EPTShooting down the goon isn't that good, you lose one voter and you lose a person that could influence the thread
[M][T] 1-Day Mafia - Page 3
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GlowingBear
Brazil12446 Posts
Shooting down the goon isn't that good, you lose one voter and you lose a person that could influence the thread | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On June 11 2016 05:38 Shapelog wrote: I actually am a bit amused that everyone is talking about the best plays for both sides in the pregame. If the game is imbalanced it should be sorted out in pre-game. There is no reason to let the game roll and make players play / use time on a game that is unwinnable (or almost unwinnable) for one side. Like i said, if people wanna play a game where town has basically 2 lynches to first figure out 2/7 chance of hitting scum and then 1/5 (assuming scum could even shoot themselves) that gives town 42,85% chance of winning the game with randomly lynching/shooting someone. Do you think it is fair for mafia? I don't. | ||
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
On June 11 2016 06:22 raynpelikoneet wrote: If the game is imbalanced it should be sorted out in pre-game. There is no reason to let the game roll and make players play / use time on a game that is unwinnable (or almost unwinnable) for one side. Like i said, if people wanna play a game where town has basically 2 lynches to first figure out 2/7 chance of hitting scum and then 1/5 (assuming scum could even shoot themselves) that gives town 42,85% chance of winning the game with randomly lynching/shooting someone. Do you think it is fair for mafia? I don't. No, its not. I have a question, Couldn't town force all the players to say who they are going to shoot, and then make a VC (unofficial) and purposely make it tied? Then, if the first person to vote gets lynched, you know that the 3 people on it are all town. If it doesn't, you know that at least 1 out of the 3 people on that wagon are scum. In senerio 1, Town gets to operate off of 3/5 or 2/5 confirm town lynch pool. Making the pool either 2 (which would be both mafia) or 2 mafia + 1 townie. In Senerio 2, Town knows that at least 1 person out of three people are scum. Assuming that indeed only 1 is scum, and none of the 3 are killed. Town also would have the 3 people on the second wagon as confirm town (if they won acourse). Town has a lynch pool of either the 3 people in the top lynch (it being 1/3) or, if the person who voted off wagon is still alive, a 1 person lynch pool. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
If the guy who got picked up as most scummiest -> vote first, doesn't die you just lynch him and win the game because he is mafia (as scum has no votes). If he is town, then you are in a "normal" D1. EDIT: I didn't think about it further, it's possible that what you are suggesting gives even better chances of winning for town. Basically, if scum have no night vigi votes, the game is always gonna be broken, that's the first thing to fix. Maybe voting should also be majority, as in, everyone has votes and only 4 or more votes on a same person gets them shot. That way there is WIFOM about why mafia didn't wanna get someone killed (are they scum or is it just WIFOM) in case the dude doesn't die (if town is dumb enough to not decide on a target). Town should basically always agree to reveal votes anyways, and should always vote for the same (and only one) person, regardless of their read on them. The only bad thing is to hit a Goon because other shots make town's job easier in LYLO (less targets) or straight out win the game (hit GF). | ||
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
Making people not able to vote for themselves also doesn't seem to fix that either. As you just get the 2nd most scummiest person to vote for the top scummiest person and vice versta. If top person dies, town goes into now normal Day 1, with a confirm person. If not, then obv. the 2nd person is scum. If it goes too the 3rd person voted, both are scum. Perhaps the fix is to make it to where scum vote's count for the vig. this also help to prevent the random 1/7 chance, since mafia can mutilate it? | ||
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
But yeah, that is what I am thinking as well. All players should have a vote that is worth it, due to mass vote claiming. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
I would suggest: - give scum vigi votes - make night vigi majority - scum are not able to shoot themselves EDIT: That way the goon basically needs to try to play scummy enough to get shot but not scummy enough to be figured out as a goon in which case town doesnt shoot him and just lynches him on D2 for the win.  | ||
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iamperfection
United States9643 Posts
On June 11 2016 06:54 raynpelikoneet wrote: Also scum should not be able to shoot themselves because if that's the case the best play is literally for the goon to claim goon at the start of the game and post nothing more whole game - and GF to shoot him. That's kinda boring if you joined to play a game of mafia. I would suggest: - give scum vigi votes - make night vigi majority - scum are not able to shoot themselves EDIT: That way the goon basically needs to try to play scummy enough to get shot but not scummy enough to be figured out as a goon in which case town doesnt shoot him and just lynches him on D2 for the win. claiming goon would be bad now town know not to vig that guy. I think if you turn the goon into a 3p jester you dont have to change anything else and have a perfect setup. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On June 11 2016 12:47 iamperfection wrote: claiming goon would be bad now town know not to vig that guy. Yes, that's kinda the point. I think if you turn the goon into a 3p jester you dont have to change anything else and have a perfect setup. Sure but the idea Artanis had imo is that there is two mafia and the GF needs to avoid getting shot on N0 (and in a perfect world the goon wants to get shot) and then both mafia need to avoid the lynch. If that is the core mechanic of the game i don't really think changing the core of the game to balance it is the way to do it. I mean, exaggeratedly speaking you could also make it a normal 13 player game with 2-3 town blues and 1-2 mafia blues and it would be balanced, if you get what i mean. + jester is the dumbest role ever in forum mafia, and having only 1 mafia kinda defeats the purpose of scumhunting since there are no connections so you can't actually "figure out scum" in a scumhunting-kinda-way... | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On June 11 2016 06:54 raynpelikoneet wrote: Also scum should not be able to shoot themselves because if that's the case the best play is literally for the goon to claim goon at the start of the game and post nothing more whole game - and GF to shoot him. That's kinda boring if you joined to play a game of mafia. I would suggest: - give scum vigi votes - make night vigi majority - scum are not able to shoot themselves EDIT: That way the goon basically needs to try to play scummy enough to get shot but not scummy enough to be figured out as a goon in which case town doesnt shoot him and just lynches him on D2 for the win. Implementing this and calling it a day  . Also making you cohost.On June 11 2016 13:01 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yes, that's kinda the point. Sure but the idea Artanis had imo is that there is two mafia and the GF needs to avoid getting shot on N0 (and in a perfect world the goon wants to get shot) and then both mafia need to avoid the lynch. Yup, this is kinda what I'm going for. I feel it makes the goon quite an interesting role. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
Just saying it now so i don't forget. | ||
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GlowingBear
Brazil12446 Posts
I don't get it. | ||
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
On June 12 2016 07:36 GlowingBear wrote: Night Vigi majority? I don't get it. Majority for the vote instead of instant or what ever it is called. | ||
yamato77
11589 Posts
many obligations, no mafia for me | ||
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GlowingBear
Brazil12446 Posts
Yeah, I'm playing Rels mini | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
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Superbia
Netherlands8889 Posts
Same.Maybe something for voice? | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
3 vengeful town, 1 goon, 1 godfather (no nights, if the godfather gets lynched town wins immediately) | ||
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Superbia
Netherlands8889 Posts
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