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Who is the best 'foreigner'? - Page 9

Forum Index > Polls & Liquibet
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Detonation
Profile Joined June 2011
United States26 Posts
July 18 2012 18:41 GMT
#161
Nani.
An2quamaraN
Profile Joined March 2011
Poland379 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-18 18:51:06
July 18 2012 18:48 GMT
#162
On July 18 2012 09:41 Renfield wrote:
How could anyone vote for Stephano when Naniwa keeps making it super far in the GSL? Until Stephano does something like that all he has proven is he can sporadically beat Koreans.


Because you see, it's because the specific format of GSL. You know far more ahead who you will be facing, therefore you have a lot of time and environment (korea) to prepare for those matches, specifically. What makes Naniwa so good is that he has the ability to perfectly prepare for his matches, come up with unique build orders. On the other hand, there is Stephano, who practices half as Naniwa does, never been to Korea, yet, has an ability to do other can not*, on the fly, without preparation, just because of his talent. Also, Stephano accomplished more than twice than Naniwa ever had outside of Korea.


*by that i meant some of the best macro combined with some of the best micro and decision making at the same time.


I don't like Stephano, i am a fan of Naniwa. But i can't deny the obvious raw talent and numbers (tournaments won). Voted Stephano.
4ZakeN87
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden1071 Posts
July 18 2012 18:54 GMT
#163
I think Stephano but it is kind of close. If Naniwa could show he has overall improved his PvZ I might shift towards Naniwa.

However I think the fact that the poll is called "is Naniwa or Stephano the best foreigner" saying a lot. 90% of all votes think one of these players are the best foreigner as of now. I think Nerchio, Thorzain and Sase could make an argument but still they have a bit left to compete with Naniwa and Stephano for that title.
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler" Einstein
Talin
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Montenegro10532 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-18 18:55:01
July 18 2012 18:54 GMT
#164
I definitely have more respect for Naniwa (more than probably any other SC2 progamer at this point) for his absolute commitment to being the best he can be, his passion for the game, and his results in GSL against the top players in the world, so I voted for him - because fuck objective voting anyway.

Still, you really can't argue with the consistency of Stephano's performances and no matter how good GSL is, double RO8 isn't really up to par with Stephano's results, so yeah.
Acquire
Profile Joined May 2012
United States6 Posts
July 18 2012 19:05 GMT
#165
Naniwa definitly. Don't even need to ask.

But most influental? Definitly Stephano right now--he did change the meta. Even though Naniwa is showing a new meta of gate 1st expands.
There is never an answer an argument, but an argument to an answer.
Dyme
Profile Joined November 2010
Germany523 Posts
July 18 2012 19:06 GMT
#166
Stephanos vP is really good, his vT is... well he is Zerg, so it's free win, vZ is not really bad, but not impressive.

Naniwa is Protoss. I just don't have much respect for Protosses. It never really feels as 'skilled' watching a Protoss play. Yea, chances are good Protosses are really good. Like LoL pros are probably also good. It just doesn't look impressive ever at all.
HotShizz
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
France710 Posts
July 18 2012 19:09 GMT
#167
Hard to say. Stephanos ZvP and ZvT are insane, but his ZvZ is realllly weak. Naniwa has show great PvP and PvZ and a lot of awesome innovation, while Stephano uses the same genre of builds, but with near flawless execution. I give the edge to Stephano, but I think that if he were to have a showmatch with Naniwa, with plenty of time to prepare, Naniwa would win or come within one game of winning. His preparation and innovation seems really key to his success, which is why he is perfect for the GSL, and really has an honest chance of eventually capturing the code S crown.
Acquire
Profile Joined May 2012
United States6 Posts
July 18 2012 19:11 GMT
#168
On July 19 2012 03:54 4ZakeN87 wrote:
I think Stephano but it is kind of close. If Naniwa could show he has overall improved his PvZ I might shift towards Naniwa.

However I think the fact that the poll is called "is Naniwa or Stephano the best foreigner" saying a lot. 90% of all votes think one of these players are the best foreigner as of now. I think Nerchio, Thorzain and Sase could make an argument but still they have a bit left to compete with Naniwa and Stephano for that title.



Haha wouldn't that make Naniwa better? Opponents are given equal amount of time to prepare against each other yet stephano can't make it to the round of 8 of the most prestigious sc2 tournament.

aka what i am trying to say is Stephano is his weakest link because he doesn't practice as much making his opponent better then him.
There is never an answer an argument, but an argument to an answer.
Acquire
Profile Joined May 2012
United States6 Posts
July 18 2012 19:12 GMT
#169
Wow my comment above was for a totally different quote. FAIL FAIL FAIL
There is never an answer an argument, but an argument to an answer.
iiant14ii
Profile Joined February 2012
12 Posts
July 18 2012 19:27 GMT
#170
NANI stephano hasnt proven shit in the big boy league. lets see how he does when a couple code s players have some time to prepare for him
G Men Superbowl champs
Fanatic-Templar
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada5819 Posts
July 18 2012 19:29 GMT
#171
Eh, I've seen enough people crush face in foreign events and immediately die in GSL to know that Naniwa is doing something no other foreigner has since Jinro. I mean, Huk did, but he was playing in the old Code S format that was extremely lenient for Code S players.

Maybe Stephano is better, but until he goes to GSL, he hasn't proven it. Benefit of doubt goes to Naniwa.
I bear this sig to commemorate the loss of the team icon that commemorated Oversky's 2008-2009 Proleague Round 1 performance.
Gigaudas
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Sweden1213 Posts
July 18 2012 19:32 GMT
#172
Their results are so hard to compare. Code S is of course super duper hard but there are very few games.

I'm going with my gut and voting Stephano. I feel like he's the favorite more often than Naniwa, even when playing against similar opponents.

I do agree with the people saying that Naniwa might be better at preparing for a bo5 but Stephano is freaking awesome at grinding through huge numbers of opponents in game intensive tournaments.
I
JJH777
Profile Joined January 2011
United States4420 Posts
July 18 2012 20:05 GMT
#173
On July 19 2012 03:19 Fr0d0 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 19 2012 03:03 TeeTS wrote:

what has the amount of money stephano makes to do with his SC2 skill. I don't see how a fan can welcome this prize-money-hunter attitude. It's understandable, yes, but is it likeable? Naniwa is the more proven player, because he has established himself very high in the toughest competition there is in SC2. Stephano never tried it until now, so I can't see why he should be considered as the best non-korean.


Money is the best unbiased measure of skill for professionals. They all doing it for money one way or another.


Fruitdealer top 10 player in the world.
MrF
Profile Joined October 2011
United States320 Posts
July 18 2012 20:13 GMT
#174
stephano does the best in foreign tournaments by far, however i have to say untill he does well in the gsl he is still unproven and thus i voted naniwa, I am sorry but there have been plenty of players korean and otherwise who have had great runs in MLG IPL ect. but then got to code S and get stomped out in ro32, some may say its just bad luck for those players and some may say that gsl isnt any different from other tournaments, i disagree and untill stephano makes the commitment to go and prove himself againt the best in the world i am staying off the bandwagon. It is quite a big bandwagon tho so im sure alot of people will hate me for saying these things. (just noticed above post was basically the same in less words..)
HunterXHunter is awesome
MrF
Profile Joined October 2011
United States320 Posts
July 18 2012 20:16 GMT
#175
On July 19 2012 04:06 Dyme wrote:
Stephanos vP is really good, his vT is... well he is Zerg, so it's free win, vZ is not really bad, but not impressive.

Naniwa is Protoss. I just don't have much respect for Protosses. It never really feels as 'skilled' watching a Protoss play. Yea, chances are good Protosses are really good. Like LoL pros are probably also good. It just doesn't look impressive ever at all.

ever play protoss?? dont compare playing protoss to LoL please....
HunterXHunter is awesome
Reptilia
Profile Joined June 2010
Chile913 Posts
July 18 2012 20:23 GMT
#176
anyone saying its OBVIOUSLY 1 or the other, then let me tell you, you are just a fanboy. They are very close and in my opinion naniwa is slightly better. But saying one is much much better than the other is pure fanboy'ism
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources
Atlas247
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada318 Posts
July 18 2012 20:32 GMT
#177
Not really a fair question, you can't really objectively measure who is better so it's going to end up being a popularity contest. I voted Naniwa but the winner will be Stephano because he's more popular.
Windex Banana Lampshade
Damonkeyy
Profile Joined May 2012
United States12 Posts
July 18 2012 20:36 GMT
#178
So..... IDRA!!
All I have in this world are my Balls and My Word "AmWDamonkey"
Seph02
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands221 Posts
July 18 2012 20:42 GMT
#179
I think it's a close call.
Naniwa, along with players such as Squirtle and Symbol, he is just below the top elite koreans (Such as MVP, DRG and MC).
Let's call it a sub-top-elite xD

Although we haven't seen Stephano in Code S yet, in tournaments I never feel he is a lesser player compared to anyone else.Not saying that Stephano is the best player in the world, but I think that Stephano is in between the top elite koreans and players such as Naniwa, Squirtle and Symbol.

What's probably also in the back of people's mind is Stephano's sort of reckless and sometimes even uninterested attitude.
Naniwa, is quite a character himself, but a damn hard worker and aware of his surroundings atleast.

But in terms of skill, I think Stephano is currently the best foreigner.. Naniwa recently tweeted that he saw Stephano as the best foreigner, no idea if Naniwa was trolling/provoking Stephano though.

I think a more interresting story, is the constantly changing number 3...I mean who is number 3 ?
Huk? Sase? Ret? Thorzain? Nerchio?
Starcraft is for life
RiSkysc2
Profile Joined September 2011
696 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-18 20:50:23
July 18 2012 20:49 GMT
#180
On July 19 2012 04:11 Acquire wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 19 2012 03:54 4ZakeN87 wrote:
I think Stephano but it is kind of close. If Naniwa could show he has overall improved his PvZ I might shift towards Naniwa.

However I think the fact that the poll is called "is Naniwa or Stephano the best foreigner" saying a lot. 90% of all votes think one of these players are the best foreigner as of now. I think Nerchio, Thorzain and Sase could make an argument but still they have a bit left to compete with Naniwa and Stephano for that title.



Haha wouldn't that make Naniwa better? Opponents are given equal amount of time to prepare against each other yet stephano can't make it to the round of 8 of the most prestigious sc2 tournament.

aka what i am trying to say is Stephano is his weakest link because he doesn't practice as much making his opponent better then him.

Stephano has more "skill" as he is very good at going against random players (not preparing specifically for each opponent) and still crushing them. This is why MVP consistently does badly (for 4-time GSL winning standards) in foreign tournaments, but still crushes in GSL-type tournaments. This does not mean either one of these "types" of players is better than the other, if it came down to a showmatch, Naniwa would pretty handily defeat stephano because he has that experience in preparing for a specific opponent and map.
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