EPT/in
Here is to hoping I'm not a train wreak at it ^.^
Newbie Student Mafia IX
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
/in Here is to hoping I'm not a train wreak at it ^.^ | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On April 23 2015 06:49 kitaman27 wrote: Maybe this thread might be a good place to start? Or you can just give into your temptations and join blindly  Pretty much what I did.  | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Oh well, I'll still have time... just not as much. | ||
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Tictock
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I am a total Mafia noob. Never played a game in my life and until recently never piqued my interest. I've been on TL for a few years now and have seen the Mafia section plenty of times, so when I decided to try my hand at the game I naturally came here. So, given my newbishness, while I have read the thread up to this point (you guys were busy while I slept) I'm not too sure what to make of things. The suspicion around scott seems to have merit, but I will have to do a more thorough read of what transpired when I get some time. I expect I should be done with work by midday and will be more active then. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
A couple reads of the thread thus far have left me with the following read/feels. -Celestial- A pretty clear town read. The initial reads are all very clear with good reasoning. While there is a bit of tunneling happening on scott celestial has given clear reasons why. scott31337 Seems scummy for sure. I can looks past the initial voting stuff,to an extent, but the reactions to the pressure do not read as town to me at all. Fecalfeast I was originally going to give FF a town read as he seems active and engadged, but looking at his filter I find nothing solid in his posts. That puts him neutral for me, with maybe just a hint of scum. I'll have to dig through more filters to see if I can get more reads. I have a hard time putting much stock into my D1 reads with the level of fluff posts and pressure plays, but I'll keep posting about what is standing out to me. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 04:11 Fecalfeast wrote: alright tick tock time to fight what are you got what makes me scum you say I have nothing in my posts so you're saying I have no reads... I could go to my computer and show you my spreadsheet if you like If you have reads I don't see you sharing them. Your active and posting lots of stuff, but out of the 4 pages of your filter I can only find a post or two that adds to real discussion. Might just be the early game fluff talk outweighing your few questions and discussions. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 04:09 Stutters695 wrote: FF is so clearly town it's unreal that you think he's neutral/slightly scummy. What makes him clearly town to you? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
I'm getting pretty strong town vibes from y0su, disformation, and ritoky. I really like disformation's attempts to poke and ask questions. y0su is my weakest read of these 3, but feels like a solid town. Everyone else... well there simply isn't enough out of prplhz or sicklucker to really go off of. Not much to go off of Stutters695 either, another person who states he "doesn't do day 1" which is pretty meh but NAI. Pretty much all I got for now. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 04:34 Stutters695 wrote: I really can't say exactly due to ongoing game. Scum FF posts often, but much less poignantly. Read some of his previous scum games and compare that to p4 of his filter here. This reasoning doesn't work for me. It would give me questionable info to try and build meta reads for people off old games. Questionable because it could or could not have any bearing on this game and I wouldn't have that much confidence in trying to build my own meta read in such a short time. Suffice it to say that I am not a fan of useing meta reads, and will just straight up not accept that a meta read is strong enough to say anyone is "clearly" anything. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 05:37 Half the Sky wrote: Can you define what you mean by "vibes" particularly with y0su and ritoky? Do you mean a tone read (which to my understanding most consider weak) or was there a particular quote/page/interaction that solidifies them as town? Tone read is probably what I mean, but I'll elaborate. y0su seems to be trying to take everything in, he is asking questions and is staying somewhat active. Actually he is fairly active because very little of his posts are fluff and generally they add to the discussion. On May 04 2015 02:41 y0su wrote: well, that's the problem, look at the biggest back and forth we've had: -c- vs scott. -c- came in with what I feel was a very bold 1st post (list) that bugged me. why would he pick 3 scum out of the active players and and let others slide just because he didn't have a read (afk/low post count)? he had some decent points, but was it all to put on pressure or to start swaying people? without experience, it doesn't feel like something town would do (and this is -c-'s 2nd game afaik) that followed into the rather aggressive finger pointing with scott. I had a weird feel from him from the start and non of what -c- said helped him... but again it just feels like "an easy target" to try to get people to bandwagon. ...but all that leaves me is not wanting to vote for either one (yet). That post is probably his strongest Town post imo. He isn't taking -c-'s reads and running with them, rather he is actively looking at them from other angles to decide if -c- is actually town modivated here. As for ritoky, his initial posts don't hold any real value but the last page and a half of his filter looks like solid town discussion to me. I could quote a few of his posts here but I think a look through his recent filter will show you what I'm seeing. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 08:34 Fecalfeast wrote: tictock calls me out for not having reads or substance, show my reads and tictock doesn't care. One shade minus Actually... On May 04 2015 04:40 Fecalfeast wrote: So tictock, I'm enjoying myself outside reading. I'm not going to show my list of people right now but i read you town atm. I really like that you're not tunneling me and questioning the ezpz town reads on me. That shows you're looking at the bigger picture, imo. On May 04 2015 05:26 Fecalfeast wrote: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xpbh2kk.png) ask questions about whoever I have to shower and prepare for work I find it a little interesting you change your mind about sharing your list pretty quickly there, probably NAI but interesting. Also, making sure I'm looking at this right, you currently have scott and prp as your scummiest reads. Do you have anything other than inactivity for your prp read? Any noteworthy changes to that list since you posted it? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
As for Superbia, I'm having a hard time getting a solid read now. I was getting a scum vibe from his play the first half of D1 here but he is looking more town here near the end of the day. I want to keep an eye on him but atm he doesn't seem like a good lynch. prplhz is looking pretty scum to me right now too. He made one post with actual content and even that was mostly an excuse as to why he isn't posting. Scott put himself in a position where he looked pretty bad, but lately he's bee making an effort and seems fairly calm given the suspicions around him. That feels town to me, he's not ignoring what ppl say about him but he's not focused on defending himself either. prp and HtS really need to contribute, SL and Stutters are also barely active & have contributed nothing solid thus far. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 15:38 Fecalfeast wrote: i explained it in the same post why I wasn't sharing my list. I was outside reading, among other activities. Ah I see, you started a new sentence so I assumed you not wanting to post your list and reading outside were separate thoughts. Like I said it felt NAI but was wondering if something made you change your mind. Disregard. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Scott is still the most appealing case, even though I have some doubts. I'm tempted to make a case against prp but there just isn't enough to go on. I just don't like his dismissive post regarding how he "spams town" normally and says he isn't around. If he is legit too busy to play a town would likely replace, this seems more like a scum excuse to skate by day 1. Unfortunately that's all I have as prp, as well as several other ppl, just aren't active enough to make real reads on. | ||
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Tictock
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On May 04 2015 19:46 sicklucker wrote: tictock you can be town. Lets kill them all Lets start with the Mafia, then we can channel that blood-lust elsewhere... | ||
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Tictock
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Besides FF, is there anyone else you think we should lynch today? | ||
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Tictock
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Tictock
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On May 05 2015 01:59 ritoky wrote: looked @ ticktock's filter: this post strikes me as odd...he is having a hard time deciding who to vote for, yet he thinks 1 guy is scum and the other guy is inactive and that's his two top scum reads? seems like not a hard decision there. i don't really understand where his hesitancy is coming from here. My issue here was that the vote on scott felt too easy. It wouldn't add pressure as scott had already seemed to accept he is probably going to be the D1 lynch and would only put me into the "lynch scott" bandwagon. So while that was my obvious vote at the time I did not see that vote giving town any new info. I was pretty tempted, and probably should have just gone with it, to vote for prp to try and pressure him into posting. Probably not the best way to play it out, but that is what was going through my head. In regards to my reads on Shining and Super, I've been having a hard time reading them or at least feeling like i have good reads on them. I'll reread them and catch up on their most recent posts here now. As for the current state of things, I can't get behind a HtS lynch. The reads against her are purely meta-based and I've already stated I wont trust those. scott... man you made yourself look pretty bad early on and at this point there is no denying your going to get lynched. Still I look at your most recent posts and I feel like you are posting genuinely. Why did you give up defending yoourself? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
HtS, I know you asked me about an exchange between Super and -c-, but I'm not sure which you are reffering to atm and don't have time to dig and respond to that right now. Sorry. As I've said, scotts latest posts feel genuine to me. -c- has a pretty solid case but my sense is that -c- joined and jumped on scott's poor play pretty hard. -c- reads as town to me but I think just got tunneled hard on scott. This has left mafia have free reign and has given breathing room to several people who never got pressured into participating due to the focus on scott. In that regard prp finally comes back and jumps onboard the newly formed HtS wagon. Entire argument is from a meta read and is generally just posting shit. I'm sticking with my scum read on him. ##Vote: prplhz | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 05 2015 07:59 -Celestial- wrote: CUT THAT A BIT FINE DIDN'T YOU? Also, wasted vote. I know, I was really scrambling. Starting to wonder if I actually have time for this or if just unlucky with my schedule at start. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Not sure it woulda made any difference, but now I feel like a fool for being wishy-washy and wasting some time. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 05 2015 08:14 Half the Sky wrote: This is true. Also I didn't see your response to me regarding Superbia. You made some comments on him and Shining, did you have anything else to add regarding his game play since? I need to re-read them, especially after EoD, but as I said before I'm not getting anything clear from them. If you just want my current opinions... I don't like how pushy and all over the place Super seems to be. There have been a few decent posts from him but too few and far between. Shining kinda fell off my radar tbh, so I got nothing till I reread. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 05 2015 08:11 sicklucker wrote: wth was your vote anyway? Not that you acualy did it you had too. But that you acualy tried to justify a useless vote... Rushed... and not well thought out I suppose. If you look back in my posts you'll see I had basically the same opinion ~12 hours before EoD. I already explained my thought process as to why I didn't vote then, but now (and even before EoD) I wish I has just gone with gut then. So my EoD I thought I should explain why I didn't care to join either wagon and go with my only other scum read, even a poor one. I accept that it comes off as scummy, but I'd rather look a little scummy than hop on a wagon I don't believe in. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
I'll be around after I get some sleep, there is no way in hell I'm doing anything remotely like work tomorrow. | ||
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Tictock
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On May 06 2015 05:54 prplhz wrote: i mean i guess ticktock still looks horrible for that vote no matter what alignment he is. he just wasted his vote and then went "oh and by the way i'm not going to do anything until n2". Huh? Oh look I'm back... well before N2... I passed out hard after a long day yesterday, just woke up a bit ago and got caught up reading whats happened since. I'm not surprised you guys don't like me for that vote, I'm disappointing in my EoD as well. I'll give up guys a post here in a few to walk you through my thinking one last time (also this will answer your question HtS). Then I'm going to start re-reading the thread, and delving into filters. Again, HtS I'll get to your question about Super after I reread his filter. I'll be around pretty much the rest of the day, so after I get the next post up if anyone still has questions feel free to ask me. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 04 2015 19:40 Tictock wrote: I'm having a hard time deciding who I want to vote for as well. Scott is still the most appealing case, even though I have some doubts. I'm tempted to make a case against prp but there just isn't enough to go on. I just don't like his dismissive post regarding how he "spams town" normally and says he isn't around. If he is legit too busy to play a town would likely replace, this seems more like a scum excuse to skate by day 1. Unfortunately that's all I have as prp, as well as several other ppl, just aren't active enough to make real reads on. As she points out, and I state in an earlier post, at this point I've been having doubts about the scum read on scott. While the votes on him at this point were light, it seemed pretty clear to me that everyone was planning to vote on scott. In my eyes, he was pretty mush for sure to get lynched at this point as there was just no body else under suspicion. So, I wasn't going by vote count, rather the fact that so many people had him scum read and there was no other target. Thus he was already a bandwagon and "too easy" a target even before the votes rolled in. It was also in this post that I had read everyone's filters and prp's stood out to me. Not only was it SUPER short but there was literally nothing of value in it. The fact that this had slid by everyone else while the focus was on scott seemed wrong to me so I started to focus him and the other inactives. In hindsight, it would have been better to just throw my vote out on prp here (or soon after), but I was unsure if that would carry much weight as it would basically be a policy vote due to inactivity. On May 05 2015 07:58 Tictock wrote: I feel like I'm scrambling so hard against the clock atm. Was supposed to have an extra hour to put some solid thought into this EoD but work had me stay late. HtS, I know you asked me about an exchange between Super and -c-, but I'm not sure which you are reffering to atm and don't have time to dig and respond to that right now. Sorry. As I've said, scotts latest posts feel genuine to me. -c- has a pretty solid case but my sense is that -c- joined and jumped on scott's poor play pretty hard. -c- reads as town to me but I think just got tunneled hard on scott. This has left mafia have free reign and has given breathing room to several people who never got pressured into participating due to the focus on scott. In that regard prp finally comes back and jumps onboard the newly formed HtS wagon. Entire argument is from a meta read and is generally just posting shit. I'm sticking with my scum read on him. ##Vote: prplhz So then comes EoD. I got home about 1.5 hours before deadline (again, was planning on being home close to 3 hours to deadline) and tried my best to read everything I had missed and form a better vote. I was able to read everything, including -c-'s full case against scott, but it didn't change my opinion. -c- was still tunneled on the same things, with weak scum reads on his recent posts and scotts own posts continued to read town, though poorly played town (I still wish he hadn't given up to the pressure and tried to defend himself more, but at that point I think he correctly assumed trying to flat out refute the claims against him wasn't going to help and decided to focus on making some reads and playing town). This left me in pretty much the same boat as where i was before, I no longer believed scott was scum, but HtS was the only other "real" option at the time. I stated in my original post why I didn't agree with that vote either. So that left prp who I'd been looking at recently anyways. His EoD posts added nothing and I still read scum on him. So I decided to follow my own opinions and vote for prp rather than let my opinions slide and jump on a wagon with everyone else. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
He was completely absent all of D1, then appear EoD and suddenly jumps on HtS for some kinda meta read. On May 05 2015 04:54 prplhz wrote: okay wtf deadline is tonight i don't know about scot31337. i got a good feeling about him pointing out that the shining was joking when other people couldn't see it. i also don't feel like lynching into some new guy for hardly any reason, did that way too much in last student mini. actually i'd much rather lynch hts. hts pointing out last game that it was obvious we were going in the wrong direction when we lynched a new guy for the third day in a row but now she doesn't mind continuing for a fourth day in a row? i don't know the cases on scot31337 don't speak to me at all and one of them is by celestial that i also have a bad feeling about (that people don't share for some reason). also hts is scum reading me for saying shining's entrance was super odd, but she's not scum reading the people who felt the same thing about it? FF ritoky super felt the same way, why is she picking me out of all players? ##Vote Half The Sky Basically dismissing the whole scott case because of a joke, and going after HtS of all people due to her going with the scott case. After EoD he totally drops HtS and does this. On May 05 2015 23:53 prplhz wrote: i actually think stutters is best lynch tomorrow just for that single thing Still so quick to jump on anyone. He goes back and forth on me regarding my EoD vote but doesn't really add anything new to that. Honestly of his whole filter I find one post that has any merit. On May 06 2015 04:10 prplhz wrote: dunno i think ticktock looks horrible for throwing away his vote like that and stutters for staying around during deadline and not say anything other than some overly aggressive remark at superbia... and i still hts has a major logical dissonanse in how she's scum reading me for something she's not scumreading other people for. it doesn't even make sense so say i'm scum because of a remark i made that like 3 other people agreed with, obviously we're not all scum. but lol hts is kind of right, i'm just scum reading everybody who is scum reading me. gonna trust my town reads and try to read more into the people who are just hanging out in the middle of everything. So yea, I'll be carrying my vote from D1 into D2. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 06 2015 07:24 Half the Sky wrote: Tictock, there are 3 scummers in this game. Do you have any insights on who you feel are the other two? (or if you posted/inferred somewhere, can you quote?) At this point I'm re-reading and waiting to see how N1 turns out. Early D2 I will give everyone my reads, assuming I don't bite it in the night here first ofc. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
-Celestial- Clear town read. He saw something scummy about scott and went after it, scott made himself look worse and so -c- tunneled him hard. All his posts are full of detailed thought and analysis. I like him questioning my EoD and vote so hard because it was out of place. y0su I was weakly town reading him before, but he's starting to look really scummy when I look at his filter. He is asking questions and staying somewhat active, but he is never reaching any conclusions. + Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 02:41 y0su wrote: well, that's the problem, look at the biggest back and forth we've had: -c- vs scott. -c- came in with what I feel was a very bold 1st post (list) that bugged me. why would he pick 3 scum out of the active players and and let others slide just because he didn't have a read (afk/low post count)? he had some decent points, but was it all to put on pressure or to start swaying people? without experience, it doesn't feel like something town would do (and this is -c-'s 2nd game afaik) that followed into the rather aggressive finger pointing with scott. I had a weird feel from him from the start and non of what -c- said helped him... but again it just feels like "an easy target" to try to get people to bandwagon. ...but all that leaves me is not wanting to vote for either one (yet). That quote is the closest he gets to really questioning somebody's allignment and he eventually drops it based on what HtS says (not his own analysis he claims to be doing). Also once he drops his questioning of -c- here he votes for scott without ever giving any more reasoning or thought to the game. All of that just stinks of scum to me. disformation I was reading him town before and still do. He is engaged, making reads, and asking questions. I was interested to see if I saw anything in his filter, especially after scott threw his dying vote on him. Even after a couple of reads on dis' filter I couldn't find anything that read as scum to me, and scott's reasoning upon reflection was shit. I'll add it in here just in case anyone wants to check it, but i think we can throw away gleaning anything from scott's vote on disformation. + Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 03:53 scott31337 wrote: disinformation - + Show Spoiler + On May 03 2015 10:42 disformation wrote: Thank you very much. Clarified your stance much better. Well, yes. But this post: Just raises a red flag for me. As I said earlier I have an idea how this could be town motivated. But I don't really see it.  Damn. Forgot. =D Have some more:  ritoky I might be leaning a little scum here but he seems neutral to me atm. I don't like his initial jump on towning prp just because they agree on one read, he does rethink it later though when prp is clearly inactive. He made a small poke at me regarding my post when I was unsure how to vote, but he didn't seem to care about my response and even posted a quote of it for HtS while never reacting to it himself. Maybe I gave him a really good answer and he just went with it. The Shining I'm not sure what to think on him, he's pretty inactive thus far and never stood out as taking a stance on anybody. I think he got a bit flustered early on (perhaps too easily?) and that's why he hasn't posted much, but that's not an excuse. I also find it interesting that he initially defended scott as town but ended up voting on him anyways. I guess he's actually scum leaning for me, but I'd like more out of him. Half the Sky A very clear town read for me. Like -c- is very active and engaged, giving lots of reasoning in her posts and doing a great job poking people to get answers and further her reads. The main argument I see in the scum reads against her is that she's not as town as usual? Really guys? Shows why I don't like meta reads, gives people out of game excuses for weird votes and doesn't focus on what is happening THIS game. Sorry to derail my read with that, but she's so town I though I should fill out my read ^.^ Superbia OMG what a complex read on this guy, I've settled on neutral but I see why there are some scum reads on him. First, he is so all over the place. I'm not sure if this is a style of play he has that creates lots of pressure or if it's scum trowing things all over the place to see what sticks. I'm tempted to think it's a style of pressure playing though, and he does follow through with what he does. I see him perusing people on things a lot, a good example is how he spends almost a full page trying to understand FF's read on me. Part of this comes off badly though. Like he's doing things for little or no reason, or just wants to strong arm people into his thinking. + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:41 Superbia wrote: The whole wagon is pretty fucking scummy while the HtS wagon is pure as fuck. On May 05 2015 07:55 Superbia wrote: THIS WAGON IS HITTING MAFIA FOR SURE BOYS. On May 05 2015 07:49 Superbia wrote: Why is this the best wagon? Why are you voting for him over others? Super has the longest filter of anyone here, which is both good and bad. Good because there is a lot to go off of to try and read him. Bad because a lot of his posts come off as spammy one liners. It is hard to follow his train of thought. He did offer this at one point. + Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 10:08 Superbia wrote: All right. Since it's my birthday tomorrow it is likely that I will not be around, not even for EoD, alas. I will try to be, but no promises. I will post where I'm at at this point in time: Town: Ritoky Fecalfeast Lean Town: y0su - Filter feels natural. Really liked the question regarding ritoky's transition from loopiness to serious. Null(ish): prplhz: I am conflicted. On the one hand I liked his very early d1 jokey behaviour and his ping on shining. On the other hand, he asks me what I think of celestial, even though I was one of the most outspoken persons when it came to celestial (feels like he isn't paying attention). Also hasn't really done anything. scott: Meh. I need to really interact with the dude but I haven't done so. He cleared his thought process on the HtS thing, which feels natural. I had him as town before that because he felt like he was relaxed, but I'm not comfortable putting him on the town pile due to a healthy dose of suspicion (e.g. the whole trusting the shining debacle). Lean Scum: disinformation - Promises to read filters with no real result (imo). This post looks really weird: + Show Spoiler + On May 03 2015 19:56 disformation wrote:ritoky: Your two pushes so were were easy pushes on me and y0su, both of which are newbies. Coincidence or looking for easy misslynches? You also seem to be defensive of superbia. Scum mate of yours? disinformation calls y0su a misslynch, but does not have any opinion on y0su in his filter. TMI. The Shining - Meh. I've said stuff about him before which kinda holds. His aggressiveness towards me feels kinda townish, as I don't really expect mafia to be aggro towards me (big ego), but they still might. His filter content wise feels very similar to his town filters, but he seems very bitter and sardonic this game, while in his other town games he is decently jokey and relaxed. Bitterness is a mafia tell. I am hesitant because this purely comes from his interactions with me. Sicklucker - NEEDS TO START DOING SHIT. WHO IS MAFIA AND WHY? WTF: Half the Sky - Half assed scum-read on a town (from my perspective), then leaves thread. What? Rest is null though I may have forgotten some. On May 04 2015 10:20 Superbia wrote: Rest of the day, town, this is your plan of approach. Pressure: - SL: needs to do shit (i.e. give reads). - HtS: needs to do shit (i.e. give reads). - prp: needs to do shit (i.e. give reads). - The Shining: needs to not be defensive anymore and give reads on essentially everyone. - disinformation: ask why he thought y0su was a "misslynch". Pressure into giving reads. Watch for TMI. - Scott: Hard reads on pretty much everyone with a conclusion. Pointers: - Celestial: stop tunneling. - Rest: Post thoughts. Come to hard conclusions. Don't be afraid to be wrong. On May 04 2015 10:21 Superbia wrote: Form TWO wagons. Not one. So yea, I'm still neutral on Super. There is a lot going on with this guy and I'm not sure I like the way he is doing things. Still I see a lot of town motivation in what he does. Yea I might give him a town lean even. prplhz I've been reading him scum since late D1, as everyone should know  I already made a case here. He's looking a little more active recently, but will need to do a lot of work to change my opinion from his D1.sicklucker Has really done nothing all game. He got a little worked up about my D1 vote and then went back to casually posting nothing. Stutters695 He did nothing D1, offered small reason why he agreed scott was town and like me voted right at the EoD. I'd be reading more scum on him but he claimed to be playing in 2 games before (which I'm starting to wonder how you could do and keep things straight) and he has become more active lately. Really it's just the fact that he is showing interest now that is keeping him off a scum read for such a poor D1. Good god that took forever to post up properly. | ||
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Tictock
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On May 05 2015 08:00 cakepie wrote: FINAL VOTE COUNT: scott31337 (8) : -Celestial-, sicklucker, disformation, Half the Sky, y0su, FecalFeast, The Shining, Stutters695 Half the Sky (3) : disformation (1) : scott31337 prplhz (1) : Tictock -Celestial- (0) : sicklucker (0) : So I mentioned this in my EoD post/vote but up till now I don't think our Mafia has been active much. Town got focused on scott early on and so mafia stayed back and let scott be our only real target. The HtS wagon right at the end seemed more of a policy wagon (that's a thing right?) to have more than one person being voted for, but that's also kinda flimsy and it's worth noting when and how people voted HtS I think. Scott's votes are a little more throwaway imo, the read and case on him was pretty good and he gave up defending himself far too early so it was an easy vote on him. I'm not ignoring them or anything I just think scott was an easy person for town to vote on and an easy wagon for mafia to hide on. I'm still looking at people who joined that wagon as sheep. As for the HtS votes, we have ritoky, prplhz, and Superbia were on that wagon. ritoky had voiced concerns about HtS since she joined in. I'm not sure they are solid or not but I can understand him joining this vote from his reads on HtS as well as wanting to start a 2nd train. prplhz, joins the discussion after being absent for about 40hours and posts this. On May 05 2015 04:54 prplhz wrote: okay wtf deadline is tonight i don't know about scot31337. i got a good feeling about him pointing out that the shining was joking when other people couldn't see it. i also don't feel like lynching into some new guy for hardly any reason, did that way too much in last student mini. actually i'd much rather lynch hts. hts pointing out last game that it was obvious we were going in the wrong direction when we lynched a new guy for the third day in a row but now she doesn't mind continuing for a fourth day in a row? i don't know the cases on scot31337 don't speak to me at all and one of them is by celestial that i also have a bad feeling about (that people don't share for some reason). also hts is scum reading me for saying shining's entrance was super odd, but she's not scum reading the people who felt the same thing about it? FF ritoky super felt the same way, why is she picking me out of all players? ##Vote Half The Sky Basically says he doesn't care about the scott case and wont listen to it. Makes a read totally based on other games (not even sure if that's meta) and since HtS is scum reading him. Pretty trash, but I will admit the obvious scum play here would be to just vote scott. I'm not impressed enough to consider that a sign of town, but it seems bold to start a new train near EoD as scum. Superbia never seemed to be on board the case against scott so I'm not surprised he didn't vote for him. Given that he was also one of the people pushing for a second target and even suggested HtS before anyone else (I think, proof?+ Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 10:32 Superbia wrote: The Shining, that's fine. I'm just not comfortable calling you null or town and I feel I need to give town a proper direction at this point in time. If anything try to ignore pressure and just post what you want to post from this point on. Give your thoughts on everyone etc. As for HtS, I vote for pressure at this point in time. I have no way to back up my vote or pressure tomorrow, so meh. I just hope I'll be around to put down a definitive vote. I probably will be able to. I suppose I'm not convinced the votes really give us too much info right now. But maybe I'm missing something or somebody has a better analysis than I do. | ||
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Also The Shining, man you haven't given us much to work with. Care to share your reads going into D2. Those of you who used excuses to skim by D1 (looking at Stutters, SL, and prp), really need to step it up and give us something real to go on. | ||
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The voters for scott: -Celestial-, sicklucker, disformation, Half the Sky, y0su, FecalFeast, The Shining, and Stutters695 -Clestial- made a clear case and was following his reads. Obv vote sicklucker ugh, I don't like his vote here seems pretty suspect and at best pure sheep. He mentioned not liking scott right after the initial scott voting (where he started to make himself look scum) fiasco, but here is his EoD stuff related to voting. + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 00:50 sicklucker wrote: So we def kill scott. Then if he flips scum we def kill super. If not maybe hts? I donno this seems solid tho On May 05 2015 00:52 sicklucker wrote: I can honestly bury him but I dont think its needed and you will all just think im bussing. But I really do think scott has been scum since my third post On May 05 2015 06:53 sicklucker wrote: Pro tips its easy because hes mafia! On May 05 2015 06:58 sicklucker wrote: Acualy scotts last post makes me think he might be town  On May 05 2015 07:51 sicklucker wrote: i might switch! On May 05 2015 07:57 sicklucker wrote: no ones switching anyway. Boring disformation gives us clear reasons why he votes scott, is not just sheep + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:19 disformation wrote: Main reason I am on the scott train: + I read the case from -c- three times and I found it to be rock solid. HtS: Leaning town on HtS. So she has probably pocketed me already. =p But I thought she was trying hard to make up lost time today. Also a lot of the reads prplhz and rikoty towards her are tone or meta reads that may simply do not function given she didn't have enough time. I'd say to give her at least one day, to see if she will really put out some great reads. Like. I don't even know what this is supposed to be. Half the Sky actually suprised me with fairly weak voting logic, + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:57 Half the Sky wrote: My reasons for voting scott were from what I presented before - he didn't even have a read on you before voting him when he first voted me. His claiming VT holds nothing to me. It's NAI - I've seen people do that as both alignments. I questioned him on why he thought disinformation was a better lynch. Waffling and committing to a read though does not look good at all, it is a scumlike behaviour. y0su seemed to be unsure of the case against scott simply because he distrusted -c-, after HtS defended -c- as town y0su dropped the whole thing and sheeped FF RIP good sir The Shining sheeped this one imo. It doesn't seem to me like he thinks scott is scum,+ Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 04:24 The Shining wrote: Still no Scott defense. Yeah, I could vote him, too. I'm sorry, I definitely avoided this game last night. I was a bit cranky and didn't want to let it get any worse. =/ Super's birthday excuse is valid but it really gives me butterflies that it just happened to excuse him for EoD. While he has a "pressure" vote on SL. How much pressure is pressure if you say it's pressure and then proceed to say you likely won't have a way of backing up your pressure or vote? It's wasted pressure, wasted vote and Scott at the time looked like the wagon that would gain traction. And it has. As for Scott, I agree with the points made against him. And if it were any other player, I'd be worried about no one defending him but if he is in fact scum, it would mean he rolled scum every game he's played here. I could understand the lack of defense, lack of posting, possible lack of motivation as someone who is tired of rolling scum as a newbie. Stutters695 was not very active D1 and was expecting to find him as another sheep, but + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 04:47 Stutters695 wrote: Anyway, main reason I'm down for a scott lynch is his read on prpl. He has him as scummy then drops it to null when he still hadn't posted. If anything it should make him scummier. Additionally, leaving me off completely is weird when from someone who doesn't know me, I should be in the same boat as the other lurkers. Not to mention unvoting his scum read and not having anything else in mind before bouncing. As for the oddball votes. I talked about scott's vote on dis in my dis read a few posts ago. The summary was that it didn't look like it held any weight and was just scott throwing his vote on someone. Why he didn't at least put it on HtS near the end is wierd, but I find nothing to suggest that scott has some kinda deep read on dis. Lastly was of course my own vote on prp. Which I've already tried to explain in some detail. | ||
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So given what I learned from EoD and the current state of my reads... ##Vote: prplhz | ||
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What sort of reads do you have now that there are 2 fewer people to look at? | ||
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I'm not sure I 100% follow SL's logic on his play (or idea) here. Guess I will read read the setup rules and his logic later at work and ponder it more. Initially, I don't like that it is ALL that he is pushing here. It might be a good play, but his entire argument and logic can easily be scum driven to avoid suspicion and get people focused on Super. My read on Super is unchanged, though it looks like I might be missing when he joins in for the day. I have a few other thoughts, but I'll just leave that for now. I'd like to get caught up before I start rethinking my reads. I'll be reading as I can during work, but likely wont be posting till I get home. | ||
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Will be around the next few hours. | ||
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On May 07 2015 03:23 ritoky wrote: dood...i fucked this up so bad in my spreadsheet. i swapped ticktock and disform. god damnit, my spreadsheet skills are a d+ this game, that's what i get when i take a month off. EBWOP: disform + prp/superb -> ticktock + prp/superb I agree with his initial logic, that there is likely 2 mafia in the main wagon and one outside, and that 2 out and 1 in is far less likely. But then his conclusion is that the mafia team is super, prp, and myself? That's totally outside what your whole post was saying since each of us were outside the scott wagon. Care to explain what I'm missing ritoky? I'm also really tired of seeing you sneak this statement into your posts, On May 07 2015 07:04 ritoky wrote: ticktock and prp, 1 mafia probably voting outside of the main wagon. as of now superbia is null with town indicators. i am confirmed town. this leaves ticktock and prp. prp is role or mafia. ticktock wasted his vote. y0su's reason for greening me is bad. his reads are too conformy, and i don't buy his remorse and what i said would have changed his vote line all that much. you fighting with him and bit and pushing on eachother doesn't feel like 2 town fighting. 1 of you is mafia. for you being mafia, would take more time and capabilities to explain. You sir are confirmed nothing, and each time I see you try to make that statement you smell more and more of scum. | ||
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Still I hate that SL is just focusing on this sole argument and claims to be unwavering in it now. Hearing some vetern's say that this is how he has played as town before makes me facepalm. It's not bad to make use of mechanical plays to aid your cause but they should never be your sole factor when voting as it's a pure numbers game. I like y0su's quote regarding this "figures don't lie, but liers do the figuring" it's pretty apt especially in this situation. At best his whole argument here is NAI but the fact that SL is willing to spend the first half of D2 suggesting this while making no effort to make other reads or participate, especially after his already poor D1, leaves him dripping red in my book. | ||
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So in that ~hour, I did exactly what I said I would do. Finished reading/catching up. Your right, I didn't look at your return to the thread much. Nothing stood out in my initial read through, besides the points I already commented on. I'll be sure to make sure and take a look at what you've done since getting back here, I need to re-read a lot of what happened while I was busy. As for ritoky, I actually missed you calling him out on using "confirmed town" so you can claim sheep if you want but I was bugged by that all on my own. I'm clearly asking him to clear up the vote logic thing kus as I said it makes no sense to me how he came up with that scum team. I'm also clearly saying he looks scum for the "confirmed town" thing. You sure your reading my posts? | ||
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The entire day you've been trying to stay active and I see lots of examples of you pushing on people to get better reads (like just now, on me for instance ^.^). In addition you are giving conclusions about people and actively trying to find not just a target for today but the whole team. Overall I'm tempted to give you a full town read atm, but there's a couple things that still bug me as I look through your filter. On May 05 2015 04:50 The Shining wrote: I almost always am before we get to D2 and I can actually do what I'm good at. Vote analysis, night reactions, association regarding first flip, etc. This is one of the main reasons I say I suck D1 and why I try not to play it. But there's no reason not to interact and at least put my reads into the thread. You gave us this promise D1 to help excuse your inactivity. I'm waiting for you to deliver on that promise. Then you post this N1. On May 06 2015 07:12 The Shining wrote: Skimmed from EoD up to now. Scott townflip really hurts but I'm not sure how we could have avoided that. Haven't had time to sit at my laptop for anything and trying to actively read 100+ posts on mobile is impossible. Looks like I'm prime d2 lynchbait so I'm going to actually take my time, reread and answer the questions and reads I was asked for. Not like I need to rush. No way scum kills me tonight when people are still scumming me. Yay me. Why you were so sure you would be D2 lynch? After EoD you seemed to have fallen off peoples radar not to mention that HtS clearly has some pressure her way at that time, so why are you so worried about yourself still? I also found where you mentioned ritoky's usage of "confirmed" + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 06:58 The Shining wrote: Like Cel wasn't this aggressive as scum when we first played but it was his first game. And the list posts and WoTs were Cel's style, and it could be argued that Cel led us right into the Scott ML. I'm not scumming Cel here but the spear head now on Prpl(wouldn't a newbie town be a little hesitant to push so Damn hard after that Scott ml?) Is enough to make me not strong town read him anymore. Definitely not enough to call someone confirmed town. | ||
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Prp needs to do something. Plain and simple. Idk why everyone is letting him sit there posting absolutely nothing of value all game. I mean... On May 07 2015 07:28 prplhz wrote: hey guys i'm reading up now anything i should pay attention to? This is his ONLY 2 posts in the past ~30 hours. He has to be the scummiest of scum here or just the worst town in history. Either way I will enjoy seeing him gone. So yes I'd say the current scum team to my eye is most likely prp, SL, and ritoky. y0su is still leaning red, but at least he's given us a full set of reads now. Though tbh I need to re-read his reads as they looked a little flimsy to me first go around. | ||
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Also, just in case, no the idea of prp being terrible town is not valid. Even a terrible town would at least be making some effort to read, not ask the thread what going on all the time. | ||
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As I see it town should be trying to give everyone their full and honest reads at any given moment. So if I read through a game and at that moment see 5 people looking scummy and say as such, how does that that fact in of itself give you any read? I could legit be town seeing 5 scummy players, or I could me mafia trying to spread distrust anywhere I can. Maybe not something I should ask in game, but it's been used as pressure more than once and I don't get it. Anyway my point here is that you are putting words in my mouth TS. I said y0su (who has been on my scum list) is not out of suspicion (leaning red) but has given reads so I'm ok letting him off the hook for now. At least until I re-read his reads. (here I'll even show you again what I said, + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 16:14 Tictock wrote: So yes I'd say the current scum team to my eye is most likely prp, SL, and ritoky. y0su is still leaning red, but at least he's given us a full set of reads now. Though tbh I need to re-read his reads as they looked a little flimsy to me first go around. | ||
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The disformation read I promised. (full filter read, idk kus I felt like it) Going a bit beyond a read and being brutally honest. He's a newbie here but I think has some at least some prior experience to the game ( He says he's read older newbie games, so that might be it). He opens the game with a fairly casual post, he's friendly and being a character with the 's.After that he gets into the game in a pretty strong fashion. He is clearly engaged and reading the thread + Show Spoiler + On May 03 2015 09:59 disformation wrote: There was a short discussion about HTS starting to play tomorrow. And so on... And yes I am the guy with all dem smilies. Would you like to have some more? You seem kinda upset about it for some reason? On May 03 2015 10:25 disformation wrote: Okay, here we go: At first I was greatly confused why asking questions == mafia in this post. But I guess I kinda asked what behaviour people are looking for, which could also benefit mafia I guess. Still kinda confused about this. Maybe he could explain that to me? Part of the HTS discussion. At first a lack of attention was suspected, but it kinda cleared up into a nullish thing. This raised some red flags for me. Sure he may want to read more stuff from other people to get more reads on them. Or to look who might follow this up... still really suspicious to me. So yeah, overall I have a slight scum leaning towards him. On May 03 2015 19:55 disformation wrote: Good morning everyone. Some stuff I am wondering: Stutters695 : You were around for a bit, but my list on you is empty and your filter is really short. Give us something more to work with? How bad do you think scott looks now? Any idea of who you would lynch as of now? Scum reads? ritoky : Your two pushes so far were towards me were easy pushes on me and y0su, both of which are newbies. Coincidence or looking for easy misslynches? You also seem to be defensive about superbia. Scum mate of yours? sicklucker : For not wanting to play d1, you seem to be around a bit. Changed your mind a bit, or is it more in the vain of your d1 reads being bad anyway? Not sure what your spamy stuff is supposed to be though. Kinda confused tbh. If that was what you were aiming for: congrats. Overall pretty impressive town play for a newcomer imo. However after his opening ~24 hours I think he finds himself in a place where he doesn't know what to make of what info he's gotten. + Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 20:13 disformation wrote: Scott : Still not looking good to me. Probably the one I would vote for if I had to right now. The Shining: Really short filter, at the time of writing that I will reread him (see aboive), there was not much to go on so he was boring null. Though I did like that he at least tried to put out some reads, even if he said that his d1 stuff isn't that great. Starts to look like a really frustrated towny as of this night. IE with: Makes me want to not lynch him today. Superbia : Was getting a lot of mixed feelings early on from him. Didn't like: And it feels strange that he didn't want to vote scott, who (surprise) is my highest scum read so far. Maybe I also just didn't like him, because he was one of the guys to point out that my entry was crap and I didn't understand why at first. But I really like his push towards me. Shows he really pays attention, points things out and is not afraid of doing pushes. Looking damn towny for me as of right now. A shame he won't be around today. prplhz : I look at his filter and see nothing. I can easily picture him sitting in mafia QT and munching popcorn, since everyone seems to have forgotten about him. HtS : I've read student mafia vii http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/480171-newbie-student-mafia-vii were I thought she was playing good (town). What I have seen here so far really didn't life up to my expectations. Not sure if really lazy mafia or really lazy town though. Hoping to see some good stuff from her today. sicklucker : Didn't like how he said he wouldn't be playing, but was in the thread being a bit distracting. Liking that he is now trying to participate and putting out thoughts. Still a bit suspicious but wouldn't lynch as of now. -celestial- : reading town here. Liked the persistent push on scott. Also really liked this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/postmessage.php?quote=505&topic_id=483492 because my reads where really similar at the time when it was posted. Stutters : See prplhz. ticktoc : not sure what to make of him as of right now. will read his filter this evening. FF : His tone is ultra town to me. A bit spamy. Will maybe have to reread him and look out for contributions, as per the line of ticktoc's thinking. rikoty && y0su : still leaning town, will look at them more and see what they have done lately. geez so many ppl to keep track on. xD I hope this post gives you some insight as to how my "thought" process is working. I will try to keep you updated more about changes in my reads in the future. Did some bad/stupid things so far and can totally see why you would read me as a newbie/bad scum instead of a newbie/bad town. Will have to step up my game it seems. Good thing I have lots of room for improvement. xD Still dis keeps up his same style of play after his weakish reads. He's constantly responding to people and updating his reads based on what he's seeing, all the time telling us what he's thinking. + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 00:33 disformation wrote: Well, this strikes me as a bit odd as I kinda read this as "At this point I don't care if he is mafia or not". So I kinda get where y0su gets his feeling from. But I don't think that is anywhere close enough to dismiss the case or call -c- scum. Plus I agree on him more likely being scum. But this might me nice to keep on hand for the night phase. I really like this post because HtS both gives advice and at the same time tries to draw more information from him and be more exact with his reads. Starting to lean town on HtS. Also regarding ritoky: He also appears very eager to place himself next to the person nearly everyone has a townboner for (FF) and someone who just did a huge push and is very easy to town as well. "Look how towny my nick looks in green." Also just remembered that Superbia was asking The Shining about the links to his other games: Was looking if Superbia mentioned these games in his list post entry of the shining and yes he did: So that is one townie brownie for superbia. Still suspicious of him though. And before I forget again: This I'm adding both because it's showing that Dis is looking at the game from multiple view-points but also because he correctly "reconstructed" my train of thought here + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 02:20 disformation wrote: Hmm. He posted: A bit earlier. So I reconstruct his train of thought as follows: 1. scott looked really bad 2. he starts to look better now 3. well, he still looks the worst, but I am having some doubts because he was starting to look better for a while Since he is a fellow newbie he might not be confident in his reads at all? Maybe he is not confident with bussing his teammate? But his filter is also really short. Granted he has gained some attention for questioning the general town read on FF... but he really needs to give us more to work with. Could see him swinging either way right now. =/ Dis's EoD is a little off, I think he got thrown by scott voting on him (which was a very odd move by scott). He starts by offering his own reasoning as to why he wants to vote scott + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:19 disformation wrote: Main reason I am on the scott train: + I read the case from -c- three times and I found it to be rock solid. HtS: Leaning town on HtS. So she has probably pocketed me already. =p But I thought she was trying hard to make up lost time today. Also a lot of the reads prplhz and rikoty towards her are tone or meta reads that may simply do not function given she didn't have enough time. I'd say to give her at least one day, to see if she will really put out some great reads. Like. I don't even know what this is supposed to be. Dis posts little N1 and he seems shaken early D2. I think the flip on scott maybe shook the confidence he was showing D1? His posting feels a little weak early D2 given what was there D1, but it's a mixed bag and he picks back up as the day goes on. Overall he's total town. As for his vote on TS, I think it's not that hard to see... On May 05 2015 23:21 disformation wrote: Ugh. Reread the filters and looked at the timestamps. You are correct. *sigh* time to take away a bunch of townie brownies from the shining. Why is this game so hard? xD On May 07 2015 00:29 disformation wrote: After looking at some filters. Really don't like prplhz. Willing to vote, not going to do so right this moment, because I am still confused as to where I put some other ppl. Read as: looking very scummy, but I am not 100% if one of my other suspects looks scummier. Yep, expecting to something good from you D2. You've had a few towny posts D1, but by now you could be easily be a scum lurker. On May 07 2015 02:32 disformation wrote: Still super waffly about Superbia. Looking forward to his answers hoping they push me in the one or other direction. Didn't like sicklucker before, starting to see him more as a towny as of now. Still don't like The Shining and prplhz at all. Willing to vote for both of them. Since there is already pressure on prplhz... The Shining: Convice me you are towny and your D2 is as good as claimed. Make me remove my vote on you. Go! | ||
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TS you joined the discussion today here + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 05:36 The Shining wrote: Hell of a lot to read. Not used to a game that has multiple large post posters. Looking at you, Cel/HtS. My thoughts are super scrambled and I'm not quoting anything because I'm on mobile and can't get on my tablet but I'm here and will be here the rest of the day. So pretty much everyone wants to see more from me or pressure me or vote me. D1, it annoyed me. Today, I can understand it. Prpl needs to show up. I've felt he could be scum(like everyone else who took my entrance srsly) and he hasn't done anything since. I couldn't have summarized Prpl better than Cel did if I tried. HtS is very slightly town. The analysis and pushes from her continue to get better as time goes on. Not shying away from her points, putting all thoughts in the thread. I think you asked me what the significance was when I asked you about Dis and you including him. As scum(& you've beat me before as scum, which), I know you're more than capable of convincing town you're one of us, which is why you're not strong town here. And it looked to me like you were trying to pocket a townDis by showing him you were mindmelding. Reading up to now, I don't see that being the case. I'm at work so I'll just be throwing reads into the thread as I keep reading, I'm filter diving today. If I missed your question or concern, it's probably better to quote it since I just read 200+ posts or wait until I get to your filter. | ||
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Lets try this. TS starts posting here and Dis goes away here. So I make of this he didn't get a chance to start reading you in that hour and post anything about it. Wth was that question? | ||
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Reference: + Show Spoiler + On May 06 2015 16:13 y0su wrote: -Celestial- I see why my filter looks so poor, I've been too worried about being wrong. There's clear thoughts and direction in almost every post. I have no idea why/how he survived the night! Tictock He's also one of the few people that expressed hesitation to jump on the "easy" train. I felt the same as d1 rookie town. I believe the way he voted was just a rookie mistake. disformation is it supposed to be disINformation? (that's not a read on him, just curious if people have been writing his name like that on purpose?) His smiles bug me - they make me feel like he's trying to win favor. Trying to sound friendly and helpful. However, a few of his posts have well explained thought processes and I'll chalk up his indecision on learning - for now. ritoky + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:59 ritoky wrote: IMAGINE THIS: YOURE GOING TO GET LYNCHED ALMOST 100%? AND HTS IS THE OTHER WAGON. AS MAFIA SCOTT, DO YOU A) PUSH ON HTS OR B) GO ON SOMEONE ENTIRELY DIFFERENT. gluck, hope you guys chose right. at least we got some 2ndary wagon info. The Shining giving him red on tone. Very willing to reconsider if/when we get d2 stuff he's promised. Half the Sky beyond "holding my hand" - for which she got T (as it seems very town beneficial) - her posts show a lot of effort and supported conclusions. Sorry, having trouble keeping my eyes open... I'll get back with super, prp, sl and stutters (but the last 3 at least need to step up a bit) On May 07 2015 04:35 y0su wrote: Superbia d1 posting was sporadic and I can let some go with his birthday. His EoD comes off as either just super rushed or trying to create confusion. His posts read like he doesn't have any aim but to get people to vote HtS in a hurry. His posts have a lot of pressure (am I using that right?) to get answers but any conclusions he keeps to himself. He also does a 180 on HtS (based on her meta - not that he survived the night) but keeps his (unexplained) pressure on dis (although as a 3rd wagon). I like is desire for multiple trains but that seems NAI prplhz more like rdhz. No d1 excuse... no filter.. OMGUS vote on HtS. All of that could change if we get some d2 out of him. I particularly don't like + Show Spoiler + you guys need to push this hts thing btw. don't know when's the last time i saw a scum be up for lynch and then oppose the alternative wagon (well okay i sort of did that when it was me or LS in titanic but that was probably a bad move lol). sicklucker I've been waiting for some d2 content from him... all I see is statistical claims. (one of my favorite quotes of all times is "figures don't lie, but liars do the figuring"). Since then, I've always been a skeptic and need some proof(s). "75% of statistics are made up" Stutters695 another "no d1" case... but picking up a bit more now. His posts seem to have direction but it's all at prp without much more than meta. So far I'm not trying to form a scum team so I'm not concerned with a red read voting another red read. Going to be on more now and looking into d2 more critically (especially the interactions of the reds and half red) The first posting of reads is super weak. Actually including Dis's smiles as a serious read? Giving ritoky a full pass for literally one post? I'm not even sure I like how easy he gives me a town read. Especially since he posted that after we had been chatting a bit. Could have easily pressured me a little since he knew he would be posting a read about me shortly. His second set of reads are better. I think I most like his read on Super, feels like he's given the most thought to super (I disagree with the read, but I see thought put into it). The rest of his reads are so close to mine that I fear bias will ruin any attempt at proper analysis. The rest of the day (so far) y0su looks like he did D1, kinda all over the place. He's a little more active but still lacks any solid conclusions in any followup posts to the ones I quoted above. He is putting on more pressure, asking more questions than D1. Overall, he's improving. y0su I'm seeing glimmers of green in your play. But y0su, at this point what do your reads (especially scum reads) look like? The votes look scattered as we near EoD. Who do you think is the best target for today? | ||
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More so for trying to read an alignment from it. IMO it's pretty much NAI. Town or Mafia wanting to look more friendly uses extra smiles to establish a happy demeanor. Or it's just straight how Dis likes to post and is representative of his personality. That's why I called you out for it, kus it was half your basis for your Dis read. Anyways, Thank God you CC'd Dis. I would have been dismayed if prp got away with that claim un-countered. And prp, wth man this is just sad... On May 08 2015 02:24 prplhz wrote: oh god dammit sorry guys i'm not DOC i'm COP dunno how my fingers managed to mess that up anyway, i'm cop You post nothing all game, then expect us to believe that the most important post from you is a typo pressuring a 2nd blue claim? No, not happening, your done. I can't imagine anyone falls for this, but holy scum move batman! Like this is downright sinister in a newbie game trying to catch a blue who isn't familiar with Claiming and CC and getting info on 2 blues for one scum. So thank you for your sacrifice Dis. This game suddenly feels like it's on the right track thanks to that information. | ||
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I have some opinions on that, but I think I should reread a few people given these doc claims. ritoky not gaining any points in my book, his D2 hasn't impressed me whatsoever. I'm also not liking ritoky's statements like "prp is mafia or blue, waiting for his claim" it feels like he was setting up for this EoD play. Idk feels like WIFOM territory if I read that too hard. We can sort him out later. | ||
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If not, you bet I'll be reading how EoD goes during my breaks. | ||
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I keep wanting to dig into the logic behind a scum prp trying to draw out a newbie cop. Thus confirming we are in setup A. But then I end up in WIFOM territory wondering, maybe scum prp wants to throw any disinformation he can. Idk the latter seems unlikely, but I wont pursue that line of thought until after the flip. Dis is absolutely D3 target in the unlikely world prp flips anything but red. In the near future, when prp does flip red, I have SL as the top of my list of scum. His D1 was poor and his D2 was (now confirmed wasted) thought given a scenario where we have a veteran and that makes some 75% scrum chance on Super the best play he has. Super for me is still leaning town. His play continues to be all over the place and is hard to follow. I'm still finding more town motivations in his posts than scum motivations, I believe he wants to solve the game. I'll give a better read on him again in the next day or so with proper quotes and such. Stutters play has picked up since D1, but not by a lot. I'm leaning town on him, but would very much like to finally see a solid case about someone from Super (which he seems to have about stutters, link). | ||
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Anything more on stutters since you noticed his "backup" on Dis? Personally I didn't take much from that, there were a few people thrown by Dis' EoD play. IMO it just looks off becuase he was confused by scotts vote on him. I also find some humor in the fact that both our lynch's have thrown their votes on Dis. I realize for prp it's auto given the CC. | ||
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On May 08 2015 04:16 Tictock wrote: Personally I didn't take much from that, there were a few people thrown by Dis' EoD play. IMO it just looks off becuase he was confused by scotts vote on him. Referring to Stutters comment about Dis. On May 08 2015 04:16 Tictock wrote: Personally I didn't take much from that, there were a few people thrown by Dis' EoD play. IMO it just looks off becuase he was confused by scotts vote on him. Referring to Dis' EoD play. Just wasn't clear, didn't want people to misunderstand what I was talking about. | ||
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If I were Vig I would probably shoot SL personally. He's not even bothing to read the thread before telling blues what to do. I kinda want to comment on more stuff but I'm on mobile while still at work so will have to wait a few more hours. Just glad to see Town looking to be on top of this game now. | ||
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On May 07 2015 01:01 sicklucker wrote: oh ok thank I will be voting super now and never changing. This means to mean mafia will fake rb here 50-75% of the time. Probably on the higher side because super has done this very play before in his last newbie game as mafia. 50% chance to flip scum is very good odds. 75% is amazing I have no reason to ever change this His math is that good guys, he doesn't need to read the thread or talk to people. Maths will save town! | ||
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We have prp trying to save his own butt. On May 08 2015 00:53 prplhz wrote: wont be back until sometimes before deadline i'm doc btw On May 08 2015 02:24 prplhz wrote: oh god dammit sorry guys i'm not DOC i'm COP dunno how my fingers managed to mess that up anyway, i'm cop On May 08 2015 06:48 prplhz wrote: can't believe it's 2015 and people are voting for uncc'd blue Dis countering that claim, and claiming doc. On May 08 2015 01:24 disformation wrote: Was thinking this trough for a bit. Also wanted to wait for reactions for a bit. Like in Team Fortress 2 and Metal Gear Solid: Revengeance the only german guy on the cast is Ze Doktor. Wondered why I get defensive so easily when called scum and didn't react to easy town reads? Well, I was scared of being misslynched. To reiterate: I am Docor. prphlz is dead scum. and ritoky doing...this? On May 08 2015 08:13 ritoky wrote: thanks for claiming my role for me disform, you don't have to cover for me any more; it was pretty obvious i was trying to bait prp into claiming my role with the role or mafia read so i could cc him. you don't gotta keep it up anymore. On May 08 2015 08:24 ritoky wrote: dis was just covering for me On May 08 2015 08:44 ritoky wrote: what, i was obviously trying to bait him into claiming and prepared to cc: i am glad someone cc'd for me, but i mean i think i have been too obvious up until now so letting disform die for me is a waste And last but not least, SuperVig. On May 06 2015 08:01 Superbia wrote: Roleblocked. No idea why. On May 08 2015 08:03 Superbia wrote: Good. I'm the vigi and I'm going to shoot. On May 08 2015 08:03 Superbia wrote: Fucking n1 roleblock. I'm just...I ... don't even right now. Posting this for reference of the claims out there right now. I'll revisit when I've eaten and had time to think. | ||
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On May 08 2015 15:44 sicklucker wrote: just because he was the 25% does not mean my estimate was wrong in the slightest. Ah so Super confirmed town then? So who do you think should be D3 lynch then SL? | ||
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On May 08 2015 15:44 sicklucker wrote: just because he was the 25% does not mean my estimate was wrong in the slightest. SL goes from being certain that voting Super is the best lynch + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 01:01 sicklucker wrote: oh ok thank I will be voting super now and never changing. This means to mean mafia will fake rb here 50-75% of the time. Probably on the higher side because super has done this very play before in his last newbie game as mafia. 50% chance to flip scum is very good odds. 75% is amazing I have no reason to ever change this I'm surprised there hasn't been more activity since I went to bed, but dissapointed. Humm, Stutters kinda dissapear, disappointing given he was giving us promises. On May 07 2015 08:35 Stutters695 wrote: Depending on Rit's answers him. I have tomorrow during the day off so I'll get a full set of reads off then. He updated with an excuse, On May 07 2015 23:40 Stutters695 wrote: And called into work early, I fucking hate my job. 2-9 switched for 11-8 is a totally fair trade right? I'll be here to get stuff out when I can. but that was quite awhile ago now. He doesn't look great already and this inactivity isn't helping, I'm starting to agree he could be scum here. | ||
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So Stutters, if you were Vig. Who would you shoot tonight? | ||
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Anyways I'm around the next ~2 hours. I'll get a post up regarding EoD and the claims before I take off for work, though I'm half tempted to just see how EoN goes. | ||
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Super as Vig adds up, makes sense with my current read. Stutters wouldn't be my first pick as a shoot, but it's not a bad option either. Doc Vig setup makes sense with Supers RB claim D2. Mafia would not stack RB and Kill targets in this setup. I guess we'll get confirmation on this given the night flips, hopefully. Not even sure what to do with Dis and ritoky both claiming Doc. I agree with TS there's tons that I feel I want to say, but that's a discussion for D3. Also fair warning: I have a friends Birthday as well as Mothers day stuff to attend to this weekend. I will do my best, but it's going to be a busy weekend. | ||
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HtS I'm confused why you are saying I'm parroting. | ||
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So, we have Superbia, -Celestial- and Half the Sky all pretty much confirmed town. I might give -c- and HtS one more filter dive later on today as a formality, but I don't expect to change those reads the rest of the game. I'd like to put myself in that group but given my D1 vote and that I was pushing for Vig shot on SL other than Stutters I get the suspicion. Still would like to know why HtS says I'm parroting here, besides her I've seen TS and ritoky voice concerns about me but haven't seen anything solid for me to respond to. If you guys are still scum reading me, care to share why? I've been a little back and forth on The Shining, but re-reading his D2 has him solid town for me. I was also in the same mindset as him last night phase not wanting to dive too deep into ritoky's CC (CCC?) for doc given that discussion only had benefits for Mafia until Day phase. + Show Spoiler + -c- makes a good point, that mafia is unlikely to shoot anyone but Dis there. Still no reason to point it out for them. That leaves 3 people who I've been scumming for the past day or so, y0su, ritoky and, SL. Shoot, was going to get into better reads on them but I need to take off for a little bit. I wont be gone long, soon as I get back will be filter diving these 3 and giving you guys my reads. | ||
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ritoky Ok so ritoky is my weakest scum read between the 3 so I will start with him. His day 1 is pretty solid, but there is some pretty interesting stuff there. He points this out + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 01:30 ritoky wrote: y'know i gave prp a early town read cuz he made a quality observation, then i layed off him cuz he did a "fuck you" post, which always gives me the hots. but this kinda disengaged is kinda meh. you're falling on my list big boy. stutters is also declining rapidly at this point. place them both on the lynchable list. I noticed this a little after EoD D1. It's been hanging in the back of my head as odd, especially given that prp was the first to vote in thread. On further inspection, though, the timing shows that ritoky votes well after prp made that post. To me that looks like prp decides to push a 2nd wagon to earn some easy "not jumping on that ML" cred and wait to make sure someone else is willing to vote with him before voting himself. It makes more sense for prp to play a town ritoky this way, rather than ritoky and prp as scum starting their own wagon so late. Even besides this bit of logic, ritoky had clearly been scum reading HtS for several reasons D1 and he has been pushing for a second wagon, thus his vote here was completly town based. ritoky's D2 stuff actually looks pretty good as I look at it today. I was focusing in a lot on his usage of "confirmed town" yesturday, but now that it's out of my system and I'm reading around it I see a lot of good town play. He weakly defends me in a push, even though he has clearly said since he still reads some scum on me. He actually pushes Stutters a lot for not being more forceful on prp. His EoD2 and N2 stuff looks a little odd, trying to call out what prp is going to do with claiming then going for that double counter claim on doc. Both actions look strange and feel wierd, but boil down to NAI when you look at it. Prp had literally no chance UNLESS he claimed a blue role, a VT claim would never stop that train given his inactivity. So ritoky pushing him to do that or be mafia is legit pressure. The doc thing... super weak town play or ballsy mafia. In fact given HOW weak of a town play it is (I agree with -c-, no way does Mafia believe a claim like this from ritoky) and the fact that ritoky is telling us he's probably going to be MIA the rest of D3, I can completely agree with him being a viable lynch target. Besides that last point though, ritoky does look fairly town. I wont vote for him today. Sicklucker I've given my reasoning on SL before and as others have said it's almost a policy lynch at this point given the general lack of reading. SL is also pushing pretty hard on ritoky right now after he posted his newest "sure win" idea. On May 09 2015 09:57 sicklucker wrote: Actually I already have auto. kill yosu ritoky tictoc win the game. So ya im not gonna try im an easy townread if you wanna throw the game go for it Notice how he's pushing y0su first here? Then he jumps to ritoky super hard. I was interested why he put y0su first and dug up some interesting quotes. Working (newest post to oldest) I find these posts which mention y0su. On May 09 2015 07:06 sicklucker wrote: I have had answered this like several times? On May 08 2015 04:38 sicklucker wrote: my yosu read was weak off one shitty post. My super read has been covered ... and that's it... I even used ctrl-f to make sure I wasn't missing anything. SOMEONE please verify this for me. Honestly, unless someone can find a post I'm missing somehow I think we've got our last scum here guys. ##Vote: sicklucker | ||
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After reading my last post, do you still feel that way? | ||
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On May 10 2015 03:39 ritoky wrote: Read some of hts whining about my alignment. I am pretty much confirmed town. She was whining about my read on her but neglected the post where I said I intentionally blew the read out of proportion to create an alternative wagon. She also neglects the part where I was one of the only people pushing on stutters all game and where I bullied pro into a claim. He'll even the play I made during the night phase was 100% but indicative. Not to even bring up how i am a mason with the vig. I hate you for the bolded statements. Not sure what you mean with the italics, and agree with the rest. That is all. | ||
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You did not pressure prp into claiming. He litteraly had no other moves, in fact had he done anything OTHER than claim it would have been a terrible night for Mafia. Prp claiming when he is for sure getting lynched like that gives mafia a blue target to go after. Look at all the arguments people have made as to why your CC for doc looks bad. Try again, also this makes you look bad for not reading. Ok, you can be masons with Super, I still don't like it... maybe I'm jealous ^.^ | ||
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On May 10 2015 04:00 ritoky wrote: Hi? See guys I pressured him into posting. | ||
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Care to give an actual response to the arguments here? Or do you prefer to continue spitting? | ||
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ritoky spitting away all the town cred I patiently read into him... such a shame. | ||
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However, claiming this read after the fact proves little as you never stated those reads untill late D2. Tone and phrasing make a world of differnce. I also like the VT throwaway notion, I'm not sold that it is a solid plan given that VT is still needed to win, but maybe in that situation it has some merit. Anyways, i still see you as town or at least my most towny scum, i just hate that you throw this " too towny to prove town" attitude at us. What do you think about my read on SL? | ||
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Until someone pokes holes in my read on SL or gives pretty solid case on y0su, my vote is staying where it is. Pondering what the last mafia would be thinking at this point. Hiding with the flow of opinion, and pushing on newbies seems like the most likely option for mafia atm. | ||
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He spends a decent bit of D1 questioning and going after -c- for his case against scott. Given how much support -c- has as town even that early in the game it seems like an odd move for scum to push on him, especially a newbie y0su scum. Not much from him until he posts his list of reads TS quoted earlier. I don't think we should read too much from the order that he posted his reads in, if you look at the order he is clearly going down the list of player in the 2nd post of this thread. A lot of his reads are fairly short and don't have much backing them up, but they are pretty consistent with newbie reads. y0su spends D2 doing some questioning and putting on a little pressure. Most of it is directed towards SL, who y0su has as more likely scum than stutters. Spends a fair bit of time in WIFOM territory (in my opinion) trying to find logic behind why Super would have been roleblocked N1. Rest of his filter is regarding ritoky's CC doc play. So to follow up on TS's case here, I'm not that sold anymore. Your first point is larely about the order of his reads, unfortunately that is circumstantial, especially given he listed ppl in order of the list in the OP. The most solid link I found in your case about Stutters and y0su being a mafia team is the way that y0su drops his line of questioning. However he does this in other cases too, which doesn't help his case as town but it doesn't help solidify this association between the y0su and Stutters either. His inactivity thus far today doesn't look great, but I'm not convinced he's the top target for today either. | ||
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On May 10 2015 10:32 ritoky wrote: I don't really see the big deal in it? Your point is that he is disengaged, has weak reads, not reading the thread, and lackluster? Meh. More interested in the fact that your read on me was so much longer, clear, and developed yet SL is the one who gets scummed...feel like the time devotion should have been the other way around? Let me go try shining's read on for size maybe his is better. (It's hard to build up a lot over someone posted so little) On May 10 2015 10:56 ritoky wrote: just read shining's case on y0su, it is slightly better than TT's on SL. i especially like the part about the prompting stutters for his next target after prp into no follow-up on the matter. where i run amuck with it is the part where y0su gives his reads. i get the whole part where he separates them in two and how he holds the 2 scum until his second post. there may be something to that, but then i look at the reads. as a new player he gives a full scum read and basically a null read to his 2 teammates? mind you prp probably encouraged bussing on himself in the QT at some point, but that....idk i feel like a newer player would be more apt to TR his other partner than null read them, especially since y0su doesn't seem like he has the capabilities to solo a game going forward. y0su's reads just leave me thinking those aren't his partners.... He is bothering to read what people are putting out there, and responds with fair reasoning. I want to throw scum on him for some of the way's he's acting but I keep looking at him and seeing towny stuff. | ||
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Actually I already have auto. kill yosu ritoky tictoc win the game. So ya im not gonna try im an easy townread if you wanna throw the game go for it | ||
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On May 10 2015 06:49 ritoky wrote: i get home in probably 4 hrs, so i will read it more thoroughly there. that said, my initial thoughts is that SL has been tunneled pretty hard on me for a lot of the game, which doesn't seem like a winning strat as the last mafia alive. he is high on the lynch list, tunneling me and me flipping town will only put him closer to the lynch so idk...doesn't seem like a winning line of play. TT statistically likely town -c- pretty much town superbia conf town y0su considered my claim so might be town. which leaves shining and hts....so after i read your SL read, i should probably read those 2 filters. I just looked through SL's filter and found 0 evidence of this claim. Care to enlighten us ritoky? | ||
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gee, I wonder why... I need to get to bed, it's only a little over 5 hours before I have to be at work. Hopefully I can get up early and figure out how to proceed into EoD. I wont have much time after work thanks to Mothers Day. D3 is turning out to be a headache, town is making this harder than it should be. | ||
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Ended up back in SL's filter seeing what I had to build a full EoD case against him, and I ran into this. On May 07 2015 02:10 sicklucker wrote: Im offering you a really good lynch math does not lie! This preflip blame is hella scummy At first this looks like it pretty much confirms SL as town. It doesn't make sense that SL and Stutters on a scum team would carry on like this, much less Stutters poke holes in a teammates theory to get a Town lynched. ...But then if we assume SL is Town (and Stutters obv would know that) WHY would stutters poke at SL's idea? Wouldn't Stutters support this completely wrong notion to the fullest (knowing as scum that it is 100% untrue). Does it make more sense that Stutters is bad Mafia and does not take advantage of town SL's incorrect play? or Is it probable that SL and Stutters per-arranged this exchange to give town cred? I can't tell if I'm getting stuck in WIFOM or if I'm just tired. | ||
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"I see all these as ppl as town, lets just roll through the rest to win, ok?" "Still voting ritoky" "I like how he defends me as town" All I see is scum. If your town, it's time to stop being a lazy ass posting one line posts and not reading the thread. So yea, I'm ready to lynch you. | ||
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Only scum tries to say that we don't have to bother to look for scum anymore. At this stage of the game that's the only thing Town has to NOT do. This is literally my first game ever of Mafia, I'm willing to say that the mechanics you've suggested this entire game are god awful and will never aid town. ##Vote: sicklucker ##Vote: sicklucker ##Vote: sicklucker | ||
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Too afraid to vote for me because I'm actually around and don't have votes stacked up on me already? | ||
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In a game where "town steamrolled mafia, so it doesn't matter" | ||
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Case ya missed it ##Vote: sicklucker | ||
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On May 10 2015 18:31 sicklucker wrote: Well Your wrong It happens, I can accept that. I'd rather not accept lazy town play as an excuse, to being wrong. | ||
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I think I have a fairly solid case against SL here, and at this point there is little that will change my vote. Fair Warning, I'm going to go a little crazy with quotes. As per usual I'll try to bury reference quotes in spoilers, just be warned there may be a lot in some of them. D1: SL enters the game with a weak town claim off the bat, hidden away in spoilers (ish). Makes a few pokes a people then jumps on scott. On May 03 2015 13:17 sicklucker wrote: ##Vote: scott31337 ya I dont like scotts no reason to vote me vote after he enters the game expecting to "keep an eye on me" This is WELL after -c- makes his open post and starts to focus scott and this is the first time he mentions scott in any post. This is exactly why I called him out for sheeping the vote, to which he tried to claim otherwise (total lies, if you check the thread) + Show Spoiler + On May 06 2015 16:53 sicklucker wrote: My vote was not sheep I was one if not the first to bring him up. He opened with how he wanted to keep an eye on me, then voted me because I didnt post much as my pre game excuse said I would then he said a bunch of other garbage and afked for 24 hours. He had 1 post after that which I called him out as being town but no one was interested in voting hts with 3 votes. Now with a vote on someone who is already under pressure, SL starts to post more casually. He stops quoting people and starts making a lot more spam posts. When called on it, he starts to use his lazy excuse. On May 04 2015 09:06 sicklucker wrote: im already doing shit On May 04 2015 09:07 sicklucker wrote: I did my usual routine of going through the thread and quoting and talking about things that interest me thoughts? On May 04 2015 09:09 sicklucker wrote: conivnce me not to vote whats his face obs guy scott because from my pov and whjat I read he looks pretty bad Notice he still gives no reason why he doesn't like scott. The rest of SL's posts D1 are trash and spam. Makes weak efforts to target people, all without anything backing it up. On May 05 2015 00:50 sicklucker wrote: So we def kill scott. Then if he flips scum we def kill super. If not maybe hts? I donno this seems solid tho Then, 1 hour before EoD (proof) SL does this. On May 05 2015 06:58 sicklucker wrote: Acualy scotts last post makes me think he might be town On May 05 2015 07:51 sicklucker wrote: i might switch! On May 05 2015 07:57 sicklucker wrote: no ones switching anyway. Boring Those last 2 posts were literally right at EoD. D2 This is the day SL starts pushing his mechanical plays. He actually starts with an interested play, On May 06 2015 16:49 sicklucker wrote: If im a cop I have a green on hts On May 07 2015 00:34 sicklucker wrote: I would totally do this as the real cop 100% of the time its something I learned on another site. The idea is to fake it x amount that mafia does not believe me. but if I do die in the night and I am the real cop theirs no fighting about who my check is because I left it in the thread. Also if I am faking a check and I die in the night as vt, it means hts is most likely town because mafia would have no reason to kill me if my fake check was on a mafia member. Its a very useful strategy that everyone should use Might have something solid behind it, seems just as misleading to town as it is to mafia to me though. SL's main play D2 is of course his theory regarding Super's RB claim making him scum. On May 07 2015 00:44 sicklucker wrote: Oh super claimed rb? Hes very likely mafia now I will vote him. From my experience mafia will claim rb like half of the time regardless of the setup so im always suspect of the roleblock claim. But when theres a vet in the game (There is 50% of the time in this set up but mafia knows what setup were in) mafia will always roleblock whoever they nk because if you roleblock your nightkill then the vet power is neutriled. So mafia will know there is a vet because they are told the setup and will have roleblocked ff if its a veteran setup 100% of the time. Also meta wise supers one mafia win that I know of was my very first game. He claimed roleblock that game too and rode it to a mafia win. Let me ask the host if rb goes through vet power in this setup but it usually does. Told ya you should have killed me super On May 07 2015 01:01 sicklucker wrote: oh ok thank I will be voting super now and never changing. This means to mean mafia will fake rb here 50-75% of the time. Probably on the higher side because super has done this very play before in his last newbie game as mafia. 50% chance to flip scum is very good odds. 75% is amazing I have no reason to ever change this This argument is total bull, it would have had us lynching our Vig. The math doesn't hold either. In a game where we have 4 setups, 2 of them with Vet 2 without, there is always a 50% chance that we don't have a Vet regardless of when or how people claim RB. To town with limited information the odds never get better than that, 50% change the claim is valid or invalid. Regardless of the mechanics there the fact that SL squandered the whole day pushing this logic and nothing else is disturbing. He keeps us the same canned responses when asked about who he would target besides Super, never actually giving a read. On May 07 2015 07:03 sicklucker wrote: stutters or that guy who just made the worst post of all time yosu On May 08 2015 04:28 sicklucker wrote: another 9-1 vote hum le sign those are never good for info. Also its not super I have no read on this person Happens when you don't make them. EoD and N2 are just disgraceful, SL doesn't even make efforts to read the thread and misses key flips and events. Bigun: + Show Spoiler + On May 08 2015 04:29 sicklucker wrote: Like the way the votes piled up . This dudes always a town unless the mafia team is super, ritoky and him. Which is acualy a potential team but very unlike;u On May 08 2015 04:30 sicklucker wrote: oh i didnt acualy read the thread before i said any of this. Did he botch a claim? On May 08 2015 04:41 sicklucker wrote: Good so there is a vet. Im usually right on these things. this makes super mafia gg buday whos your partner is it rly ritoky? On May 08 2015 04:41 sicklucker wrote: Good so there is a vet. Im usually right on these things. this makes super mafia gg buday whos your partner is it rly ritoky? Legit terrible town play? Mafia trying "too scum to be scum"? D3 SL starts to claim some people town, continues his trend from the ENTIRE game of never really looking for scum. I already did a bunch of reading into his stuff from today in my past few posts so most of my arguments about his D3 are there, but it's really just more of the same. The ONLY hole I see in my entire case I posted here. Feel free to comment. Besides the slew of other disinformation SL has been spouting out this game, some of which I included here, there is one more key thing I would like to make VERY clear. On May 10 2015 18:21 sicklucker wrote: or lazy town. Look we steam rolled mafia. Plenty of people got spewed town by the mafia that flipped. We have 3or 4 lynches left. Theres 8 players. Im pretty sure none of the five I listed are scum. So if we kill the 3 people outside of them. It helps that two of them want to kill me for pretty scummy reasons with bad logic. Im very happy where this game is at. We have 3 lynches left. We are in D3 with 8 people, and unless we catch the last scum we will loose 2 town per day. That leaves us with 6 people going into D4 and 4 people going into D5, I believe you'd call D5 lylo? If by the EoD5 town has not correctly voted the last scum Town looses as the ML drops us to 3 and the NK to 2, Mafia wins. Therefor it is still VERY important that we make sure our last 3 targets count, and the sooner we find scum the better. Can't believe I feel like I have to say that last part. That's likely it from me until EoD (maybe after) thanks to work, Mothers Day and the fact I have now been up all night >.< | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Everything I said is evidence that all you have done this game is given misdirection, lied, and made terrible plays. If that is not the definition of scum play then I clearly walked into the wrong game. I also like how you remind me I'm town every other post, while posting stuff like this. On May 10 2015 18:14 sicklucker wrote: I would acualy rather see yosu dead over ritoky. My logic is if hes town then hes not going to derp away an auto win an dvote me here like the newer players will On May 10 2015 18:14 sicklucker wrote: So thats why im voting him. Think id rather tictoc over yosu but I really dont care | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Feels like I was useless. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
D1 I didn't realize just how much time I was going to need to read and absorb enough to make reads on people. Ended up with no time and a little confused what I wanted to do. Felt like I was able to pick up the ball after that and town was able to do the same with picking off prp D2. I found it a little odd though how a few people ignored my early suspicion of him and gave credit to -c- and HtS who solidified the case. I mean sure the deserve the credit for making him the clear target to town, but I felt like I got brushed aside as a newbie. It was also a bit odd playing since I often found myself posting when nobody was around. D3 was the first day where I felt like I had an idea who and how I should push on, but the interactions felt so sour. Especially my exchange with SL left me pretty frustrated. Actually that's why I only posted that snippet before, wanted to give myself time to calm down and reflect before posting again. I'll likely play again in the next newbie game to give Mafia a fair chance, but my experience from this game is pretty mixed. I've found that sometimes being totally honest and sharing what I think pisses people off a lot more than I expect, so I'm spoiler-ing the rest of my thoughts. So if I manage to piss you off just remember you choose to read this + Show Spoiler + First off this is more or less about my stuff with SL, trying not to be personal about it, but if I fail sorry. So I get that he plays this super lazy style, but I don't get why everyone just accepts it. I mean I put together some pretty solid reasons why I thought he was scum this game and put some effort into detailing why I thought that. This is instantly brushed off by everyone who isn't new SIMPLY because that's his Meta. Like really? Metas change you guys, if SL knows that he never does PoE as scum and knows that you all know that, whats to stop him just throwing that into a game as scum and suddenly everyone goes, "ok thats his town meta, mark him green"? Maybe the biggest reason why that bugs me is because this is a newbie game. A game that HAS to have multiple new players who are learning. I noticed you guys tend to push newbies quite a bit and point out when their reads are weak in an instance. When I was seeing this I thought "of man, these guys are really gunna me on my feet, much less scum." Then I see SL doing the same stuff (giving weak, or unbacked reads, posting very little, etc) and everyone goes, "Oh he plays like that" How am I supposed to take this as a new person here? It's a bit of a double standard to push new players for stuff but excuse vets for the same stuff. A new player has literally NO WAY of understanding anyone's metas and besides reading past games has no way of learning. So either we have to accept what is being said about that person (removing our ability to judge them on our on) or go spend a ton of extra time reading for peoples metas. Why should we have to do all that work to understand a player who is just lazy? I might not mind this style of play so much, expect that SL was outright giving bad advice to town the whole game. As town... in a NEWBIE game... simply because he's too lazy to do real reading so he comes up with "great mechanical plays." In addition when I was pressuring him D3, he keeps giving me glib one line responses, and eventually stars just calling me names. One post that showed more than 5 seconds of thought or minimal effort would have given me pause, but that's too much effort. That REALLY bugs me. Then he just gets defended and my whole bit of reasoning is thrown out the window, because of one word, Meta. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say meta reads should never happen. I totally get the value, I just see Meta reads as possibly misleading due to changing metas. It's when that's literally the ONLY defense for a person's actions/play that late in a game. That's an issue for me. I feel like this is telling me I shouldn't bother to try so hard. It might look bad to be lazy, but it will soon get read not as lazy, but as meta. Not only will it let me avoid reading or giving more than minimal effort, but it makes my scum game easier to play since my town game already will luck scummy. Are you guys really ok sending this message? So thats my rant, here is my question. Given that SL's town play is at best lazy, and possibly hugely detrimental to town (if we had followed his play on D2...) why isn't he just a policy lynch every game? You possibly catch an easy scum, at worst get rid of an unreliable town. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
On May 12 2015 15:27 sicklucker wrote: Also you didnt even remotely "piss me off" I dont take this game personal you shouldnt either Good, I'm not taking it personally either. Bugged the hell out of me for a bit, but I def didn't loose any sleep over it (even when I said I was going to bed and came back an hour later, happens all the time thanks to my unreliable work hours). I'm probably being overly critical about your idea D2 with the RB lynch. You did post that stuff about pseudo-claiming DT checks with "if I was DT, X is green" which seems like it has some merit, though at the same time it serves to confuse town as much as mafia. On May 12 2015 22:38 Half the Sky wrote: You didn't do badly at all for your first game, you had to counterclaim prplhz (from your perspective) though on my end given his play and the timing of his claim (6h prior to EoD is too premature...1-2h is more acceptable) even if he had claimed DT, I would not have believed it and I would have proceeded to push his lynch based on gameplay. But things like that you figure out only through experience. Your medic save on Superbia was fine N1 since he was most obvious town. Celestial would have also been acceptable. I'm not sure I understand why that is such a distinct difference, especially factoring in time zones. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
I was thinking, and the reason I brought up time zones, that if someone is unable to play EoD (say EoD occurs at 5am or while at work) then claiming 6 hours prior could make sense as a blue role. I was also assuming earlier is better as it allows more time for discussion, but I suppose that's also more time for people to CC which makes the case more complicated. | ||
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