Winter Warfare Mafia - Page 81

Alakaslam

United States17324 Posts

December 13 2023 15:32 GMT

#1601

Marv if you are backing off the scum read on Sandro, why keep voting him?

If you are still Scum reading him, why the recent posting feel?

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 13 2023 15:35 GMT

#1602

See post about having doubt. I can have doubt and still think he is the best lynch.

Also I am entertaining the idea he is town, even if it’s not my belief

What I do know, is that it’s infuriating when you’re town and everyone thinks you’re mafia because you can’t try to play and solve the game because no one listens to you.

So I want to extend sand the opportunity to play the game properly.

Or, to look at it another way, it could be an opportunity to bang himself/ his team further.

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 13 2023 15:36 GMT

#1603

Bang/hang.

But both work tbh

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 15:45 GMT

#1604

First post, besides my initial call out that I think is fabricated:

On December 10 2023 13:25 Trfel wrote:

Show nested quote +

I guess instead of waiting I'll let the cat out of the bag, I'm impatient.

This post seems very wishy-washy, non-committal, and pointless. The first paragraph doesn't really say anything of substance (not that it's wrong per se, just doesn't really contribute anything meaningful to the game). The second paragraph is the same way. To me, he seems to end with exactly no read (and next to no thoughts) on Alakaslam. There's even "I like the poking about smiles, but it's phrased as a question so there is avoidance as well" which seems like aggressive-but-with-a-heavy-grain-of-salt that is easy to say without actually committing to it. "Posting within what I expected" and "not leaning one way or the other based on initial posts" doesn't end up meaning much at all.

The other thing I want to note is all of the caveats and grain of salts and backtracking in sandroba's post. Not exactly sure how to phrase what I mean, but see here, in red:

Show nested quote +

He's shying away from saying something, like making a read and then backing off from it. Or giving a reason to doubt what he just said, or placing a limiter on it. For such a small post, it's riddled with it. To me, this comes across as trying to be non-committal and playing the "safe game" while making it look like you are saying things and trying to figure things out.

On December 10 2023 21:24 Trfel wrote:
After DP pressure he admits on it being fake, but says he did it to try to figure out my alignment:

Show nested quote +

I assume you are talking to me, I am having a bit of trouble understanding what you are actually getting at here though.

Yes, I think sandroba is suspicious. No, I wouldn't wager high stakes on it. He's one of the people I'm most interested in (along with Alakaslam and perhaps yourself and an off-chance of Vivax), but I'm not certain yet. I posted the way I did to try and figure out sandroba's alignment (and eventually everyone else's). Just because I'm not very confident yet doesn't mean that I can't figure things out and investigate and that sort of thing. I didn't bring any aggression, that's just me trying to ask questions and figure things out.

If there is anything you'd like me to clear up please don't hesitate to ask, I'm just having a bit of trouble understanding this post though, it feels a bit nebulous to me.

Second post:

On December 11 2023 04:49 Trfel wrote:

Show nested quote +

To be honest I think you are nitpicking a bit. Even if we say you are right and Holyflare isn't, I'm not sure what that demonstrates. It means he messed up in reading the thread maybe, I don't think it makes him mafia. I think that the overall picture of Holyflare's play is much more important.

Holyflare, thoughts on DarthPunk? I get that it's night in Australia but he still feels a bit off to me.

Compare to his comment on Vivax doing the same thing:

On December 11 2023 03:04 Trfel wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 10 2023 22:47 marvellosity wrote:

On December 10 2023 21:24 Trfel wrote:

On December 10 2023 21:16 DarthPunk wrote:
It just seems to me that you came roaring out of the gate with a huge case, based on some nitpicking really early in the thread, and you end up going nowhere on anything which is the essence of what the case you wrote on Sandro in the first place.

Now fair enough, sandroba hasn't been around so you haven't been able to pursue things further.

But your level of aggression just didn't really match with what was going on in the thread at the time, which you kind of acknowledge at the start of said post.

On December 10 2023 13:25 Trfel wrote:

On December 10 2023 12:49 sandroba wrote:
Hi everyone, excited to be playing a game after being away from Mafia for so long! I believe I have some familiarity with most if not all players on the list, although I might be very outdated in accessing their meta.

So far we have Alakaslam who I feel is posting within what I expected, not leaning one way or the other based on his initial posts. I like the poking about smiles being sus, but at the same time, it's phrased as a question so there is a bit of avoidance in there as well. Again, not very telling.

For Trfel, some might say I'm nit-picking, but I don't like the self-demeaning tone about his performance right out of the gate. Also, some generic advice and deadlines which sounds like trying to say something just to fit in. This could be understandable because we are mostly trying to generate some content at this point and get the discussion going, but this advice at this point so far away from the deadline doesn't do us much good at face value or as a conversation starter. Leaning suspicious from what I've seen so far.

I guess instead of waiting I'll let the cat out of the bag, I'm impatient.

It's almost like an apology, like what were you waiting for?

And now you are kind of backtracking, which also doesn't match with the way you lead out originally.

it's all quite jarring to me.

I assume you are talking to me, I am having a bit of trouble understanding what you are actually getting at here though.

Yes, I think sandroba is suspicious. No, I wouldn't wager high stakes on it. He's one of the people I'm most interested in (along with Alakaslam and perhaps yourself and an off-chance of Vivax, but I'm not certain yet. I posted the way I did to try and figure out sandroba's alignment (and eventually everyone else's). Just because I'm not very confident yet doesn't mean that I can't figure things out and investigate and that sort of thing. I didn't bring any aggression, that's just me trying to ask questions and figure things out.

If there is anything you'd like me to clear up please don't hesitate to ask, I'm just having a bit of trouble understanding this post though, it feels a bit nebulous to me.

Wanna tell me about this, Trfel?

Part of it is Vivax's first post (here), which we discussed briefly. I didn't like how weak his questioning to sandroba feels, Vivax recognized the issues with sandroba's post but didn't seem to want to challenge sandroba over it or actually do anything with this knowledge. The other thing was that Vivax's posts didn't seem to have any order, he pulled quotes from seemingly random points in the thread. I can't follow the thought process that leads him to bring up the things he did, and especially not in that order. This isn't necessarily mafia indicative, it just feels weird and I'm not sure what to make of it yet.

Show nested quote +

I eagerly await your report.

This post is extremelly wish-washy, contrary to all things he deems pro-town:

On December 11 2023 06:35 Trfel wrote:
I think at this point I'd be okay with lynching Koshi (if he is going to play like this), and potentially okay with lynching DarthPunk. Sandroba's recent set of posts were more interesting to me, I didn't necessarily agree with everything he was saying but it helps me to put together his mindset/approach. Holyflare's point that he's focusing on defending himself from presumed incorrect accusations instead of actually finding mafia or being productive is strong, now that he's actually shared suspicions I look forward to him coming back tomorrow. Vivax I could definitely see being mafia but I don't think I want to lynch him as much as Koshi or DarthPunk at this point.

And finally the Vivax vote justification:

On December 11 2023 16:57 Trfel wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'm asleep.

I think Vivax is the best chance at mafia. His play is very underwhelming and uninspired, in contrast to his town play where he is capable of being a very strong player. He also seems to not care about his relatively poor performance/lack of investmemt.

Sandroba and Koshi might be worth considering but I think I like lynching Vivax more by a decent margin.

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 15:48 GMT

#1605

Something interesting (imo) that we discussed in the chat was that given the DP kill, if palmar and marv are town they are as bad as I am (maybe worse?)

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 15:51 GMT

#1606

Is mafia just gaslighting me into thinking I'm bad when actually I was instinctively right on Trfel on the very first post he made?

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 15:53 GMT

#1607

Oh shit I fucked up the quote:
The second post I quoted I embeded my commentary:
"After DP pressure he admits on it being fake, but says he did it to try to figure out my alignment:"
Inside the post. Just note that it's supposed to be outside

Koshi

Belgium38797 Posts

December 13 2023 16:11 GMT

#1608

Just did ctrl+f for "DMB" & another one for "meat" in both sandroba and tfrel filters.

tfrel: 1 hit. (DMB was mentioned in a quote, 0 times mentioned by Tfrel)
Sandroba 4 hits (1 time from my DMB is mafia post, which sandroba didn't expand on, just asked why I found him mafia) the other 3:

On December 12 2023 07:23 sandroba wrote:
I feel like rayn, you and koshi are town.
Lean town on slam, palmar (move to town if vivax is scum)
Neutral on hf, chezinu, dmb
I lean scum on vivax, marv, conflicted on trfel.

On December 13 2023 07:42 sandroba wrote:
dmb also looks bad

On December 13 2023 11:56 sandroba wrote:
I think mafia is within HF Trfel Chez Marv Koshi DMB. Would leave the last 3 for last maybe?

Koshi

Belgium38797 Posts

December 13 2023 16:12 GMT

#1609

Like.... DMB is mafia... Best lynch imo.

Alakaslam

United States17324 Posts

December 13 2023 16:12 GMT

#1610

On December 14 2023 00:35 marvellosity wrote:
See post about having doubt. I can have doubt and still think he is the best lynch.

Also I am entertaining the idea he is town, even if it’s not my belief

What I do know, is that it’s infuriating when you’re town and everyone thinks you’re mafia because you can’t try to play and solve the game because no one listens to you.

So I want to extend sand the opportunity to play the game properly.

Or, to look at it another way, it could be an opportunity to hang himself/ his team further.

Ok this makes good sense.

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 16:15 GMT

#1611

On December 14 2023 01:12 Koshi wrote:
Like.... DMB is mafia... Best lynch imo.

Somewhat likely, but according to your own logic we should kill either me or trfel or both first?

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 16:16 GMT

#1612

Can you comment on the posts I quoted from Trfel?

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 13 2023 16:16 GMT

#1613

On December 14 2023 00:51 sandroba wrote:
Is mafia just gaslighting me into thinking I'm bad when actually I was instinctively right on Trfel on the very first post he made?

Maybe :/

Holyflare

United Kingdom30774 Posts

December 13 2023 16:21 GMT

#1614

+ Show Spoiler +

// ==UserScript==
// @name         Copy post number with URL in URL block
// @namespace    [url=http://tampermonkey.net/]http://tampermonkey.net/[/url]
// @version      2023-12-13
// @description  Copies TL.Net forum post URLs on click of post nunber for easy referencing
// @author       Holyflare
// @match        [url=https://tl.net/forum/*]https://tl.net/forum/*[/url]
// @icon         [url=https://www.google.com/s2/favicons?sz=64&domain=mozilla.org]https://www.google.com/s2/favicons?sz=64&domain=mozilla.org[/url]
// @grant        none
// ==/UserScript==

(function() {
    'use strict';

    var messages = document.querySelectorAll(".fpost-postinfo");
    for (var i = 0; i < messages.length; i++) {

        const msgNumberNode = messages[i].getElementsByTagName("div")[0];
        const url = messages[i].getElementsByTagName("a")[0].getAttribute("href");

        msgNumberNode.addEventListener("click", function() {
            navigator.clipboard.writeText(`[url=${"https://www.tl.net" + url}]${msgNumberNode.innerText}[/url]`);
            console.log("Copied to clipboard");
        });
    }
})();

If anyone wants a nifty little script I just wrote this that you can use with something like greasemonkey/tampermonkey to click a post number and it auto copies the url and post number in a url block like #258 for example.

Holyflare

United Kingdom30774 Posts

December 13 2023 16:28 GMT

#1615

uhh might have to remove the www. from the navigator line actually so it's:

+ Show Spoiler +

navigator.clipboard.writeText(`[url=${"https://tl.net" + url}]${msgNumberNode.innerText}[/url]`);

other than that, decent

Koshi

Belgium38797 Posts

December 13 2023 16:28 GMT

#1616

On December 14 2023 01:15 sandroba wrote:

Show nested quote +

Somewhat likely, but according to your own logic we should kill either me or trfel or both first?

Bwaa. Simply isnt normal that nobody talks about her. In theory one of you could be town and ignoring her. Both? Unlikely due to PoE but if you are both town then she is it at the minimum really flying under the radar. And protected by higher powers. (For example Palmar)

Koshi

Belgium38797 Posts

December 13 2023 16:31 GMT

#1617

On December 14 2023 01:16 sandroba wrote:
Can you comment on the posts I quoted from Trfel?

I dont understand the case in it.

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 16:43 GMT

#1618

Going through and reading dmb filter, lost of complaining, apologizing for being inactive in the beginning. Don't have any prior experience with them as a player, but would tend to see this as biased towards mafia behavior. Never really comments on the interaction that happened between me and trfel that dominated the initial part of the game. The one mention of Trfel kinda assumes he is mafia and tries to softly throw some shade on Koshi for defending him:

On December 11 2023 10:10 die_meatbaby wrote:

Show nested quote +

sorry getting active now. The thing is i don´t like how Koshi is just like 100% sure that Trfel is Town and just almost every post from him is like trying to save him. But also if Koshi is mafia he wouldn´t be that activ.

On December 11 2023 11:26 die_meatbaby wrote:

Show nested quote +

Just to make this clear my decision to vote for Vivax is based on my own analysis and not because your ego convinced me to vote who ever you think is scum. And yes your filter looks good but you still not town for me and I will read and analysis every post you will make until you lose a bit of this self believing god player stuff here.

This post sounds a bit fake to me, especially the part where it says "yes your filter looks good but..."

Don't like this post here either:

On December 12 2023 10:57 die_meatbaby wrote:

Show nested quote +

okey i love a chez lynch before he starts to meme up the thread and confuse me or creep me out with his strange post, but why is he scumy for you he was not posting much here. How can we read him? I can not soul read him as i do often in here espescially with players I already played. Feeling like gambling to vote on him and even if he flips red I can not see who would be with him. I am still sure he is not human. He is AI player which Grack is puting in the game for his on satisfaction to see us or def. me struggling to not. But I am open for an Chez lynch just not looking so scumy as V

sandroba

Canada4998 Posts

December 13 2023 16:45 GMT

#1619

Fuck Koshi, I think you are right, but it would be even more solid if Trfel is scum too.

Holyflare

United Kingdom30774 Posts

December 13 2023 16:46 GMT

#1620

I think I agree with the sandro points about trfel's treatment of vivax/me being weird so maybe I kinda understand where he's coming from here. Although, I'd like to suggest he read what I said about Trfel's post before he pokes it further.

I think it's just simply that trfel wanted to add more words to his posts about vivax. In 2 or 3 of the posts his takes on vivax are almost meaningless words framed as something that could be construed as scummy. Vivax posted in a non-chronological order (which turned out to not be true) and vivax looks like he's caught up with the thread but going back to old posts (so what?). None of these things make sense to harp on and are just vaguely thrown around to look like trfel is pondering something imo.

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