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gisado aka KTH on gomtv - Page 17

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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ZeNd0kUn
Profile Joined October 2010
United States331 Posts
December 22 2010 12:58 GMT
#321
IdrA .. release the Gracken within you! Fighting !
"Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment." - Jesus
wintergt
Profile Joined February 2010
Belgium1335 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-22 12:58:32
December 22 2010 12:58 GMT
#322
On December 22 2010 21:54 CalmDown.Breathe wrote:
safe enough to fast expand AND go straight to battle cruiser without pressure or worry of losing. zerg is on lair tech while terran is easily on their final tech tree with same amount of mining bases/expansions, and same size army.

what was it again that day9 says all the time? "tech, army, economy. you pick two of the three". MVP chose all three -_-

I think you misunderstand that statement. You can't power econ, tech AND have enough army to pressure or do a timing push, which MVP didn't. He played passive until his first BC was out.
here i am
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38257 Posts
December 22 2010 12:58 GMT
#323
On December 22 2010 21:57 Dingotrold wrote:
If MVP wins this is the show then over? Or if IdrA wins, does he have 5 bo3's to go vs Terrans?


Yup, it's a sort of king of the hill where a racespecific winner stays on, Zerg are down to their last player...Terran still on their first.

It's a nice format actually, here's hoping Idra makes it look a bit less one sided.
CalmDown.Breathe
Profile Joined June 2010
United States176 Posts
December 22 2010 12:58 GMT
#324
When one korean man pummels the rest of korea with unfair tactics, korea turns to the white people to save them. no, this is not north korea. this is starcraft!
BennyTurner
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia49 Posts
December 22 2010 12:59 GMT
#325
On December 22 2010 21:42 FataLe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2010 21:39 rift wrote:
Greg Fields: will he build an infestor?
Will any of them?

Zenio built infestors.
Nullified by Siege Tanks bro.

Edit: Oh sorry, "bro" is a very commonly used word in New Zealand (slang) if you thought I was bringing in 4chan crap into TL then you are sorely mistaken, mod.
User was warned for this post


wow, never realised this was some sort of diss outside of Australia/nz haha, user definitely wasn't being disrespectful ha.
I suggest that the anthropomorphic god-idea is not a harmless infirmity of human thought, but a very noxious fallacy, which is largely responsible for the calamities the world is at present enduring
Dingotrold
Profile Joined July 2010
Denmark622 Posts
December 22 2010 12:59 GMT
#326
On December 22 2010 21:58 Asha` wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2010 21:57 Dingotrold wrote:
If MVP wins this is the show then over? Or if IdrA wins, does he have 5 bo3's to go vs Terrans?


Yup, it's a sort of king of the hill where a racespecific winner stays on, Zerg are down to their last player...Terran still on their first.

It's a nice format actually, here's hoping Idra makes it look a bit less one sided.


Thanks.

Yeah I love this format, pokemon-style. I just hope IdrA makes it to MarineKing!
Soft is the blade that is the heart || 万歳!
Razyel
Profile Joined May 2010
295 Posts
December 22 2010 12:59 GMT
#327
On December 22 2010 21:56 ChickenLips wrote:
IdrA hwaiiiitiiiiiiiing :D

mvp so bm with the BCs, knowing he has the game won ;_;

I dont think he was bm i think he just wanted to give Nestea a chance that's all.
Tester Iron NonY WhiteRa Huk Genius
FataLe
Profile Joined November 2010
New Zealand4531 Posts
December 22 2010 13:00 GMT
#328
Good luck IdrA.

hi. big fan.
dookudooku
Profile Joined December 2010
255 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-22 13:01:42
December 22 2010 13:01 GMT
#329
On December 22 2010 21:52 Byzantium wrote:
MVP on 2 bases with marine/tank, attempted banshee harass but with no cloak damage was limited.

Nestea harasses with mutas but MVP is playing oddly passive... because he's built a fusion core. Battlecruiser out for MVP and it's again a tank/marine push but this time with a battlecruiser floating about blasting spine crawlers, overlords, and banelings.

Mutas take down the first BC but there's a second one lumbering towards the tank line.

MVP now pushing Nestea's third. Banelings do damage but there are still tanks and marines left and Nestea has nothing. GG!


MVP killed 2 queens and about 6 drones with his banshee. Two queens is a huge loss -- it's 300 minerals and 8 larva.

MVP used BC to take out spine crawlers and soak up damage from the mutas. Nestea moved most of his ground army away from the BC and into his 3rd base.
FataLe
Profile Joined November 2010
New Zealand4531 Posts
December 22 2010 13:01 GMT
#330
On December 22 2010 21:59 BennyTurner wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2010 21:42 FataLe wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:39 rift wrote:
Greg Fields: will he build an infestor?
Will any of them?

Zenio built infestors.
Nullified by Siege Tanks bro.

Edit: Oh sorry, "bro" is a very commonly used word in New Zealand (slang) if you thought I was bringing in 4chan crap into TL then you are sorely mistaken, mod.
User was warned for this post


wow, never realised this was some sort of diss outside of Australia/nz haha, user definitely wasn't being disrespectful ha.

Yea lol apparently "bro" is offensive outside of SEA.
hi. big fan.
Byzantium
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States423 Posts
December 22 2010 13:02 GMT
#331
IdrA of course goes 15 hatch on Scrap Station, while MVP opts to place his barracks at the entrance to his natural and early expand as well, followed up by double gas at his main.
MSL 2052
Vroommmm
Profile Joined December 2010
Netherlands25 Posts
December 22 2010 13:02 GMT
#332
go MVP, such a hard map for MVP but maybe he can pull it off...

go terran!
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38257 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-22 13:04:34
December 22 2010 13:03 GMT
#333
MvP opening the same way he has previously on this map (and a number of other easy first expo maps), 1 rax FE and then following with an additional 2 rax and a factory.

Doubling up on the factories and researching siege mode...think we all probably know how he wants this one to go.
Ayrie
Profile Joined September 2010
United States213 Posts
December 22 2010 13:04 GMT
#334
omg omg THE GRACKEN HAS BEEN UNLEASHED. will he deliver or fall to cattlebruisers like nestea? WILL HE REVERSE ALL-KILL?
also, I love Ret's "GET EM" cameo.

I get the feeling that MVP's wins were more due to him playing a solid build / composition and letting his zerg opponents handle his pressure a bit sloppily. I couldn't have been the only one watching lings, ovies, and mutas rallied uselessly into the marine / tank spread and mutas engaging groups of stimmed marines far longer than they should've (cough fruitdealer)

Yet the zerg has so much less room for error than the terran does, and these games highlight that rather brutally with mvp crushing top zergs with ease.
And that's what she said.
namedplayer
Profile Joined June 2010
844 Posts
December 22 2010 13:05 GMT
#335
Nestea picked SOW for you IDRA. GOGO!
You know what I'm talking about
Asta
Profile Joined October 2002
Germany3491 Posts
December 22 2010 13:06 GMT
#336
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2010 21:49 BritishBeef wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:45 Asta wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:38 Killmouse wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:37 IdrA wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:33 OutlaW- wrote:
mvp is too good
almost makes this stream boring

mvp has nothing to do with the results so far


so u think Terra imba ? lol


ugh...


You do realize that there do exist more than one map and more than one strategy, right? Even if there is one situation that is completely broken, it can't necessarily be properly described with "Terra imba . lol".
That would only be the case if there was a deterministic way for the beneficiary to reach that situation on every map.
On the other hand, even a "balanced" match up can be utterly broken.



I guess the general jist of it is.. if you are a zerg player like me... it really FUCKS you off that when u 15 hatch you have to make a sunken + 10/12 lings to stop something that PROBLY isn't even coming but just incase it does you still have to build it...

Then after terran still has 3/4 options .. expand.. tech...(to either hellions or banshee which are complete opposite responses) or time a all-in

Then to top it off you can't even scout what hes guna do .. sorry for bringing balance into this thread but clearly you are not a zerg player and don't see the ACTUAL problem not theoretical


I am a zerg player and I do think that the matchup is broken. It's just this stupid "imba ? lol" thinking that permeates most forum discussions which covers any reasonable arguments that angers me.

For example as I have said a thousand times, it sucks if you play ZvT and you walked that tightrope (see good post above) 90% to the finish which means you look like you are way ahead (like a number of zergs today) but Terran can still turn it around with one single battle. On the other hand, if you ever slip as a zerg, you are going to lose, for a number of reasons:

  • The Terran army recovers very quickly, with healing and repair.
  • The Terran usually ends up with some MMM after a battle which work reasonably well while Zergs can only pump lings quickly which don't work at all without support.
  • The Terran can get into your base immediately if you lose your army (the reverse does not hold true).
  • A Zerg needs to be able to pick the time and place of the fight in order to win (impossible if you are still gathering your defences and T is already at your base). That the map didn't allow you this is probably why you lost the battle in the first place.


Even though the match up is broken, it might still not be reflected in the winning percentages, because it might just be that Z wins easily if they can avoid for example ever losing a big fight.
Byzantium
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States423 Posts
December 22 2010 13:07 GMT
#337
MVP also with double engineering bay for infantry upgrades as he uses siege mode to cover both his 3 barracks wall-in and the destructible rocks at the natural.

Mutalisks come into the main mineral line before the turret comes out and pick off some SCVs before being pushed back by the marines, MVP has an armory up for instant +2 research as +1 finishes at both ebays.

IdrA has his third and creep spread across the middle bridge and down towards the Xel'Naga tower.
MSL 2052
MrCon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France29748 Posts
December 22 2010 13:09 GMT
#338
And the push begins !
Dingotrold
Profile Joined July 2010
Denmark622 Posts
December 22 2010 13:09 GMT
#339
On December 22 2010 22:06 Asta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2010 21:49 BritishBeef wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:45 Asta wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:38 Killmouse wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:37 IdrA wrote:
On December 22 2010 21:33 OutlaW- wrote:
mvp is too good
almost makes this stream boring

mvp has nothing to do with the results so far


so u think Terra imba ? lol


ugh...


You do realize that there do exist more than one map and more than one strategy, right? Even if there is one situation that is completely broken, it can't necessarily be properly described with "Terra imba . lol".
That would only be the case if there was a deterministic way for the beneficiary to reach that situation on every map.
On the other hand, even a "balanced" match up can be utterly broken.



I guess the general jist of it is.. if you are a zerg player like me... it really FUCKS you off that when u 15 hatch you have to make a sunken + 10/12 lings to stop something that PROBLY isn't even coming but just incase it does you still have to build it...

Then after terran still has 3/4 options .. expand.. tech...(to either hellions or banshee which are complete opposite responses) or time a all-in

Then to top it off you can't even scout what hes guna do .. sorry for bringing balance into this thread but clearly you are not a zerg player and don't see the ACTUAL problem not theoretical



Even though the match up is broken, it might still not be reflected in the winning percentages, because it might just be that Z wins easily if they can avoid for example ever losing a big fight.


Yeah. matchup is broken because if one thing happens T wins, and if another thing happens Z wins...
Soft is the blade that is the heart || 万歳!
Essentia
Profile Joined July 2010
1150 Posts
December 22 2010 13:10 GMT
#340
wownice tank spread
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