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On April 10 2012 03:07 Morfildur wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:01 Sabu113 wrote:On April 10 2012 02:36 HaXXspetten wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp  Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. MMA outclasses everyone in TvZ, except maybe DRG. I think people underestimated how sick Stephano was in their g1 because of the show MMA put on in g2. In G1 for most of the game, Stephano had managed to deny /any/ worker kills whatsoever. Stephano is pretty damn impressive... it's just that like you say MMA's TvZ is absurd (yet he won't do an SCfou style tvp t.t). Even in g2 i was impressed by stephano. As a former Zerg i was in horror while as current Terran i was also in awe of what MMA unleashed on poor Stephano and Stephano still managed to almost keep up with the multitasking of MMA, he even managed to get quite a huge army out. I wish i was even half as good as either of them.
na, MMA could have just 1a-ed him from the moment those 3banshees killed the third and stephano only killed one.
His army was "impressive" because ultras and lings take up like infinity space and make you max really fast, compared to more expensive (lategame)efficient stuff.
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Zerg do better than protoss but I don't hear you whining about that? Wonder why?
1. Protoss have worst win rates almost every month since release
http://twitter.com/#!/SC2Statistics
2, Protoss have won least premier tounamnets of all race
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Premier_Tournaments
an so on,,,
It's not balance. It's play.Good play win not as good lose. Unless you play perfect and it's unstoppable then you can cry balance. e.g. 5 rax reaper before nerf.
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I missed most of the tournament. Are any of the games "omfg must see"?
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It seems that Stephano deserves at least half the hype he is getting from what i've seen this IPL.
Nestea and MMA beating him is no shame really.
Now what remains to be seen is how he will do in the future, will he be able to adapt to other meta game changes, or is he good because he is riding the current metagame wagon
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lol I just go to youtube to listen IU song.
It surprise me that top comments are talking about IPL.
So i go to check other K-pop songs that they had stream.
Most of them is about IPL haha.
ESPORTS IS EVERYWHERE.
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On April 10 2012 03:18 Serthius wrote:
I missed most of the tournament. Are any of the games "omfg must see"?
I'll just quote myself from earlier:
On April 09 2012 19:57 HaXXspetten wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2012 19:06 polybios wrote:
is there any list of recommended games to watch? Honestly, you should watch the entire NesTea/aLive, NesTea/Squirtle and aLive/Squirtle series, all so sick. If I had to pick one game it would be NesTea/aLive game one though.
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Stephano definity deserves the hype. He's only foriegner proven to stand toe to toe with koreans tounamanet after tounament. You can't win them all. Look at MC and his 16th place. But respectable finishes increase your chace to win some and Stephano will in future, I'm sorta an anti fan for his attitude but you can't deny skill.
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On April 10 2012 03:13 noddy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:11 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 03:06 noddy wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. I love Stephano and is far and away the best foreigner and would do ok in Code S but the only reason he got a win vs MarineKing was because MKP did the same build in the regame (first game dced) and Stephano took advantage of this by all-inning. sorry but that was a stupid excuse. mkp did same build in regame against PartinG as well. ..and parting didn't take advantage of it? the end of it is that Stephano hasn't won vs MarineKing without all-inning
He had to.
Macro games are way too hard for Zerg with the level of greed MKP, MMA, and other top TvZers are getting away with - I mean, CC first with three orbitals before the Zerg is able to get a third, really? That has to be punished.
The set up in ZvT is simple - Terran is cost efficient, Zerg has better macro. When Terran is both cost efficient and has equivalent macro, the match-up is unplayable.
Stephano isn't the only Zerg having trouble with Terrans. Nestea lost to Alive, whose TvZ is a level below that of MKP's and MMA's. DRG's win ratio vs. MKP has been tanking over the course of the last two months. No top level ZvTer has a winning record vs. the top level TvZers. The number of ZvT wins due to baneling busts and all-ins has drastically increased in tournaments.
The match-up is in the midst of a meta-game change that favors Terran, and I don't think Zergs have found the solution. ZvT win rates were converging with TvZ win rates in March due to the ling infestor style - but then MKP, MMA, and Jjakji came along and demolished that style with a greedy triple orbital, fast upgrades, low tank count style that out-macros Zerg in the mid-game and prevents Hive tech from becoming an issue. It is this style that destroyed the best Zergs in MLG and in IPL.
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On April 10 2012 03:34 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:13 noddy wrote:On April 10 2012 03:11 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 03:06 noddy wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. I love Stephano and is far and away the best foreigner and would do ok in Code S but the only reason he got a win vs MarineKing was because MKP did the same build in the regame (first game dced) and Stephano took advantage of this by all-inning. sorry but that was a stupid excuse. mkp did same build in regame against PartinG as well. ..and parting didn't take advantage of it? the end of it is that Stephano hasn't won vs MarineKing without all-inning He had to. Macro games are way too hard for Zerg with the level of greed MKP, MMA, and other top TvZers are getting away with - I mean, CC first with three orbitals before the Zerg is able to get a third, really? That has to be punished. The set up in ZvT is simple - Terran is cost efficient, Zerg has better macro. When Terran is both cost efficient and has equivalent macro, the match-up is unplayable. Stephano isn't the only Zerg having trouble with Terrans. Nestea lost to Alive, whose TvZ is a level below that of MKP's and MMA's. DRG's win ratio vs. MKP has been tanking over the course of the last two months. No top level ZvTer has a winning record vs. the top level TvZers. The number of ZvT wins due to baneling busts and all-ins has drastically increased in tournaments. The match-up is in the midst of a meta-game change that favors Terran, and I don't think Zergs have found the solution. ZvT win rates were converging with TvZ win rates in March due to the ling infestor style - but then MKP, MMA, and Jjakji came along and demolished that style with a greedy triple orbital, fast upgrades, low tank count style that out-macros Zerg in the mid-game and prevents Hive tech from becoming an issue. It is this style that destroyed the best Zergs in MLG and in IPL.
how about 6 pooling or cheesing the greedy terran? wouldn't that be the counter to the Terran build?
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On April 10 2012 03:31 HaXXspetten wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:18 Serthius wrote:
I missed most of the tournament. Are any of the games "omfg must see"? I'll just quote myself from earlier: Show nested quote +On April 09 2012 19:57 HaXXspetten wrote:On April 09 2012 19:06 polybios wrote:
is there any list of recommended games to watch? Honestly, you should watch the entire NesTea/aLive, NesTea/Squirtle and aLive/Squirtle series, all so sick. If I had to pick one game it would be NesTea/aLive game one though.
Thanks, I'll have a look.
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On April 10 2012 03:42 chatuka wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:34 Azarkon wrote:On April 10 2012 03:13 noddy wrote:On April 10 2012 03:11 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 03:06 noddy wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. I love Stephano and is far and away the best foreigner and would do ok in Code S but the only reason he got a win vs MarineKing was because MKP did the same build in the regame (first game dced) and Stephano took advantage of this by all-inning. sorry but that was a stupid excuse. mkp did same build in regame against PartinG as well. ..and parting didn't take advantage of it? the end of it is that Stephano hasn't won vs MarineKing without all-inning He had to. Macro games are way too hard for Zerg with the level of greed MKP, MMA, and other top TvZers are getting away with - I mean, CC first with three orbitals before the Zerg is able to get a third, really? That has to be punished. The set up in ZvT is simple - Terran is cost efficient, Zerg has better macro. When Terran is both cost efficient and has equivalent macro, the match-up is unplayable. Stephano isn't the only Zerg having trouble with Terrans. Nestea lost to Alive, whose TvZ is a level below that of MKP's and MMA's. DRG's win ratio vs. MKP has been tanking over the course of the last two months. No top level ZvTer has a winning record vs. the top level TvZers. The number of ZvT wins due to baneling busts and all-ins has drastically increased in tournaments. The match-up is in the midst of a meta-game change that favors Terran, and I don't think Zergs have found the solution. ZvT win rates were converging with TvZ win rates in March due to the ling infestor style - but then MKP, MMA, and Jjakji came along and demolished that style with a greedy triple orbital, fast upgrades, low tank count style that out-macros Zerg in the mid-game and prevents Hive tech from becoming an issue. It is this style that destroyed the best Zergs in MLG and in IPL. how about 6 pooling or cheesing the greedy terran? wouldn't that be the counter to the Terran build?
Most terrans play rax first (>6pool) and scout (>6pool). Also Zergs are trying to allin it a lot on GSL level (roach/bling) but it doesn't even win a lot against 3CC no banshee/marauder builds, due to 3mule "comeback" potential. So no, right now zergs havent figuered reliable ways to punish it, but have to rely on macroing back or getting some good defensive trades.
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I think the lb in the championship bracket hurt the event a lot. The last day took way too long and the players got really tired in the end...
After a group-stage a loser bracket is not really necessary and I feel like a single-elimination bracket with bo5 in the quater- and semi-final and a bo7 in the finals would have been MUCH better.
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On April 10 2012 04:04 Awesomeness wrote:
I think the lb in the championship bracket hurt the event a lot. The last day took way too long and the players got really tired in the end...
After a group-stage a loser bracket is not really necessary and I feel like a single-elimination bracket with bo5 in the quater- and semi-final and a bo7 in the finals would have been MUCH better.
but... but then we would never have seen Squirtle's epic LB run :/
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On April 10 2012 04:12 HaXXspetten wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 04:04 Awesomeness wrote:
I think the lb in the championship bracket hurt the event a lot. The last day took way too long and the players got really tired in the end...
After a group-stage a loser bracket is not really necessary and I feel like a single-elimination bracket with bo5 in the quater- and semi-final and a bo7 in the finals would have been MUCH better. but... but then we would never have seen Squirtle's epic LB run :/
That and the fact that it guarantees more highest level games in the tournament. I really like that. It took too long because of the way they scheduled the matches in my opinion. It could have been done much quicker.
more games = more awesome
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On April 10 2012 03:16 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:07 Morfildur wrote:On April 10 2012 03:01 Sabu113 wrote:On April 10 2012 02:36 HaXXspetten wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. MMA outclasses everyone in TvZ, except maybe DRG. I think people underestimated how sick Stephano was in their g1 because of the show MMA put on in g2. In G1 for most of the game, Stephano had managed to deny /any/ worker kills whatsoever. Stephano is pretty damn impressive... it's just that like you say MMA's TvZ is absurd (yet he won't do an SCfou style tvp t.t). Even in g2 i was impressed by stephano. As a former Zerg i was in horror while as current Terran i was also in awe of what MMA unleashed on poor Stephano and Stephano still managed to almost keep up with the multitasking of MMA, he even managed to get quite a huge army out. I wish i was even half as good as either of them. na, MMA could have just 1a-ed him from the moment those 3banshees killed the third and stephano only killed one. His army was "impressive" because ultras and lings take up like infinity space and make you max really fast, compared to more expensive (lategame)efficient stuff.
MMA was pretty much playing with him at that point.
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I'm still unsure how aLive got the clue of roach/baneling all-in from Nestea in game 3. I thought he saw just a glimpse of a roach or two but he immediately canceled blue flame and got the seige mode like 5 secs before the bust came. That was an amazing game sense for sure but I wonder if he was sure of it or simply being (overly) cautious.
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On April 10 2012 04:16 JOJOsc2news wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 04:12 HaXXspetten wrote:On April 10 2012 04:04 Awesomeness wrote:
I think the lb in the championship bracket hurt the event a lot. The last day took way too long and the players got really tired in the end...
After a group-stage a loser bracket is not really necessary and I feel like a single-elimination bracket with bo5 in the quater- and semi-final and a bo7 in the finals would have been MUCH better. but... but then we would never have seen Squirtle's epic LB run :/ That and the fact that it guarantees more highest level games in the tournament. I really like that. It took too long because of the way they scheduled the matches in my opinion. It could have been done much quicker. more games = more awesome
We didn't really see the highest level games towards the end, because the players were super tired. A tournament should be about the best player winning and IPL felt like an endurance contest. Well, maybe I'm biased because I stayed up till 8am and literally couldn't stay awake for the 2nd bo5 of the finals. But yeah, a better scheduling and less pauses would have helped a lot as well.
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On April 10 2012 04:21 Fawkes wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 03:16 Big J wrote:On April 10 2012 03:07 Morfildur wrote:On April 10 2012 03:01 Sabu113 wrote:On April 10 2012 02:36 HaXXspetten wrote:On April 10 2012 02:31 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 02:21 arfyron wrote:On April 10 2012 01:04 dragonborn wrote:On April 10 2012 00:13 Cereb wrote:I went to bed after Stephano got destroyed by MMA... But it's kinda funny that MMA is unbeatable in zvt (As far as I can tell from TLPD he hasn't lost a single series) but just completely falls apart in tvp Im pretty sure Stephano would have had a much better chance vs Squirtle than MMA. And the games against Nestea were too bad as well. Picking Taldarim as your last map in zvz is kinda a cheap move since you don't get any scouting info so it's much more build order based. But man! Amazing performance by Stephano! It's nice that there is atleast ONE bloody guy from outside of Korea who knows how to play this game. i went bed/stop watching as well after stephano eliminated, haha but i still want to thanks stephano, he was the only reason for watching IPL 4.He is the only foreigner player in top 16, also he beat legit GSL players like Bomber/JYP/Curious, played toe to toe with best ZvZer NesTea, such a close games against Marineking and losing to best TvZer MMA. at the end, stephano shows he is a legit player and skilled as top koreans. He's the best foreigner for sure and can definitely compete with mid tier koreans but as you just said he lost to all the top ones so I wouldn't go so far. if his games were 2-0 lose against nestea/mkp, i can say you are right, but score was 2-1 with such a close games. he is just outclassed against MMA @game 2. MMA outclasses everyone in TvZ, except maybe DRG. I think people underestimated how sick Stephano was in their g1 because of the show MMA put on in g2. In G1 for most of the game, Stephano had managed to deny /any/ worker kills whatsoever. Stephano is pretty damn impressive... it's just that like you say MMA's TvZ is absurd (yet he won't do an SCfou style tvp t.t). Even in g2 i was impressed by stephano. As a former Zerg i was in horror while as current Terran i was also in awe of what MMA unleashed on poor Stephano and Stephano still managed to almost keep up with the multitasking of MMA, he even managed to get quite a huge army out. I wish i was even half as good as either of them. na, MMA could have just 1a-ed him from the moment those 3banshees killed the third and stephano only killed one. His army was "impressive" because ultras and lings take up like infinity space and make you max really fast, compared to more expensive (lategame)efficient stuff. MMA was pretty much playing with him at that point.
Yes, which is BM. Stephano had one option at that point - GG as soon as he was contained on two bases, which in the foreigner's scene results in him being called an IdrA, not fighting to the last, etc. Yet, the alternative to that was getitng humiliated by MMA, who refused to push because he wanted to humiliate Stephano.
MMA's behavior is a huge blow to people who think Korean pros are GM, respectful, etc., unlike foreigners. It doesn't work that way.
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I just finished watching the archives of the last finals matches an hour or so ago, having watched most of the finals live, but could someone confirm for me that I just watched Squirtle win the series and then watch Alive get the trophy due to winning some nonsense second series that popped up out of the blue and cannot be an extended series that was due to previously losing to Alive earlier in the tournament (because he didn't)?
Did that really just happen?
Was this tournament Bo3s most of the way, Bo5 in the Semi-Finals and Bo5 in the final with the condition that someone coming from the Loser's Bracket, with a SUPERIOR record in pools after coming from the Open Bracket, WITHOUT having been knocked down to the Loser's Bracket before the finals would have to win a SECOND Bo5 if he managed to win the first? What the hell kind of s system is that? It was terrible and illogical! Have I misunderstood something? Was there some match-up between them not mentioned on Liquipedia that I am unaware of?
>.>
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On April 10 2012 03:34 Azarkon wrote:
He had to.
Macro games are way too hard for Zerg with the level of greed MKP, MMA, and other top TvZers are getting away with - I mean, CC first with three orbitals before the Zerg is able to get a third, really? That has to be punished.
The set up in ZvT is simple - Terran is cost efficient, Zerg has better macro. When Terran is both cost efficient and has equivalent macro, the match-up is unplayable.
Stephano isn't the only Zerg having trouble with Terrans. Nestea lost to Alive, whose TvZ is a level below that of MKP's and MMA's. DRG's win ratio vs. MKP has been tanking over the course of the last two months. No top level ZvTer has a winning record vs. the top level TvZers. The number of ZvT wins due to baneling busts and all-ins has drastically increased in tournaments.
The match-up is in the midst of a meta-game change that favors Terran, and I don't think Zergs have found the solution. ZvT win rates were converging with TvZ win rates in March due to the ling infestor style - but then MKP, MMA, and Jjakji came along and demolished that style with a greedy triple orbital, fast upgrades, low tank count style that out-macros Zerg in the mid-game and prevents Hive tech from becoming an issue. It is this style that destroyed the best Zergs in MLG and in IPL.
Agreed. Terrans have learned how to fight zerg in late game. (3/3 marines FTW) They are not only NOT afraid of the late game but may even favor it. Look at the difference between the finals of the last 2 MLG events. Earlier, MKP largely relied on 2-rax opening to kill DRG but more recently he simply went onto macro and timing with a great efficiency. Zergs need to find an answer. I thought Nestea's muta play wasn't bad at all. Yes they die to 3/3 marines eventually but Nestea was able to maximize their utility with his great awareness of the terrains. His lings/blings definitely had a chance against aLive's tanks/marines, but his decisions were bad. It's something to look out for. I like to watch mutas in TvZ, too.
But it seems like Terrans haven't found the magic in TvP late game yet, thus they tend to rely on early game tricks against P.
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EPT
