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DreamHack Winter 2011 Day 2 - Page 247

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
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Please stop the tournament comparison discussion. Especially regarding players their runs (Stephano seems to be the current topic). Stay on topic and stick to the games. Consequences will be met out to further derailment.

In addition leave the usual out of this topic:

-Balance complaints
-Map complaints
-Stream complaints
-Caster/player bashing
-Off topic discussions

Logically continue this list with things that are obviously frowned
upon. Enjoy the free and wonderful event with loads of games and coverage!
Shurayuki
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2665 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-25 22:47:38
November 25 2011 22:46 GMT
#4921
On November 26 2011 07:44 PG13 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:43 Makenshi wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:39 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:38 Micket wrote:
Just saying, Terrans have often complained about 'imbalance' when match ups have gotten closer to 50%. So, seeing Terran tears is often a good sign! Having said that, foreigner Terrans sure never win anything. Really wonder why they can't do as well as the Koreans whilst the foreign P and Z can at least compete.

Because, maybe, unlike what every whining kid on the internet thinks, terran actually isn't the easiest race?

Shocking, I know.


Out of curiosity, in your opinion if terran isn't the easiest which one do you think?

I'm not poking or anything just curious


I doubt anyone with a brain would say that protoss isn't the easiest race, lol


Oh boy you're about to have a stellar future on TL. Cheers

~~

Jinro i'd think his point was if terran 'whining' gets us anything beneath 90% Terrans in GSL, it's probably a good thing.

(why exactly are we playing Power Ranking and Race balance arguing again?)
なまいきになんなよ~ Don't be too stakka~ ☆ SKT Harlequin ☆ n.Die_soO Hoppin You ♪ 愛 am BeSt ♪ ワイフ♥小早川りんこ
Poopi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France13023 Posts
November 25 2011 22:46 GMT
#4922
On November 26 2011 07:45 Packawana wrote:
The thing I don't get is why is it that so many strong Korean players play Terran? Is it a cultural holdover from Brood War (4 out of 5 bonjwas are Terrans) or is it something else?

MarineKing played terran because of BoxeR I think (he was P on BW), TheStC too but not that sure.
So yeah that makes sense
WriterMaru
Fionn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States23455 Posts
November 25 2011 22:46 GMT
#4923
On November 26 2011 07:39 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:38 Micket wrote:
Just saying, Terrans have often complained about 'imbalance' when match ups have gotten closer to 50%. So, seeing Terran tears is often a good sign! Having said that, foreigner Terrans sure never win anything. Really wonder why they can't do as well as the Koreans whilst the foreign P and Z can at least compete.

Because, maybe, unlike what every whining kid on the internet thinks, terran actually isn't the easiest race?

Shocking, I know.


But they have mules!
Writerhttps://twitter.com/FionnOnFire
Xoronius
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany6362 Posts
November 25 2011 22:47 GMT
#4924
On November 26 2011 07:45 Bro_Stone wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:44 McFeser wrote:
9-10 Protosses, 2-3 Terrans, and and four zergs in the top 16. Any Koreans that are watching this must be really confused.


Haha, sad but true XD

I am just curious: Why is it sad?
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
November 25 2011 22:48 GMT
#4925
--- Nuked ---
MCDayC
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom14464 Posts
November 25 2011 22:48 GMT
#4926
On November 26 2011 07:45 CursedRich wrote:
Ive been very busy at work etc so I'm not sure if this was posted a lot already, but I just wanted to say that I really like this tournament format with the 2 group stages followed by knockout rounds - obviously not every event can match this because of numbers - but imagine if TSL4 had something similar

Agreed, this format is really good, as it gives lesser known players the chance to get known fairly, by beating top players.
VERY FRAGILE, LIKE A BABY PANDA EGG
Taug
Profile Joined March 2011
United States146 Posts
November 25 2011 22:48 GMT
#4927
On November 26 2011 07:43 WaSa wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:40 hugman wrote:
I'm disappointed by DH
Game quality is lower than most tournaments, so much sloppy play


me too. Maybe GSL/MLG has spoiled us too much.


I agree, this is quite a boring tournament. I hope next DH will have quality players.
The Golden Rule
Kilby
Profile Joined August 2010
Finland1069 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-25 22:53:16
November 25 2011 22:48 GMT
#4928
On November 26 2011 07:40 Kilby wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:37 Desert Fox wrote:
Well, I'm sorry if my posts offend you but my point was that WhiteRa has actually done very much for Starcraft overall and he is probably the number 1 foreigner overall considering SC1 and SC2. Admittably I do not know everything about SC1 history and maybe Idra can compete but I don't know if he has equally long bacground. As far as I have understood WhiteRa has been kicking ass longer than Idra.


Stop posting. Your opinion is obviously subjective, the idea of a number one is always subjective and you obviously have no idea what you're writing about if your opinion is prefaced with a "probably" after getting smacked down by everyone regarding it. Just let it go and move on.


By the way, If I can ask, why exactly do you take it so personally that you would ask someone to not post anything ever if you think someone's opinion is subjective and cannot be absolutely defined? Seems pretty strange to me.
hasuterrans
Profile Joined April 2009
United States614 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-25 22:50:59
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4929
On November 26 2011 07:34 Kilby wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:24 eourcs wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:16 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:10 R!! wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:07 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:00 mki wrote:
On November 26 2011 06:58 Kilby wrote:
WhiteRa is absolutely awesome. How many other pro player do you know who have been at the absolute top of the game at pro level for as long as he has.

He is probably the number 1 foreigner of all time. Easily.


It's pretty early to talk about #1 foreign players of all time. You'd have to include SC1 into this discussion because SC2 is too young to call players best of all time. And when you include SC1 then there are a bunch of names which come to mind...


Well, the good thing about talking about #1 foreigner of all time is that you can talk about them at any point in time. You don't need to wait for a new extension to come into play or more tourmanents to take place. You can talk about them at any point in time because they have such long history. And in my opinion the best would be WhiteRa. Just look at what he accomplished in BW and how he remained relevant in SC2 beta and then in SC2 after publish and even now. That guy is a legend.

I really don't wanna be condescending but how can you even begin to talk about the best players of all time with such a limited knowledge?Grrrr was the only foreign player to ever win an OSL and you don't even recognize him (or his akas), not that I think that you know how big of a deal that is.


Ok I admit that I don't know who was the #1 best foreigner in SC1 but when you talk about the best foreigner in Starcaft overall you have to take SC2 into account and in that sense I would imagine WhiteRa would rank pretty highly since he appanretly had some pretty big wins in SC1 as well.


You probably shouldn't these kinds of post if you don't know the history of starcraft. White-ra was a damn good foreigner, but as Idra has said, being a good foreigner is like doing well in retard school (not the exact quote, but captures the same meaning). In SC2, Whitera has done well, but he hasn't actually won much. If anything, IdrA has had way more success (in both SC1 and SC2).


Well, I'm sorry if my posts offend you but my point was that WhiteRa has actually done very much for Starcraft overall and he is probably the number 1 foreigner overall considering SC1 and SC2. Admittably I do not know everything about SC1 history and maybe Idra can compete but I don't know if he has equally long bacground. As far as I have understood WhiteRa has been kicking ass longer than Idra.


White-Ra was really good for a foreigner at SC1, but he wasn't the best foreigner, not even close.
Shurayuki
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2665 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4930
On November 26 2011 07:48 JimmiC wrote:
I think the which race is the easiest discussion is stupid. They are all very different and require different skill sets. If one race was that much easiesr most or all smart pros would play that race since there livelyhood depends on it. The easiest race would probably only matter to bronze players. Or could come down to whats easier to pull off a 6 pool a 4 gate or a 2 rax.


easy =/= win at these levels though
なまいきになんなよ~ Don't be too stakka~ ☆ SKT Harlequin ☆ n.Die_soO Hoppin You ♪ 愛 am BeSt ♪ ワイフ♥小早川りんこ
McFeser
Profile Joined July 2011
United States2458 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4931
On November 26 2011 07:47 Xoronius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:45 Bro_Stone wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:44 McFeser wrote:
9-10 Protosses, 2-3 Terrans, and and four zergs in the top 16. Any Koreans that are watching this must be really confused.


Haha, sad but true XD

I am just curious: Why is it sad?

Because in Korean Terran dominance his so widespread and on the flipside there are hardly ever any Protosses in the top 4 (It is changing though)
Promethelax still hasn't changed his quote
Micket
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom2163 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4932
So everyone agrees that Terran is really hard and why foreigners can't be successful with it, yet they are constantly nerfed because of a stupid format in Code S. Players like Select, Thorzain and Sjow must be scratching their heads. Blizzard should leave the game alone.
Serinox
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany5224 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4933
Wow my love for TLO is just increasing incredible right now!!!~~ <3
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4934
On November 26 2011 07:41 Bro_Stone wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:39 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:38 Micket wrote:
Just saying, Terrans have often complained about 'imbalance' when match ups have gotten closer to 50%. So, seeing Terran tears is often a good sign! Having said that, foreigner Terrans sure never win anything. Really wonder why they can't do as well as the Koreans whilst the foreign P and Z can at least compete.

Because, maybe, unlike what every whining kid on the internet thinks, terran actually isn't the easiest race?

Shocking, I know.


True, most games I see of TvP for example is Terran trying to exploit a weakness while Protoss just defends defends defends until 200 supply and push with 15 WG...


It's not really Protoss' fault. Right now, playing turtle Toss, as boring as it may be, is probably optimal over more agressive play. That's probably part of why MC is not doing very well in PvT despite every other korean Toss being a beast in that matchup as of late. MC turtling to get mass tech and mass upgrades? Lol.

Now, with quicker upgrades, and EMP being much weaker, Terran's late game is apparently way inferior to Protoss late game, which makes turtling impossible for Terran.

Conclusion, PvT is indeed a shitty matchup.
I would say though. One base terran and random proxy rax are as strong as ever (too strong imo) and we always see Terrans randomly win with that regardless or their weaker late game. HotS needs to change all that, I hope.

And as I write that, Happy is one base all-inning as in all his TvP I believe.
Bro_Stone
Profile Joined April 2011
United States510 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4935
On November 26 2011 07:47 Xoronius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:45 Bro_Stone wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:44 McFeser wrote:
9-10 Protosses, 2-3 Terrans, and and four zergs in the top 16. Any Koreans that are watching this must be really confused.


Haha, sad but true XD

I am just curious: Why is it sad?


Because in GSL Code S in the last few month=60% terran 30% zerg 10% protoss?
Stim Go Go GO!
Shurayuki
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2665 Posts
November 25 2011 22:49 GMT
#4936
On November 26 2011 07:49 hasuterrans wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:34 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:24 eourcs wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:16 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:10 R!! wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:07 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:00 mki wrote:
On November 26 2011 06:58 Kilby wrote:
WhiteRa is absolutely awesome. How many other pro player do you know who have been at the absolute top of the game at pro level for as long as he has.

He is probably the number 1 foreigner of all time. Easily.


It's pretty early to talk about #1 foreign players of all time. You'd have to include SC1 into this discussion because SC2 is too young to call players best of all time. And when you include SC1 then there are a bunch of names which come to mind...


Well, the good thing about talking about #1 foreigner of all time is that you can talk about them at any point in time. You don't need to wait for a new extension to come into play or more tourmanents to take place. You can talk about them at any point in time because they have such long history. And in my opinion the best would be WhiteRa. Just look at what he accomplished in BW and how he remained relevant in SC2 beta and then in SC2 after publish and even now. That guy is a legend.

I really don't wanna be condescending but how can you even begin to talk about the best players of all time with such a limited knowledge?Grrrr was the only foreign player to ever win an OSL and you don't even recognize him (or his akas), not that I think that you know how big of a deal that is.


Ok I admit that I don't know who was the #1 best foreigner in SC1 but when you talk about the best foreigner in Starcaft overall you have to take SC2 into account and in that sense I would imagine WhiteRa would rank pretty highly since he appanretly had some pretty big wins in SC1 as well.


You probably shouldn't these kinds of post if you don't know the history of starcraft. White-ra was a damn good foreigner, but as Idra has said, being a good foreigner is like doing well in retard school (not the exact quote, but captures the same meaning). In SC2, Whitera has done well, but he hasn't actually won much. If anything, IdrA has had way more success (in both SC1 and SC2).


Well, I'm sorry if my posts offend you but my point was that WhiteRa has actually done very much for Starcraft overall and he is probably the number 1 foreigner overall considering SC1 and SC2. Admittably I do not know everything about SC1 history and maybe Idra can compete but I don't know if he has equally long bacground. As far as I have understood WhiteRa has been kicking ass longer than Idra.


White-Ra was really good for a foreigner at SC1, but he wasn't the best foreigner, not even close. His mechanics just weren't good enough for the highest levels of BW : \


good enough for Boxer *snip*
なまいきになんなよ~ Don't be too stakka~ ☆ SKT Harlequin ☆ n.Die_soO Hoppin You ♪ 愛 am BeSt ♪ ワイフ♥小早川りんこ
MingusDew
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States77 Posts
November 25 2011 22:50 GMT
#4937
After seeing White-Ra go 4-0 I'm excited to see what, "special tactics," he'll pull out for fun against Sjow.
Do not worry if you have built your castles in the air. They are where they should be. Now put the foundations under them.
leo23
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States3075 Posts
November 25 2011 22:50 GMT
#4938
On November 26 2011 07:48 Taug wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:43 WaSa wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:40 hugman wrote:
I'm disappointed by DH
Game quality is lower than most tournaments, so much sloppy play


me too. Maybe GSL/MLG has spoiled us too much.


I agree, this is quite a boring tournament. I hope next DH will have quality players.


Yeah I agree with these sentiments even though there has been a couple of good games here and there
banelings
Micket
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom2163 Posts
November 25 2011 22:51 GMT
#4939
On November 26 2011 07:46 Poopi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:45 Packawana wrote:
The thing I don't get is why is it that so many strong Korean players play Terran? Is it a cultural holdover from Brood War (4 out of 5 bonjwas are Terrans) or is it something else?

MarineKing played terran because of BoxeR I think (he was P on BW), TheStC too but not that sure.
So yeah that makes sense

MVP as well. In fact, tons of them.
eourcs
Profile Joined February 2011
United States459 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-25 22:51:46
November 25 2011 22:51 GMT
#4940
On November 26 2011 07:48 Kilby wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2011 07:40 Kilby wrote:
On November 26 2011 07:37 Desert Fox wrote:
Well, I'm sorry if my posts offend you but my point was that WhiteRa has actually done very much for Starcraft overall and he is probably the number 1 foreigner overall considering SC1 and SC2. Admittably I do not know everything about SC1 history and maybe Idra can compete but I don't know if he has equally long bacground. As far as I have understood WhiteRa has been kicking ass longer than Idra.


Stop posting. Your opinion is obviously subjective, the idea of a number one is always subjective and you obviously have no idea what you're writing about if your opinion is prefaced with a "probably" after getting smacked down by everyone regarding it. Just let it go and move on.



By the way, If I can ask, why exactly do you take it so personally that you would ask someone to not post anything ever if you think someone's opinion is subjective and cannot be absolutely defined? Seems pretty strange to me.


Maybe before you state such a bold opinion on a subject you obviously have no idea about, you should attempt this thing called research.
Masters Terran | Strelok after losing to Kas' BCs "FUUUUUCK" *Stream Offline* | "Fuck hellions. Fuck them in the ass" IdrA
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