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This build is a 2-base thor/banshee/hellbat +1 armor allin. I have a high rate of success with this at the mid master level. One good counter to it is when the toss meets you outside of your base base with stalker/coll and kites you across the map. In general, if the toss does not know to kite you across the map he will probably have a tough time defending this.
Also of note is that if you're against a 1 base allin, you abandon the build and go marine/tank (so you need to make sure to keep a SCV alive and see if he builds a nexus). 1 rax FE is somewhat risky due to its vulnerability to toss aggression including proxy oracle. However, only rarely have I faced this as a reaction to my 1 rax FE. Which is to say most players don't have good decision making.
Below is the build order in somewhat imprecise form. Note that even if you fall behind and don't hit your timing all that well, your ball of shit will still give you a decent chance of winning. Also note this build order may not be completely optimal, as this is basically what I've come up with on the fly...I haven't tested different variations or really done any sort of testing outside of games. It's possible you could work in Ravens (but I feel pretty strapped for gas already) and/or +1 attack. But again, I feel like I'm spending all my gas here.
1. 1 rax FE, 19/19 gas
2. factory, reactor on rax (swap fact onto rax and make hellions), starport, techlab on rax (swap port onto techlab and make cloak banshee)
3. 3rd and 4th gas after first banshee, armory w/ first 100 gas after first banshee
4. constant hellions, 2 banshee. See what harassment you can get done with this, however it's very important not to afk your base and forget to make your 2nd and 3rd facts AND 2 techlabs w/ the rax on time.
5. First 200 gas after 2nd banshee - 2 facts. Make 2 techlabs with your rax during the time these factories are building. This is going to be very important to hitting your timing, because you need to get the lengthy thor production underway.
6. +1 armor
7. After your harassment has ended you can look around for proxy pylons/take map control/scout with your hellion banshee. Also keep a hellion outside his ramp
8. Once 2nd and 3rd facts are done - 2 thors, followed by a 4th fact and reactor on the rax.
9. Constant production of the following: 2x thors, 1x banshee, 4x hellions, 2x SCV.
10. Start hellbat transformation after 2nd set of thors is underway
11. Move out once you have 6 thors (~14:00, ~175 supply). You should have 4-5 banshee, a fuckton of hellions, and a fuckton of SCVs
12. Bring almost all of your mineral SCVs (then remember to drop mules so you still have a mineral income. BUT save a scan or two for obs/DT). This should be 40+. I use one base's SCVs for autorepair, and the other base's SCVs for my front line.
13. Once you get outside his base, transform your hellions into hellbats.
14. Charge. Scan to kill obs. Target immortals/coll with your banshee. The toss will tend to kite back, so you what you don't want is for your thors to be way behind your frontline of hellbats, not doing much. It's important to keep your ball together and doing max DPS during the fight.
15. Laugh
Replays:
http://drop.sc/336272
http://drop.sc/336273
http://drop.sc/336274
http://drop.sc/338087
Those happen to all be on the same map but the basic principle is there. Try this out and let me know how it goes for you!
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Had a quick look at the replays,
I quite like the idea how you show the hellions (implying there is no need to have ob in his base cuz of widow mine drops) and come up with the cloaked banshee thats been dropped off the face of the earth at the moment.
Thought the transitions were very smooth but would like to know how it holds off against earlier protoss gateway aggression.
Have you tried attacking without all your scvs? How does the attack flare up without them?
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Russian Federation101 Posts
1 rax FEwith double gases is too greedy since gateway pressure or MSC with zealot stalker can kill you in an instant unless you make it in base. Banshee doesn't realy work beacause most likely will get robo or stargate which are instant counter.
So I would've made few changes:
1) Go 15 gas-reactor as you have more marines and can deviate a lot more easier from original build
2) Get raven instead of cloak unless you scouted that his going for no detection(double forge play)
3) If you see colosus, then make vikings or few tanks to zone out your opponent
4) Possible to get 1 medvack to drop hellions
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Just added a 4th replay. I played terribly and the guy killed like 10 hellions and 2 banshee for free at the start. He had 2/2 and a LOT of stalkers when the all-in hit. But I still won.
But yes, I'd imagine early aggression is the counter but honestly I rarely face it. Most people expand in response to seeing my expand. It is what it is, a ladder build that will get you a lot of wins.
Has anyone else been trying this?
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when i get home from work today ill try on my stream :D
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bumping. Seriously this thread just suddenly got forgotten or something and fell off the strat section
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On May 29 2013 16:20 padfoota wrote:
bumping. Seriously this thread just suddenly got forgotten or something and fell off the strat section
trust me if it a build that people want to discuss they would no need to bump, no one forgot about it i just don't think it generate's much interest
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I really like this build, 700 point master player and I am experiencing great success with this build. Even if the Protoss scouts I am able to hold it. The only thing I feel like I would have trouble with is a build incorporating a really fast third + storm.
As a tip, don't worry about sacking a ton of hellions early on to prevent attack and to harass. Even if I lose my first four hellions I can take out a lot of probes at the natural, or some weak sentries.
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On May 30 2013 03:53 Freeze967 wrote:
I really like this build, 700 point master player and I am experiencing great success with this build. Even if the Protoss scouts I am able to hold it. The only thing I feel like I would have trouble with is a build incorporating a really fast third + storm.
As a tip, don't worry about sacking a ton of hellions early on to prevent attack and to harass. Even if I lose my first four hellions I can take out a lot of probes at the natural, or some weak sentries.
Good to hear someone is using it. I will say I demolished someone who went triple nexus into double forge. Although he did not get storm. The other day I lost to MSC + blink allin and a 2 base allin that hit when I had 2 thors (which was in reaction to me killing a ton of his probes). In both cases, I think I could have won if I played better.
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Have you considered doing an in base CC and walling off before the scouting probe? I feel like this would help disguise the build.
I tried it a while ago but lost to a blink allin on Neo Planet.
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The big attack moves out after 14 min mark so what is there to disguise? 
My main problem with this plan is pretty much summed up well by TRpredator. Taking his suggestion to make this less greedy would be better than trying to hide gasless CC since many of the 1 base aggression from the protoss players don't really depend on their scouting info because they can just pull back and most current Terran meta builds don't have any means of picking off retreating protoss units that early in the game.
I just want to emphasize how risky the gasless FE is here... SCV scouts can get shut down before finding critical information so I think that unless your build ends up building good defensive units (bio in bunker) automatically early on, getting a reaper to scout for early aggression is a key to not getting build order losses. I use Strelok's hellbat/tank build and about half of my games in this matchup are saved from instant loss to some early aggression thanks to that reaper scouting twilight, double gas with not enough pylon (proxy stargate), 4 gate, etc.
Or am I being completely mistaken here and is there a reliable way of scouting using just SCV?
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On June 01 2013 15:30 Cortza wrote:
Have you considered doing an in base CC and walling off before the scouting probe? I feel like this would help disguise the build.
I tried it a while ago but lost to a blink allin on Neo Planet.
letting him scout the cc will make him think you are playing standard macro bio play until he has obs out or you show hellions/banshees/tanks.
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EPT
