EPT[G] TheCore Lite - Advanced Keyboard Layout - Page 5
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niks2
Sweden2 Posts
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Akinokaze
Australia326 Posts
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Drazzzt
Germany999 Posts
On May 02 2012 19:10 Crushgroove wrote: So he uses only tab and 1 for camera? You're saying he uses all of the alt keys for that also... I didn't see that he called them "screen hotkeys", but that hardly seems more efficient to me.. Wouldn't the old way of just hitting one button to recall a camera state, instead of alt+ a button be more efficient? This probably depends on your point of view. He is convinced that it is more efficient if you only move your hand (not your fingers) as little as possible. If you use F keys you definitely have to lift your hand a bit. But I don't know if there is that much of a difference *shrug* | ||
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leo23
United States3075 Posts
as of now my setup is 1. ground 2. infestors 3. bl 4. queens 5. hatches and the backspace inject trick (change base camera to space) it doesn't give me much harass options or control groups to deal with drops so i find myself defending these manually which ultimately loses me some precious time like you mentioned. when i see your guide and see 8 controls group for army that are easily accessible i drool because that would open so many options. i have one problem though and it may be because im fucking stupid but... how do i start editing everything? i mean i get the gist of the process but i would appreciate it if you could send me a pm of what keys do i change exactly to what. thanks a lot man and i appreciate your effort edit: oh and i also use f1-f4 keys for camera downloading the doc whoops | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 13:32 Awoodcol wrote: Off topic, I realize....but why do you say it isn't "larvae, it's larva. It's phonetic."? Larvae is just the plural of larva... Woah, dropping knowledge :D I never knew that (should have done my research) although I'm pretty sure that Sc2 casters use larva for both singular and plural. Thanks for the clarification :D | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 12:42 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: Wow, great work! It definitely looks very good. However, I'm not sure if I prefer to have my terran buildings on different hotkeys or grouped all in one. The pro of being grouped on one means you can tap 1 and see all of the production, but it's 1 more click if you need to produce out of everything (like in a late game situation when you need to remax quickly or something, vs trying to keep constant production). Another con of this is if you're producing units out of rax, fact, and starport. If you're doing some early game pressure like rax/fact and starport+tech lab for marine hellion banshee, having to press Space each time to get to the building I want will slow down the time I can put into micro. And of course another big pro is that you have more hotkeys for drops/flanks and such. So I'm definitely going to consider this. (Though anyways if I do such a strategy or just generally in the early game, I can use those 2 "flank/harass" hotkeys along with the building hotkey to fit my rax, fact, and starport individually, then later on I can group them all together if I find i need to use more hotkeys to harass/flank). I really like your idea to use the hotkeys in a more flexible way. I'm definitely going to mess around with that in the future :D | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 12:51 ChimeraGaming wrote: I use q for main army/lings w for banes/roaches (much like a control group only for marines) e for infestors and r for anything else i might need like mutas. I bind my hatches on 4 my creep spread queen on 1 and evos on 2 and 3. I also bind tech structures like spawning pool or roach warren on 5 and 6. I use the camera location method at each base to inject hatcheries! I know my method of camera controls seems confusing, but notice i said i use the ctrl + shift modifiers at the same time to set all 8 locations. I only use ctrl to jump to them. This leaves no modifiers and shift modifiers all open. This allowed me to keep many of the same binds such as attack move while still being able to shift attack move. All my abilities and macro binds are on t, a-h, and z-b. I also have warp gates on ` (aka ~) Hopefully this makes a bit more sense. It defiantly isn't the correct setup for everyone, but neither is any bind setup. The thing i must admit i like most is the fact that you aren't reaching for the function keys ever. And again no use of alt which is the bane of my existence in video games. for me, snagging the alt key with my thumb is so automatic (from many alt+tabs, alt with the thumb, tab with the pinky, so I never have to look down when shuffling through programs) I totally agree with reaching for the function keys though, that was such a pain for me to deal with in bw. Also I avoid triple key combinations because its an extra key to hit. I understand what you're doing now, thanks for the clarification :D | ||
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098799
Poland4 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 12:55 Angel_ wrote: Is grey = black in this picture? I tend to think that what's most efficient will vary from person to person and that regardless of what's most comfortable, what's best will basically just be what you practice at the most, but this is interesting information. I have to disagree that what is best is what you practice most. I get what you mean, but if someone practiced using mouse only and didn't use the keyboard at all, at first, when they tried using the keyboard, it would be awkward. There would be waves of people saying that the advantage of using the keyboard is trivial and using just the mouse is "fine". (This actually happened at the beginnings of sc:bw) The mouse only player would be best at playing mouse only, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the way he is playing is the best. Once he learned to use the keyboard properly he would be better at starcraft. I propose that this is a similar situation. We all have human hands, some layouts are definitively more ergonomically efficient than others. The goal of this project is to bring people together and find the best one we can.\ Also, grey is grey in this picture... black are keys i want to avoid ever having to press if possible. the grey might look like light blue? | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 13:36 SirPsychoMantis wrote: Here is my thread about it, Problem right now is I use the specific unit groupings for darkgrid. Holy shit, that is wild man. That's really awesome. I want to learn how to program one day, for now though, i'm 100% sc2 :D | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:00 HyDr0iD wrote: The select idle workers key is great if you have to spread workers out due to harassment, or just easily grab all workers if you let a base mine out completely. When I offrace as terran I also use the idle worker key to easily select my Supply Depot building SCVs as soon as they finish building a supply depot without having to waste a whole control group on them. woah, that's sweet man. I'll get to work on adding it into the layout. I really like the idea of using idle worker select for supply depot building scv. Cool shit. | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:02 NrGmonk wrote: Tagged and changed title. Thanks man. Very much appreciated. | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:23 Alvalanker wrote: Very interesting, I will definitely be looking into this when I have more time. Thanks man. Let me know how long it takes you to feel comfortable with the new setup. I wanna have good data on that (people ask about that often) | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:46 superbarnie wrote: So, what are the benefits of hotkeying rax/fact/port on 1 hotkey as opposed to hotkeying them on 3 keys? I've always used 3 keys and i think pressing 7dd or 6s is faster than tabbing thru the groups. I find this crucial when macro while microing. So what do you think? Its definitely a tradeoff. I used 5 for macro (CC Rax Fact Port Ups) initially, but when I brought it down to 2 I was actually macroing better and had more room for harass/flank control groups. You lose a couple keystrokes when you aren't making out of all your structures at once, but you gain more precise army control, and a constant reminder of all of your upgrades and units in production. I think that its a good trade, but that's definitely where personal preference comes in. For anyone who is more interested in multiple macro CGs I used to do FDGER as my "tap" (notice alternating fingers throughout) F for CC; D for Rax; G for ups; E for fact; R for port. The hotkey setup works fine for that style too :D | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 15:23 CakeSauc3 wrote: Hey JaKaTaK, i just messed around with this on a few comp stomps, and I have to say - this is genius work :D nice job. I can already feel that I'm gonna be a lot quicker and have more control over my gameplay. As I've been struggling a bit with losing my hands on the keyboard for a while now, this is gonna help me a lot. I'll keep playing with it for a while and see what it does for me in ladder games. Thanks so much man! I was in that exact position when i started this project. A lot of missing keys and looking down at the keyboard. PM me with the number of games it takes you until you feel comfortable please! Thanks again :D | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 15:23 Drazzzt wrote: Hi, very interesting and thanks for your effort. I dont know if I should try it as i am playing with the other setup for such a long time now (>12 years if you take my bw background into account where at least the 1a2a3a4a etc hasn't changed). But on the other training your brain with new things is always good. The hard part would be really learning it cause I usually have only time for 5-10 games a month (!) :-). Anyways, I still have a question about the screen hotkeys. I have to admit (it's embarrassing i know :-)) that i dont use any screen hotkeys at all, mainly relying on clicking on the minimap or pressing the space bar (which really can be a pain in the ass, I agree), but I'd like to. So, you say for zerg that you use 1 and tab for "creep cam/rally point". Unfortunately, I don't understand exactly what you mean by this. Could you elaborate a bit more? Are you resetting them all the time? creep spread is quite wide. where would be one spot to focus on? rally point? Last question: HOTS will be out soon, don't you fear that your setup becomes somewhat obsolete then? Or at least hard to adapt again? Maybe I should wait till hots comes out as i have to learn new hotkeys anyways...mmh. Thanks man. The creep cam really works best if you want one line of creep going to your enemy's base. The loop would go: 1, click on tumor, spread, center on new tumor, Shift+1. I've been trying to think of ways to make the creep spread mechanic better ( like rehotkeying etc etc) but haven't really found anything I think is definitively awesome. Rally point is just where i have my hatcheries rallied to at the time, it changes throughout the game and I just rebind the location. That way I can press the rally key quick, put the new units into my control groups and be back to other things. If the place you want your units to gather just happens to be where you want to push creep, then you could use the rally cam as one creep highway and the creep cam as a second creep highway. i use the remaining 6 screen hotkeys (accessed with alt) for bases. That way if i get dropped i can snap right to the base i'm getting dropped in, run my workers and bring my anti-drop squad in to wreak face :D I WILL BE UPDATING CHAMELEON AS SOON AS HOTS IS RELEASED. This project is not set in stone, I will always be tweaking it and making it better. I am actually really excited for hots to come out so I can get to work on figuring out the best setup with the new units and abilities. (I fucking love this kind of stuff :D) Was that clear? Any ideas on creep spread mechanics?? EDITED for name change | ||
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Pabs
93 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 15:35 Akamu wrote: wow really?! I'm quite surprised. I use it often, if i forget to shift click any workers back to minerals after building things or if a base mines out. I would normally just hit CTRL+ F1 and have them all selected and tell them where i want them to go. Couldn't i in theory just keep it like that since i'm not using F1 in this current set up? Shift clicking scvs and probes back to mine is deep in my blood, It almost never happens that I forget it because its such a habit for me. I am sure that i forget sometimes, but I can't think of a time off the top of my head. You could keep it at F1, I'm working on incorporating it now that I know it is useful. I think N or H might be better options. But then again, I'm working on a big issue with zergs accidentally making extra queens and getting upgrades they don't want to get. (Zerg is definitely the biggest pain in the ass for hotkeys) and may want to use N, H and 6 to solve that. What do you think is faster F1 or N or H? | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 19:10 Crushgroove wrote: So he uses only tab and 1 for camera? You're saying he uses all of the alt keys for that also... I didn't see that he called them "screen hotkeys", but that hardly seems more efficient to me.. Wouldn't the old way of just hitting one button to recall a camera state, instead of alt+ a button be more efficient? Okay, so the most commonly changed screen hotkeys (for chronoboost, creep and rally point type things) are on 1 and Tab. to bind them I press shift+1 and shift+tab (as this is faster than ctrl+1 and ctrl+tab) The less commonly changed screen hotkeys are set to Alt+Q, Alt+W, Alt+A, Alt+S, Alt+C, Alt+V. To bind them I use Ctrl+Q,Ctrl+W,Ctrl+A,Ctrl+S,Ctrl+C,Ctrl+V. The issue is that I can't figure out a way to incorporate a single key stroke method of snapping to bases without reaching far across the keyboard. The two options I can see are: 1. Use Alt+ the keys 2. Use F1-F5, 7, U, and J (or 6, Y, H, N for non-zergs and precision zergs) Any ideas that you think will work better? | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On May 02 2012 19:00 piiiT wrote: i cannot download it it just sends me to the google docs main page... Anyone have a solution for piiiT?? piiiT, can you describe the page your getting more specifically? It doesn't say Chameleon anywhere on the page??? EDITED for name change | ||
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