EPTTL Mafia LXXIV: Storm Mafia 3 - Page 199
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
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Shapelog
United States5185 Posts
On March 31 2016 23:20 Shapelog wrote: Eh i need to look at tumble again. Has he even posted this cycle? He has. | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
1. His mindset on claims doesn't match with his play OK this is Koshi's point. It's the biggest him against ritoky. ritoky has stated that he dislikes claim centric gameplay, but a large majority of his posts are centered on claims. That actually starts with his very first one, since he opened the game with a plan to make all VT claim and form a confirmed VT circle. A few sample: What he says he's doing: On March 28 2016 17:04 ritoky wrote: reading this phase has made me kinda remember why i stopped playing on another forum i played on. and why i don't sign up for a lot of games with tons of PRs....cuz if you roll VT i feel like the game becomes less about reading people and a battle of wits and more about evaluating PRs and their claims and its kinda meh feeling. What he's actually doing: + Show Spoiler + On March 24 2016 07:17 ritoky wrote: ![[image loading]](http://assets.forddirect.fordvehicles.com/assets/2016_Ford_Expedition_J1/NGBS/Model_Image3/Model_Image3_136B520C-1AD6-4419-8794-C04F8794C04F.png) On March 24 2016 08:45 ritoky wrote: damdred is probably not VT, burgeoning on almost certainly not. you might be VT. On March 24 2016 10:16 ritoky wrote: SL vivax supebia damdred lightningstrike On March 25 2016 06:57 ritoky wrote: i spelled it out multiple times, but sure. i am vt, i know nothing about the setup since it is closed. i have been in closed setups that are basically the same as a normal game and closed setups with 20 players, 19 of which are roles or mafia. i wanted to gauge the nature of how many PRs were in the game while locating all the VTs and narrowing down my potential mafia greatly. so i angle shot using the name of the role, assuming all town roles are named the same thing and that mafia either didn't get fake role pms or were too careless to reference them and understand what i was doing before it was already too late. the goal was to utilize the picture of the expedition, have people understand it, realize expedition was also in their role pm, and start forming a coalition of townies who understood we were all town based on the understanding of the expedition. from there you have a large block of people who identify eachother as near lock town and there is a vast amount of control over the day phase because of it as well as a smaller pool of people for potentially mafia. it forces mafia into an awkward spot where they have to choose to not PR hunt and leave PRs alive thus costing them a great deal or leave this large block of semi-confirmed townies alive and concede a ton of day phase control. the mafia lose something large either way. i think it is a pretty well devised plan, apparently i am alone. On March 27 2016 15:49 ritoky wrote: This. Very much this. Your role is effectively useless without its counterpart which is someone you don't know and who could be of the opposite alignment? You don't know what your role is capable of; but it is a "really bad idea" to shoot you or lynch you? Also when your role is this convoluted to the point where even if you claimed it in the thread no one would really know what the hell it does and if you're a priority night kill; why don't you claim it when you're tied in votes and have to leave the thread? That said I have slightly softened based on the content of the claim because it almost seems so wonky it might be true...but her play and the method of claim and everything about this stinks.....ugh I wanna conf bias so hard on this. On March 28 2016 17:14 ritoky wrote: i will be the first one to tell you rsoul that my execution of that plan was bad. the plan is good, execution bad. said it a bunch of times and have since moved on cuz if i bring it up people take that opportunity to call me an idiot and being called bad/trash/dumb gets old so i will just keep my disagreements on the matter to myself going forward. i posted the picture -> people aren't grasping what i am doing because they scroll past the picture w/o thinking -> i make a post indicating the picture is a play -> that post was dumb and i shoulda just stayed quiet to let it develop -> the play then becomes a clusterfuck. basically it fucked up because i, as a player, am bad at staying quiet and on the sidelines when i am available to post. if that explanation doesn't reach you, that's on you cuz it is the truth. outside of that, which i guess i can understand how my filter can be read as me utilizing my play to confirm myself rather than build something (altho i do tend to try and find ridiculous ways to confirm myself as town); no i don't understand how i can be read mafia. i have deep reads, not as much as i would like but that's due to the holiday primarily, have spent a lot of time attempting to drive the game forward or develop my reads (i mean a lot of this is at your expense so i guess you wouldn't view it as useful)....and i think some of what i have done and said i can't do as mafia....so yeah i think i am pretty blatantly town outside of the fact that i was spamming the word expedition and claiming VT and then a VT flipped as an expedition member. On March 28 2016 17:48 ritoky wrote: i am trying to evaluate if it is even worth lynching rsoul today.....supposedly she has an item that has a 50% chance of turning into an action or blowing up and being useless immediately upon night phase correct? so the options are: 1 - town -> item -> potential useful information 2 - town -> nothing -> we are at the same place tomorrow 3 - mafia -> item -> net loss, will probably say no item or lie about usage to seem more town 4 - mafia -> nothing -> we are at the same place tomorrow ugh that's a shitty EV imo On March 30 2016 12:28 ritoky wrote: i am still stuck on what the hell rsoul's plan was supposed to be.......i mean it is entirely possible she just lied about her role and how it works.....but what's her plan there. if damdred is mafia with her -> gives explanation why damdred keeps living through phases, since "mafia is afraid to shoot the vest" if damdred is town -> "i gave damdred a vest" -> "uhhh, no you didn't" -> "guess i was roleblocked guys!" -> get lynched it is very confusing to me right now. On March 31 2016 06:51 ritoky wrote: is mass claim a terrible idea right here? On March 31 2016 12:49 ritoky wrote: you're claiming a role in direct conflict with the OP and stated rules. if you live you need to explain. if i am alive and you do not, my vote will be on you and i will encourage every other vote to be on you too. we are lynching mafia and likely reducing kp (whether it is kp/faction or 2kptill2) so i am willing to postpone this discussion until tomorrow, but it will be happening next day phase. On March 31 2016 20:43 ritoky wrote: dunno, haven't read his filter. was going to, then he claimed so i didn't care and still don't because his game is now entirely claim centric. he's a claimed medic, if he dies he is town, if he doesn't he is mafia....pretty mafia 101, there's no particular value in evaluating his play 2. His plan is scum motivated, but more than that the way he played the plan is scum motivated First, his plan is scum motivated because it has benefits and weakness: its benefit is the creation of a confirmed town circle, the weakness is that it helps scum to bluehunt. Now scum is very likely to have access to fakeclaim, so there is actually no benefit since we cannot believe the results of the plan. Even if we were sure it was not the case, a smart scum could have realized very quickly what ritoky was doing and enter the plan, making it work for only the first few person to claim to become confirmed. Finally, even if smart scum didn't realize the plan before too late, they STILL could arguee the previous point to cast doubt on the confirmed status of the VT. To summarize, the plan itself has benefits for scum mainly. This doesn't mean much for ritoky's alignment 'cause townies can push bad plan. But there is something that is super scum indicative. ritoky played this plan not to discover VTs but to confirm himself town. He blew his plan very quickly, making comment on what he was doing along the way, making it obvious what he was going for. After that, the plan couldn't work; there is no town!motivation to do that. Absolutely none. The scum!motivation is to clearly show that he was really trying to solve the game via a smart plan, so he was town. In particular, this post doesn't make any sense from a town perspective: On March 24 2016 08:45 ritoky wrote: damdred is probably not VT, burgeoning on almost certainly not. you might be VT. He posted this 1h30 after the picture. Bluehunting only helps scum. If ritoky was town and saw that his plan was not working, he would shut up about his resulsts and move on to something else, either abandonning his plan or hoping it would work later when more people saw the picture. Posting "Damdred is not VT" doesn't do anything to push town forward; it does the opposite. 3. His attitude, especially compared to previous games in which he was town ritoky has only a few elaborate reads. He's not doing much to push the game forward. His only elaborate reads that doens't rely on claims are on LS, rsoul and me. It looks like he tryharded his push against rsoul and lost this motivation after that. Incidentally, townies should have the opposite reaction to 2-soon-to-be-3 scum death in a row. This is a scummy attitude by itself, but it's even worst when you take meta into account. ritoky has coached me, so I can say without the shadow of a doubt that he is a very smart player that knows how to evaluate people smartly. For example, he has a very good read on me. I remember the nutcracker game in which he was killed N1; I was town but was super inactive D1. Some people wanted to lynch me. But ritoky was in control of the game, stating that my lynch (and a few others) were off-limit 'cause he wanted to have more infos on me. That is how ritoky plays as town. Proactively. Same thing for Damdred. ritoky has a soulread on Damdred. It might not be as strong now as it used to be, due to Damdred improving his already-very-good scum play lately; but I'm sure ritoky never tried to not read Damdred in a game where he was town. This game ? I made a post on that subject there: + Show Spoiler + On March 31 2016 21:41 Rels wrote: ritoky's read progression on Damdred. Never did he give a single, real, non-claim-related read on him when Damdred is supposed to be one of ritoky's best read. And even if that was not the case, it doesn't match up with "I don't like claim centric stuff" he says he has. To repeat, ritoky got killed in nutcracker N1 because he was so active, proactive and most of all smartly questionning people and driving the thread. Same thing happened in millionaire: he was elected mayor because of his play D0. This is NOT how ritoky is playing this game. THis is way more similar to his passive play in Outlaws, when he just watched me get lynched D1. He would have lynched me D2 if he could in this current game. To explain this change of heart, ritoky has had a few scummy excuses. Not gonna quote "normal" excuses which everyone make like "can't play tomorrow I'm traveling"; these are scum indicative because they try to explain why ritoky is playing bad for no reason. + Show Spoiler + On March 24 2016 15:55 ritoky wrote: nah, i plan to stay at my current capacity. i carried and dumped too much effort into my last couple games and haven't spammed pictures or been a useless pile of shit in a while. gotta level that play and stick to my style of high variance. of course i say that today while i am emotionally stable, and i am prone to getting mad or sad and being a spamlord. On March 28 2016 17:04 ritoky wrote: reading this phase has made me kinda remember why i stopped playing on another forum i played on. and why i don't sign up for a lot of games with tons of PRs....cuz if you roll VT i feel like the game becomes less about reading people and a battle of wits and more about evaluating PRs and their claims and its kinda meh feeling. On March 31 2016 20:43 ritoky wrote: dunno, haven't read his filter. was going to, then he claimed so i didn't care and still don't because his game is now entirely claim centric. he's a claimed medic, if he dies he is town, if he doesn't he is mafia....pretty mafia 101, there's no particular value in evaluating his play Conclusion ritoky is scum. Lynch him as soon as there is no more claimed scum to lynch. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
This game was so easy... But then it all got ruined with the swing on TT and rso dying out of the sudden... Thank heavens our pet monkey Bamboozled is still here!  | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
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Rels
France13467 Posts
Town: Koshi Damdred sandroba Maybe town : Shape scott LS Maybe scum / 3P : VA OWS SL Tumble Superbia Koshi is 100% town. Maybe he will pull a LS one game and be able to imitate his town game perfectly, but until that happens I will townread him in every game he plays that way because I've seen him try and fail to imitate it as scum. Damdred has claimed doctor. It makes sense that town has a doctor. He will probably be killed soon. In addition, he lead a shennannie on TT D2, which makes no sense as scum. Either he's with TT and that makes 0 sense; or he's scum but not in TT's team, and he painted a big cross on his head. This doesn't match up with Damdred finding Superbia's play in PYP bad because Superbia palyed a super townie game and should have been killed by the other scum team. Damdred said the best play would be to play more calmly. So applying this, if Damdred was scum not in TT's team, he wouldn't try to find the other scum team too much. Sandroba is very very likely town because he's pushing to solve the game, because he's a vig and it's logical town has a vig, because he shot someone that scum would like to mislynch (unless scum knew he was engineer, which is not proven), and his activity has also exceeded all of his scum games. Only one even come close, but is still less than here, and he specifically said at the end of that game that he really tryharded but still had a hard time posting during the later days. I'm not seeing a decrease in quality or quantity in this game. Shape makes a lot of sense. That is actually what is scaring me a little, 'cause he usually is way more trolly as town. So there is a small chance he's scum tryharding his ass off. Probably not. scott is only there instead of the confirmed town category because of how little he has posted. But it's usual for town!scott, he's hard to read. His very few posts seemed OK. He's townread because of Slam's play; if he was a scum day vig, I don't understand why he would claim instead of just shooting someone like JAT without problem. LS is a hard read for me. He seems to care about the game. Damdred says LS is town and I think Damdred is town so I'm also sheeping him on that read. VA is not sharp and to-the-point as usual. I also didn't like how he hided behind "vote analysis" and "JAT analysis" to explain his reads, instead of letting them evolve organically. He could be scum. OWS is kinda useless and is making excuses to not play the game. He had a few moments where he was proactive, namely starting both wagon on tube D1 and TT D2, but he's not doing much apart from that. He CAN play like that as town (examples in my mind: millionaire when he couldn't bring himself to read LS, DF and my filter; the new personality mafia during the later days where he just didn't care about the game) so he's my least favorite lynch out of the people I want to lynch. I want him to do more. SL doesn't have a big impact on the game for the number of pages in his filter. And it's possible he has that kind of activity as scum; I've played with him as scum in Drams, and he had like 20 pages of fitler in 4 days I think. So activity doesn't prove anything one way or the other. He's insisting a loooooot on his vest. If there is a SK in the game, I think it's SL. Tumble is kinda invisible. The only real thing he had for him was that both rsoultin and TT tried to push him D2, but if it's ever proven there is two scum teams, this doesn't mean anything. He has a few posts I liked but he's just not doing enough for me to townread him. Like OWS, I want him to do more. Superbia is not playing very smart. He also has a lot of pages but he's just playing along the game, not really proactively. He's not making an impact. I'm also used to a Superbia that is way sharper as town; he scared me a lot in resistance V where I was scum and he was town. He jumped on the slightest inconsistency and pushed the person in front of him very hard. Here, he doesn't have that kind of game solving mentality. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 31 2016 23:54 Koshi wrote: Tell us who the 3p is Kurumi. Come on! You can do it! But I don't know! I know that one of the players has a very astonishing role name! | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
On March 31 2016 23:48 Kurumi wrote: Isn't this amazing your read on ritoky coincides with mine, ReIs? This game was so easy... But then it all got ruined with the swing on TT and rso dying out of the sudden... Thank heavens our pet monkey Bamboozled is still here! No ^^ there might be two scum teams. And even if there is only one, here is a quote from ritoky: I make a good distraction as mafia. I have this weird ability to always live about 2 days longer than I should. I get lynched a lot as mafia but it is because I both bus my teammates and encourage them to bus me to build credit. I like to play more for the team as mafia. If you want to read me basically soloing a game as mafia, then read Down Under 2. In that game, I tried to lead a lynch on my partner day 1, then town for some reason hammered the other wagon, so I told the vigi to shoot my partner in the night. The vigi listened, shot my partner, then we lynched my other partner day 2 or 3. So I essentially ran the game 1v7 and won. It is probably the best scum game I have played on these forums. That would actually explain why his only really elaborate read is rsoultin. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
On March 31 2016 23:58 Kurumi wrote: But I don't know! I know that one of the players has a very astonishing role name! Well. You don't have to do anything but you can do so much. You must have more sympathy for town than that fucker who killed rsoultin. Who isn't it? And do you think it is 3p or another mafia team? | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On April 01 2016 00:00 Koshi wrote: I agree with all. SL is mafia or 3p for sure. Superbia is not doing jack shit. Tumble is only mafia if there are 2 teams. VA made mistakes. OWS is an empty suit. ritoky can die. Kill them before me!!! You'll miss me!!! | ||
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
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Rels
France13467 Posts
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Rels
France13467 Posts
On April 01 2016 00:00 Rels wrote: No ^^ there might be two scum teams. And even if there is only one, here is a quote from ritoky: That would actually explain why his only really elaborate read is rsoultin. Fuck I regret not putting this quote in the case. This is so good | ||
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LightningStrike
United States14277 Posts
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
On April 01 2016 00:04 Rels wrote: VA did you ever do that JAT analysis thing ? I did, nothing to post about it. Didn't really find anyone that was adamant JAT was town or overly so besides LS, but who actually thinks LS is calling the shots in his scum team? The only other plausible one was sandroba but hes probably town if kurumi is scum | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
On April 01 2016 00:15 VayneAuthority wrote: what clowns were playing in that game ritoky is talking about? why would some one that did that live that long On March 01 2015 15:29 Half the Sky wrote:D1: prplhz, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been lynched. N1: Palmar, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been nightkilled. N1: Alakaslam, the ignorant tourist, (Mafia Goon) has been nightkilled. D2: Superbia, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been lynched. N2: Damdred, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been nightkilled. D3: IAmRobik, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been modkilled. D3: Snickers, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been lynched. N3: Onegu, the vintner, (Town Medic) has been nightkilled. D4: MysteryMeat1, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been lynched. D4: Oatsmaster, the supply chain manager, (Mafia Roleblocker) has been modkilled. D4: rsoultin, the festivalgoer, (Vanilla Townie) has been endgamed. D4: Trfel, the head of security, (Town Vigilante) has been endgamed. D4: ritoky, the viticulturalist, (Mafia Godfather) has survived. | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
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