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On May 23 2011 19:36 KvltMan wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is. IdrA won the series vs LaLush.
I'm just referring to the first game. Idra got outmicroed and out multitasked that game; he played pretty poorly and honestly LaLush isn't amazing from what I've seen. Its really not a surprise he lost to Zenio, who's a lot better than people give him credit for.
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On May 23 2011 23:20 iokke wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 17:00 Defacer wrote:On May 23 2011 13:46 iokke wrote:On May 23 2011 12:31 Hazu~ wrote:On May 23 2011 12:30 Dexington wrote:
Idra's ZvZ is awful it seems IdrA himself said he wasn't so sure about his ZvZ since there's pretty much no good zerg player on NA server to play against. How is it that every time Idra loses there is always an excuse to be found? Balance, race, wrong type of practice. Don't get me wrong, he is an amazing player and would crush me with both his hands tied behind his back. But this seems very disrespectful to players that won vs him, give them some credit plz? I mean really, is it not possible that someone would beat Idra simply because they are better at the game atm? On a positive note, first time watching ZvZ and I really enjoyed it, as well as NASL in general, thanks! Um, how does saying that there are no high caliber players on the NA server disrespectful towards Sen or Zenio? If anything, he's saying that Sen and Zenio are so much better than North American Zergs that it's difficult for him to prepare against them. It's actually a compliment and shows just how much IdrA respects Korean Zergs, silly-pants. Because some of the posts I read have an undertone that feels like ppl are saying that Idra would walk all other Sen or Zenio if he had the same practice partners. But I'm probably reading too much between the lines... I guess you are right though, having better practice partners makes a big difference and no disrespect was implied by Idra himself. But like the other poster said, he should probably practice on EU then if Korea is too laggy. Or watch more Korean replays? I know its not the same as actual practice, but with his understanding of the game he should be able to tell exactly what goes on in players' minds and how metagame changes.
I doubt a lot of pros consider laddering a legitimate form of practice. From reading a lot of post game interviews from Koreans, even they don't take the ladder all that seriously.
In the Korean scene, pros help other pros practice [not necessarily teammates]. Just read a few interviews and the people they thank. It's not unusual seeing pros from other teams being thanked in post game interviews.
IdrA just needs better practice partners. Whether they're on the NA or EU server makes no difference, he just needs access to other pro players from different teams. If he's just practicing with EG, I don't really see IdrA improving a whole lot moving forward.
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Why are people suprised Zenio won? His ZvZ is beastly and he knows exactly how Idra plays, I wouldn't be suprised if he prepared like crazy.
Wp Zenio.
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IdrA's ZvZ isn't that good tbh. It's top in the NA sure, but compared to Koreans and maybe Europeans it's not that strong.
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From what i've seen in the latest ZvZs idra lost is that people always get infestor very early and when idra gets is infestors the opponent allready hast full mana and crushes idra.
I think idra should do the same thing first infestors updates later!
anyways zenio played really good and so did idra but it was not enought
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Spine crawlers>infestors 
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On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is.
Basing it off 1 series? No I'm basing it off 1 year. Yes the gap isn't like it is in sc1. Obviously foreigners can take games, sometimes even series off of the koreans. But as a WHOLE the average skill difference in widening, not closing, and it doesn't take a genius to recognize that. Your statements are just as dumb as mine if you can even call me dumb.
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Russian Federation132 Posts
why they are starting with boxer vs. mana? i thought sen vs tyler is the first game and boxer plays against socke??
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On May 24 2011 01:42 Gaspadin wrote:
why they are starting with boxer vs. mana? i thought sen vs tyler is the first game and boxer plays against socke??
It's a game from last week.
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On May 23 2011 23:35 TheSubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 19:36 KvltMan wrote:On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is. IdrA won the series vs LaLush. I'm just referring to the first game. Idra got outmicroed and out multitasked that game; he played pretty poorly and honestly LaLush isn't amazing from what I've seen. Its really not a surprise he lost to Zenio, who's a lot better than people give him credit for.
It was a build order loss, nothing more nothing less. 10pool will always lose to a properly played 14gas 13/14 pool. The reason you 10 pool in the first place is because you're fairly certain the opponent is going to hatch first. Which, if he does, will pretty much give you a free win.
I had my chance to beat idra in the second game on xelnaga, when we both opened same build, but i totally misread his intentions with the 8 ling run around. Thought he'd morph banes in a corner somewhere.
And in the third game he just outplayed me.
From playing vs idra on ladder and in that clan war, i can say he certainly has one of the strongest ZvZ outside Korea. He's the only one whose hatch first builds i cannot regularly beat with a 14gas 13/14pool opening. Where it feels like a build order loss to open that build vs hatch first.
I've been stubborn holding on to pool before hatch in ZvZ, but feeling forced to change my play up now.
Also: Why am I arguing with a bronze player?
Didn't see idra's games vs zenio, so can't say anything about them. What I can say is that you're full of shit. Stop exaggerating.
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On May 24 2011 01:48 LaLuSh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 23:35 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 19:36 KvltMan wrote:On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is. IdrA won the series vs LaLush. I'm just referring to the first game. Idra got outmicroed and out multitasked that game; he played pretty poorly and honestly LaLush isn't amazing from what I've seen. Its really not a surprise he lost to Zenio, who's a lot better than people give him credit for. It was a build order loss, nothing more nothing less. 10pool will always lose to a properly played 14gas 13/14 pool. The reason you 10 pool in the first place is because you're fairly certain the opponent is going to hatch first. Which, if he does, will pretty much give you a free win. I had my chance to beat idra in the second game on xelnaga, when we both opened same build, but i totally misread his intentions with the 8 ling run around. Thought he'd morph banes in a corner somewhere. And in the third game he just outplayed me. From playing vs idra on ladder and in that clan war, i can say he certainly has one of the strongest ZvZ outside Korea. He's the only one whose hatch first builds i cannot regularly beat with a 14gas 13/14pool opening. Where it feels like a build order loss to open that build vs hatch first. I've been stubborn holding on to pool before hatch in ZvZ, but feeling forced to change my play up now. Also: Why am I arguing with a bronze player? Didn't see idra's games vs zenio, so can't say anything about them. What I can say is that you're full of shit. Stop exaggerating.
You such an arrogant and rude punk. If you arnt insulting people you whining about game balance. I wish you the worst of luck in future tournaments. You are a discrace to the sc2 community
User was temp banned for this post.
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The reason Koreans are better than foreigners is because they have better practice schedules/regimes/partners and are just more focused than foreigners. It doesn't have anything to do with inherent skill. Koreans aren't just born gosu at SC2. They practice and work hard. They have coaches that help them analyze their play.
So yea, who IdrA has to practice with is a large part of how successful he will be.
+ Show Spoiler +Not to say he is more skilled than Zenio or anything. Quite the contrary, Zenio showed he is the better player (it's not like he fluked a victory at all, he outplayed IdrA).
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Yeah Lalush why are you arguing with a bronze player? Oh wait...you were a nobody in SC:BW and now you think you are a star? Damn!
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On May 24 2011 02:04 Nerdslayer wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2011 01:48 LaLuSh wrote:On May 23 2011 23:35 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 19:36 KvltMan wrote:On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is. IdrA won the series vs LaLush. I'm just referring to the first game. Idra got outmicroed and out multitasked that game; he played pretty poorly and honestly LaLush isn't amazing from what I've seen. Its really not a surprise he lost to Zenio, who's a lot better than people give him credit for. It was a build order loss, nothing more nothing less. 10pool will always lose to a properly played 14gas 13/14 pool. The reason you 10 pool in the first place is because you're fairly certain the opponent is going to hatch first. Which, if he does, will pretty much give you a free win. I had my chance to beat idra in the second game on xelnaga, when we both opened same build, but i totally misread his intentions with the 8 ling run around. Thought he'd morph banes in a corner somewhere. And in the third game he just outplayed me. From playing vs idra on ladder and in that clan war, i can say he certainly has one of the strongest ZvZ outside Korea. He's the only one whose hatch first builds i cannot regularly beat with a 14gas 13/14pool opening. Where it feels like a build order loss to open that build vs hatch first. I've been stubborn holding on to pool before hatch in ZvZ, but feeling forced to change my play up now. Also: Why am I arguing with a bronze player? Didn't see idra's games vs zenio, so can't say anything about them. What I can say is that you're full of shit. Stop exaggerating. You such an arrogant and rude punk. If you arnt insulting people you whining about game balance. I wish you the worst of luck in future tournaments. You are a discrace to the sc2 community
Are you serious? There was nothing arrogant about his post. And the only person he insulted was some guy that insulted him first...
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On May 24 2011 01:48 LaLuSh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 23:35 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 19:36 KvltMan wrote:On May 23 2011 19:26 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 14:43 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2011 13:39 j3i wrote:On May 23 2011 13:30 TheSubtleArt wrote:On May 23 2011 13:17 0neder wrote:
The SC2 foreigner scene is saddening. In BW, we were so far behind that we couldn't catch up. Now in SC2, tons of foreigners have the chance to be on the same level, but they abandon it because they don't want to sacrifice what it takes (more practice, moving to Korea, etc.) - I bet a lot of foreigners will have regrets in a few years, and even more fans will have regrets that the foreigner players decided not to try to be the best in exchange for the security of some chump change small prize pot online tourneys.
Foreign sc2 actually offers way more money for the average player than korea I think his point is that foreigners are too content with being, as you said, "average" The foreigner scene has, is ,and possibly always will be average compared to the korean scene. It's not exactly rocket science. About time people start realizing that the gap is going to widen with time, not shrink. It was exactly the same way with sc1. You're basing this off 1 series? Idra's ZvZ hasn't looked good at all recently. Hell, he got outplayed by Lalush and there was no build order disadvantage you could pign that one on. Knee jerk statements like this are kinda silly. MC is like 2-3 in the NASL, Select just curbstomped Ace 2-0, Dimaga has beaten MVP and Nestea ina a latency free setting, Jinro and Idra have made Round of 8 in the GSL, etc. Besides, Zenio is a really good Zerg and a consistent Code S player. It's definitely not like it was in Sc1, I highly doubt you actually watched Sc1 because if you did you would realize how uh...dumb....what you're saying is. IdrA won the series vs LaLush. I'm just referring to the first game. Idra got outmicroed and out multitasked that game; he played pretty poorly and honestly LaLush isn't amazing from what I've seen. Its really not a surprise he lost to Zenio, who's a lot better than people give him credit for. It was a build order loss, nothing more nothing less. 10pool will always lose to a properly played 14gas 13/14 pool. The reason you 10 pool in the first place is because you're fairly certain the opponent is going to hatch first. Which, if he does, will pretty much give you a free win. I had my chance to beat idra in the second game on xelnaga, when we both opened same build, but i totally misread his intentions with the 8 ling run around. Thought he'd morph banes in a corner somewhere. And in the third game he just outplayed me. From playing vs idra on ladder and in that clan war, i can say he certainly has one of the strongest ZvZ outside Korea. He's the only one whose hatch first builds i cannot regularly beat with a 14gas 13/14pool opening. Where it feels like a build order loss to open that build vs hatch first. I've been stubborn holding on to pool before hatch in ZvZ, but feeling forced to change my play up now. Also: Why am I arguing with a bronze player? Didn't see idra's games vs zenio, so can't say anything about them. What I can say is that you're full of shit. Stop exaggerating.
Wow, I can't believe you read through the thread and gave a detailed reply. However, does that mean that even SEn's hatch first is problematic (i.e exploitable)?
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On May 23 2011 23:14 bgx wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2011 13:01 I)etox wrote:
Woah Zenio beating out IdrA? This is interesting. why? he already beat him in gsl
People somehow got overexcited and exaggerated IdrA's skill all over the place for some reason. Saw someone saying IdrA currently would be BO4 minimum in GSL. Delusional really..
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If I ever see any of the members of that band in the Bing commercial im going to trow my shoe at them. I hate that ad, they look so cocky!
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lol, what the fuck, iNcontrol is laughing like a madman.
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EPT
