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On July 07 2011 08:19 BjC wrote:
I just jumped straight to the last page of the thread as i wondered the reaction to the games and been out all day. How has an Idra disscussion hijacked the thread?? who cares about idra all the time?? In every tournament american idra fanboys bring him up. Why? Really? Why? He is a decent player, but one of many "decent players". He hasent won anything meaningfull and is a shame to his sport alot of the time due to his constant moaning and disrespect. Also IPL wasnt a meaningfull win for him. It was NA only and im sure if any Koreans or even europeans were in it they would of smashed most of those players that took part outta the tournament.
Big Cheer for Huk finishing top of his group. Happy MC made it out too, should be a good rematch from homestory cup between those two in the next round. =]
You've never heard of Idra's law? Any discussion of players will inevitably resolve itself into a discussion of Idra. By calling it Idra's law, we are doubly invoking Idra's law.
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On July 07 2011 09:13 lorkac wrote:
I LOVE biased commentary because I keep hoping we get two people with opposing opinions cast the same game. I'm talking verbal flamewar during a match--it'd be hilarious.
That did happen a few times in the past between Artosis and Tastless when Artosis was Z and Tastless was P. (In a very subtle fashion) Tastless usually doesn't have player-based bias but lacks game knowledge compared to Artosis, so that might be a reason why Tastless tries to avoid label/rank players like Artosis does (blatantly and sometimes obnoxiously).
But now that both are Protoss, Tastless lets Artosis get away with most of his biased comments without countering. Tastless does try to fill the void as much as he could, though, which I appreciate.
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On July 07 2011 09:29 usethis2 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 09:13 lorkac wrote:
I LOVE biased commentary because I keep hoping we get two people with opposing opinions cast the same game. I'm talking verbal flamewar during a match--it'd be hilarious. That did happen a few times in the past between Artosis and Tastless when Artosis was Z and Tastless was P. (In a very subtle fashion) Tastless usually doesn't have player-based bias but lacks game knowledge compared to Artosis, so that might be a reason why Tastless tries to avoid label/rank players like Artosis does (blatantly and sometimes obnoxiously). But now that both are Protoss, Tastless lets Artosis get away with most of his biased comments without countering. Tastless does try to fill the void as much as he could, though, which I appreciate.
What protoss biased comments has Artosis been saying? I haven't noticed any.
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On July 07 2011 08:07 lorkac wrote:
Idra has more raw talent than Huk.
Huk has more practice than Idra.
This is the classic foreigner vs Korean debate isn't it?
There's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. It's not like a physical sport where your body type and athleticism can play a huge role in how good you are. The amount of practice you put in directly correlates to how good you will be in Starcraft 2. Where do you think IdrA got that "raw talent" from anyways? It's his great mechanics carrying over from BW where he was one of the hardest working foreigners.
Also, I don't see how it's a foreigner vs Korean debate. It seems more like a who is the best foreigner debate.
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On July 07 2011 09:51 JKira wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 08:07 lorkac wrote:
Idra has more raw talent than Huk.
Huk has more practice than Idra.
This is the classic foreigner vs Korean debate isn't it? There's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. It's not like a physical sport where your body type and athleticism can play a huge role in how good you are. The amount of practice you put in directly correlates to how good you will be in Starcraft 2. Where do you think IdrA got that "raw talent" from anyways? It's his great mechanics carrying over from BW where he was one of the hardest working foreigners. Also, I don't see how it's a foreigner vs Korean debate. It seems more like a who is the best foreigner debate.
Just like there is no such thing as raw talent when it comes to how good you are academically.
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On July 07 2011 09:51 JKira wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 08:07 lorkac wrote:
Idra has more raw talent than Huk.
Huk has more practice than Idra.
This is the classic foreigner vs Korean debate isn't it? There's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. It's not like a physical sport where your body type and athleticism can play a huge role in how good you are. The amount of practice you put in directly correlates to how good you will be in Starcraft 2. Where do you think IdrA got that "raw talent" from anyways? It's his great mechanics carrying over from BW where he was one of the hardest working foreigners. Also, I don't see how it's a foreigner vs Korean debate. It seems more like a who is the best foreigner debate.
there are factors other than practice time that contribute to winning. some ppl call it talent, others intelligence, others ...other stuff...
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I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can.
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On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can.
QFT. Do you think Flash is this good because he practices more than his teammates? Give me a break.
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On July 07 2011 09:51 JKira wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 08:07 lorkac wrote:
Idra has more raw talent than Huk.
Huk has more practice than Idra.
This is the classic foreigner vs Korean debate isn't it? There's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. It's not like a physical sport where your body type and athleticism can play a huge role in how good you are. The amount of practice you put in directly correlates to how good you will be in Starcraft 2. Where do you think IdrA got that "raw talent" from anyways? It's his great mechanics carrying over from BW where he was one of the hardest working foreigners. Also, I don't see how it's a foreigner vs Korean debate. It seems more like a who is the best foreigner debate.
That's rubbish. There's plenty raw talent in video games. Countless Brood War players play all day, but there's only one Flash.
You've never met people who are just good at all video games as soon as they play them?
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On July 07 2011 09:23 KimJongChill wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 08:19 BjC wrote:
I just jumped straight to the last page of the thread as i wondered the reaction to the games and been out all day. How has an Idra disscussion hijacked the thread?? who cares about idra all the time?? In every tournament american idra fanboys bring him up. Why? Really? Why? He is a decent player, but one of many "decent players". He hasent won anything meaningfull and is a shame to his sport alot of the time due to his constant moaning and disrespect. Also IPL wasnt a meaningfull win for him. It was NA only and im sure if any Koreans or even europeans were in it they would of smashed most of those players that took part outta the tournament.
Big Cheer for Huk finishing top of his group. Happy MC made it out too, should be a good rematch from homestory cup between those two in the next round. =]
You've never heard of Idra's law? Any discussion of players will inevitably resolve itself into a discussion of Idra. By calling it Idra's law, we are doubly invoking Idra's law.
It's the haters.
Huk wins a game, so someone has to snidely make a "hurr durr i wonder what idra thinks about dat, i bet he so jelly"
It's never the fans that start this shit =/
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On July 07 2011 10:49 PHC wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can. QFT. Do you think Flash is this good because he practices more than his teammates? Give me a break.
Why do people always come up bw analogies when they have no clue?
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On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can.
Because you can change your mind much more easily than you can change your body. (Almost) anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation, but a lot of people simply don`t have the genes to be a good sprinter. Something like table tennis would be in the middle, I guess.
Imagine someone who has the raw talent to be a murderer. It certainly is a fair assumption, but you wouldn't just let that go, right? You'd try to change that. It doesn't have to be a major factor in your life. If you have the raw talent to get cancer there's not much you can do.
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On July 07 2011 11:30 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can. Because you can change your mind much more easily than you can change your body. (Almost) anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation, but a lot of people simply don`t have the genes to be a good sprinter. Something like table tennis would be in the middle, I guess. Imagine someone who has the raw talent to be a murderer. It certainly is a fair assumption, but you wouldn't just let that go, right? You'd try to change that. It doesn't have to be a major factor in your life. If you have the raw talent to get cancer there's not much you can do.
LOL... that's just crazy. The mind is definitely much harder to change than the body. Obviously there are things that just won't change (for instance, your height), but saying that it's easy to change your mind is just ridiculous.
You don't become smarter by studying more, you just know more stuff. What your mind can do with that knowledge and training is not something easy to modify. Some people just don't have the genes to be a great scientist.
God that statement is so incredibly ignorant I can't even find a decent way to answer.
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On July 07 2011 11:30 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can. Because you can change your mind much more easily than you can change your body. (Almost) anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation, but a lot of people simply don`t have the genes to be a good sprinter. Something like table tennis would be in the middle, I guess. Imagine someone who has the raw talent to be a murderer. It certainly is a fair assumption, but you wouldn't just let that go, right? You'd try to change that. It doesn't have to be a major factor in your life. If you have the raw talent to get cancer there's not much you can do.
No they really really cant. I'm mid way through a PhD in engineering and it certainly isn't possible for everyone. It takes a combination of motivation and talent imagining someone could work hard and catch up is wrong, I have seen plenty of people work hard and fail.
Also I find it odd people don't think that starcraft requires physical prowess, have you watched their hands flying over the keyboard.
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Huk is on fire! I'm usuall a total korean homer, but he's a talented guy, and I'm glad he's winning! He's not scary yet, but I can totally see him taking out MC, who seems to have become quite inconsistent!
He seems to have developed a very acute "sense of danger" that comes from having being beaten by EVERYTHING in the past few months.
The ability to practice hard and well is a talent in itself.
On an aside, I dreamt that OGSTop was winning this GSL. My money's on him now.
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On July 07 2011 11:30 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can. Because you can change your mind much more easily than you can change your body. (Almost) anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation, but a lot of people simply don`t have the genes to be a good sprinter. Something like table tennis would be in the middle, I guess. Imagine someone who has the raw talent to be a murderer. It certainly is a fair assumption, but you wouldn't just let that go, right? You'd try to change that. It doesn't have to be a major factor in your life. If you have the raw talent to get cancer there's not much you can do.
Uhhh... I really don't know how to respond to this, other than you're really, really wrong. Anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation? While I'd argue that you're even wrong on that, I'd like to point out that your point is completely unrelated to what I'm saying. I'm talking about raw talent, while you're talking about being able to be good given enough practice and motivation. Those two are different things.
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On July 07 2011 11:43 BRJ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 11:30 Redmark wrote:On July 07 2011 10:29 HolyArrow wrote:
I don't get why people think there's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. Your mind can naturally develop differently than others, just as your body can. Because you can change your mind much more easily than you can change your body. (Almost) anyone can be a good scientist given enough study and motivation, but a lot of people simply don`t have the genes to be a good sprinter. Something like table tennis would be in the middle, I guess. Imagine someone who has the raw talent to be a murderer. It certainly is a fair assumption, but you wouldn't just let that go, right? You'd try to change that. It doesn't have to be a major factor in your life. If you have the raw talent to get cancer there's not much you can do. No they really really cant. I'm mid way through a PhD in engineering and it certainly isn't possible for everyone. It takes a combination of motivation and talent imagining someone could work hard and catch up is wrong, I have seen plenty of people work hard and fail. Also I find it odd people don't think that starcraft requires physical prowess, have you watched their hands flying over the keyboard.
I don't really care to jump in on the talent argument, but keep in mind that there are factors besides raw talent that contribute to one's success (or lack thereof) in academic environments.
Having said that ... the Starcraft "physical prowess" can be trained. Yes, there are people who just have fast fingers, but even someone with mediocre hand speed can attain an insanely high APM once the movements become muscle memory. I mean, if you want a comparison, take a look at concert pianists: I assure you that not all of them were born with fast fingers. 
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On July 07 2011 09:55 OwlFeet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 09:51 JKira wrote:On July 07 2011 08:07 lorkac wrote:
Idra has more raw talent than Huk.
Huk has more practice than Idra.
This is the classic foreigner vs Korean debate isn't it? There's no such thing as raw talent when it comes to video games. It's not like a physical sport where your body type and athleticism can play a huge role in how good you are. The amount of practice you put in directly correlates to how good you will be in Starcraft 2. Where do you think IdrA got that "raw talent" from anyways? It's his great mechanics carrying over from BW where he was one of the hardest working foreigners. Also, I don't see how it's a foreigner vs Korean debate. It seems more like a who is the best foreigner debate. Just like there is no such thing as raw talent when it comes to how good you are academically.
Gauss would beg to differ.
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Wow, you people are talking some crazy stuff, and some of the statements almost made me retaliate with some deeply personal things I don't want to talk about with such people.
I think I'll stop checking on LR threads after the games are finished.
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I am really upset when MC and Huk have to fight each other...This bracket is fcked up
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EPT
