EPTNewbie Student Mafia XIX - Page 35
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
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Ikidomari
Australia485 Posts
On January 28 2016 14:42 darthfoley wrote: Welcome to the thread! Hope you're getting caught up. I like your post, but I have a question. You mention that Onegu and Trfel are in your scum category. Do you think that they could be on a scum team together? If one flips mafia, will that change your opinion on the other? All of my calls were made based on the person's filter, their posting style, how constructive they were. I'm still wrapping my head around everyone's opinion of everyone else. I went back and read through all of Trfel and Onegu's filters. Based on their posts to each other, I don't think they're both scum. Both come off as scummy, but if one was proven scum, my suspicion toward the other would drop. This is because they've frequently questioned each other and have interacted quite a lot. If I was scum, I'd likely talk to my teammates in the thread, to divert suspicion, but not THIS much. I have a stronger scum read for Trfel than I do for Onegu. + Show Spoiler + On January 28 2016 14:46 Eden1892 wrote: Bingo. And not only that, I don't even see how Tumblewood's opinions about Shapelog and darthfoley are inconsistent. He pointed out early that both players made self-references to their not being mafia and had them as two of his top three suspects. His opinions of the two players diverge as the game goes on, which makes sense given that they're saying and doing different things. I'm biased and open to being talked down, but I read Trfel's case and came away feeling like I'd cornered him on his apparent flip-flop on his read on Tumblewood, and that he forced this case where it wasn't really there to look like he sincerely believed he had something there. I'm still fine lynching Trfel. Keeping my vote in place. Also okay with this wagon on Jesus. kush's point on Jesus is okay, darth's emergent case on Jesus is pretty strong for day 1, both of those players are strong town to me, and both players attacked on completely different axes from the other. Would sheep 10/10, will switch vote to push this wagon over the top if Trfel isn't going or some other wagon looks poised to overtake both. EBWOthreadrefresh: This Ikidomari guy is basically lock scum, we can lynch him too. Stealing my dude Koshi's styling and heuristic for part of this. literally "this guy is town, either that or mafia," breaking the tie on an arbitrary factor (alleged lack of forum experience) which has no impact on alignment again with the "this guy is town, either that or mafia" read, but this time with a dose of newbie johns to excuse himself from not committing to one stance or the other. Everyone go read the stickied analysis by Ver on XXX Mafia and then scroll for the part where he dissects how this one new player does the exact same thing in that game as mafia. You'll see it and you'll read this and thank me. how is this constructive Ikidomari? you go on to say that I'm town and Shapelog (the object of the strategy in question) isn't necessarily scum so how is this helping anybody? and what good is the question to Jesus there anyway? is that going to help you read him? because neither alignment is incentivized to make themselves more prone to being attacked so I'm not sure how this does... no use to this at all. doesn't explain how Kuragari is particularly scummy, says he doesn't have enough info for proper judgment, throws a scumread out anyway. yet another "this guy is town, either that or mafia" read, arbitrarily tiebroken toward Trfel being mafia based on experience. he at least commits to Onegu being scum, but again with the "suspicious but not enough to vote on" conclusions... but then he also thinks Trfel is scum? and even says he agrees with Onegu's read on Trfel. How do you have both of them as scum, Ikidomari? - so now Jesus became a top 3 scum read after calling Jesus "unhelpful town" in the actual read on Jesus - he has Onegu as "keep my eye on" but then puts him in scum instead of the literal reads group titled "keep a close eye on" and he doesn't list me and kush/noon as town reads despite calling us these. ^^i bring this up even though it's NAI in and of itself, because these arbitrary designations give him a clean "three town three scum three watch-out" list of reads; too clean to me. It just looks inorganic that he has an even split of reads, that's just not how reads naturally evolve normally. It looks more like a manufactured list to me. also there's this: excuses for not being caught up. this might as well read "disregard what I'm saying and ignore my reads," he's literally giving us multiple reasons (inactivity/falling behind, struggling to read the thread thoroughly) for discrediting his reads. what townie does this? if you just don't have anything to add then you don't post anything or post what you do have to add (strong town reads if nothing else). newbie scum do this all the time, they post a large post of reads that looks involved and invested in the game, but then seed all kinds of backdoors to escape committing to those reads with various excuses and waffling in the reads themselves. this is basically a portrait of what new scum looks like ##UNVOTE ##VOTE: Ikidomari Man I knew my town was bad but I don't think it's fair for you to go on me this hard. This is literally my first ever game of mafia, my only experience is watching "the town" LAN by beyond the summit. I know that right now I am super useless town, but I'm here to learn. I would be a fair day-1 lynch for being so inactive, and you have a pretty compelling case for me being mafia, but I ask that you leave me alive simply so I can have a chance to be more active and learn more. As for my posts being waffling and leaving backdoors, that's simply because at this point I didn't want to commit too hard to my reads, because my reads are BAD. I haven't been fully engaged in the game, I've tried to wrap my head around 30 hours of posts in the space of an hour or 2, and get my post out. as to why I had such a concise list with 3 town 3 scum 3 watch, that's because (I believe it was) Mexican asked earlier for everyone to do a 3 scum list with reasons. I merely added on the other 2 categories because I thought it would be useful. On January 28 2016 14:47 Eden1892 wrote: oh my goodness it's actual literal magic christmasland. is it really this easy? lock for scum +other posts on me voting for jesus. It took me about an hour and a half to write that post with my thoughts on everyone. My opinion of Jesus changed as I got further into it, and I didn't edit my summary on him. Again. I'm probably the weakest player in this game, so feel free to lynch me for that reason, but I'm not scum and I'd really love to hang around and learn + Show Spoiler + it was really quite hard to learn from the BTS stream, because you know who is scum and who is town going into it, so there's an inherent bias. | ||
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_MexicanAlien
South Africa193 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:07 darthfoley wrote: Can it actually be that simple Eden? Wouldn't a mafia coach specifically coach against some of the stuff (e.g. noob card, "he's either town or mafia" reads, etc.) that Ikidomari posted? darthfoley let's just wait and see what Ikidomari has to say for himself. Then decide from there. | ||
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
I'll humor that your post took a while and you changed your mind as a result, Iki. After all, I pretty rapidly changed course on who I wanted to lynch while I was typing my post  But you got to explain to me what changed your mind. It's a bit odd to me that you claim you did, because you didn't make much mention of Jesus in-between your read on him and your list of reads. And you didn't put it back in at the end... or in the follow-up post where you voted for him... So what changed your mind about Jesus? Please be as specific as you can. | ||
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Tumblewood
United States3709 Posts
On January 28 2016 14:51 darthfoley wrote: Tumble I'd like to know if these are still your scum reads? If they've changed, I want to know why. Also, you have both Trfel and Onegu in your scum pile. They've been pretty accusatory against each other; same question I posed to Aussie friend: do you believe they could be on the same team? If one flips scum, does it change your opinion on the other? My reads on Onegu and Trfel haven't changed, but you can add JesusIncarnate and Ikidomari to that list. JesusIncarnate is scummy IMO for being inactive and unhelpful. Ikidomari... I would have probably townread, but Eden has scumreading powers I am not yet blessed with, and I can't help but agree with her. On the subject of Onegu and Trfel, I think it would still make sense if they were scum together, but it's getting hard to picture Onegu as scum now (even without him saying anything) when there are four players I believe are acting scummier. This is a weird game. | ||
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_MexicanAlien
South Africa193 Posts
I'm probably the weakest player in the game, so feel free to lynch me for that reason,... Falls back on "I'm the weakest player" when there are better candidates for that role (Shapelog....ect). He's trying to guilt us into not lynching him! This would be a horrible strategy for a townie, a last resort as Mafia! | ||
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:16 Eden1892 wrote: sigh hittin me right in the feels with "keep me alive so I can learn" I'll humor that your post took a while and you changed your mind as a result, Iki. After all, I pretty rapidly changed course on who I wanted to lynch while I was typing my post But you got to explain to me what changed your mind. It's a bit odd to me that you claim you did, because you didn't make much mention of Jesus in-between your read on him and your list of reads. And you didn't put it back in at the end... or in the follow-up post where you voted for him... So what changed your mind about Jesus? Please be as specific as you can. *hint, if you want to stay alive, I suggest you do as he says and not fall back on "i'm a noob!" excuse* We've all been there, but if you want to stick around, you need to prove that you have value. This doesn't mean that you need to solve every person in every post you write. It's perfectly fine to focus on only a couple of people, if you have legitimate reasons to do so. With that said, I am too interested in hearing about why your opinion of JesusIncarnate changed. I'm assuming you read my case against him before you posted, so why the change mid way through your post? | ||
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Ikidomari
Australia485 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:16 Eden1892 wrote: sigh hittin me right in the feels with "keep me alive so I can learn" I'll humor that your post took a while and you changed your mind as a result, Iki. After all, I pretty rapidly changed course on who I wanted to lynch while I was typing my post But you got to explain to me what changed your mind. It's a bit odd to me that you claim you did, because you didn't make much mention of Jesus in-between your read on him and your list of reads. And you didn't put it back in at the end... or in the follow-up post where you voted for him... So what changed your mind about Jesus? Please be as specific as you can. Sure. It's his attitude. I admit I'm biased because I dislike the way he types, but I couldn't stop thinking about motivations as to why he'd be so arrogant, and how that arrogance could be used to his advantage. The only logical reason that I could see someone would draw so much attention to themselves is so that, if they were mafia, people would think "Man, there's no way mafia would be stupid enough to draw that much attention to themselves, he must be town" It seems suspicious as hell to me, and I can't think of a good reason a town player would paint themselves as a target. His posting style reminds me of an anonymous poster on 4chan, not of a TL user looking to solve a puzzle. Source: I spend far too much time on both websites. | ||
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
1. JesusIncarnate 2. Kuragari 3. Ikidomari (??) Strongest TRs: 1. Eden 2. Alur 3. PMT Starting to get town vibes from Tumblewood, so he's off my list for now. I don't really see myself voting for anyone besides Jesus or Ikidomari at this point in time. Maybe if Kuragari continues to be lackluster and a wagon forms somehow. | ||
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Ikidomari
Australia485 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:23 darthfoley wrote: *hint, if you want to stay alive, I suggest you do as he says and not fall back on "i'm a noob!" excuse* We've all been there, but if you want to stick around, you need to prove that you have value. This doesn't mean that you need to solve every person in every post you write. It's perfectly fine to focus on only a couple of people, if you have legitimate reasons to do so. With that said, I am too interested in hearing about why your opinion of JesusIncarnate changed. I'm assuming you read my case against him before you posted, so why the change mid way through your post? I agree, using the "I'm a noob" excuse is cheap, and should be disregarded. Lynch me for being useless. I did read your post on jesus, and you posted it after I wrote my bit on jesus, but before I voted for him. I admit that I was a little influenced by your post, but my main reason for voting to lynch jesus, remains that I just don't like his arrogance. | ||
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:25 Ikidomari wrote: Sure. It's his attitude. I admit I'm biased because I dislike the way he types, but I couldn't stop thinking about motivations as to why he'd be so arrogant, and how that arrogance could be used to his advantage. The only logical reason that I could see someone would draw so much attention to themselves is so that, if they were mafia, people would think "Man, there's no way mafia would be stupid enough to draw that much attention to themselves, he must be town" It seems suspicious as hell to me, and I can't think of a good reason a town player would paint themselves as a target. His posting style reminds me of an anonymous poster on 4chan, not of a TL user looking to solve a puzzle. Source: I spend far too much time on both websites. Why would a mafia want to paint a target on their back if a townie wouldn't want to paint a target on their back? | ||
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_MexicanAlien
South Africa193 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:19 Tumblewood wrote: My reads on Onegu and Trfel haven't changed, but you can add JesusIncarnate and Ikidomari to that list. JesusIncarnate is scummy IMO for being inactive and unhelpful. Ikidomari... I would have probably townread, but Eden has scumreading powers I am not yet blessed with, and I can't help but agree with her. On the subject of Onegu and Trfel, I think it would still make sense if they were scum together, but it's getting hard to picture Onegu as scum now (even without him saying anything) when there are four players I believe are acting scummier. This is a weird game. darthfoley asks Tumbleweed for his views on Onegu and Trfel, Tumbleweed says his reads haven't changed, but then goes on to say his read on Onegu is getting weaker. Tumble joins the Jesus wagon on grounds of "inactive and unhelpful", but he doesn't accuse others for any of these reasons, even though in his mind it should be solid ground. He implies his TR on Ikidomari, but then jumps on Ikidomari's wagon too! And he bases this on the fact that Eden1892 had better scumreading 'powers' than him. While this may be true, it is hardly reason for wagoning Ikidomari. | ||
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_MexicanAlien
South Africa193 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:31 Ikidomari wrote: I agree, using the "I'm a noob" excuse is cheap, and should be disregarded. Lynch me for being useless. Again with the guilting. | ||
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Ikidomari
Australia485 Posts
1. I start writing my first long post 2. darth writes his case against jesus 3. I read darth's case [bold] after [/bold] writing my part on jesus 4. I post 5. I realize I have to vote 6. I vote for my least favorite person in the game so far- Jesus has contributed very little, his attitude annoys me, other players have a case against him too. that last point about other players having a case against him is important to me, I don't want to mis-lynch someone, in the off chance that it's a close vote, and my vote tips the scales. Here's my last point in defense for now. If I was mafia, I'm most afraid of Eden and Darth, and people in the thread know that. If I survive being lynched today, who dies in the night will pretty much confirm whether or not I'm mafia / town, and I'm an easy vote for day 2. | ||
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
I got work allllll day tomorrow, will hopefully be able to check in before deadline and read. I don't think we should lynch JesusIncarnate today. Too many people are willing to do it for reasons that don't really make him scummy with nobody really trying to stop it (except I guess me). I'm still down for a Trfel lynch as a backup plan. And if all that goes to hell I'm 99% sheeping kush. | ||
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_MexicanAlien
South Africa193 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:38 Ikidomari wrote: I should clarify. Order of events is 1. I start writing my first long post 2. darth writes his case against jesus 3. I read darth's case [bold] after [/bold] writing my part on jesus 4. I post 5. I realize I have to vote 6. I vote for my least favorite person in the game so far- Jesus has contributed very little, his attitude annoys me, other players have a case against him too. that last point about other players having a case against him is important to me, I don't want to mis-lynch someone, in the off chance that it's a close vote, and my vote tips the scales. Here's my last point in defense for now. If I was mafia, I'm most afraid of Eden and Darth, and people in the thread know that. If I survive being lynched today, who dies in the night will pretty much confirm whether or not I'm mafia / town, and I'm an easy vote for day 2. This is WIFOM | ||
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darthfoley
United States8001 Posts
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Iki, why would a mafia want to paint a target on their backs if a townie wouldn't want to do so? | ||
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