On May 04 2012 19:09 Surili wrote: I don't understand the 14 gate... Unless you are scouting on 9 there is no reason at all as i far as i can tell to go 14 gate, even if you line up the chronos perfectly, at about 3/4 quarters of the second probe at 12 supply, you can still place a 13 gate if you didn't scout at nine and are working stacking even remotely okay.
I wouldn't read to much into it, it's clear you won't be needing the gateway to hit any strict timings. You can get it on 15 if you so desire it's probably not a big deal.
On May 05 2012 00:28 Lazzi wrote: I've been playing it for 2 weeks. It is awesome, you can hold any reactif pressure with good micro if you don't fuck up.
Yeah, it can be really good against most things T can throw at you. Like to see it vs. proxy rax more, though...
EDIT:
Also, this isn't really new. I know this video says "Nexus First" but it isn't a Nexus first opening that HuK uses. He uses more or less the same opening that the OP lays out and follows it up with a sick timing-attack.
That build is quite a bit different. Not nearly as refined and cool.
12gate 2chronos on probes instead of 3 Nexus built with 16th probe instead of 17th probe Core on 18 before gas etc.
On May 05 2012 00:28 Lazzi wrote: I've been playing it for 2 weeks. It is awesome, you can hold any reactif pressure with good micro if you don't fuck up.
Yeah, it can be really good against most things T can throw at you. Like to see it vs. proxy rax more, though...
EDIT:
Also, this isn't really new. I know this video says "Nexus First" but it isn't a Nexus first opening that HuK uses. He uses more or less the same opening that the OP lays out and follows it up with a sick timing-attack.
PvT: PartinG 1gate FE If you click on this thread, you already know what a 1 gate FE Im not sure if your oblivious to the important changes that parting adds in this build or your trying to self promote a youtube video. Either way, i think you need to realise the adaptation that players are taking from a 1 gate FE, these threads are about promoting strengths/weaknesses at all of them to get more ahead from what the terran player is doing. Mc 1 gate FE, Huks 1 gate FE, Parting 1 gate FE. There is a reason why there isnt just 1 GATE FE, you want an optimised build.Depending on the situation you should be able to choose each of these builds. Although, these builds are 'more or less' the same opener, they abuse the terrans opener meaning that you can get that slight advantage when transitioning
On May 05 2012 00:28 Lazzi wrote: I've been playing it for 2 weeks. It is awesome, you can hold any reactif pressure with good micro if you don't fuck up.
Yeah, it can be really good against most things T can throw at you. Like to see it vs. proxy rax more, though...
EDIT:
Also, this isn't really new. I know this video says "Nexus First" but it isn't a Nexus first opening that HuK uses. He uses more or less the same opening that the OP lays out and follows it up with a sick timing-attack.
What are you talking about, that's not even the same BO. Check the OP and watch the video again please.
Do you not know what "more or less" means? I was saying that the concept is similar, not that it is exactly the same thing. Check a dictionary and learn English again please.
EDIT:
I don't know why people are seeming so offended by an old video that shows a similar Nexus before Core concept =S I'm just pointing out that what PartinG is doing isn't exactly a new idea. He's just refined it a lot since it was first debuted.
PvT: PartinG 1gate FE If you click on this thread, you already of the 1 gateFE Im not sure if your oblivious to the important changes that parting adds in this build or your trying to self promote a youtube video. Either way, i think you need to realise the adaptation that players are taking from a 1 gate FE, these threads are about promoting strengths/weaknesses at all of them to get more ahead from what the terran player is doing. Mc 1 gate FE, Huks 1 gate FE, Parting 1 gate FE. There is a reason why there isnt just 1 GATE FE, you want an optimised build.Depending on the situation you should be able to choose each of these builds. Although, these builds are 'more or less' the same opener, they abuse the terrans opener meaning that you can get that slight advantage when transitioning
On May 05 2012 00:28 Lazzi wrote: I've been playing it for 2 weeks. It is awesome, you can hold any reactif pressure with good micro if you don't fuck up.
Yeah, it can be really good against most things T can throw at you. Like to see it vs. proxy rax more, though...
EDIT:
Also, this isn't really new. I know this video says "Nexus First" but it isn't a Nexus first opening that HuK uses. He uses more or less the same opening that the OP lays out and follows it up with a sick timing-attack.
What are you talking about, that's not even the same BO. Check the OP and watch the video again please.
Do you not know what "more or less" means? I was saying that the concept is similar, not that it is exactly the same thing. Check a dictionary and learn English again please.
EDIT:
I don't know why people are seeming so offended by an old video that shows a similar Nexus before Core concept =S I'm just pointing out that what PartinG is doing isn't exactly a new idea. He's just refined it a lot since it was first debuted.
PvT: PartinG 1gate FE If you click on this thread, you already of the 1 gateFE Im not sure if your oblivious to the important changes that parting adds in this build or your trying to self promote a youtube video. Either way, i think you need to realise the adaptation that players are taking from a 1 gate FE, these threads are about promoting strengths/weaknesses at all of them to get more ahead from what the terran player is doing. Mc 1 gate FE, Huks 1 gate FE, Parting 1 gate FE. There is a reason why there isnt just 1 GATE FE, you want an optimised build.Depending on the situation you should be able to choose each of these builds. Although, these builds are 'more or less' the same opener, they abuse the terrans opener meaning that you can get that slight advantage when transitioning
The video I showed is pretty old, nor is it mine: I've just known about it for a long time. The only reason I linked it is because as soon as I saw the Nexus before Core part of this build, it made me think of that video. I've also never said that they are the exact same build, I was just stating that the Nexus before Core concept had been done before and that a Gateway-timing would be a pretty strong transition (which is what the video shows). Anything else is an extrapolation; and a bad one at that.
I know what you were getting at. That game was also a nexus before core and 2nd pylon. It's still a very different build even if the concept is similar.
The flames directed towards you however are entirely misguided and derail the discussion of any merits or faults of the build.
^Yea i'd like to know the response to a few all-ins since you're scouting so late. if you don't see the cc on the low ground you're basically in the dark. that and warpgate is delayed a good 20s.
^^ if you CB warpgate constantly and add 2 gateways (for total 3) then you can get some units warped in at ~6:10--this is basically what you want to do if you don't confirm gasless cc. As for marine SCV allin with like proxy barracks (assuming worst case scenario), I'm not really sure, my guess is you could build your 3rd pylon at the top of the ramp to your main, so when you add the 2 gateways you can wallof--this build gets a fast sentry so you should be okay.
Looks like Naniwa was going to do this build since he made a very late gate and didn't have gas until right after he scouted the proxy. He didn't make the nexus and couldn't even hold. I don't think there is any way to hold a good proxy rax unless you try to transition ASAP into a "normal" build.
There is also no reason to get a 15 gate like Naniwa did in that vod. 13 gate is rather tight but with good mineral stacking I can make the gateway with my rallied 12th probe, continuously chronoboost, and still not have to cut probes before my 14th is started. Definitely 14 gate at the latest. Also I'm not convinced that scouting after nexus is safe; scouting for proxies after putting down the gate (or maybe rallying 14th/15th probe to scout) seems almost mandatory to be able to react in time to have a chance of holding. Of course if you don't gate scout then your gate timing isn't very relevant.
I have been doing this build with core before pylon, do you have any thoughts on that? The way I see it is that I've already got such a big economy I'd rather prolong my probe cut a bit to be safer especially on ladder.
You need to cut probes and add 2 more gateways around 5:00 minutes to hold a 2 rax. Chronoboost your warptech 3 times. i tried it. i would even recommend if you have enough minerals after the 3 gates to add a 4th. After you hold the 2 rax (with 3 scvs for bunker - 1 marauder 7 marines 3 scvs) you can follow it up with a strong 4 gate and denie any lowground expansion or kill him.
Tested it in 6 games - Masters Protoss
edit: only if you do the build perfectly, means no pylo for the 26 supply block because your nexus will finish there
EPT
