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[M] (2) SB - New Heartbreak Ridge

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Avexyli

United States697 Posts

September 13 2015 04:04 GMT

Anaylzer:
+ Show Spoiler +

Size: 148x116
Tileset: Zerus + LOTV Aiur
Spawn Positions: 9, 3
Base Count: 12*
Servers: NA, EU

Features: This is a complete re-work of Heartbreak Ridge, ported from Brood War. I had ported originally for Starbow, but made it slightly too large for play, and with heavy demand I have completely re-done it with more detailed doodad placement and textures, on a more accurate layout.

Artsy:
+ Show Spoiler +

SwedenTheKid

567 Posts

September 13 2015 04:24 GMT

At first the aesthetics looked sloppy but after seeing the close ups they are really well done. The overall unappealing look of Heartbreak could also be to blame (I assume I'm not the only one who gets put off by the original's and remake's immediate layout look. It always has looked kinda silly.). As for the map, I think you've done a pretty good job. The backdoor would seem to work in starbow with the lack of reapers, and the lack of bases shouldn't be an issue either. My only concern is how open a lot of the areas are. There are a few chokes outside the natural but I'm not sure if there are enough. Then again I'm not an expert on starbow. Overall looks well done. I might even try to revisit this layout for a HotS/LotV map.

Edit- I didn't see the rocks blocking the backdoor in the overview. I'm not sure if I'm blind or they aren't there. Anyway, I honestly don't see a reason for them in this port, aside from maybe speedling raids. Would be interesting to see the map with the backdoor open.

sTYleZerG-eX

Mexico473 Posts

September 13 2015 04:27 GMT

Very nice texturing and deco.
What did u improve from the last Starbow version? (so far I see u messed with the middle (I like it)
The only thing I don't like is the texturing of the middle ramps, at least from afar I think they should b textured in a way so they are more clear (in game & mini map)
Other thing, where is the neutral rock block? I don't see it.
Also linked images to imgur.com would be nice.

Avexyli

United States697 Posts

September 13 2015 04:33 GMT

On September 13 2015 13:24 SwedenTheKid wrote:
At first the aesthetics looked sloppy but after seeing the close ups they are really well done.

Yea, I noticed that too, lots of blending colors made it look awful from afar.

On September 13 2015 13:24 SwedenTheKid wrote:
The backdoor would seem to work in starbow with the lack of reapers, and the lack of bases shouldn't be an issue either.

Reapers do exist in Starbow but they're a more mid/lategame unit, the backdoor was meant for pressuring with tanks or other siege units.

On September 13 2015 13:24 SwedenTheKid wrote:
My only concern is how open a lot of the areas are. There are a few chokes outside the natural but I'm not sure if there are enough. Then again I'm not an expert on starbow. Overall looks well done. I might even try to revisit this layout for a HotS/LotV map.

Openness is important in Starbow, because of how powerful splash damage is (Storm, lurkers, tanks, reavers). Units are smaller and the pathing works differently. You should play and see how it all works, map design in SB is very fun.

On September 13 2015 13:24 SwedenTheKid wrote:
Edit- I didn't see the rocks blocking the backdoor in the overview. I'm not sure if I'm blind or they aren't there. Anyway, I honestly don't see a reason for them in this port, aside from maybe speedling raids. Would be interesting to see the map with the backdoor open.

Yeah I forgot to update that picture. An open backdoor would make early harass very overpowered due to defenders advantage (50% miss up cliffs), so tanks would mean players could never take a natural without going 1base air.

On September 13 2015 13:27 sTYleZerG-eX wrote:
Very nice texturing and deco.
What did u improve from the last Starbow version? (so far I see u messed with the middle (I like it)

The original SB version I made was much bigger in size, everything felt huge and rush distance was crazy long, this map is much closer (if not identical) to the Brood War scale, so everything should feel proper ingame. And like I mentioned up above I forgot to update the backrocks on the thumbnail.

Here's what the old version was:

+ Show Spoiler +

The dimmensions were 188x156.

On September 13 2015 13:27 sTYleZerG-eX wrote:
The only thing I don't like is the texturing of the middle ramps, at least from afar I think they should b textured in a way so they are more clear (in game & mini map)
Other thing, where is the neutral rock block? I don't see it.
Also linked images to imgur.com would be nice.

Originally the ramps were green like the grass of the highground, but I exchanged it for dirt, not sure what to do with them.

Will link to the imgur as well.

SwedenTheKid

567 Posts

September 13 2015 05:03 GMT

@Avex

Thanks for addressing my concerns, I haven't played SB in a long time, I remember there not being reapers though, in the version I played. I've been looking into making SB maps, is there a thread where it explains how to make a map for a mod? Or is there some other place to get that information?

Avexyli

United States697 Posts

September 13 2015 05:20 GMT

The way I learned was by porting Brood War maps and getting used to the feeling of how they were, before making my own (such as Aiur Heights).

There's some pretty easy principles to SB maps though, these are how I work my maps:

1) Expansions are not aggressive (you do not expand towards your opponent, which is why 4p maps always seem to look like Fighting Spirit)
2) The middle of the map needs to be open, meaning there are many ways of accessing it.
3) Naturals are generally on the smaller end, supportive of FFEs
4) Zergs need a base with gas to have a choke hold-able by lurkers (generally a highground with the smallest ramp)
5) ALL smallest ramps should have the starbow-shrunken version seen here
6) Tanks are really, really good, with high damage and splash radius, so lots of small chokes make PvT really difficult.
7) Bases can't be too open, as vulture, ling, etc runbys become very very strong.

It took me at least 20 maps to start nailing these principles, just like how it takes many people a wihle to learn SC2 mapping (a proper 3 base setup, avoid blink maps, etc).

SwedenTheKid

567 Posts

September 13 2015 05:37 GMT

@Avex

Thank you! I will be sure to keep this in mind. Perhaps some of my WIP map ideas would be well suited for SB. One last question- are 3rd bases generally easier or harder than in sc2?