt defense and zealot runby defense was so good ) is to sacrifice his scvs and build more OCs, so that his army supply is even bigger. But that would be PERFECT play. I also think that flash played a lot better and did deserve the win.
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
The last Engagement was bad + he had 2 Drops going on. Happens quite fast if the Protoss takes a good fight at this time.
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
2 x 2 medivac unsuccessful drops. Bad engagement. He had to press advantage a bit earlier imo.
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
as far as I could see absolutely nothing. He tried to drop "all over" and none of it was effective with photon overcharge and a couple of dts, then his main army got caught in a corner as he was heading to the fifth (bottom right). He probably felt pretty desperate to do some economical damage at that point...
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Should have probably just pulled SCVs to bash Puzzle pre-Storm.
I guess so, but i think Flash doesn't like gambling like this. I think he felt pretty damn confident entering late game. He had like what, 20 ghosts, 20 vikings, plenty of MMM and a bit of hellbat mixed in. I think he was in a perfect spot. Guess not
sorry to get into your talk, but i think the only thing flash could've done better ( since his dt defense and zealot runby defense was so good ) is to sacrifice his scvs and build more OCs, so that his army supply is even bigger. But that would be PERFECT play. I also think that flash played a lot better and did deserve the win.
Thing is he never banked enough money to make a bunch of OCs. I didn't see his workers count but it wasn't too high i think.
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Should have probably just pulled SCVs to bash Puzzle pre-Storm.
I guess so, but i think Flash doesn't like gambling like this. I think he felt pretty damn confident entering late game. He had like what, 20 ghosts, 20 vikings, plenty of MMM and a bit of hellbat mixed in. I think he was in a perfect spot. Guess not
Had he gathered his whole army together, he definitely had a chance, but he sent 20 supply in Puzzle's main and 10 at his fifth, so he had not enough bio along with his Ghosts at the last fight.
By midgame, he also needed to deny Observers, Puzzle just had maphack and thus could block his whole agression.
I don't think a SCV pull would have been a gamble, Flash was slightly ahead since his maneuvers had still succeeded in reasonably delaying Puzzle's third, and Puzzle forgot to start 2-0-2. But Flash's Armory was too late, his +2 attack was complete long after Storm.
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
the weather forecast said 100% of storm but Flash ignored the warning
So... KT Rolster did not want Nathanias to cast Flash vs. Puzzle game 2 and the following games. I guess thats an violation of ESL rules.
On the game: Flash had so many possibilities to win, but did ignore every one of them. -.- That was really painful to watch. Excellent mechanics like always from Flash, but *REALLY* bad decision making, like really miserable.
Most harasses did neither make sense nor do any damage. Did not use upgrade advantage that he had. Did not use vikings properly, no sniping of Colossi. Did not expand enough. Did not deny expanding of Puzzle. Did not take good battles.
But instead waited until Puzzle had his perfect composition and position and... gg. Like really bad from Flash. Disappointed. And now he does not want 5k fans to see him play. Again disappointed from him (there was no lag).
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
I feel the late Armory is the main culprit here, 10'30 Armory into +2 bio SCV Vikings all-in would have prevailed.
On July 10 2013 21:46 Caladan wrote: So... KT Rolster did not want Nathanias to cast Flash vs. Puzzle game 2 and the following games. I guess thats an violation of ESL rules.
I guess KeSPa doesn't care and players of high profile got the benefit to ban a caster if they happen to have issues/lag with him in the game. I think its fine.
On July 10 2013 21:38 HugzForL wrote: TheDwf, seeing you here, i think Flash played like MUCH better than Puzzle in that game, what do you think?
Should have probably just pulled SCVs to bash Puzzle pre-Storm.
I guess so, but i think Flash doesn't like gambling like this. I think he felt pretty damn confident entering late game. He had like what, 20 ghosts, 20 vikings, plenty of MMM and a bit of hellbat mixed in. I think he was in a perfect spot. Guess not
Had he gathered his whole army together, he definitely had a chance, but he sent 20 supply in Puzzle's main and 10 at his fifth, so he had not enough bio along with his Ghosts at the last fight.
By midgame, he also needed to deny Observers, Puzzle just had maphack and thus could block his whole agression.
I don't think a SCV pull would have been a gamble, Flash was slightly ahead since his maneuvers had still succeeded in reasonably delaying Puzzle's third, and Puzzle forgot to start 2-0-2. But Flash's Armory was too late, his +2 attack was complete long after Storm.
You must be right... well i still think he played good and it ended up like it was a trash no-match. That's what i dont like in TvP.
On July 10 2013 21:48 iLoveKT wrote: Flash was probably embarassed with the way he played. Damn it, KT, this is not cool!
Yeah, it's common for players that *used* to be good, to say it was lag.
But there was clearly no major lag, and even then, decision making was the important part why he lost... Really lame from him. And there are rules in ESL/IEM, that even Kespa has to follow.
Don't think I'll cheer for Flash in the future again.
Basically flash didn't really do anything wrong. If you can't slow down protoss economy you are always at risk of getting stomped in the late game. Flash couldn't push his upgrade advantage because of the zlot run bys. Wish flash would have been more aware of all the observers all over the place.
On July 10 2013 21:46 Caladan wrote: So... KT Rolster did not want Nathanias to cast Flash vs. Puzzle game 2 and the following games. I guess thats an violation of ESL rules.
I guess KeSPa doesn't care and players of high profile got the benefit to ban a caster if they happen to have issues/lag with him in the game. I think its fine.
I do not think it was lag or Flash/Puzzle would have brought it up ingame and would paused or w/e.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
On July 10 2013 22:01 jekku wrote: Pretty thumbs down worthy move from KT if its true.
I think maybe they just aren't used to this type of thing, a random twitch caster doing qualifier games from another country. When usually they attend live events.
Would've been nice to catch the whole series though ,_,
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
Whatever the reason was to not allow him to stream it, it was a dumb move that probably wasn't in line with the tournament rules and they didn't explain it at all. No, it wouldn't be strange if Flash beat Puzzle, but if they wanted to hide builds or do whatever they shouldn't have signed them up for the qualifier. It is streamed and you have to deal with it.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
Whatever the reason was to not allow him to stream it, it was a dumb move that probably wasn't in line with the tournament rules and they didn't explain it at all. No, it wouldn't be strange if Flash beat Puzzle, but if they wanted to hide builds or do whatever they shouldn't have signed them up for the qualifier. It is streamed and you have to deal with it.
what? is it any rule that specifically say that KT players have to be streamed? 80% of the qualifier are not streamed so whats the deal here?
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
Whatever the reason was to not allow him to stream it, it was a dumb move that probably wasn't in line with the tournament rules and they didn't explain it at all. No, it wouldn't be strange if Flash beat Puzzle, but if they wanted to hide builds or do whatever they shouldn't have signed them up for the qualifier. It is streamed and you have to deal with it.
what? is it any rule that specifically say that KT players have to be streamed? 80% of the qualifier are not streamed so whats the deal here?
The deal is that they accepted having the first game casted and then refused to let it continue. I am certainly not going to jump to conclusions, but that is definitely suspicious. I doubt that they are actually match fixing, but StarVe's point was that it was incredibly stupid of them to do this because they brought the suspicion upon themselves. Furthermore, it is not up to KT to decide what games get streamed. If they're hiding strategies, that's a bs reason because they should either not use whatever their secret strategy is, or they should not have signed up in the first place as StarVe also point out. There is probably a rule about IEM being able to stream games at their own discretion (I am not certain, so I could be wrong) which would be the rule being broken if they refuse to let their games be cast. Even if there is not a rule, it is still a dumb thing to do for the reasons mentioned above.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
thats incredibly disappointing of Stork again. He has a huge advantage in like 80% of the game but decides to sit there playing max vs max instead and loses
How surprising... i won't do any comment, but this is weird. I didn't expect such an attitude from KT. Flash might have won 2-1 for real, or just with a little help... we will never know, which is lame.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
On July 10 2013 22:34 HugzForL wrote: Nathanias won't cast Flash vs Mini either.
Proofes that he has some sort of issues, doesn't it? Or do they want to cheat Flash through the tournament?-_-
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
and in the meantime not pausing once during game 1 due to lag. I dont buy it. its just a big fuck u to the audience
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
On July 10 2013 22:34 HugzForL wrote: Nathanias won't cast Flash vs Mini either.
Proofes that he has some sort of issues, doesn't it? Or do they want to cheat Flash through the tournament?-_-
Why on earth would Flash have an issue being casted though?
I'm not saying its rigged or anything - but it still seems rather stupid. Realistically, you should be able to go into any game and play the same regardless of who is watching. The guys played on the big stage more than anyone.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
If lag was an issue, then the move was legit, but this is just speculation on your side and they should have explained this to Nathanias if it was the case.
And it doesn't matter if you think people are stupid for thinking KT match fixes, it's the fact that people think it that counts. And this could have been avoided pretty easily, therefore I still think it wasn't a smart move.
To make myself clear: I don't think they matchfixed, but we all know how the community likes their drama and a move like this should be avoided if it is not at least of high importance.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
If lag was an issue, then the move was legit, but this is just speculation on your side and they should have explained this to Nathanias if it was the case.
And it doesn't matter if you think people are stupid for thinking KT match fixes, it's the fact that people think it that counts. And this could have been avoided pretty easily, therefore I still think it wasn't a smart move.
To make myself clear: I don't think they matchfixed, but we all know how the community likes their drama and a move like this should be avoided if it is not at least of high importance.
who gives a shit if you guys think the move is legit or not? They are in the position to do so and they arent against any rules. End of the story.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
If lag was an issue, then the move was legit, but this is just speculation on your side and they should have explained this to Nathanias if it was the case.
And it doesn't matter if you think people are stupid for thinking KT match fixes, it's the fact that people think it that counts. And this could have been avoided pretty easily, therefore I still think it wasn't a smart move.
To make myself clear: I don't think they matchfixed, but we all know how the community likes their drama and a move like this should be avoided if it is not at least of high importance.
who gives a shit if you guys think the move is legit or not? They are in the position to do so and they arent against any rules. End of the story.
If its not against the rules then everything is fine, but most people assume it is.
On July 10 2013 21:39 NovemberstOrm wrote: also apparently KT Rolster doesn't want nathanias to stream the rest of the series o_O so we only get 1 game.
What? Noooo
Edit: Sounds really suspicous too, not the smartest move of them. Their Big gun is down one game and suddenly the stream gets shut down. If the result is Flash 2-1 this is really strange.
Yeah would be really strange if Flash would win 2-1 vs Puzzle. Jesus are you dumb. Are you implying they cheat? Check out the MLG KeSPa qualifier where INnoVation lost to Sacsri 1-2 ... clearly they are cheating their best players into tournaments, jesus.
No I really do not believe that. I just say it's no smart move, because it makes them look suspicous. Can't argue on that, it is just not a smart move at all, always makes your team / company / organisation look bad
As you can see, you clearly can argue the point. Its not just me that makes no big deal if any out of it. I can fully understand high profile players not wanting to be streamed especially if they feel it hinders their performance. It neither makes KT look bad nor the players in the match. I would bet there's plenty of matches that asked to not be streamed.
Additionally, would you rather not see him competing at all? Because then we'll have an IEM with foreign players and a few invites, that I personally would not want to watch. So I'd rather "miss out" on qualifiers and see him in a real tournament more than not competing at all. See WJS, STX, SKT1 ...
The problem here is not asking for a series not to be streamed. It's the fact to stream game 1 and then tell the caster that he can't stream the rest of the series. This annoys the caster aswell as some of the viewers, because they could have followed an other series at that time. Of course there are some people like you who don't mind, but as you see there are also people who are quite pissed by that move. But there are 0 people who say : "huraaaay I can't watch game 2 and a possible game 3, i love you KT"
So pissing of some people, while gaining no positive reactions is not a smart move for a team that is dependent on sponsors who want positive exposure for their brand.
That's how esport works.
Thank you for lecturing me on how eSports work, I think I am very well aware. As I said, if Flash for example (thats why KT stepped in I suppose) felt like he couldn't perform due to whatever issues because of a caster ingame, then KT did the right move to get the caster out of the way, as they will get MORE and MORE IMPORTANT exposure if he qualifies compared to what they get showing a series where he potentially loses because he feels uncomfortable.
I am not saying that should be done as standard and obviously its never good to quit a boX after the first or even worse the second map, but I am a player myself, I feel the playing condition is most important and I'd rather go through a walkover instead of playing under (for me) disadvantageous situations aka lag, delay etc....
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
If lag was an issue, then the move was legit, but this is just speculation on your side and they should have explained this to Nathanias if it was the case.
And it doesn't matter if you think people are stupid for thinking KT match fixes, it's the fact that people think it that counts. And this could have been avoided pretty easily, therefore I still think it wasn't a smart move.
To make myself clear: I don't think they matchfixed, but we all know how the community likes their drama and a move like this should be avoided if it is not at least of high importance.
who gives a shit if you guys think the move is legit or not? They are in the position to do so and they arent against any rules. End of the story.
On July 10 2013 22:41 NovemberstOrm wrote: apparently flash lost 0-2 to Mini
That was quick. He got cheesed 2 times i guess.
Betting on 10 gate vs CC first and either an Immortal bust or some random DT prism to complete the collection of typical TvP ladder losses. (:
What i've been facing currently is an handful of proxy-what-ever-you-want. I open reaper, scout whole map except the position of the proxy. Ends up losing like a retard. Watch replay, see your reaper not scouting the proxy for 3 pixels, rage.
On July 10 2013 22:41 NovemberstOrm wrote: apparently flash lost 0-2 to Mini
That was quick. He got cheesed 2 times i guess.
Betting on 10 gate vs CC first and either an Immortal bust or some random DT prism to complete the collection of typical TvP ladder losses. (:
What i've been facing currently is an handful of proxy-what-ever-you-want. I open reaper, scout whole map except the position of the proxy. Ends up losing like a retard. Watch replay, see your reaper not scouting the proxy for 3 pixels, rage.
On July 10 2013 22:49 edgeOut wrote: Flash can't beat Mini, man. Don't ever expect him to be a OSL/GSL champion anymore. Semis appearance will be highlights of his SC2 career.
You forgot to add he should probably retire as well.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
On July 10 2013 22:49 edgeOut wrote: Flash can't beat Mini, man. Don't ever expect him to be a OSL/GSL champion anymore. Semis appearance will be highlights of his SC2 career.
It was probably because they streamed his first game with Puzzle *sunglasses*
Bit unfortunate though, International-Flash brings da hype
On July 10 2013 22:49 edgeOut wrote: Flash can't beat Mini, man. Don't ever expect him to be a OSL/GSL champion anymore. Semis appearance will be highlights of his SC2 career.
You forgot to add he should probably retire as well.
Staying in Code S as a gatekeeper is pretty decent for a player, and he contributes big in teamleague, why retire?
On July 10 2013 22:49 edgeOut wrote: Flash can't beat Mini, man. Don't ever expect him to be a OSL/GSL champion anymore. Semis appearance will be highlights of his SC2 career.
You forgot to add he should probably retire as well.
Staying in Code S as a gatekeeper is pretty decent for a player, and he contributes big in teamleague, why retire?
Because losing mini is apparently the end of the world, so when the world ends you just retire. Logical thought.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
I thought that game 1 was pretty sick. Great play by both players.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
One player of KT Rolster, Luxury. 5 From Hite Sparkyz, 1 Airforce Ace, 1 STX, 1 CJ Entus, 1 HwaSeung Oz and 1 eSTRO .... so you are basically saying all teams would do that? I doubt the teams or team owners were invovled, but rather the players.
On July 10 2013 22:49 edgeOut wrote: Flash can't beat Mini, man. Don't ever expect him to be a OSL/GSL champion anymore. Semis appearance will be highlights of his SC2 career.
You forgot to add he should probably retire as well.
Staying in Code S as a gatekeeper is pretty decent for a player, and he contributes big in teamleague, why retire?
Because losing mini is apparently the end of the world, so when the world ends you just retire. Logical thought.
By pure logic, if it is end of the world, you don't retire, you just die.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Did they only remember that after the first game? disclaimer: no I don't think they cheated, I'm just another person who thinks it was a bad move on their part.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Not so much the replay, but the latency from the NA based caster was the problem unfortunately. I'm sure stuff will be made more clear so issues like this hopefully wont come up again, at least not this last minute.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Not so much the replay, but the latency from the NA based caster was the issue unfortunately. I'm sure stuff will be made more clear so issues like this hopefully wont come up again, at least not this last minute.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Not so much the replay, but the latency from the NA based caster was the problem unfortunately. I'm sure stuff will be made more clear so issues like this hopefully wont come up again, at least not this last minute.
Observers have 0 impact on games unless he's disconnecting....
Pretty sure if he thought it was lagging it was in his head.
Cannot believe the stupidity of people who think KT/Flash cheats or does match fixing, and being suprised over a 2-1 victory when he should be the clear favorite in this match.
Flash was clearly off his game in Game 1. The reason there are rumblings in the forums was over how KT handled this situation.
If you don't think eSports team can resort to match fixing when there is huge sponsorship money or gambling involved, I've got a bridge to sell you. It's only 3 years ago when eSports took a hit in Korea because of match fixing.
And take a guess which team was involved?
Yes you're right. It's inconceivable Flash could win 2 games in a row -.-
It's far more likely that KT didn't want obs having replays of their games with the SPL playoffs coming up.
Not so much the replay, but the latency from the NA based caster was the problem unfortunately. I'm sure stuff will be made more clear so issues like this hopefully wont come up again, at least not this last minute.
If it was the observer they would just disconnect(if they were lagging), they have 0 to do with the lag of the players.
On July 10 2013 23:47 skipdog172 wrote: I can't believe IEM allowed this.
I'm just kind of furious right now that this precedent has been set. How many other games are teams going to simply request don't get broadcasted?
I can't believe there isn't more outrage. This should be a top news story.
Sarcasm? If not, please keep in mind, that this was just a qualifier and Nathanias is a free streamer, not an IEM employee, so just regarding the rules, everything is fine. It was just a "fuck you" towards the community.
On July 11 2013 00:17 Daswollvieh wrote: Thank God I´m not the guy who has to come up with a way to hype Savage, Solar, Myungsik and Reality. I assume the invites will have some star power.
they're from kespa. In the place of star power they just bring good play.
Unfortunately not all KeSPA teams had been informed about stream happening before they agreed to play the qualifier. Players are generally not allowed to deny official streams and going forward we do not expect this to happen again. A side-note is that the qualifier is different to the others and is actually run by KeSPA themselves as part of a new co-operation with the ESL and we are still working out the finer points. We had not anticipated for this kind of situation and would like to apologise to the community for it.
On July 11 2013 00:32 messioso wrote: Unfortunately not all KeSPA teams had been informed about stream happening before they agreed to play the qualifier. Players are generally not allowed to deny official streams and going forward we do not expect this to happen again. A side-note is that the qualifier is different to the others and is actually run by KeSPA themselves as part of a new co-operation with the ESL and we are still working out the finer points. We had not anticipated for this kind of situation and would like to apologise to the community for it.
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
they are not even sure to go... there is still one more stage with 8 players we don't know yet
On July 10 2013 21:19 TriZ wrote: No innovation? Rooting for Flash then ! Too bad, Cure, TY and Flash in same group hope 2 of them get qualified.
Stork & CoCa for group B!!!
gogo Reality in group D
Group C is like 75% protoss or something :o
Carmac tweeted this yesterday:
Michal Blicharz @mbCARMAC 22h #IEM Shanghai KR qualifier signups: top 4 #IEM World Ch. [x], top 4 #WCS Korea [x], top 4 #WCS America [x], #WCS Europe winner Juergen [x].
So maybe Soulkey, sOs and Innovation will be seeded in stage 2.
They may even be seeded directly into the final tournament. There is 4 spots/invites reserved for top WCS players
On July 10 2013 21:19 TriZ wrote: No innovation? Rooting for Flash then ! Too bad, Cure, TY and Flash in same group hope 2 of them get qualified.
Stork & CoCa for group B!!!
gogo Reality in group D
Group C is like 75% protoss or something :o
Carmac tweeted this yesterday:
Michal Blicharz @mbCARMAC 22h #IEM Shanghai KR qualifier signups: top 4 #IEM World Ch. [x], top 4 #WCS Korea [x], top 4 #WCS America [x], #WCS Europe winner Juergen [x].
So maybe Soulkey, sOs and Innovation will be seeded in stage 2.
They may even be seeded directly into the final tournament. There is 4 spots/invites reserved for top WCS players
Asked Carmay a few days ago on twitter, ESL pays travel costs for qualifiers, not for invites, so they try to qualify first, to avoid costs and if that does´nt work, may be invited later.
The bracket of the KeSPA qualifier is something to look at, Mini defeating Cure and Flash and Savage going rampage on EffOrt, TY and Mini! Stork beating Argo(Jaehoon) 2-0 is pretty funny as well. And who's this toss eMotion? He beat Terminator and Stats two to zero. Reality qualified without dropping a game, he's on my FPL next season
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
Lol so when the stronger Kespa players lose to the weaker Kespa players in a qualifier, your theory is that they simply don't care? Sorry if these upsets hurt your notions of how good certain players are, but I highly doubt they lost because they didn't care and neglected to prepare/practice/try hard enough.
I think a more reasonable theory is that Kespa players' greatest strength is preparation and that in a format where many games are played back-to-back in a short time, that strength isn't apparent and thus strange results like this happen.
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
Why would they? Their sponsors are Korean, and their primary focus is proleague. They throw the foreigners a bone, albeit small one.
Still, Reality is not "weak." He's as good or better than a lot of hyped terrans like Bomber or Taeja.
On July 10 2013 21:41 Rhaegal wrote: what did Flash do wrong? It looked like he was playing perfectly for the entire game, then I glance away for one second and look back and it's 170 supply vs 90...
I feel the late Armory is the main culprit here, 10'30 Armory into +2 bio SCV Vikings all-in would have prevailed.
Major said that scv timings are the only strong option T has against P. I guess that's why so many Koreans do it. Guess I need to research the timings more tho, because whenever I try it I get stomped.
Thanks for tuning in everyone, Zepph and I alongside Nate had some fun casting. Again I do apologise for the wait at the start but unfortunately the Kespa guys were told the wrong time (an hour later...), but other than that things were run really smoothly, thanks to the ESLAdmin and the Kespa manager that we worked with.
I got to cast young fella Ty(Baby) which was interesting for me, considering I remember first seeing him when he looked like this as a 12 year old in GomTV Avertec Intel Classic :D
As for the Flash controversy, unfortunately I don't know too much more than you guys, only that word is Flash was trying something new but other than that I don't know, I was busy looking after my content. Speaking of which; big thanks to Fenner for helping out HEAPS and Zepph for being awesome co-casting.
A couple of things:
On July 10 2013 23:14 Tsubbi wrote: duckville sometimes sounds 100% like kermit the frog lol
I don't even - I can actually do a really good impression of Kermit (and Arnie) but that's the first time I've had someone say that when I wasn't doing the impression hahaha xD
On July 10 2013 22:57 Arceus wrote: The Escala is strong with Duckville stream
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
Lol so when the stronger Kespa players lose to the weaker Kespa players in a qualifier, your theory is that they simply don't care? Sorry if these upsets hurt your notions of how good certain players are, but I highly doubt they lost because they didn't care and neglected to prepare/practice/try hard enough.
I think a more reasonable theory is that Kespa players' greatest strength is preparation and that in a format where many games are played back-to-back in a short time, that strength isn't apparent and thus strange results like this happen.
Don't worry about it, it's the common excuse. Fan favourites only lose because the sun was in their eyes, or some other excuse.
Welcome to starcraft 2. B-teamers can beat A-teamers. I prefer seeing the future come out of more open qualifiers as opposed to seeing the same names all the time.
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
On July 12 2013 17:50 ESLAsia wrote: It is time to put an end to the wait.
On July 11 2013 00:56 Elroi wrote: loool another batch of weak kespa players send to a foreign tournament... It seems like they don't really care about these tournaments.
Why would they? Their sponsors are Korean, and their primary focus is proleague. They throw the foreigners a bone, albeit small one.
Still, Reality is not "weak." He's as good or better than a lot of hyped terrans like Bomber or Taeja.
Based on what I saw from Bomber vs Flash in Starleague a few days ago Id say Reality is nowhere near as good as Bomber.
I'm just going to assume these were all walkovers since they show a 1-0 score and it's bo3 einsPrime > NesTea Sleep > BBoongBBoong InCa > Brave JYP > SalvatioN YoDa > Venus
I just want to express my opinion that this qualifier is fucking ridiculous. first you have an open bracket of pretty much every player in korea, then the top 4 from kespa and non kespa go to the stage 2 qualifier with mvp, losira, roro, symbol, innovation, ryung, alive and revival. then from those 16 players only 2 will go to IEM? It's silly that korea only gets 2 qualification spots
On July 14 2013 15:55 Dodgin wrote: I just want to express my opinion that this qualifier is fucking ridiculous. first you have an open bracket of pretty much every player in korea, then the top 4 from kespa and non kespa go to the stage 2 qualifier with mvp, losira, roro, symbol, innovation, ryung, alive and revival. then from those 16 players only 2 will go to IEM? It's silly that korea only gets 2 qualification spots
On July 14 2013 15:57 Zoku wrote: I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but how come there's a qualifier just for kespa players, and then there's a qualifier for everyone else?
On July 14 2013 15:55 Dodgin wrote: I just want to express my opinion that this qualifier is fucking ridiculous. first you have an open bracket of pretty much every player in korea, then the top 4 from kespa and non kespa go to the stage 2 qualifier with mvp, losira, roro, symbol, innovation, ryung, alive and revival. then from those 16 players only 2 will go to IEM? It's silly that korea only gets 2 qualification spots
if you qualify, you got paid trip, so they first try to qualify for the tournament other players may be invited later though
On July 14 2013 15:55 Dodgin wrote: I just want to express my opinion that this qualifier is fucking ridiculous. first you have an open bracket of pretty much every player in korea, then the top 4 from kespa and non kespa go to the stage 2 qualifier with mvp, losira, roro, symbol, innovation, ryung, alive and revival. then from those 16 players only 2 will go to IEM? It's silly that korea only gets 2 qualification spots
if you qualify, you got paid trip, so they first try to qualify for the tournament other players may be invited later though
this post confuses me, because it shows both " wcs applicants " in the qualifiers and 4 of them seeded into the tournament itself directly, you figure mvp and innovation being top 2 on wcs points would be directly invited and not playing in the qual.
On July 14 2013 16:58 RawBeeG wrote: Wow, why did life forfeit then, he didn't have any other tourney's atm. Unless school or something like that came up
On July 14 2013 16:58 RawBeeG wrote: Wow, why did life forfeit then, he didn't have any other tourney's atm. Unless school or something like that came up
Or you know ... LoL
Just curious, where did all the stuff about life playing LoL come from....unless it is just completely a rumor
On July 14 2013 16:58 RawBeeG wrote: Wow, why did life forfeit then, he didn't have any other tourney's atm. Unless school or something like that came up
Or you know ... LoL
Just curious, where did all the stuff about life playing LoL come from....unless it is just completely a rumor
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
I don't get how someone with DRG's legacy suddenly gets nervous enough to lose all the time.
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
I don't get how someone with DRG's legacy suddenly gets nervous enough to lose all the time.
PTSD from losing the GSL and GSTL semifinals that one season?
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
I don't get how someone with DRG's legacy suddenly gets nervous enough to lose all the time.
Some of the stuff the comes out of interviews makes me question how truthful they really are.
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
I don't get how someone with DRG's legacy suddenly gets nervous enough to lose all the time.
Some of the stuff the comes out of interviews makes me question how truthful they really are.
waxangel has this conspiracy theory that every interview nestea and mvp have ever done is scripted and fake, designed to fool the fans and their opponents.
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
yeah DRG said hes consistently top 16 on ladder (this was about a month ago he said that though) and that he always wins practice matches. I think hes starting to get some nerves in the booth, but hopefully hes overcoming that.
I don't get how someone with DRG's legacy suddenly gets nervous enough to lose all the time.
i dont know either. I guess maybe you start losing and then the pressure to win just keeps getting greater.
On July 14 2013 17:31 DJHelium wrote: Just tuned in, can't find the result for jjakji vs Violet. Did Violet win? Were the games any good?
I wasn't watching too closely but viOLet won 2-0 and I'm pretty sure jjakji got stomped. I think nathanias said it was a hidden spire in game 1 and jjakji just died to mutas
Wow MKP ... I mean I understand that he's a good player if you compare him to the likes of us, but what the fuck is he doing. It looks like he just doesn't care-_-
On July 14 2013 18:13 NarutO wrote: Wow MKP ... I mean I understand that he's a good player if you compare him to the likes of us, but what the fuck is he doing. It looks like he just doesn't care-_-
On July 14 2013 18:13 NarutO wrote: Wow MKP ... I mean I understand that he's a good player if you compare him to the likes of us, but what the fuck is he doing. It looks like he just doesn't care-_-
what did he do? ;d
Timing with few marauders, marines and hellions.... on creep, stimmed, without combat shields, with his medivacs 10 seconds away from the fight. Lost everything-_-
On July 14 2013 20:21 Hyoshiro wrote: Why there aren't any invited protoss?
invitations to stage 2 are based on WCS ranking. the only possible protoss were: sOs, HerO & Alicia. Woogjin Stars didn't participate so I guess that's why sOs wasn't invited. I don't know about Alicia & HerO
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
Bisu was supposedly the best SKT player in HOTS in practice but it's never materialized in televised games.
Stage 2 will favor players who excel in XvT and XvZ hahaha. Only two Protosses in the form of San and MyuNgSiK really does not favor the chances of a Protoss qualifying, especially with this player pool.
On July 14 2013 17:01 Keeemy wrote: DRG 2-0'd Keen? Wow, didn't expect that.
I think neoghaleon posted something about talking to DRG and apparently DRG is dominating ladder or in house practice or whatever but he's just not doing well in televised matches. maybe he's starting to get his mojo back, though
Bisu was supposedly the best SKT player in HOTS in practice but it's never materialized in televised games.
that's because he started months before though, and the interview that asserted that bisu was the best was like 4 months ago or something? he's certainly improved enough to be consistently on the lineup
can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
No idea, sorry, I only asked carmac the other thing on twitter.
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
Yes, if Innovation loses the qualifier, he can still go and be seeded directly into group stage. Someone lower in the ranking has to count on people above him choosing not to go to get that spot.
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
Yes, if Innovation loses the qualifier, he can still go and be seeded directly into group stage. Someone lower in the ranking has to count on people above him choosing not to go to get that spot.
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
Yes, if Innovation loses the qualifier, he can still go and be seeded directly into group stage. Someone lower in the ranking has to count on people above him choosing not to go to get that spot.
On July 15 2013 15:01 Dodgin wrote: can someone explain to me how the WCS invite system works? the graphic says 4 players from WCS points are being invited directly to the tournament, but they're also playing in qualifiers?
Qualifiers get trips paid, invites do not.
Ok thank you, second question, can players who played in qualifiers but failed to qualify still get invited for wcs points without a paid trip? (thinking it would be a shame for mvp or innovation to not be there because they had an off day)
Yes, if Innovation loses the qualifier, he can still go and be seeded directly into group stage. Someone lower in the ranking has to count on people above him choosing not to go to get that spot.
On July 15 2013 16:00 BigFan wrote: what's with mvp micro and multitasking? It was non-existent :O He's back in KR isn't he?
he was late coming to the im house to play or something so maybe he wasn't in good condition to play, he was going to be dq'd in like 5 mins or something.
DRG was playing very well there coming from that Marine runby which inflicted so much damage. Mvp on the other hand struggled with his micro and maintaining his lead.
What do you use to get specific stats for an encounter? Like we know San vs Life is now 5-0. I wanted to check San vs Symbol cause I don't remember him losing to Symbol either, and they played at least once in gstl and once in the osl dual tournament
On July 15 2013 16:07 Nebuchad wrote: What do you use to get specific stats for an encounter? Like we know San vs Life is now 5-0. I wanted to check San vs Symbol cause I don't remember him losing to Symbol either, and they played at least once in gstl and once in the osl dual tournament
On July 15 2013 16:07 Nebuchad wrote: What do you use to get specific stats for an encounter? Like we know San vs Life is now 5-0. I wanted to check San vs Symbol cause I don't remember him losing to Symbol either, and they played at least once in gstl and once in the osl dual tournament
San has been good forever. He just had some sort of major nerve issues during qualifiers. Most of the top Protoss Code S players talked about how San always helped them with practice. He's also friends with Life, practiced with Mvp during Code S, etc.
On July 15 2013 16:36 Fionn wrote: San has been good forever. He just had some sort of major nerve issues during qualifiers. Most of the top Protoss Code S players talked about how San always helped them with practice. He's also friends with Life, practiced with Mvp during Code S, etc.
now that he won TESL against SEn in front of the home crowd maybe he'll play a little better in a live setting, although that GSTL match against Avenge wasn't a good start.
On July 15 2013 16:36 mrtomjones wrote: A pity Reality let that widow mine hit him. If he was watching that whole fight he wins the game right there..
Yeah, that was probably the point where he let the game slip from his hands. Pretty cool game though, impressive that innovation actually came back from a 20 supply deficit in the early game.
can someone who watched mvp symbol tell me how it went?
also mvp got owned pretty hard but i'm confident he will perform much better at the live event if IM sends him, he looked like he had not practiced tvz in the new patch vs drg.
On July 15 2013 16:54 Dodgin wrote: can someone who watched mvp symbol tell me how it went?
also mvp got owned pretty hard but i'm confident he will perform much better at the live event if IM sends him, he looked like he had not practiced tvz in the new patch vs drg.
Game 1: Money scan on 2-bases Roach Nydus, perfect defence, doesn't matter as Symbol contains him with creep, switches to 11 mutas and wins since Mvp had mostly Marauders/Tanks. Game 2: Scans 1/1 Speedroaches timing, sends a 16 Marine drop while leaving the rest of his troops on natural but Roaches just bulldoze through the Tank while Drones/Roaches/Queens defend the dual drop in the main as it lands. Meanwhile, Hellions had wiped out most of the mineral line at the natural but since 20 Roaches were in his production, Mvp was forced to gg.
On July 15 2013 17:09 hoemuffin wrote: Wow these qualifiers are so stupidly stacked.
I don't know why korean/taiwan is so stacked but not many good players played in EU for example. sLivko and TitaN are the ones who qualified from EU ^^
On July 15 2013 17:18 Shellshock1122 wrote: San just beat Myungsik on Bel'Shir vestige. I didnt watch any games before that but I guess it was game 2 from looking at liquipedia? so 1-1 now?
Is solar a new player? I don't recognize him from broodwar, and some of his games have been excellent, like his zvp vs rain, and that innovation game before.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Yeah, I am wondering if someone will find some answers sometime soon. I can't figure out yet if Innovation is just that much better or what it is :/
Since I watched plenty of TvZs where zerg managed to prevail over terran going bio+medivac+mine, I would say that Innovation is just that much better.
If you watch the game closely, the supplies were even and they were trading back and forth until Innovation managed to snipe that 4th base. Only after that he jumped by 40 supply and it was gg. But you need great bio + wm control + save as many medivacs vs. mutas to be able to do that.
i hope w/ this kind of tvsz going on with widow mine we can expect a overlord buff soon, making z pay gas for detector and making it slow and visible just pure disadvantage
On July 15 2013 17:43 Waxangel wrote: ultras are like insta lose vs innovation
just dump money into upgrades and go muta-ling-bane until the end of time :D
ultras are only good with fungal vs terrans that micro d;
No they are good when zerg is at least equal with terran in economy and army. It was a 40 supply difference against player with insane micro and multitasking. The game turned in Innovation's favor when he managed to stop the 4th from going up.
On July 15 2013 17:46 double1185 wrote: i hope w/ this kind of tvsz going on with widow mine we can expect a overlord buff soon, making z pay gas for detector and making it slow and visible just pure disadvantage
The player with superior mechanics prevails → loser's race needs a buff? Strong logic...
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Yeah, I am wondering if someone will find some answers sometime soon. I can't figure out yet if Innovation is just that much better or what it is :/
Since I watched plenty of TvZs where zerg managed to prevail over terran going bio+medivac+mine, I would say that Innovation is just that much better.
If you watch the game closely, the supplies were even and they were trading back and forth until Innovation managed to snipe that 4th base. Only after that he jumped by 40 supply and it was gg. But you need great bio + wm control + save as many medivacs vs. mutas to be able to do that.
Yea inno is a beast, he was actually always ahead on supply, even when roro was dealing with mines very well, on that counter-attack it actually hurt my brain, cause it looked like a winning move, it was a whole army vs rally'd units and some mines, but building placement + mine placement.. actually held roro's army.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Really? You can burrow your fucking banelings, so we cannot simply run in, matter of fact NO ONE DOES USE IT. We leave supply as defence, same can be done by you. Also "Terran just" - NO. INnoVation was playing insanely amazing, now stop your shit QQ--_-
On July 15 2013 17:47 nimdil wrote: Wow, the reigning King of Europe was stomped really hard, not winning a single set.
Shows you how much being King of Europe means in Korea. Nothing.
Apparently it's still good enough to make it to RO4 at WCS global finals.
Against Alicia, Ryung and Losira.
That is exactly one top Korean and additionally his teammate. Bracket luck much?
how is it bracket luck when his group was the second hardest one? ;/
bracket luck would be in group a instead of soulkey/alive and getting 2 foreigners that he already beat.
Excuse me, he didn't even win vs Alicia. Also I would argue that the other groups were harder. They all had one or max 2 weak players, the other two in those groups were the best of the best for compensation tough.
Mvp just doesn't care about Korean tournaments anymore. He's a 4 time champion, too good for those random 1 time GSL champions. Talk to him when they get the 4th champion. Let alone those runner ups.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Yeah, I am wondering if someone will find some answers sometime soon. I can't figure out yet if Innovation is just that much better or what it is :/
Since I watched plenty of TvZs where zerg managed to prevail over terran going bio+medivac+mine, I would say that Innovation is just that much better.
If you watch the game closely, the supplies were even and they were trading back and forth until Innovation managed to snipe that 4th base. Only after that he jumped by 40 supply and it was gg. But you need great bio + wm control + save as many medivacs vs. mutas to be able to do that.
Yea inno is a beast, he was actually always ahead on supply, even when roro was dealing with mines very well, on that counter-attack it actually hurt my brain, cause it looked like a winning move, it was a whole army vs rally'd units and some mines, but building placement + mine placement.. actually held roro's army.
It would probably be a winning move in WoL because there was no way for terran to control the map like you can in Hots with mines. Zerg now takes more skill than in WoL which is in my opinion a good thing, you cant just send lings in and expect them to do damage by themselves, killing workers and sitting on top of production. It is the same as terran cant just send bio force to zerg side of the map without babysitting or else you die to banes or fungals etc.
If anything the amount of babysitting and army control evened up a bit in comparison to WoL.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Really? You can burrow your fucking banelings, so we cannot simply run in, matter of fact NO ONE DOES USE IT. We leave supply as defence, same can be done by you. Also "Terran just" - NO. INnoVation was playing insanely amazing, now stop your shit QQ--_-
Take a deep breath, you just compared burrowed banelings to widow mines.
On July 15 2013 17:47 nimdil wrote: Wow, the reigning King of Europe was stomped really hard, not winning a single set.
Shows you how much being King of Europe means in Korea. Nothing.
Blah, it was just poor performance. In season 1 finals he has beaten KangHo and Ryung and his losses against Alicia and INoVation were rather close - not to mention ForGG.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Yeah, I am wondering if someone will find some answers sometime soon. I can't figure out yet if Innovation is just that much better or what it is :/
Since I watched plenty of TvZs where zerg managed to prevail over terran going bio+medivac+mine, I would say that Innovation is just that much better.
If you watch the game closely, the supplies were even and they were trading back and forth until Innovation managed to snipe that 4th base. Only after that he jumped by 40 supply and it was gg. But you need great bio + wm control + save as many medivacs vs. mutas to be able to do that.
Yea inno is a beast, he was actually always ahead on supply, even when roro was dealing with mines very well, on that counter-attack it actually hurt my brain, cause it looked like a winning move, it was a whole army vs rally'd units and some mines, but building placement + mine placement.. actually held roro's army.
It would probably be a winning move in WoL because there was no way for terran to control the map like you can in Hots with mines. Zerg now takes more skill than in WoL which is in my opinion a good thing, you cant just send lings in and expect them to do damage by themselves, killing workers and sitting on top of production. It is the same as terran cant just send bio force to zerg side of the map without babysitting or else you die to banes or fungals etc.
If anything the amount of babysitting and army control evened up a bit in comparison to WoL.
Yea I agree if roro had perfect micro there, he'd be able to do massive damage if not camp inno's production.
On July 15 2013 17:41 sibs wrote: this upsets me so much, how zerg has to tiptoe around counterattacking and terran just runs in.
Really? You can burrow your fucking banelings, so we cannot simply run in, matter of fact NO ONE DOES USE IT. We leave supply as defence, same can be done by you. Also "Terran just" - NO. INnoVation was playing insanely amazing, now stop your shit QQ--_-
Take a deep breath, you just compared burrowed banelings to widow mines.
in terms of walking-paths and defence, this is kind of equal. Both cost supply, both have potential to be devastating and both require detection to nullify the damage. You just made it sound like Terran is playing for INnoVation and every Terran player out there can tell you, it is not. Its brutally hard but ignorant people will never understand
On July 15 2013 17:47 nimdil wrote: Wow, the reigning King of Europe was stomped really hard, not winning a single set.
Shows you how much being King of Europe means in Korea. Nothing.
Blah, it was just poor performance. In season 1 finals he has beaten KangHo and Ryung and his losses against Alicia and INoVation were rather close - not to mention ForGG.
I guess then it solely depends on what you define as meaningful. The performance you just listed is pretty good but is in no, absolutely no way worth the hype he received afterwards.
On July 15 2013 17:47 nimdil wrote: Wow, the reigning King of Europe was stomped really hard, not winning a single set.
Shows you how much being King of Europe means in Korea. Nothing.
Blah, it was just poor performance. In season 1 finals he has beaten KangHo and Ryung and his losses against Alicia and INoVation were rather close - not to mention ForGG.
With MVP it's mostly a question of format. With preparation time he's godly. Without it he's just a mid-level Korean terran.
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
On July 15 2013 18:15 TheDwf wrote: Déjà vu in half my ladder games. ////:
So sad that you can't see the similarity between what you were mocking slbs for doing earlier and what you are doing now :&
sibs said it takes no effort as Terran while Zerg always needs to tiptoe around. TheDwf simply said that he loses like that on ladder as well. Which is really how you lose against Protoss if it goes into macro especially on Neo Planet. Zealot runbys being out of position all the time due to that etc.
could just be nerves. He's probably a godly practice partner and chokes when it's offline. Different ballgame since he's playing in his normal conditions.
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
Upgrade for bunkers that gives them turrets? heuheuheu
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
I think the trade off for "supply cost defense" is the fact that terran can attack a large number of points with very cost effective units in the late game.
Triple prong drops of stim marauders/marines is more potent than any other late game harasss afaik :\
So the idea is to leave some stuff at home for the trade off of not just doom dropping the main and wrecking everything.
The speed which a nexus can go down from a drop is pretty savage
wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
I think the trade off for "supply cost defense" is the fact that terran can attack a large number of points with very cost effective units in the late game.
Triple prong drops of stim marauders/marines is more potent than any other late game harasss afaik :\
So the idea is to leave some stuff at home for the trade off of not just doom dropping the main and wrecking everything.
The speed which a nexus can go down from a drop is pretty savage
??? You can't drop in lategame TvP, because Protoss would just kill your army lacking the supply gone in drops. See Flash vs Puzzle on this very map, for instance.
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
Ah I thought you mean something to build a defence after maxing out. Well, a PF with a supply depot wall can buy a lot of time. I think terran does not have something like cannons because bio is so mobile.
On July 15 2013 18:20 Waxangel wrote: wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
On July 15 2013 18:20 Waxangel wrote: wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
has this been addressed arleady?
because they have paid trip if they qualify invited players don't
On July 15 2013 18:20 Waxangel wrote: wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
has this been addressed arleady?
the qualifier gives a free trip. Carmac tweeted that they can still come there and play (Kangho as well I think) but they would have to pay for their own trip
On July 15 2013 18:20 Waxangel wrote: wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
has this been addressed arleady?
To get a free trip
oh so only the qualifier guys get trips, and the WCS point spots are for people who can afford to fly on their own dime?
On July 15 2013 18:20 Waxangel wrote: wait, so why are innovation and mvp (top 3 wcs point players) playing in the qualifier, instead of just applying for the 4 "WCS point" spots in the tournament?
has this been addressed arleady?
To get a free trip
oh so only the qualifier guys get trips, and the WCS point spots are for people who can afford to fly on their own dime?
i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
Ah I thought you mean something to build a defence after maxing out. Well, a PF with a supply depot wall can buy a lot of time. I think terran does not have something like cannons because bio is so mobile.
PFs can easily die to committed Zealots/DTs raids, even with repair, and alas, no, I'm not kidding.
On July 15 2013 18:12 NarutO wrote: Need for Terran
[x] supplyless defence [ ] anything else
-_-
maybe buff the bunker upgrades to 5 armor so you can use them in the lategame?
Besides I think that this is sarcasm, you either have to leave supply at all of your bases Or send army there which is just not good. You can always be put out of position easily which is never a good thing. It doesn't need to be amazing all-destroying defence, but at least something that buys time...
I think the trade off for "supply cost defense" is the fact that terran can attack a large number of points with very cost effective units in the late game.
Triple prong drops of stim marauders/marines is more potent than any other late game harasss afaik :\
So the idea is to leave some stuff at home for the trade off of not just doom dropping the main and wrecking everything.
The speed which a nexus can go down from a drop is pretty savage
Not in the game like that last one when protoss is sitting in front of your base and can be on top of your production in 5s
On July 15 2013 18:22 Dodgin wrote: i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
On July 15 2013 18:22 Dodgin wrote: i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
jin air also do cheap trips daily to shanghai
just saying =]
but jin air green wings has no players at the top of wcs points, hmm but there is the open bracket on-site I think
On July 15 2013 18:22 Dodgin wrote: i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
jin air also do cheap trips daily to shanghai
just saying =]
but jin air green wings has no players at the top of wcs points, hmm but there is the open bracket on-site I think
On July 15 2013 18:22 Dodgin wrote: i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
jin air also do cheap trips daily to shanghai
just saying =]
but jin air green wings has no players at the top of wcs points, hmm but there is the open bracket on-site I think
On July 15 2013 18:32 shinosai wrote: Those two games were like my TvP history. Good drops + an early push = yay I won. Late game = He HAS to run out of storms eventually.... right? Right?
Amazing games by both players. They both playing very well.
His network connection has to drop eventually.... right? Right?
On July 15 2013 18:22 Dodgin wrote: i would expect that mvp and losira will go, flying to shanghai isn't that expensive if you're departing from korea. a trip to EU probably costs x3 or x4 as much including a hotel to stay in and all that.
jin air also do cheap trips daily to shanghai
just saying =]
but jin air green wings has no players at the top of wcs points, hmm but there is the open bracket on-site I think
what the hell? this is the most thrown game i have ever seen on korean level.. but the pylon correctly or dont go away with the probe, with the extra dps he would have cancelled that depot
How does someone control their army so immaculately in the lategame with a bunch of different units to micro, but fail to place a pylon correctly to block a building? -_-;;
I'd actually say Myungsik's is worse because if San didn't pylon block his own nexus, the game would have gone on like normal, maybe he'd have won, maybe he'd have lost. While if Myungsik placed the pylon the way he intended to, he would have very likely won, and now he's going to very likely lose.
San has been known for fails his entire career. His first nickname was Sadzenith because he kept getting cheesed out and never had a game in GSL longer than 8 minutes.
On July 15 2013 18:36 HolyArrow wrote: How does someone control their army so immaculately in the lategame with a bunch of different units to micro, but fail to place a pylon correctly to block a building? -_-;;
There are no grids and marker for enemy buildings, yo.
Edit: oh sniped... so it happens more often San did it also. Funny
San's one stuck because Tastosis randomly decided to give him a massive amount of crap for it at a time when half the games were horrible and most people made huge mistakes. Yeah, Golden vs Squirtle, I'm looking at you.
Man, I really love how laidback and groovy the IEM tracklist is for intermissions. It's really neat, I always have to mute the sound in disgust when listening to GSL.
I think there was also a game from RSL where someone blocked their natural with a supply depot and an add-on, killed the supply depot, realized the add-on was still blocking and then decided it wasn't worth killing off the add-on too and instead took the third, but that was on the map where the natural expansion was supposed to make part of the ramp wall in the spot it's built on.
This looked like something Stardust would do... I'm supposed to lose very badly with these comps? I don't care, look, I win. Honeybadger protoss stuff right there.
On July 15 2013 19:07 Nebuchad wrote: This looked like something Stardust would do... I'm supposed to lose very badly with these comps? I don't care, look, I win. Honeybadger protoss stuff right there.
On July 15 2013 19:12 Zheryn wrote: I'm still impressed by how you can fail cannon rushes that hard after getting a successful pylon-walloff behind the minerals.
On July 15 2013 19:17 Elite_ wrote: (San vs. HyuN) vs. MyuNgSiK... Who will qualify?
Feeling Hyun.
Hyun is probably the strongest player on average but San is doing very well in ZvP and Myungsik is having a hell of a qualifier already beating both players in the WB
i REALYL hope myung wins ... i mean hyung goes iem if he wins or not, then quantic pays for it and azubu should pay san the way too so myungs only chance to go there is to win now !
On July 15 2013 19:22 Drake wrote: i REALYL hope myung wins ... i mean hyung goes iem if he wins or not, then quantic pays for it and azubu should pay san the way too so myungs only chance to go there is to win now !
With what funds do you expect AZUBU to pay for San, exactly?
Will be interesting to see if Soulkey and sOs are allowed to go to Shanghai. Woongjin might want to keep them in Korea to practice solely for the Proleague finals at the start of August. TLO might make it in if they decline.
On July 15 2013 19:45 liberate71 wrote: Man twitch chat is full of SO many stupid comments.
I know this is common knowledge, but I still seem to be *mindblown* at something every time I'm in there.
Weirdly, when everyones just spamming kappas and "AT WHAT COST!?!?" it's usually more intelligent than when they actually try to have conversations. This is only true of like, 2 or 3k+ viewers, smaller numbers are surprisingly alright.
On July 15 2013 19:55 digmouse wrote: If STX made it to Proleague Grand Final Innovation probably won't come to Shanghai.
KT pls win
Lol they should let either flash or innovation go depending on which team wins Although a part of me is cheering for STX to make finals to help solve any potential future sponsor issues once STX sinks.
This is a tough call. I really like Hyun but I also want to see more games from Myungsik and Hyun seems to be in every tournament ever. I guess I'll cheer for Myungsik because I think the paid transport etc would be more important for him.
On July 15 2013 20:35 Daswollvieh wrote: I always wondered, whether in online games, the whole coaching staff stands behind a player, telling him what to do.
kespa referees are present at team house every qualifier to avoid these situations
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
The counter is not letting the p take a 3rd without units. whats your 1v1 rank?
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
Infestors probably help. Fungal is still good even if it's a projectile now...
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
Infestors probably help. Fungal is still good even if it's a projectile now...
very good advice, also ultras would be good or some broodlords with a lot of queens
on a more serious note these new 3 gate stargate builds are looking very promising, so far the best response seems to be more queens and only zerglings while staying out of gas for alonger time
but lots of top zergs just flat out die to this or end up way behind so well see if they come up with a better response soon
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
The counter is not letting the p take a 3rd without units. whats your 1v1 rank?
Wow sorry, tunnel vision >< I hadn't seen that protoss had a third on that star station game.
In my defense I'm going to sleep now and it's been the first time in a LONG while
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
Infestors probably help. Fungal is still good even if it's a projectile now...
very good advice, also ultras would be good or some broodlords with a lot of queens
Except you can't get those units out before this push comes...
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
The counter is not letting the p take a 3rd without units. whats your 1v1 rank?
Wow sorry, tunnel vision >< I hadn't seen that protoss had a third on that star station game.
In my defense I'm going to sleep now and it's been the first time in a LONG while
He didn't have a third on Star Station. He was talking about game 1 on Newkirk.
On July 15 2013 20:45 Nebuchad wrote: Okay, for once I'm not certain that there's a counter to this... Would like to see more protoss do it and see if zergs find a way to survive.
Anyway this was impressive, gg Myungsik.
The counter is not letting the p take a 3rd without units. whats your 1v1 rank?
Wow sorry, tunnel vision >< I hadn't seen that protoss had a third on that star station game.
In my defense I'm going to sleep now and it's been the first time in a LONG while
Ups :D. I thought you meant the other map, where it was ultra obvious. Edit: i would build mass queen and mass hydra.
On July 15 2013 20:51 Daswollvieh wrote: The Protoss presidency takes titles, not a good run in a qualifier. But it was a really nice one.
I´m not ready to give my heart to a rising Protoss so easily, after what sOs did with it.
It's just a good run. With pretty much no games played in proleague, hard to imagine he's a practice monster, probably ranked mid-low level in KT house.
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