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What do you think of Naniwa vs Nestea? - Page 11

Forum Index > Polls & Liquibet
Post a Reply
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SaYyId
Profile Joined August 2010
Portugal277 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-15 19:58:03
December 15 2011 19:57 GMT
#201
You should add the "Don't really give a fuck" or "Doesn't matter to me" option to the poll. I find it hard to care about this.
No Strings. No attachments.
EriMus
Profile Joined September 2011
United States11 Posts
December 15 2011 20:05 GMT
#202
Why do people act like he is somehow required or obligated to please others with his gameplay - especially when the game was meaningless. He is a professional player, he is not held by law to act any certain way to please others. I agree that what he did was perhaps unsportsmanlike, but people blow it out of proportion when they say he must act a certain way. His team pays for him to succeed, so why would anyone say they were sorry for him throwing a game that had no effect on his tournament placement at all? It may be unfortunate that he threw away a meaningless game in a silly way, but you as a spectator don't have to like him or watch him or support him if you don't like the way he behaves.

"We don't believe that winning games and getting prizes make you a pro-gamer. We think that pro-gaming as a vocation should be about gamers competing for the victory, for the audience so they would get excited, and in all that, players job is to compete for the victory through that. We gave the seed to Quantic Gaming's protoss pro-gamer NaNiwa, not the Swedish youth Johan Lucchesi who plays the game well."

If you do not succeed at the game, what else can carry you to become a profession gamer? It's kind of sad that the tournament revolves around the "show" that helps their image. It should be about the players, not about appeasing general audiences. I understand that they try their best to make the show interesting for everyone, so that they can grow and gain prominence, but this goal should never come at the expense of a player - the players are the only thing keeping the game alive.
wOrD yO
Profile Joined December 2011
Australia119 Posts
December 15 2011 20:06 GMT
#203
as a person who pays for GSL, i was pissed off.
wOrD.339
Karius
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany6 Posts
December 15 2011 21:19 GMT
#204
This is a good example for a really bad poll design.

What is completely unacceptable?
Naniwas behaviour or Goms reaction?

How do you expect a representative poll this way? -.-
Plaguuuuuuuuuuuuuueee!!!!
iPho
Profile Joined October 2011
United States6 Posts
December 15 2011 21:36 GMT
#205
Do we really need a poll about this? This is just feeding the fire.
I like Pho
Hamzilla
Profile Joined April 2011
United States143 Posts
December 15 2011 21:54 GMT
#206
all of the drama from 25% of the community
nerd
Minored
Profile Joined April 2011
Brazil88 Posts
December 15 2011 21:55 GMT
#207
wait, is this pool about what i think of what Naniwa did or GOM decision ?
go ahead, make my day.
rezoacken
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada2719 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-15 22:02:58
December 15 2011 21:58 GMT
#208
Unacceptable and ban is deserved.

If SC2 is gonna be popular this is the kind of things that should not happen. If a losing team stop playing a football game it is unacceptable, this is the same here.

Even if the heart is not there, you just play. This is your job. Maybe the match will be bad, who cares you'll just lose fans. But this was a farce.
Either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.
vitruvia
Profile Joined June 2009
Canada235 Posts
December 15 2011 22:12 GMT
#209
meh.
naniwa probe rush-> fine with that
gomtv punish naniwa -> fine with that
everyone making a big deal, -> fine with that

just like an average harmless esport related drama.
good or bad, its not my right to decide.
what quote?
twndomn
Profile Joined September 2010
401 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-16 02:13:52
December 16 2011 02:13 GMT
#210
1. Korean League
GSL is a league formed by a Korean company, made of mostly Koreans. When in Rome, do what Roman does. If you are unable to follow Korean's value and culture, which pays attention to respect, status quo, and sportsmanship, then you should not participate in that league.

2. Principle
It is a matter of principle, it's NOT about 0-3. It's the fact that he did not even try, lack of effort. Stealing one cent might not be the same as stealing hundred dollars, but it's still stealing. GOM is punishing a player for the Principle it wants to stress, not because some irrelevant 0-3 matters.
"If MC wins this, his name would not be SK MC, it would be ST MC, ST for Saint, performing miracles." - Artosis.
Wedberg
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden169 Posts
December 16 2011 02:15 GMT
#211
Where's the "hilarious" option?
Syli
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany4 Posts
December 16 2011 02:21 GMT
#212
now iam a nani fan!
oygp
Profile Joined January 2011
United States40 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-16 05:16:07
December 16 2011 04:18 GMT
#213
@EriMus

You need to understand what "professional" means.

As a 3rd year medical student, I've seen situations in the hospital where the patient is obviously going to die. But it still matters that the doctor behaves as a professional and continues to try his best despite the futility of it all. You would expect no less. There no such thing as being a "bad-ass" doctor. That's just a bad doctor.

That's the difference between being professional and amateur. It's no different for a "professional" gamer.

Reliability and dedication are just as important as skill and ability.

If Naniwa feels comfortable showing so much disdain towards the game, fans and other players, he can and should be KICKED OUT. The paying viewers don't deserve that garbage, and neither do the fine people at GomTV and even NesTea who have all worked so freaking HARD to make that game even possible in the first place. He can do that garbage on bnet whenever he wants. Why he thought it was okay to do it on the grandest stage that Starcraft II has to offer can only be explained by pure and simple immaturity.

That being said, I did laugh when I saw the probe rush. Being punished is never fun... and I hope Naniwa is able to take this lesson seriously. Not being seeded into the GSL next season is pretty harsh... but it shouldn't make a difference in the long run.
Ownos
Profile Joined July 2010
United States2147 Posts
December 16 2011 05:32 GMT
#214
On December 16 2011 07:12 vitruvia wrote:
meh.
naniwa probe rush-> fine with that
gomtv punish naniwa -> fine with that
everyone making a big deal, -> fine with that

just like an average harmless esport related drama.
good or bad, its not my right to decide.


I see you have tried Not Giving a Fuck™
...deeper and deeper into the bowels of El Diablo
Lobo2me
Profile Joined May 2010
Norway1213 Posts
December 16 2011 08:58 GMT
#215
Since the poll question doesn't ask about anything, I answer "all of the above" to different parts of the issue, both to what Naniwa, MLG, GOMTV and the community did.
Bad manners are better than no manners at all.
Aserrin
Profile Joined October 2011
Uruguay231 Posts
December 16 2011 09:07 GMT
#216
On December 16 2011 04:57 SaYyId wrote:
You should add the "Don't really give a fuck" or "Doesn't matter to me" option to the poll. I find it hard to care about this.

If you don't care then you don't vote...
Bogeyman
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden307 Posts
December 16 2011 09:25 GMT
#217
Next poll please: What do you think of GOM's change to the GOM/MLG Exchange Program?
eg9
Profile Joined February 2011
Norway43 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-16 14:47:20
December 16 2011 14:47 GMT
#218
On December 16 2011 13:18 oygp wrote:
@EriMus

You need to understand what "professional" means.

As a 3rd year medical student, I've seen situations in the hospital where the patient is obviously going to die. But it still matters that the doctor behaves as a professional and continues to try his best despite the futility of it all. You would expect no less. There no such thing as being a "bad-ass" doctor. That's just a bad doctor.

That's the difference between being professional and amateur. It's no different for a "professional" gamer.

Reliability and dedication are just as important as skill and ability.

If Naniwa feels comfortable showing so much disdain towards the game, fans and other players, he can and should be KICKED OUT. The paying viewers don't deserve that garbage, and neither do the fine people at GomTV and even NesTea who have all worked so freaking HARD to make that game even possible in the first place. He can do that garbage on bnet whenever he wants. Why he thought it was okay to do it on the grandest stage that Starcraft II has to offer can only be explained by pure and simple immaturity.

That being said, I did laugh when I saw the probe rush. Being punished is never fun... and I hope Naniwa is able to take this lesson seriously. Not being seeded into the GSL next season is pretty harsh... but it shouldn't make a difference in the long run.


I agree in your views of what professional means but i disagree in your conclusion. NaNiwa is a professional "player", not a professional entertainer. His job is to fight to be the best and imo all the rest is irrelevant. If a game like this one is not furthering his career or in any way making him a better player i can completely understand why he had no desire to play the game seriously. The fact that he is excluded from the competetion of being the best player(which is his job to struggle for) because GOM did not get the commercial payoff that they wanted i feel like is completely unacceptable from "the worlds best tournament". GOM's job is to try to build a show around the struggle, not interfere in it imo.

With regards to him rather doing a 4gate or another sort of shortgame cheesy build i do not know if i agree with it being the better option. I want all i see to be real, if they dont care i dont want them to pretend they do. If i want some sort of fake fucking struggle i would rather watch american wrestling.

His job is to be the best and nothing else, period.
Deadlyeye
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany14 Posts
December 16 2011 17:29 GMT
#219
my 2cents: a tournament should just cancel/ask the players if a game doesent help any of them to get a better standing. no pro will give his best in a match where both players are allready eliminated. best a host can hope for is a showmatch.
on the other hand, if one is eliminated and the other may still, if he wins, move on in the tourney, i think its professional to give the best.

in this case, no one profited or lost anything regardless of the outcome, a game like this should never exist, and it shouldnt be the one on the big screen. i realy dont get why gom thinks its unprofessional or not competetive, there was no competition, non at all.
sure, we as the fans want to see a epic battle for the honor, but i get the proplayer point, that you dont want do reveal al the good stuff you prepared for the matchup.
so theres only disapointing, but completely justified (even thou a 5 mins 4 gate would have served him better).
Camdeon
Profile Joined November 2011
United States14 Posts
December 16 2011 18:29 GMT
#220
Dude, it's his job to play the game. I wouldn't hire a guy who is not smart enough to just throw in some random cheese under those circumstances. I wouldn't hire someone who decides when he wants to work. I wouldn't hire someone who doesn't have enough respect for the team to publicly represent it well. Right or wrong, I think everyone would have to agree that this was a childish thing to do. Naniwa's reputation proceeds him in this case, and that hurts him as well. Teams appears to be tired of his behavior. My guess is if this was the first incident in his career, and he apologized afterwards and explained it as a breakdown or something the organization would be more understanding. You only get so many chances before people just don't care anymore.
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