EPTEven so, id have around 12 marines and 2 ghosts by that time. stim wouldnt be finished, but if i saw the carrier being made with my reaper (once again gauranteed unless its a proxy, even then its dicey), then i would get stim early instead of combat sheild, get 1 ghost, make 20 rines. and considering i dont get combat shield or a second ghost (lots of extra gas there), i could probably get a medivac up too. i doubt your carrier would stand a chance when i emp it then stim it down.
[D] Carrier Viability + 1 Base Carrier - Page 4
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DocM
United States212 Posts
Even so, id have around 12 marines and 2 ghosts by that time. stim wouldnt be finished, but if i saw the carrier being made with my reaper (once again gauranteed unless its a proxy, even then its dicey), then i would get stim early instead of combat sheild, get 1 ghost, make 20 rines. and considering i dont get combat shield or a second ghost (lots of extra gas there), i could probably get a medivac up too. i doubt your carrier would stand a chance when i emp it then stim it down. | ||
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DanielD
United States192 Posts
On June 28 2010 19:32 Lighioana wrote: Sorry but any kind of tech tree rush will be demolished if scouted by any decent player. Duh. That doesn't mean you cant do it. You see it in pro BW sometimes. And to whoever was talking about their bio+ghost running thru this -- what makes you think you'll be able to emp all the sentries? Any 'decent player' is going to have a probe or some kind of spotter and see your push before you get to the ramp, drop an FF, and get out of EMP range. See how the theorycrafting goes both wasy? Of course it is a vulnerable build, that doesn't mean its not viable. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
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Piski
Finland3461 Posts
On June 29 2010 04:00 nujgnoy wrote: Carriers are OP relative to vikings. One fully upgraded carrier can take down 5 fully upgraded vikings iirc. Vikings melt to carriers when they are supposed to counter them. I don't even play protoss as my main but carriers op? Even if one carrier can take 5 vikings (yeah right :D) carriers are costly and very late tech. You just try to get few carriers with full upgrades without being completely destroyed :f | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
The key to making carriers work is as soon as cyber core finishes to start +1 air. then get warp gate and then +2 air. (at least w/ my build) warp gate finishes as you are transitioning to your mass gateway section and so immediately allows you to reinforce your few zealots and couple sentries that are trying to pin the enemy in with a bunch of units and you get about two carriers and another full cycle of units and then push. you limited their options to anti ground (and likely factory play or marauder play) by the early pressure and unit choices, and they can't switch to marine viking in time to stop the carriers and they seem to be able to push you back right as the third carrier arrives and that will end it. at least that was my experience in the week before beta ending. I have 0 data on vs zerg or protoss though. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
On June 29 2010 04:23 Piski wrote: I don't even play protoss as my main but carriers op? Even if one carrier can take 5 vikings (yeah right :D) carriers are costly and very late tech. You just try to get few carriers with full upgrades without being completely destroyed :f I tested this out, I didn't believe my eyes but yes, one fully upgraded carrier took down a ridiculous amount of fully upgraded vikings. I believe it was 5 which costs 750/375. And I said carriers are OP relative to vikings, not that carriers are OP in general. I have no comment on whether carriers are OP in general. | ||
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EnderCN
United States499 Posts
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Interfect
Canada52 Posts
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
On June 29 2010 05:43 Interfect wrote: Carriers also take a long time to build, to even mass them you need like 12 Stargates and you still gotta wait for like 2mins. That's not true. For example, in pro BW games, progamers use 2 starports. After 2 cycles, you have 4 carriers, and from there on they will be able to participate significantly in battles and control the flow. You don't need 12 carriers to effectively use them. And really you only generally have put down 12 starports in money maps and not in low money maps. This is roughly similar in SC2 as well. And again, I am saying that carriers are OP in relation to Vikings which are supposed to counter them, not that they are OP in general because I haven't been able to test much of it. | ||
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Fumble
156 Posts
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lololol
5198 Posts
On June 29 2010 05:21 nujgnoy wrote: I tested this out, I didn't believe my eyes but yes, one fully upgraded carrier took down a ridiculous amount of fully upgraded vikings. I believe it was 5 which costs 750/375. And I said carriers are OP relative to vikings, not that carriers are OP in general. I have no comment on whether carriers are OP in general. One carrier can kill 20 vikings, which is 9001 minerals and 2805 gas. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
On June 29 2010 08:14 lololol wrote: One carrier can kill 20 vikings, which is 9001 minerals and 2805 gas. 1 viking costs 150/75 iirc, so 20 vikings cost 3000 1500. Unless you mean vikings in assault mode, I don't think one carrier can kill 20 vikings when both parties have been given attack command towards each other. If you don't have the beta, I think there's a TL rule against posting w/o any knowledge of the game. | ||
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lololol
5198 Posts
On June 29 2010 08:37 nujgnoy wrote: 1 viking costs 150/75 iirc, so 20 vikings cost 3000 1500. Unless you mean vikings in assault mode, I don't think one carrier can kill 20 vikings when both parties have been given attack command towards each other. If you don't have the beta, I think there's a TL rule against posting w/o any knowledge of the game. No, I was just one upping your bullshit. The question is, why are you posting without having any knowledge about the game? 1 carrier killing 5 vikings at equal ups. What game are you playing? | ||
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
On June 29 2010 08:45 lololol wrote: No, I was just one upping your bullshit. The question is, why are you posting without having any knowledge about the game? 1 carrier killing 5 vikings at equal ups. What game are you playing? Do upgrades even do anything? I mean Carriers get +1 attack on each interceptor for each attack upgrade which would be perfectly offset by the armor ups... and assuming that Vikings get +1 (+2 overall, one for each attack), then it would be perfectly offset by Carrier armor/shields? How much HP do vikings have btw? Because carriers with +3 will do 128 dmg per volley, and you get +2 really quick on the build I have, typically before Terran builds their first armory, so I'm wondering if a quick +3 would be worth it, especially since Terran tends to upgrade bionic ups first. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
I had tested this in a unit tester map before and a carrier did take down 5 vikings with me thinking that they both had full ups. The map must have been in a bugged state. | ||
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sinn
United States132 Posts
On June 29 2010 08:45 lololol wrote: No, I was just one upping your bullshit. The question is, why are you posting without having any knowledge about the game? 1 carrier killing 5 vikings at equal ups. What game are you playing? Wait...seriously? I mean i'm assuming you micro'd the vikings so they focus fired the carrier...but still. This is so counter-intuitive. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
On June 29 2010 09:22 sinn wrote: Wait...seriously? I mean i'm assuming you micro'd the vikings so they focus fired the carrier...but still. This is so counter-intuitive. Uh... read into the tone of his post. He's saying it *wouldn't* happen like that. | ||
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
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nujgnoy
United States204 Posts
LOL Hey sinn, I actually was the one who was wrong @. @. The testing I did in the past was wrong. Sorry to make you rage when I'm the one who failed | ||
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