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On February 10 2013 16:00 wrl wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 14:10 Ruinsteel wrote:Well, the measure distance tool says its about 75, which is the same with Cloud Kingdom, so I wouldn't think it's too bad. But, I haven't actually tested the map, so it's very much possible that it doesn't play out well. Cloud Kingdom is also set up in a fairly different way, and I'm not sure how accurate the measure distance tool is. Still had fun doing this so it's not a big deal, plus I could always stretch it or make changes after the contest  . The difference is that you don't have to take the natural ramp on CK, you can walk over to the third instead. It would just be extremely difficult to take any additional bases on your map. That said, the only reason I'm commenting on it is because I like the idea.
That's a good point! I'm considering revising it a little bit because I am pretty happy with the layout. Not sure exactly what I want to do with it yet, but will probably post any changed in the WIP thread ^_^.
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1) When does the voting close?
2) What is the size of eTcetRa's map?
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The voting will close on Tuesday, at 11:00am EST, at which point a winner will be announced. I don't know eTcetRa's map's size... hopefully he'll enlighten us!
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Well he's the one who submitted the rule, odds are it's legal. Hopefully it isn't though, cuz if it is he'll just win.
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The map size is small enough
136X122 - 16592
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On February 11 2013 10:27 The_Templar wrote:Really? Not one person is going to vote for my map?  
Join the club.
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HypertonicHydroponic, as gimpy and broken as your map is, the tightness of the middle, having to go up hill, while still being able to get a surround, I find really interesting.
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Well, my votes in now, and no, it wasn't for myself! =P I'll save my review until after the results are in, but first a couple comment responses:
On February 11 2013 10:55 Coppermantis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2013 10:27 The_Templar wrote:Really? Not one person is going to vote for my map? Join the club.
Yay! You guys got your pity vote, too! Moving up to a club with real status -- so exciting!
On February 11 2013 11:57 RFDaemoniac wrote:
HypertonicHydroponic, as gimpy and broken as your map is, the tightness of the middle, having to go up hill, while still being able to get a surround, I find really interesting.
And I find your broken and gimpy compliment quite interesting, too! XD Anything to inspire a fellow mapper. tee hee
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I didn't mean to be insulting or anything, just that it isn't standard and encourages very aggressive play
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I know you didn't which is why I teased you back. If you had I would have reported you to the internet police. :p
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In Unearthed I really like the main/nat/third and the middle part(not the towers tho) but I think the sides are quite weak and need some rework.
Viridian Valley again I love the main/nat/third and I like the base behind the main as well. However the middle part is quite mediocre and there is clearly one base too many as the two full bases in the corner are basically defendable in the same way and right next to each other. I'd love to see the things around the main reused but not the rest.
I think Delusion is the map I like the most in its current state, it has the strong cliff overlooking the third and the path between nat and third which requires rather offensive defending. Also when taking more than three bases you best take position on the highground quite offensively and the highground is really open for interesting battles. Also harrassing the fourths with small armies through cliffing or drops is encouraged.
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Voting is now over. I'm glad to see at least one of these continue in the WIP thread, as the maps almost all have cool concepts/elements.
Including PM votes, the vote count is
9 - Archvil3 - Lunar Jam
12 - NewSunshine - Viridian Valley
3 - Gfire - Delusion
1 Coppoermantis - Tazal
1 - moskonia - Ruin Mountain
3 - Ruinsteel - Spire Island
1 - The_Templar - What the Sphinx
1 - HypertonicHydroponic - Seedy Underbelly
12 - eTcetRa - Unearthed
So we have a tie between eTcetRa's Unearthed and NewSunshine's Viridian Valley. Congratulations to the winners!
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Grats to the winners! My personal top three I think are the same, but Unearthed ez #1, then Lunar Jam, then Viridian Valley.
I'll throw a few quick notes out there since I know people like feedback (maybe not from me, XD):
Lunar Jam -- Strong Middle high ground, like the feel of the way this will play, very good interpretation of the restriction.
Viridian Valley -- Weak middle high ground, while it's a pivot point on the map most of the map is middle ground, meaning it's essentially flat; really though, I think this can be pretty easily fixed by raising the middle bar another level and doubleing the ramps down to the two low ground no-man's-land areas, and having a ramp down to the half fifths, that would maybe jump this up to #2 or maybe even #1 in my estimation.
Delusion -- Too strong middle high ground, not enough play around option paths, even though the middle is large and could theoretically be fought over, it seems like you might be able to just set up a seige line (terran or toss) and hold that from the forward ramp in front of the natural and deny any 3rd base that is not ferried to by drop.
TazalOk -- middle high ground I think is okay, maybe decent as far as position play and caputuring the theme, the map just doesn't strike me though... =/
Ruin Mountain -- Interesting length could be made into something more interesting, middle high ground seems fairly inconsequential as far as its intent to be a pivot point of the map, it seems fairly easy to get a split map situation without too much back and forth play.
Spire Island -- Weak middle high ground, decent side routes, like my opinion for the current veridian valley the middle high ground area seems too weak as a point of control, in once sense it is stronger because it is more isolated, and in another it is weaker because it is so easy to go around it, don't get me wrong, I think it is a good map, maybe #4 on my personal list, I just feel it is a little weak toward the theme.
What the Sphinx -- Misinterpretation of forward high ground, interesting map otherwise.
Seedy Underbelly -- should inspire some very interesting, unorthodox cheese play, looolz... (really though I'd like to know where my vote came from XD, while perhaps not competitve, I think it would turn out to be a very fun map, so whoever voted for it, let's go play XD)
Unearthed -- awesome forward middle, and side routes, encourages planning and positional play, I really like the way the little pathways, side routes and forward high ground pods all interact with each other, very cool, one of my favorite 2p maps (I tend to like >2p maps in general).
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I will be honest, I liked Unearthed the most, I feel the execution of forward high ground in particular should have been stronger on my map, and I agree with Ragoo's point about the base count. These are things that happen to a map when they're made, relatively speaking, in a minute. I could probably take what I've made and turn it into a further polished creation, but that would get in the way of my other forthcoming projects 
I'm perfectly happy to forget about the map as quickly as it was made, since the point of it was for fun, and keep these things in mind when working on future maps.
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some discssion about unearthed ... simply sharing what was said in the TPW chat on skype. I choose to think arch won't care if I quote.
http://i.imgur.com/nMLiUFa.jpgthis is why i think unearthed is such a terrible map. If you look at the red lines they seperate the center so much that moving out to take a positiion puts you in a bad position. You are never in a position to intercept counterattacks and cannot reinforce any of your bases from the center so moving out is really really bad. Looking at the yellow line you have the defensive path required to defend FOUR bases. Basicly you are greatly encouraged to not move out and at same time encouraged to sit back home and turtle up on 4 bases. Any move out that isnt a commited attack puts you off much worse then if you just turtle at home. The green line is the path to defend 5 bases. At the very edge of the map furthest from the oponent. Thats how you defend 5 bases. Overall I find the layout to be one of the most borring I have ever seen so I am slightly didappointed that the map making community may choose it as the winner of the contest
I'm not sure I agree on the yellow line. you'd want to control the area with the rocks when you have a third and then the middle plateau when you have a 4th and 5th. While doing so you're very vulnerable to air, plus atks via the other two atk paths.
I do get where you're coming from, though. In the cases when you only need to move a deathball close to the CC postion to save a base ... your yellow-line theory applies. I hope the three middle lanes so far from one another promotes splitting deathballs, and static defense ... unless the yellow line theory is right and any game without air will be too static.
I'm sceptical to nats on higher ground, although I think players could learn to cope with it. It promotes drops and early warp-ins .. which is booth good and bad I guess. I'd still put the nat inside the main as one big base.
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I don't think unearthed is as bad as that image from the TPW chat would say. Adding a small path from the rocked forward expansion to the other small path in the middle would make it easier to move out, give an additional attack path, and and make horizontal movement through the middle much easier, while still keeping it choked and giving an advantage to a high ground flank.
I'm also encouraged to start using the double ramp down from the main with a set of rocks on it, for pretty much every map. Allows for safe enough very early game, but allows for pressure to ramp up very quickly ~7-8 minutes.
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Overall I find the layout to be one of the most borring I have ever seen so I am slightly didappointed that the map making community may choose it as the winner of the contest
Well, its overview is really pretty (the metal pods look especially great) which goes a really, really long way with most people. Also it has interesting little paths so if you don't stop and actually think about how the layout would play out, you might think it is a 10/10 map.
I personally think the map has some potential, it just needs some tweaks to help its interconnectivity. Right now you have 3 long lanes across the map with no good way to switch lanes if you need to. So you have to gamble everything and fully commit to an attack, or turtle.
p.s. there's also a good amount of unused space.. which you don't necessarily have to use, but it could help to fix some of the problems.
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EPT
