• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:40
CEST 15:40
KST 22:40
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo20Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28)12[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June4
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th Is the larve respawn broken? Yamato Cup Series What kind of tool would you be interested in? Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) GSL CK #4 20-21th June Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ STARCRAFT MOVIE - Last Night at the Command center BW General Discussion Battle cruiser feet vs Carrier fleet Fact based Zerg Upgrade Tier List
Tourneys
CSLAN 4 is Coming! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Relatively freeroll strategies Creating a full chart of Zerg builds
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Beyond All Reason ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread [H]Internet/Gaming Cafe Tips and Tricks The Games Industry And ATVI UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
ICO Development for AI, G…
Joshlittle
How To Predict Tilt in Espor…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 10349 users

Power Rank 05/09/2011 - Page 10

Forum Index > Polls & Liquibet
Post a Reply
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 25 Next All
Gescom
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada3513 Posts
May 12 2011 20:09 GMT
#181
Aaaaand JD buries Grape in a pool of his own blood.

Move along folks.
Jaedong Hyuk || Bisu Jangbi || Fantasy Flash
Kaal
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Djibouti2570 Posts
May 12 2011 20:33 GMT
#182
How was Soo not in the "Close but no Cigar" section? 5 game winstreak in proleague against some really solid players means nothing?
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
May 13 2011 01:15 GMT
#183
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?
MeteorRise
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada611 Posts
May 13 2011 01:33 GMT
#184
Jaedong 1 and Bisu 2 just warms my heart x)
Elegance, in all things.
red4ce
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States7313 Posts
May 13 2011 02:33 GMT
#185
Random question for anyone who has been around more than 5 years. Was the November 2006 PR the first bw pr done on TL? I can't find any that go further back than that one.
Mortality
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States4790 Posts
May 13 2011 04:58 GMT
#186
On May 13 2011 11:33 red4ce wrote:
Random question for anyone who has been around more than 5 years. Was the November 2006 PR the first bw pr done on TL? I can't find any that go further back than that one.


Yes.

On May 13 2011 10:15 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?


I fully agree that Bisu has something to prove. He's been "PL only" for way too long. But the reality is that Bisu was not an S-class player for most of 2010 and these arguments don't really say anything about Bisu's skill right now, when he most certainly is S-class, #1 Protoss player by ELO in every single match.

And it's certainly true that Bisu is still failing to advance now, but this past Ro32... fuck, EVERYONE knew that one of the three best players in the world was going to be sent home. As far as I know that situation has only happened once before in history (IOPS: NaDa, Oov, July in the same group -- NaDa and July faced off in the finals as a result).

Old results do provide a standard that can be used to put new results in context, but don't get carried away in thinking "Bisu can't possibly win a series because he has no ability at series play" when he's won THREE fucking SL's.



FFS why the fuck do I have to argue in favor of Bisu when 95+% of Bisu fans annoy the crap out of me?
Even though this Proleague bullshit has been completely bogus, I really, really, really do not see how Khan can lose this. I swear I will kill myself if they do. - nesix before KHAN lost to eNature
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
May 13 2011 05:22 GMT
#187
On May 13 2011 13:58 Mortality wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 11:33 red4ce wrote:
Random question for anyone who has been around more than 5 years. Was the November 2006 PR the first bw pr done on TL? I can't find any that go further back than that one.


Yes.

Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 10:15 darktreb wrote:
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?


I fully agree that Bisu has something to prove. He's been "PL only" for way too long. But the reality is that Bisu was not an S-class player for most of 2010 and these arguments don't really say anything about Bisu's skill right now, when he most certainly is S-class, #1 Protoss player by ELO in every single match.

And it's certainly true that Bisu is still failing to advance now, but this past Ro32... fuck, EVERYONE knew that one of the three best players in the world was going to be sent home. As far as I know that situation has only happened once before in history (IOPS: NaDa, Oov, July in the same group -- NaDa and July faced off in the finals as a result).

Old results do provide a standard that can be used to put new results in context, but don't get carried away in thinking "Bisu can't possibly win a series because he has no ability at series play" when he's won THREE fucking SL's.



FFS why the fuck do I have to argue in favor of Bisu when 95+% of Bisu fans annoy the crap out of me?


I'm not saying he can't possibly win a series. But to go two years without winning one is truly amazing. The list of players who've won a series in the past two years is incredibly long. And yes, he's obviously the best Protoss player right now, and got a little unlucky with the group of death. But at a certain point when you have been unable to scrap together a win for two years, that's just simply indefensible, and until he manages to change there's not much to say. None of this "PL comes first" BS ... two years.

And of course everyone remembers he's won three titles - he's the greatest Protoss player of all time (and I say this as a huge anti-Bisu person), and I don't think there's even a close second place. But at a certain point, the statute of limitations on his titles has to be coming up, doesn't it? He hasn't won a title since 2008, nearly three years. His last title was only four months after July's last (and admittedly flukiest of all time) title. It was a different era ... Bisu needs to step up and go deep in a league for the sake of BW as a spectator sport. As someone who loves to hate Bisu, it actually frustrates me that he can't go deep in a league. It's no fun rooting against someone who can't even make ro8.
vishrut
Profile Joined April 2009
United States567 Posts
May 13 2011 06:34 GMT
#188
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-13 08:17:45
May 13 2011 08:16 GMT
#189
Bisu not winning series makes his fans root for him all the more, because all evidence in the past 2 years suggests he easily has the skill to win one, but he keeps failing all the time in varying ways. We're waiting for the moment the dam bursts and Bisu storms his way to another gold.

2011 looks to be as good a year as any for him to do just that. Maybe in the revamped OSL. Maybe in the next MSL. We all hope, because as much as Stork has been the most consistent Protoss of the past few years, it's hard to hope for him winning in the finals against the current crop of S-Class (Flash, Jaedong, Fantasy, maybe Hydra and soon to be Effort).
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
pathy
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Taiwan619 Posts
May 13 2011 21:53 GMT
#190
sighhh stork :s
Graphicscolosi suck
Nick_54
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States2230 Posts
May 13 2011 22:14 GMT
#191
On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


Yeah, I am wondering about this as well.

I am also really glad to see Movie back on the power rank. As for Bisu, his lack of individual league success will just make his next big run all the better.
infinity2k9
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom2397 Posts
May 13 2011 22:25 GMT
#192
I can't believe that Bisu hasn't won a series for so long and the last was 4 months close to July's last title. Pretty damning stuff.

On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


The OSL has already started after it's rebranding as MyStarleague, there's qualifiers already taking place around Korea afaik. Why there's barely any information about it on here i don't know.
Tempest[OEC]
Profile Joined February 2010
United States417 Posts
May 13 2011 22:58 GMT
#193
On May 14 2011 07:25 infinity2k9 wrote:
I can't believe that Bisu hasn't won a series for so long and the last was 4 months close to July's last title. Pretty damning stuff.

Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


The OSL has already started after it's rebranding as MyStarleague, there's qualifiers already taking place around Korea afaik. Why there's barely any information about it on here i don't know.

Well he did beat Mind and hyvaa in Bo3s during Ro36 for Korean Air OSL S2. And he beat Baby at WCG 2010 if we're gonna count that. Not the most impressive list of series opponents but its something? Lol.
Tenhou
Profile Joined April 2011
1052 Posts
May 14 2011 00:30 GMT
#194
On May 14 2011 07:58 Tempest[OEC] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 07:25 infinity2k9 wrote:
I can't believe that Bisu hasn't won a series for so long and the last was 4 months close to July's last title. Pretty damning stuff.

On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


The OSL has already started after it's rebranding as MyStarleague, there's qualifiers already taking place around Korea afaik. Why there's barely any information about it on here i don't know.

Well he did beat Mind and hyvaa in Bo3s during Ro36 for Korean Air OSL S2. And he beat Baby at WCG 2010 if we're gonna count that. Not the most impressive list of series opponents but its something? Lol.


Maybe he was probably talking about Individual Leagues after the group ceremonies? The OSL ceremony is when 16 players are left.
Tempest[OEC]
Profile Joined February 2010
United States417 Posts
May 14 2011 01:49 GMT
#195
On May 14 2011 09:30 Tenhou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 07:58 Tempest[OEC] wrote:
On May 14 2011 07:25 infinity2k9 wrote:
I can't believe that Bisu hasn't won a series for so long and the last was 4 months close to July's last title. Pretty damning stuff.

On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


The OSL has already started after it's rebranding as MyStarleague, there's qualifiers already taking place around Korea afaik. Why there's barely any information about it on here i don't know.

Well he did beat Mind and hyvaa in Bo3s during Ro36 for Korean Air OSL S2. And he beat Baby at WCG 2010 if we're gonna count that. Not the most impressive list of series opponents but its something? Lol.


Maybe he was probably talking about Individual Leagues after the group ceremonies? The OSL ceremony is when 16 players are left.

If that is the case then yes I will concede that point. Haha.
Mortality
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States4790 Posts
May 14 2011 03:18 GMT
#196
On May 13 2011 14:22 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 13:58 Mortality wrote:
On May 13 2011 11:33 red4ce wrote:
Random question for anyone who has been around more than 5 years. Was the November 2006 PR the first bw pr done on TL? I can't find any that go further back than that one.


Yes.

On May 13 2011 10:15 darktreb wrote:
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?


I fully agree that Bisu has something to prove. He's been "PL only" for way too long. But the reality is that Bisu was not an S-class player for most of 2010 and these arguments don't really say anything about Bisu's skill right now, when he most certainly is S-class, #1 Protoss player by ELO in every single match.

And it's certainly true that Bisu is still failing to advance now, but this past Ro32... fuck, EVERYONE knew that one of the three best players in the world was going to be sent home. As far as I know that situation has only happened once before in history (IOPS: NaDa, Oov, July in the same group -- NaDa and July faced off in the finals as a result).

Old results do provide a standard that can be used to put new results in context, but don't get carried away in thinking "Bisu can't possibly win a series because he has no ability at series play" when he's won THREE fucking SL's.



FFS why the fuck do I have to argue in favor of Bisu when 95+% of Bisu fans annoy the crap out of me?


I'm not saying he can't possibly win a series. But to go two years without winning one is truly amazing. The list of players who've won a series in the past two years is incredibly long. And yes, he's obviously the best Protoss player right now, and got a little unlucky with the group of death. But at a certain point when you have been unable to scrap together a win for two years, that's just simply indefensible, and until he manages to change there's not much to say. None of this "PL comes first" BS ... two years.

And of course everyone remembers he's won three titles - he's the greatest Protoss player of all time (and I say this as a huge anti-Bisu person), and I don't think there's even a close second place. But at a certain point, the statute of limitations on his titles has to be coming up, doesn't it? He hasn't won a title since 2008, nearly three years. His last title was only four months after July's last (and admittedly flukiest of all time) title. It was a different era ... Bisu needs to step up and go deep in a league for the sake of BW as a spectator sport. As someone who loves to hate Bisu, it actually frustrates me that he can't go deep in a league. It's no fun rooting against someone who can't even make ro8.


You've read my posts. You know I don't buy into that crap about PL uber alas. It's just crap. But I'm not going to ignore what he's doing in it either. The reality is that Bisu's play in April was fantastic -- unquestionably better than it's been during that entire 2 year time. And quite frankly it caught me by surprise too, because I wasn't expecting it.

P.S. July's title wasn't so much a fluke as metagame circumstances conspiring in his favor. It was Protoss season and July happened to be the best ZvP player in the world at that time. And I might be tempted to argue Nal_Ra and maybe even Giyom (not many people remember because a number of Giyom's wins predate the existence of KeSPA, but Giyom won 75000 in prize money in a 6 month period, basically the same amount as winning 4-5 SL's in 6 months) on Bisu's level.
Even though this Proleague bullshit has been completely bogus, I really, really, really do not see how Khan can lose this. I swear I will kill myself if they do. - nesix before KHAN lost to eNature
Taekwon
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8155 Posts
May 14 2011 03:50 GMT
#197
On May 13 2011 10:15 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?


God.dammit lol.
▲ ▲ ▲
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-14 08:44:09
May 14 2011 04:04 GMT
#198
On May 14 2011 12:18 Mortality wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 14:22 darktreb wrote:
On May 13 2011 13:58 Mortality wrote:
On May 13 2011 11:33 red4ce wrote:
Random question for anyone who has been around more than 5 years. Was the November 2006 PR the first bw pr done on TL? I can't find any that go further back than that one.


Yes.

On May 13 2011 10:15 darktreb wrote:
On May 11 2011 22:26 aupstar wrote:
On May 11 2011 17:07 chisuri wrote:
On May 11 2011 03:19 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 11 2011 01:06 Mortality wrote:
I ask myself, had it been any other group -- or even any other permutation of the same group -- would Bisu have dropped out of MSL? And the answer I come back with is no.


Why? Failing out of individual leagues against opponents over whom he is the favorite has been Bisu's modus operandi for a while now.

What's unusual about this season is that Bisu was knocked out by a good player.

You forgot last MSL, Bisu was knocked out by Stork. And in OSL he was knocked out by Shine, who was in a hot streak at that time. Hard to believe if you look at his results now, I know. But it's true.


Lets look at individual titles in the previous seasons and see who Bisu was kicked out by:

Korean air S2 OSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by effort and leta

WCG2010
Knocked out by Kal 2:0

Bigfile MSL 2010
Knocked out Sea 2:0

Hana Daetoo MSL 2010 (Ro32)
Knocked out by shuttle and movie

Korean Air S1 OSL 2010
Knocked out by go.go 2:1

Nate MSL 2009
Knocked out by Bogus and Guemchi

Ever OSL 2009
Knocked out by Shine 2:1

Which brings us finally to his last series win

WCG2009 Finals
Not Knocked out by Stork 2:0 (This was also the last Bo3 that he won)

Avalon MSL2009
Knocked out by Iris 3:2

And his last Bo5 win

GomTV Classic Season 2 2009 (09-02-08 to be exact)
Not Knocked out by Jangbi 3:1


In conclusion, Mindcrime's hilarious statement holds true.

gg


Seriously, how do Bisu fans even talk? He hasn't won a BO3 or BO5 since 2009. 2009! It's been nearly TWO years since he's won even a single series!!!!!! No OSL ro4's. No MSL ro8's. TWO years, the streak continues until OSL starts, and let's be honest, who really thinks he's going to win a series there?


I fully agree that Bisu has something to prove. He's been "PL only" for way too long. But the reality is that Bisu was not an S-class player for most of 2010 and these arguments don't really say anything about Bisu's skill right now, when he most certainly is S-class, #1 Protoss player by ELO in every single match.

And it's certainly true that Bisu is still failing to advance now, but this past Ro32... fuck, EVERYONE knew that one of the three best players in the world was going to be sent home. As far as I know that situation has only happened once before in history (IOPS: NaDa, Oov, July in the same group -- NaDa and July faced off in the finals as a result).

Old results do provide a standard that can be used to put new results in context, but don't get carried away in thinking "Bisu can't possibly win a series because he has no ability at series play" when he's won THREE fucking SL's.



FFS why the fuck do I have to argue in favor of Bisu when 95+% of Bisu fans annoy the crap out of me?


I'm not saying he can't possibly win a series. But to go two years without winning one is truly amazing. The list of players who've won a series in the past two years is incredibly long. And yes, he's obviously the best Protoss player right now, and got a little unlucky with the group of death. But at a certain point when you have been unable to scrap together a win for two years, that's just simply indefensible, and until he manages to change there's not much to say. None of this "PL comes first" BS ... two years.

And of course everyone remembers he's won three titles - he's the greatest Protoss player of all time (and I say this as a huge anti-Bisu person), and I don't think there's even a close second place. But at a certain point, the statute of limitations on his titles has to be coming up, doesn't it? He hasn't won a title since 2008, nearly three years. His last title was only four months after July's last (and admittedly flukiest of all time) title. It was a different era ... Bisu needs to step up and go deep in a league for the sake of BW as a spectator sport. As someone who loves to hate Bisu, it actually frustrates me that he can't go deep in a league. It's no fun rooting against someone who can't even make ro8.


You've read my posts. You know I don't buy into that crap about PL uber alas. It's just crap. But I'm not going to ignore what he's doing in it either. The reality is that Bisu's play in April was fantastic -- unquestionably better than it's been during that entire 2 year time. And quite frankly it caught me by surprise too, because I wasn't expecting it.

P.S. July's title wasn't so much a fluke as metagame circumstances conspiring in his favor. It was Protoss season and July happened to be the best ZvP player in the world at that time. And I might be tempted to argue Nal_Ra and maybe even Giyom (not many people remember because a number of Giyom's wins predate the existence of KeSPA, but Giyom won 75000 in prize money in a 6 month period, basically the same amount as winning 4-5 SL's in 6 months) on Bisu's level.


July's title was a fluke because he played rock, backho, and best. Anyone's title would've been a fluke with that lineup.

And while I know people want to make a big deal out of best and such but he's never proved since that he was really a good enough player to be true contender for titles, he just happened to be hot in one tournament and made it there (like Yarnc, Movie, Great, etc. pretty good players who happened upon a final that they probably aren't the correct calibre for).
Remember Violet.
hacklebeast
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5090 Posts
May 14 2011 04:30 GMT
#199
Best was a little different. Of the four you mentioned, best had the 2nd highest elo peak, just short of calm by 4 points (and he is far ahead if you ignore vZ). There was a time when his vT looked just about invincible, and a different time when his vP looked just about invincible. The other three can't say they dominated a MU (or 2) as thoroughly.
Protoss: Best, Paralyze, Jangbi, Nal_Ra || Terran: Oov, Boxer, Fantasy, Hiya|| Zerg: Yellow, Zero
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-14 06:40:06
May 14 2011 05:38 GMT
#200
On May 14 2011 07:25 infinity2k9 wrote:
I can't believe that Bisu hasn't won a series for so long and the last was 4 months close to July's last title. Pretty damning stuff.

Show nested quote +
On May 13 2011 15:34 vishrut wrote:
does anybody actually know when the osl is going to start? Are they trying to desynchronize the msl and osl so that there is always one league going on? That would be good for the players


The OSL has already started after it's rebranding as MyStarleague, there's qualifiers already taking place around Korea afaik. Why there's barely any information about it on here i don't know.


He hasn't won a title since 4 months after July's, not series, minor point but it'd be RIDICULOUS (even moreso I guess) if he hadn't even won a series since then.

Who'd have thought that it would all start going downhill after his epic loss to Iris?

Edit: In other news, phenomenal play by Bisu against Jaedong. Simply beautiful to watch.
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 25 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Weekly
11:00
WardiTV Mondays #92
WardiTV1063
IntoTheiNu 1020
Rex163
Ryung 111
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Rex 160
Ryung 111
BRAT_OK 49
RushiSC 3
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 7425
Shuttle 1927
Horang2 1831
EffOrt 880
Hyuk 837
Soulkey 526
Soma 442
firebathero 376
Light 302
actioN 270
[ Show more ]
Snow 269
Mong 218
Leta 144
hero 130
NaDa 124
Zeus 119
Sharp 105
Rush 101
Hyun 91
Killer 81
Free 75
[sc1f]eonzerg 54
Sea.KH 50
ToSsGirL 38
scan(afreeca) 32
soO 16
Movie 15
JulyZerg 14
Hm[arnc] 13
zelot 13
Sacsri 12
Noble 8
Terrorterran 7
Icarus 5
Dota 2
Gorgc6000
qojqva1228
Dendi982
BananaSlamJamma80
Counter-Strike
x6flipin637
Sick188
kRYSTAL_90
Other Games
B2W.Neo915
hiko845
Lowko469
crisheroes300
byalli58
MindelVK13
BEARDiaguz9
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream13322
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream4212
Other Games
gamesdonequick798
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2394
• Nemesis1836
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
2h 20m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
20h 20m
The PondCast
1d 20h
Douyu Cup 2020
2 days
Oliveira vs Trap
Jieshi vs XY
soO vs FanTaSy
TY vs Coffee
Douyu Cup 2020
3 days
Neeb vs Impact
MacSed vs Cyan
Scarlett vs Kelazhur
INnoVation vs Dear
Douyu Cup 2020
4 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
herO vs Classic
Maru vs Serral
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
5 days
Douyu Cup 2020
5 days
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
6 days
[ Show More ]
Online Event
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4
WardiTV Spring 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 1
SCTL 2026 Spring
Maestros of the Game 2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026

Upcoming

CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
BCC 2026
Light HT
Heroes Pulsing #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.