• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 20:14
CEST 02:14
KST 09:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3
Community News
Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?82Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over3New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!40Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week6
StarCraft 2
General
Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game SC4ALL: II Winner Will Earn a Spot at HSC 30! Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) September World Ranking: herO leads, Serral climbs
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly SC2 INu's Battles#20 [BO.9] 2026 GSTL Announcement
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 541 Binary Choice The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 540 Dodge This Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome
Brood War
General
Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL22 General Discussion Gypsy to Korea [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60
Tourneys
Brood War in Budapest ! WORTEX 2026 BW Finals KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues BSL LAN Party - Kraków 29-30 August - OPEN SIGNUPS
Strategy
Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Replay Review Process - What do you do? Game Theory for Starcraft Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Diablo IV EVE Corporation [Maplestory Hardcore] Let's Play~!! General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Regacy Esports: The Bh…
regacyesports
Violent Games and Crime Rate…
TrAiDoS
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9817 users

[H] ZvT how to stop Marine/Rauder/Hellbat/Medivac - Page 3

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 All
Dvriel
Profile Joined November 2011
607 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-01 11:03:29
June 01 2013 11:02 GMT
#41
On June 01 2013 19:18 StatixEx wrote:
mate i have this same problem now EVERY zvt, Its not the fact that the comp they have is a problem its their remax. Banes are a one shot punch and when you use them or morph them you deplete so much gas when you need to do it again you dont really have the econ because.......

they drop with a couple of those hellbats and you take significant damage to your econ, and usually at the time of the game where everything is a mess anyway (if they do it early it can ruin you as well) every says put down spines, put down spores . . .well i saw moonglade mass do this like literally 5 or 6 spores asround each baseand its DIDNT MATTER. The hellbats got in did the damage. At the time i thought it was good . . .but in the meantime moons standing army wasnt that big and the other guys tanks marauders thors and hellbats part of their main army rolled him, after he killed it twice . .. the terran just kept coming.

I do believe mutalisks are the way to go but you just cant seem to get enough of them, they directly counter the hellbats, tanks and marauders and so some extent with mboxing thors . . .but its the handfull of fucking marines which kill them, the maraduers they produce stop the banes and if you try to focus with the mutas the thor splash rapes the mutas and the lings cant get the surround they need and roaches are good but they dont seem to do the dps you need. SO

Vipers. Blinding cloud. Ive been having a bit of success with this but its the whole thing of having the econ to support it they can basically harass for free and we cant get into their lines really, and if we do with the lisks 300m of marines. and 3 turrets is enough where we have spent all of our gas and usually most of the minerals to get numbers up enough to do actual damage.

Yes i hear you man, but i dont think its the comp it seems to be the remax of the terran which is the problem, they seem to be able to produce just as much shit at us which by default is way more cost efficient]



here are some of my reps where i won (it is getting to that point where i want to play as terran just to do this)

Now im not a masters player but i watch a hell of a lot of streams and everyone is having an issue with this to a point, but you have to nail it exactly right and you arent allowed to make mistakes, a-moving WILL get you killed

1. BC the tanks first and a thors (need 5 vipers fully charged ive found)
2 A-move your army into their just to get close to exvery thing is fighting and magic box 1 thor leave these lisks
3 - MACRO MORE ARMY, roaches may be good as they live longer or lings to morph purely to banes
4. select hydras and target thors
5- a-move everything closer and send the remaining viper energy on the tanks

now this doesnt always work but ive been satisfied to see a few marauders and a couple of tanks left over where another round of lings cleans it up BUT

they come at you with a very similar sized push . . .and i cant stop that usually. Im really really trying to find a way to beat this at my skill level and im prepared to sit and practice with someone if they want to frind me, but which terran wants to give this strangle hold up!

http://sc2replaystats.com/replay/41600




What League are you? I am Diamond Terran. If you want, we can practice whatevr BO you need. Tell me here or PM.
Holo82
Profile Joined April 2013
Austria107 Posts
June 01 2013 12:08 GMT
#42
Small Tutorial for Zerg to not die to hellbat drops, followed up by 2 base marauder / hellbat allin:

Hellbats are slow. they are slower than workers. they are even slower than queens. Medivacs with boost are fast. the combination of both makes hellbats faster, therefore dangerous. The danger doesn't lie in the hellbats, but in the medivac. The solution doesn't lie in direct combat with hellbat force, but in avoiding the medivac micro over your bunched up workers.

1) build a queen and a spore per base, have them chip away the medivac.
If hellbats are unloaded, run away with workers + lings + queens. dont clump them up, because a pickup and redrop might occur. Make sure, pickup will not occur by having queen hurting medivac into retreat. go back to mining, kill hellbats that have not been picked up with roaches.

2) make a Roachwarren, if this kind of play is suspected. Generally, a Roachwarren is always a good idea, as other similar openers of t might by widowmines, bio , or 3 cc double ebay greed, which both are shutdown /countered by a random high number of roach.

The only thing a hellbat drop does to a zerg that is prepared, is deny some mining time, and if lucky, get a queen and perhaps 1 or 2 drones from the gas geysers if really comitted.

To hold the allin: i think pure pumping roaches is enough. just macro hatch mass roaches, no ammount of 2 base marauders will power threw 3 base roaches, as roaches are cheaper. if u have gas over, some banelings or Hydralisk, infestors or mutalisk.
Hydralisk in ZVT are very underestimated by many zerg, their dps is awsome, and their defensive value togeter with roaches is huge.

5 Hydralisk defenslve positioned are shutting medivac drops down way harder than a bunch of 15 mutalisk ever could.

Generally, from t perspective, Mutalisk in ZvT is often overestimated by many zerg, they are very weak in defensive combat situation.
Investing big ammounts of Gas into Mutalisk in a close game is very often the cause for a Zerg to lose a ZVT.
Muta Job is scouting, anti drop play, picking up single reinforcements, getting some unguarded workers, addons and stuff like that. Muta is not good for combat, and if u are getting allined, u want to have combat units.

roaches, hydras, they can fight.
Mutas can fly around fast and look awesome,
but this will not help winning against a guy that just pulled his 45 workers together with hellbats and marauders and moves in direction of your 3rd.
StatixEx
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United Kingdom779 Posts
June 01 2013 15:34 GMT
#43
HEY GUY ABOVE, i think me and you played yesterday and you did this strat and then told me mutalisks are a bad idea after then telling me you had no idea who life and leenock are who USE mutalisks against this strat, the difference between us and them is we cant get enough out to do the damage and contain harass we need so in a manner of speaking yes . . the mutas arent that good.

see tanks, hellbats marauders and vacs . . . are countered by mutalisks! (oh and build a roach warren should go in your step 1 btw) and have you seen roaches against hellbats . . unless you have a load of them they take ages to kill them in the mean time i think a hellbat can 1 on 1 a spine as i had 2 in my lines and you killed one, got away droped and did more damage.

and muta is good for combat just you need to be pretty good at controlling 2 armies, 3/3 mutas with a backbone roach army is damn good
ShamW0W
Profile Joined March 2010
160 Posts
June 01 2013 15:53 GMT
#44
I still advocate Roaches into Hydras to deal with this along with other, non-tank, forms of Terran play. At lower skill levels you're likely going to be flipping coins on if you trade effectively with ling/bane/muta. However, using Roach/Hydra you can focus on more controlled engagements where Roaches can actually be super cost-effective against most Terran compositions early game. If they go pure Marauder/Hellbat then building a wave of Hydras is going to clean that up no problem. (be sure to snipe Medivacs)
Half-Man Half-Amazing
willstertben
Profile Joined May 2013
427 Posts
June 01 2013 18:35 GMT
#45
as shown by soulkey today a 2-2 roach hydra allin can be a really powerful response to a hellbat drop opener. if he didn't throw away so many units before actually attacking he would have CRUSHED innovation hard. he still almost broke him.
mass roaches + banes is the best way to hold this for sure and that transitions pretty smoothly into the aforementioned allin.
Prev 1 2 3 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 9h 46m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SpeCial 137
JuggernautJason98
RuFF_SC2 4
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 530
Hyuk 238
Horang2 209
White-Ra 199
910 29
sSak 17
Yoon 14
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm154
League of Legends
Doublelift5457
JimRising 625
Counter-Strike
summit1g7889
minikerr55
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor204
Other Games
PiGStarcraft379
KnowMe150
Mew2King59
ViBE58
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2061
BasetradeTV83
[ Show 9 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• musti20045 31
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
9h 46m
OSC
11h 46m
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
14h 46m
Mixu vs TBD
Spirit vs TBD
Clem vs TBD
Patches Events
15h 46m
OSC
23h 46m
Afreeca Starleague
1d 9h
Soma vs Shuttle
BeSt vs Rush
WardiTV Weekly
1d 10h
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 15h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Leta vs ggaemo
Jaedong vs Queen
GSL
2 days
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
Escore
5 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
5 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-02
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Light Tournament 2026

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
RSL Revival: Season 6
Calamity Invitational
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: King of Kings
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.