EPT[NASL] S4 Week 6 Division 3 - Page 3
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PeaCeR
57 Posts
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:03 Probasaur wrote: Obvious troll is obvious. HerO NOOOOO!!!!!!!!! Thats so painful to watch... 3 lousy infested terrans lost him the game. More like PvZ lost him the game. Two of the big reasons listed in Gretorp's post came into play here..... the Mothership being way too depended upon and completely controlling the tide of the end-game battles in PvZ. And also the fact that infested terrans are 0 supply and with upgrades just demolish everything including +3+3 stalkers. What....you're calling me a troll for saying PvZ lategame is tough for most tosses? You're kidding right? | ||
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Gojira621
United States374 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:04 Swords wrote: I disagree. HerO killed tons of drones. He sniped a ton of queens. He killed the Greater Spire, Hive, Infestation Pit. He killed macro hatches. To do this he used mostly minerals, which at that point in the game are a wash compared to gas. Killing a tremendous amount of economy and tech like that should cripple your opponent far more than losing the minerals HerO did - and yes, he did lose a lot of minerals. Then he managed to kill Lowley's army without even using a vortex and still lost the game despite outplaying him at every point. Okay he killed all of the tech buildings, that's great. Except he wasn't killing the main army which continued to grow and at that point was already at a pretty stable level (around 10 or so broods). You can kill every single tech structure zerg has but if they already have their deathball you don't just auto win, and realistically you can rebuild most of those tech structures within 4 or 5 minutes of gametime. | ||
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Swords
6038 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:06 xXFireandIceXx wrote: What....you're calling me a troll for saying PvZ lategame is tough for most tosses? You're kidding right? I think he was saying that you missed the sarcasm in the post you responded to. | ||
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:07 Swords wrote: I think he was saying that you missed the sarcasm in the post you responded to. Oh haha got it. My bad. Cmon Hero, 2-base him. | ||
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Serinox
Germany5224 Posts
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
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Ansinjunger
United States2451 Posts
He's not getting drop yet though, and the robo bay finally started. | ||
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BathTubNZ
New Zealand2556 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=376188 | ||
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
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Swords
6038 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:06 Gojira621 wrote: Okay he killed all of the tech buildings, that's great. Except he wasn't killing the main army which continued to grow and at that point was already at a pretty stable level (around 10 or so broods). You can kill every single tech structure zerg has but if they already have their deathball you don't just auto win, and realistically you can rebuild most of those tech structures within 4 or 5 minutes of gametime. Obviously you shouldn't auto-win, but you should be able to trade armies at that point - as happens in PvT/TvP/TvT. The problem with PvZ is you can do tremendous amounts of damage, but if Zerg has a Broodlord/Infestor army you cannot trade with it no matter the damage you do (army trading being one of the more exciting parts of the game - leads to nonstop action like in early/mid TvZ, etc.). You have to hit the vortex and destroy it in a few archon shots and the game is over - the winner depending on who hits the vortex or if it's missed or not. That's poor game design. The problem I have is that once the Zerg gets a certain critical number of Broods/Infestors there stops being any reason for the Zerg to attack. They can just wait for the Protoss to attack into spines or make their Mamaship vulnerable to NP (something Lowely didn't even do, but better Zergs do though). That's really boring to watch, and frustrating to see when an opponent destroys a tremendous amount of economy/tech and it doesn't even matter. Note, I have no problem with Zergs winning - I'm a huge Life fan for example. However, I hate watching PvZ. It's either a boring turtle-fest on both sides. A boring Protoss all-in. Or an interesting Protoss harass game into whatever happened in the first 45 mins of the game not mattering at all. Also, sorry for all the ranting, these games just drive me nuts to watch, maybe I need to take a step back. | ||
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
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Probasaur
United States461 Posts
And wow, there's another major point made by either Gretorp or Grubby recently, or maybe both. The unforgiving zergling run-by that is infinite in damage when you account for the positioning of HerO's army allowing Lowley to take prime position on his 3rd and kill all his collosi. Really sad to see. Lowely is performing superbly, still tho..... HerO played so well in these games, and after killing all the broodlords and then all the infestors in the 3rd game he was ahead. Then just to lose to a run-by is really disheartening. | ||
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Bagration
United States18282 Posts
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:23 Probasaur wrote: Thankyou Swords, you kind sir you. And wow, there's another major point made by either Gretorp or Grubby recently, or maybe both. The unforgiving zergling run-by that is infinite in damage when you account for the positioning of HerO's army allowing Lowley to take prime position on his 3rd and kill all his collosi. Really sad to see. Lowely is performing superbly, still tho. Protoss can warp in units anywhere. | ||
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Gojira621
United States374 Posts
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TheDougler
Canada8324 Posts
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snowfox330
Canada61 Posts
To be honest, even though I did not like the tempest design when it was announced, now I can't wait for it to come out. I think the tempest will be the one essential unit for protoss to take initiative against a zerg in the late game, since it can snipe broods from a million miles away. | ||
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Probasaur
United States461 Posts
Okay? That costs a plethora of minerals and warpgate cooldown time. Two very expensive and valuable resources no matter how late the game is. And all it costs zerg is very few minerals and supply for the amount of lings, which we all know minerals and lings are cheap and not at all valued highly. Especially when he has more larvae then he needs.... especially when maxed. On October 20 2012 14:26 snowfox330 wrote: ZvP nowadays is disgusting. You either win an all-in as P or the game just drags out incredibly boringly. To be honest, even though I did not like the tempest design when it was announced, now I can't wait for it to come out. I think the tempest will be the one essential unit for protoss to take initiative against a zerg in the late game, since it can snipe broods from a million miles away. Don't forget about turtle zergs who do nothing but mass spines and yawn until you die from boredom and getting poked. | ||
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openbox1
1393 Posts
On October 20 2012 14:23 Probasaur wrote: Thankyou Swords, you kind sir you. And wow, there's another major point made by either Gretorp or Grubby recently, or maybe both. The unforgiving zergling run-by that is infinite in damage when you account for the positioning of HerO's army allowing Lowley to take prime position on his 3rd and kill all his collosi. Really sad to see. Lowely is performing superbly, still tho..... HerO played so well in these games, and after killing all the broodlords and then all the infestors in the 3rd game he was ahead. Then just to lose to a run-by is really disheartening. I'm a T so I hate both zerg and toss, but complaining about ling runbys is a little petty in my opinion. Sure, toss has no harass early game, but look at all the games. Multiple warp prism and zealots snipe everything. Zergs had to respond by spining and sporing their bases. Why should toss get a free pass? Drop cannons and a few zlots. Late late game zerg vs toss is kinda coinflippy on vortex vs mass blord and something should be changed, but saying ling runbys is op is kinda... | ||
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