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LOLZEY
Canada71 Posts
I just played a PvZ on ladder where I lost horribly to a roach drop. Map was Belshir Vestige. Replay is attached. Basically: - I open gate expand into SG - I build a Oracle and do reasonable damage - I transition into a 3rd base and immortal/colossus/blink stalker - He gets up to 170 supply in roaches by 12 min and drops them all in my main, doing irreparable damage I am wondering how I would be able to defend this? Thanks http://drop.sc/365935 | ||
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LOLZEY
Canada71 Posts
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esReveR
United States567 Posts
Edit: I want to clarify that I am not suggesting you blindly make phoenix. | ||
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SpeedyBozar
England56 Posts
What u can do after scouting when having no phoenixes or void rays on the field is to warp stalkers and kite the overlords as long as possible while waiting with zealots under the overlords so he is forced to drop roaches on top of zealots and after the roaches r dropped, you can forcefield them between your buildings and kill them with stalkers and immortals. If u have a stargate, start void rays immediately. If u have a robo, make more immortals. | ||
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watchlulu
Germany475 Posts
- You can scout and have map control - they'll always be cost efficient - since you have MSC in HotS, you can play greedy every game because of photon overcharge/ canons and some Sentries will hold every Zerg all in which comes earlier than 8 min. And also: Voidrays are pretty good ^^ | ||
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Tempest636
United States15 Posts
I can't watch the replay right now, but if you had blink and a couple of immortals it is defendable, but you might lose a base. With stellar micro, losing a base isn't the biggest deal, and even if you opened mass sentry immortal you can still hold. No matter how grim things get or how bad it looks, remember that they are only roaches and if you never lose an immortal you will eventually beat him back and you will have a significantly greater army. The main worry here is if you take too much damage, more than 1 base or >15ish workers, OR if he is great at macro and does some heavy tech switch (mutas or SHs). Gl with your matches, pm me if you want clarification or if you want me to watch the replay. | ||
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Moonsalt
267 Posts
Try to harass the zerg as much as possible in the early-mid game it's really annoying to deal with as zerg and also it messes up his build and while you harras you can scout with phoenixes and prepare for what's coming. the best way to defend that drop is to place some cannons and get colossus/immortal sentry asap with blink stalkers. | ||
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gingerfluffmuff
Austria4570 Posts
On November 25 2013 22:16 TrumpetWilli wrote: I don't understand why Protoss don't always open with stargate and like 4-5 phoenix... - You can scout and have map control - they'll always be cost efficient - since you have MSC in HotS, you can play greedy every game because of photon overcharge/ canons and some Sentries will hold every Zerg all in which comes earlier than 8 min. And also: Voidrays are pretty good ^^ Needs multitasking. They start to get effective at about mid master level. (phoenix is meant) | ||
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Xequecal
United States473 Posts
On November 25 2013 23:29 Moonsalt wrote: Always open stargate unless you're masters/gm. It's the best opening vs zerg atm. It provides map control, the ability to harass the mineral line, scouting and it's something good to have(phoenixes) against mutas if the zerg is foolish enough to transition. Also it's to core opening for the Stalker/Colossus/Void Ray deathball late game. Try to harass the zerg as much as possible in the early-mid game it's really annoying to deal with as zerg and also it messes up his build and while you harras you can scout with phoenixes and prepare for what's coming. the best way to defend that drop is to place some cannons and get colossus/immortal sentry asap with blink stalkers. Honestly, I think this is terrible advice. Players below masters/GM can not micro phoenix and macro at the same time. | ||
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KingAlphard
Italy1705 Posts
On November 25 2013 22:16 TrumpetWilli wrote: I don't understand why Protoss don't always open with stargate and like 4-5 phoenix... - You can scout and have map control - they'll always be cost efficient - since you have MSC in HotS, you can play greedy every game because of photon overcharge/ canons and some Sentries will hold every Zerg all in which comes earlier than 8 min. And also: Voidrays are pretty good ^^ It delays your unit count and tech a lot --> it delays your third base--> you have less units in the midgame and you are vulnerable to a lot of timings. I used to play phoenixes every PvZ but then i stopped almost completely because of this, every time i die to 1-1 lings / roach / roach+hydra / roach+hydra+corruptor / roach+hydra+viper timings or to the follow up muta switch. | ||
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ffadicted
United States3545 Posts
With mothership core recall, observers and hallucinated phoenixes, I can't feel sorry for any toss that dies due to unscouted stuff. Zerg drops are very easy to stop when scouted, that's why they're not popular at the top level. Hallucinate some phx every once in a while, it'll win you games tbh | ||
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watchlulu
Germany475 Posts
On November 26 2013 00:37 Xequecal wrote: Honestly, I think this is terrible advice. Players below masters/GM can not micro phoenix and macro at the same time. Come on, really? It's not like you have to be active with your Phoenix all of the time, you can always makro and than stop for like 10 seconds to go in and kill like a couple of drones or a queen I think in Gold league you can start and do multitasking at least a little bit | ||
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Ryndika
1489 Posts
On November 26 2013 00:37 Xequecal wrote: Honestly, I think this is terrible advice. Players below masters/GM can not micro phoenix and macro at the same time. Worst advice you can give, is to not do something because it's hard. | ||
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Entropy137
Canada215 Posts
On November 28 2013 20:34 Ryndika wrote: Worst advice you can give, is to not do something because it's hard. He is correct though. The biggest thing people below masters struggle with when doing that build is actually being able to be active with the phoenix and still macro correctly. | ||
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Agh
United States1045 Posts
Also if you're doing little to no unit 3rd base you need voids to put any roach/ling attacks on a timer, otherwise you're playing unnecessarily risky. | ||
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