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[MSL] Dragons > Knights

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[MSL] Dragons > Knights

Text byJWD
March 12th, 2009 03:29 GMT
[image loading]

Whoa! Another week is behind us, and that means more MSL news from TL. Yes, while we forum denizens have busied ourselves with flaming Raithed and making animations, Lost Saga MSL play has continued as usual.

This week's update recaps Quarterfinals C (NaDa vs. JangBi) and D (fOrGG vs. Stork) and previews upcoming Semifinals A (ZerO vs. Luxury) and B (JangBi vs. Stork). My guest strategy writers this time around are Kwark and puppy-loving Protoss hater Artosis!

Since Kwark's set analyses are extremely detailed, I decided to change up my format by creating highlight videos rather than writing battle reports with pictures. Let me know what you think!





Quarterfinal C Report

(T)NaDa vs. (P)JangBi


A word from the match preview:

On March 04 2009 11:54 JWD wrote:
NaDa is by far the Lost Saga MSL's weakest remaining link, and simply no match for a modern PvT monster like JangBi. I pick JangBi to advance 3-0, in a drubbing as painful to watch as NaDa's exit from the ClubDay MSL (0-3 to free).


                                        + Show Spoiler [Recommended Game] +
4set: NaDa vs. JangBi on Destination



I enjoyed every game in this series, but none as much as the fourth set. Facing elimination, NaDa shows us exactly the sort of gutsy play that has allowed him to stay relevant in today's BW scene. This game is short and sweet - if you want longer macro slugfests, try sets 1 or 5.


Semifinal C Highlights



                                + Show Spoiler [Match Analysis from Kwark] +
So, JangBi against NaDa. Should be an obvious favourite here. JangBi is a monster right now and his PvT is his best matchup. I know I was critical of him last week when I described his victory over his teammate FrOzean as plain... and it was... extremely so.... but JangBi is still JangBi. When it's PvT he's a favourite over any Terran and NaDa isn't top level anymore.




1set on Byzantium 2

I like 2 gate goon openings on Byzantium. While the rush distances are long so a quick victory isn't likely they give the Protoss dominance over the Terran, stopping him from playing a FE into macro game like they'd like and instead making them work for the ramp. High nats favour P imo. We've seen this before and we've seen NaDa transition very easily into highly effective drop play. But JangBi has proven himself uniquely competent at dealing with that kind of play. It's not the special tricks that mark JangBi out, rather it's his flawless solidity at the basics that make him unique as a player. His pylons will be spread around his main scouting drops early. He won't take a stupid risk or misread his opponent. Fancy vulture play will not catch him off guard. And that's why this opening is good here, not because it's imbalanced or Protoss favoured but simply because it plays perfectly into JangBi's hands. It limits the options of the Terran and forces them to play in a way which will lead to JangBi winning.

His micro in the first fight could have been better. You could see what he was trying to do and if NaDa had been moving or in any way flanked then it would have been effective. But NaDa knew what he was doing and his defensive micro against tank sniping attempts was perfect. JangBi expected NaDa to follow with a quick expansion covered by mines, as indeed he did, and therefore went semi-allin with a robo/reaver himself. I say semi-allin because it didn't have to kill NaDa, just do a lot of damage or kill the expansion. Letting T finish their exp before P even starts theirs is risky but JangBi knew what NaDa had and hoped he could kill it rather than play out the macro war. He denied NaDa's scouting with a cute goon wall near his nat so NaDa didn't know he was doing this and then started his own expansion so that, as long as some damage was done, he wouldn't be too behind.

NaDa's defence was impeccable. Not a single weak point in his defence. Reavers were unable to land close enough to get a shot at the tanks, nor enter NaDa's main to try and spread out his defence and get a shot at scvs. NaDa would have been severely behind if JangBi had double expanded in that time (although he had a vulture at 3 which didn't see any kind of expansion attempt so he could be reasonably sure JangBi wasn't) but JangBi didn't. NaDa's read was spot on and his defence was faultless. It reached that point that JangBi knew he had to attack because he knew he was allin but after checking out NaDa's defence decided it wasn't worth it and that it was better to accept the minute chance that he could pull back the mid game through some epic mistake by NaDa than go through with his original plan.

JangBi double expands because although he can't hold them he also can't hold up NaDa's army without the money they provide. Then, desperate to validate my high opinion of him, he shuts down a vulture drop in his main with the loss of just 2 probes and another vult raid at 3 with his ever reliable walls. I'd like to clarify here that I haven't seen these games, I'm writing this as I watch, JangBi really is that predictable.

NaDa uses his defensive unit advantage to expand all over his corner, defended by a big mass of tanks, high ground and turrets. I'm not sure whether I like this or not. If there's anybody I'd trust to dismantle a tornado then it's JangBi and they are cross positions so pushing is hard. Equally if there's anyone I'd trust to abuse arbiters to the absolute limit and recover a big deficit late game it's JangBi. So I don't know exactly how NaDa should be exploiting his opponent here, maybe just sitting back, expanding and double grading is the best option.

JangBi casually ups it to 11 gates, 2 stargates and a fuckload of scary Protoss units in classic JangBi late game style. The arbiters are late because he's opted for storm, speedlots and all sorts of other midgame dominance units but I don't know if I can fault that or not. His dilemma is that if he had rushed to arbs then he couldn't have held the expansions he needs to win against a midgame push. However he needs the arbs to deal with NaDa's 200/200 3-3 lategame. I guess this kind of catch 22 is the cost of a big early game disadvantage, I can't argue that he's made a mistake since then, I can point out NaDa didn't attack so he should have expanded and rushed arbs but we don't know if NaDa would have done the same in that situation.

JangBi's counterattack at 6 was the only move he could do. He correctly judged that he didn't have the stasis to take NaDa on head on but he had to slow the push. It cost him a lot of units but he had the gates to replace those. It didn't buy him enough time though, his stasis were less than perfect and he repeatedly fell victim to EMP. NaDa knocked out his two expansions near 12 and took the game.

GG

Perhaps JangBi would have been better off taking no risks in an early game build which simply had to work. NaDa is certainly an experienced player with finely attuned game senses and despite JangBi denying him scouting he hard countered the fuck out of that goon/reaver/ob rush. He took a risk and it turned out NaDa is just that good. Not sure though. It's impossible to play while taking no risks. Draw your own conclusions about whether he should have gone for the execution of NaDa's FE (which is also safe against 2 facts) or double expanded himself with a late robo.




2set on Carthage

Game 2 JangBi opened with an unusual (for him) rush. One well hidden proxy gate with a gas steal and probes pumping as normal (after the initial delay). While NaDa reacted with a bunker the zealots killed several marines and scvs and delayed the gas and factory, as well as messing with mining a bit. NaDa was perhaps too cautious, but given the number of Terrans losing to proxy 99 and the lack of scouting information he had no way of knowing that JangBi's opening was just offensive, rather than actually allin. His scv scouted nothing in JangBi's main so he had no way of knowing whether it was one gate or two and, if I'm judging the minimap correctly, JangBi actually sent 2 probes after it to kill it which NaDa didn't notice while microing marines. In the mean time JangBi was expanding and following up with a quick core and second gate. Amusingly enough NaDa actually prisoned his factory leaving his first tank very vulnerable but JangBi didn't notice.

JangBi's 2 gate faced off against NaDa's 2 fact, 4 dragoons and 3 zealots against 3 tanks, 3 vultures and 6 marines. But NaDa hadn't even started his expansion whereas JangBi's economy was surging ahead off 2 bases. In trying to stay safe against a fake allin from JangBi NaDa had in fact forced himself allin with no expansion, nor any hope of recovering the game if he waited to take one. He was forced to attempt a tornado into a wide concave position without any entrenched support (turrets, mines, other sieged tanks). The result was extremely predictable and very painful for any terrans watching it. JangBi got obs out and flattened it with barely a loss.

GG

This was a very smooth game by JangBi. His build looked very scary, especially given the number of proxy 99s we've seen so far in the MSL, and NaDa wasn't a bad player to overreact to it. But he overcompensated to the extent that he was allin in a position where he simply couldn't execute an effective allin build. I liked it, he just took control and dominated the game from start to finish. Oddly enough the pivotal moment in this game was given no attention by the observer. If you watch NaDa's scout scv on the minimap it leaves JangBi's base, scouts for proxies and then returns whereupon 2 white dots approach it. Then JangBi's expansion probe is clicked and has 1 kill. NaDa didn't know JangBi was expanding and macroing up because he let his scv die (while saving himself from zealots). That decided the game.




3set on Neo Harmony

So, game 3 on Neo Harmony. JangBi at 7, NaDa at 11. We've seen JangBi take firm control of the game flow early on in the first 2 games and I must admit I like it. This is rather more assertive than his normal play style and if he keeps it up I might actually become a fan (instead of just sullenly admitting he isn't bad). JangBi scouted on 8 and scouted correctly which made life much harder for NaDa who had to deal with a very annoying harassing probe. A second probe scouted the middle for proxies (as well as being seen by NaDa's scv) and then went to 12 to hide. JangBi made a fast zealot, I assume hoping to wall the ramp before the scv arrived to notice minerals were missing but it was too late and promptly went to chase the scv.

The inevitable proxy robo at 12 was placed down and I have to admit I like this new JangBi with his aggressive dominant game style. That said I'd question how appropriate it is when NaDa scouted your second probe heading out early (I'm not sure whether NaDa actually noticed but you can't rely on that crap) and noticed that your main is missing a 2nd gate, any tech and an expansion. NaDa knew what JangBi wasn't doing and should really have known there was a proxy going down at 12.

NaDa's fast expanded, defended by tanks and mines off 1 factory. What happened next was simply rape. I don't know wtf NaDa was thinking. Any half decent player knows to turn the tank away as the reaver fires to take half damage and not to clump their units against reavers. Instead the first scarab shot killed 2 marines and left a tank dead as a dragoon finished it off seconds later. The second one almost finished a second tank while the dragoon killed a vult, forcing NaDa to back his army off and just let JangBi have a party in his main. Eventually NaDa got some units together and took back his main min line only to have a group of dragoons trash up his natural. With the first reaver still alive the addition of a second made NaDa's position untenable and he surrendered the game to a proxy reaver rush that he really had to know was coming.

GG

NaDa was inexcusable this game. Scouting the second probe heading to 12 should have tipped him off. Scouting the lack of tech or a 2nd gate or an expansion limited JangBi's range to proxy dark rush with tech hide or proxy robo. While he did eventually send a vulture to 12 it was intercepted by a dragoon also going there and backed off. Why was a dragoon going to 12 NaDa?!?! Why would JangBi do that?!?! What could there be at 12 that would require the use of just one dragoon?!?! Jesus. A C rank terran should be ashamed at not covering half his main with mines.




4set on Destination

So, that's three games in three that JangBi has taken by the balls and forced his game plan upon. Admittedly one of them NaDa saw through him and shut him down completely (and not the one where NaDa actually saw what he was doing three different times) but whatever, I'm liking it. JangBi spawned at 11 and NaDa at 5. JangBi scouted on 8 and NaDa sent out a scv on 8 to commit petty animal cruelty at 3. Using another scv to hold the wall at his ramp and prevent JangBi's scout probe getting in he successfully kept his proxy factory at 3 hidden. JangBi opted for a soft contain while expanding and then realised that somehow NaDa hadn't got any mech nits anywhere near his ramp and broke in for some ownage. He successfully took NaDa's ramp but then realised something was up and that it wasn't worth trying to break in. NaDa had gone 2 fact at 3 and his fast expansion off 1 gate was incredibly vulnerable. Credit where it's due, JangBi brought his army back immediately, before NaDa's rush even hit. He microed well against the mines and sniped the tanks quickly. However 2 fact double graded vults against 1 gate goons without obs is just not going to happen. Ever. NaDa sacrificed his tanks for the ramp and once he was in there was no way JangBi was going to be able to micro well enough to stop his gates from being mined up. His unit production was shut down by mines and then vults smashed his min line.

GG

That said, JangBi could have stayed in this (and possibly come out ahead) with a single simple trick. One that to be honest it is inexcusable that he didn't use. Sure it would have required some incredibly sexy on the spot thinking but he's a top level progamer, I expect that. He sold his nexus for 300 minerals, that's enough to wall the ramp with pylons. Doing so stops the vults from getting to the gates and allows the 2 dragoons he already has out to stop the pylons being attacked. It's the mines that make speedvults dangerous against goons, a wall makes them impotent. There are no two ways about it, JangBi knew what he was up against, he had the money, he had the probes nearby, he had the time. What he lacked was the inspiration. I really would have loved it if he had. I'd have loved the look on NaDa's face. The "Oh.... I didn't think of that.... That was actually quite good.... I might be fucked here." But it wasn't to be.




5set on Byzantium 2

So, JangBi, we're down to game 5. Game 4, the one game you don't do an aggressive dominant game, NaDa does and he takes it from you. And now we're back where we started, a game on Byzantium, this time for the series.

JangBi spawns at 7 and NaDa at 11. Close positions with NaDa's main exposed to JangBi, perfect for JangBi to go into drop play and very poor for NaDa. JangBi scouts correctly again while NaDa scouts the wrong way, as in game 3. He opens zealot first and then attacks with zeeprobe off 1 gate while getting a goon and a second gate. We've seen this build before from JangBi earlier in the tournament and it absolutely raped, excellent micro humiliating Iris. However it seems that NaDa has been keeping up with the MSL and refused to fight, backing off his marines and waiting until he had a stronger count to fight. NaDa pushed out to take his nat with 5 marines and a tank and JangBi moved in with 3 dragoons and a zealot. The inevitable tank snipe attempt happened, and it almost worked, bringing the tank within 2 hits of death. However it backed off to safety and faced with the risk of losing goons as in game 1 JangBi was forced to back off. A vulture with mines arrived to secure the area and NaDa took his expansion. JangBi, unwilling to let his rush fail, outmicroed a mine and started sniping the barracks, more out of spite than of any real attempt to break through. In the mean time he expanded, unwilling to repeat the risks of the first game and confident he could take it from NaDa in a macrowar.

NaDa looked physically shocked when his barracks died but started a new one slightly further back to maintain the wall. However the wall was broken and JangBi was out for blood, sacrificing a dragoon to clear a mine and moving in to harass NaDa. This was not an attempt to win, there was no way he could outmicro all the mines and he knew it. This was psychological warfare, pointless attacks to throw NaDa off his comfortable footing while keeping him blind. A scv, a vulture, 2 more mines and the building barracks all died before siege forced JangBi back. He hadn't lost a goon, but the one he had suicided. NaDa was still on one factory and more importantly, JangBi knew he was. That kind of scouting information doesn't normally come until obs are out but killing their barracks twice does the trick. JangBi swiftly took his third off just 1 gateway while grabbing a reaver and staying safe with a wall against any kind of proxy play a la game 4.

As in game 1, NaDa made a dozen turrets all round his perimeter and left enough sieged tanks about to make any reaver play impossible. However unlike in game 1, JangBi was already on 3 base with 3 gas and was doing his JangBi thing. And he's good at that. His reaver harass was more threat based than intending to do any damage and JangBi took no risks with the reaver itself, the loss of a single zealot was negligible.

I think NaDa realised he was behind because whereas in game 1 he camped mass tanks on a single corner, taking 4 base before becoming aggressive, in game 5 he went to 6 fact very early with mass tank and goliath forcing a path to his 3rd. The depth of his tank formation was physically scary as a protoss player but JangBi was taking over the map while buying time. Not interested in killing NaDa's expansion he just took another two of his own while flying a pair of speedshuttles in to set shit of fire in NaDa's main. This wasn't an attack, it was just arson. It was sabotage. Even though it didn't kill any scvs (scarab bugged on them as they slid out) it killed a few tanks, stopped mining for a long time and generally fucked shit up. This is actually described in Legs guide, just annoying the Terran with drop play and threat while you do your taking over the map thing. Words cannot describe how bad JangBi's scarabs are. A total of 7 scarabs, fired directly at scvs from point blank range killed 2 scvs. A bad thing can only continue for so long though and eventually his luck turned and he killed a dozen or so. Realising he'd maxed out and still had a ridiculous amount of money he decided to keep up the theme and went in for some terrorism. With some speedlots drawing fire a group of stormers threw storms all over NaDa's army as it sat in his 3rd base. JangBi wasn't willing to attack NaDa's tanks head on but he was more than content to set fire to shit and storm all over stuff. In the mean time he did what all protoss players do when the terran has too many tanks for you to be legitimately expected to attack it. He went carriers. I don't think there's any carrier imba thing going on here. JangBi was legitimately a mile ahead. It's just terrans can be a bitch to clean up when they don't want to lose and NaDa was camping in the hope that eventually JangBi would get bored and suicide his army, allowing NaDa to win.

Eventually NaDa decided things were looking as good as they ever would and moved out. JangBi did his JangBi thing and poured storms all over NaDa's goliaths while his carriers sniped the tanks that had been massing all game. A counter attack of JangBi's main army hit 9 but was cleaned up and NaDa went for the expansions at 6 and 5 that JangBi needed. However with Byzantium being covered with cliffs the group of carriers harrying NaDa's main army took its toll. Yet another ground attack killed the now undefended 9 and left JangBi with 2 bases to NaDa's one, map control and a much larger army. Realising he couldn't hold his only expansions and that it simply wouldn't matter even if he could NaDa gged out.

GG

This game was more like it. JangBi didn't use an unorthadox build but was still as dominant as I'd like. His entire early and midgame, from the goon suicide to sniping into dual speedshuttle arsonist toss into suicide storm attacks on NaDa's army were built around maintaining aggression and threat while not actually committing his main army. NaDa was on the back foot all game and couldn't stop JangBi from taking the map and the win.


Match Notes

NaDa made his Lost Saga MSL goal crystal clear in his post-Ro16 interview: win it all, not merely a seed into the next MSL. Genius Terran's performance in this series revealed just how serious he was about achieving that goal. NaDa confounded his doubters (myself included) by blowing JangBi out of the water with a carefully prepared and perfectly executed gameplan in the 1set. Even longtime NaDa fans were impressed with the new level of TvP he displayed in game 1 - the only person who didn't seem phased was JangBi.

JB calmly but deftly adjusted his play to emerge victorious when the match returned to Byzantium 2 in its deciding set. This display of flexibility and adaptation earned JangBi a semifinal berth and proved why he is the favorite in this Starleague. JB is fast developing from a precise, technical practice house monster (playing in Stork's shadow) to a master of the five-set match who is a deep threat in any Starleague and a BW celebrity in his own right. The Lost Saga MSL is JangBi's to lose, now more than ever.

As for NaDa, his body language upon conceding the fifth set pretty much says it all:

[image loading]

For many professional gamers, a quarterfinal run capped by a gritty, impressive five-game series with the tourney favorite would be a satisfying accomplishment. For NaDa, it's cause to bury his head in his hands - and that's why this man is the most successful StarCraft player of all time. We haven't heard the last from Lee Yoon Yeol.

[image loading] Artosis on NaDa

NaDa's grade: A+

NaDa played brilliantly. Game 1 was a thing of pure beauty. In fact, it was the closest thing to a perfect game that has been played since sAviOr was bonjwa or iloveoov before him. No one has played a game of that level in years. At every turn, NaDa made exactly the right decision. Watching it, I thought back to NaDa's statement about being desperate to win the MSL, and realized that it was totally within his grasp. Sadly, JangBi came back with cheesy play to take NaDa down 3-2. On the bright side, NaDa has shown us that he absolutely has what it takes, and resecures his position as the greatest player who ever lived. Sure, Flash is bringing Terran to a new level, but NaDa can play a slightly older style perfectly when he wants. Beautiful strategic play, beautiful mechanics. If NaDa keeps this level of play up, he will be winning a StarLeague in the next season.

[image loading] Kwark on JangBi

JangBi's grade: B

For the series as a whole I'm giving JangBi a B. To qualify that, a B means he is meeting his own very high standard, but not exceeding it. JangBi was the clear favourite coming into this and he struggled, but that was more due to NaDa upping his game than out of any incompetence on JangBi's part. There were moments, like the fact that NaDa refused to play intelligently in game 3, or the failure to pylon wall in game 4, where JangBi didn't show anything masterful. And I'm still unconvinced by his risk taking in game 1, when he could have just played it out as in game 5. JangBi didn't wow me today and he could very easily have lost this series. I don't see him winning this MSL, and if he does I see it being a very underwhelming MSL. But his play was as solid as ever and he's turned the aggression up a notch. JangBi has to play very well to even earn a B because he's set the bar so high that anything below perfection is him on a bad day. He played well.




Semifinal D Report

(T)fOrGG vs. (P)Stork


A word from the match preview:

On February 24 2009 16:07 JWD wrote:
fOrGG barely bested free in a pathetically cheesy series of games, but he is nevertheless my darkhorse pick to take the Lost Saga MSL title…I think fOrGG's unlikely run will begin in earnest with a dominant victory over Stork: aided by a very Terran-friendly map pool, fOrGG will take this series 3-1.


                                        + Show Spoiler [Recommended Game] +
1set: fOrGG vs. Stork on Byzantium 2



Quarterfinal D's game quality really pales in comparison to Quarterfinal C's, so if you have the time to watch two (or even three) VODs, you should stick to NaDa vs. JangBi. Of the fOrGG vs. Stork games, set 1 is probably most watchable - it's one-sided, but features some clever early-game antics.


Semifinal D Highlights



                                + Show Spoiler [Match Analysis from Kwark] +
Stork vs fOrGG. Another clear favourite, another Samsung PvT. I almost pity the Samsung terran lineup for having to get raped but then I remember it's FBH and FrOzean and I just don't care. We saw these two play in the ro32 and I was very impressed by Stork's technical rush, a well executed and very clever build. While it turned out to be a close game I still expect Stork to win. And so do the fans with 79% favouring Stork.




1set on Byzantium 2

Stork spawned at 11 and fOrGG at 7. However lacking JangBi's luck he scouted the wrong way while fOrGG scouted correctly. This took some of the wind out of 10/15 gate goon rush build which was countered easily by a bunker. Stork knew that once scouted it was unlikely to work so rapidly transitioned into economy and proxy robo attempt, making just 3 dragoons. fOrGG made a bunker and then repaired it until a siege tank arrived to secure the natural for him. His proxy pylon was scouted but Stork simply switched to a robo in main. fOrGG, still worried about a goon break decided to come out of the closet and made a wall of a rax, ebay and bunker in front of his nat with tanks behind it. Stork then revealed his secret build, the same one as he used in the ro16. If you read my ro32 report you'll see me giving a whole lot of love for the build. Subsequently I've been using it every game I can and extremely happy to see a Byzantium variation of it. He elevatored down an army and tore shit up in fOrGG's main. By the time fOrGG finally had a tank line set up the reaver arrived and Stork ripped it to pieces before moving on to rape the scv line. While all this was going on Stork was double expanding and just generally being a much better player than his opponent.

fOrGG scouted how far behind he was and decided he was eager for the next game so tried moving out. Stork was happy to oblige and flattened him with absolutely no regard for micro or strategy.

GG

Fucking loved it. I loved this build when I saw it the first time round, I love it the second time round and I really love the balls to use the exact same build vs the same opponent twice in a row. Even when he scouts it the second time. Stork gets bonus points for his perfect execution with that reaver micro.




2set on Neo Harmony

So, game 2 on Neo Harmony. If there's a map that's good for him to do the exact same build again it's this one. However after JangBi did a proxy robo last week and Stork did a proxy robo every game so far I guess fOrGG is expecting it. Still, we can hope. Stork at 11, fOrGG at 7.

Stork opens macro tech in a "I don't care what you do" build. Standard 1 gate fast core with a very late scout because he's powering his economy. He scouts the wrong way but still scouts faster than fOrGG who doesn't scout at all, eventually scouting correctly after his second depot finishes. Rather amusingly, before fOrGG even scouts a single base site he checks the expo next to his cliff to see if he's being proxy roboed. Now that is mind fuckery right there. You know you've got into their head when they don't care where you are, all they care about is whether you're going to beat them in the same way again. After checking every proxy site he could think of fOrGG placed the cc in his main for a 1 fact expansion build. However he was a little too ambitious trying to push back Storks dragoons. What happened next was, in my opinion, hilarious. Stork pushed in with 3 dragoons and a zealot taking the mine damage. A mine killed 2 marines and hurt the tank allowing Stork to push in and kill the tank. Stork then outmicroed a few mines and forced the cc to fly out. Deciding that 4 dragoons and no observers, or even a robo, was enough to take the kill Stork then sniped a vulture on the ramp and pushed up with his dragoons into the mines, blowing up 2 more vultures along with half his dragoons. Stork kept up these utterly ridiculous attacks which were somehow doing more damage to fOrGG than they were him, despite the fact that his goons were walking corpses and he still had no robo. Eventually fOrGG got enough mines down that Stork would risk losing all his goons if he just moved into them, rather than the previously acceptable loss of 3/4 of his goons. The observer then panned back to Stork's base where he's going 2 base carrier without bothering with a robo. It's glorious.

Stork tries to take a 3rd base and wall it in but vultures get there too early and it is mined off from him. Eventually Stork gets his critical mass of carriers (3) and moves in for the kill. fOrGG realises he's been pimped and moves his entire tank force to camp the choke by Stork's nat where he knows Stork can't engage him in a fair fight. Stork sacrifices his expansion as his carriers (4 now) take out fOrGG's. Then carrier micro destroys groups of goliaths while Stork's main army holds his main against the tank push. The armoury goes down and fOrGG realises he's been defeated.

GG

I loved it. The goon rushes were ridiculous. You just don't normal move a group of dragoons up a ramp you know has mines on it. It's not done, and not done for very good reasons. But he was in a rare moment where fOrGG had absolutely nothing and if he kept attacking then fOrGG couldn't establish the foundations of a solid defence. Terran defences get exponentially stronger as you add units and by constantly attacking Stork created the amusing sight of a single red hp goon tearing shit up. The 2 base carrier rush was just funny. I don't know if he's taking the piss or not but I really hope he is and fOrGG must be fuming.




3set on Destination

Stork 11, fOrGG 5 on Destination, the site of Stork's first victory in the ro32. Stork scouted on 7, as in the ro32, while fOrGG went for a very fast rax at his wall, perhaps fearing some kind of cheese rush from Stork given that he was 2-0 up. Stork got his probe in and threatened to take the gas. This is actually a form of harass because often the T will cancel a scv to get the minerals for an immediate refinery. Even if you have no intention of taking their gas you should threaten it. fOrGG was cutting serious scvs. A quick count of them while he took his gas revealed nine, presumably with one building. Given his barracks was half done at this point that means that he must have fucked his own economy over fairly hard just to play safe against a potential rush. Being forced to make the refinery early can't have helped his situation, and nor would the manner pylon that Stork placed, trapping 2 scvs fOrGG simply couldn't afford to have trapped. Stork opted for a zealot to into 1 gate goons with range into robo and a 2nd gate while fOrGG went for 2 fact with both addons. Conscious of JangBi's loss Stork carefully scouted all proxy sites but was ill prepared for fOrGG's push of pure rines and tanks with fast siege. He eventually killed the marines and a standoff ensued. Then Stork decided to do something progamers never do and went for a tank break with 5 dragoons against 3 tanks. It was a bad time for it and mines fucked him up a fair bit but whatever, it's the thought (and the pure aggression) that counts. fOrGG's build, a contain rush, trying to establish position on the twin bridges at his nat, seemed to have worked. Stork FEed to his mineral only because his nat was very vulnerable and tried to break out. His usually perfect reaver micro let him down and his goon suicides which were so amusing to me in game 2 were very costly to him in game 3. However as fOrGG played safe, securing his main against any possible drop play and taking his expansion, Stork was able to force the bridges from him and expand to his nat.

fOrGG's retreat is fine in theory because he's done all he needs to, delaying Stork's expansion while getting his own. Unfortunately for him Stork took his mineral only early so it didn't actually work but the thought was there. I guess Stork then felt he had something to prove after wasting his first reaver so he went on a killing spree. A serious killing spree. He raped fOrGG's nat, not only stopping mining but also killing 2 tanks and a turret, as well as the usual scvs of course. Then he moved on to the main where he stopped mining, killed scvs, killed a turret and claimed 3 tanks. I'm not entirely sure how he did all this with just one reaver (it was the same one, it just didn't die). fOrGG decided to take his huge mob of tanks on the offence and pushed towards the high ground at 2, hoping to take out the expansion attempts. While he was successful against Stork's main army he hadn't bargained on the mighty shuttle (this time armed with a zealot and a few mines) which promptly took out 3 more tanks and injured many more, causing fOrGG to retreat once again. Stork attempted to push the advantage with mass goon into mass tank and wasted a dozen more goons, as well as losing his hero reaver. fOrGG again tank pushed to 2 and again the shuttle moved in with zeebombs which claimed another 3 tanks while his main army (now with speedlots instead of just pure goon vs pure tank) flattened fOrGG's. Then Stork wasted another group of dragoons allowing fOrGG to rush up onto the high ground at 2 with 3 tanks, 8 vultures and an awful lot of mines. The vultures slaughtered probes at his mineral only while Stork forced the high ground off him by wasting units (and the hero shuttle). Deciding he hadn't quite wasted enough goons yet Stork suicided a few more into mines (wtf are you doing man? It was funny game 2 where I thought you were being all awesome but this is just sad) and again had trouble holding 2. fOrGG lifted the cc from his mined out main to 5 and started mining there while Stork attempted to take 10 but was delayed by a mine. The push against 2 turned into a stalemate with neither side earning anything but losses as both the no mans land between them proved unholdable. fOrGG got a group of tanks dug in on the high ground at 3 and then pushed a wall of tanks forwards, eventually taking 2 off Stork who evaced the probes to 10.

Stork realised he might actually be in trouble so made another of his ultimate unit, the shuttle, to destroy fOrGG at 5. Faced with a reaver fOrGG countered the only way he knew how, by stacking his scvs. When reinforcements moved in it 2 darks also emerged from the shuttle and racked up some kills before jumping back in away from the scan. Stork suicided 4 more dragoons into mines, probably because he was winning again and then moved his main army down the left hand side of the map which was largely tank free. Defeating fOrGG's main army (and suiciding another 8 dragoons into mines) fOrGG was forced to move his army from his base at 5 which was promptly raped by the shuttle which was still there.

GG

This game was really scrappy. Stork was all over the place, his refusal to use observers, his inability to use speedlots for half the game, his unwillingness to go above tier one tech. It wasn't a good display of Brood War. It was just a mess. fOrGG stayed at 0-0 all game but I'm not sure I can blame him for that because he was against the wall for most the game. What I can blame him for is being raped by reavers over and over all game. Jeez. Also he obsessed way too much about taking 2 to the point that his entire force was committed to an unstoppable slow push which Stork promptly went round while abandoning the top right in favour of new bases on the left. And he kept walking his army over mines. It was just a complete mess from both players. Stork should be ashamed of how many dragoons he threw away that game, especially when he had observer tech throughout.


Match Notes

I'd like to dedicate this section of this article to the two Stork fans who bumped last week's MSL update to blast me for picking fOrGG to win this series - after the games had been played. I understand: you guys were totally appalled that I could doubt Stork's invincible PvT…you just wanted to wait for the results of the series before you decided how appalled to be.

I'll concede that my prediction for the outcome of this match was off - no, way off. fOrGG's performance here suggests the reason he hasn't been making Winners League appearances for Hwaseung isn't a rigorous MSL-focused practice schedule (as I suspected), but rather a steep dropoff in his quality of play. Apparently, fOrGG was not the Lost Saga MSL's darkhorse, but its lame horse. And Stork just put him out of his misery.

fOrGG had the misfortune of facing Stork two days after his teammate JangBi had qualified for the semifinals - I say misfortune because this match looked suspiciously like Stork using fOrGG to one-up JB in any way possible: "You proxy robo? I'll proxy robo, have it scouted, and then win with an elevator trick." "You play an aggressive early game and transition to 3-base carrier? I'll play a fearless early game and transition to 2-base carrier." Of course, Stork had the advantage of a weaker opponent - and his lackluster performance in the third set suggests he needed that advantage to advance. As I'll discuss in the Semifinal B Preview below, Stork is going to have to step up his game significantly if he wants to keep his Lost Saga MSL hopes alive.

[image loading] Artosis on fOrGG

fOrGG's grade: C

Poor fOrGG. Nothing went right for him. Stork looked like he was playing in his old cheesy abusive style, instead of the newer "brute force of skill" Stork that we've grown used to. fOrGG just lacked the edge needed to compete at this level TvP. Everything went wrong, and he never seemed to be in control of his fate. All in all a poor series from the former MSL champion.

[image loading] Kwark on Stork

Stork's grade: C

Game 1 I loved, mainly because I loved the build. I found his refusal to micro his actual army late game kinda funny because of how far ahead he was and his reaver micro was excellent. Game 2 was semi-cheese and fOrGG threw it away with one overambitious push early. Again I found his refusal to accept that mines might be a problem funny and it worked out fairly well for him. It was game 3 where we saw that Stork wasn't actually just not bothering with micro in the first two, he was actually playing really badly. It's only when we get a straightupish game that we see Stork's play is really messy and he relies upon being really ahead or doing tricky carrier rushes to win. I was very happy with his bad play when it didn't matter, but when he shows the same bad play in a clutch situation I can't justify it and I have to hold him to account for all the bad play.

Yes, he still won game 3. His reaver micro was sublime. But that's all that won it for him and he still made it really hard work for himself. Had fOrGG been any good at blocking reavers then he'd have been flattened. Stork gets a C because quite frankly, he shouldn't be playing like ass. He came in today with some strong builds and an outmatched opponent and given that context his performance was weak. Unless he ups his game Stork isn't making it any further.




Semifinal A Preview

[image blocked] [image blocked]

      (Z)ZerO                            vs                             (Z)Luxury

Career vZ:
22-19 (54%)                                          Career vZ: 46-24 (66%)
Last 10 vZ: 6-4                                                  Last 10 vZ: 7-3

The elusive ZvZ Bo5 will make a second appearance in the Lost Saga MSL tonight, when Zero and Luxury square off for a spot in the finals. ZvZ's fast-paced, micro-intensive style fits Luxury perfectly, so its no surprise he's long been considered a master of this matchup - Luxury's ZvZ ELO of 2163 is second only to Jaedong, and he's never lost more than two consecutive ZvZs over his entire career. Lux's consistency in this matchup makes him the heavy favorite in this series.

Luxury is also 3-1 lifetime against Zero, and his most recent win was en route to qualifying for this MSL from the Survivor tournament. However, as Zero's quarterfinal romp over Savior demonstrated, citing career statistics when discussing Zero's play is an exercise in futility. The young WJ Zerg is rapidly improving, and terribly streaky. This series' entertainment value and eventual outcome both depend heavily upon which version of Zero shows up to play tonight: the lights-out master of muta control who whomped Savior two weeks ago, or the nervous little kid who lost his last three ZvZs to keke, hyvaa, and Calm.

Having already taken out Lux's twin in the Ro16 and MJY in the Ro8, Zero is just one match away from running a brutal ZvZ gauntlet all the way to the MSL finals - and, given that he's come this far, I think he'll bring his A-game to this semifinal match. Unfortunately, I don't think even Zero's best showing will be enough to put him past Chance Park. I pick Luxury's tried-and-true ZvZ, in five nailbiting sets.




Semifinal B Preview

[image loading]
[image loading]


(P)JangBi                             vs                             (P)Stork

Career vP:
28-25 (53%)                                          Career vP: 73-45 (62%)
Last 10 vP: 6-4                                                  Last 10 vP: 5-5

The LS MSL's second semifinal may be its easiest match to call, simply because we have access to first-hand accounts of how the players involved stack up in practice games. Whenever JangBi comes up in one of Stork's interviews, Birdtoss maintains that his Protoss dongsaeng dominates him at the Samsung house. This tidbit is from Taek-Bang Era, Stork's chat with Bisu and Fomos in December:

Stork, how do you do against Jangbi in practice games?
▲ Stork: I literally lose every single game. (Laughs) I am not trying to be modest or anything, that’s just the truth. A while ago I couldn’t beat him if my life depended on it. Now it’s getting closer to 50-50, but I always play worse verses Jangbi, maybe because of all the horrible memories of getting crushed.

There was a time when Stork could rely on his years of experience in BoX series for an advantage over JangBi outside of the practice house's pressure-free environment, but that time has passed - JangBi's clutch performance against NaDa laid to rest any doubts about his ability as a series player.

Stork's bumbling play in his third set against fOrGG is merely more evidence that this quarterfinal will turn out exactly like the finals of KHAN's average in-house tournament: with a JangBi victory. JangBi has the talent, momentum, and, given his history against Stork, confidence to take this series and a berth in the finals. I predict JangBi over Stork, in four.




One More Thing:

[image loading]

I am NaDa, destroyer of critters




Thanks for reading! I hope you enjoy the semifinal matches this week. The next MSL update will be a semifinal review and finals preview!

Peace,
JWD (with massive thanks to Kwark and Artosis)
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Mista
Profile Joined January 2009
Singapore1022 Posts
March 12 2009 03:55 GMT
#2
Great write up awesome as always battle reports are so detailed.Here's to Jangbi's first ever MSL !
Time for some Revolution !
RoieTRS
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States2569 Posts
March 12 2009 03:55 GMT
#3
Nice write-up! Thanks
konadora, in Racenilatr's blog: "you need to stop thinking about starcraft or anything computer-related for that matter. It's becoming a bad addiction imo"
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
March 12 2009 03:56 GMT
#4
<3333333333 JWD + Kwark + Artosis!
tytyty!
Awesome writeup!
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
ambit!ous1
Profile Joined September 2007
United States3662 Posts
March 12 2009 03:57 GMT
#5
Excellent Read!

thanks JWD!
Bisu[Shield] / ♔ SoYeon
piskooooo
Profile Joined November 2008
United States351 Posts
March 12 2009 04:03 GMT
#6
NaDa hiding his face was so sad ;_;
<3 MKP
AlTheCake
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Canada1071 Posts
March 12 2009 04:03 GMT
#7
Great write up!

When I watched NaDa vs. JangBi on Destination I was screaming louder than the fangirls.
DanceCommander
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States1808 Posts
March 12 2009 04:15 GMT
#8
Nice, I like that Artosis and Kwark are offering some insight.
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
March 12 2009 04:17 GMT
#9
NaDa T_T
GHOSTCLAW
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States17042 Posts
March 12 2009 04:21 GMT
#10
On March 12 2009 13:03 piskooooo wrote:
NaDa hiding his face was so sad ;_;


Nada losing was so sad. Especially after that game 1. Game one, everyone was hoping, crossing their fingers, thinking that nada could win this. And then...crush.
PhotographerLiquipedia. Drop me a pm if you've got questions/need help.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
March 12 2009 04:26 GMT
#11
Game 1 NaDa blind countered an allin. If anyone else did that I'd say they were fortunate. But this is NaDa, he understands shit on a level beyond us all. Game 1 mechanically he was nothing special. But in terms of game sense maphack I really have no idea how the fuck he did it.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Verilan
Profile Joined March 2009
United States67 Posts
March 12 2009 04:27 GMT
#12
Stork just got owned in this write-up

Gonna have to root hard for him.
oo_xerox
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States852 Posts
March 12 2009 04:29 GMT
#13
This thing is great, really. I felt really bad in the jangbi vs Nada, and reading this made me feel even worst! knowing that nada was a+ and jb b............. oh well at least he could win the msl!
I could get a more coherent article by gluing a Sharpie to a dog's cook and letting it hump the page.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
March 12 2009 04:32 GMT
#14
On March 12 2009 13:27 Verilan wrote:
Stork just got owned in this write-up

Gonna have to root hard for him.

My feelings changed drastically as I watched game 3. Game 1 and 2 I thought he was a fantastic PvTer who was having fun and taking the piss by doing retarded semi allins and then microing like ass after he had a huge advantage. I was assuming that because his straightup PvT has always been Godly he was just doing this for fun.

However game 3 he showed straightup PvT, and it was really fucking bad. With that in mind I had to reconsider the whole series (although I didn't rewrite the first 2 with the benefit of hindsight). 2 base carrier rush while suiciding units for most the game stops being loltastic and starts being a desperate, pointless cheese from someone afraid he can't win straightup.

I don't know. One really bad display isn't enough to condemn him. But he didn't play well the first 2 games, his control was awful throughout. He just played loltastic for 2 games, which is either kinda funny or really bad depending on whether his straightup play is good or not.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
March 12 2009 04:34 GMT
#15
On March 12 2009 13:29 oo_xerox wrote:
This thing is great, really. I felt really bad in the jangbi vs Nada, and reading this made me feel even worst! knowing that nada was a+ and jb b............. oh well at least he could win the msl!

NaDa exceeded everyones expectations (except in game 3 lol). I'd definitely give him an A for a performance of game 1 and 5s calibre against a player like JangBi. But JangBi's B game is better than NaDa's A game, just the way it is.

When an S class player struggles against an A class player you give him bad grades. Equally when that A class player makes a gg against an S class player you give him good grades, even though the S class is still better.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
March 12 2009 04:43 GMT
#16
On March 12 2009 13:21 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 13:03 piskooooo wrote:
NaDa hiding his face was so sad ;_;


Nada losing was so sad. Especially after that game 1. Game one, everyone was hoping, crossing their fingers, thinking that nada could win this. And then...crush.

I know
NaDa was so close T_T
so depressing.
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
March 12 2009 04:48 GMT
#17
Isn't a lot of Stork's sloppiness from the schedule? He's made it pretty clear in his recent interviews and last season he doesn't practice at all when he plays fOrGG because's he's been too busy practicing for his OSL opponents. I'd imagine he'll be in better shape against Jangbi, especially since he's writing off TotM against Jaedong.
Orbifold
Profile Joined September 2008
United States1922 Posts
March 12 2009 05:06 GMT
#18
(T)NaDa came so close... what a great series of games. Let's just home the rest of the league is that exciting.

(P)JangBi's PvT continues to be disgustingly good, sigh.
Allow me to reintroduce myself...
Ozarugold
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
2716 Posts
March 12 2009 05:07 GMT
#19
I was so sad when Nada lost against Jangbi in game 5. I still believe! Go Nada!
this is my quote.
boesthius
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States11637 Posts
March 12 2009 05:08 GMT
#20
--- Nuked ---
Titusmaster6
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States5937 Posts
March 12 2009 05:24 GMT
#21
Too bad the winner of Stork and Jangbi will lose to a zerg anyway.

Silver :p
Shorts down shorts up, BOOM, just like that.
Mooncat
Profile Joined October 2007
Germany1228 Posts
March 12 2009 05:36 GMT
#22
This is JangBi's MSL for the taking. Take it for fuck's sake! You need a title, kiddo!
"[Lee Young Ho] With this victory, you’ve risen to Bonjwa status."
fanatacist
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
10319 Posts
March 12 2009 05:49 GMT
#23
Great write-up, nice vids, thanks for the mention n_n
Peace~
GhostPrototype
Profile Joined August 2008
Vietnam9 Posts
March 12 2009 05:55 GMT
#24
The writers didn't mention the fact that Stork had just won a very stressful match against the beast Jaedong 1 day before.

DAMN! 3-0 and you got a C, that's not exactly generous.
A noob needs help
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 12 2009 06:00 GMT
#25
Thanks for the comments everyone!

I'd just like to add that I find Artosis's clear Terran bias hilarious ^^
✌
baubo
Profile Joined September 2008
China3370 Posts
March 12 2009 06:18 GMT
#26
LOL at Kwark's report on Stork. What's weird is that Stork almost never fails to get an early game advantage in PvT. It seems that when the dust settles and the game moves to the mid-game, Stork would always inevitably be at such an edge that he doesn't need micro to win. Then it's just a matter of macroing enough units to a-move FTW!

I must say you got to at least give Stork credit for knowing his opponent and the map enough to do this. In terms of strategy, Stork is a PvT God.
Meh
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 12 2009 06:32 GMT
#27
On March 12 2009 15:18 baubo wrote:
LOL at Kwark's report on Stork. What's weird is that Stork almost never fails to get an early game advantage in PvT. It seems that when the dust settles and the game moves to the mid-game, Stork would always inevitably be at such an edge that he doesn't need micro to win. Then it's just a matter of macroing enough units to a-move FTW!

I must say you got to at least give Stork credit for knowing his opponent and the map enough to do this. In terms of strategy, Stork is a PvT God.


Stork played really well in the 1set and 2set no doubt. He exploited timings and maps perfectly, and was really aggressive when necessary. However, it's just hard to heap praise upon him considering a) the level his opponent was playing at and b) his fairly abysmal performance in the 3set.

It could very well be that Stork tanked simply because he knew he didn't even have to bring his A-game to win...that's just not a very likely story IMO.
✌
baubo
Profile Joined September 2008
China3370 Posts
March 12 2009 06:40 GMT
#28
On March 12 2009 15:32 JWD wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 15:18 baubo wrote:
LOL at Kwark's report on Stork. What's weird is that Stork almost never fails to get an early game advantage in PvT. It seems that when the dust settles and the game moves to the mid-game, Stork would always inevitably be at such an edge that he doesn't need micro to win. Then it's just a matter of macroing enough units to a-move FTW!

I must say you got to at least give Stork credit for knowing his opponent and the map enough to do this. In terms of strategy, Stork is a PvT God.


Stork played really well in the 1set and 2set no doubt. He exploited timings and maps perfectly, and was really aggressive when necessary. However, it's just hard to heap praise upon him considering a) the level his opponent was playing at and b) his fairly abysmal performance in the 3set.

It could very well be that Stork tanked simply because he knew he didn't even have to bring his A-game to win...that's just not a very likely story IMO.


Well, I think it's more a matter of Stork unable to bring his A-game due to all the PvZs(especially against Jaedong just the day before) he's been playing.

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.
Meh
deathgodtoss
Profile Joined July 2008
Korea (North)189 Posts
March 12 2009 06:40 GMT
#29
artosis, cheese is part of the game. boxer will tell that to you too. jangbi did what needed to get done, deviating from his standard play to keep nada guessing. the better player came out on top, even though i was rooting for nada.
god is about as useful as a protoss scout
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 12 2009 06:44 GMT
#30
On March 12 2009 15:40 baubo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 15:32 JWD wrote:
On March 12 2009 15:18 baubo wrote:
LOL at Kwark's report on Stork. What's weird is that Stork almost never fails to get an early game advantage in PvT. It seems that when the dust settles and the game moves to the mid-game, Stork would always inevitably be at such an edge that he doesn't need micro to win. Then it's just a matter of macroing enough units to a-move FTW!

I must say you got to at least give Stork credit for knowing his opponent and the map enough to do this. In terms of strategy, Stork is a PvT God.


Stork played really well in the 1set and 2set no doubt. He exploited timings and maps perfectly, and was really aggressive when necessary. However, it's just hard to heap praise upon him considering a) the level his opponent was playing at and b) his fairly abysmal performance in the 3set.

It could very well be that Stork tanked simply because he knew he didn't even have to bring his A-game to win...that's just not a very likely story IMO.


Well, I think it's more a matter of Stork unable to bring his A-game due to all the PvZs(especially against Jaedong just the day before) he's been playing.

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.


Yeah, I hear ya. Honestly, I would have like fOrGG to punish him for not preparing for this series but instead fOrGG came out and pretty much played with his head where the sun don't shine.
✌
Marine50
Profile Joined September 2007
Australia1764 Posts
March 12 2009 06:53 GMT
#31
cheers
IRIS FIGHTING!!!
Marine50
Profile Joined September 2007
Australia1764 Posts
March 12 2009 06:55 GMT
#32
On March 12 2009 15:44 JWD wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 15:40 baubo wrote:
On March 12 2009 15:32 JWD wrote:
On March 12 2009 15:18 baubo wrote:
LOL at Kwark's report on Stork. What's weird is that Stork almost never fails to get an early game advantage in PvT. It seems that when the dust settles and the game moves to the mid-game, Stork would always inevitably be at such an edge that he doesn't need micro to win. Then it's just a matter of macroing enough units to a-move FTW!

I must say you got to at least give Stork credit for knowing his opponent and the map enough to do this. In terms of strategy, Stork is a PvT God.


Stork played really well in the 1set and 2set no doubt. He exploited timings and maps perfectly, and was really aggressive when necessary. However, it's just hard to heap praise upon him considering a) the level his opponent was playing at and b) his fairly abysmal performance in the 3set.

It could very well be that Stork tanked simply because he knew he didn't even have to bring his A-game to win...that's just not a very likely story IMO.


Well, I think it's more a matter of Stork unable to bring his A-game due to all the PvZs(especially against Jaedong just the day before) he's been playing.

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.


Yeah, I hear ya. Honestly, I would have like fOrGG to punish him for not preparing for this series > but instead fOrGG came out and pretty much played with his head where the sun don't shine.


Storks got the skills to back up his cocky tvp talk. In their previous boX series stork walked over him again even though he was practicing for the OSL semis vs Best. And it doesn't help that forgg sucks at vP compared to his other match ups
IRIS FIGHTING!!!
Hot_Bid
Profile Blog Joined October 2003
Braavos36374 Posts
March 12 2009 07:08 GMT
#33
Nice writeup!

This season our coverage is better than ever.
@Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10663 Posts
March 12 2009 07:11 GMT
#34
The cool thing about this MSL is:

Stork: Came in second so damn many times, he deserves another title (he is actually the only player with chances to get the double this year?).
Jangbi: Came in second twice (?), he deserves a title.
Luxury: Stuck around for a while, showed good results here an there but won nothing major yet (well WCG) and would also be a *good* title holder.
Zero: New kid on the block...

3 Players are kinda overdue for a title (1 for sure and 1 really deserves more than 1 gold for his long term results)... This MSL shapes up really good and we will have an exciting ZvP final.
brjdrb
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States577 Posts
March 12 2009 07:13 GMT
#35
two things: 1. the first part of the write-up should say quarterfinal C, not semifinal C.
2. in the first paragraph of the semifinal A preview, you spelled paced wrong (pased). great write-up though. especially kwark's view on stork's play. and hopefully artosis will do the terran write-ups from now on. artosis rocks.

also, i think stork's mediocre play vs forgg was due to him practicing his ass off for osl. he's up against jaedong, and his pvz has historically been terrible. at least he'll get time to practice for the semi's (he'll need it vs jangbi)
Stork's biggest fan
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 07:18:34
March 12 2009 07:18 GMT
#36
On March 12 2009 16:13 brjdrb wrote:
two things: 1. the first part of the write-up should say quarterfinal C, not semifinal C.
2. in the first paragraph of the semifinal A preview, you spelled paced wrong (pased).


Fixed...thanks. For the record, I do know how to spell paced ^^.

And thanks a lot Hot_Bid...it's tough to compete with your ClubDay coverage TBH
✌
Hot_Bid
Profile Blog Joined October 2003
Braavos36374 Posts
March 12 2009 07:20 GMT
#37
highlight vids!!!
@Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png
omninmo
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
2349 Posts
March 12 2009 07:26 GMT
#38
great write up.
FYI the red digitalized character superimposed over the two combatants in the middle of front page banner is the traditional chinese character 龍 which means DRAGON.
MrWinkles
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States200 Posts
March 12 2009 07:55 GMT
#39
This series was so much fun to watch. NaDa's still got it. I will not doubt him again -- I called this one 3-1 JangBi because JangBi is just that good, but JangBi wasn't so much better than NaDa to make me feel like I'd call the series that way again if they played another bo5.
And why can't there be more bo5s? These are so much fun!!
What does the knight do?
KOFgokuon
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States14893 Posts
March 12 2009 08:06 GMT
#40
i hope stork kills jangbi ><
amorpheus
Profile Joined May 2007
Bulgaria2144 Posts
March 12 2009 08:20 GMT
#41
On March 12 2009 12:29 JWD wrote: Unfortunately, I don't think even Zero's best showing will be enough to put him past Chance Park. I pick Luxury's tried-and-true ZvZ, in five nailbiting sets.

and I pick Zero for a clear 3:0 rape.
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 12 2009 08:21 GMT
#42
On March 12 2009 17:06 KOFgokuon wrote:
i hope stork kills jangbi ><


I agree: the lesser of two evils.
✌
CDRdude
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States5625 Posts
March 12 2009 08:27 GMT
#43
Lesser of two evils? I hope Stork loses to Jangbi again, as continued payback for when he picked his own teammate to play against in the OSL (was there every any explanation of why he did that?). Stork lost then, and he deserves to lose now.
Force staff is the best item in the game.
Jenia6109
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Russian Federation1612 Posts
March 12 2009 09:08 GMT
#44
JWD i see u dont like Stork. U said he would lose to ForGG, now JangBi. But it's just funny. Stork will win
INnoVation TY Maru | Classic Stats Dear sOs Zest herO | Rogue Dark soO
Pholon
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Netherlands6142 Posts
March 12 2009 09:10 GMT
#45
On March 12 2009 12:29 JWD wrote:

2set on Carthage

Game 2 JangBi opened with an unusual (for him) rush. One well hidden proxy gate with a gas steal and probes pumping as normal (after the initial delay).


Serious? If memory serves me right, ALL PvTs have seen a proxy on that map so far. -_-
Also, in Stork s ForGG 3rd game, I feel ForGG was pretty ahead, getting the bridge contain up, only thing he needed to fear was a shuttle (to break the contain or to drop the main), yet he refuses to make a wraith/goliaths. I feel either of those might have sealed the game early on. Thoughts?
Moderator@TLPholon // "I need a third hand to facepalm right now"
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 09:52:19
March 12 2009 09:12 GMT
#46
On March 12 2009 18:10 Pholon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 12:29 JWD wrote:

2set on Carthage

Game 2 JangBi opened with an unusual (for him) rush. One well hidden proxy gate with a gas steal and probes pumping as normal (after the initial delay).


Serious? If memory serves me right, ALL PvTs have seen a proxy on that map so far. -_-
Also, in Stork s ForGG 3rd game, I feel ForGG was pretty ahead, getting the bridge contain up, only thing he needed to fear was a shuttle (to break the contain or to drop the main), yet he refuses to make a wraith/goliaths. I feel either of those might have sealed the game early on. Thoughts?

If only I'd clarified that it wasn't unusual for the map but was rather an unusual thing for him to have done given his usual safe style.
If I'd thought to do that you'd have absolutely no point at all.

As for your other comments. Yeah, he really needed to be better antireaver. It completely raped him. In the bread and butter PvT Stork was all over the place, not so much being outplayed as suiciding. He didn't need goliathes or wraiths to beat it, although they certainly would have helped. He just needed to be better at using the standard counter of mines, tanks and turrets.
I guess if you're really bad at antireaver then you can justify going extra stuff to seal the deal but fOrGG should really be able to stop a reaver without going wraith.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 09:25:55
March 12 2009 09:25 GMT
#47
Edit: nevermind I readjusted my sarcasm meter and now all is well.
✌
latent
Profile Joined March 2009
United States428 Posts
March 12 2009 09:39 GMT
#48
Boy, you must really not like stork to give him a C after he 3-0'd his opponent. Regardless of his play, he 3-0'd his opponent, which is really hard to do regardless of who you're playing.

I'd also like to point out that after his 2 PvT losses, Jangbi's PvT Elo score is lower than Bisu's. Yay!
Moo
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
March 12 2009 09:49 GMT
#49
On March 12 2009 18:39 latent wrote:
Boy, you must really not like stork to give him a C after he 3-0'd his opponent. Regardless of his play, he 3-0'd his opponent, which is really hard to do regardless of who you're playing.

I'd also like to point out that after his 2 PvT losses, Jangbi's PvT Elo score is lower than Bisu's. Yay!

No. 3-0s are easy if you're substantially better than the opponent, which Stork is. If Stork played like we know he can play and straightup raped then he'd get a B. If he somehow exceeded himself (which tbh he can't do vs fOrGG because he's not sufficiently challenged) he'd get an A. If he scraped through some extremely sloppy wins while playing substandard games he gets a C. It's not about the result, it's about how he's playing.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Heimatloser
Profile Joined March 2009
Germany1494 Posts
March 12 2009 10:09 GMT
#50
whoever wins jangbi vs stork ( i hope for stork ) will lose to luxury anyways, so it doesnt matter.
i doubt that the finals will be as interesting as the semifinals.
bad bracketmaking from the msl staff... even though it ofc good to have no interteam finals, well, it was probably the best they could make out of that lineup.
All what KT currently needs is a Zerg and a second Terran
hymn
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Bulgaria832 Posts
March 12 2009 10:14 GMT
#51
jesus, reading this was almost as good as watching the games. Thank you!
azk he is the north american player but the titan he is the french stars
Spenguin
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia3316 Posts
March 12 2009 10:22 GMT
#52
Naddaaa ;_;
< TeamLiquid CJ Entusman #46 > I came for the Brood War, I stayed for the people.
Loanshark
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
China3094 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 11:12:38
March 12 2009 11:10 GMT
#53
On March 12 2009 19:09 Heimatloser wrote:
whoever wins jangbi vs stork ( i hope for stork ) will lose to luxury anyways, so it doesnt matter.
i doubt that the finals will be as interesting as the semifinals.
bad bracketmaking from the msl staff... even though it ofc good to have no interteam finals, well, it was probably the best they could make out of that lineup.


And you have no idea what you are talking about.
Bad bracketmaking....what the fuck.
No dough, no go. And no mercy.
Nytefish
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United Kingdom4282 Posts
March 12 2009 12:10 GMT
#54
Highlight videos are really nice.
No I'm never serious.
YY_August
Profile Joined March 2009
China3 Posts
March 12 2009 12:38 GMT
#55
hello,everyone!
I am from china !
真正的贵族不会和平民抢镜头!
meegrean
Profile Joined May 2008
Thailand7699 Posts
March 12 2009 13:21 GMT
#56
Stork should get a B I think.
Brood War loyalist
riotjune
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States3392 Posts
March 12 2009 14:37 GMT
#57
Maybe Stork didn't care, he was already ahead by 2 games (they were good)
Kerotan
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
England2109 Posts
March 12 2009 14:50 GMT
#58
I think Jangbi will have Stork, I don't feel too strongly about either one to care much, but I do like jangbis shuttle play.
Nerdette // External revolution - Internal revolution // Fabulous // I raise my hands to heaven of curiosity // I don't know what to ask for // What has it got for me? // Kerribear
LordWeird
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States3411 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 15:10:29
March 12 2009 15:10 GMT
#59
Really nice write up. At first glance, the picture on the front page made me think that they were wearing kilts.
Chains none
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
March 12 2009 15:25 GMT
#60
On March 12 2009 15:40 deathgodtoss wrote:
artosis, cheese is part of the game. boxer will tell that to you too. jangbi did what needed to get done, deviating from his standard play to keep nada guessing. the better player came out on top, even though i was rooting for nada.

It's extra funny because NaDa cheesed just as much as JangBi did.
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
b(town)
Profile Joined February 2009
United States20 Posts
March 12 2009 16:07 GMT
#61
Great write-up Kwark, I feel I better understand the matches I've already I watched once it's explained by someone who really knows the high-level strategy. Keep it coming, it's much appreciated.
Zyarktodt
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
United States67 Posts
March 12 2009 16:26 GMT
#62
Dragons, Knights, and..... wait what do they call zerg masters again?
LordWeird
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States3411 Posts
March 12 2009 16:30 GMT
#63
On March 13 2009 01:26 Zyarktodt wrote:
Dragons, Knights, and..... wait what do they call zerg masters again?


Cerebrates.
Chains none
DoctorHelvetica
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States15034 Posts
March 12 2009 16:37 GMT
#64
On March 13 2009 01:26 Zyarktodt wrote:
Dragons, Knights, and..... wait what do they call zerg masters again?


sAviOr.
RIP Aaliyah
Tuke
Profile Joined January 2009
Finland1666 Posts
March 12 2009 17:17 GMT
#65
great writeup
I am NaDa, destroyer of critters ^^
TeamLiquid CJ Entusman #42
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42393 Posts
March 12 2009 17:51 GMT
#66
Hmm... Do you think Samsung will clear the proleague schedules of Stork and JangBi in order to let them practice? It'd take the heart out of the team and there's really no point when they're not playing a PvP final. Might as well not let either practice for the semifinal. As long as they keep it fair no harm no foul.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
sAw
Profile Joined November 2008
965 Posts
March 12 2009 17:55 GMT
#67
Jangbi vs Luxury finals please.
Thanx for the writeup!
Clownz
Profile Joined February 2009
Finland53 Posts
March 12 2009 18:57 GMT
#68
No audio commentary :/
Radical dude!
InfeSteD
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States4658 Posts
March 12 2009 19:23 GMT
#69
I loved the highlight videos to summarize the series... really nice to the eyes... the pictures for the previews are really nice too..

I love it!

Thanks artosis, JWD and KwarK
w/e
StarBrift
Profile Joined January 2008
Sweden1761 Posts
March 12 2009 19:30 GMT
#70
Artosis whining about cheese again! I love the guy but that shit is getting old. I guess it's a terran only disease though.
NiTenIchiRyu
Profile Joined February 2009
United Kingdom273 Posts
March 12 2009 20:04 GMT
#71
I reckon JangBi will rape Stork.
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
March 12 2009 20:06 GMT
#72
On March 13 2009 05:04 NiTenIchiRyu wrote:
I reckon JangBi will rape Stork.

I hope he uses protection!
+ Show Spoiler +
against storks imba reaver drops of course. ;D
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
MuffinDude
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States3837 Posts
March 12 2009 22:49 GMT
#73
Heh heh. Sorry about that. Its just that I didn't read the other article until I saw stork won so yea. Sorry. XD
Zerg can be so abusive sometimes | third member of the "loli is not a crime club" PM konadora to join!
ZidaneTribal
Profile Joined September 2007
United States2800 Posts
March 12 2009 23:28 GMT
#74
first there is bisu v best now there is stork v jangbi. the starcraft gods want the protosses to eliminate themselves XD
fuck lag
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 12 2009 23:34 GMT
#75
On March 13 2009 07:49 MuffinDude wrote:
Heh heh. Sorry about that. Its just that I didn't read the other article until I saw stork won so yea. Sorry. XD


hehe np mate ^^
✌
Athos
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States2484 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 23:38:59
March 12 2009 23:37 GMT
#76
Great writeup except for the part where you said that Stork vs. Jangbi would be the easiest set to call. I have news for you, this set is anybody's game right now. With the obvious except of Bisu, these are the two best protoss of this era. Even if Stork says that he gets destroyed by Jangbi in practice, we don't know if he was telling the truth. Even if he was, Stork is capable of pulling an upset. Least we forget that everybody and their mother had Best beating Stork until Stork stunned the world in a 3-1 victory against the then-pvp bonjwa Best.

Oh that's right, the OP is Best biased and probably deleted that series from his memory. (jk OP) Stork is one of the sneakiest players of all time; he loves going for insane strategies during high stakes situations. And hell, Jangbi has a history of choking. It's almost like Stork wins an OSL and Jangbi gets Stork's luck. Stork will practice very hard for this match so that he can prove that he is the superior player. I predict Stork to win 3-1.
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
March 12 2009 23:47 GMT
#77
On March 13 2009 02:51 Kwark wrote:
Hmm... Do you think Samsung will clear the proleague schedules of Stork and JangBi in order to let them practice? It'd take the heart out of the team and there's really no point when they're not playing a PvP final. Might as well not let either practice for the semifinal. As long as they keep it fair no harm no foul.

They don't actually have any PL matches coming up, since it's WL playoffs coming up and Samsung isn't in them.

I don't know how hard they're practicing, but I suspect Stork is putting most of his effort into his OSL match with Jaedong. Jangbi has nothing else until PL starts up again, so he's probably been practicing for this pretty hard, teammate or no teammate.
Liquipedia
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-12 23:59:22
March 12 2009 23:57 GMT
#78
On March 13 2009 08:37 Athos wrote:
Great writeup except for the part where you said that Stork vs. Jangbi would be the easiest set to call. I have news for you, this set is anybody's game right now. With the obvious except of Bisu, these are the two best protoss of this era. Even if Stork says that he gets destroyed by Jangbi in practice, we don't know if he was telling the truth. Even if he was, Stork is capable of pulling an upset. Least we forget that everybody and their mother had Best beating Stork until Stork stunned the world in a 3-1 victory against the then-pvp bonjwa Best.

Oh that's right, the OP is Best biased and probably deleted that series from his memory. (jk OP) Stork is one of the sneakiest players of all time; he loves going for insane strategies during high stakes situations. And hell, Jangbi has a history of choking. It's almost like Stork wins an OSL and Jangbi gets Stork's luck. Stork will practice very hard for this match so that he can prove that he is the superior player. I predict Stork to win 3-1.


Oh, I wish I could erase that BeSt-Stork series from my mind...I woke up at 3:00 AM to watch that and after the 1set it was just painful. But I think you're exaggerating how much of a favorite BeSt was in that match...Stork's PvP was also really impressive (he had just beaten Bisu in the Ro8) at that time and there were plenty of people who were predicting him to win the series. Even I thought the match would be close (but a BeSt victory, of course )

You're right that Stork can never be counted out (especially in series play) but I think we have to take his word about practice games against JangBi - Stork has little incentive to lie in his interviews, especially not in the way he did (specifically mentioning that JangBi "destroys" him every game). My point is that, unlike for the Ro16 or Ro8 matchups, we have some pretty concrete information about how this semifinal's players match up in day-to-day games. I think that's the best kind of evidence for trying to predict match outcomes. If JangBi really does win almost every practice game against Stork, it's going to be near impossible for him to lose this series.
✌
K1te
Profile Joined January 2009
United States5 Posts
March 13 2009 00:05 GMT
#79
On March 12 2009 13:27 Verilan wrote:
Stork just got owned in this write-up

Gonna have to root hard for him.



Don't worry. Every single season TL's writeups completely berate Stork and say how he will lose in every single round and yet every single round he advances through and still manages a really high placing though.

The only thing that might keep Stork from winning would be that he's busy practicing for the OSL.

If you look at the more recent interviews they say that he goes even with Jangbi in practice. If he focuses on this match I don't see any way for him to lose. He's simply a superior player to Jangbi. I doubt even Bisu could take him.
Lessthan3
Profile Joined February 2009
Luxembourg20 Posts
March 13 2009 00:38 GMT
#80
I was so sad watching NaDa after he lost.
Lee Yoon Yeol fighting.
Awww man, he built zerglings. D:
I_L_Jl
Profile Joined January 2009
United States225 Posts
March 13 2009 01:30 GMT
#81
Pshhh, can't take player complimenting their teammates seriously. Bisu always says Best is the best player in SK house. Is it true?
l10f *
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States3241 Posts
March 13 2009 01:32 GMT
#82
The only reason Nada lost game 5 is because he killed a critter in game 4. CURSE YOU STUPID ANIMALS!
Writer
Archaic
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States4024 Posts
March 13 2009 02:52 GMT
#83
I love Nada even more for killing a critter.
IdrA
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
United States11541 Posts
March 13 2009 03:00 GMT
#84
On March 12 2009 15:40 baubo wrote:

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.

lol
why wouldnt he
http://www.splitreason.com/product/1152 release the gracken tshirt now available
Kinky
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States4126 Posts
March 13 2009 03:55 GMT
#85
When I saw Dragons > Knights, I started thinking about the Dragon and Knight in Gunbound
baubo
Profile Joined September 2008
China3370 Posts
March 13 2009 04:36 GMT
#86
On March 13 2009 12:00 IdrA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 12 2009 15:40 baubo wrote:

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.

lol
why wouldnt he


Well obviously he has all the skills to back up that stuff, but it just seemed weird coming from Stork.
Meh
Heimatloser
Profile Joined March 2009
Germany1494 Posts
March 13 2009 11:15 GMT
#87
On March 13 2009 13:36 baubo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2009 12:00 IdrA wrote:
On March 12 2009 15:40 baubo wrote:

Also, the impression I get from Stork interviews is that he's extremely cocky when it comes to PvT. Almost as if he just dismisses any terran opponent he faces. Which seems very out of character considering his views on other things.

lol
why wouldnt he


Well obviously he has all the skills to back up that stuff, but it just seemed weird coming from Stork.


same thoughts here ^^
he's always like mimimi i am so bad, its just my opponents that make me look strong, but what he said there was completely unlike his usual self.
All what KT currently needs is a Zerg and a second Terran
Mazepa
Profile Joined July 2007
United States2 Posts
March 13 2009 17:12 GMT
#88
Does anybody know who won zero vs luxury? and is there a site that has like the brackets for sc tournaments and stuff?
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-13 17:19:08
March 13 2009 17:18 GMT
#89
On March 14 2009 02:12 Mazepa wrote:
Does anybody know who won zero vs luxury? and is there a site that has like the brackets for sc tournaments and stuff?


Hello, welcome to TL! In short: yes, there is a site that has like brackets for sc tournaments and stuff, and this is it!

There are several ways to find out results of recent matches. The first is to go to teamliquid.net (our homepage) and click the "show latest results" link under the MSL logo towards the middle of the page (though that hasn't been updated with Ro4 results yet).

The second is to consult TLPD, TL's database of SC data. You can see a link and search field for TLPD over to the right. If you were to search "Zero Luxury", you'd find a listing of the games from their semifinal series. You can also see their games by clicking on "2009 Lost Saga MSL" in the "Hot Leagues" listing that appears when you click the TLPD banner to the right there.

The third is to check the LS MSL's R&S (Results and Standings) thread, which appears under "League Standings" below the TLPD search field on the right there. R&S threads are the oldest form of keeping track of tourney results, and often include brackets.

The fourth is to check the match's topic in the "Tourneys" forum on the left (you can click the Tourneys forum's banner on the left and then page through until you see a topic titled something like "MSL semifinal A: Zero vs. Luxury", or you can use TL's forum-wide search bar at the lop left. Match results will be in the OP of the associated topic, in spoilers.
✌
Heimatloser
Profile Joined March 2009
Germany1494 Posts
March 13 2009 19:38 GMT
#90
and the fifth is to check out the liquibets, most usefull way for me.
All what KT currently needs is a Zerg and a second Terran
errol1001
Profile Joined April 2008
454 Posts
March 14 2009 04:51 GMT
#91
Less sensationalist headlines would be nice. So people could see them, and decide - hey I haven't seen that yet, so I shouldn't read it - rather than Damn.. screwed again.
DoX.)
Profile Joined December 2008
Singapore6164 Posts
March 14 2009 10:34 GMT
#92
Nada.......T.T
RYZmooN
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Canada575 Posts
March 16 2009 21:57 GMT
#93
I hate you (T)NaDa... you killed an innocent creature just to build a factory =(
(accualy I like doing this to xD)

good write-up dude ^^ liked it

Go (Z)Luxury! Go (P)Stork!
How do u doto?
Hot_Bid
Profile Blog Joined October 2003
Braavos36374 Posts
March 16 2009 22:10 GMT
#94
On March 14 2009 13:51 errol1001 wrote:
Less sensationalist headlines would be nice. So people could see them, and decide - hey I haven't seen that yet, so I shouldn't read it - rather than Damn.. screwed again.

if you haven't seen the games by the time the newspost comes out a full week later, its your own fault. bookmark the VOD page, or go directly to nevake on youtube, but don't complain when a thread title spoils you. 48 hours is usually the grace period for spoilers, 72 at most.
@Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png
ghostWriter
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States3302 Posts
March 17 2009 03:25 GMT
#95
Game one really was a work of art. Nada's macro style, forcing Jangbi to conform to his build and pressuring him with perfect timing. That was the perfect game. It's a shame that he barely missed the proxy gateway, but I'm still rooting for him.
Sullifam
errol1001
Profile Joined April 2008
454 Posts
March 17 2009 04:57 GMT
#96
Hot Bid, this isn't a thread title. This is a front page article. It would seem reasonable to let people visit the site without being spoiled. Even thread titles are pretty bad.. 48 hours within threads? Sure, I don't care.

I really don't get this setup that deters people from visiting the site if they aren't up to date within a day or two. I enjoy the site.. but I also like to watch games in groups, and that doesn't happen within 48 hours of games airing.
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
March 17 2009 05:10 GMT
#97
On March 17 2009 13:57 errol1001 wrote:
Hot Bid, this isn't a thread title. This is a front page article. It would seem reasonable to let people visit the site without being spoiled. Even thread titles are pretty bad.. 48 hours within threads? Sure, I don't care.

I really don't get this setup that deters people from visiting the site if they aren't up to date within a day or two. I enjoy the site.. but I also like to watch games in groups, and that doesn't happen within 48 hours of games airing.


This article was posted on March 12, a full five days after the last MSL quarterfinal (fOrGG vs. Stork) on March 7. Five days!

I don't really think it's reasonable to visit a StarCraft news site five days after a major SC event and expect not to find...StarCraft news. If you're going to lag almost a week behind, it's your responsibility to avoid spoilers!
✌
errol1001
Profile Joined April 2008
454 Posts
March 17 2009 05:27 GMT
#98
Of course, there's going to be news. Obviously I do not expect what you said I expect. I expect to be able to avoid spoilers. What you're telling me is that to avoid spoilers, I need to avoid the site completely. I am unable to avoid the spoilers while visiting the site if the spoilers are all over the front page..

I don't even think of TL as a Starcraft news site.. I think of it as a Starcraft community, by starcraft fans, for starcraft fans. Who knows what people are going to visit for.

To put into perspective a bit; five days may seem like a long time, but when you can only gather to watch starcraft on weekends, it isn't. I can do a decent job of even completely avoiding the forums.. but when it comes up on the front page, I can't do anything. Planning to watch things on the weekend can result in being up to date on everything except one event, and I'd like to be around for all of those other events.

For what? The single line ' Dragons > Knights'? It was a good news article, and it would've been without that title too (the only thing about the article that spoils people just by going to TL). Are my thoughts really unreasonable?
rjagarrity
Profile Joined May 2007
Japan31 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-17 06:12:52
March 17 2009 06:11 GMT
#99
Maybe killing critters is bad juju.

[image loading]

Poll: Critters...
(Vote): Kill'em all and let Aiur sort'em out!
(Vote): Grease only the ones that get in the way.
(Vote): Kill only as many as you intend to eat.
(Vote): Catch and release.
(Vote): Leave'em be. They're pretty.
(Vote): Adopt one for a base mascot!



Auir loves Lucy...
thedeadhaji *
Profile Blog Joined January 2006
39489 Posts
March 17 2009 13:38 GMT
#100
haha I only skimmed the newspiece but loved every part I read

in particular the Stork "one upping" Jangbi + the Nada-the-critter-killer
Fx_
Profile Joined April 2008
503 Posts
March 18 2009 11:19 GMT
#101
Stork...
i never saw so worst play.......
Power is your Intelligence
Piste
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
6174 Posts
March 22 2009 08:55 GMT
#102
God damn cheeseJangbi -_-
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