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It's disheartening to hear about Tyler. I like him in StoG, he is very articulate and says a lot of worthwhile interesting things in the community.
I don't know the exact reasons, but it sounds like a battle against himself. Losing comes with the territory in Starcraft 2. It's how you deal with it is the ultimate test of character. I personally compare this game to tennis or any other individual sport 1v1.
Competitive people get frustrated with themselves, when they know they made mistakes, when know they can play better. They beat themselves up, smash their own rackets, keyboards, etc. They are constantly questioning themselves. It's not fun when you feel that way.
Sometimes it can help drive you to become better, other times it can mentually drain you and deter you from becoming better, you end up just being angry. It's a hurdle hopefully Tyler will overcome. Don't give up man!
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On September 26 2011 18:20 ShatterZer0 wrote:
Why did NASL even show that first match? Were they trying to make threads go crazy? Why didn't they just say it was a walk-over after talking it over with TT1 or something...? I mean, they can and should fine Liquid'Tyler if it was a purposeful disconnect... but otherwise... I just don't get it...
Dont you think that would be disprespectful towards TT1? He won the first game fair and square as far as we know, and was prepared to take the next sets too, why would you dismiss his achievment? Just to protect another player who was obliged to play the second one, even if he felt he had no chance? I wonder if he loses money from the security deposit.
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I hope we will get proper response from TL without eye washing.
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I agree. Basically every TL player had longer slumps but yet you could always see that they tried to succumb it and they always showed good manners and professionalism. Tyler on the other hand seems unable to do so for whatever reasons.
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So, I was doing this project at work.
Not that I put my best effort to prepare for it but still, it didn't turn out the way I wanted.
So, I fucking stormed out of my office without telling anyone at work and drove off.
But I think it's going to be OK. They will still give me another project soon, I'm sure.
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I think Tyler is much the same as Idra. Both are BW pros who shared good success in that game and transferred over to SC2. Both get frustrated when they play poorly or are out played and are prone to rage quit / bm (Idra more so than Tyler). Both describe SC2 as "not a real game" and would perfer to play BW if they could make as good of a living off it.
I just think Tyler's heart isn't in SC2. Maybe he has to wait for his contract with Stride to end to take a prolonged absence from the game, but I feel he should do so when he can. If you don't enjoy what you're doing (and I personally feel Tyler does not), why keep forcing yourself to do it. Taking some time off from having to play, practice and do things like STOG would probably be good for him. He may never play SC2 again professionally if he does it, but as long as he's happy that should be good enough for all his fans.
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On September 26 2011 21:53 CptGrackSparrow wrote:
I think Tyler is much the same as Idra. Both are BW pros who shared good success in that game and transferred over to SC2. Both get frustrated when they play poorly or are out played and are prone to rage quit / bm (Idra more so than Tyler). Both describe SC2 as "not a real game" and would perfer to play BW if they could make as good of a living off it.
I just think Tyler's heart isn't in SC2. Maybe he has to wait for his contract with Stride to end to take a prolonged absence from the game, but I feel he should do so when he can. If you don't enjoy what you're doing (and I personally feel Tyler does not), why keep forcing yourself to do it. Taking some time off from having to play, practice and do things like STOG would probably be good for him. He may never play SC2 again professionally if he does it, but as long as he's happy that should be good enough for all his fans.
IdrA ~ Tyler in BW, sure. But to be fair, IdrA >>> Tyler in SC2, and that's not even up for debate. IdrA's shown plenty of results, and even though he's not performing incredibly well right now, Tyler's pretty much produced nothing in the entire year that SC2 has been out.
And people shouldn't be giving Tyler hypothetical credit if he's not actually dedicating himself to the game. Saying things like "He'd win everything if only he practiced" takes away the credit from the people who actually worked hard and won tournaments.
I hope Tyler starts shaping up and kicking ass. Really, I do. But how fast do people jump on the "lol Player X used to be amazing at SC2 but now he's fucking terrible" bandwagon but give Tyler a free pass because he was a foreigner legend at BW- and never even the best at SC2 to begin with? FruitDealer is shit; IdrA is terrible; MC is in Code B lol wtf; but Tyler... yeah he'd kick ass if only he'd try!
And I think Tyler is honest with himself; I just think it's the people who are overzealously obsessed with him who aren't. I'm a fan of Nony; but not so much of Tyler.
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On September 26 2011 05:27 Montana[TK] wrote:
if there were lines for PuMa vs TLO I'd take Puma 1.05 for my entire BR
And you'd be feeling a little iffy after game 2. 
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On September 26 2011 21:20 fritos wrote:
So, I was doing this project at work.
Not that I put my best effort to prepare for it but still, it didn't turn out the way I wanted.
So, I fucking stormed out of my office without telling anyone at work and drove off.
But I think it's going to be OK. They will still give me another project soon, I'm sure.
If you were a progamer, you would get one. I guess QQ-ing about your job is the new "terran op" :D
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On September 26 2011 14:08 DystopiaX wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2011 13:43 Imbak333 wrote:On September 26 2011 13:23 DystopiaX wrote:On September 26 2011 13:10 0neder wrote:On September 26 2011 12:47 FrankWalls wrote:On September 26 2011 12:34 Bashion wrote:On September 26 2011 12:32 Maghetti wrote:
Last time I visited Tylers stream he said he "hadn't played in a week" with this coming only a few weeks after he said on state of the game that he was finally practicing hard. I don't know what his issues are but I do not feel he should be allowed to stay in TL anymore if he isn't going to take it seriously and ragequit midway in a NASL series(assuming that is what he did because he didn't even answer his phone). This week he started to stream. Lost the first game to a random zerg. Got mad and simply quit. I feel bad for Tyler. He has good mechanics, lots of creativity and raw talent. Too bad he doesnt take the game serious like other progamers do. i dont think people not taking the game seriously would get that upset about losing Yeah you can, if you have an elitist attitude and think you can somehow cheat the system and get by on raw talent alone. The fact is Tyler could own almost anyone if he practiced half as much as Koreans do. But he doesn't, which is the point. Sc2 doesn't run on raw talent alone, otherwise Stephano would arguably be the SC2 Bonjwa. It also runs on commitment, drive, and practice time, which Tyler has been lacking. Does he have the talent? Yeah. But hypotheticals such as "he would own up IF..." mean nothing, because he didn't. Where did all this Stephano praise come from all of a sudden? I feel like EVERYONE is saying he has the most talent out of any player on earth, but I have no idea why. What has he won? All this hype for him materialized out of nothing, I swear >.> I never said he was the best, just that he had the most talent. And I think he does, because apparently he managed to be a top tier EU player while only practicing 2 hours a day, which is ridiculous. I'm not going as far as other people as to say he's top3 zergs in the world or whatever, just that his practice time to payoff ratio is ridiculous.
Correct me if I'm wrong but it's kind of summer. He's probably been practicing full or at least close to fulltime for 2 months. To call him the most talented sc2 player of all because he topped EU ladder, and beat some koreans in an online qualifier, and a couple small online tournaments is just ridiculous I'm sorry. Maybe if he won MLG practicing 2 hours a day.
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NASL has lost a lot of viewers compared to the first regular season. I guess people caught on that the real meat of the league lies in the final tournament.
Tyler should start easing into more of a coaching role at TL, seeing him struggle like this is painful to watch. I know he was great in BW etc etc, but not everyone can make the transition successfully. He has been a part of one of the strongest teams in the world for a year now and he has basically nothing to show for it in terms of achievements.
He'll be a great asset to assist the other TL members as a coach/mentor type of figure.
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I hate to bring this up too much in these threads, but Tyler has a lot of stuff he's dealing with and it's not as simple as him just deciding to be serious about the game and practicing (if it was, he would have done it ages ago), he explained parts of this himself on SoTG which he absolutely didn't have to do given the personal nature of the problem. Also his "ragequits" and outbursts aren't intended and aren't due to anger or disrespect to his opponents, I hope everyone realizes this.
Let's keep in mind that Tyler isn't just some progamer, he's also been a member of this community for a long time. Obviously he wouldn't get as much respect and support (or special treatment, if you will) if he didn't do something to deserve it in the past. If you can't find it in your heart to respect that, at least refrain from piling on the relentless criticism every time something like this happens (and it's not that it happens often anyway).
The "he would kick ass if he practiced" posts can be a bit over the top, but it's mainly a way of showing support. It's partially true anyway, because someone's raw rts talent doesn't just go away even after an extended period of not practicing.
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On September 26 2011 23:52 Bobster wrote:
Tyler should start easing into more of a coaching role at TL, seeing him struggle like this is painful to watch. I know he was great in BW etc etc, but not everyone can make the transition successfully. He has been a part of one of the strongest teams in the world for a year now and he has basically nothing to show for it in terms of achievements.
He'll be a great asset to assist the other TL members as a coach/mentor type of figure.
If TL would tak that stance they would be left with 3-4 players max. And extra P and Z coaches that frankly TL doesnt need. What can Tyler teach Hero about Sc2?
On September 26 2011 23:45 Olinim wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2011 14:08 DystopiaX wrote:On September 26 2011 13:43 Imbak333 wrote:On September 26 2011 13:23 DystopiaX wrote:On September 26 2011 13:10 0neder wrote:On September 26 2011 12:47 FrankWalls wrote:On September 26 2011 12:34 Bashion wrote:On September 26 2011 12:32 Maghetti wrote:
Last time I visited Tylers stream he said he "hadn't played in a week" with this coming only a few weeks after he said on state of the game that he was finally practicing hard. I don't know what his issues are but I do not feel he should be allowed to stay in TL anymore if he isn't going to take it seriously and ragequit midway in a NASL series(assuming that is what he did because he didn't even answer his phone). This week he started to stream. Lost the first game to a random zerg. Got mad and simply quit. I feel bad for Tyler. He has good mechanics, lots of creativity and raw talent. Too bad he doesnt take the game serious like other progamers do. i dont think people not taking the game seriously would get that upset about losing Yeah you can, if you have an elitist attitude and think you can somehow cheat the system and get by on raw talent alone. The fact is Tyler could own almost anyone if he practiced half as much as Koreans do. But he doesn't, which is the point. Sc2 doesn't run on raw talent alone, otherwise Stephano would arguably be the SC2 Bonjwa. It also runs on commitment, drive, and practice time, which Tyler has been lacking. Does he have the talent? Yeah. But hypotheticals such as "he would own up IF..." mean nothing, because he didn't. Where did all this Stephano praise come from all of a sudden? I feel like EVERYONE is saying he has the most talent out of any player on earth, but I have no idea why. What has he won? All this hype for him materialized out of nothing, I swear >.> I never said he was the best, just that he had the most talent. And I think he does, because apparently he managed to be a top tier EU player while only practicing 2 hours a day, which is ridiculous. I'm not going as far as other people as to say he's top3 zergs in the world or whatever, just that his practice time to payoff ratio is ridiculous. Correct me if I'm wrong but it's kind of summer. He's probably been practicing full or at least close to fulltime for 2 months. To call him the most talented sc2 player of all because he topped EU ladder, and beat some koreans in an online qualifier, and a couple small online tournaments is just ridiculous I'm sorry. Maybe if he won MLG practicing 2 hours a day.
Those small EU online torunaments at some times are more stacked than MLG...
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On September 26 2011 23:45 Olinim wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2011 14:08 DystopiaX wrote:On September 26 2011 13:43 Imbak333 wrote:On September 26 2011 13:23 DystopiaX wrote:On September 26 2011 13:10 0neder wrote:On September 26 2011 12:47 FrankWalls wrote:On September 26 2011 12:34 Bashion wrote:On September 26 2011 12:32 Maghetti wrote:
Last time I visited Tylers stream he said he "hadn't played in a week" with this coming only a few weeks after he said on state of the game that he was finally practicing hard. I don't know what his issues are but I do not feel he should be allowed to stay in TL anymore if he isn't going to take it seriously and ragequit midway in a NASL series(assuming that is what he did because he didn't even answer his phone). This week he started to stream. Lost the first game to a random zerg. Got mad and simply quit. I feel bad for Tyler. He has good mechanics, lots of creativity and raw talent. Too bad he doesnt take the game serious like other progamers do. i dont think people not taking the game seriously would get that upset about losing Yeah you can, if you have an elitist attitude and think you can somehow cheat the system and get by on raw talent alone. The fact is Tyler could own almost anyone if he practiced half as much as Koreans do. But he doesn't, which is the point. Sc2 doesn't run on raw talent alone, otherwise Stephano would arguably be the SC2 Bonjwa. It also runs on commitment, drive, and practice time, which Tyler has been lacking. Does he have the talent? Yeah. But hypotheticals such as "he would own up IF..." mean nothing, because he didn't. Where did all this Stephano praise come from all of a sudden? I feel like EVERYONE is saying he has the most talent out of any player on earth, but I have no idea why. What has he won? All this hype for him materialized out of nothing, I swear >.> I never said he was the best, just that he had the most talent. And I think he does, because apparently he managed to be a top tier EU player while only practicing 2 hours a day, which is ridiculous. I'm not going as far as other people as to say he's top3 zergs in the world or whatever, just that his practice time to payoff ratio is ridiculous. Correct me if I'm wrong but it's kind of summer. He's probably been practicing full or at least close to fulltime for 2 months. To call him the most talented sc2 player of all because he topped EU ladder, and beat some koreans in an online qualifier, and a couple small online tournaments is just ridiculous I'm sorry. Maybe if he won MLG practicing 2 hours a day.
Please follow the european scene more closely, to call that ridiculous. The online tournaments he won weren`t small and against the top of the european scene. Just yesterday he won 500 pounds at the Dignitas Invitational beating Kas, Socke and ToD.
In LAN environment he beat Huk, Sen, took a game of Puma. And that was some months ago.
And when people state that he has the most talent, its their opinion. Talent means, he will win something big, not that he already did it.
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On September 27 2011 00:05 Frankon wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2011 23:52 Bobster wrote:
Tyler should start easing into more of a coaching role at TL, seeing him struggle like this is painful to watch. I know he was great in BW etc etc, but not everyone can make the transition successfully. He has been a part of one of the strongest teams in the world for a year now and he has basically nothing to show for it in terms of achievements.
He'll be a great asset to assist the other TL members as a coach/mentor type of figure. If TL would tak that stance they would be left with 3-4 players max. And extra P and Z coaches that frankly TL doesnt need. What can Tyler teach Hero about Sc2?
No, they'd go from 7 to 6 active players.
And it's not only about "teaching" - it's about observing, talking strategy, support and having a knowledgeable "outsider" perspective at hand. Remember Tyler coaching Huk in the finals at Dreamhack? Tyler really looked at ease there, I think he would fit well into that coach/mentor role.
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On September 26 2011 23:40 n00b3rt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2011 21:20 fritos wrote:
So, I was doing this project at work.
Not that I put my best effort to prepare for it but still, it didn't turn out the way I wanted.
So, I fucking stormed out of my office without telling anyone at work and drove off.
But I think it's going to be OK. They will still give me another project soon, I'm sure.
If you were a progamer, you would get one. I guess QQ-ing about your job is the new "terran op" :D
I was actually making a point of how ridiculous Tyler's actions were. (I was being sarcastic about the whole work story). There is no way that kinda action can fly in real professional world.
Do you want people to consider e-sport as a real professional sport?
How can we make that claim when the actual e-sport players like Tyler who shows no repect for his opponent, the league, fans, mostly importantly e-sport?
In real professional world, not only he would get fired for his action but it will be hard for him to get a job anywhere.
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I remember the discussion about Puma and EG - where is a statement of TeamLiquid? On this site most users "asked" fpr a statement from EG within 12 or 24 hours. I dont say that I liked the way people bashing EG for the late statement (it wasnt a late statement), but here we got a similar case where a statement is required and most of the community says... nothing.
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On September 27 2011 01:47 slimbo1 wrote:
I remember the discussion about Puma and EG - where is a statement of TeamLiquid? On this site most users "asked" fpr a statement from EG within 12 or 24 hours. I dont say that I liked the way people bashing EG for the late statement (it wasnt a late statement), but here we got a similar case where a statement is required and most of the community says... nothing.
Meh. I just think we'd like Tyler to clear the air, but I don't think the situation is nearly as important as clarification regarding player contracts (like the Puma or Stephano controversies).
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Sure it is not that important. But its funny how the player LiquidTyler was talking really bad about the whole EG-Puma situation and that he would never join a team like EG and now there is this curious situation.
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Oh yes! TheGunRun ftwwwww. so long time since i've heard him :'(
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EPT
