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Zerg Upgrades

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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TurboT
Profile Joined January 2010
Germany33 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-04-09 06:32:55
April 09 2010 06:31 GMT
#1
I'm experimenting with all sorts of Upgrade variations and wanted to ask for your latest opinion on zerg Upgrades. Basically what i'm stuck with is:

ZvZ: Zergling +1 atack and speed or +1 Atack Roaches. I'm still experimenting with +1 Carapace first but it feels kinda weak...dunno. Roaches should die to mass zergling now, however, i seem to never get Zergmirrors on the ladder now, so i can't tell if thats really true.

ZvP: +1 Attack seems not necessary because i get a small amount of t1 units while expanding. I tried mass Zergling with speed and +1 Carapace or +1 Atack...while expanding. Both seem viable to me, allthough your zerg/Roach army won't benefit from +1 Atack. On the other hand you can transition your mutaharass into a fast Broodlord (so that Broodlings benefit from atackupgrades), which worked a few times. Still not sure what I'll play in the end.

ZvT: I am a Fan of early Zergling Pressure in this matchup. Normally I add the Evochamber after Lair Tech, which feels quite late to me. On the other hand i see no reason to get it earlier since most Terrans play quite passively on my t1. I'm having more problems with drops and multitasking than with straight up fights in this matchup. Since a lot of Terrans seem to favor mech now, i usally stick with +1 range on t2 for roach and Hydra. Haven't played Mutas lately so i can't tell if +1 Armor for Air is necessary. I guess mass Muta could break a relatively slow Terran Mechbuild...but this is speculation.

Of course i want to have 3/3 in the end but I'm still questioning my decisions towards upgrades. What do you think about it? Any intresting games since the patch that made you say: "OMG MY ROACHES NEED more armor now!"?

Rushing for upgrades feels semicheesy to me... I rather save the mins for an evochamber and upgrade for another 2 Units or so.

Any ideas or your own experience is welcome.

On April 12 2010 15:09 Manifesto7 wrote: To not GG is to not respect the art.
MLG_Wiggin
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States767 Posts
April 09 2010 06:37 GMT
#2
Well, even before the patch I did Speedlings builds in almost all my ZvZ's with a high degree of success, but after the patch I seem to win the vast majority of my ZvZ match ups against Roaches if I get a quick +1 attack (Gold Division, by the way). I get the +1 attack even faster if I'm going against a Speedling Mirror. It's TOTALLY worth it ZvZ.

I haven't played a really good Roach user yet, but I can see how Roaches with a few banelings could totally wreck a Speedling build in the worst kind of way.

The only moment I've gone "Wow" about the armor nerf was against a Protoss player who cheesed a bit with a Zealot rush and fast Charge. His Zealots tore my Roaches to pieces at about equal supply. Haven't had anything like that happen since, but I have noticed Protoss in particular be more difficult to deal with, as it makes Immortals take one less shot to kill Roaches, makes Zealots more effective, and makes Collossi slightly more effective. The real killer has been the 10 HP nerf to Hydras... it makes all those splash damage attacks from Terran hurt that much more, and made bio-balls harder to deal with.
@DBWiggin, SC2 ref
Antpile
Profile Joined March 2009
United States213 Posts
April 09 2010 06:43 GMT
#3
You definitely don't want to go muta vs terran mech now. Thors wreck them so bad.

+1 armor is pretty key vs toss if you plan to use zerglings just to prevent their +1 attack zealots from 2 shotting your zerglings.
FlamingTurd
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1059 Posts
April 09 2010 12:41 GMT
#4
Yep I'm definitely having a much tougher time vs the MMMT balls... as if it wasn't difficult enough in the past to even get near em without your army splattering. The upgrades are definitely essential and ya wanna get em as fast as reasonably possible, wut they said above is pretty much the same as my experience as well.
Nerf MMMT!!! Liquid`Ret Hwaiting!!!
PeterDoe
Profile Joined March 2010
United Kingdom53 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-04-09 16:38:11
April 09 2010 14:52 GMT
#5
My opinion on ZvZ:

Most time the case is roaches Vs.lings:

(under same resources condition,if u lose ur RoachesVSLings battel,there must be a upg problem occurs:

If you use roaches counter lings, you should always go (+Lv1 attacks upg), roache 3hit to kill a ling will change to 2hit(50% extra benefit then Lv0 attack!,this also means you roaches will kill lings 50% Faster then before)

Note:you should not keeping upg on attack lv after ur reach lv1, even you got Lv3 attack, it still take 2hit to kill a ling,therefore,0% extra benefit.( as long as ur oppenent didn't upg ling's carapace, u are keeping ur roaches at +Lv1 attack, and continue upg ur carapace Lv, you always has extra benefit % from upg ur carapace when you use roaches counting lings)(btw,most times, when ur oppenent using lings,and they see you build a evochamber,they will continue upg their attack level,so dont worried about that too much~ )


A different story on using lings to counter roaches:

two possibilities:
1. u didn't see ur oppenent build evochamber,that means their attack lv is keep 0, Therefore you should not upg ur carapace, even ur lings at Lv3 carapace, roaches will 3 hit kill a ling, same as Lv0 carapace. You should always go upg ur attack lv. you always get extra benefit %( less hit to kill a roache).

2.U see ur oppenent build a evochamber, 99% of the case they will upg the attack level, cuz it makes roaches 2 hit kill a ling , instead of 3 hit, that was big big big advantages.You should immdiate cancel ur upg on attack lv,and change to upg carapace to compensating that advantages.( +Lv1 carapace ling, their +Lv1 attack roaches will take 3hits to kill them, instead of 2 hit to kill a Lv0 carapace ling.) that means ur lings are 50% tougher then before, it was a very obvious change.( if u had enough money, build 2 evo instead of 1)

btw: you should not contiue upg ur carapace, as long as the lv is same as the attack lv of the roaches.
lv1 attack roach 3hit lv 1 carapace ling, 2hit Lv0
lv2 attack roach 3hit lv 2 carapace ling, 2hit Lv1,lv0

so you dont need to go upg lv2 caraspces, cuz that takes 3hit to kill ur ling, same as lv1.
you should always go upg ur attack lv, and keep ur ling's carapace lv same as ur oppenent roache's attack lv.This is quite important,cuz that advantage cacel is very noticable,and ur oppent will wondering why ur lings so tough~

and if they did build a evo, then you go +3 attack straight, and dont bother upg ur carapace.
When there's a shadow, you follow the sun.When there is love, then you look for the one. And for the promises, there is the sky. And for the heavens are those who can fly.
thez
Profile Joined August 2003
Canada65 Posts
April 09 2010 16:01 GMT
#6
I havn't explored upgrades hardly at all yet, so it's a topic i'm still very interested in. I will share what i have learned.

I've learned you should always upgrade your roaches asap in a zvz battle. I was in a 1v1 where we both 1 based till we ran out of minerals. It was an incredibly close game. After we both mined out, he won only because he had 1-1. Unless lings own roaches now from last patch, once roaches come into play, a good player will be upgrading roaches anyway and they will still own lings. I have also learned upgrading carapace vs immortals is pointless. And of course zealot/lings are still the same as sc1. LOL so ya that's what i have learned so far about upgrades. i'll be interested to hear what other people have learned.
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