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[N] Uninspired Mafia - Page 3
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
On May 02 2019 10:28 wherebugsgo wrote: actually nah Pandain is not scum HF's case is pretty trash And why is that? | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30775 Posts
On May 02 2019 18:23 wherebugsgo wrote: I don't claim to be some sort of Pandain whisperer, but here's my top 3 clickbait list: 1. Pandain's behaviour is different enough between alignments to be noticeable, at least after reading 3-4 games. As town, Pandain seems to be trying to figure things out, and tends to use a lot of conditional language/hedging. Here are a couple examples, which ones are town and which are mafia? Example 1: + Show Spoiler + On October 28 2013 08:46 Pandain wrote: There's too much scum for me to ignore in Rayn. I'll clarify my case. I agree my case on Rayn isn't that convincg. It's based on a whole bunch of small tells. However, given the information we have now he is objectively the most scummy of everyone. WoS you think I might be scum because my reasons are crap, but okay then I guess I'm crap. Let me know why revealing a role to a person who's alignment isn't certain is town or comes from a blue role. I don't think my arguments are weak, they're non-conclusive at best but it's ultimately a matter of debate. I also think you don't like me for some reason, so I hope we can get that behind me. Or if you think I'm bad just address the arguments rather then the person. Sentinel, it's not set in stone but its at least semi-serious. Answer: + Show Spoiler + town Example 2: + Show Spoiler + On November 15 2013 09:52 Pandain wrote: Why do you think he's town so far? I don't think effort is the town indicator you think it is, unless you're looking at something else which of course I may have missed. I don't like this by the way. I totally agree that the best canidate, in yamato's terms but it makes sense anyway, is to vote someone who wants to lynch a scum who you believe is scum. That will make my best vote, but it's not indicative. So right now, if I wasn't voting kush, I would be voting someone who is a good anazlyer probably VE because I think he's alright in the long term and is also town. Even if your town, we're not just trying to vote someone who is town. We want to vote a good analyzer because they get two votes each day. Answer: + Show Spoiler + town Example 3: + Show Spoiler + On March 12 2019 04:59 Pandain wrote: Fuck busy again tonight. Can't do a last post but if I die slam and onegu need to be next lynches. Grack I saw your post but meta tells like that are shit compared to actual analyses. Any good player can change their meta, and honestly people can't read meta for shit. Slam has two huge scum tells. He voted for HF and then later pushed HF for lynching palmar(extremely hypocritical and makes sense from mafia perspective). And he also, despite being very active most times, was completely "gone" during the sentinel lynch, and "convienantly" just showed up five minutes after. Yeah right. Lynch this guy. Onegu has just been scummy this whole game, pushing me for absolutely no reason (like actually none. His reason was because of a misunderstanding of acros role later shown to he false. But onegu never backtracked. And he too convienantly afked during sentinel lynch. Also I can't do analysis because g2g but his whole filter is pretty bad. If ace ever lives past night 4 he's 100% scum. Acro is town I think. Don't agree with aces analysis at all. It's not anti town mechanic because he wasn't forced to shoot anyone. Answer: + Show Spoiler + mafia I tried seeing if there is any language Pandain uses differently based on alignment, and you can try searching "think" or "don't think" in filters; I think as scum P uses words like "think" and "don't think" less often than as town but it's certainly not conclusive. Here are some numbers: + Show Spoiler + Thug life: 23 pages mafia - 1.13 don't think per page 21 don't think total 169 think 7.34 per page noir 19 pages mafia 0.78 per page 15 don't think 181 think 9.5 per page end of the world 9 pages mafia 1 per page don't think 57 think 6.3 per page time to die 30 pages town 1.35 per page 40 don't think 280 think 9.33 per page ##mafia 15 pages town 1.7 per page 26 don't think 159 think 10.6 per page 2. P's reads tend to be more consistent as scum and this matches what I'd expect of scum in general being unwilling to change reads. I think townies try to figure out the game rather than just lining up people to kill. I wouldn't expect scum P to just immediately backtrack and put me in a list of potential scum after calling me the towniest person in the game on the same day: 3. P was trying to consolidate people to kill Vivax at EoD. This shows initiative and is quite a risk as scum I think-why not just sit back and watch Jock die/what purpose does it accomplish? I tend to believe that scum will look to see if there is support before trying something like that, and actually I've seen that in Pandain's past games as well: In that game Pandain voted MZ, but then got off MZ when there wasn't any traction and moved to Onegu (following a vote by MZ on Onegu as well, making it clearer that there was traction on Onegu). In general Pandain's vote movements were minimal even with townies getting lynched. Here Pandain was happy to move around the vote and try and get a different person lynched even last minute, regardless of support existing. Ok, you're almost definitely mafia then. Not only did you call my CASE trash, which you haven't talked about once in this entire wall of Pandain defence but you quite conveniently also highlight points I was making in it too. Point 1. Pointless meta defence based on language he may or may not use. Point 2. He's more consistent as mafia? That's literally the point I'm saying, he's not consistent, his accusations don't align with his posts and furthermore he was hesitant at every point to lynch his mafia read and even tried to vreate shenanigans away from it but then attack everyone on it afterwards. Point 3. I do not believe for one second you went back through all of his town games and found a specific moment where he did some kind of shenanigan or whatever it is you're trying to prove. This looks almost definitively like you have cherry picked something that fits your narrative because you either have insider information on Pandain's alignment or you're trying to cover for him. Something, I might add, that he absolutely does not need. None of this addresses the case, one of these proves the case has credibility, at least from your perspective and narrative and the other is inadmissible. You maf. | ||
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Holyflare
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On May 02 2019 18:32 wherebugsgo wrote: HF do you think any of MZ, Vivax, or BC are scum? What a pointless trivial question which I've addressed already. Mz has posted shit all, could be anything. Vivax has done nothing to sway me one way or the other and didn't post anything I hated yet. BC has only made posts I've agreed with. Rayn I can't believe you fell for my posts last night. Reread them as if I'm talking about actual insects :D I will lynch bugs with you. | ||
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Holyflare
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Holyflare
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My reads being awful is not going to convince anyone of anything to do with my alignment. If you would actually spend the time attacking your mafia reads as much as you did defending your town reads with narratives and figures maybe you'd figure that out. | ||
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Holyflare
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Pointless already answered questions. Calling cases bad but then not addressing the case and instead writing walls of text on defending a town read Pandain instead. Even with Jock it was asking about reading the guide and then complaining about the Jock meta being wrong after the fact. | ||
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Holyflare
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Based on bugs defence of pandain tempted to take pandain out but we'll see. Koshi hit or miss kinda like what he posted but I trained him as mafia well and he's a complete non entity. | ||
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Holyflare
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Interestingly ff left pandain out of his read list. | ||
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Holyflare
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On May 02 2019 03:18 Pandain wrote: I mean he could be town perhaps even likely. Im not even voting him. But it's day 1 so do what you do That looks like a town read to me, not even a hedge. | ||
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Holyflare
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On May 02 2019 19:07 wherebugsgo wrote: are you serious I've avoided confronting you because I didn't want to pollute the thread, but if you're town, you need to be told this as honestly you're so arrogant, ESPECIALLY when you're wrong. I pointed out that I disagreed with your meta case on Jock right at the beginning and you chose to tell me I don't know how to read. I responded reasonably and instead of entertaining the thought that you could be wrong, you decided to make the environment completely hostile. Now you call me scum because I disagree with you and provide reasons for my town reads. Literally the only acceptable reason for you to play like this is if you are scum. I stand by the comment that you were unable to see the differences, it's laughable since you've spent more time defending pandain in the same way I attacked jock than even checking up on Jock. The meta was not wrong in the slightest, he played differently to both his previous games. I just attributed that to being mafia. It was wrong, big deal. Similarly, you've just done the EXACT same defending Pandain. I don't agree with it, in fact it looks like a scummy narrative. I think you're mafia for it because you've spent more time doing that than responding to the actual case in the first place. You then asked me a pointless question about 3 people I've largely already even talked about, which shows you just didn't care about reading me. You simultaneously say I'm going to ruin the game because if I die people will sheep me but also call me mafia. But then attack me in a way that only makes sense if you know I'm town. It's my literal job as mafia to shit up a thread and make it hostile and out talk people but at every step it's the old fake hedge from you. | ||
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Holyflare
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On May 02 2019 19:37 wherebugsgo wrote: Rayn is this scum HF being fake aggressive or town HF who thinks he's posted something but actually hasn't? I ask him about MZ, Vivax, and BC. 1. Up until this post, MZ is not at all mentioned in HF's filter. Here, HF doesn't take a stance. 2. HF did say the same thing about Vivax earlier, so sure, fine. But again, no stance. 3. "BC only made posts I've agreed with" no direct interaction besides that first weird mistake post HF had, we can come to this conclusion I suppose based on the fact that BC and HF both voted Jock but why should vote alignment matter in reading BC? So why does HF say this is a pointless question when the only thing that HF actually said was #2? 1. What has mz done since that required me to take a stance on him? Like I said, he's done shit all. Also I quite categorically do mention him in my filter. I ask him when he's going to stop fannying around not voting Jock, which now Jock has flipped town makes him look more suspicious. Regardless, I don't have enough information because he just hasn't posted enough. If anyone says they can form an opinion on him they're either lying or wrong. 2. Yup. 3. What has BC posted since that would make me change my mind? If you think it's anything to do with voting alignment or whatever nonsense then ok but it's clearly not and I've highlighted that in my post. If someone says stuff I am thinking before I've posted it when reading the thread there's a strong chance we're on the same wavelength and are the samw alignment. That's a pretty basic tenet of mafia. Either way, you've only just now blatantly gone through my filter to check these things and then point it out after the fact. You've asked me the question before you even knew whether I had answered them. So this question WAS largely pointless because: A) you didn't know if I had already talked about them B) you didn't actually care about the response because you've gained nothing from it other than showing your true colours | ||
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Holyflare
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Yes, I do filter people before I ask them questions because otherwise it is pointless. | ||
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Holyflare
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Holyflare
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Holyflare
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Holyflare
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With regards to the people I actually push, the ones that now actually matter (you and pandain) I have posted my thoughts quite well and elaborated. Pretty obvious. I don't go into your filter where you pick out the list of like 3-4 people you said contains mafia and say omg unexplained reads no way do I? Pretty petty if you ask me. | ||
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Holyflare
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Literally in the next post On May 02 2019 18:58 Holyflare wrote: And all those shitty afkers and ff I guess but pointless trying to include those shitters yet. Interestingly ff left pandain out of his read list. | ||
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Holyflare
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I'm extremely hopeful that other people will see how obviously mafia you are and sheep me after your petty attacks. | ||
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