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On April 18 2013 22:02 DarkLordOlli wrote:
And I think I've seen Maru scout sometimes
He scouts very often. In fact he scouts uncommonly early, it just so happens that his scouting scv sometimes take a detour to build a barracks.
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On April 18 2013 22:02 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:00 Insoleet wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:On April 18 2013 21:41 Heartland wrote:
I wonder if a few progamers on twitter are eating their words now : P Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. As if you can micro against 24 window mines which has lower priority than the 3 3 bioball. Seriously... I'd like to micro against widow mines, but its just not possible. Terrans should try one day to micro with the swarm against mines. They'd see. Because, I can easily micro marines against banelings. I can micro the swarm agaisnt 4-6 widow mines. But i cant micro against 24 widow that my units doesnt even attack, they just run over it. I have to FOCUS FIRE every mine. I think terrans dont realize how hard it is. yes that's true, if your entire army is ling/bling/muta then u are obviously fucked. it's not wise to defuse mines with melee units.
One problem, most zerg units are either melee or range lower then mines. You cannot even pick them off with muta's cause for some reason they also hit air.
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The future has been revealed. Whatever the next patch brings, bunkers will be nerfed again.
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On April 18 2013 22:05 Decendos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:02 shadymmj wrote:On April 18 2013 22:00 Insoleet wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:On April 18 2013 21:41 Heartland wrote:
I wonder if a few progamers on twitter are eating their words now : P Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. As if you can micro against 24 window mines which has lower priority than the 3 3 bioball. Seriously... I'd like to micro against widow mines, but its just not possible. Terrans should try one day to micro with the swarm against mines. They'd see. Because, I can easily micro marines against banelings. I can micro the swarm agaisnt 4-6 widow mines. But i cant micro against 24 widow that my units doesnt even attack, they just run over it. I have to FOCUS FIRE every mine. I think terrans dont realize how hard it is. yes that's true, if your entire army is ling/bling/muta then u are obviously fucked. it's not wise to defuse mines with melee units. best thing is the T argument: "mass infestor is stupid and OP...lets do mass mine, thats fine". at least mines cost much less, come much earlier and are faster etc. ^^ Mines can also be tricked and have almost a minute cooldown.
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
Meanwhile on HerO's stream. He doesn't lose.
Soulkey fighting!
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I think late game the simplest way to deal with mines is to have ultralisks to tank. This might become a necessary composition to be able to defeat large number of widow mines, because at some point no ling micro can help you defuse 15+ mines.
The issue then is that viewers have different expectations, they see an equal supply muta ling army and feel like those armies should be equal, so they complain about imbalance. But it might be that large number of mines are just the counter to that army composition.
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On April 18 2013 22:03 warcralft wrote:
Progamers on twitter are not complaining how bad zerg is. But how good terran is, like if everyone played terran so perfectly like flash. There is 0 ways for a zerg to win.
Right, basically the argument is that Terran has the highest skill cap, but possibly also the hardest mechanics to master -- so maybe only a few will ever be insanely dominant, but those that do should easily best the top P & Z players.
Only time will tell if that's true in HotS.
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On April 18 2013 22:05 Lysanias wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:00 nomyx wrote:On April 18 2013 21:59 ETisME wrote:On April 18 2013 21:57 Kommander wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:
[quote]
Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. Yeah, this so called Terran "imbalance" vs zerg is nowhere near the level of BL + infestor. I know Life is on another level but Zergs should really take a look at what he's doing because it works against Terran. bl infestor is still no where as imbalanced as pre ghost nerf terran though Luckily that lasted two weeks while BL-Infestor lasted a year 6 months don't talk out of your ass please, Terran dominated an entire year they only race to do so in Sc2.
MMA and Mvp bad players right? They only won tournaments in 2011 because Terran was too strong? Is that what you're trying to say? 
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I can feel the mentat TheDwf overheating thanks to the comments in this thread.
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On April 18 2013 22:01 Kommander wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 21:59 ETisME wrote:On April 18 2013 21:57 Kommander wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:On April 18 2013 21:41 Heartland wrote:
I wonder if a few progamers on twitter are eating their words now : P Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. Yeah, this so called Terran "imbalance" vs zerg is nowhere near the level of BL + infestor. I know Life is on another level but Zergs should really take a look at what he's doing because it works against Terran. bl infestor is still no where as imbalanced as pre ghost nerf terran though Difference is Blizz nerfed ghosts while doing jack shit vs BL/infestor
didn't infestor got nerfed like twice?
walking speed, np range etc?
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United States97277 Posts
On April 18 2013 22:03 Shellshock1122 wrote:0:00  Soulkey spawns in the bottom right  Maru spawns in the bottom left
1:20
gas first for Maru
rax for Maru
2:00
hatch first for Soulkey
drone scout from Soulkey finds Maru first and sees the gas first
gas for Soulkey
pool for Soulkey
3:00
Factory for Maru
reactor for Maru
4:00
ling speed started for Soulkey
Starport for Maru
overlord scouts the starport for Maru
reactored hellion production started for Maru
spine started for Soulkey
5:00
medivac for Maru
first 2 hellions of Maru drive into the main but they take a lot of damage on the way in
Soulkey only loses 1 drone to the first 2 hellions
viking for Maru
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On April 18 2013 22:06 MasterOfPuppets wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:05 Lysanias wrote:On April 18 2013 22:00 nomyx wrote:On April 18 2013 21:59 ETisME wrote:On April 18 2013 21:57 Kommander wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:
[quote]
@LiquidRet 13m
Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage
@AcerScarlett 33m
at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. Yeah, this so called Terran "imbalance" vs zerg is nowhere near the level of BL + infestor. I know Life is on another level but Zergs should really take a look at what he's doing because it works against Terran. bl infestor is still no where as imbalanced as pre ghost nerf terran though Luckily that lasted two weeks while BL-Infestor lasted a year 6 months don't talk out of your ass please, Terran dominated an entire year they only race to do so in Sc2. MMA and Mvp bad players right? They only won tournaments in 2011 because Terran was too strong? Is that what you're trying to say?
No but the GSL was stuffed with average players who were Code S because they played terran.
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Fenrax
United States5018 Posts
On April 18 2013 22:03 warcralft wrote:
Progamers on twitter are not complaining how bad zerg is. But how good terran is, like if everyone played terran so perfectly like flash. There is 0 ways for a zerg to win.
Tell that Life, he doesn't know!
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On April 18 2013 22:05 Daralii wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:05 Decendos wrote:On April 18 2013 22:02 shadymmj wrote:On April 18 2013 22:00 Insoleet wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:
[quote]
Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. As if you can micro against 24 window mines which has lower priority than the 3 3 bioball. Seriously... I'd like to micro against widow mines, but its just not possible. Terrans should try one day to micro with the swarm against mines. They'd see. Because, I can easily micro marines against banelings. I can micro the swarm agaisnt 4-6 widow mines. But i cant micro against 24 widow that my units doesnt even attack, they just run over it. I have to FOCUS FIRE every mine. I think terrans dont realize how hard it is. yes that's true, if your entire army is ling/bling/muta then u are obviously fucked. it's not wise to defuse mines with melee units. best thing is the T argument: "mass infestor is stupid and OP...lets do mass mine, thats fine". at least mines cost much less, come much earlier and are faster etc. ^^ Mines can also be tricked and have almost a minute cooldown.
If you really want to compare directly, then fungal has a 75s "cooldown". In any case they are different races so this unit to unit comparison is pointless.
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On April 18 2013 22:03 warcralft wrote:
Progamers on twitter are not complaining how bad zerg is. But how good terran is, like if everyone played terran so perfectly like flash. There is 0 ways for a zerg to win.
Play Zerg "perfectly"?
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
I want Maru to advance - more terrans for Life to eat
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lol maru has like 2 builds
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On April 18 2013 22:00 Insoleet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:On April 18 2013 21:44 Heartland wrote:On April 18 2013 21:42 Zheryn wrote:On April 18 2013 21:41 Heartland wrote:
I wonder if a few progamers on twitter are eating their words now : P Who tweeted what? @LiquidRet 13m Let's wait till flash wins 3 gsls and then we get a patch..with WCS/DH next week..this sucksl. Already did 3 tournaments in this garbage @AcerScarlett 33m at least i get to feel what it was like for zergs in 1st year of WoL now T_T~ Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. As if you can micro against 24 window mines which has lower priority than the 3 3 bioball. Seriously... I'd like to micro against widow mines, but its just not possible. Terrans should try one day to micro with the swarm against mines. They'd see. Because, I can easily micro marines against banelings. I can micro the swarm agaisnt 4-6 widow mines. But i cant micro against 24 widow that my units doesnt even attack, they just run over it. I have to FOCUS FIRE every mine. I think terrans dont realize how hard it is.
yeah, so Zerg is way harder to play now. They do very well at the top level though, and the balancing should be done at that very top level. Thats life, pun intended, when there are three different races. Unfortunately for Ret and Scarlett it seems like they have to work hard to find a solution for now, because there wil be no big patch any time soon, and there is a very good reason for that: Korean zergs do fine.
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opterown
Australia54785 Posts
On April 18 2013 22:07 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2013 22:06 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 22:05 Lysanias wrote:On April 18 2013 22:00 nomyx wrote:On April 18 2013 21:59 ETisME wrote:On April 18 2013 21:57 Kommander wrote:On April 18 2013 21:54 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 18 2013 21:51 Assirra wrote:On April 18 2013 21:50 Godwrath wrote:On April 18 2013 21:48 rasnj wrote:
[quote]
Why would they want to eat those words? I guess because they posted after maru vs B4, and soulkey is rippin a new one to maru now. Its quite obvious at least Ret was talking about Flash his matches rather then maru vs B4. He even calls him by name... Not gonna lie, that makes me lose some respect for Ret. So it's ok when infestors can just fungal everything and win, but it's not ok when widow mines force a bit more micro out of the Zerg? Plus, this is fucking FlaSh we're talking about, and he didn't even play against a top 5 Zerg... Completely uncalled for. Yeah, this so called Terran "imbalance" vs zerg is nowhere near the level of BL + infestor. I know Life is on another level but Zergs should really take a look at what he's doing because it works against Terran. bl infestor is still no where as imbalanced as pre ghost nerf terran though Luckily that lasted two weeks while BL-Infestor lasted a year 6 months don't talk out of your ass please, Terran dominated an entire year they only race to do so in Sc2. MMA and Mvp bad players right? They only won tournaments in 2011 because Terran was too strong? Is that what you're trying to say? No but the GSL was stuffed with average players who were Code S because they played terran.
nah it was because only 8 qualified each season
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