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EDIT: Fingo and I would first like to say that we're glad this helped some of you guys out there. That's all we wanted to do.
Secondly, I've uploaded new replays that reflects an improved build order that involves chronoboosting out 2 probes before putting down the forge. As you can see in the replay, it works quite well.
I've also uploaded a replay where I decide to play the game out after I don't bust the wall, and instead choose to drone up. The result is astounding. There's a 30 food advantage for the protoss player at the 8 minute mark. He then kills me shortly thereafter. If you watch the replay, I don't catch up in econ until halfway through the game, and Fingo is able to maintain the 30 food lead while teching up to templar. Granted, I played poorly that game, but the point is that a 30 food advantage after your opponent 6 pools is better than anything any toss going 10 or 12 gate could achieve.
If you watched the GSL from last night (Fruit Dealer vs. Inca) you'll see how devastating a 6 pool is if you only try to use probes/zealots and a "normal build (12 gate, etc) to hold it off. It's hard, and you could lose outright. Why would you choose a response that has even remotely a chance to lose when you can instead respond in a way that guarantees you a 30 food advantage going into the mid game, with a push that can often kill the Zerg outright? I just don't understand it.
Disclaimer: This is a guide for Steppes of War. On this map it's almost impossible to stop a 6 pool with even a 10 gate without taking Probe losses, due to the Zealot nerf. This would work on other maps as well (except Scrap Station), since you'd have a little more time to respond.
Introduction
My friend Fingo and I were talking about how powerful 6 pool had become in ZvP since the zealot nerf made it pretty hard to stop a 6 pool with even a 10 gate. So, we started working on build orders that would survive a 6 pool while still being ahead in econ (i.e., not losing any probes). In the end, we discovered a build order that stops a 6 pool cold with you being 15 probes to his 6-7 drones (depending on how many drones the zerg decided to build, and whether you decide to squeeze out 2 extra probes), without having to scout ridiculously early. All credit goes to Fingo for finetuning this build order.
P.S. Fingo is 1600 diamond, and I am 1400.
The Build Order
Probe until 9/10
9/10 Pylon
9/10 Probe
Scout immediately after pylon
See 6 pool, return with scouting probe
10/18 Chrono Probe
11/18 Chrono Probe
12/18 Forge at ramp
12/18 Begin cannon and Gateway, using the cannon to block the space between the Gateway and Forge
12/18 Resume Probe production
At this point, the lings should be arriving at your ramp. If the Zerg is smart about it, he'll choose to focus the Forge, but it doesn't matter if he focuses the Gateway either. Your Gateway/Forge will probably fall (or come close to dying), and it is essential that you pull probes at this point to block the remaining lings he has, especially if you went with Version 2. You shouldn't lose any probes because the cannon will have come up by then. After you finish off the lings with 0-1 Probe losses, you should be 14-15 probes to his 6-7 drones. Now, rebuild your wall. You've won!
A Photon Cannon teabagging a Zergling
Replays
Replay 1
Replay 2
Replay 3 (Where we play the game out after I choose not to bust, and drone up instead)
Note
We did a couple variations of this build order. In one variation, Fingo cut the 2 chronoboosted Probes in favor of a pylon block and a faster Gateway. This method still leaves you ahead quite a bit economically, and is also a little safer.
In our replays, I also tried a few variations of the 6 pool, including one replay in which I pulled all my drones to completely all-in the Protoss. The drones don't do much except inflict more Probe casualties.
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Or you could micro your probes, try dropping a 13 gate at the ramp and when you see the zerlings coming pull workers to block the choke and click the minerals to bring them back if they get to low. Keep reinforcing till your zealot finishes.
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On September 24 2010 10:19 tru_power22 wrote:
Or you could micro your probes, try dropping a 13 gate at the ramp and when you see the zerlings coming pull workers to block the choke and click the minerals to bring them back if they get to low. Keep reinforcing till your zealot finishes.
That results in far too many probe losses =\ This way is the cleanest way we found to do it.
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I should mention for those bound to reply without watching the replays, this is specifically designed to deal with 6 pool on Steps of War. On other maps, the build is less worrisome.
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On September 24 2010 10:31 Fingo wrote:
I should mention for those bound to reply without watching the replays, this is specifically designed to deal with 6 pool on Steps of War. On other maps, the build is less worrisome.
We still haven't tried it on Scrap Station yet...But honestly, on Scrap Station you'd have time to put down 2 gateways to block off the ramp completely.
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Good guide, I lost to a 6 pool last night and it was pretty frustrating, next time I'll give this a go 
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Or you could block the ramp with probes until the zealot comes out.
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On September 24 2010 10:36 Twistacles wrote:
Or you could block the ramp with probes until the zealot comes out.
Did you even watch the replays? We stopped the 6 pool on Steppes of War taking 0 probe casualties. None.
Of course we tried the probe block method. It's not optimal. The protoss ends up equal or just slightly ahead of the Zerg in harvesters. Our aim in this guide was to take NO probe losses and survive the 6 pool while completely crushing the Zerg in worker count.
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then you realized he didn't 6 pool...
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On September 24 2010 10:40 ionlyplayPROtoss wrote:
then you realized he didn't 6 pool...
If you watch the replays, Fingo waits til he sees the 6 pool until he puts down any buildings. He goes about his build normally until then. Please watch the replays before you comment.
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Not only will you lose probes, you may lose ALL of them. That is the risk factor. The timing just doesn't work safely, even with 10 gate chrono-boosted zealot. There is a reason we posted this. Before posting further suggestions I urge you to try them in a game first. Cheers
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On September 24 2010 10:12 Goobus wrote:
9/10 Probe
Scout immediately after pylon
See 6 pool, return with scouting probe
10/18 Forge at ramp
The replays you provided confirm that if you were 10 gating, you would have started a Gateway by the time you scout the 6 pool, even with the short walk paths of Stepps of War. You'd have to cancel it to start the Forge. If you were 12 gating, you might have to cancel a probe, and since the probe wouldn't be at the ramp, you'd have to run one up there to begin the wall-in.
I would remake the replays showing the reactionary steps as well (for both 10 and 12 gate, where you succeed), rather than just having the building probe wait for the scouting probe to see the 6 pool before plonking down a Forge... at 215 minerals. At the least, you should mention this in your guide.
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Thanks man crushing my 6 poolin now.
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On September 24 2010 11:05 Aylear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2010 10:12 Goobus wrote:
9/10 Probe
Scout immediately after pylon
See 6 pool, return with scouting probe
10/18 Forge at ramp
The replays you provided confirm that if you were 10 gating, you would have started a Gateway by the time you scout the 6 pool, even with the short walk paths of Stepps of War. You'd have to cancel it to start the Forge. If you were 12 gating, you might have to cancel a probe, and since the probe wouldn't be at the ramp, you'd have to run one up there to begin the wall-in. I would remake the replays showing the reactionary steps as well (for both 10 and 12 gate, where you succeed), rather than just having the building probe wait for the scouting probe to see the 6 pool before plonking down a Forge... at 215 minerals. At the least, you should mention this in your guide.
Good concern. Actually, the build is reactionary as it is. Part of this build (as you may note in the replays) is to wait until your probe scout reaches the zerg base before putting down the forge/gateway. Of course, if you don't scout a 6 or 7 pool, you simply put down a slightly late gateway. When scouting with your pylon probe, this typically results in the forge/gateway being 50 minerals late.
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On September 24 2010 11:05 Aylear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2010 10:12 Goobus wrote:
9/10 Probe
Scout immediately after pylon
See 6 pool, return with scouting probe
10/18 Forge at ramp
The replays you provided confirm that if you were 10 gating, you would have started a Gateway by the time you scout the 6 pool, even with the short walk paths of Stepps of War. You'd have to cancel it to start the Forge. If you were 12 gating, you might have to cancel a probe, and since the probe wouldn't be at the ramp, you'd have to run one up there to begin the wall-in. I would remake the replays showing the reactionary steps as well (for both 10 and 12 gate, where you succeed), rather than just having the building probe wait for the scouting probe to see the 6 pool before plonking down a Forge... at 215 minerals. At the least, you should mention this in your guide.
I admit, our "scouting" was a bit contrived, but that's a good point. Fingo was at 215 minerals when he put down his Forge, which means that he could have squeezed out some probes there too. Good catch. Post whatever replays you can make and I'll update the OP with them.
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So I just checked the replay for the ling timing on Steppes, and I have definitely held off a 6pool that arrived just 4 seconds later without diverting from a 12gate. I suppose if he'd tried to run through with his first lings that I would have taken probe losses, and perhaps I didn't have the money for the walling pylon 4 seconds earlier (pretty sure I did), but I'd be interested to know why you think its impossible to hold it with a 12gate on steppes (and, really, you should 10gate by default on steppes anyway vZ).
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[edit] Granted, its the same basic idea as your build in terms of what it does, but its not delayed if you dont see a 6pool.
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What happens if zerg sends his first built drone to block the gateway build?... As I see it, this will effectively fuck up your wall build unless you somehow manage to kill the drone really fast, or get the gateway up before the drone arrives, which can only be done if you don't build probes after 10 i pressume.
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On September 24 2010 11:27 Yilar wrote:
What happens if zerg sends drone #6 to block the gateway build?... As I see it, this will effectively fuck up your wall build unless you somehow manage to kill the drone really fast, or get the gateway up before the drone arrives, which can only be done if you don't build probes after 10 i pressume.
I'd assume you'd just send 2 probes to chase it off and plop the gateway down right away.
On September 24 2010 11:22 kzn wrote:
So I just checked the replay for the ling timing on Steppes, and I have definitely held off a 6pool that arrived just 4 seconds later without diverting from a 12gate. I suppose if he'd tried to run through with his first lings that I would have taken probe losses, and perhaps I didn't have the money for the walling pylon 4 seconds earlier (pretty sure I did), but I'd be interested to know why you think its impossible to hold it with a 12gate on steppes (and, really, you should 10gate by default on steppes anyway vZ).
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[edit] Granted, its the same basic idea as your build in terms of what it does, but its not delayed if you dont see a 6pool.
The timing is really important. The 4 seconds matters quite a lot. Even if you had walled off with a pylon, the pylon would have gone down, and as soon as your first Zealot pops, it would've been surrounded and killed by the 10 lings running in (I double extractor trick to get out my 9th and 10th lings). And even if you do use probes to block, you end up losing a significant number of probes.
As someone mentioned above, I think it's completely possible to chrono out 2 more probes and adapt this build so that it becomes more in line with what a toss does normally.
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Couldn't you just micro over the gateway location, or send the following drone right after? There is no need for these drones in terms of getting the first 6 lings anyway.
Actually if you pull a drone after the new drone is done and move in with 2 drones you can completely shut down his wall build. It takes almost 10 seconds to get probes from the mineral line upto the wall and even more time to kill the actual drones, which should ruin the timing on wall build vs ling arrival.
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On September 24 2010 11:30 Goobus wrote:
The timing is really important. The 4 seconds matters quite a lot. Even if you had walled off with a pylon, the pylon would have gone down, and as soon as your first Zealot pops, it would've been surrounded and killed by the 10 lings running in (I double extractor trick to get out my 9th and 10th lings). And even if you do use probes to block, you end up losing a significant number of probes.
As someone mentioned above, I think it's completely possible to chrono out 2 more probes and adapt this build so that it becomes more in line with what a toss does normally.
So you just build the pylon without waiting, and drop a cannon down without waiting for like 5 seconds like I did - mostly because I wasn't sure if my zealot would get out in time or not. Certainly it will be a lot closer than it is even in the +2 probes replay, but you dont have to delay anything for scouting.
[edit] And the point of that zealot is more to delay the building deaths than anything else, so that the cannon gets up in time.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/B3vfz.jpg)
