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On May 25 2019 23:05 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:01 wherebugsgo wrote:
VE if you want me to detunnel you have to provide me alternative scumreads. I'm perfectly fine with an iGrok lynch. I disagree that the case on him is as cut and dry and Holyflare makes it, but I think it's a good enough shot for today. You want me to be certain. I can't indulge you and I'm not going to lie to you. I also have a mild scumread on Calix still, if you're reading my posts you saw me disagree with the case on her that rayn put forward, but I read her mafia independently. I'm unsure on a third because there are now 3 PR claims and those will solve themselves I hope, GIVING us the third maybe.
Which parts of Holyflare's case do you disagree with? Because I agree with you on this sentiment.
What do you read Calix as mafia for? Can you point it out to me like I'm an idiot? Cause I read her townier than basically anyone except Jock, conversion, and HF. And in fact I've swapped HF and Calix multiple times and had her above HF for quite a while just on the basis of her nerves of iron steel. Well that and her pretty good reads, question and answer followups and general feeling that she's trying to figure out the game and genuinely frustrated that she has to deal with Koshi rayn etc. and the fact that she dreads having to read 80 pages of one liners.
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On May 25 2019 23:10 wherebugsgo wrote:
anyway HF I understand you're still frustrated because you're really confused on what I'm doing.
Trust me, I'm not trying to frustrate you on purpose. I'm not scum here. I will agree with you 100% that I probably am tunneled. However, you and I both know that we have different methods and we disagree on them. I have moved in your direction since I watched your play unfold last game. I don't think I'm a complete moron; I very well could be given how many times I've been called that (rightly so) for lynching townies.
In my defense, though, remember that I townread Pandain in light of rayn flipping town and calling Pandain mafia, and that I townread both BC and VE after fairly minimal interactions. It actually took me a lot longer for me to come to a very solid conclusion on both players this game and I credit that to mafia playing very very well in this game.
Like really, I am in some sort of zen mode right now because I spent time reflecting on my chats with Foolishness a lot and channeled House Chezinu and now I feel like the game is just unfolding before my eyes. Anyway I'm going to sound like a complete moron if I end up being dead wrong and I accept complete responsibility for that if that's the case.
I am super happy with the play of every player in this game because no matter who is scum and who is town, I think everyone played to their win conditions. And actually I think the major shitfests were scum-started so I don't even really feel bad about that now either.
Also VE I totally still love you and I hope you will forgive me horribly for the sins I have caused if my read is wrong on you. I swear, if I am wrong on you I actually don't know how I will be able to apologize because there is just so much stuff that I cannot bring myself to ignore and I respect your play a lot. Like truly, a lot. You nailed Koshi last game, you shot him in the dick bro. Me calling you scum here and not a pants-on-head idiot town is honestly the highest compliment I can give you for turning the beautiful garden roses and twinkling fairies of a town from last game into the raging breakneck 200 mph one liner troll fest that this one was.
There's a reason I'm so good as scum. It's because my play lacks consistency. You're witnessing that right now. I believe in you. You can get past it. You can do it Bugs.
I had a pregame excuse. I said "I have no strong feelings one way or the other"
I'm not going to lie and say I was going to play this game intentionally differently, but it turns out that due to the player list and circumstances, the difference between this game and last game actually did end up being "I have no strong feelings one way or the other" which, for those of you keeping track at home and in the ObsQT, is THREE prescient things VisceraEyes has said this game. I had a hard time developing reads yesterday and it shows in my play. I didn't have a hard time forming TOWNREADS, only MAFIA READS, which are the important kind when deciding on who to consolidate on.
So no, given that you're being reasonable now, I'm not going to just let you go with "Sry bro I can't" because I know you can. You proved it last game. You can. Plz do.
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On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion?
basically confirmed town
read for yourself:
On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together.
I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town.
Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum.
As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts.
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On May 25 2019 23:15 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:10 wherebugsgo wrote:
anyway HF I understand you're still frustrated because you're really confused on what I'm doing.
Trust me, I'm not trying to frustrate you on purpose. I'm not scum here. I will agree with you 100% that I probably am tunneled. However, you and I both know that we have different methods and we disagree on them. I have moved in your direction since I watched your play unfold last game. I don't think I'm a complete moron; I very well could be given how many times I've been called that (rightly so) for lynching townies.
In my defense, though, remember that I townread Pandain in light of rayn flipping town and calling Pandain mafia, and that I townread both BC and VE after fairly minimal interactions. It actually took me a lot longer for me to come to a very solid conclusion on both players this game and I credit that to mafia playing very very well in this game.
Like really, I am in some sort of zen mode right now because I spent time reflecting on my chats with Foolishness a lot and channeled House Chezinu and now I feel like the game is just unfolding before my eyes. Anyway I'm going to sound like a complete moron if I end up being dead wrong and I accept complete responsibility for that if that's the case.
I am super happy with the play of every player in this game because no matter who is scum and who is town, I think everyone played to their win conditions. And actually I think the major shitfests were scum-started so I don't even really feel bad about that now either.
Also VE I totally still love you and I hope you will forgive me horribly for the sins I have caused if my read is wrong on you. I swear, if I am wrong on you I actually don't know how I will be able to apologize because there is just so much stuff that I cannot bring myself to ignore and I respect your play a lot. Like truly, a lot. You nailed Koshi last game, you shot him in the dick bro. Me calling you scum here and not a pants-on-head idiot town is honestly the highest compliment I can give you for turning the beautiful garden roses and twinkling fairies of a town from last game into the raging breakneck 200 mph one liner troll fest that this one was. There's a reason I'm so good as scum. It's because my play lacks consistency. You're witnessing that right now. I believe in you. You can get past it. You can do it Bugs. I had a pregame excuse. I said "I have no strong feelings one way or the other" I'm not going to lie and say I was going to play this game intentionally differently, but it turns out that due to the player list and circumstances, the difference between this game and last game actually did end up being "I have no strong feelings one way or the other" which, for those of you keeping track at home and in the ObsQT, is THREE prescient things VisceraEyes has said this game. I had a hard time developing reads yesterday and it shows in my play. I didn't have a hard time forming TOWNREADS, only MAFIA READS, which are the important kind when deciding on who to consolidate on. So no, given that you're being reasonable now, I'm not going to just let you go with "Sry bro I can't" because I know you can. You proved it last game. You can. Plz do.
Yeah honestly the thing that made me waver so hard on BC this game was that he seemed to agree with me that your tone is different, voted you, and then slinked off and disagreed with me a lot about you. You think he's fucking us? It'd be in his wheelhouse.
But you know whatever. I can do this.
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On May 25 2019 23:15 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:05 VisceraEyes wrote:On May 25 2019 23:01 wherebugsgo wrote:
VE if you want me to detunnel you have to provide me alternative scumreads. I'm perfectly fine with an iGrok lynch. I disagree that the case on him is as cut and dry and Holyflare makes it, but I think it's a good enough shot for today. You want me to be certain. I can't indulge you and I'm not going to lie to you. I also have a mild scumread on Calix still, if you're reading my posts you saw me disagree with the case on her that rayn put forward, but I read her mafia independently. I'm unsure on a third because there are now 3 PR claims and those will solve themselves I hope, GIVING us the third maybe. Which parts of Holyflare's case do you disagree with? Because I agree with you on this sentiment. What do you read Calix as mafia for? Can you point it out to me like I'm an idiot? Cause I read her townier than basically anyone except Jock, conversion, and HF. And in fact I've swapped HF and Calix multiple times and had her above HF for quite a while just on the basis of her nerves of iron steel. Well that and her pretty good reads, question and answer followups and general feeling that she's trying to figure out the game and genuinely frustrated that she has to deal with Koshi rayn etc. and the fact that she dreads having to read 80 pages of one liners.
Re: iGrok - Mostly that the coloration of the reads and their timings mean so much. It's not so much that I disagree with parts of the case, mostly with how strongly HF feels they MAKE iGrok mafia. Like, I think the strongest point is the skipping over Calix EoD, being the actual thread action portion of the affair. But I don't like, disagree with his conclusions. It's a matter of scale.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
When iGrok returns, since he is ignoring me can you please make him clarify the following:
+ Show Spoiler + This is his posted read list a while ago when responding to me. It shows VE as red coloured for points up to when he posted it. That's 2 red coloured things on his list and 2 (cut off when he showed the later one) green posts (that aren't actually related to what VE has said, just meta so don't actually know why they are coloured green).
This is his post after with VE not coloured green or red or anything, just white + Show Spoiler +
As you can see, literally nothing has changed other than the cropping but his name has changed colour. He also clarifies the following:
On May 25 2019 03:23 iGrok wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 03:18 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because his hidden points are no longer hidden? 2 of them were townie? Oh no, hidden stuff is still hidden. So you have 2 more points. in green. Basically my read on you has never been certain.
So, he's got 2 hidden reads in green (why are there even hidden ones if he was never showing this to begin with who the fuck knows?) but this doesn't correlate with what he's said here:
On May 21 2019 16:58 iGrok wrote:
alright guys its 1am and I have to be up at 5am for another all-day class. I'll be back before the vote, catch up, give my thoughts, and vote. next day cycle won't be like this, class finishes friday.
And I guess I shouldn't really say class, its a programming seminar thats 12 hours/day.
Go catch some scum for me lol. Most of my reads are there.
Some hidden thought counts for future use:
BC:1
WBG:2
HF:2
VE:4
Rux:1
Actually, I'll go ahead and open the rux thought up. Someone should review post #682. I honestly dont even remember what it was and I'm about to pass out, but I made a note to review it.
There are 4 hidden points for VE.
Can you please make him clarify when these "hidden points" occurred. It makes a big big lot of difference based on the colouring times.
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On May 25 2019 23:18 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion? basically confirmed town read for yourself: Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together. I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town. Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum. As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts.
That's fair. I remember him getting into a bunch of swears earlier and FF had to come in. Dick move analysis does suggest he's town.
On May 24 2019 23:47 Holyflare wrote:
[...] (post on people's reasons for not voting iGrok) Honestly, they all look pretty bad. The caveat is that I don't think Conversion would be mafia with igrok arguing about logic together like that. VE is super non-committal to igrok, BC defends igrok in a really bad way, Koshi I could actually see be town but it's weird igrok town reads him when he scum reads me for changing my reads. Rayn is... absent and needs to start taking stances.
Also a good point so I guess it's irrelevant until iGrok flips.
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On May 25 2019 23:23 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:18 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion? basically confirmed town read for yourself: On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together. I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town. Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum. As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts. That's fair. I remember him getting into a bunch of swears earlier and FF had to come in. Dick move analysis does suggest he's town. Show nested quote +On May 24 2019 23:47 Holyflare wrote:
[...] (post on people's reasons for not voting iGrok) Honestly, they all look pretty bad. The caveat is that I don't think Conversion would be mafia with igrok arguing about logic together like that. VE is super non-committal to igrok, BC defends igrok in a really bad way, Koshi I could actually see be town but it's weird igrok town reads him when he scum reads me for changing my reads. Rayn is... absent and needs to start taking stances. Also a good point so I guess it's irrelevant until iGrok flips.
nah I think you misread some of that interaction. You should go back and reread the dick move thing cause I am fully team conversion there
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On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Oh Disfo you too please.
from the top of my head:
his readprogression on me sounded very natural.
think i liked a bunch of his posts n1/d2. esp. tone wise.
some ppl pointed out his eod1 to be questionable and hf pointed out an issue in conv's read progression yesterday that i also would call bad.
overall without going diving i think id still say more likely to be town.
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On May 25 2019 23:25 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:23 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 25 2019 23:18 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion? basically confirmed town read for yourself: On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together. I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town. Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum. As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts. That's fair. I remember him getting into a bunch of swears earlier and FF had to come in. Dick move analysis does suggest he's town. On May 24 2019 23:47 Holyflare wrote:
[...] (post on people's reasons for not voting iGrok) Honestly, they all look pretty bad. The caveat is that I don't think Conversion would be mafia with igrok arguing about logic together like that. VE is super non-committal to igrok, BC defends igrok in a really bad way, Koshi I could actually see be town but it's weird igrok town reads him when he scum reads me for changing my reads. Rayn is... absent and needs to start taking stances. Also a good point so I guess it's irrelevant until iGrok flips. nah I think you misread some of that interaction. You should go back and reread the dick move thing cause I am fully team conversion there
Don't give me more homework dad, I'm already swamped.
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On May 25 2019 23:23 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:15 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:05 VisceraEyes wrote:On May 25 2019 23:01 wherebugsgo wrote:
VE if you want me to detunnel you have to provide me alternative scumreads. I'm perfectly fine with an iGrok lynch. I disagree that the case on him is as cut and dry and Holyflare makes it, but I think it's a good enough shot for today. You want me to be certain. I can't indulge you and I'm not going to lie to you. I also have a mild scumread on Calix still, if you're reading my posts you saw me disagree with the case on her that rayn put forward, but I read her mafia independently. I'm unsure on a third because there are now 3 PR claims and those will solve themselves I hope, GIVING us the third maybe. Which parts of Holyflare's case do you disagree with? Because I agree with you on this sentiment. What do you read Calix as mafia for? Can you point it out to me like I'm an idiot? Cause I read her townier than basically anyone except Jock, conversion, and HF. And in fact I've swapped HF and Calix multiple times and had her above HF for quite a while just on the basis of her nerves of iron steel. Well that and her pretty good reads, question and answer followups and general feeling that she's trying to figure out the game and genuinely frustrated that she has to deal with Koshi rayn etc. and the fact that she dreads having to read 80 pages of one liners. Re: iGrok - Mostly that the coloration of the reads and their timings mean so much. It's not so much that I disagree with parts of the case, mostly with how strongly HF feels they MAKE iGrok mafia. Like, I think the strongest point is the skipping over Calix EoD, being the actual thread action portion of the affair. But I don't like, disagree with his conclusions. It's a matter of scale.
what things are stretches in your mind?
And what do you make of iGrok hard town-reading conversion for the same post I pointed out? You know the one I'm talking about?
Like if you ignored HF's case entirely what would be your read on iGrok?
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Gimme a sec Holyflare i need to go to the store real quick first, i will answer your iGrok case right after, since i think you at least deserve an answer whther or not you like the answer.
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On May 25 2019 23:25 disformation wrote:from the top of my head: his readprogression on me sounded very natural. think i liked a bunch of his posts n1/d2. esp. tone wise. some ppl pointed out his eod1 to be questionable and hf pointed out an issue in conv's read progression yesterday that i also would call bad. overall without going diving i think id still say more likely to be town.
hmmm actualy not 100% sure.
would say looks better than grok/art/bc.
but imo calix looks better.
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re: Calix Rayn's case is based on meta, afaict it's based on a game he and holyflare were in with her that should make her doubt her ability to read rayn/HF and one of her first reads was a hard read of both he and HF. Like HF, I disagree with the SCALE of this accusation, fmp it looks like she CAN arrive at that level of certainty, but I don't KNOW that and it COULD be mafia that she's reading rayn/HF that strongly that early. IDK. But fmp she comes in at convenient times to shade convenient people, all while both being indignant when people doubt her ability AND acting like people shouldn't listen to her because she doesn't know meta, or is confused, or the thread is too long etc etc etc
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On May 25 2019 23:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:25 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:23 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 25 2019 23:18 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion? basically confirmed town read for yourself: On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together. I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town. Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum. As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts. That's fair. I remember him getting into a bunch of swears earlier and FF had to come in. Dick move analysis does suggest he's town. On May 24 2019 23:47 Holyflare wrote:
[...] (post on people's reasons for not voting iGrok) Honestly, they all look pretty bad. The caveat is that I don't think Conversion would be mafia with igrok arguing about logic together like that. VE is super non-committal to igrok, BC defends igrok in a really bad way, Koshi I could actually see be town but it's weird igrok town reads him when he scum reads me for changing my reads. Rayn is... absent and needs to start taking stances. Also a good point so I guess it's irrelevant until iGrok flips. nah I think you misread some of that interaction. You should go back and reread the dick move thing cause I am fully team conversion there Don't give me more homework dad, I'm already swamped.
Also I think you misunderstood me. I'm saying that from recollection the way Conversion replied to pressure from Jock was so toxic that I don't think he'd do it as scum.
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VE, could you still give me your take on Conversion?
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On May 25 2019 23:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:25 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:23 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 25 2019 23:18 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
VE, WBG, can you give me your thoughts on Conversion? basically confirmed town read for yourself: On May 23 2019 22:24 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 22:15 Conversion wrote:On May 23 2019 21:00 Holyflare wrote:On May 23 2019 18:49 Koshi wrote:
Can somebody explain to me why the thread now thibks conversion is mafia? I saw rayn put it in the thread and after that he dropped on both HF and VE townlist by more than he should. I don't think he's dropped through actions really, just by poe and the fact I've not entirely liked what he's been up to. He has no focus on me which is something I think he'd be doing as town (afraid as mafia maybe? Bit of a stretch) and he's kind of in a weird tangential place not playing the same game as other people. I'm just gonna address this here and now, whether that's for you or anyone else: I am ignoring everyone that doesn't do anything memorable to me, and I'm spending like the maximum that I can on this game without going insane, because in the past when I tried my hardest I'd just get flamed and that usually devolved into shitfights with people. It almost happened with Jock this game (sorry for being a flamer Jock!). also doesn't help that when I case something people barely have opinions on it and don't engage me. They just tell me I'm doing well, or that I'm wrong, and that's it. I'm not going to flame people to get my opinions heard, and if people aren't going to engage me on shit (especially when I thought I made two good cases and there was like 3 responses to it), it just demotivates me from my game. In fact, the only one who really engaged me this entire game are like Bugs, Calix, and Jock-- which is why I'm inclined to believe they are town rather than every one speaking around me like I don't exist tl;dr I don't want to play like I normally do (flaming everyone that scumreads me, flaming my scumreads, modkilling myself because I'm pissed off), but damn is it demotivating to have people just speak around you alright, I couldn't resist, I pronounce to you all, my first read of today. I basically consider you confirmed town for this post. I mean, I already invited you to my circle so it can't get much better than this. If you have any questions for me, I'll play with you. Also, I want you to read tl.net and let me know your thoughts on that little game. You won't get anything from me for playing or even winning, unfortunately, because you've already won in my book, but maybe you'll get something for yourself. You mentioned memorability. I agree, memorability is good. Whose takes have not been memorable? I think I know, and I think you know as well. If knowledge aligns, then we're probably not wrong together. I think you should relate a lot to that if you're town. Also conversion dropped like two giant meta cases and was willing to go meta ruxxar (and not just trust me on my word for it) so just on sheer effort to figure out the game (given his limited time) I don't read him as scum. As an aside, IIRC iGrok noticed this same post as me and also confirmed conversion. Not sure why scum would do that and eliminate a possible mislynch (look at what rayn is saying about conversion) and it's a bit of why I'm townier on iGrok after reading his image posts. That's fair. I remember him getting into a bunch of swears earlier and FF had to come in. Dick move analysis does suggest he's town. On May 24 2019 23:47 Holyflare wrote:
[...] (post on people's reasons for not voting iGrok) Honestly, they all look pretty bad. The caveat is that I don't think Conversion would be mafia with igrok arguing about logic together like that. VE is super non-committal to igrok, BC defends igrok in a really bad way, Koshi I could actually see be town but it's weird igrok town reads him when he scum reads me for changing my reads. Rayn is... absent and needs to start taking stances. Also a good point so I guess it's irrelevant until iGrok flips. nah I think you misread some of that interaction. You should go back and reread the dick move thing cause I am fully team conversion there Don't give me more homework dad, I'm already swamped.
okie just trust my word on conversion. Feel free to trust me on Jock, conversion, Calix, HF. I mean, if you're not sure after I've said things and think I'm wrong + Show Spoiler +or if you don't believe I'd cut my dick off for my townreads this game
I townread BC but he also needs to pull his own weight though so if you can encourage him to followup with me that would be great. Same posts you followed up on with me. Kthxbai
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On May 25 2019 23:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Gimme a sec Holyflare i need to go to the store real quick first, i will answer your iGrok case right after, since i think you at least deserve an answer whther or not you like the answer.
oooohhhh he's about to poo poo you HF
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
On May 25 2019 23:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Gimme a sec Holyflare i need to go to the store real quick first, i will answer your iGrok case right after, since i think you at least deserve an answer whther or not you like the answer.
Ignore the read colouring part, that's subpar compared to the actual case.
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On May 25 2019 23:27 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 23:23 VisceraEyes wrote:On May 25 2019 23:15 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 25 2019 23:05 VisceraEyes wrote:On May 25 2019 23:01 wherebugsgo wrote:
VE if you want me to detunnel you have to provide me alternative scumreads. I'm perfectly fine with an iGrok lynch. I disagree that the case on him is as cut and dry and Holyflare makes it, but I think it's a good enough shot for today. You want me to be certain. I can't indulge you and I'm not going to lie to you. I also have a mild scumread on Calix still, if you're reading my posts you saw me disagree with the case on her that rayn put forward, but I read her mafia independently. I'm unsure on a third because there are now 3 PR claims and those will solve themselves I hope, GIVING us the third maybe. Which parts of Holyflare's case do you disagree with? Because I agree with you on this sentiment. What do you read Calix as mafia for? Can you point it out to me like I'm an idiot? Cause I read her townier than basically anyone except Jock, conversion, and HF. And in fact I've swapped HF and Calix multiple times and had her above HF for quite a while just on the basis of her nerves of iron steel. Well that and her pretty good reads, question and answer followups and general feeling that she's trying to figure out the game and genuinely frustrated that she has to deal with Koshi rayn etc. and the fact that she dreads having to read 80 pages of one liners. Re: iGrok - Mostly that the coloration of the reads and their timings mean so much. It's not so much that I disagree with parts of the case, mostly with how strongly HF feels they MAKE iGrok mafia. Like, I think the strongest point is the skipping over Calix EoD, being the actual thread action portion of the affair. But I don't like, disagree with his conclusions. It's a matter of scale. 1)what things are stretches in your mind? 2)And what do you make of iGrok hard town-reading conversion for the same post I pointed out? You know the one I'm talking about? 3)Like if you ignored HF's case entirely what would be your read on iGrok?
1) Like I said, colorations and timings of the colorations seem to be a strong indicator to HF, not so much to me. He also, like you, does a bit of narrative building to explain some of his posts which I don't find particularly convincing.
2) Let me go look at it. I think I know which (because I am reading  )
3) Bad question. Scum based on activity For real though, he comes in and cries about the thread length and then barely contributes before pissing off again, it all feels bad and has all game. I'd be maf on him outside HF's case.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/zCs9KrG.png)
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