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No
I'm saying you said (twice) that sulfur's vote was not alignment indicative because he did the same thing last game to SL and breshke.
Then you went back and said it is alignment indicative and points against him.
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On June 15 2015 23:19 Rels wrote:KickstartI think the guy is mafia for these reasons: 1. Lots of fluff and not a lot of analysis. I didn't believe that before rerading his filter but that is true: there is almost no analysis in it. 2. This case is super forced 4 hours into the game. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 11:16 Kickstart wrote:Here's something of a mini-case on why I am scum reading ruXxar atm. First several posts he seems quite concerned about the scum team! Why is this. This doesn't seem to be normal new town player concerns to me. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:22 ruXxar wrote:
Well if the mafia are just going to lynch themselves then this should be an easy game! Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:26 ruXxar wrote:I actually believe in the right of individual freedom, so as long as the mafia just stick to themselves and don't hurt anyone, I don't mind having them around  . *slaps himself* No, stop daydreaming ruxx! Then there was his answering question slip which has been the topic of much debate. It is really weird because I said I don't like people answering questions directed at others, Trfel asks me why, and then ruxx answers -______-. I think a townie would read that and be wary of answering because they see me saying that answering for others is a bad thing. My take on it is that ruxx maybe saw an easy opportunity to seem helpful and didn't even pay attention to the interaction going on there. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:36 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:32 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
A friendly PSA: I don't like lurkers or liers or people who answer questions directed at other people. Why don't you like it when people answer questions directed at others? Usually you want to hear the reasoning of the person you're asking. If someone answers the question before him, you potentially open up for someone else to make a logical conclusion beforehand, and then the guy the question was directed at get an easy bandwagon onto that guys conclusions. At least that is what I think. Another post which doesn't seem like a town mindset at all to me. Why would town try to defend lying. This seems like scum saying "lying is ok" but trying to make it seem like something town just does all the time too, it isn't, and this is scum mindset imo. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:39 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
A friendly PSA: I don't like lurkers or liers or people who answer questions directed at other people.
Why don't you like liars? Lying is a powerful tool that when used in the right situation can greatly benefit one's interests. This goes for both sides. Deception is not a thing reserved only for mafia. What you meant to say is that you don't like liars that have conflicting interests from you. And yet another on the lying thing that I just don't see a townie making. This just stinks of scum mindset to me again. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 08:04 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:56 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:54 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:50 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:46 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:41 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:36 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:32 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
A friendly PSA: I don't like lurkers or liers or people who answer questions directed at other people. Why don't you like it when people answer questions directed at others? Usually you want to hear the reasoning of the person you're asking. If someone answers the question before him, you potentially open up for someone else to make a logical conclusion beforehand, and then the guy the question was directed at get an easy bandwagon onto that guys conclusions. At least that is what I think. ........ The "at least that is what I think" pushes it over the top. I could see it as a joke, but then there's no reason to include the last sentence. It's either inherently contradictory or unnecessarily cautious. Scum lean. What I meant by the last sentence was that that was my number one assumption of why he made that statement. I won't pretend to be a mind reader, but I find it strange that he throws out unsubstantiated claims like that. So far kickstart is a scumlean for me. Wait.... So you are serious about your explanation for not answering a question directed at someone else, because it helps them answer the question if they are scum. But in saying this, you answered a question directed at someone else, your scum read? This explanation is going to be good. Yes my answer was serious. I see now how that actually denied us information from kick start. It was a mistake on my part to actually answer that question. Can you please clarify, why are you scumreading Kickstart? I didn't like his statement about not liking liars. This whole game is based on the concept of deception. If you don't like that aspect of the game, why are you here? You might claim that you like hunting lying mafia, But it's not a given beforehand what role you will be, so that doesn't make sense either. I have no prior info about any of the players here, so he might have some personal conviction for why he said that, but to me it didn't seem like a genuine well thought through statement. And here is a ton of WIFOM that is literally useless to town. Ended with a pointless question to me. Again to me it is just obvious why as town you don't like people to lie, I even explained a few times what I meant by the statement, so he is either not reading or pressing a nonsensical point. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 08:43 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 08:19 Trfel wrote:ruXxar1. Answered a question directed to someone else, while explaining why answering questions directed at others hurts town + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 07:36 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:32 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
A friendly PSA: I don't like lurkers or liers or people who answer questions directed at other people. Why don't you like it when people answer questions directed at others? Usually you want to hear the reasoning of the person you're asking. If someone answers the question before him, you potentially open up for someone else to make a logical conclusion beforehand, and then the guy the question was directed at get an easy bandwagon onto that guys conclusions. At least that is what I think. RuXxar provided a reasonable explanation for why it is bad to answer questions directed at other people. However, this explanation was an answer to my question directed at Kickstart. In this very post, he's doing why he says that this is bad. He's confident enough to ignore any potential purpose that I had for this question, confident enough in Kickstart's alignment that he doesn't want to hear Kickstart's answer, but not confident enough to leave the post without stating that this is what he thinks, implying that he could be wrong. 2. The person he answered a question for is now his scumread + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 07:46 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 07:41 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:36 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 07:32 Trfel wrote:On June 12 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
A friendly PSA: I don't like lurkers or liers or people who answer questions directed at other people. Why don't you like it when people answer questions directed at others? Usually you want to hear the reasoning of the person you're asking. If someone answers the question before him, you potentially open up for someone else to make a logical conclusion beforehand, and then the guy the question was directed at get an easy bandwagon onto that guys conclusions. At least that is what I think. ........ The "at least that is what I think" pushes it over the top. I could see it as a joke, but then there's no reason to include the last sentence. It's either inherently contradictory or unnecessarily cautious. Scum lean. What I meant by the last sentence was that that was my number one assumption of why he made that statement. I won't pretend to be a mind reader, but I find it strange that he throws out unsubstantiated claims like that. So far kickstart is a scumlean for me. When he is questioned, ruxXar throws out a scum lean. However, he does this on Kickstart, the same player he just answered a question for. Imagine that ruXxar is town. He sees Kickstart make a post, but doesn't try to look into his alignment. Then he sees me (Trfel) ask a question to Kickstart about that post, then immediately answers the question without stopping to realize that this is the same behavior criticized in his explanation (and he realizes that his play hurt town here). Only after answering my question to Kickstart does he bother to actually think about Kickstart's alignment. I can't see this coming from a town mindset, from someone who is actually interested in determining people's alignments. Furthermore, he hasn't made any alignment-related comments about anyone in the game other than Kickstart. RuXxar is being contradictory, cautious, and is showing a mindset that isn't towny at all. He's not interested in thinking about people's alignments. I beg to differ. I've been leading an open and active discussion, answering and asking questions. If I was scum I would be very careful not to expose myself like that. I already admitted that I missed the logical inconsistency in answering kick starts question. If I had been mafia then I would have been way more careful in considering my response and not make such an obvious error. The only one that has made any statements that I don't understand / agree with so far is kick start. He's also dodged my question so far. Liers means if you say you are going to do something but don't when it comes to forum mafia. Also good job breaking one of my rules, He only explained what it means, not why he said it. So @ kickstart. Please explain why you don't like liars. On its own this post isn't too bad but coupled with his general tone I think this just adds to it. A tell that a lot of new scum players fall for is proclaiming their inexperience. He does this a lot in his earlier posts in the way of justifying various things because of not knowing the game or the players, and in this post he does it again when it is needless imo. Saying I agree would have sufficed but for some reason he feels the need to proclaim his inexperience, something that everyone in the game knows. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 08:53 ruXxar wrote:On June 12 2015 08:46 n00bKing wrote:On June 12 2015 08:24 ruXxar wrote:
I'm not voting on anyone yet, it's way too early for that.
I'm gathering information to base my reads upon.
I can only evaluate what I've read so far.
Putting pressure on people is also a good thing, not necessarily because you believe they are scum, but to see how they react in tense situations.
You're right, putting pressure on people can be a good thing, to see how they react. That's why you're wrong, it is not too early to vote. I agree. As said, it's my first time playing mafia and I haven't been in many situations lately where i have to formulate sharp logical arguments. I am usually forgiving to players I don't know or newer players, but to me there are so many things that seem scummy to me that I can't do that in ruXxars case. Thoughts? 3. Posted a lot day 1 and left a good impression on everyone, then left. Came back multiple times with an excuse but didn't a whole lot and left again. Even worse, promised something and never did it. + Show Spoiler +First time he came, he promised an analysis of bats filter that never came. On June 13 2015 05:37 Kickstart wrote:
Damn I went back to sleep and slept forever. 2 replacements already whata game. Still think ruXxar is slightly scummy but several people think he isn't so that's that. Sulfuris did come in and logic up his posts but that still leaves me baffled about his initial vote. If he is so concerned with the logic of his arguments and reads then how the hell did he make that post with that mindset. Seems like he did something scummy then tried to logic his way out. Seems the idea of a bats lynch is gathering steam. I actually thought his posting was weird but I have only played with him in 1 other game to go off of. I'll reread his filter at some point before EoD and see if I still get that impression. On June 15 2015 07:17 Kickstart wrote:
First of all I want to apologize for my lack of activity. It isn't fair to everyone that I am usually quite active and in this game I neglected to play for some time. I am town though.
Secondly this end of cycle times is getting really stupid, please set a time and stick to it. I thought it was 21:00 originally then it was 1 hour earlier and now its 18:00.
Originally was suspicious mainly of ruxx and sulf. Sulf still scummy ruxx not so much. Hate to just come in and agree with thread sentiment but rels is scummy as well. Tbh I just skimmed through most of the EoD and the night stuff though.
4. This post seems forced to me too. It's about how he doesn't like noobking's posting. Not sure about that one though. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 16:38 Kickstart wrote:
Eh got some beauty sleep so I'm a bit calmer, lets see how long that lasts. Don't like n00bKing's posting in general. First game here, very lectury. Goes out of his way to tell people not to post fluff, yet posts nothing in the way of reads.
@king
Who are you suspicious of at the moment, who do you think could be scum? 5. His progression of his read on me is so bad. I think at least one of the people pushing me is doing so because I'm an easy mislynch. And I think kickstart is the most opportunistic person that came into my train. Here is his train of thought regarding me. Please read at least the last quote in the spoiler, it's hilarious as hell. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 16:53 Kickstart wrote:
Either Rels is second smartest person in here behind me or he is trying real hard to pocket me D:. Everything hes posted has been in line with my thinking as well. On June 13 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Wheres does scotts 'wouldn't lynch rels' read come from. U wot.
Gosh i rly dont like list posts with no reasoning in them. Are me and rels suspicious to you but not enough to not vote and that is why we aren't in your 'like' list or what. On June 15 2015 07:17 Kickstart wrote:
First of all I want to apologize for my lack of activity. It isn't fair to everyone that I am usually quite active and in this game I neglected to play for some time. I am town though.
Secondly this end of cycle times is getting really stupid, please set a time and stick to it. I thought it was 21:00 originally then it was 1 hour earlier and now its 18:00.
Originally was suspicious mainly of ruxx and sulf. Sulf still scummy ruxx not so much. Hate to just come in and agree with thread sentiment but rels is scummy as well. Tbh I just skimmed through most of the EoD and the night stuff though.
On June 15 2015 07:18 Kickstart wrote:
meant to go ahead and vote.
##Vote Rels On June 15 2015 07:34 Kickstart wrote:
Yeah I don't agree with everything in noobs large post but I tend to agree that the most likely scum trio to me atm is sulf, ruxx, rels. And if one of them flips red it makes the other 2 look even scummier. On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Conclusion: Mafia
What happened to moose and Scott?
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It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it.
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On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way?
I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence.
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I did vote ruxxar btw I just didn't post it. I do consider him an excellent lynch. Dude votes and scum reads me for 99% of the day only to sheep me hard onto a town wagon for reasons that he himself says were bad and a mistake.
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On June 16 2015 03:02 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:54 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way? I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence. Lol, which is not what I was trying to say, say no.
Sometimes human beings accidentally reveal their intentions with their word choices. But it seriously doesn't matter you could have afked all day today and still not been the lynch.
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Your reasons for mouse being town are way stronger than your reasons for moose being mafia.
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On June 16 2015 03:32 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 00:46 ruXxar wrote:
Moosy and kick then both HARD agree that I have to bus rels and sulfur as the only chance to clear my name. Wait.... what??? The amount of content that Rels put out is just insane.... and while I don't like all of his points, he does raise some good points (particularly some of the ones against scott31337). I don't really like his response to batsnacks' case, but if he is scum, it's really impressive that he would go through all that work when he seemed to be completely doomed. ##unvote
You should read that thing I said about ruxxar being mafia because he voted me for 99% of d1 only to sheep me hard at the last second on a town wagon for reasons that he considers bad and a mistake. Then you should vote ruxxar because he's probably the best lynch.
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Is the mafia team ruxxar/Scott/kickstart?
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Or maybe Damdred is in there. Damdred did one of his mafia tells this game but I'm not saying anything about that unless I have to.
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On June 16 2015 05:36 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 05:32 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 16 2015 05:31 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:22 WaveofShadow wrote:
I've already said I haven't read much of Rels' posts.
Top scum is still absolutely Sulf. If the only reason to not lynch him is because 'oh well he did this shit in another game,' then that's not nearly enough.
Not much else has changed to be honest, other than the fact that I'd probably bump Rels up on my list to that muddle of 'null' players.
Other two are more than likely amongst Damdred/you(ruxxar)/Rels/Scott/Kickstart. I think Oats re-gets a townread for feels and you move down slightly because I dunno how you could be voting moosy and calling Sulf town without some shenanigans going on. And why won't you read rels posts?!.... As a town it's your duty to stay informed so you can make a judgement based on as much information as possible. Because they're long, boring, and mostly useless clearly. Can you explain to me what makes them particularly important in the grand scheme of things? It gives us a window into how he thinks, who he suspects, why he suspects them. We can use them to see if he's making good or bad reads, if his alignment is the same as ours, and to better judge him. What you're essentially saying is that you'd rather he had said nothing. That's not a very towny perspective now is it?
Yeah I'd be happier if sulfur is lynched but I'd be happier if ruxxar was lynched.
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***happy for sulfur, ***happier for ruxxar
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On June 16 2015 05:40 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 05:37 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 05:36 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:32 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 16 2015 05:31 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:22 WaveofShadow wrote:
I've already said I haven't read much of Rels' posts.
Top scum is still absolutely Sulf. If the only reason to not lynch him is because 'oh well he did this shit in another game,' then that's not nearly enough.
Not much else has changed to be honest, other than the fact that I'd probably bump Rels up on my list to that muddle of 'null' players.
Other two are more than likely amongst Damdred/you(ruxxar)/Rels/Scott/Kickstart. I think Oats re-gets a townread for feels and you move down slightly because I dunno how you could be voting moosy and calling Sulf town without some shenanigans going on. And why won't you read rels posts?!.... As a town it's your duty to stay informed so you can make a judgement based on as much information as possible. Because they're long, boring, and mostly useless clearly. Can you explain to me what makes them particularly important in the grand scheme of things? It gives us a window into how he thinks, who he suspects, why he suspects them. We can use them to see if he's making good or bad reads, if his alignment is the same as ours, and to better judge him. What you're essentially saying is that you'd rather he had said nothing. That's not a very towny perspective now is it? Yeah I'd be happier if sulfur is lynched but I'd be happier if ruxxar was lynched. I see you're at it again with you "Bat Traps™ mafia traps. The highest quality traps for your scum hunting needs." We all saw how that worked out with geript.
Look how the mafia continues to discredit the read that he sheeped. Please take note newbies.
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On June 16 2015 05:44 ruXxar wrote:
Just to make it clear to everyone.
I wouldn't mind if Sulfur was lynched for his complete lack of contribution.
However, I would much rather try to lynch a mafia than a shitty town any day of the week.
Wanna know the easiest way to tell the difference between mafia and shitty town? Be mafia. Like seriously there is no way you should be able to tell the difference as town given what sulfur has provided, unless you are mafia and you actually know sulfur's alignment.
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On June 16 2015 05:48 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 05:41 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 16 2015 05:40 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:37 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 05:36 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:32 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 16 2015 05:31 ruXxar wrote:On June 16 2015 05:22 WaveofShadow wrote:
I've already said I haven't read much of Rels' posts.
Top scum is still absolutely Sulf. If the only reason to not lynch him is because 'oh well he did this shit in another game,' then that's not nearly enough.
Not much else has changed to be honest, other than the fact that I'd probably bump Rels up on my list to that muddle of 'null' players.
Other two are more than likely amongst Damdred/you(ruxxar)/Rels/Scott/Kickstart. I think Oats re-gets a townread for feels and you move down slightly because I dunno how you could be voting moosy and calling Sulf town without some shenanigans going on. And why won't you read rels posts?!.... As a town it's your duty to stay informed so you can make a judgement based on as much information as possible. Because they're long, boring, and mostly useless clearly. Can you explain to me what makes them particularly important in the grand scheme of things? It gives us a window into how he thinks, who he suspects, why he suspects them. We can use them to see if he's making good or bad reads, if his alignment is the same as ours, and to better judge him. What you're essentially saying is that you'd rather he had said nothing. That's not a very towny perspective now is it? Yeah I'd be happier if sulfur is lynched but I'd be happier if ruxxar was lynched. I see you're at it again with you "Bat Traps™ mafia traps. The highest quality traps for your scum hunting needs." We all saw how that worked out with geript. I'm not sure what bats said has anything to do with geript's supposed scumslip. He's nitpicking on a word that was supposedly a "slip" from me.
I'm not nitpicking. Pairing yourself with wave by saying OUR is not something town needs to or thinks to do. Wave isn't just making that up. Then you fling suspicion at him in the same post?
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On June 16 2015 05:53 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 05:48 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 05:44 ruXxar wrote:
Just to make it clear to everyone.
I wouldn't mind if Sulfur was lynched for his complete lack of contribution.
However, I would much rather try to lynch a mafia than a shitty town any day of the week.
Wanna know the easiest way to tell the difference between mafia and shitty town? Be mafia. Like seriously there is no way you should be able to tell the difference as town given what sulfur has provided, unless you are mafia and you actually know sulfur's alignment. Well except that this would belie that Sulf is actually town and Ruxxar's case is a simple case of TMI, and I have a very hard time believing that Sulf is town. Associations aside I still don't know if I'd lynch Ruxxar first, but I think at this point I'd do it over Rels. Votecount?How many people are still on him actually, because that may be some interesting info too considering how quickly the wagon started at the beginning of the day.
If ruxxar and sulfur are both mafia I don't think it's unreasonable to think that ruxxar is defending his scum mate who has all but left their team to fend for themselves. I also don't think it's unreasonable to think that ruxxar's case is TMI. So sulfur's alignment doesn't matter, ruxxar is scummy regardless.
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No town should feel confident enough that sulfur of all people is townie enough to defend them with an actual case. Especially someone who has never played with sulfur before.
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EPT
