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On June 05 2015 03:38 disformation wrote:going to /obs this one, too. if I may. 
Try reading me
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Just in case: on june 16th, I'll have my final oral exam. I might turn up drunk if I pass. Also, if I don't pass.
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Hello, people
Sick case already, looking forward to the answers!
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On June 05 2015 15:11 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 14:39 boxerfred wrote:Hello, people Sick case already, looking forward to the answers! lol? lol. ##Vote: boxerfred
You have the best filter EU. Your first participation in this game actually is "lol? lol. vote".
Would you mind to explain why you're voting me? Would you mind to explain why of all posts (and cases) that were put out thus far you choose my post to reply to?
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On June 05 2015 16:53 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 16:33 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 15:11 yamato77 wrote:On June 05 2015 14:39 boxerfred wrote:Hello, people Sick case already, looking forward to the answers! lol? lol. ##Vote: boxerfred You have the best filter EU. Your first participation in this game actually is "lol? lol. vote". Would you mind to explain why you're voting me? Would you mind to explain why of all posts (and cases) that were put out thus far you choose my post to reply to? because it was tonally scummy, for an opening post at this point in the game @JAT I'm just surprised you aren't putting pressure on anyone yourself. Your post looked more like complaining about how prplhz was playing than actually commenting on either player's alignment, and you still have yet to take such a stance. I mean, if you're thinking of prplhz's alignment in relation to how he's going after CHEZINU, isn't there something you'd actually consider in this instance, given the players involved?
##vote yamato77 since your answer looks totally scummy *rolls eyes*
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On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you?
No thought on you or fecal thus far
On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently.
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ok im here for the evening now
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On June 06 2015 04:51 yamato77 wrote:
fecal is right tho, game is pretty boring
until BF does something that looks even remotely townie, I'm content sitting on the idea of lynching him,
you lazy fucks can do the scumhunting this game, I'm uninspired.
nah bro Imma be content with sitting here and reading and spreading the love
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On June 06 2015 19:19 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded.
well I said "I tend to no-lynch" not that I would do it straight away. Fuba why so hard on me when I push yamato the slightiest?
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On June 06 2015 23:26 fuba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:34 prplhz wrote:
@fuba What do you think about marvellosity's read on boxerfred? The read where he says bf's opening sounds different than bf's newbie mafia game? I think it sounds like barely a read. Is that supposed to dissuade me from thinking he could be scum? Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk.
Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded.[/Quote]
Case in point.
On June 06 2015 20:05 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:19 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded. well I said "I tend to no-lynch" not that I would do it straight away. Fuba why so hard on me when I push yamato the slightiest?
Also ignoring what I said, and simply suggesting that the entire thing is a defense of yamato.
brb shower[/QUOTE]
I'm indeed ignoring what you're saying since I don't feel like it has any ground. I don't exactly understand why you say that a "tend to no-lynch" after saying "That guy might be scum" is scummy if it is not for some constructed reasons, trying to get a mis-lynch on a townie. I tend to no-lynch on D1 because it simply makes sense. The probability of hitting a town is way higher than hitting a scum member. I guess you know that. So while I have a scum read on yamato, that scum read is not built on like a rock solid ground but is more a first impression that I'll try to get a grip upon later on. Just like I did when I said "Why are you jumping on me, pulling attention on me instead of my read on yamato?" - Well, instead of replying to that, you just say "LOOK HE'S IGNORING MY WORDS", still shifting attention away from yamato (who seldomly posts anyways) to, oh look, me again.
So. You don't like the bolded part, alright? Well shame, deal with it. On D1, there's no evidence or indications of anything in general besides someone's posts. D1 is the day where (IMHO) scum can just lay back, chill the fuck out and jump on the first guy they feel is probably being mislynched. So BOOM ##unvote ##vote no-lynch until I find a case or create a case which seems to be worth a vote.
I might change my vote lateron though, I did not yet find the time to read through that Artanis story. Weekend with kids do that to people.
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EBWOP: formatting is kinda broken but I guess the main points are understandable.
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On June 07 2015 01:54 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 01:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 06 2015 23:26 fuba wrote:On June 06 2015 16:34 prplhz wrote:
@fuba What do you think about marvellosity's read on boxerfred? The read where he says bf's opening sounds different than bf's newbie mafia game? I think it sounds like barely a read. Is that supposed to dissuade me from thinking he could be scum? On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded. Case in point. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:05 boxerfred wrote:On June 06 2015 19:19 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded. well I said "I tend to no-lynch" not that I would do it straight away. Fuba why so hard on me when I push yamato the slightiest? Also ignoring what I said, and simply suggesting that the entire thing is a defense of yamato. brb shower
I'm indeed ignoring what you're saying since I don't feel like it has any ground. I don't exactly understand why you say that a "tend to no-lynch" after saying "That guy might be scum" is scummy if it is not for some constructed reasons, trying to get a mis-lynch on a townie. I tend to no-lynch on D1 because it simply makes sense. The probability of hitting a town is way higher than hitting a scum member. I guess you know that. So while I have a scum read on yamato, that scum read is not built on like a rock solid ground but is more a first impression that I'll try to get a grip upon later on. Just like I did when I said "Why are you jumping on me, pulling attention on me instead of my read on yamato?" - Well, instead of replying to that, you just say "LOOK HE'S IGNORING MY WORDS", still shifting attention away from yamato (who seldomly posts anyways) to, oh look, me again.
So. You don't like the bolded part, alright? Well shame, deal with it. On D1, there's no evidence or indications of anything in general besides someone's posts. D1 is the day where (IMHO) scum can just lay back, chill the fuck out and jump on the first guy they feel is probably being mislynched. So BOOM ##unvote ##vote no-lynch until I find a case or create a case which seems to be worth a vote.
I might change my vote lateron though, I did not yet find the time to read through that Artanis story. Weekend with kids do that to people. [/QUOTE]
A no-lynch day1 is far worse for town than a mislynch. Just sayin.
[/QUOTE]
Why? Remember, 2nd time TL mafia here
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still gotta follow up on the last pages -.-
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At this point, I'm on page 21. I have read those pages completely and will hopefully get to the rest of the pages until EoD.
I wanted to do something helpful and decided to skim through yamato's filter since he was the guy who voted me.
So, what did I find? Lots (LOTS) of non-helpful posts. Here's a list:
On June 05 2015 15:11 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 14:39 boxerfred wrote:Hello, people Sick case already, looking forward to the answers! lol? lol. ##Vote: boxerfred
Cool reasoning on a vote.
On June 05 2015 17:50 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 17:12 justanothertownie wrote:On June 05 2015 17:01 Mig wrote:On June 05 2015 16:53 justanothertownie wrote:
If what you asked was relevant is debatable. It also does not serve as a good duscusdion starter at all. Fact is compared to your towngames your posts lack opinions and are rather shallow. Asking for opinions on people that have done nothing so far is also not helpful.
I think regardless of your alignment you will not be able to defend against this so if you are town you should probably post something more productive instead. It was relevant to me, I don't really care if you agree. And anyway retarded to complain that it isnt a good discussion starter when you compare it to what else was in the thread (nothing) and the fact that it actually has lead to discussion. I am not asking for your opinions on fuba/artanis. Asking for them to give their opinions on what is happening. Ah, misreas that fuba/artanis thing. Still asking for their opinions is also not helpful. My complaining is not retarded because noone is trying to sell that the early trolling is valuable for the game while you are trying to justify your stuff this way. @Yamato: No idea what your problem is. It should be apparent that I do not think the interactions tells us anything about chez alignment. Accusing him the way he did does not look good for prplhz but there is nothing to pressure here. In fact I would argue that me going against mig is the most pressure anyone in this game has applied so far btw. you don't get it -_- WHATEVER
Cool answer to a longer post.
On June 05 2015 18:40 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:08 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 16:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 05 2015 16:33 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 15:11 yamato77 wrote:On June 05 2015 14:39 boxerfred wrote:Hello, people Sick case already, looking forward to the answers! lol? lol. ##Vote: boxerfred You have the best filter EU. Your first participation in this game actually is "lol? lol. vote". Would you mind to explain why you're voting me? Would you mind to explain why of all posts (and cases) that were put out thus far you choose my post to reply to? because it was tonally scummy, for an opening post at this point in the game @JAT I'm just surprised you aren't putting pressure on anyone yourself. Your post looked more like complaining about how prplhz was playing than actually commenting on either player's alignment, and you still have yet to take such a stance. I mean, if you're thinking of prplhz's alignment in relation to how he's going after CHEZINU, isn't there something you'd actually consider in this instance, given the players involved? ##vote yamato77 since your answer looks totally scummy *rolls eyes* lel Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:32 marvellosity wrote:
boxerfred's entrance seems kinda different to his newbie game (where he was mafia).
That's all I got. I'm blown away, zz
Even better answers. "You did work? Cool, I have my unreasoned opinion and will keep it, thanks."
On June 06 2015 03:59 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 03:29 Fecalfeast wrote:
like I have a bunch of filters open and nothing to say about them because they all suck.
The case on mig is meta from like 100 years ago -sucks
prplhz calling chez mafia for 'making excuses' even though he was directly asked why he was talking differently -sucks
VA talking about mafia QT in 50% of his posts this game -sucks
boxerfred's opener reads like he has a fake smile the entire time and he insults someone's filter less than 12 hours into the game -sucks
Everything sucks You suck.
Great contribution.
On June 06 2015 04:51 yamato77 wrote:
fecal is right tho, game is pretty boring
until BF does something that looks even remotely townie, I'm content sitting on the idea of lynching him,
you lazy fucks can do the scumhunting this game, I'm uninspired.
"Wow guys I won't scumhunt why should I even?" I mean, if you're town, you should be scumhunting, shouldn't you?
On June 06 2015 05:07 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:04 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 04:51 yamato77 wrote:
fecal is right tho, game is pretty boring
until BF does something that looks even remotely townie, I'm content sitting on the idea of lynching him,
you lazy fucks can do the scumhunting this game, I'm uninspired. scummy. very funny
"What, you think that's suspicious? You sure must be joking."
On June 06 2015 05:11 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:08 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:07 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:06 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 04:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I think this game needs some action, berating for people being bad and stuff like that.
I hardclaim jailkeeper. the fuck is your problem? zzzzzzz this is like those artanis medic claims in voice mafia, don't take them seriously Thank you, this is getting much better. On June 06 2015 05:06 marvellosity wrote:
would lynch Artanis -> fuba -> yamato Still bad. hardly, everything you've done and said has been trash. look at yourself if you are town. this is your case on artanis fucking lol
#1
On June 06 2015 05:14 yamato77 wrote:
it says something that I take so little meaning from such a shit post and you apparently think it's enough to have him as your top scumread
fucking LOL
#2
On June 06 2015 07:34 yamato77 wrote:
you're a fucking idiot
I'm getting tired of reading this filter by now.
On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims?
moar rants in capslock, everyone's "an idiot". Yeah, if those claims are real, scum has easy targets at night. However I'd assume that players are actually not that stupid and try to make the best out of the situation instead of contributing exactly NOTHING by saying "LOL U STIPID". Well those claims would only be stupid if they would be 100% right. Wouldn't they? Like, imagine the following hypothetical scenario:
I claim Doc. I have a role PM that says Doc and I am indeed the real Doc, I'm not lying. However, noone can know if I'm lying or not. Townies will have to think about that a lot before mislynching me. However, for scum, it's easier. Because scum knows: even if the claim is a lie, the guy is a townie. So, scum can of course pull out the "YOU'RE SUCH AN IDIOT FOR HARDCLAIMING" card, seemingly being the caring townie who's upset about how a fellow town member ruined the game.
To me, it appears that you are doing exactly that. Why are you so upset about a hardclaim? You cannot possibly know if that is a correct claim, you can only guess, and the most sure on that claim you would be if you'd be scum.
Up to this point, you orchestrated everything well. A mixture of disinterest, insults, yolo'ing and emotional writing. Emotional writing is great since you can never know if it is a concious use of capslock or if it is really someone banging his head on the keyboard in frustration.
And of course there's this gem:
On June 07 2015 03:11 yamato77 wrote:
I gave an alternative and no one listens to me.
I've had better things to do and today I have work. Enjoy finding a good lynch, I tried to do my part.
"I did my work. Do what you must." The intelligent counseller is not listened to, thus he leaves, saying to the peasants "IF YOU DON'T NEED ME, DO BETTER". What kind of town play is that?
##unvote ##vote yamato77
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brb, gotta read up some more stuff.
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On June 06 2015 23:26 fuba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:33 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Sure, there's a town narrative that fits for Artanis[Xp] but not if you consider that he's Artanis[Xp]. Artanis[Xp] hasn't been lynched in like 15 town games. Survived or night killed every single one of them. Is that because he pulls shit like this as town? Or is it because his town is extremely solid and he can rely on just playing normally to not get lynched? How do you reconcile Artanis[Xp]'s meta of never getting lynched as town with his behavior this game? Do you think this is the behavior of someone who never gets lynched? I've never been mislynched either. Is it because of my sterling town play? Just feels like a silly metric to me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:34 prplhz wrote:
@fuba What do you think about marvellosity's read on boxerfred? The read where he says bf's opening sounds different than bf's newbie mafia game? I think it sounds like barely a read. Is that supposed to dissuade me from thinking he could be scum? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:35 prplhz wrote:
like, fuba coming in here with nothing but an inconsistent artanis read and a scum read on the new guy who talks funny is seriously underwhelming I really have trouble understanding how my D1 returns to the thread are consistently underwhelming, when they're almost always the same kinds of posts. Literally 100% of my town games involve returning to the thread to have at least one person declare my entire post scummy, without actually addressing anything that I've said. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:19 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded. Case in point. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:05 boxerfred wrote:On June 06 2015 19:19 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Holy shit, I hate this post. Especially the bolded. well I said "I tend to no-lynch" not that I would do it straight away. Fuba why so hard on me when I push yamato the slightiest? Also ignoring what I said, and simply suggesting that the entire thing is a defense of yamato. brb shower
I can reply to that case although I think it's really not too well constructed. Just to prove I'm town, I pull that up instead of letting it die in older pages. Are there any questions regarding me?
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On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today.
This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move.
On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc.
There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town.
Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too:
+ Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77
He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things:
a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum.
b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it.
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SO I'M UP TO DATE NOW GUYS
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so concluding, my reads:
town:
JAT, NaCL
scum: yamato
null with scum tendency: artanis, fuba, marv
rest is null. gonna look into that JAT vs. prplhz discussion next, maybe I'll find something.
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On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town.
That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato.
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On June 07 2015 06:53 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 06:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town. That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato. Could you explain your other scumleans?
Not with quoted posts, no. Tomorrow I'll do that, but I'm way too tired to do this now.
My Artanis' scum read comes mainly from your post. I like the idea of "too experienced for a dumb move so that might be a scum claim". Fuba since he went at me when I started going on yamato. However he rather early went on Yamato, too, so that weakens my read. That's why I lean him null with a scum tendency and not scum.
Marv, because he got in that fight with yamato and that felt way over the top.
Was that sufficient?
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On June 07 2015 07:01 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 06:57 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 06:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town. That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato. Could you explain your other scumleans? Not with quoted posts, no. Tomorrow I'll do that, but I'm way too tired to do this now. My Artanis' scum read comes mainly from your post. I like the idea of "too experienced for a dumb move so that might be a scum claim". Fuba since he went at me when I started going on yamato. However he rather early went on Yamato, too, so that weakens my read. That's why I lean him null with a scum tendency and not scum. Marv, because he got in that fight with yamato and that felt way over the top. Was that sufficient? meh... you base all your reads on association with yamato which is pretty dangerous.
Yeah true. Probably change my reads depending on this. However, don't we have EoD by now?
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EBWOP: "this" means "depending on the flip" since he's gonna be lynched?
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On June 07 2015 07:15 Fecalfeast wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 07:14 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 07:10 Fecalfeast wrote:
I'm still here, always down for shenanigans Onto which player? boxerfred comes to mind
give it to me, my body is ready
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On June 07 2015 07:09 NaCl`y wrote:
I'm here, albeit sporadically. I feel uneasy about boxerfred. Very uneasy and I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe it's because he seems to have sheeped all of my reads and made it look like his own? I'm not quite sure.
It's also a bit disconcerting that all of the people suddenly popped up, voted yamato and then afk'd again.
I understand that. Saying "I put up my theory by reading through the thread one page by another" doesn't help I guess? My filter diving on yamato happened before I saw your post on him. I know that this is easy to say and hard to prove but that's how it is.
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On June 07 2015 07:17 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i kinda retract my v light boxerfred meta read
i said it because he voted yamato casually right out the gate, whereas in his newbie game he was floundering away saying he didn't know who to vote.
but then he went back to vote no lynch here saying he had no idea again, so yeah, whatever
c'mon meta reads on me are just a bad idea, whether you try it for a town or a scum read. It's been one game, there's not too much meta to brag about.
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On June 07 2015 07:09 NaCl`y wrote:
I'm here, albeit sporadically. I feel uneasy about boxerfred. Very uneasy and I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe it's because he seems to have sheeped all of my reads and made it look like his own? I'm not quite sure.
It's also a bit disconcerting that all of the people suddenly popped up, voted yamato and then afk'd again.
Does it help that I quoted the case that fuba made on me and also your post saying you have a scum read on me? Like why would I do that if I was scum?
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On June 07 2015 07:25 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 07:23 Fecalfeast wrote:
salt boy makes a good point that BF came into thread and basically re-stated what salt said.
I had a perusal of BF's last game where he was scum, he follows thread direction like a puppy in that game. Though in that game he spent a lot of time defending himself day 1.
IDK, I was in the middle of reading his last game and his filter when nacl came in saying bf parroted him Well, he has been following thread sentiment here too. But we have no town baseline to compare this to so... :/
well my general scum strategy is to pretend im town :/
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kaboom
I voted the guy first ppl, I voted the guy first
thank me later
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On June 07 2015 08:10 NaCl`y wrote:
I noticed in boxerfred's mafia game that he likes to bus team mates by the way so he's totally not off the chopping block either. A lot of effort in his post to say basically the same thing as me.
:D I thought exactly this. Hard to argue against that. You're starting a tunnel on me though, I'm town. I'm okay with a mislynch though this time, I'm not a blue role.
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I still don't buy the marv vs. yamato stuff btw
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On June 07 2015 08:21 Fecalfeast wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:18 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 08:10 NaCl`y wrote:
I noticed in boxerfred's mafia game that he likes to bus team mates by the way so he's totally not off the chopping block either. A lot of effort in his post to say basically the same thing as me. :D I thought exactly this. Hard to argue against that. You're starting a tunnel on me though, I'm town. I'm okay with a mislynch though this time, I'm not a blue role. If you are town you basically just offered yourself to mafia as a mislynch candidate. "Hey scum I probably wont fight a mislynch pushed on me, also I'm not blue so don't shoot me"
Or, I lied to protect my green or even red identity, eh?
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Wow just went into Vayne's filter. Not even a whole page. Around EoN though, with two posts indicating that Yamato really did bad plays:
On June 07 2015 08:05 VayneAuthority wrote:
i am really surprised yamato plays like that as scum now too, he has sunk to new lows
On June 07 2015 08:07 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:06 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 08:05 VayneAuthority wrote:
i am really surprised yamato plays like that as scum now too, he has sunk to new lows nah man, yamato always sucked as mafia. i mean just the blatant anger and insults, so unnecessary as scum lol
Vayne, you seem to be bothered quite a lot with the death of yamato? Thought you wouldn't care too much:
On June 07 2015 06:09 VayneAuthority wrote:
i dont think yamato is mafia but dont mind if he dies. hes basically just IamRobik except he doesnt ever get warned for behavior somehow even though every post he makes is a personal insult
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On June 06 2015 08:47 VayneAuthority wrote:
i really dont see whats so unbelievable about jailkeeper/doctor tbh. if there is another blue then it is pretty ridiculous but just the 2 on their own is not a big deal. I would probably give mafia something like roleblocker/vig and call it a day.
Trying to derail townies into thinking about a unlikely setup?
On June 06 2015 10:00 VayneAuthority wrote:
i think mig is still a good lynch tbh, all this confirmed is that the guy is town and giving a genuine opinion on mig.
Weak read followed by a vote?
On June 06 2015 14:52 VayneAuthority wrote:
##vote mig
More shady than slim, bro.
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So, here are my questions, Vayne:
1. Why didn't you think Yamato was mafia? There were quite some strong points raised
2. Why did you initially vote on Mig and then switch to Chenizu?
3. You were around EoN, why not say anything about Yamato?
On June 07 2015 08:07 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:06 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 08:05 VayneAuthority wrote:
i am really surprised yamato plays like that as scum now too, he has sunk to new lows nah man, yamato always sucked as mafia. i mean just the blatant anger and insults, so unnecessary as scum lol
This really makes me feel like your scum ally went over the top and you're really not content with the way things backfired.
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Artanis, are you still claiming Jailor? Why did you hardclaim Jailor in the first place?
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On June 07 2015 08:40 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:38 boxerfred wrote:
Artanis, are you still claiming Jailor? Why did you hardclaim Jailor in the first place? Nope, I'm unclaiming it. Well documented.
Mind to re-elaborate?
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Yeah but did the ruse pay off?
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On June 07 2015 08:47 justanothertownie wrote:
I mean we would have never caught yamato without the fakeclaim, so there is that.
haha yeah
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thoughts on vayne, anyone?
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well good night people, seeya tomorrow.
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On June 08 2015 02:18 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 01:26 NaCl`y wrote:On June 07 2015 22:43 marvellosity wrote:
I don't care if I repeated or not, it's what I think ^^
it could be chez, but it could be several ppl really.
Who are these other people you speak of? I think these people are town: 1.marvellosity 2.justanothertownie 3. NaCl`y 4.prplhz 7. Alakaslam 13. Artanis[Xp] slam is kinda squeezy in betweeny, but i'd still be surprised if he were mafia. so anyone not in that list basically
why are you in that list do you need to point something out?
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On June 07 2015 21:20 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 06:57 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 06:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town. That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato. Could you explain your other scumleans? Not with quoted posts, no. Tomorrow I'll do that, but I'm way too tired to do this now. My Artanis' scum read comes mainly from your post. I like the idea of "too experienced for a dumb move so that might be a scum claim". Fuba since he went at me when I started going on yamato. However he rather early went on Yamato, too, so that weakens my read. That's why I lean him null with a scum tendency and not scum. Marv, because he got in that fight with yamato and that felt way over the top. Was that sufficient? Like this entire post is conditional on yamato flipping mafia, which might be TMI-ish here.
Which part of that post is TMI (I read TMI as "too much information", correct?)?
Like, where is the part where I'm talking about something I'm not supposed to know?
I more and more get the feeling your shittalk with yamato was orchestrated.
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On June 08 2015 06:01 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 05:58 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 21:20 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 06:57 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 06:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town. That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato. Could you explain your other scumleans? Not with quoted posts, no. Tomorrow I'll do that, but I'm way too tired to do this now. My Artanis' scum read comes mainly from your post. I like the idea of "too experienced for a dumb move so that might be a scum claim". Fuba since he went at me when I started going on yamato. However he rather early went on Yamato, too, so that weakens my read. That's why I lean him null with a scum tendency and not scum. Marv, because he got in that fight with yamato and that felt way over the top. Was that sufficient? Like this entire post is conditional on yamato flipping mafia, which might be TMI-ish here. Which part of that post is TMI (I read TMI as "too much information", correct?)? Like, where is the part where I'm talking about something I'm not supposed to know? I more and more get the feeling your shittalk with yamato was orchestrated. Is marv scummy for that read?
Yes
On June 08 2015 05:59 marvellosity wrote:
yes, i can see you're trying to strengthen making something out of nothing, you've been at it a while
not even caring to answer
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On June 08 2015 07:01 NaCl`y wrote:
to what
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On June 08 2015 03:37 NaCl`y wrote:
Boxerfred, what made you go so hardcore on Yamato compared to say, FecalFeast or Fuba. Fuba and Yamato had similar reactions to each other in regards to the claims and Fuba was also shutting down your yamato reads. Why has he not featured in anything you have said at all the entire game? Surely he'd be one of your top suspects since the yamato flip, no? Also fecalfeast did much the same complaints as yamato and you never mentioned him at all.
What made you pick yamato over the others? Similarly with your VayneAuthority read, why does what he say make him mafia but not a towny who just dislikes the way Yamato77 played? Why do you jump to such odd conclusions.
I would also like you to explain why you referenced all of your scum reads in accordance with Yamato77 flipping mafia before he did so.
ah this
he voted me and I don't like people voting me. That made me go at him. I had prepared a piece on fuba, too because he jumped to help yamato. later I saw he pressured yamato too so I said "well fuck this go into yamato filter".
but let's go through it one by one:
What made you pick yamato over the others?
- his vote on me
Similarly with your VayneAuthority read, why does what he say make him mafia but not a towny who just dislikes the way Yamato77 played?
- his appearance EoD compared with his very low post count. He posts seldomly but then drops by to say twice how fucked up yamato is? feels scummy.
I would also like you to explain why you referenced all of your scum reads in accordance with Yamato77 flipping mafia before he did so.
Ya sure. At this point I was voting yamato and I was quite sure he'd be scum. Following that theory, I try to find the person that I feel like made plays that may match it. If you think that was a TMI call, well can't help with that. You can ofc lynch me and then check out who started that bus on me (oh it's marv who I think is at least scummy).
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feel free to ask more questions, I'll be around another 10 mins or so and then in like 8-10 hours again. almost 0:30 here in germany, am
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meanwhile, I want Vayne to answer my questions
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On June 07 2015 21:20 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 06:57 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 06:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 07 2015 06:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? This is what I dislike the most about yamato. Even if we ignore that the crumb is not obvious to anyone else he just assumes that town Artanis felt pressured and claimed because of that. How on earth is it even possible to reach this conclusion with the way the claim went down when Artanis said something like "I am bored.... btw I am JK" to claim for example? It looks like he knows that Artanis is town. That's exactly the point I raised when I pointed to the "what a dumb play"-quotes of yamato. Could you explain your other scumleans? Not with quoted posts, no. Tomorrow I'll do that, but I'm way too tired to do this now. My Artanis' scum read comes mainly from your post. I like the idea of "too experienced for a dumb move so that might be a scum claim". Fuba since he went at me when I started going on yamato. However he rather early went on Yamato, too, so that weakens my read. That's why I lean him null with a scum tendency and not scum. Marv, because he got in that fight with yamato and that felt way over the top. Was that sufficient? Like this entire post is conditional on yamato flipping mafia, which might be TMI-ish here.
On June 07 2015 21:22 marvellosity wrote:
boxerfred's filter is weird because it goes
1. joke (?) vote on yamato
2. "i dunno who to lynch" - #nolynch
3. ...............
4. KILL YAMATO FOR ALL THESE REASONS
5. These guys might all be mafia because unflipped yamato has certain associations with them
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On June 08 2015 07:31 marvellosity wrote:
what's your point? jat/salty came first...
shame that jat is like my top town read and salty appears quite townie to me, too. also, salty asked questions which makes it seem like he wants to come to a certain point and a conclusion while all you do is say "looks scummy" without even trying to elaborate further. salty asked decent questions, you seem to be content with sitting there, buying bus tickets.
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so good night now, gonna be around tomorrow.
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oh also, I completely forgot about saltys questions and simply thought you'd be the first to start. jat's stuff didn't feel like a scum read towards me.
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On June 08 2015 07:35 Fecalfeast wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 07:34 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 07:31 marvellosity wrote:
what's your point? jat/salty came first... shame that jat is like my top town read and salty appears quite townie to me, too. also, salty asked questions which makes it seem like he wants to come to a certain point and a conclusion while all you do is say "looks scummy" without even trying to elaborate further. salty asked decent questions, you seem to be content with sitting there, buying bus tickets. What do you mean by buying bus tickets?
bad metaphor for "he's bussing me"
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On June 08 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 07:34 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 07:31 marvellosity wrote:
what's your point? jat/salty came first... shame that jat is like my top town read I suddenly fear for my life 
well screw it. im not scum and im trying my best to prove it. if you think im scum, go lynch me.
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On June 08 2015 07:48 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 07:34 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 07:31 marvellosity wrote:
what's your point? jat/salty came first... shame that jat is like my top town read and salty appears quite townie to me, too. also, salty asked questions which makes it seem like he wants to come to a certain point and a conclusion while all you do is say "looks scummy" without even trying to elaborate further. salty asked decent questions, you seem to be content with sitting there, buying bus tickets. ah, so now it's about the phrasing of the stuff, glad to have cleared that up do i need to particularly interrogate you when someone else is already doing so? would that make you happy?
It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. You see, I'm trying to collaborate. You're just holding your barrel at me, not even caring about anything else.
Besides your scum read on me, what do you think about Vayne and my stuff on him? What do you think about fuba, given that Artanis claimed to have him blocked? Any more reads on potential scum?
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On June 08 2015 18:56 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 16:28 boxerfred wrote:
It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. You see, I'm trying to collaborate. You're just holding your barrel at me, not even caring about anything else.
Actually can't get over how bad this interpretation is, gonna dissect it for my own amusement Show nested quote +It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. Totally irrelevant to anything? It's like criticising a tennis player for preferring to rally on the baseline or something, it means nothing to anything Show nested quote +You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. The "only" context it looks "remotely scummy"? You mean it's a fucking beacon of townie shining light otherwise? You make a bunch of reads conditional on yamato being mafia, it doesn't take much putting in context. And I was 3rd to the punch! You keep attacking me for it, yet not the others before me, but we'll come to that... Also "a huge TMI blow"? I think my wording at the time was "this may be TMI-ish". Exaggeration much? Show nested quote + I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. Yes, you answered the latter by going "I find these two people townie, so the points they make that are identical to yours are fine. Because I don't find you townie, these points that these 2 townies already mentioned are scummy coming from you." Yes, that doesn't make sense, sorry. You're going after me for points that aren't even mine because I'm the only one you can go after. But there is no logical sense behind it. lol
Three ways to go on:
a) you continue to pick away at my post, not asking a single question, interpreting things the worst way possible.
b) you actually start asking questions that lead to a convincing point
c) people just lynch me, I'll flip VT and boom scum shines.
I don't even care about your answers at this point. You still did not say a single thing that sounds remotely like an indication of me being scum, yet you follow your read hardcore. Sounds like bussing to me.
When you bring up sentences with a question mark again, I'll answer to what you're saying.
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It's so fun how Vayne is still not responding
##vote VayneAuthority
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On June 08 2015 22:35 justanothertownie wrote:
I thought marv was scum?
He's at least communicating, Vayne is not. Bro if you wanna go at me vote me and see me flip VT. I said I stop talking about marv.
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On June 08 2015 22:36 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 20:11 marvellosity wrote:On June 08 2015 19:40 marvellosity wrote:On June 08 2015 19:36 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 18:56 marvellosity wrote:On June 08 2015 16:28 boxerfred wrote:
It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. You see, I'm trying to collaborate. You're just holding your barrel at me, not even caring about anything else.
Actually can't get over how bad this interpretation is, gonna dissect it for my own amusement It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. Totally irrelevant to anything? It's like criticising a tennis player for preferring to rally on the baseline or something, it means nothing to anything You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. The "only" context it looks "remotely scummy"? You mean it's a fucking beacon of townie shining light otherwise? You make a bunch of reads conditional on yamato being mafia, it doesn't take much putting in context. And I was 3rd to the punch! You keep attacking me for it, yet not the others before me, but we'll come to that... Also "a huge TMI blow"? I think my wording at the time was "this may be TMI-ish". Exaggeration much? I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. Yes, you answered the latter by going "I find these two people townie, so the points they make that are identical to yours are fine. Because I don't find you townie, these points that these 2 townies already mentioned are scummy coming from you." Yes, that doesn't make sense, sorry. You're going after me for points that aren't even mine because I'm the only one you can go after. But there is no logical sense behind it. You see, I'm trying to collaborate. lol Three ways to go on: a) you continue to pick away at my post, not asking a single question, interpreting things the worst way possible.b) you actually start asking questions that lead to a convincing point c) people just lynch me, I'll flip VT and boom scum shines. I don't even care about your answers at this point. You still did not say a single thing that sounds remotely like an indication of me being scum, yet you follow your read hardcore. Sounds like bussing to me. When you bring up sentences with a question mark again, I'll answer to what you're saying. I am not interpreting anything in the worst way possible. If you are going to claim that, demonstrate it. Because I didn't. ##Vote: boxerfredat the very least until you can demonstrate how this is even slightly true ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
sorry can't see a question mark
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On June 08 2015 22:37 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:36 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:35 justanothertownie wrote:
I thought marv was scum? He's at least communicating, Vayne is not. Bro if you wanna go at me vote me and see me flip VT. I said I stop talking about marv. Dude if you keep this super defensive whiny attitude up I might just do that. Stop the martyring. Vayne rarely communicates as town. He just doesn't give a fuck usually.
Yeah then do just that. Holy fuck at this point it's all marv picking my posts instead of actually contributing so I go back to the guy who I was looking at anyways, which is Vayne. You can continue this now between me and marv in a pointless discussion, lynch martyring me and see me flip vt or you can actually try to contribute. Until there's nothing new on marv, I don't have anything to construct a case on. I am not going to get wrapped up in pointless discussions.
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On June 08 2015 22:38 marvellosity wrote:
To be very clear, I'd like very much how my post was "interpreting things in the worst way possible." i'd like specifics.
it would make me feel warm and fuzzy and you might get a bj out of it
On June 08 2015 18:56 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 16:28 boxerfred wrote:
It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. You see, I'm trying to collaborate. You're just holding your barrel at me, not even caring about anything else.
Actually can't get over how bad this interpretation is, gonna dissect it for my own amusement Show nested quote +It's not about the phrasing. It's about a point. In my first game, my coach advised me to not only ask random questions or do "he's scummy" statements, but actually try to work towards a point or a conclusion which would help set up a picture of someone that is as bulletproof as it gets. You're not trying to do that. Totally irrelevant to anything? It's like criticising a tennis player for preferring to rally on the baseline or something, it means nothing to anything Show nested quote +You take out one post out of my filter, put it in the only context where it looks even remotely scummy and insist that this post is a huge TMI blow that I made. The "only" context it looks "remotely scummy"? You mean it's a fucking beacon of townie shining light otherwise? You make a bunch of reads conditional on yamato being mafia, it doesn't take much putting in context. And I was 3rd to the punch! You keep attacking me for it, yet not the others before me, but we'll come to that...Also "a huge TMI blow"? I think my wording at the time was "this may be TMI-ish". Exaggeration much? Show nested quote + I already answered Salty's questions. Then, I answered the ones you raised, explaining why I went for you and not for Salty or JAT. Yes, you answered the latter by going "I find these two people townie, so the points they make that are identical to yours are fine. Because I don't find you townie, these points that these 2 townies already mentioned are scummy coming from you." Yes, that doesn't make sense, sorry. You're going after me for points that aren't even mine because I'm the only one you can go after. But there is no logical sense behind it. lol
ok see those? Most of them are exaggerated, eg. "cant get over how bad it is". Next up: "3rd to the punch" yeah I explaind why I cared for your post only. I was not even denying that it looked like TMI. Also it's just wrong that you're the only one I'm attacking, my main points are still on vayne. also there's fucking 48 hours for the day and most of those hours I spent because you keep picking at my posts. Well done, well done. "doesn't make sense"? well it does Oo is there like a rule that says "don't go for one guy only but instead if you name 3 guys you lean to scum then you have to go for all of them in the same weight"? Sorry I missed that.
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On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange.
I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it.
Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down.
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On June 08 2015 22:47 NaCl`y wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:41 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 08 2015 22:36 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:35 justanothertownie wrote:
I thought marv was scum? He's at least communicating, Vayne is not. Bro if you wanna go at me vote me and see me flip VT. I said I stop talking about marv. Dude if you keep this super defensive whiny attitude up I might just do that. Stop the martyring. Vayne rarely communicates as town. He just doesn't give a fuck usually. Yeah then do just that. Holy fuck at this point it's all marv picking my posts instead of actually contributing so I go back to the guy who I was looking at anyways, which is Vayne. You can continue this now between me and marv in a pointless discussion, lynch martyring me and see me flip vt or you can actually try to contribute. Until there's nothing new on marv, I don't have anything to construct a case on. I am not going to get wrapped up in pointless discussions. Unfortunately, they have a point. You say marvellosity was looking worse for pointing out those things but never actually address that he wasn't the first to do so. You say that because Justanothertownie and myself looked towny then he is probably mafia for raising those points. Can you explain how this makes sense? If two people you think are towny had raised those points why does the third person who did the same thing look scummy?
Because the third one did not look towny to me before. We do not know the alignment of others, expect if we'd be scum or masons or whatever.
So:
I read person 1 as town.
I read person 2 as town.
I read person 3 as scum.
They all say the same: "Your behaviour looks scummy/TMI'ish". So I say: "well p1 is probably town. No need to go at them for that. p2? Same. But wait, there's p3. I thought he's scummy anyways, and now he goes at me? Wait a second.."
See the logic?
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On June 08 2015 22:50 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. This is just deeply inconsistent - either the things on you are valid/scummy or they are not. So even if you think jat/salty are town, you should be attacking their reasoning, rather than simply attacking me for holding the same/similar reasoning.
It's valid that this was a TMI-ish call, can't deny that. If you go in my filter, you'll see that I needed a while to realize that. So I see why there's a scum lean on me.
Regarding the bolded part: oh should I? Why should I stop going after you?
|
On June 08 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. That's fine. It is a good reason to townread me. But if marv has the same thoughts about your posting than me then that itself cannot be scummy since I am town.Ok, so you claim he is only adding fuel to the fire. Maybe. But that's not all he is doing, right? He did not focus only on you. He made quite a few posts about mig for example. Do you think those posts are scummy too?
Explain the bolded part, I don't understand it. Why can't he be scum AND point out my TMI-ish behaviour?
"Do you think those posts are scummy too?"
Cant say. In general, asking questions and building cases is a good thing for town. Of course that can be a try to mis-lynch.
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On June 08 2015 22:54 justanothertownie wrote:
Like, I want you to read marvs filter and tell me what you think of it if you ignore his push on you.
That's a great idea. I'll do this.
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On June 06 2015 05:04 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 04:51 yamato77 wrote:
fecal is right tho, game is pretty boring
until BF does something that looks even remotely townie, I'm content sitting on the idea of lynching him,
you lazy fucks can do the scumhunting this game, I'm uninspired. scummy.
On June 06 2015 05:07 marvellosity wrote:
not funny. i've heard the "woe betide is me, i cba to do things, you guys do things" shtick before
and you've done it twice already.
Good posts on yamato being scum.
On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum.
No vote following that up however, and no reasoning. Lateron, he says it "was an emotional reaction".
See also:
On June 07 2015 01:13 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 01:11 NaCl`y wrote:On June 07 2015 01:06 marvellosity wrote:Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. i do this sort of thing all the time. so either you don't know my play at all, or you're just trying to guess how i'd play. both options suck. While you may lynch people like that "all the time" that is because you have simply eliminated the possibility of other people being mafia through repeated interactions and thinking. Something that is severely lacking from you in this game. I do not believe you call Artanis[Xp] confirmed mafia for his claim with the provision that you'll leave him alone unless someone counterclaims him: On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. and then see a counterclaim yet still call him possibly mafia but not want to lynch him 10,000 times over when this would pander to your ego for finding him. because the first quote is an emotional reaction the second is me making myself step back and think basically a massive towntell.
True, but what I don't like is that you point out that it's a towntell. That could be a scum play.
On June 06 2015 06:16 marvellosity wrote:
##unvote
##vote: fuba
come play, sweetie
Coming out of nothing, really. Just a pressure vote for an afk I guess.
Then, two pages of oneliners happen, with great posts like..
On June 06 2015 20:56 marvellosity wrote:
there should really be a "rules people should pay attention to" part of every OP
On June 07 2015 00:13 marvellosity wrote:
is my read on you reasonable, fuba?
On June 07 2015 01:32 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 01:21 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:17 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:15 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:12 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:08 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:04 marvellosity wrote:
boring. maybe you should lynch me then, that would be fun.
i don't really understand why jat thinks i might be mafia though. I had the feeling since your first posts and your reaction to the claims HAS been pretty weird in the sense that you agreed with my logic but still did not join my wagon and went for this lurker scumread on Fuba instead. And like salty said this mod question is just really really strange. Why do you understand other people scumreading you but not me? because i've not done very much, but usually you have been quite good at picking up on my tone as town, so i thought you would have in this instance too. also you know (re: getting on artanis' wagon) that i can be swayed by a logical argument but still not "feel it" as much as i maybe should. (or in fact shouldn't, given how things have turned out - seems i was right. being scumread for being right in the end would be annoying) Yes, it would be annoying but you were not right. You called my stuff convincing which means you thought Artanis was more than likely mafia. I don't know what's not to feel about that when you called him mafia BEFORE the counterclaim and then a counterclaim happens but you still do not want to lynch Artanis. so why would i play like that as mafia??? set up my lynch and then not go for it, for free, when you give me an ironclad argument i can vote on, and i will never, ever, ever come under scrutiny because i attacked artanis first? i don't get the logic Because you KNOW that Artanis is town and are cautious because if you also know that NaCl is town then you know something is up. you believe this? fine. that's ludicrous, but ok. whatever floats your boat.
"You don't like my reasoning? Well fuck it then". Not liking that.
On June 07 2015 07:27 marvellosity wrote:
bitch pls
get on my level
Quality
On June 08 2015 02:18 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 01:26 NaCl`y wrote:On June 07 2015 22:43 marvellosity wrote:
I don't care if I repeated or not, it's what I think ^^
it could be chez, but it could be several ppl really.
Who are these other people you speak of? I think these people are town: 1.marvellosity 2.justanothertownie 3. NaCl`y 4.prplhz
7. Alakaslam13. Artanis[Xp] slam is kinda squeezy in betweeny, but i'd still be surprised if he were mafia. so anyone not in that list basically
Why those two in particular?
On June 08 2015 19:42 marvellosity wrote:
also, boxerfred - bussing = attacking/voting a team-mate
watch that lingo, boy
Oh. I thought bussing = getting a vote train on someone going with the intention of a mis-lynch. :<
Regarding mic: well scum read with decent reasoning into meta town read, full circle. I like that he went off me and onto someone else, though he backed off rather fast. I'd like to know what he thinks about Vayne, as I pointed out before.
Re-reading my stuff vs. him - I might want to erase those posts from the thread, most of it is rather emotional and dumb. Shouldn't post late-night.
Fire at will now
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On June 08 2015 22:57 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:53 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:50 marvellosity wrote:On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. This is just deeply inconsistent - either the things on you are valid/scummy or they are not. So even if you think jat/salty are town, you should be attacking their reasoning, rather than simply attacking me for holding the same/similar reasoning. It's valid that this was a TMI-ish call, can't deny that. If you go in my filter, you'll see that I needed a while to realize that. So I see why there's a scum lean on me. Regarding the bolded part: oh should I? Why should I stop going after you? I just explained? Literally everything you have on me is: 1. you don't like my shit-fight with yamato, which is just a feeling (NB: I have never, to my recollection, just randomly shit-fighted with any of my mafia partners for no reason whatsoever. But that's just a sidenote) 2. you are attacking my reasoning on you which somehow you accept is valid coming from two of your "townreads". no bueno.
Yeah true. And guess what, I voted Vayne thus far, not you.
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On June 08 2015 23:25 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 23:21 boxerfred wrote:On June 06 2015 05:04 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 04:51 yamato77 wrote:
fecal is right tho, game is pretty boring
until BF does something that looks even remotely townie, I'm content sitting on the idea of lynching him,
you lazy fucks can do the scumhunting this game, I'm uninspired. scummy. On June 06 2015 05:07 marvellosity wrote:
not funny. i've heard the "woe betide is me, i cba to do things, you guys do things" shtick before
and you've done it twice already. Good posts on yamato being scum. On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. No vote following that up however, and no reasoning. Lateron, he says it "was an emotional reaction". See also: On June 07 2015 01:13 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:11 NaCl`y wrote:On June 07 2015 01:06 marvellosity wrote:Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. i do this sort of thing all the time. so either you don't know my play at all, or you're just trying to guess how i'd play. both options suck. While you may lynch people like that "all the time" that is because you have simply eliminated the possibility of other people being mafia through repeated interactions and thinking. Something that is severely lacking from you in this game. I do not believe you call Artanis[Xp] confirmed mafia for his claim with the provision that you'll leave him alone unless someone counterclaims him: On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. and then see a counterclaim yet still call him possibly mafia but not want to lynch him 10,000 times over when this would pander to your ego for finding him. because the first quote is an emotional reaction the second is me making myself step back and think basically a massive towntell. True, but what I don't like is that you point out that it's a towntell. That could be a scum play. On June 06 2015 06:16 marvellosity wrote:
##unvote
##vote: fuba
come play, sweetie Coming out of nothing, really. Just a pressure vote for an afk I guess. Then, two pages of oneliners happen, with great posts like.. On June 06 2015 20:56 marvellosity wrote:
there should really be a "rules people should pay attention to" part of every OP On June 07 2015 00:13 marvellosity wrote:
is my read on you reasonable, fuba? On June 07 2015 01:32 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:21 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:17 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:15 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:12 marvellosity wrote:On June 07 2015 01:08 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 01:04 marvellosity wrote:
boring. maybe you should lynch me then, that would be fun.
i don't really understand why jat thinks i might be mafia though. I had the feeling since your first posts and your reaction to the claims HAS been pretty weird in the sense that you agreed with my logic but still did not join my wagon and went for this lurker scumread on Fuba instead. And like salty said this mod question is just really really strange. Why do you understand other people scumreading you but not me? because i've not done very much, but usually you have been quite good at picking up on my tone as town, so i thought you would have in this instance too. also you know (re: getting on artanis' wagon) that i can be swayed by a logical argument but still not "feel it" as much as i maybe should. (or in fact shouldn't, given how things have turned out - seems i was right. being scumread for being right in the end would be annoying) Yes, it would be annoying but you were not right. You called my stuff convincing which means you thought Artanis was more than likely mafia. I don't know what's not to feel about that when you called him mafia BEFORE the counterclaim and then a counterclaim happens but you still do not want to lynch Artanis. so why would i play like that as mafia??? set up my lynch and then not go for it, for free, when you give me an ironclad argument i can vote on, and i will never, ever, ever come under scrutiny because i attacked artanis first? i don't get the logic Because you KNOW that Artanis is town and are cautious because if you also know that NaCl is town then you know something is up. you believe this? fine. that's ludicrous, but ok. whatever floats your boat. "You don't like my reasoning? Well fuck it then". Not liking that. On June 07 2015 07:27 marvellosity wrote:
bitch pls
get on my level Quality On June 08 2015 02:18 marvellosity wrote:On June 08 2015 01:26 NaCl`y wrote:On June 07 2015 22:43 marvellosity wrote:
I don't care if I repeated or not, it's what I think ^^
it could be chez, but it could be several ppl really.
Who are these other people you speak of? I think these people are town: 1.marvellosity 2.justanothertownie 3. NaCl`y 4.prplhz
7. Alakaslam13. Artanis[Xp] slam is kinda squeezy in betweeny, but i'd still be surprised if he were mafia. so anyone not in that list basically Why those two in particular? On June 08 2015 19:42 marvellosity wrote:
also, boxerfred - bussing = attacking/voting a team-mate
watch that lingo, boy Oh. I thought bussing = getting a vote train on someone going with the intention of a mis-lynch. :< Regarding mic: well scum read with decent reasoning into meta town read, full circle. I like that he went off me and onto someone else, though he backed off rather fast. I'd like to know what he thinks about Vayne, as I pointed out before. Re-reading my stuff vs. him - I might want to erase those posts from the thread, most of it is rather emotional and dumb. Shouldn't post late-night. Fire at will now I have nothing to fire at will at, because this is a bunch of random commentary that shows nothing about anything
After reading your filter and completely disregarding what happened between us two only, I feel like you're an uneasy person who rather fucks up mafia games by throwing in random oneliners and emotional responses. Also, your tone is rather arrogant. Your filter is more townish than scummy, and I hate to say that. :-*
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On June 08 2015 23:58 NaCl`y wrote:
I'd appreciate if you were more accommodating to new people. Thank you.
Nah it's okay. It's his way of posting, why change that. This is not a newbie game.
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I have a pretty good idea who nacl is. By the way salty, who are you scum reads as of now?
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Gonna look into Fuba in a few
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On June 09 2015 03:48 NaCl`y wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 03:31 boxerfred wrote:
I have a pretty good idea who nacl is. By the way salty, who are you scum reads as of now? Do share with the class! I do not particularly know at this time since half of the players have disappeared. If I had to base it primarily from reactions and such that I remember it would be some variant of you/Chezinu/Fuba, possibly FecalFeast. Fuba's post today left me most perplexed.
cakepie. Same style of writing/posting, very sophisticated and detailed. The thing that made me commit to that was your defense of new players. 
Regarding fuba - I think he has valid reasonings behind his stuff. Like when he initially voted me for my push on yamato into unvoting etc., that was an okay-ish argumentation. He then drew a connection between marv and me, here:
On June 06 2015 23:26 fuba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:33 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 15:59 fuba wrote:Sorry, I was really out of it today. First, regarding the claims... I can't find a reason to really disbelieve NaCl's claim. Was at least leaning town on him before it (mostly because of the case that people seem to agree seems accurate, though I haven't had the time to look into mig's previous games myself). That being said, I can't really decide what to make of Artanis's claim. My instinct is to believe him, though that instinct has bitten me in the ass before. Like prplhz said, his story does have a consistency to it that leads me to believe he's telling the truth. The fact that prplhz's view suddenly seemed to flip on the subject makes me... uncomfortable. On June 05 2015 20:40 boxerfred wrote:On June 05 2015 18:10 Mig wrote:
boxerfred what do you think of me? Fecal?
Is your vote for yamato a serious one? You believe he's most likely to be scum just because he voted you? No thought on you or fecal thus far On yamato? Given that he lurks, only to make a vote on me, only to leave another short, lurky comment? Yeah could very well be. That's not too solid however. I tend to no-vote currently. I think I'd prefer to lynch this guy. Gives reasons to see yamato as scummy>says yamato could be scummy>backs off on it>prefers no-lynch over guy he thinks could be scum. I mean, I understand wishy-washiness better than anyone, but he definitely seems to just be coasting by. Like... if he'd really given enough thought to preferring a no-lynch over a yamato lynch, why didn't he then switch his vote? He seems to just be saying things to say things, giving the appearance of participation, and disappearing. ##Vote boxerfredGotta get some sleep, but I'll get up an hour or two early to read/talk. Sure, there's a town narrative that fits for Artanis[Xp] but not if you consider that he's Artanis[Xp]. Artanis[Xp] hasn't been lynched in like 15 town games. Survived or night killed every single one of them. Is that because he pulls shit like this as town? Or is it because his town is extremely solid and he can rely on just playing normally to not get lynched? How do you reconcile Artanis[Xp]'s meta of never getting lynched as town with his behavior this game? Do you think this is the behavior of someone who never gets lynched? I've never been mislynched either. Is it because of my sterling town play? Just feels like a silly metric to me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:34 prplhz wrote:
@fuba What do you think about marvellosity's read on boxerfred? The read where he says bf's opening sounds different than bf's newbie mafia game? I think it sounds like barely a read. Is that supposed to dissuade me from thinking he could be scum?
He completely unfollows that train of thoughts though.
I can't really find any points from which I'd give him a scum lean thus far. Only thing to note is that he never really commits to something. On the other hand, he genuinely explains his thoughts and soft pushes. I'd expect him to go harder at people when the game goes further but at this point, he's poking very softly and disappears again then. So at this point I'm willing to read him town.
Also, regarding me: FF says I'm looking rather frustrated than townish, fuba also goes for a null/town read on me, for other reasons though. It's interesting that Salty, while being all polite, obviously has a strong scum read on me. Hm.
So here's a "feeling ranking" of all the players:
marvellosity:
town tendency. His filter didn't give any clues of huge scum players or anything that would indicate a thing. Also, he started a case on Mig, I guess that's something.
justanothertownie
Town. Still for his read that I quoted earlier and nothing that would indicate a scum alignment.
NaCl`y
Town. If I remember correctly, he also went hard on yamato. gotta re-check but I'm kinda sure.
fuba
town tendency. see this post.
VayneAuthority
scum tendency. Because he didn't really answer my questions and pops up every now and then only
FecalFeast
town tendency. his posts feel good and are very reasoned. no derailing or similar.
So that makes me locate the living scum members at:
prplhz, chezinu, HTS, Mig, VA (in no particular order).
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On June 09 2015 04:16 Fecalfeast wrote:
boxerfrank if you think marv is unfairly twisting your words, why are you content to look elsewhere? Willfully misrepresenting someone is a scum trait and you could easily make a case on marv if you compiled all the ways in which he misrepresented your argument.
I think I did the most reasonable thing: I dived his filter without taking the clash between him and me into account to get a mostly objective read on him. I reacted way too emotional to his posts and let me drag down in fast typing without much thinking. Like, I skimmed his posts and answered without putting too much thought into it. That kinda sucks. That is why I am quite content with not checking if he actually twisted my words. I'll probably dive into that conversation once more sooner this day (or next day) but at this point, I feel like there are plenty of people to concentrate on.
Another thing I want to talk about is NaCl's (fake) Doctor claim when Artanis claimed Jailor.
On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77
This huge post basically shouts "I'M TOWN". What happened to the marv scum read, NaCl? I realized that you kept me in your recent list, while Chezinu went from "no idea about" to "scum". Why is he scum by now? I am asking that because the fight between me and Marv pulled (IMHO) too much attention off previous thoughts and cases. I don't want that to happen. Also, I want you to filter dive on me and make a case. You're posting in a fair and reasonable way and I'll try to explain anything you find in a genuine way.
|
Hm. JAT insisted on Artanis' claim to be a scum play. After like page 2-3, his filter dies, almost solely oneliners without much town stuff.
Here is why I townread him in the first place:
On June 08 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. That's fine. It is a good reason to townread me. But if marv has the same thoughts about your posting than me then that itself cannot be scummy since I am town. Ok, so you claim he is only adding fuel to the fire. Maybe. But that's not all he is doing, right? He did not focus only on you. He made quite a few posts about mig for example. Do you think those posts are scummy too?
However, this is like the only post that gives a clear and big town indication.
Here is his most recent top lynch list:
On June 09 2015 01:31 justanothertownie wrote:
Hm.
Right now I would lynch into Fuba, chezinu and maybe boxerfred too. Pretty disappointing how lazy all those suspects are. FF and Migs recent absence is also annoying.
JAT, can you actually elaborate on why Fuba, why chezinu, why me? If I missed explaining posts in your filter, just quote them to me.
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On June 09 2015 18:25 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 15:42 prplhz wrote:
justanothertownie's d2 impact is extremely lacking considering that he's universally townread and he has an 11 page filter. Who does he event want to kill today? Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 15:57 Mig wrote:
What has JTA done this entire game? He is around constantly, but how many people have you seen him push to get lynched? The only person this entire game that JTA has been 100% gunho on lynching was artanis. Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 16:35 Fecalfeast wrote:On June 09 2015 16:11 prplhz wrote:
probably not gonna read assassination/aperture.
jta is interesting to me because he hasn't done much today even though showing on d1 that he wanted to lead town. then everybody town read him and poof.
would you lynch jta over chez today if you could have it your way? i tend to agree with this I have probably done more than all 3 of you clowns together. Just sayin.If you do not know who I want to kill you did not read my filter. If you think I need to be gungho about lynching anyone as town you are wrong. Assassination is not representative of my mafia play but we can ignore that because more importantly Aperture is DEFINITELY NOT representative of my town play. I even made that a point after the game that people should not meta read me comparing to that game. Mig is probably excused because he wasn't around for that but it is probably one of the worst games you could use to try and meta me. But what's even more disturbing is how you say that the sandroba quote is fitting my play this time around? Seriously? You think I have been angry or detached this game at all? Please.
What have you done besides the Artanis theory crafting?
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On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 17:50 boxerfred wrote:Hm. JAT insisted on Artanis' claim to be a scum play. After like page 2-3, his filter dies, almost solely oneliners without much town stuff. Here is why I townread him in the first place: On June 08 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. That's fine. It is a good reason to townread me. But if marv has the same thoughts about your posting than me then that itself cannot be scummy since I am town. Ok, so you claim he is only adding fuel to the fire. Maybe. But that's not all he is doing, right? He did not focus only on you. He made quite a few posts about mig for example. Do you think those posts are scummy too? However, this is like the only post that gives a clear and big town indication. Here is his most recent top lynch list: On June 09 2015 01:31 justanothertownie wrote:
Hm.
Right now I would lynch into Fuba, chezinu and maybe boxerfred too. Pretty disappointing how lazy all those suspects are. FF and Migs recent absence is also annoying. JAT, can you actually elaborate on why Fuba, why chezinu, why me? If I missed explaining posts in your filter, just quote them to me. How come you go from a solid townread to this? Do you think migs case is that good? The fact that posts are oneliners says NOTHING about their quality. I gave reasons for you being possibly mafia (I cannot imagine that you of all people forgot them either) and I repeatedly called out posts by fuba I thought were awful and/or scummy. Up to the point where I went to sleep yesterday no reason to scumread chez was required because he simply wasn't participating in the game. And as far as I see he still isn't really.
I filter dived you. I pointed out why I read you town and I think that since that happened, you didn't commit to anything that would strengthen that read.
On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:26 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:25 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 15:42 prplhz wrote:
justanothertownie's d2 impact is extremely lacking considering that he's universally townread and he has an 11 page filter. Who does he event want to kill today? On June 09 2015 15:57 Mig wrote:
What has JTA done this entire game? He is around constantly, but how many people have you seen him push to get lynched? The only person this entire game that JTA has been 100% gunho on lynching was artanis. On June 09 2015 16:35 Fecalfeast wrote:On June 09 2015 16:11 prplhz wrote:
probably not gonna read assassination/aperture.
jta is interesting to me because he hasn't done much today even though showing on d1 that he wanted to lead town. then everybody town read him and poof.
would you lynch jta over chez today if you could have it your way? i tend to agree with this I have probably done more than all 3 of you clowns together. Just sayin.If you do not know who I want to kill you did not read my filter. If you think I need to be gungho about lynching anyone as town you are wrong. Assassination is not representative of my mafia play but we can ignore that because more importantly Aperture is DEFINITELY NOT representative of my town play. I even made that a point after the game that people should not meta read me comparing to that game. Mig is probably excused because he wasn't around for that but it is probably one of the worst games you could use to try and meta me. But what's even more disturbing is how you say that the sandroba quote is fitting my play this time around? Seriously? You think I have been angry or detached this game at all? Please. What have you done besides the Artanis theory crafting? I won't even entertain this. Read my filter and you will know.
I did, and I don't know. Care to explain?
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On June 09 2015 18:32 justanothertownie wrote:
I must say boxerfred questioning me after 3 people voiced suspicion on me strikes me as very opportunistic.
Well my vote is still on Vayne and I'm just asking questions that do not even imply that you're scum. I just want you to strengthen my town read on you. Is that too much to ask? I feel like you're overly defensive here.
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On June 09 2015 18:46 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:45 marvellosity wrote:
I was supposed to think about boxerfred today, but it seems like a lot of effort.
I can't decide what his backing off me means. Genuine re-read or opportunistic because i'm a rather more annoying foe than bargained for?
Are the people who were suspicious of him before now happy with him? Not really. I feel like he is just going with thread sentiment. He backed off of you after NaCl and me made it very clear that he would not have success with that push multiple times.
If I was going with thread sentiment I would not ever have gotten in that shitwar with Marv. Also, I wouldn't have made a case on Vayne (that is still being disregarded). Also, I would have voted for Chenizu instead asking why you did not imply him. Also, I wouldn't pressure you. It's just Mig popping up and asking "Wait, why exactly is JAT town?" - and I asked specific questions that you refuse to answer. I wouldn't call that thread sentiment. Thread sentiment was basically "look there's Chez let's discuss with him in friendly banter". You might've noticed I completely refrained from that, also because I simply don't understand everything he's saying. I backed off of marv since I was advised to read his filter without the shitwar which I did.
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On June 09 2015 18:48 marvellosity wrote:
why is your vote still on vayne exactly?
you don't push him in the thread, other people don't seem interested, but you don't seem interested that other people aren't interested
i'm interested that you don't seem interested that other people don't seem interested in your lynch choice.
interested.
I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance?
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On June 09 2015 18:48 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:47 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:32 justanothertownie wrote:
I must say boxerfred questioning me after 3 people voiced suspicion on me strikes me as very opportunistic. Well my vote is still on Vayne and I'm just asking questions that do not even imply that you're scum. I just want you to strengthen my town read on you. Is that too much to ask? I feel like you're overly defensive here. I do not care about "strenghtening your townread". Why would you need me to strengthen the townread if I am your top townread anyways?
Well you are not anymore, given your dodgy answers. If you have no interest in proving that you're town, well that's your business. Boom, tinfoil hat: if I was a scum member, I'd know already you're town and wouldn't need to test the waters. People are watching me already, why should I draw more attention to me by poking my so-far top town read?
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On June 09 2015 18:46 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 17:50 boxerfred wrote:Hm. JAT insisted on Artanis' claim to be a scum play. After like page 2-3, his filter dies, almost solely oneliners without much town stuff. Here is why I townread him in the first place: On June 08 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. That's fine. It is a good reason to townread me. But if marv has the same thoughts about your posting than me then that itself cannot be scummy since I am town. Ok, so you claim he is only adding fuel to the fire. Maybe. But that's not all he is doing, right? He did not focus only on you. He made quite a few posts about mig for example. Do you think those posts are scummy too? However, this is like the only post that gives a clear and big town indication. Here is his most recent top lynch list: On June 09 2015 01:31 justanothertownie wrote:
Hm.
Right now I would lynch into Fuba, chezinu and maybe boxerfred too. Pretty disappointing how lazy all those suspects are. FF and Migs recent absence is also annoying. JAT, can you actually elaborate on why Fuba, why chezinu, why me? If I missed explaining posts in your filter, just quote them to me. How come you go from a solid townread to this? Do you think migs case is that good? The fact that posts are oneliners says NOTHING about their quality. I gave reasons for you being possibly mafia (I cannot imagine that you of all people forgot them either) and I repeatedly called out posts by fuba I thought were awful and/or scummy. Up to the point where I went to sleep yesterday no reason to scumread chez was required because he simply wasn't participating in the game. And as far as I see he still isn't really. I filter dived you. I pointed out why I read you town and I think that since that happened, you didn't commit to anything that would strengthen that read. On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 18:26 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:25 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 15:42 prplhz wrote:
justanothertownie's d2 impact is extremely lacking considering that he's universally townread and he has an 11 page filter. Who does he event want to kill today? On June 09 2015 15:57 Mig wrote:
What has JTA done this entire game? He is around constantly, but how many people have you seen him push to get lynched? The only person this entire game that JTA has been 100% gunho on lynching was artanis. On June 09 2015 16:35 Fecalfeast wrote:On June 09 2015 16:11 prplhz wrote:
probably not gonna read assassination/aperture.
jta is interesting to me because he hasn't done much today even though showing on d1 that he wanted to lead town. then everybody town read him and poof.
would you lynch jta over chez today if you could have it your way? i tend to agree with this I have probably done more than all 3 of you clowns together. Just sayin.If you do not know who I want to kill you did not read my filter. If you think I need to be gungho about lynching anyone as town you are wrong. Assassination is not representative of my mafia play but we can ignore that because more importantly Aperture is DEFINITELY NOT representative of my town play. I even made that a point after the game that people should not meta read me comparing to that game. Mig is probably excused because he wasn't around for that but it is probably one of the worst games you could use to try and meta me. But what's even more disturbing is how you say that the sandroba quote is fitting my play this time around? Seriously? You think I have been angry or detached this game at all? Please. What have you done besides the Artanis theory crafting? I won't even entertain this. Read my filter and you will know. I did, and I don't know. Care to explain? No, I do not.
You really make me want to vote you with that stuff.
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On June 09 2015 18:54 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:54 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 18:53 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:48 marvellosity wrote:
why is your vote still on vayne exactly?
you don't push him in the thread, other people don't seem interested, but you don't seem interested that other people aren't interested
i'm interested that you don't seem interested that other people don't seem interested in your lynch choice.
interested. I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? Show me this. Given my last words about Chez were "i'd happily die to take you [Chez] down" Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 17:58 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 17:29 Mig wrote:
Chezy I don't think you actually think I am mafia.
Your hatter claim is obviously bs, that role is too fun for you, 0 chance you forget about the game as a hatter. The only reason you are claiming I am mafia is because you are claiming that I am mafia team mates with marv and now am trying to save him. Really don't think you believe that.
I guess that probably means you are mafia and now just spamming stuff you don't believe to distract the thread and cause chaos. I agree with this btw. There's no reason for Chez to think I am mafia (and i am not). Push on FF was ?? and is now gone with the wind. Now he's bringing Mig into it? meh whatever. i'd happily die to take you down, chez my friend
I just re-read the last pages and apparently, I was wrong with that. Still got the feeling though that besides the votes on Chez, noone is really trying to read into his posts and find out what's going on.
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On June 09 2015 18:54 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:51 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:46 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 18:45 marvellosity wrote:
I was supposed to think about boxerfred today, but it seems like a lot of effort.
I can't decide what his backing off me means. Genuine re-read or opportunistic because i'm a rather more annoying foe than bargained for?
Are the people who were suspicious of him before now happy with him? Not really. I feel like he is just going with thread sentiment. He backed off of you after NaCl and me made it very clear that he would not have success with that push multiple times. If I was going with thread sentiment I would not ever have gotten in that shitwar with Marv. Also, I wouldn't have made a case on Vayne (that is still being disregarded). Also, I would have voted for Chenizu instead asking why you did not imply him. Also, I wouldn't pressure you. It's just Mig popping up and asking "Wait, why exactly is JAT town?" - and I asked specific questions that you refuse to answer. I wouldn't call that thread sentiment. Thread sentiment was basically "look there's Chez let's discuss with him in friendly banter". You might've noticed I completely refrained from that, also because I simply don't understand everything he's saying. I backed off of marv since I was advised to read his filter without the shitwar which I did. And who did advise you to do that? ME. But you think I haven't done anything except for the Artanis thing. Good job. And going against me after mig, prplhz and FF previously voiced suspicion IS going with thread sentiment because I think at least 2/3 of those are town.
True that! See, you actually CAN point to something. That's all I wanted. Well done.
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On June 09 2015 18:57 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 18:55 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:46 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 18:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 17:50 boxerfred wrote:Hm. JAT insisted on Artanis' claim to be a scum play. After like page 2-3, his filter dies, almost solely oneliners without much town stuff. Here is why I townread him in the first place: On June 08 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:On June 08 2015 22:49 boxerfred wrote:On June 08 2015 22:45 justanothertownie wrote:
And you are still scumreading marv for pointing things out about you that I pointed out first while you are townreading me which is very very strange. I'm reading you town for this + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 06:26 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. This post is really good. The bad thing for me is that I have to trust in what he's saying on marv's and artanis' backstory in mafia, I don't have the experience to judge that. However, given how Yamato reacts to the claim ("it's so stupid to claim!!") this feels like he makes the claim look like a bad town move and not a genious scum move. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. There, Mig jumps the train, too. All those posts have one thing in common, and that is not Artanis, but Yamato. I really think he's a good lynch by now, even if he's town. Also, NaCl (who I read as town for his explanations and the idea behind his CC) made the spoilered post, mentioning Yamato in a reasonable way, too: + Show Spoiler +On June 07 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:First and foremost, I'd just like to get this out of the way. I am NOT the doctor. I decided to do this for reasons twofold: 1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed:
The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far.
prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 07:55 NaCl`y wrote:
@Everyone
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote:On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy? No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote:
seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games
it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now.
I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:26 marvellosity wrote:On June 06 2015 05:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. You are going to be so disappointed. then why did you claim? what possible motivation when you have a total of 1 vote on you? Because the thread was boring and I figured with the attention you gave to that part mafia would've certainly noticed and probably figured it out. This way at least everyone has the info. that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote:
There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here.
None.
He is scum. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote:
yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote:
Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add
what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly
like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely
that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway.
soooo......
Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote:
Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia.
Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:57 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:48 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote:
Okay, JAT, we'll make assumptions about a closed setup and then blame balance and stupid hosting postgame when you're wrong and you lynched a fucking protective role that wasn't even directly counterclaimed.
Why should I not believe Artanis' claim? And unless NaCl is literally suicidal, why the fuck would he do this as mafia? You need to answer these questions rather than just scream your assumptions in the thread. Yes, doing this would be suicidal as NaCl. That's why we are lynching Artanis who made a claim that as town made no fucking sense at all and outed a powerrole in the process. It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? It is literally irrelevant if NaCl is an idiot or not. Artanis claim makes 0 sense from a town pov. The crumb is not obvious at all. Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote:
Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way.
I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation.
I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either.
This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity
People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar)
##unvote
##vote yamato77 He also reads me as scum - well AMA then, really don't want to make you think that. Since you refer to my last game for your statement, I'll say 2 things: a) 1 game of many to come is not indicative of how I play, neither as scum nor as town. It was my first game ever on TL mafia, even my first game ever in a forum. b) Can you please point out the parallels that you are seeing so scum boxerfred can get rid of them? Nah kidding. You don't need to explain the parallels to me as of now but before you start a train on me getting a mislynch, I want to have the reasoning behind it. Since town is supposed to find scum I'm not mad at you for pointing out things on me that look scummy. It's fine, go on. I just don't like marv jumping that train. He's just adding fuel to the fire. Shame I'm adding more fuel by myself already, I need to calm down. That's fine. It is a good reason to townread me. But if marv has the same thoughts about your posting than me then that itself cannot be scummy since I am town. Ok, so you claim he is only adding fuel to the fire. Maybe. But that's not all he is doing, right? He did not focus only on you. He made quite a few posts about mig for example. Do you think those posts are scummy too? However, this is like the only post that gives a clear and big town indication. Here is his most recent top lynch list: On June 09 2015 01:31 justanothertownie wrote:
Hm.
Right now I would lynch into Fuba, chezinu and maybe boxerfred too. Pretty disappointing how lazy all those suspects are. FF and Migs recent absence is also annoying. JAT, can you actually elaborate on why Fuba, why chezinu, why me? If I missed explaining posts in your filter, just quote them to me. How come you go from a solid townread to this? Do you think migs case is that good? The fact that posts are oneliners says NOTHING about their quality. I gave reasons for you being possibly mafia (I cannot imagine that you of all people forgot them either) and I repeatedly called out posts by fuba I thought were awful and/or scummy. Up to the point where I went to sleep yesterday no reason to scumread chez was required because he simply wasn't participating in the game. And as far as I see he still isn't really. I filter dived you. I pointed out why I read you town and I think that since that happened, you didn't commit to anything that would strengthen that read. On June 09 2015 18:30 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 18:26 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:25 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 15:42 prplhz wrote:
justanothertownie's d2 impact is extremely lacking considering that he's universally townread and he has an 11 page filter. Who does he event want to kill today? On June 09 2015 15:57 Mig wrote:
What has JTA done this entire game? He is around constantly, but how many people have you seen him push to get lynched? The only person this entire game that JTA has been 100% gunho on lynching was artanis. On June 09 2015 16:35 Fecalfeast wrote:On June 09 2015 16:11 prplhz wrote:
probably not gonna read assassination/aperture.
jta is interesting to me because he hasn't done much today even though showing on d1 that he wanted to lead town. then everybody town read him and poof.
would you lynch jta over chez today if you could have it your way? i tend to agree with this I have probably done more than all 3 of you clowns together. Just sayin.If you do not know who I want to kill you did not read my filter. If you think I need to be gungho about lynching anyone as town you are wrong. Assassination is not representative of my mafia play but we can ignore that because more importantly Aperture is DEFINITELY NOT representative of my town play. I even made that a point after the game that people should not meta read me comparing to that game. Mig is probably excused because he wasn't around for that but it is probably one of the worst games you could use to try and meta me. But what's even more disturbing is how you say that the sandroba quote is fitting my play this time around? Seriously? You think I have been angry or detached this game at all? Please. What have you done besides the Artanis theory crafting? I won't even entertain this. Read my filter and you will know. I did, and I don't know. Care to explain? No, I do not. You really make me want to vote you with that stuff. I would call you bad for this but that would be unfair since you are so new. If someone openly refuses to do useless requests like that for you while talking about more important things that is generally not a scumtell.
Wow thanks so much great master!
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w00t gonna get out of here, the tone is like really unforgiving. I'm trying my best, if I'm just a bad player, lynch me already and see which side I flip.
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Just doens't make sense to continue discussion here. I'm asking stuff and get blamed for it, so I'll just leave it here and pop up if I feel the need to do so. This game IMHO has enough lurkers, I'll join the ranks of those.
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On June 09 2015 19:12 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:04 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:03 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:54 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 18:54 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 18:53 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 18:48 marvellosity wrote:
why is your vote still on vayne exactly?
you don't push him in the thread, other people don't seem interested, but you don't seem interested that other people aren't interested
i'm interested that you don't seem interested that other people don't seem interested in your lynch choice.
interested. I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? Show me this. Given my last words about Chez were "i'd happily die to take you [Chez] down" On June 09 2015 17:58 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 17:29 Mig wrote:
Chezy I don't think you actually think I am mafia.
Your hatter claim is obviously bs, that role is too fun for you, 0 chance you forget about the game as a hatter. The only reason you are claiming I am mafia is because you are claiming that I am mafia team mates with marv and now am trying to save him. Really don't think you believe that.
I guess that probably means you are mafia and now just spamming stuff you don't believe to distract the thread and cause chaos. I agree with this btw. There's no reason for Chez to think I am mafia (and i am not). Push on FF was ?? and is now gone with the wind. Now he's bringing Mig into it? meh whatever. i'd happily die to take you down, chez my friend I just re-read the last pages and apparently, I was wrong with that. Still got the feeling though that besides the votes on Chez, noone is really trying to read into his posts and find out what's going on. What do you take from this observation? This is a perfectly civil question you could answer it.
Chez' filter is basically unreadable and really strange so why would anyone dive in there and try to find something? Feels like reading a pothead's diary.
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On June 09 2015 19:14 marvellosity wrote:
so what's your point?
Can't extract a point of such weirdness, sorry.
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On June 09 2015 19:15 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:15 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:14 marvellosity wrote:
so what's your point? Can't extract a point of such weirdness, sorry. i'll rephrase my question. why did you say the observation in the first place?
Because I wanted to explain my feeling that people backed off of Chez. I found out that this might be because of his filter.
On June 09 2015 19:16 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:15 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:14 marvellosity wrote:
so what's your point? Can't extract a point of such weirdness, sorry. wat, you just questioned why people aren't trying to read into his posts.
Yes. And questioning wants answering so I tried to find an answer. There I found it.
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1. marv is wrong, I am interested. My vote is still on. He didn't post too much since my case so what am I supposed to add to it now?
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Since 1 is wrong, the rest is pretty much constructed.
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On June 09 2015 19:20 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:19 boxerfred wrote:
1. marv is wrong, I am interested. My vote is still on. He didn't post too much since my case so what am I supposed to add to it now? Well, but apparently noone else is interested and that does not seem to bother you.
YES
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On June 09 2015 19:20 marvellosity wrote:
1 being wrong or right is totally irrelevant to the rest being correct
I didn't even go deep into why people care or not care for chez until you guys asked me and pinned me on it so it's constructed.
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On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other
No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there.
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not gonna continue that circlejerk now.
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On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne Show nested quote +I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here.
What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit.
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On June 09 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
Can't decide if most obvious mafia ever or not.
On June 09 2015 19:25 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:23 boxerfred wrote:
not gonna continue that circlejerk now. you can't keep running away and martyring every time the heat is on. Firstly, that makes you a pussy. Secondly, that makes you a pussy.
Can't decide if strong scum tag team or simply circlejerking nerds.
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On June 09 2015 19:28 marvellosity wrote:
nerds, coming from you?
cute
yeah I'm not really angry so I choose my insults on a ironical basis.
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On June 09 2015 19:28 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:27 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here. What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit. I distinctly remember telling you that VA doing jackshit does not make him scum and that he tends to not give a fuck as town.
I distinctly remember that I played one game of Mafia thus far here and can't tell if you're right.
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On June 09 2015 19:30 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:29 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:28 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 19:27 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here. What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit. I distinctly remember telling you that VA doing jackshit does not make him scum and that he tends to not give a fuck as town. I distinctly remember that I played one game of Mafia thus far here and can't tell if you're right. Ok, then ask ANYONE else if it is true. We can't all be mafia. Why did you not do that?
Sorry was busy circlejerking and overly defensive. So you're saying "Vayne is not scum despite the points raised since he's normally absent when he's town"?
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On June 09 2015 19:31 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:29 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:28 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 19:27 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here. What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit. I distinctly remember telling you that VA doing jackshit does not make him scum and that he tends to not give a fuck as town. I distinctly remember that I played one game of Mafia thus far here and can't tell if you're right. + Show Spoiler [VayneAuthority] +5 minutes of your time to confirm/deny jat
Wow, such small filters.
##unvote
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On June 09 2015 19:35 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:33 prplhz wrote:
jat maybe you can not be a dick and we'd all have a better time? Can you maybe play the game instead of whining about my play and we'd all have a better time? I wouldn't even have to be mean to you.
yay circlejerking without me this time, I like that
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I'll try to think more and post less.
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On June 10 2015 00:24 fuba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 00:18 justanothertownie wrote:On June 10 2015 00:15 Half the Sky wrote:
Someone (you marv?) said he had a hard time posting as scum and a quote like that with a response like that (second quote) makes me think (if what you are saying is correct) he's posting just to post.
That's the impression I get from reviewing those last two things of his filter.
He says Vayne is scummy and I'm having a tough time seeing why, you are having a tough time seeing why and then he says "I never said....etc....it's pretty much all I can say."
The quotes alone don't make him mafia but based on what you (or whoever said it) know about him, that he has trouble posting or in this case explaining his position on Vayne. Exactly. Right now, I'm still thinking BF is town. Though I'm gonna read his previous game to see if I get the same feeling from him there as I do here. And I have little idea about Vayne. The only thing I directly remember about him is his reaction to yamato flipping (which was either just an honest town reaction or scum wifom) and the fact that he reposted his post about me from our last game together (which would seem to indicate he's a survivor XD). So... my current VA read is a whole lot of *shrugs*
My behaviour this game is totally different from last game I have to say. Lots of bullshit posts and lots of fights that I normally don't take.
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On June 10 2015 00:04 Half the Sky wrote:
If that was it, then that's even worse than I expected.
I checked VA's filter now - he voted once for Mig and once for Chez, post-lynch reaction he's saying wtf Yamato has sunk to new lows (paraphrasing) so that just doesn't compute logically on my end.
On June 07 2015 08:31 boxerfred wrote:Wow just went into Vayne's filter. Not even a whole page. Around EoN though, with two posts indicating that Yamato really did bad plays: Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:05 VayneAuthority wrote:
i am really surprised yamato plays like that as scum now too, he has sunk to new lows Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 08:07 VayneAuthority wrote:On June 07 2015 08:06 justanothertownie wrote:On June 07 2015 08:05 VayneAuthority wrote:
i am really surprised yamato plays like that as scum now too, he has sunk to new lows nah man, yamato always sucked as mafia. i mean just the blatant anger and insults, so unnecessary as scum lol Vayne, you seem to be bothered quite a lot with the death of yamato? Thought you wouldn't care too much: Show nested quote +On June 07 2015 06:09 VayneAuthority wrote:
i dont think yamato is mafia but dont mind if he dies. hes basically just IamRobik except he doesnt ever get warned for behavior somehow even though every post he makes is a personal insult
On June 07 2015 08:33 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 08:47 VayneAuthority wrote:
i really dont see whats so unbelievable about jailkeeper/doctor tbh. if there is another blue then it is pretty ridiculous but just the 2 on their own is not a big deal. I would probably give mafia something like roleblocker/vig and call it a day. Trying to derail townies into thinking about a unlikely setup? Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:00 VayneAuthority wrote:
i think mig is still a good lynch tbh, all this confirmed is that the guy is town and giving a genuine opinion on mig. Weak read followed by a vote? More shady than slim, bro.
Yes.
On June 10 2015 00:00 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2015 22:59 fuba wrote:
I will say that the scummiest thing about vane isn't even anything he did. In yamato's last game, he opened with an instant vote for VA. Basically a policy lynch. I think he could have done the same thing this game and not looked suspicious, but he didn't. Maybe because he didn't want to bus so early? *shrugs*
(At work for the next few hours) Alright Marv (from your quote on this), I am also having this same problem with this quote he says on Vayne. Vayne doesn't post much as either alignment, and even as scum he's not as tryhard as he was supposedly before (well I learnt that the hard way in Aperture 4). I also don't understand the associative read that he makes between yam and VA here. Fuba are you referring to the timing of the vote here that makes Vayne scummy? Had to read this more than a few times now. I checked the vote count and VA voted Chez so I am completely confused by this? In any case looking at the rest of the filter, I still would have expected some followup if he had a problem with Vayne. Even a one-liner for what it was worth.
So we not dropping Vayne, ya? fredies likes that.
##vote Chezinu because everyone does it anyways. I guess I'll be next up for the lynch so let this not be a mislynch, please.
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On June 10 2015 00:30 marvellosity wrote:
I bring that out in people <3
I've halfway given up on this game already.
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On June 10 2015 00:34 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 00:28 boxerfred wrote:
My behaviour this game is totally different from last game I have to say. Lots of bullshit posts and lots of fights that I normally don't take. And how does bullshit and fighting make you town (by the way you worded it)?
Not at all. But my read on Vayne, my filter diving on yamato (when I typed this post, I hadn't read NaCl's case yet but I guess that will nobody believe anyways) and my conclusions to it, my push on marv.
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thing is that when I have to catch up on pages, I read them, quote a post, answer to it, continue reading. I don't know if you can see this from my posting behaviour. when nacl's case was built up, I had to catch up 10+ pages because I had been busy before.
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On June 10 2015 07:00 NaCl`y wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 06:55 Chezinu wrote:On June 10 2015 06:52 marvellosity wrote:
are you actually going to claim or what? I claimed day 1. I doubt most voters even read my filter. Then why did you ignore 2 doctor claims and vote someone else? Why did you check marvellosity over fecalfeast who you had called mafia the entirety of day 1? Why did you leave it so long to "out" a red check on marvellosity? Why did you leave it till an hour before deadline to properly claim?
On June 09 2015 17:02 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote:Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind.Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. On June 06 2015 07:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also as scum if this had happened I'd know I'd have been caught and just afk for the rest of the day. Self-meta and all but it's probably accurate. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. Good stuff
maybe? dunno
if he flips green, we lynch marv amirite?
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no wait if he flips blue that is
well gnite won't be around eod because i need to sleep.
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On June 10 2015 07:08 marvellosity wrote:
we're not lynching marv whatever happens
haha you wish
##unvote ##vote marvellosity
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On June 10 2015 07:09 marvellosity wrote:
oh don't flatter yourself honey.
b-but I'm looking so good today
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Why exactly is marv town, jat?
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On June 11 2015 01:42 marvellosity wrote:ask yourself, you went through my filter and came to the town conclusion
nah it's not about this. I wanna know why jat thinks it.
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On June 11 2015 02:14 justanothertownie wrote:You will probably not like the reason. Ok, first of all he is putting in quite a bit of effort even though we lynched mafia day1 and it is his second consecutive scumgame. He could do that as scum but it is something. But more importantly the reason I scumread him early day1 can be explained by what he said about not being joyful as town. Dick move analysis says he would not try to convince me that this is the case with the argument that he wants to retire from playing mafia. I just do not think he would do that. If he did, fine. It will never work again. But I doubt it. And fortunately if we lynch his partner he will probably concede anyways - it will get easier to lynch him the longer he lives. So I do not concern myself too much with doubting him.
hmkay
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I actually think it's not too unlikely for marv and jat to be a scum tag team. They're both going for the easy target (me) and continue reading each other town. Especially JAT is not really doing huge cases, he's more following things other people say and keeping discussions running with oneliners.
On June 11 2015 02:14 justanothertownie wrote:You will probably not like the reason. Ok, first of all he is putting in quite a bit of effort even though we lynched mafia day1 and it is his second consecutive scumgame. He could do that as scum but it is something. But more importantly the reason I scumread him early day1 can be explained by what he said about not being joyful as town. Dick move analysis says he would not try to convince me that this is the case with the argument that he wants to retire from playing mafia. I just do not think he would do that. If he did, fine. It will never work again. But I doubt it. And fortunately if we lynch his partner he will probably concede anyways - it will get easier to lynch him the longer he lives. So I do not concern myself too much with doubting him.
This post is one of the seldom times where he really answers to a question. JAT, I didn't ask why you read him scum D1. Also, what brings you on the idea he'd concede that easy if his scum partner gets lynched? There are not too many people down yet and at this point, there's no pressure on him. That's quite the green read you're doing without having anything actually based on his filter.
On June 11 2015 02:15 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 02:11 VayneAuthority wrote:
well i suck at actual scumhunting, back to gut reads.
mig train choo choo Fuba and boxer will both have to go before I even consider lynching mig.
I understand wanting to lynch fuba first but since you said that you're not really sure if I'm scum or if my plays are just dumb/newbie/whatever I wonder what brings you to this. Also, Mig is one of the few guys that's actually pressuring you (or has been). Saying "he's doing rightfully so because it's a town effort" is a very charming move - if you'd be scum.
On June 10 2015 08:12 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 08:11 NaCl`y wrote:
No. Tomorrow we absolutely are lynching Fuba. You should not contest this lynch. Why the sudden confidence?
On June 10 2015 08:16 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 08:14 Half the Sky wrote:On June 10 2015 08:12 justanothertownie wrote:On June 10 2015 08:11 NaCl`y wrote:
No. Tomorrow we absolutely are lynching Fuba. You should not contest this lynch. Why the sudden confidence? JAT, look at pages 67-68. Confidence isn't sudden. Yeah, I just saw. Well, if I go with my personal opinion I could lynch Fuba in a heartbeat. I am just giving marv a little credit and he is calling him town :/
On June 10 2015 08:18 justanothertownie wrote:The point about the absolutes is definitely true.
Talk about following thread sentiment. I mean, this is quite weak to say because the arguments towards fuba are reasonable. Meta reads can be wrong though and in my opinion are not the strongest instruments to rely upon. This is not meant to be a defense of fuba but more a thing to point out that it is easy for pretty much everyone to agree on those points (well I do), for scum as well as for town.
On June 11 2015 03:29 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 03:26 Fecalfeast wrote:
wow 16 pages of one-liners. That's impressively annoying to read. Better than 16 pages of not-one-liners. Btw. it's nice and all that you are reading a filter/doing anything at all but what exactly is the point? Are you sad that I am scumreading you? If you are town it would be more productive to read the filter of someone that could actually be mafia.
This post strikes me a lot. While you rather disregard Mig's concerns about you (blabla, "rather lynch bf and fuba before talking about Mig", you react pissed to Fecalfeast's post, implying you're seriously fucking town. Do you see yourself as a confirmed town or what makes you so sure FF is gonna believe that you "could actually be" not "mafia"?
Let's go on:
On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis.
So you'll 100% lynch the guy who just claimed a vital town role? Because of the #sickPlays? I mean, there couldn't happen a better thing for scum to have the JK lynched D1. You seem to not care for that risk.
On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad.
Look, scum believed.
On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me.Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup?Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER.
Bro, I did. However, the second bolded part strikes me. This really looks like a genuine discussion between scum yamato and not-scum JAT. Was that orchestrated? I imagine this scenario:
1. Artanis claims JK.
2. scum qt discusses if it's a true claim or not
3. CC of Salty happens
4. scum qt goes a bit nuts and starts discussing about who to lynch
5. they decide to take those discussions to the public since it would be quite the ruse to cover up the connection between them.
Hm. Feels constructed, even to me. But if not, it's really a sick play. #tinfoilhat.
On June 06 2015 07:44 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 07:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:39 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. We don't know what roles scum have. I'm not quite as convinced as you, more so because I see little reason for you to fakeclaim as scum here. Then again, Toad did do it in LX or whatever so I guess it's possible, but it seems unlikely. On June 06 2015 07:37 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On June 06 2015 07:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Which ruse? I've already fully owned up to being bad. Are you going to be bad with me? Your claim is so utterly terrible it is mindblowing. I have no idea how you can think doing this is a good idea (at least as town) regardless of your role. I refuse to believe that you actually felt threatened by 1 fucking vote. I have not been trying to figure out the game? When I was in the thread I was basically the only one to do this at all. I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I also don't believe you thought scum would catch on to your ridiculous "crumb". You are not this bad. I actually figured you already figured it out when you kept talking about how bad I looked yet never voted or actually pushed me. I don't doubt that a 3-player scumteam would figure it out themselves. Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. On June 06 2015 07:40 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:37 yamato77 wrote:On June 06 2015 07:35 justanothertownie wrote:On June 06 2015 07:33 NaCl`y wrote:On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote:
@Artanis
I think you know which ruse I am talking about.
I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. If this is a harcclaim we are 100 % lynching artanis. care to explain? I'm all ears. There are never both jk and doctor in the game. If the salty guy hardclaims we are lynching the shit out of artanis. In the worst case he trades 1:1 with mafia NaCl. So you're banking on lynching claims in a closed setup? Yeah, no. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. How does lock and jail not make sense together? When marv pointed it out so strongly I figured it was obvious. Why would you ever think that? Why would he ever point that out if he really thinks that? As town he would never point it out if he thinks it is a crumb. As scum he would also never do it and instead just kill you.
First sentence: subtle scum read on marv. Second sentence: subtle town read on marv. Given that your filter is consisting of 95% oneliners, that's another indicator of you not commiting too much on anything. Even your first D1 vote (on Artanis) isn't an unsafe one.
On June 06 2015 08:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Ok, tell me:
1) Why would scum NaCl counterclaim if they can shoot town artanis in the night?
2) How on earth does Artanis play make sense from a town pov? Do you think he is usually a pretty stupid guy?
You REALLY wanted to get him lynched, eh? Even voting him.
On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today.
Here you explain it. First sentence: what makes you so sure that NaCl's claim is a true one? That is a slight TMI call to me. You hide it nicely, talking about setup speculation which at this point is likely to keep everyone busy. However while you strongly doubt Artanis' claim, you don't put a second thought onto NaCl's claim being a fake one. Why not? Why are you so sure that his claim is real? Does it make that much sense for a Doctor to claim D1, even if Artanis' claim was fake for real (which is something that salty could not know). You're experienced, why didn't you identify that CC just as a play to test the waters (hell even I did that)?
Next you say, "the situation is the following". Holy hell it's D1 and you cannot possibly know what drives people to do what they do. Yet you construct a theory that is terribly wrong. Next bolded part: "Artanis had weak scum games in the past. Now he's pulling an absolutely sick move!" How does that make sense? Like: "meta says Artanis sucks as scum but I'm sure he's rocking it this time!"
On June 06 2015 19:52 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 14:04 Alakaslam wrote:On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote:
Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this:
First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game:
The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim?
The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched).
On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots.
So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he?
Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation?
The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit.
If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. I don't have to explain shit to youI do as I damn well please Yes, you actually have to. If you are town and want to win that is. I am town and I WILL lynch artanis today. So if you have reason to think he isctown you need to tell them. If you do not have a reason like that/if you cannot refute my case on artanis there is no excuse for voting anyone else.
Are you serious? You so often did not answer raised questions. You're not following your own town guidelines.
On June 07 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote:
##Unvote
Yes, marv might be mafia. Gonna read you yamato bit now.
lel. Strongly going on Artanis, weak scum read on marv, boom switch into yamato (note, only announcing "to read a bit" not putting much pressure) after a huge case by Salty was done. Not too eager on following that case huh.
C'mon, this is just D1. I'm on page 4 of his filter now. Gonna come back to it later.
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On June 11 2015 04:10 marvellosity wrote:
how does any of this commentary make him mafia exactly?
Shame you don't see it.
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On June 11 2015 04:14 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 04:11 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:10 marvellosity wrote:
how does any of this commentary make him mafia exactly? Shame you don't see it. I mean this in all seriousness, and not as a criticism of you, so please take it in the spirit it's intended (we'll assume you're town for now) when you talk about someone, you need to be clear/concise about how what you're saying is more likely to come from a mafia perspective than a town perspective this isn't the first time you've done this - you just comment on a series of posts and you create your own narrative. Well, I (and also most other players in this game) can easily provide you with an alternative narrative. A better case structure is as follows: 1. jat does this thing (1 or 2 quotes as evidence) 2. here's why it makes sense from a mafia perspective 3. here's why i don't think it's the town perspective 4. conclusion
1. jat does only oneliners, has a huge misread on Artanis which I don't think would come from such an experienced player.
2. jat does a TMI-ish call on NaCl (yamato got hanged for a similar one on artanis)
3. a filter of oneliners is not townish
4. thus he's scummy
On June 11 2015 04:20 Half the Sky wrote:
BF, two major flaws in your case offhand.
1 The one-liner thing is not a valid argument. First JAT does that as both alignments. Second if you don't trust what I, or anyone else, says there on JAT, case building is not the only way to go about doing things, most people on this forum generally prefer conversational approach to scumhunting, some people find it easier to detect scumtells in conversation. There are some people like Damdred, Trfel, Tictock, myself, ritoky to a lesser extent that do go the case route, but to be a truly masterful mafia player on this site, you should know how to work both conversationally and via case route.
2 A number of those points about the Artanis claim are similar to what Mig tried to do when scumreading JAT and I shot just about everything down. There are honest reasons to doubt a claim and I can tell you haven't looked into those.
ad 1: this is not a meta read but a "he's not very townie in the majority of his posts". note that "not very townie != scummy"
ad 2: okay I can get that, but what about my TMI argument on NaCl's claim? The bolded part?
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On June 11 2015 04:14 justanothertownie wrote:
That boxerfred post is so remarkably shit that I consider lynching him over fuba.
You have my vote. And my axe.
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On June 11 2015 04:23 justanothertownie wrote:
I won't even adress most of this bullshit because it is pretty obvious how wrong the whole narrative is but what really sticks out to me is how BF says "it was clear that NaCl was just testing the waters with his cc - even I saw it". Where on earth does this shit come from? Even if this wasn't incredibly wrong in the first place I was his TOP townread before for exactly the reason that I went at Artanis/for the claim analysis thing. It doesn't make ANY sense.
Are you so pissed you aren't anymore?
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On June 11 2015 04:27 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 04:07 boxerfred wrote:
Here you explain it. First sentence: what makes you so sure that NaCl's claim is a true one? That is a slight TMI call to me. You hide it nicely, talking about setup speculation which at this point is likely to keep everyone busy. However while you strongly doubt Artanis' claim, you don't put a second thought onto NaCl's claim being a fake one. Why not? Why are you so sure that his claim is real? Does it make that much sense for a Doctor to claim D1, even if Artanis' claim was fake for real (which is something that salty could not know). You're experienced, why didn't you identify that CC just as a play to test the waters (hell even I did that)?
Next you say, "the situation is the following". Holy hell it's D1 and you cannot possibly know what drives people to do what they do. Yet you construct a theory that is terribly wrong. Next bolded part: "Artanis had weak scum games in the past. Now he's pulling an absolutely sick move!" How does that make sense? Like: "meta says Artanis sucks as scum but I'm sure he's rocking it this time!"
This whole part makes no fucking sense with how boxerfred played day1. It does not compute.
Yeah feels like I did what I said I'd do: post not so often but put more effort in my posts and think things out. Keep on not answering. You're my top vote by now.
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On June 11 2015 04:36 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 04:32 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:07 boxerfred wrote:
Here you explain it. First sentence: what makes you so sure that NaCl's claim is a true one? That is a slight TMI call to me. You hide it nicely, talking about setup speculation which at this point is likely to keep everyone busy. However while you strongly doubt Artanis' claim, you don't put a second thought onto NaCl's claim being a fake one. Why not? Why are you so sure that his claim is real? Does it make that much sense for a Doctor to claim D1, even if Artanis' claim was fake for real (which is something that salty could not know). You're experienced, why didn't you identify that CC just as a play to test the waters (hell even I did that)?
Next you say, "the situation is the following". Holy hell it's D1 and you cannot possibly know what drives people to do what they do. Yet you construct a theory that is terribly wrong. Next bolded part: "Artanis had weak scum games in the past. Now he's pulling an absolutely sick move!" How does that make sense? Like: "meta says Artanis sucks as scum but I'm sure he's rocking it this time!"
This whole part makes no fucking sense with how boxerfred played day1. It does not compute. Yeah feels like I did what I said I'd do: post not so often but put more effort in my posts and think things out. Keep on not answering. You're my top vote by now. I don't care in the slightest. I am never getting lynched this game. You on the other hand just volunteered to be hanged day3.
Cool so people can lynch you when I flip VT
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On June 11 2015 04:46 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 04:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:36 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:32 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:07 boxerfred wrote:
Here you explain it. First sentence: what makes you so sure that NaCl's claim is a true one? That is a slight TMI call to me. You hide it nicely, talking about setup speculation which at this point is likely to keep everyone busy. However while you strongly doubt Artanis' claim, you don't put a second thought onto NaCl's claim being a fake one. Why not? Why are you so sure that his claim is real? Does it make that much sense for a Doctor to claim D1, even if Artanis' claim was fake for real (which is something that salty could not know). You're experienced, why didn't you identify that CC just as a play to test the waters (hell even I did that)?
Next you say, "the situation is the following". Holy hell it's D1 and you cannot possibly know what drives people to do what they do. Yet you construct a theory that is terribly wrong. Next bolded part: "Artanis had weak scum games in the past. Now he's pulling an absolutely sick move!" How does that make sense? Like: "meta says Artanis sucks as scum but I'm sure he's rocking it this time!"
This whole part makes no fucking sense with how boxerfred played day1. It does not compute. Yeah feels like I did what I said I'd do: post not so often but put more effort in my posts and think things out. Keep on not answering. You're my top vote by now. I don't care in the slightest. I am never getting lynched this game. You on the other hand just volunteered to be hanged day3. Cool so people can lynch you when I flip VT I am sorry to disappoint you but that is not how this works
No you're not
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On June 11 2015 05:07 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 05:02 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:46 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:36 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:32 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 04:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 04:07 boxerfred wrote:
Here you explain it. First sentence: what makes you so sure that NaCl's claim is a true one? That is a slight TMI call to me. You hide it nicely, talking about setup speculation which at this point is likely to keep everyone busy. However while you strongly doubt Artanis' claim, you don't put a second thought onto NaCl's claim being a fake one. Why not? Why are you so sure that his claim is real? Does it make that much sense for a Doctor to claim D1, even if Artanis' claim was fake for real (which is something that salty could not know). You're experienced, why didn't you identify that CC just as a play to test the waters (hell even I did that)?
Next you say, "the situation is the following". Holy hell it's D1 and you cannot possibly know what drives people to do what they do. Yet you construct a theory that is terribly wrong. Next bolded part: "Artanis had weak scum games in the past. Now he's pulling an absolutely sick move!" How does that make sense? Like: "meta says Artanis sucks as scum but I'm sure he's rocking it this time!"
This whole part makes no fucking sense with how boxerfred played day1. It does not compute. Yeah feels like I did what I said I'd do: post not so often but put more effort in my posts and think things out. Keep on not answering. You're my top vote by now. I don't care in the slightest. I am never getting lynched this game. You on the other hand just volunteered to be hanged day3. Cool so people can lynch you when I flip VT I am sorry to disappoint you but that is not how this works No you're not You got me - I am not. But if you get lynched and happen to be incredibly wrong town instead of scum then I will never get lynched for that.
If you turn out to be scum after the game I'll make you all remember that moment
well if not you'll make me remember I guess
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##vote JAT
I'm not even gonna defend myself, I played so bad.
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On June 11 2015 17:59 justanothertownie wrote:
If we lynch through this list:
Boxerfred, (Fuba), Mig
the game might be won already.
Haha no
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On June 11 2015 18:44 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 18:43 Mig wrote:
It sounds to me like you aren't actually trying to consider whether I am town at all. You are not giving me any reason to consider that.
Haha you don't give reasons yourself. All you say to raised things is basically "LEL SO STUHPIT"
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On June 11 2015 09:46 NaCl`y wrote:Rest in peace, dear marvellosity! ##vote boxerfredI know I made a lot of posts on Fuba being mafia and honestly he probably still is mafia! There is now someone else that I have a greater passion for lynching. Boxerfred. This is because of quite a few reasons and all of them are backed up simply by reading the game so I'll make this short and quoteless due to a lack of time.
Day 1: Boxerfred's play can be summarised on day 1 as simply going from clueless and spreading feelers in directions (such as on yamato briefly etc) to full on try hard and associative based on Yamato77 flipping mafia before he actually has (most damning). He also says Justanothertownie is his top town read going into night 1 for his reaction to the Artanis[Xp] situation etc. I feel like this was a disingenuous flip of "ability" to read people that simply didn't fit with his earlier playstyle. It conveniently kicked in when it was decided Yamato77 was the lynch anyway.
Day 2: Boxerfred meekly pushes VayneAuthority and is quite happy to use any excuse whatsoever to just disappear from it when provided with little evidence: Show nested quote +On June 09 2015 19:33 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:31 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:29 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:28 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 19:27 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:21 marvellosity wrote:
the *point* is that you made the point about Chez *because* I questioned you on Vayne, so you turned it around to people talking or backing off Chez
one caused the other No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here. What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit. I distinctly remember telling you that VA doing jackshit does not make him scum and that he tends to not give a fuck as town. I distinctly remember that I played one game of Mafia thus far here and can't tell if you're right. + Show Spoiler [VayneAuthority] +5 minutes of your time to confirm/deny jat Wow, such small filters. ##unvote Yes, it's a quote. I lied earlier. He then jumps on Chezinu because it was what everyone else was doing. Suddenly, Boxerfred makes a big case on Justanothertownie being mafia which contained all of the posts that Boxerfred said made Justanothertownie his top town on day 1. Note earlier when he dropped his VayneAuthority read based on people giving evidence to the opposite? Now this is not the case for Justanothertownie. Unfortunately I can't finish this due to time, will continue later.
Look that's a solid town post, JAT, not the bullshit you're producing on the daily basis. I'd follow this case any day. It's a shame I played so dumb because I don't see me surviving this day anyway. However, JAT, look at such posts. They are towny. Your posts simply aren't, they are uncommiting rubbish. All the way down your filter. You're actively spitting out bullshit post after bullshit post.
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On June 11 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
And I have no intention of being nice to you if you are pushing on me as scum or if you are being an idiot as town which are the only 2 possible worlds right now.
How about you do something productive instead and tell me why we should not lynch boxerfred? You seem to just ignore him and his wagon entirely.
wait wait wait I thought we lynch me eh? You said "WE ARE GOING TO LYNCH YOU DAY THREE" and now you want to hear reasons on why not to vote me? Haha sure bro start committing to something already -.- you're boring.
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On June 11 2015 19:26 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 19:25 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 09:46 NaCl`y wrote:Rest in peace, dear marvellosity! ##vote boxerfredI know I made a lot of posts on Fuba being mafia and honestly he probably still is mafia! There is now someone else that I have a greater passion for lynching. Boxerfred. This is because of quite a few reasons and all of them are backed up simply by reading the game so I'll make this short and quoteless due to a lack of time.
Day 1: Boxerfred's play can be summarised on day 1 as simply going from clueless and spreading feelers in directions (such as on yamato briefly etc) to full on try hard and associative based on Yamato77 flipping mafia before he actually has (most damning). He also says Justanothertownie is his top town read going into night 1 for his reaction to the Artanis[Xp] situation etc. I feel like this was a disingenuous flip of "ability" to read people that simply didn't fit with his earlier playstyle. It conveniently kicked in when it was decided Yamato77 was the lynch anyway.
Day 2: Boxerfred meekly pushes VayneAuthority and is quite happy to use any excuse whatsoever to just disappear from it when provided with little evidence: On June 09 2015 19:33 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:31 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:29 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:28 justanothertownie wrote:On June 09 2015 19:27 boxerfred wrote:On June 09 2015 19:23 marvellosity wrote:On June 09 2015 19:22 boxerfred wrote:
[quote]
No. I did not make a point. I simply wrote about a fucking filter observation not coming to any conclusion or point. I came to that conclusion when you asked your questions 2 minutes ago. stop reading stuff into my posts that is not there. You made the fucking point to deflect off me questioning you on Vayne I don't see any reason to unvote someone who is not replying to pressure. Like, you all went on the Chez train because "oh he's not here" and now that he's here you start saying "nah he doesn't look so scummy anyways". I might do the same depending on his replies but as long as there are no replies, well why should I change my stance? "why would I unvote Vayne? Here! Look at what you guys are doing with Chez!" that was precisely your defence here. What the fuck. So I explained thoroughly why I am voting Vayne. Of course I am showing what you guys are doing on Chez since I feel like noone even cares to look at my points on Vayne. Did you even check my points on Vayne by now? No? Cool shit. I distinctly remember telling you that VA doing jackshit does not make him scum and that he tends to not give a fuck as town. I distinctly remember that I played one game of Mafia thus far here and can't tell if you're right. + Show Spoiler [VayneAuthority] +5 minutes of your time to confirm/deny jat Wow, such small filters. ##unvote Yes, it's a quote. I lied earlier. He then jumps on Chezinu because it was what everyone else was doing. Suddenly, Boxerfred makes a big case on Justanothertownie being mafia which contained all of the posts that Boxerfred said made Justanothertownie his top town on day 1. Note earlier when he dropped his VayneAuthority read based on people giving evidence to the opposite? Now this is not the case for Justanothertownie. Unfortunately I can't finish this due to time, will continue later. Look that's a solid town post, JAT, not the bullshit you're producing on the daily basis. I'd follow this case any day. It's a shame I played so dumb because I don't see me surviving this day anyway. However, JAT, look at such posts. They are towny. Your posts simply aren't, they are uncommiting rubbish. All the way down your filter. You're actively spitting out bullshit post after bullshit post. It is funny that you are trying to educate your SCUMREAD how to play TOWN better.
Haha no I'm just saying (in a rather obvious way, like, it's written there) that your so-called town posts that make you feel like you are a CONFIRMED TOWN (your words mate) are just bullshit. Like, hardcore uncommitting bullshit. Posting such a whole lot of stuff, it's impossible to find anything of value in that. The only valuable thing that I thought was a good thing was your Artanis post and I have explained already why that post is not really towny anymore.
Bro you're scum.
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On June 11 2015 19:27 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 19:26 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
And I have no intention of being nice to you if you are pushing on me as scum or if you are being an idiot as town which are the only 2 possible worlds right now.
How about you do something productive instead and tell me why we should not lynch boxerfred? You seem to just ignore him and his wagon entirely. wait wait wait I thought we lynch me eh? You said "WE ARE GOING TO LYNCH YOU DAY THREE" and now you want to hear reasons on why not to vote me? Haha sure bro start committing to something already -.- you're boring. Are you dense? I want to know why mig does not want to lynch you. That in no way means that I do not want to lynch you. my vote on you should indicate as much.
Haha so fucking what? I wanted to know a lot from you, you don't care, you don't commit. I want you lynched. Badly. Get over it and keep on insulting, at this point I'm just laughing on the frustration you're trying to cause.
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On June 11 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
And I have no intention of being nice to you if you are pushing on me as scum or if you are being an idiot as town which are the only 2 possible worlds right now.
How about you do something productive instead and tell me why we should not lynch boxerfred? You seem to just ignore him and his wagon entirely.
So WHAT EXACTLY MAKES YOU CONFIRMED TOWN BRO I asked that before and ask it again. Can't see it and as long as you don't care to explain, I don't see why you should go through with "YOU'RE SCUM OR DUMB TOWN" train you're pulling on everyone.
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##unvote haha here's step 1 ....
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##vote justanothertownie KABOOM AGAIN HAHA
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On June 11 2015 19:33 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 19:31 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 19:27 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 19:26 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
And I have no intention of being nice to you if you are pushing on me as scum or if you are being an idiot as town which are the only 2 possible worlds right now.
How about you do something productive instead and tell me why we should not lynch boxerfred? You seem to just ignore him and his wagon entirely. wait wait wait I thought we lynch me eh? You said "WE ARE GOING TO LYNCH YOU DAY THREE" and now you want to hear reasons on why not to vote me? Haha sure bro start committing to something already -.- you're boring. Are you dense? I want to know why mig does not want to lynch you. That in no way means that I do not want to lynch you. my vote on you should indicate as much. Haha so fucking what? I wanted to know a lot from you, you don't care, you don't commit. I want you lynched. Badly. Get over it and keep on insulting, at this point I'm just laughing on the frustration you're trying to cause. That's fine keep laughing until you die as far as I am concerned.
I'm actually interested in knowing who of the rest is really reading you town. That's far more interesting than reading your posts. Your posts are oneline bullshits, still.
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On June 11 2015 19:34 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 19:32 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 19:24 justanothertownie wrote:
And I have no intention of being nice to you if you are pushing on me as scum or if you are being an idiot as town which are the only 2 possible worlds right now.
How about you do something productive instead and tell me why we should not lynch boxerfred? You seem to just ignore him and his wagon entirely. So WHAT EXACTLY MAKES YOU CONFIRMED TOWN BRO I asked that before and ask it again. Can't see it and as long as you don't care to explain, I don't see why you should go through with "YOU'RE SCUM OR DUMB TOWN" train you're pulling on everyone. I never said I was CONFIRMED town. I said I am the most obvious town in the game and gave multiple reasons for it. The fact that you are conveniently ignoring all of the to start this ridiculous shitshow speaks for itself. I am done with this conversation - I do not need to convince you that you are scum.
Okay so what makes you the most obvious town? 16 pages on oneliners and a push on me which is like the easiest thing to do? Or is it your awesome way of not answering questions raised to wards you? Or what? Let me know, share with us dumb peasants so we may get on your level you awesome sick playing obvious greatest townie of all lel
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On June 11 2015 19:36 Mig wrote:
I also wonder if a newbie mafia would fight with you and marv so much. Also, flipping from you being his #1 town read to scum read is either really horrible mafia play or something that a townie would do. Usually competent mafia are more careful with keeping their story straight and having a narrative that people cant shit on. Townies sometimes just flip flop randomly because they have real opinions that change.
I am not saying boxer is town to btw, these are just the little things that cause me more doubt about him than you.
Hoho and guess who has that? JAT! He has not commited to any unsafe plays, his only slip was a bigger post on Artanis. Tell me, WHO has JAT been going for? Where is the case he created on someone? Where did he actually follow through on someone besides, well, me? And even when going at me, he wishy-washed a lot of "Dunno if newb madness or scum play" and stuff like this. He's not committing to anything he could possibly be nailed upon later. He's scum.
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On June 11 2015 19:40 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 19:38 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 19:36 Mig wrote:
I also wonder if a newbie mafia would fight with you and marv so much. Also, flipping from you being his #1 town read to scum read is either really horrible mafia play or something that a townie would do. Usually competent mafia are more careful with keeping their story straight and having a narrative that people cant shit on. Townies sometimes just flip flop randomly because they have real opinions that change.
I am not saying boxer is town to btw, these are just the little things that cause me more doubt about him than you. Hoho and guess who has that? JAT! He has not commited to any unsafe plays, his only slip was a bigger post on Artanis. Tell me, WHO has JAT been going for? Where is the case he created on someone? Where did he actually follow through on someone besides, well, me? And even when going at me, he wishy-washed a lot of "Dunno if newb madness or scum play" and stuff like this. He's not committing to anything he could possibly be nailed upon later. He's scum. Yes, I am commiting to something. And it is lynching you today.
Are you so convinced I'm scum?
On June 11 2015 19:46 justanothertownie wrote:
At this point we are just lynching boxer and mig back to back and probably win. And if one of them happens to be just terrible town I won't even feel bad about it.
Yes let's lynch the two people that are pressuring you.
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On June 11 2015 22:11 Half the Sky wrote:
BF...there are two scum remaining. Besides JAT, who else do you think is scum and why?
I have no idea. I have the impression that there are some thigns on fuba but I need to go back in the thread and find out if they stand. Also if JAT flips green, Mig is likely to be scum and me too of course. I know I won't flip red anytime soon which brings me to Mig. On the other hand I feel like his points are rather genuine. :/
Also Vayne is afk I hate this
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On June 11 2015 22:12 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:10 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:09 Half the Sky wrote:Returning to BF now - D1 read on you to D2. If the below is true that wouldn't be logical for a new player, heck, experienced players miss reaction tests all the time. On June 11 2015 21:33 justanothertownie wrote:
You will have a hard time finding a "why". He townreads me for the Artanis post and because there is "Nothing scummy about me". Later he scumreads me for the same fucking post and for using oneliners like I have all game. And because an "experienced player like me" did not immediately read NaCl cc as a reaction test because "even he knew that" which is fucking ridiculous. Yes, and there is the fact that NOONE in this game thought it was a reaction test at all. Despite yamato who was mafia. And even fucking yamato believed him later.
Here's a "go fuck yourself" to you JAT for your continous efforts to piss people off by your tone
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On June 11 2015 22:24 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:21 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:11 Half the Sky wrote:
BF...there are two scum remaining. Besides JAT, who else do you think is scum and why? I have no idea. I have the impression that there are some thigns on fuba but I need to go back in the thread and find out if they stand. Also if JAT flips green, Mig is likely to be scum and me too of course. I know I won't flip red anytime soon which brings me to Mig. On the other hand I feel like his points are rather genuine. :/ Also Vayne is afk I hate this I will not flip green because I will not be lynched. As of now YOU will be lynched so if you are town you better find out who you think is scum very soon because your only current scumread is town.
yawn
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On June 11 2015 22:29 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:21 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:11 Half the Sky wrote:
BF...there are two scum remaining. Besides JAT, who else do you think is scum and why? I have no idea. I have the impression that there are some thigns on fuba but I need to go back in the thread and find out if they stand. Also if JAT flips green, Mig is likely to be scum and me too of course. I know I won't flip red anytime soon which brings me to Mig. On the other hand I feel like his points are rather genuine. :/ Also Vayne is afk I hate this Vayne is afk, right, but do you have anything from your perspective on what he has posted?
yep I built a case on him before already, just check my filter, should be at beginning of D2 or so
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noone cared for it though
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On June 11 2015 22:37 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:33 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:29 Half the Sky wrote:On June 11 2015 22:21 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:11 Half the Sky wrote:
BF...there are two scum remaining. Besides JAT, who else do you think is scum and why? I have no idea. I have the impression that there are some thigns on fuba but I need to go back in the thread and find out if they stand. Also if JAT flips green, Mig is likely to be scum and me too of course. I know I won't flip red anytime soon which brings me to Mig. On the other hand I feel like his points are rather genuine. :/ Also Vayne is afk I hate this Vayne is afk, right, but do you have anything from your perspective on what he has posted? yep I built a case on him before already, just check my filter, should be at beginning of D2 or so Nothing's changed since then?
afaik, no
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On June 11 2015 22:34 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:21 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:11 Half the Sky wrote:
BF...there are two scum remaining. Besides JAT, who else do you think is scum and why? I have no idea. I have the impression that there are some thigns on fuba but I need to go back in the thread and find out if they stand. Also if JAT flips green, Mig is likely to be scum and me too of course. I know I won't flip red anytime soon which brings me to Mig. On the other hand I feel like his points are rather genuine. :/ Also Vayne is afk I hate this What makes you think Mig is scum when he's voting your top scumread? You say "on the other hand.....genuine" but you have some potential reason for scumreading Mig. You're scumreading JAT, you don't know he's green one way or another, so what in JAT's flip according to you makes Mig mafia?
Ah yeah I get that
Okay so my scenarios are basically:
1. JAT = scum, Mig = town
2. Mig = scum, JAT = town
I believe the first scenario is true. If it isn't thought, i'd test mig's waters. But since JAT is behaving like an ass, I'm fine with yoloing him anyways
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On June 11 2015 22:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Fair enough but I already told you why that does not make VA mafia. You even had a look at his past games and agreed. And now that's the best you have to offer as a read?
yawn
shift more attention to me
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well JAT will probably get me lynched this day. he's not letting off the idea not even considering lynching someone else . he doesn't want to let go off the bus I guess since scum needs a lot of mislynches to actually win.
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Can we hold on for a second and think about why Marv was killed btw? If I was scum, I would've not done this. I would've killed NaCl tbh.
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On June 11 2015 22:44 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:44 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Fair enough but I already told you why that does not make VA mafia. You even had a look at his past games and agreed. And now that's the best you have to offer as a read? yawn shift more attention to me What are you even trying to say with this post?
That you're bussing on me since day2, and this time I'm using the word correctly. Please stop asking me stuff you're boring
Instead try to read on someone that is not named boxerfred.
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On June 11 2015 22:47 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:45 boxerfred wrote:
Can we hold on for a second and think about why Marv was killed btw? If I was scum, I would've not done this. I would've killed NaCl tbh. Sure. You would have killed NaCl who was hellbent on lynching fuba during the night. Very believable. I already said why marv was probably killed. Not that marv isn't always a good kill anyways.
okay let me correct
Can we now talk without JAT's bullshit oneliners about why Marv was killed?
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On June 11 2015 22:47 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:44 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:43 Half the Sky wrote:On June 11 2015 22:41 boxerfred wrote:
did he pop up or what? You voted JAT right after he did and he queried you on it. Wait, what? VA never voted me. That was in reference to Mig. Unless I misunderstood BF, I thought BF meant Mig.
"did he pop up" => "did Vayne pop up"
"you voted JAT right after he did" => "you voted JAT right after mig did"
That's how I take it. My JAT vote was basically "screw it not gonna read all of it just gonna vote, I'm dead anyways this day", I wasn't following mig. I'm half-heartedly trying to read into JAT but seriously he's just throwing so much useless shit that sparks up fights over and over again that I'm tired of arguing. I'll just vote him and be content if it's sufficient. I'll congratulate him on his awesome scum play after the game ofc.
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On June 11 2015 22:49 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:44 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:44 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Fair enough but I already told you why that does not make VA mafia. You even had a look at his past games and agreed. And now that's the best you have to offer as a read? yawn shift more attention to me What are you even trying to say with this post? That you're bussing on me since day2, and this time I'm using the word correctly. Please stop asking me stuff you're boring Instead try to read on someone that is not named boxerfred. No, you aren't. A bus is if someone is attacking his scum teammate. Why on earth would you want me to stop asking you stuff if you are town? I gave plenty of reads besides you.
Blablablabla you gave plenty of oneliners
show me a read you did that was not started by someone before you already
or shut up and stop talking to me I think we both know where our votes go today
you're toxic, really
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On June 11 2015 22:51 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:47 Half the Sky wrote:On June 11 2015 22:44 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:43 Half the Sky wrote:On June 11 2015 22:41 boxerfred wrote:
did he pop up or what? You voted JAT right after he did and he queried you on it. Wait, what? VA never voted me. That was in reference to Mig. Unless I misunderstood BF, I thought BF meant Mig. Wait hold on. Scratch that. I see where the misunderstanding is since I'm asking you about two people at once. Let me rephrase, re: Mig I see you already answered that question. Re: Vayne, yes, I asked you whether your opinion's changed and yes he's popped in again, last thing I recall him saying "Mig train choo choo" or something like that.
Yeah I don't recall exactly, didn't care too much since JAT managed to piss me off that hard that I'll just keep voting him until I'll get killed and flip VT. He's just setting up mislynches instead of actually helping out town, sticking to his bullshit oneliners
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On June 11 2015 22:53 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 11 2015 22:51 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:49 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:44 justanothertownie wrote:On June 11 2015 22:44 boxerfred wrote:On June 11 2015 22:43 justanothertownie wrote:
Fair enough but I already told you why that does not make VA mafia. You even had a look at his past games and agreed. And now that's the best you have to offer as a read? yawn shift more attention to me What are you even trying to say with this post? That you're bussing on me since day2, and this time I'm using the word correctly. Please stop asking me stuff you're boring Instead try to read on someone that is not named boxerfred. No, you aren't. A bus is if someone is attacking his scum teammate. Why on earth would you want me to stop asking you stuff if you are town? I gave plenty of reads besides you. Blablablabla you gave plenty of oneliners show me a read you did that was not started by someone before you already or shut up and stop talking to me I think we both know where our votes go today you're toxic, really YOU are toxic. It is blatantly obvious who of us 2 is trying to evaluate the game/the others play and who is just kicking and screaming without presenting any actual arguments. It literally does not matter at all if someone posts oneliners or not. That's completely irrelevant for the quality of the posts.
"You're toxic." - "no, YOU are." Quality!
Show me your arguments, show me your cases, show me awesome posts that actually contribute and are not useless. Show me, show me, show me, I cannot find them. Until you do so, you have my vote and no more answers.
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yeah whatever, mislynches are great for scum anyways.
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##unvote ##vote boxerfred
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Nah seriously i wont get a lynch on jat so i prefer to lynch me instead. Im raising way too much attention and im playing like shit. Tbh i totally agree that at this point its best to lynch me. Whatever case i will possibly throw out will be looked at as if im scum. So town needs to get me out because scum will not kill me anytime soon since im the best distraction they have.
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My credibility is gone anyways
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On June 12 2015 00:29 justanothertownie wrote:
I will explain this to you calmly and without calling you an idiot, boxerfred.
If you are town then lynching you does not help town in the slightest. The first duty of a townie is to not get mislynched and that is written in the guides for a reason. You argue that town needs to get rid of you because you are an distraction which is not entirely wrong but flawed logic. If you are town and we lynch someone else then that person could be scum. If you are town and just give up then we are wasting a lynch on you and we won't even get any information out of it because scum does not even have to justify voting for a martyr that won't play the game.
That post stuns me. I just gave you the easiest way to jump on me and get me lynched and you did not take it.
##unvote
On June 12 2015 00:49 NaCl`y wrote:
Justanothertownie give me your thoughts. Why does that case on you from mig make mig mafia? Explain why it can't come from a town mig.
Boxerfred, if you agree with mig's case on justanothertownie why would that change your opinion on mig's alignment and make him mafia if justanothertownie flipped town if you're agreeing with everything he is saying? Surely that just makes him misguided? Why not consider any of the other people that aren't saying things you agree with?
Also, boxerfred, why do you think marvellosity was killed?
Also, a public service announcement. Please, in future, try to take the higher ground in arguments and answer the questions people ask no matter whether you think they are stupid or not.
I agreed with Mig's place because I wasn't too fond of JAT being town in the first place. I townread him rather early and got to regret that for reasons I named. However weak or strong those reasons are now, I thought they were quite good when I initially stated them.
The other thought I had at that time was "Wait, why is Mig pushing on JAT when JAT is already in a fight with me?" Like, for scum, the best thing to have is to have as many accusations going as possible. Light fires wherever you can and once some fires are burning, chime in every now and then to make sure it keeps burning. I'm the biggest fire that's currently burning, yes, but once I'm lynched, it gets hard to get another fire started when you didn't spark something up in the first days already. So Mig might've seen a good opportunity in jumping on JAT, since he can imagine me getting lynched and then town people might jump on JAT.
That's why I think they are not the same alignment. It's a bit tinfoilhatty but I can see scum-Mig putting pressure on people because scum really needs mislynches. That's like the one thing I took from my first game since we lost scum-scott D1 when I was scum in that game.
Hm. Why do I think marv was killed. Actually I'm asking that myself just now for the first time so let me just write down my stream of thoughts. I feel like most people (especially JAT) read him as town before he was killed. I'm not sure about that, it's more a gut feeling. I myself did not have a town read on him because I fought with him all the time, however his filter indicated to me (as I posted) that he does not have a really scummy appearance. Let's say I leaned him slightly town before he was killed, without being really sure as I was in NaCl.
Hm, okay, that's how we went into the night. The scum team knows the alignment of marv so they put him, I guess along with NaCl, on their "top town to find out about us" list. That's why they decide to kill him, although he was on a wrong path with Chezinu. Might've happened to put more blame on me even, since I was already likely to get lynched at that point and they saw that I react spontaneously to thinks and might be caught in an overreaction as soon as someone claims that I insisted on killing him. Scum would've thought like this if I'm right: "Look, marv is quite active. And he's fighting with boxerfred. Now if we kill scum, wouldn't town think rather fast that boxerfred snapped and killed him because he's pissed off? He's already set up for the lynch, that'd be the nail. If need be, we can even point that out." However, there was no need to point that out this day, because I went nuts and am quite close to getting lynched.
Hm, I'm trying to imagine other reasons to kill marv. Who was marv pushing besides Chezinu? He was pushing fuba a bit on D1 but that's not really telling too much. Hm.
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Going into "why was marv killed", I'd like to ask why Artanis was killed N1. How could scum be so sure that the claim was for real?
On June 05 2015 20:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Marv is probably town for reasons JAT would hate.
I liked Sodium Chloride's case on Mig. Wouldn't consider it a lock though.
I also like Prplhz in that he wasn't afraid to go after Chez, a dangerous move to anyone that knows him. Also feels too forthcoming and relaxed to be scum.
Here is the original breadcrumb tell from Artanis that made him claim. Now why would you pick that breadcrumb up? I mean, let's take the sentence: "Wouldn't consider it a lock though."
So for me as a newbie, I read that as "Well, I wouldn't lock that opinion yet. The case might be solid but it's not enough to justify a lynch". A more experienced player would probably read it as "Well, solid case, but I'm not using my Jailkeeper ability to block him in the night." But still, it's a crumb, not a huge tell. So who would read that sentence so accurate, so exactly, that he'd find that breadcrumb? I mean, it's D1. We're all still a bit kidding and joking, right? Except the one that is directly mentioned in the post: Mig. Mig sees his name pop up. He sees that this is an opinion on the case on him AND he sees that he's considered (or not) to be jailed. Mig's reaction? Go to scum qt, tell everyone that there is a Jailkeeper and pray that the guy gets killed at night - or even day. That would explain why yamato did his original TMI tell: directly believing the claim.
I mean let's be honest, scum must've seen the breadcrumb (the crumb was even pointed out once the claim came) and they believed Artanis. I don't understand why Artanis instaclaimed or even dropped that crumb but he got us a red. Now that we all know that the claim was for real, I think it might be worth it to go through the D1 posts and re-read all the reactions. I mean by now, we have several townies dead. Might be worth gathering who went on who. Shame I have no time this evening, my passion is almost restored with that post. However I'll try my best to do what I just said before EoD.
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On June 12 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 00:56 VayneAuthority wrote:
Actually I for one find the marv kill very puzzling, sure it was obvious he was town but he wasn't really going to his usual great lengths to solve the game, he was just kind of playing a more casual style. Why the hell would some one like boxerfred kill him who doesnt know his rep? there are a lot of reasons for why boxerfred isnt mafia. The only logical explanation after this would be that fuba is mafia but Salty is contributing a lot more to the game and was also pushing fuba so you'd then have to go back to this being a rep kill, meaning the mafia team is comprised of at least 1 if not two people that are scared of marv.
Which leads me to believe that if fuba is not mafia then there is something off about this game. I think this is the best information kill today while also yielding the highest mafia percentage There is absolutely nothing puzzling about that kill. And it for sure does NOT indicate that fuba is mafia. He could very well be but if he was then a NaCl kill would make way more sense. "Why would someone like boxerfred kill him?" Because marv was going against him pretty hard during the night? Because boxerfred has a teammate that knows how good marv is? Because he just has to read the thread to know that? Seriously, wtf.
marv pushed fuba D1 already, so let's say fuba is scum and knows how good "marv is" as you say, he'd have quite the reason. Also I'd like to note that all the rethorical questions you raise on "why would bf kill marv" are not limited to me. You could exchange my name with pretty much everyone because the answers to those questions are not "Well, that's because boxerfred...". Only the "marv went at me"-argument stands.
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On June 12 2015 01:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
and yes you see that i am implying that salty could be mafia here but im not ready to entertain that yet. although the kill certainly suggests it
Okay but let me raise Salty's case on yamato that got him lynched D1. Mafia could've clearly avoided that if that case would not have happened. Do you think that this is a play do confirm him town for the rest of the game?
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On June 12 2015 01:37 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote:On June 12 2015 00:56 VayneAuthority wrote:
Actually I for one find the marv kill very puzzling, sure it was obvious he was town but he wasn't really going to his usual great lengths to solve the game, he was just kind of playing a more casual style. Why the hell would some one like boxerfred kill him who doesnt know his rep? there are a lot of reasons for why boxerfred isnt mafia. The only logical explanation after this would be that fuba is mafia but Salty is contributing a lot more to the game and was also pushing fuba so you'd then have to go back to this being a rep kill, meaning the mafia team is comprised of at least 1 if not two people that are scared of marv.
Which leads me to believe that if fuba is not mafia then there is something off about this game. I think this is the best information kill today while also yielding the highest mafia percentage There is absolutely nothing puzzling about that kill. And it for sure does NOT indicate that fuba is mafia. He could very well be but if he was then a NaCl kill would make way more sense. "Why would someone like boxerfred kill him?" Because marv was going against him pretty hard during the night? Because boxerfred has a teammate that knows how good marv is? Because he just has to read the thread to know that? Seriously, wtf. marv pushed fuba D1 already, so let's say fuba is scum and knows how good "marv is" as you say, he'd have quite the reason. Also I'd like to note that all the rethorical questions you raise on "why would bf kill marv" are not limited to me. You could exchange my name with pretty much everyone because the answers to those questions are not "Well, that's because boxerfred...". Only the "marv went at me"-argument stands.
Also you're now just doing what I said in the above (longer) post:
"Look, marv is quite active. And he's fighting with boxerfred. Now if we kill scum, wouldn't town think rather fast that boxerfred snapped and killed him because he's pissed off? He's already set up for the lynch, that'd be the nail. If need be, we can even point that out."
That's not a blame, I'm just saying. Can't really say anything about it since my post came after yours and you wouldn't believe me that I didn't refresh before I hit the post button anyways. At least I wouldn't believe that.
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On June 12 2015 01:41 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 01:37 boxerfred wrote:On June 12 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote:On June 12 2015 00:56 VayneAuthority wrote:
Actually I for one find the marv kill very puzzling, sure it was obvious he was town but he wasn't really going to his usual great lengths to solve the game, he was just kind of playing a more casual style. Why the hell would some one like boxerfred kill him who doesnt know his rep? there are a lot of reasons for why boxerfred isnt mafia. The only logical explanation after this would be that fuba is mafia but Salty is contributing a lot more to the game and was also pushing fuba so you'd then have to go back to this being a rep kill, meaning the mafia team is comprised of at least 1 if not two people that are scared of marv.
Which leads me to believe that if fuba is not mafia then there is something off about this game. I think this is the best information kill today while also yielding the highest mafia percentage There is absolutely nothing puzzling about that kill. And it for sure does NOT indicate that fuba is mafia. He could very well be but if he was then a NaCl kill would make way more sense. "Why would someone like boxerfred kill him?" Because marv was going against him pretty hard during the night? Because boxerfred has a teammate that knows how good marv is? Because he just has to read the thread to know that? Seriously, wtf. marv pushed fuba D1 already, so let's say fuba is scum and knows how good "marv is" as you say, he'd have quite the reason. Also I'd like to note that all the rethorical questions you raise on "why would bf kill marv" are not limited to me. You could exchange my name with pretty much everyone because the answers to those questions are not "Well, that's because boxerfred...". Only the "marv went at me"-argument stands. Yes, but marv was townreading fuba on and off while NaCl said "We are lynching fuba - don't even contest this lynch". And you are right that the only argument that stands is that marv went against you but the point of my post wasn't to say why you are scum but to explain why what vayne said makes no sense.
Hmyeah, I get this. You're basically saying "everyone has a good reason to lynch marv but bf has the best one". Hm. Your argumentation implies that NaCl could be scum since he was the best target to kill. I mean, he's the towniest of towns to me and his posts are really well thought out. He's the biggest danger probably. So why not kill him but kill marv? To put the blame on me, like I said before? If fuba was mafia, that would be a decent play I think. He's not killing the most obvious guy which would even put blame on him (because nacl went after him) but instead kills another high value town target, putting the blame on me. What do you think of that?
On the other hand, the death of marv is an indicator that NaCl is scum in a weird way ("well scum would kill NaCl for his efforts and because he got yamato lynched. But he's scum so we can't kill him. He's got town cred over 9000 anyways.")
Not sure if I'm willing to believe that. TBH, I'm not, no.
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On June 12 2015 01:49 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 01:46 boxerfred wrote:On June 12 2015 01:41 justanothertownie wrote:On June 12 2015 01:37 boxerfred wrote:On June 12 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote:On June 12 2015 00:56 VayneAuthority wrote:
Actually I for one find the marv kill very puzzling, sure it was obvious he was town but he wasn't really going to his usual great lengths to solve the game, he was just kind of playing a more casual style. Why the hell would some one like boxerfred kill him who doesnt know his rep? there are a lot of reasons for why boxerfred isnt mafia. The only logical explanation after this would be that fuba is mafia but Salty is contributing a lot more to the game and was also pushing fuba so you'd then have to go back to this being a rep kill, meaning the mafia team is comprised of at least 1 if not two people that are scared of marv.
Which leads me to believe that if fuba is not mafia then there is something off about this game. I think this is the best information kill today while also yielding the highest mafia percentage There is absolutely nothing puzzling about that kill. And it for sure does NOT indicate that fuba is mafia. He could very well be but if he was then a NaCl kill would make way more sense. "Why would someone like boxerfred kill him?" Because marv was going against him pretty hard during the night? Because boxerfred has a teammate that knows how good marv is? Because he just has to read the thread to know that? Seriously, wtf. marv pushed fuba D1 already, so let's say fuba is scum and knows how good "marv is" as you say, he'd have quite the reason. Also I'd like to note that all the rethorical questions you raise on "why would bf kill marv" are not limited to me. You could exchange my name with pretty much everyone because the answers to those questions are not "Well, that's because boxerfred...". Only the "marv went at me"-argument stands. Yes, but marv was townreading fuba on and off while NaCl said "We are lynching fuba - don't even contest this lynch". And you are right that the only argument that stands is that marv went against you but the point of my post wasn't to say why you are scum but to explain why what vayne said makes no sense. Hmyeah, I get this. You're basically saying "everyone has a good reason to lynch marv but bf has the best one". Hm. Your argumentation implies that NaCl could be scum since he was the best target to kill. I mean, he's the towniest of towns to me and his posts are really well thought out. He's the biggest danger probably. So why not kill him but kill marv? To put the blame on me, like I said before? If fuba was mafia, that would be a decent play I think. He's not killing the most obvious guy which would even put blame on him (because nacl went after him) but instead kills another high value town target, putting the blame on me. What do you think of that? On the other hand, the death of marv is an indicator that NaCl is scum in a weird way ("well scum would kill NaCl for his efforts and because he got yamato lynched. But he's scum so we can't kill him. He's got town cred over 9000 anyways.") Not sure if I'm willing to believe that. TBH, I'm not, no. No, I personally do not believe NaCl is scum. And sure scum could have killed marv to incriminate you but usually scum just kills townies that are on the right track and if fuba isn't mafia then NaCl was NOT on the right track. But this whole discussion is more or less WIFOM anyways. Fact is marv is a good kill for any scumteam.
hmkay, I get this. So what do we do now?
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Won't escape the train obviously
HTS's stuff on me is strong. I can't really get that off me. I realized by now that my D1 behaviour can looks scummy, yes, but I really am not. So considering I will be lynched anyways, I'm now giving my impressions of people where I'd locate scum. So once I flip green (this is not martyring but instead saying how it is ).
##vote fuba
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On June 12 2015 18:28 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 17:44 boxerfred wrote:Won't escape the train obviously HTS's stuff on me is strong. I can't really get that off me. I realized by now that my D1 behaviour can looks scummy, yes, but I really am not. So considering I will be lynched anyways, I'm now giving my impressions of people where I'd locate scum. So once I flip green (this is not martyring but instead saying how it is ). ##vote fuba Good. You could start with the reason why you are voting Fuba.
Won't have time to elaborate on anything today, won't be around EoD too. Work got me. I won't be around tomorrow in the night, too, and I'll be back at sunday, if I'm still alive then. So you guys can lynch me this day or next day. If next day, I'll be able to provide reads and help, if this day, you'll be able to be sure about one of the players you think are scum.
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Didn't know I'd be gone before the game, would've said something else. My friends suggested to spontaneously go camping over the weekend. I might chime in by mobile but I don't think so.
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ebwop: "I would have said something/not have played if I'd known that before".
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I'm back, guys. I'll try to catch up on the last pages.
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I mean it looks like I'm getting lynched anyways. Which is incredibly bad for town.
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Who was never pressured by JAT?
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On June 14 2015 22:48 Half the Sky wrote:
The other thing to consider is if BF flips town, could there be an element of TMI in VA hard defending him? Especially in light of all the evidence presented.
I had the same thought
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On June 14 2015 22:49 justanothertownie wrote:
I never called FF scum I just disputed the townreads on him. I never pushed marv. I never pushed salty. The only reason I pushed Artanis was the cc.
And even if I had pushed everyone at some point - so what? That's not exactly what scum wants to do. So what is your point bf?
I'll try to set up a list of all players alive and the pushes that came. Maybe we'll get something out of this.
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I am currently creating the push (google doc) file. I will use the following
Red - hard scumread
Orange - soft scumread
Green - strong townread
light green - soft townread
no color - null read (an explicit post saying "I don't know")
I might expand those colours. Gimme an hour or two..
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okay, I'm at the top of page 29 by now. Gonna continue if I find the time, still gotta cook and eat and so on.
Thus far, I'm really into reading Mig as scum for his D1. The initial case from (confirmed town) Salty was decent, he only [url=http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/486819-i-still-cant-believe-its-not-themed-mafia?page=28#553]pushes a little bit on Yamato while hard-pushing (and voting) Fecalfeast[/rl]. At this point, Salty's case was already up. Might very well be a try to get attention off of yam. You can take from the table that he made a wishy washy read on prhplz, and, much more important, [url=http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/486819-i-still-cant-believe-its-not-themed-mafia?page=23#460]is fine with lynching artanis[/url] while admitting that "he might be bsing". Then, he asks Artanis to give reads which [url=http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/486819-i-still-cant-believe-its-not-themed-mafia?page=17#337]Artanis had already done at this point. [/url]
If I then take the cases into consideration that have been brought up already on Mig, I think my vote is good on him.
##unvote ##vote Mig
more to come.
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okay, I'm at the top of page 29 by now. Gonna continue if I find the time, still gotta cook and eat and so on.
Thus far, I'm really into reading Mig as scum for his D1. The initial case from (confirmed town) Salty was decent, he only pushes a little bit on Yamato while hard-pushing (and voting) Fecalfeast. At this point, Salty's case was already up. Might very well be a try to get attention off of yam. You can take from the table that he made a wishy washy read on prhplz, and, much more important, is fine with lynching artanis while admitting that "he might be bsing"[/url]. Then, he asks Artanis to give reads which Artanis had already done at this point.
If I then take the cases into consideration that have been brought up already on Mig, I think my vote is good on him.
##unvote ##vote Mig
more to come.
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On June 16 2015 03:42 Half the Sky wrote:
When you have the time, can you explain why you voted fuba yesterday (the votes only got closer I believe after you AFKed)?
I had almost no time to read so I voted off of a feeling to not get modkilled. I gut-felt that fuba was under pressure and decided that my vote would not get him killed, thus it'd be safe to put pressure on him too without actually killing him.
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On June 16 2015 03:48 Fecalfeast wrote:
OHHHHHH
I think I get it.
it's a compilation of everyone's scumreads
This is actually pointless
..and town reads and null reads
bro stop killing my motivation, this has already been a shitload of work
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On June 16 2015 04:06 boxerfred wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 03:48 Fecalfeast wrote:
OHHHHHH
I think I get it.
it's a compilation of everyone's scumreads
This is actually pointless ..and town reads and null reads bro stop killing my motivation, this has already been a shitload of work
also I'm bolding out reads that feel important to me. Plus, I'm commenting on stuff so I guess it helps you to find out about my alignment.
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On June 16 2015 05:02 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 04:15 Half the Sky wrote:On June 16 2015 04:05 boxerfred wrote:On June 16 2015 03:42 Half the Sky wrote:
When you have the time, can you explain why you voted fuba yesterday (the votes only got closer I believe after you AFKed)? I had almost no time to read so I voted off of a feeling to not get modkilled. I gut-felt that fuba was under pressure and decided that my vote would not get him killed, thus it'd be safe to put pressure on him too without actually killing him. I don't understand the logic here. You could have voted for anyone so that you would not get modkilled. How does fuba - or anyone - being under pressure - alone, make them scum? There are things such as pressure votes, but pressure votes generally have a purpose. So let me ask you this - putting into context your lack of time - if you had had the time to re-evaluate, what would (you have wanted) your vote on fuba to achieve? The bolded is actually total bullshit. Fuba was clearly the only other player that could be lynched realistically and bf tries to sell that he voted him because he wasn't likely to die. Complete and utter bullshit.
ok fuck it I'm out of here
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On June 16 2015 05:02 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 04:15 Half the Sky wrote:On June 16 2015 04:05 boxerfred wrote:On June 16 2015 03:42 Half the Sky wrote:
When you have the time, can you explain why you voted fuba yesterday (the votes only got closer I believe after you AFKed)? I had almost no time to read so I voted off of a feeling to not get modkilled. I gut-felt that fuba was under pressure and decided that my vote would not get him killed, thus it'd be safe to put pressure on him too without actually killing him. I don't understand the logic here. You could have voted for anyone so that you would not get modkilled. How does fuba - or anyone - being under pressure - alone, make them scum? There are things such as pressure votes, but pressure votes generally have a purpose. So let me ask you this - putting into context your lack of time - if you had had the time to re-evaluate, what would (you have wanted) your vote on fuba to achieve? The bolded is actually total bullshit. Fuba was clearly the only other player that could be lynched realistically and bf tries to sell that he voted him because he wasn't likely to die. Complete and utter bullshit.
like what in "I HAD ALMOST NO TIME TO READ" did you not understand?
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ah w/e I'm the fuck out of here
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On June 16 2015 05:29 Mig wrote:
boxer I dont get it are you voting for me just because of what you saw up till page 29? What about the rest of the game? If I am scum who is the other member?
I was simply going through what I found out and decided that those were legit points that were not disproved.
On June 16 2015 05:31 Mig wrote:
Also yea there were only 2 people who had votes and you voted for the other guy with the reasoning he wasn't likely to die lol?
I. Had. No. Time. To. Read.
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just lynch me to end all the confusion coming off me, okay? better than having a stupid standoff with me as potential scum.
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i screwed up several times, played a terrible game, and there is no point to it anymore.
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On June 16 2015 05:58 Mig wrote:
Ok but that is page 29..... We are 110 pages in. Also NAc's case against me was terrible, my last mafia game was 4 years ago trying to use meta from that is retarded. So trying to use that as your main reason for voting me is insanely dumb.
Like boxer it is clear this game you have just been making a ton of shit up. Unfortunately that doesn't guarantee you are mafia, townies make shit up too.
What I want is some actual honest thoughts from you. Like you have read this entire game havent you? You really believe I am mafia based on a case nac made at the beginning of day1? You don't have any original thoughts on anything that has happened yourself?
Yes, I have read the game. Yes, I believe you are mafia because nacl made a case on you, also for the other reasons I said in my post, plus the impression I got when you pushed on DIS and the stuff that was brought up on you. No, I don't have any original thoughts.
On June 16 2015 05:31 Mig wrote:
Also yea there were only 2 people who had votes and you voted for the other guy with the reasoning he wasn't likely to die lol?
Yes.
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I think that it would actually be a good idea to look at the players that did not activelytry to get me lynched.
At this point you a) believe me that I'm town or b) lynch me, there's not much I can do.
I'd locate scum at Mig/phrplz/FF, HtS is my top town read, I'm not sure about JAT but I can see him being town too.
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On June 16 2015 07:50 Mig wrote:
now you show up boxer lol, gotta be kidding me!
I'll enjoy my last 10 minutes of the game.
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On June 16 2015 07:51 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 07:50 boxerfred wrote:
I think that it would actually be a good idea to look at the players that did not activelytry to get me lynched.
At this point you a) believe me that I'm town or b) lynch me, there's not much I can do.
I'd locate scum at Mig/phrplz/FF, HtS is my top town read, I'm not sure about JAT but I can see him being town too.
What about VA?
He's my scum ally of course
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gosh I have no idea about va
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Day 4 Vote Count
VayneAuthority (1)
prplhz
boxerfred(4) tentatively will be lynched
Half the Sky
justanothertownie
Mig
VayneAuthority
Mig (1)
boxerfred
Not Voting (1)
FecalFeast
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On June 16 2015 07:55 Half the Sky wrote:I brought up TMI from last cycle. What do you think?
Might be, he's hard-reading me green and he's the only one doing so. I feel like for scum, it would actually be great to have me alive (at least to fuck up JAT). So that makes me think about JA/prphsadk whatever his name is.
I'll go with Vayne since at least there's a vote on him. ##unvote ##vote VayneAuthority
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but hey that's it, I'll be lynched. Sorry for really (really!) fucking up this game, for terrible plays, emotional reactions, absence and general bs.
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On June 16 2015 07:59 Half the Sky wrote:
And you think he's more mafia than Mig at this point?
My case on Mig is from D1, remember?
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gonna go to bed now, since no mod's here and it's really late. I'm town people.
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On June 16 2015 08:05 Mig wrote:
seriously boxer? Why didnt you show up when I was talking to you. I was trying to see if we could move to vayne
mainly because JAT pissed me off and I lost interest in the game.
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nah let's be real here. I did my efforts, I had real life stuff, and I came back to check if something changed. can't do much about FF being afk, and bad play is bad play. I'm not screwing the game on purpose. good night now.
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Let's say it like this: I learned a lot . Looking forward to the next game.
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Also, Mig: I did want to screw the game by coming in 10 minutes before EoD. It was more a mixture of having no time whatsoever anyways plus being frustrated. It was not a "fuck you people" move.
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Also guys, thanks for the motivation post-game! Really cool stuff
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On June 16 2015 20:49 justanothertownie wrote:@Boxer: sorry, for being rough on you but that is the price for joining a non newbie game without ever having played a towngame. I mean I respect that choice (I did the same when I was new) but you can't expect people to go easy on you because of that. You probably learned your lessons. No hard feelings.
I think what I can take with me from this game is basically to never, ever get emotional. I terribly failed at doing so and every day, I got myself deeper into it. No hard feelings here, too, not at all. Let's see how I'll be playing up in the Himalaya mountains.
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EPT
