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On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah.
MVP, TaeJa, Ganzi, Flash, Boxer and even TLO before he left Korea... apparently the Terran race comes with a curse 
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On February 01 2013 04:29 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah. I'm sure MVP is in a lot of pain. I'm not saying that he's not one of the best (because he is) I'm just saying that the likelihood of him and Nestea winning all of those GSLs wouldn't have been possible if the Kespa players transitioned sooner. I mean MVP, Nestea, MC, MarineKing, etc all came to WOL with the Kespa experience which gave them a good edge over their competition.
Except for the fact that he has competed WITH wrist problems even after they got here. He would be much better off without them. I fully expect that if he ever gets healthy and can figure out HOTS like he did WoL that he will be up top again.
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On February 01 2013 05:02 mrtomjones wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 04:29 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah. I'm sure MVP is in a lot of pain. I'm not saying that he's not one of the best (because he is) I'm just saying that the likelihood of him and Nestea winning all of those GSLs wouldn't have been possible if the Kespa players transitioned sooner. I mean MVP, Nestea, MC, MarineKing, etc all came to WOL with the Kespa experience which gave them a good edge over their competition. Except for the fact that he has competed WITH wrist problems even after they got here. He would be much better off without them. I fully expect that if he ever gets healthy and can figure out HOTS like he did WoL that he will be up top again.
Of course, anybody would be better off without wrist problems lol He just needs to give up WOL and recover. There's no reason why he should continue when HotS is going to be released in March. I'm not saying that he can't figure out HotS, I'm sure he will. I can see him as being a contender but not a top player like he was back in the past.
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On February 01 2013 04:35 Sein wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah. MVP, TaeJa, Ganzi, Flash, Boxer and even TLO before he left Korea... apparently the Terran race comes with a curse
Terran has to do more then any other races. It was pretty much the same in BW except 100% worst since you had to use multiple hotkeys for control groups and do everything else manually.
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nestea looking so sloppy
nice tvt's as always though, gsl never disappoints
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On February 01 2013 00:33 bsdaemon wrote:
Is there a free VOD for GSL matches? I want to see Taeja's game T_T
The first VOD (first game of the night) is free, the rest requires a GSL ticket or sub.
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On February 01 2013 05:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 05:02 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:29 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah. I'm sure MVP is in a lot of pain. I'm not saying that he's not one of the best (because he is) I'm just saying that the likelihood of him and Nestea winning all of those GSLs wouldn't have been possible if the Kespa players transitioned sooner. I mean MVP, Nestea, MC, MarineKing, etc all came to WOL with the Kespa experience which gave them a good edge over their competition. Except for the fact that he has competed WITH wrist problems even after they got here. He would be much better off without them. I fully expect that if he ever gets healthy and can figure out HOTS like he did WoL that he will be up top again. Of course, anybody would be better off without wrist problems lol He just needs to give up WOL and recover. There's no reason why he should continue when HotS is going to be released in March. I'm not saying that he can't figure out HotS, I'm sure he will. I can see him as being a contender but not a top player like he was back in the past.
isn't his wrist problem bigger than just his wrist? doesn't it have to due with his neck being bent a bit in the wrong direction. Remember something about if he was ever to get surgery to fix it. It would mean the end of being a progamer
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Noblesse played pretty well last night, some flashes back to his old self.
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On February 01 2013 06:42 mistax wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 05:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:02 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:29 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:24 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. Uhh MVP has serious wrist and health problems dude and yet he is still performing well. If he had none he would still be one of the best. On SOTG I believe it was Artosis who said the coach told him MVP was in a lot of pain.. it could have been someone else but yah. I'm sure MVP is in a lot of pain. I'm not saying that he's not one of the best (because he is) I'm just saying that the likelihood of him and Nestea winning all of those GSLs wouldn't have been possible if the Kespa players transitioned sooner. I mean MVP, Nestea, MC, MarineKing, etc all came to WOL with the Kespa experience which gave them a good edge over their competition. Except for the fact that he has competed WITH wrist problems even after they got here. He would be much better off without them. I fully expect that if he ever gets healthy and can figure out HOTS like he did WoL that he will be up top again. Of course, anybody would be better off without wrist problems lol He just needs to give up WOL and recover. There's no reason why he should continue when HotS is going to be released in March. I'm not saying that he can't figure out HotS, I'm sure he will. I can see him as being a contender but not a top player like he was back in the past. isn't his wrist problem bigger than just his wrist? doesn't it have to due with his neck being bent a bit in the wrong direction. Remember something about if he was ever to get surgery to fix it. It would mean the end of being a progamer
For me MVPs story reminds me of the stereotypical TV drama situation of the football player with some sort of head injury that could kill him but he still wants to play. Honestly if he's in this much pain and physically unable to perform at his peak, with no hope of ever getting there again...I know it's his dream to be a progamer, but at some point we all have to let some dreams go.
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On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time.
If Flash was born earlier and played in the Boxer era, either him or Boxer won't have been as successful...
I think your arguement might have worked with Kespa came over and dominated right away. But as we have seen, this is not the case. There is still a learning curve and the best players in BW might not necessary transition to be the best players in WoL. Flash, JD are doing better than Stork, BIsu.
Would Mvp/Nestea have less wins, probably, but it is not certain. It would be like saying if SC2 didn't come along. Players like Life, Creator, PartinG would be doing well in BW so Jangbi's OSLs weren't against the 'best' competition. Or that if the foreign scene in BW had as much financial support as the Korean scene, some foreigners would be competitive in BW.
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On February 01 2013 10:38 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. If Flash was born earlier and played in the Boxer era, either him or Boxer won't have been as successful...
That's two different eras. The difference is that the Kespa players and players who switched over to SC2 exist in the same era. I don't understand the whole "going back in time argument".
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Urgh, those games from Nestea were horrible! Haven't seen such mis-control for a long while now.
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On February 01 2013 10:38 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. If Flash was born earlier and played in the Boxer era, either him or Boxer won't have been as successful... I think your arguement might have worked with Kespa came over and dominated right away. But as we have seen, this is not the case. There is still a learning curve and the best players in BW might not necessary transition to be the best players in WoL. Flash, JD are doing better than Stork, BIsu. Would Mvp/Nestea have less wins, probably, but it is not certain. It would be like saying if SC2 didn't come along. Players like Life, Creator, PartinG would be doing well in BW so Jangbi's OSLs weren't against the 'best' competition. Or that if the foreign scene in BW had as much financial support as the Korean scene, some foreigners would be competitive in BW.
The thing is that Jangbis OSL wins were against the best competition at that time. Whereas MVP and Nestea's wins weren't against the actual "Kespa pro" (The people who pioneered StarCraft to what it is today) starcraft players when they both co-existed in the same era. This argument is getting us no where  All I can say is time will tell.
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In time, both the current eSF pros and KeSPA pros will fall. The guys who are trainees now will reign supreme. It happened with BW, it will happen in SC2.
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On February 01 2013 10:57 achan1058 wrote:
In time, both the current eSF pros and KeSPA pros will fall. The guys who are trainees now will reign supreme. It happened with BW, it will happen in SC2.
A lot of the current SC2 pro's on the kespa side are trainees though lol
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On February 01 2013 10:59 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 10:57 achan1058 wrote:
In time, both the current eSF pros and KeSPA pros will fall. The guys who are trainees now will reign supreme. It happened with BW, it will happen in SC2. A lot of the current SC2 pro's on the kespa side are trainees though lol
I didn't say which sides the trainees are on. It's indiscriminate. Old fan favourites won't be old fan favourites forever, be it MVP or Flash.
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On February 01 2013 11:00 achan1058 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 10:59 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 10:57 achan1058 wrote:
In time, both the current eSF pros and KeSPA pros will fall. The guys who are trainees now will reign supreme. It happened with BW, it will happen in SC2. A lot of the current SC2 pro's on the kespa side are trainees though lol I didn't say which sides the trainees are on. It's indiscriminate. Old fan favourites won't be old fan favourites forever, be it MVP or Flash.
Flash is a beast though plus he's still young. I think he'll be around for a while.
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On February 01 2013 10:48 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 10:38 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. If Flash was born earlier and played in the Boxer era, either him or Boxer won't have been as successful... That's two different eras. The difference is that the Kespa players and players who switched over to SC2 exist in the same era. I don't understand the whole "going back in time argument".
And your arguement contains a big IF. IF the Kespa players switched over. Well, they didn't so I don't see why we 'project' what they would have done. It is not much different from the "going back in time argument".
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On February 01 2013 11:03 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 10:48 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 10:38 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 03:38 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 02:53 Sajaki wrote:
3 time and 4 time code S champs are both out of the running for code S. z_z Not sure we can base caliber off WoL GSL since they got there wins when half the competition didn't even transition until way later. Not taking away from MVP or Nestea but they had that Kespa experience coming into SC2 whereas everybody else did not thus giving them a clear edge when it came to strategy, mechanics, micro/micro, and multitask. If everybody had of switched at the same time I don't think those wins for MVP and Nestea would have been achievable. Although both earned their wins against who they played. It's a different story when you play people who on paper were clearly better then you. HotS GSLs will determine who the best of the best are because everybody will be starting at the same time. If Flash was born earlier and played in the Boxer era, either him or Boxer won't have been as successful... That's two different eras. The difference is that the Kespa players and players who switched over to SC2 exist in the same era. I don't understand the whole "going back in time argument". And your arguement contains a big IF. IF the Kespa players switched over. Well, they didn't so I don't see why we 'project' what they would have done. It is not much different from the "going back in time argument".
Yeah but it's still within the same era not a completely different timeline. Regardless, time will tell.
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EPT
