EPTI assume Dwarf isn't your top town anymore right? Who is?
Who are the ton you'd lynch?
Newbie Student Mafia VII - Page 5
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
I assume Dwarf isn't your top town anymore right? Who is? Who are the ton you'd lynch? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 12:53 Trfel wrote: I'm pretty confident that prplhz is town here. I've read Stutters695's arguments (or at least, the posts that I believe he is referring to) and I don't find them to be all that convincing. He's being forceful, active, and his reads have generally been good. I don't normally see all three of these traits at once from a town prplhz, so I doubt even more that he would play like this as mafia. I can demonstrate this if necessary, but at this time I don't think that it is necessary. And prplhz can speak for himself. I can see those three things being true enough. What exactly is he being forceful about aside from protecting Dwarf though? I don't think you can say he was that forceful on Plotspot since it didn't take much of any force for people to attack him. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:06 Trfel wrote: Prplhz has been an active participant in the town throughout Day 1. He started out by voting Bourneq and townreading Soren333. Also, prplhz was one of the main people trying to get off of the plotspot wagon, which certainly wasn't a mainstream idea when he started suggesting it. I realize that the way he did so can be considered sheeping, and isn't being particularly independent, but if you look at how he does it, he is consistent between his play and his words. Uh, I think he was first to mention getting off Plot and it was a bad lynch. It was around 2 hoursish before lynch. I know, we talked about Plot for a little bit when I arrived after I had breakfast. I don't think he would have switched unless HtS or I went with him. I think he was visibly getting support. I think you can do that as town just as likely as mafia. He wasn't sheeping though. No way. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:10 Trfel wrote: I agree that The Shining/Ace1312's slot doesn't look very good, but that's mostly for activity. I'm ignoring it for now. At the same time, I almost wonder if he could have an easier time jumping into the thread if he is scum? Scum replacements don't really have to read the thread, they can sort of make stuff up and hope to get by. Especially in a newbie game. Obviously that isn't a very effective way to play, but many people claim to play scum without reading the thread. I don't think I agree with this at all. People are asking you stuff since you're here. If he showed up people will be asking him stuff too. In my 2nd game a newbie (I don't remember the name of it, but you were nightkilled N1 trfel in it) There was a replacement scum Scott1313371234123541235 for Gumdrops. Gum made 2 posts and was replaced. Scott's entrance was a thread sentiment list post with nice little links to the post for each player that expressed his read. He HAD to show us he read the thread and was eventually caught up. He would have died right then. Same with you, you HAVE to show you've read town or mafia. Like, you get leeway but not a pardon. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:15 rsoultin wrote: lol >< true i know i don't cause i'd get caught in a new york minute but lol he replaced in before EoD though so i mean, at some point that excuse stops being valid i brought it up less because of the afk bit and more because while bourne is being discussed, shining isn't, which i find odd. plus lol you can't really argue that his post today was...i mean, what's even the point of posting? I'm queasy on Prplhz right now. Do you really think that he can't act like he is this game as scum? | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 14 2015 13:21 rsoultin wrote: xP that doesn't tell me what you think about shining lol and whether you agree or not, some players don't read the thread as scum, or at least claim they don't. whether it's good play or not doesn't really matter? unless this argument has any bearing on shining's alignment i don't see why we're discussing it again -_- ha forgot that part. I liked the little content he had, but yeah why hasn't he produced like he said he would? How long do we give these lurker players to be town? Why does it feel like town is just eating town right now? If we are going to lynch a lurker type player, I want to kill Dwarf. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:23 Trfel wrote: I mean, everyone makes errors. And no one can remember every detail, most players forget most of the details. My point is that, you know who scum is, and you have scum teammates in the scum QT who can help you. They can tell you the thread sentiment, who the main town players are, who they are currently pushing, etc. Like, I imagine that they could basically tell you where your reads should be at the start of the game with basic reasons for each one, and then that could be posted without having carefully read the thread at all. Clearly he can't admit to not have read the thread (or tried to) here, but I do think he could fake it (this doesn't work if someone analyzes him really well, but good analysis is hard to do). A town replacement is under pressure to produce content just as much as a scum replacement is. The Shining's inactivity is definitely scummy, but I would still expect the scum team to give him some kind of ground to stand on (unless they're giving him up for dead, or they aren't very competent, or my analysis of how scum teams should work is completely wrong). That makes sense. He can be spoonfed the answers. Should have thought of that. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:26 rsoultin wrote: lol tbh i've seen him play scum once, so if he was just exceptionally bad that game my opinion is completely skewed, however he looks townie separate of the meta, too. i've already mentioned how he took the lead on the thread, his questions were pointed, his reads have been fluid throughout the game... like i see the arguments but i don't see why they make him scum? so he decided not to lynch plot for acting "weird" and he's always maintained that he doesn't want to lynch dwarf for acting weird...at least he's consistent? what's making you queasy? It's dumb. I have trouble with hypocriticalness sometimes but theres times I'll be hypocritical. I don't see what's so different from Dwarfs play and Plots. Prp towned Dwarf right away, but was on Plot hard from the git go and didn't start questioning it till about 4 hours or so prior to end of day when he had 7 votes or so. but they were in many ways playing the same. Same with Bourneq, scummed him hard fro mthe get go and floated it out there earlier today to lynch Bourneq. Prp also essentially said that even if Dwarf does nothing new he will still be towned. I understand a day or 2 pass even but uh the game? | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 14 2015 13:28 jarjarbinks wrote: + Show Spoiler + Ugh this day got away from me xD taxes are evil. Also, HTS might not be that evil, questions for HTS: 1. Who is your top scum target? Bourneq? Onegu? Tube? Stutters? If you say Onegu we have a problem. Granted, I think #2 on your case might be viable, but I think you blew that case out of proportion. If you don't mind putting out a top 2 or something that would help me understand where you stand? Since EOD happens before I return from work I'm going to put up a tier list and a vote right now. List: lower you are the scummier I think you are even in categories IF I had to say you were town: Breshke- not most vocal but reads are pretty good and I liked D2 play. Townleans Stutters- Still think he's town. If HTS clears her name and PRP gets more towny I'm completely wrong... Trf/Onegu- Onegu was on drugs + funny. HTS's case on him was good, but it didn't convince me he's scum. Trf seems like superTrf like my last game with him. Rso- Didn't dominate D1. Did more D2. Interactions with her didn't draw red flags, but she could fool me in a heartbeat Unlynchables Shining- Ace was questionable. Shining's gone. Excuse? Idk. Literal null for me prob. We shall see. Tube- On Stutter wagon (lolz) and seemed to be TR or not read much. And he dissed the list. Tinfoil tunnel seemed genuine though. And HTS's case on him was weakest by far. + Show Spoiler + Bourneq- I didn't get much chance to go through him, but HTS's case on him I thought was her strongest. Especially the policy over the hard scumread. Plus he's the guy I keep forgetting is playing. HTS- unless her top two scumreads strikes a nerve I don't want to lynch. Some pretty good analysis and I liked the D1 analysis more as I went through it. I could see how her EOD story is believable, just not sure to believe it or not... Lynchables Dwarf- Scummy D1 play + on Stutter train + earlier case I posted + 0 scumhunting + policy + no real danger of lynched? Prp- I wish I got to this. If I magically have free time tomorrow I will make a case. If not pretend I did and check him. Red flag + worse filter than HTS + earlier case I posted + on my list for most TR ##vote: Prp I dissed the list? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
I just have weird bad feelings. I just think with like 5 lurkers about how angry I'm going to be if we have 3 lurker mafias who thought Soren was the towniest player so NK his slot but HF enters and the rest of us are like "holy shit obviously a vet is on the mafia team!" I missed it, you voting Shining? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:45 jarjarbinks wrote: First line: HILARIOUS. I literally laughed. It was great. "How do i use this information?" ITS A TOOL! USE IT! you might as well have said, this list serves no point to nobody lol Ahhh well I didn't mean that I just didn't know how I was going to apply that. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:47 Trfel wrote: Yeah, sorry, the night kill doesn't really suggest this at all. Remember, this is a newbie game. Uh that was my point. sometime in the thread multiple people said that HF was NK'd which meant there's a vet on the scum team. I will admit I also think there's a vet on the mafia team but that has just as much to do with RNG probablilites as it does HF dying. It's just as easy that there are 3 vets on the mafia team too but we do have a bunch of lurkers. Anyway, what do you think about Dwarf? If you said something about it I missed it. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 14 2015 13:51 rsoultin wrote: nah, ise being mysterious! (see prp now you have to townread me xP) if you put a gun to my head and said pick your lurker lynch, though, i think shining has a higher probability of flipping scum than bourneq (based mostly on the townie posts i posted earlier) and dwarf (i don't get the hard townread really, but i do still get that floundering newbie feel from him lol ><) shining just...okay it always bugs me when people promise things then don't deliver, plus i know for a fact being lurkery is part of how he plays scum. like the difference between the newbie games i played with him (i can look up the numbers if you want them) and student V where he was scum was pretty much night and day lol >< outside the lurkers, still weighing half-the-sky and bresh honestly...his day 1 was pretty damn good and maybe it's just cause he kept disagreeing with me lol >< but it just seems like he hasn't brought much to day 2 at all beyond that, stutters' close-to-the-vest play is getting less interesting and more aggravating (in b4 this becomes about the potential blue soft), again probably because the one thing he's really pushing (prp) i don't agree with >< I really like Breshke. I do have a soft spot for people who are nice to me and tell me I'm wrong. And I think when he does tell me I'm wrong, he explains it in ways that I think he's considering what I said. But that being said, I've never read/obs/played in a game where there wasn't at least 1 mafia who I knew was town. I really like Shinings entrance and had flashbacks of our game with him in it. He started really slow but by the end of the game he was shining! haha, but ugh it is irritating he promised and hasn't delivered anything. | ||
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Tubesock
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##Unvote ##Vote: TheBloodyDwarf I can't vote for Prplhz or Stutters695. Not today anyway. | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 14 2015 21:48 Bourneq wrote: Good afternoon! Ill start with me "jumping to reads". My feelings on dwarf day 1 "I really like TBD's explenation of his behaviour but not reading the OP is really reckless and I would like fellow towns to know the rules and the pace of the game. But tbd seems as new as me at this so I will tread carefully here." Basicly I thought I should give TBD some time to give reads and get into the game before I jumped to a conclusion. Next up was Ace because he had not said a word all game. Since I did not have much to go on so early in the game I was concidering making a policy lynch. So when asked if I had to cast my vote right now who would I cast it on I said Ace. There was still plenty of time left of d1 so I was almost certain I would never acctualy cast that vote. As d1 went on and I got to read the cases against plotspot and my own personal reads of him I felt plotspot was the correct lynch. I had been keeping "my options open" because I did not feel I had very strong reads but that my strongest read was on plot. That was my first ever day of mafia so I would be a fool to trust my very first reads to much. So to answer "2 Was queried multiple times on the read switches from plotspot to TBD to Ace (who would be policy) to plotspot. Gives an answer to prplhz saying that TBD was most likely scum. " I am not sure what you meant by "read switches". Early on in the day I was getting bad vibes from tbd who was acting pretty suspicious to me. But it was early on in the day so I was going to give him time to redeem himself. He did not do much of anything for the rest of the day while plotspot was making a very bad case for himself and I thought that my reads on him were stronger than thoose I had on tbd. Somewhere in the middle of d1 I am asked who I would vote on if I had to vote that very second. I answered Ace because I did not feel enough information had surfaced on anybody so a policy lynch would be in good order. First, I'm glad you're voting Dwarf. Second, the way I read your list post you basically scummed everysingle person on that list except for Breshke. Later you said you only have 2 scums...Can you update please? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
At least Shining has done something. | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 15 2015 01:33 Trfel wrote: TheBloodyDwarf + Show Spoiler + On April 10 2015 16:15 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I feel that this is a key post from TheBloodyDwarf. After a long series of rules misunderstandings and not really adjusting to the game properly, TheBloodyDwarf states (in bold) that this is a different game than SC2 arcade mafia. Because of this post, I am willing to forgive him his previous errors. And from this point out, I expect to see him attempting to play the game in the forum mafia style, instead of the SC2 arcade mafia style. But I don't see him following through with this.Looks like I have to bit explain myself. After reading this I think my posts make more sense. This is not sc2 arcade mafia. I thought day 1 is just day for chat. Nothing happens before somebody brings evidency to table. Also I didnt know its insta lynch who gets most votes. So pretty much my day1 posts mean nothing. I felt like everybody is chatting (felt for me) and then suddenly Soren333 starts replying to those chatty posts. I thought it looked really funny and he even asked questions that I answered later but before he asked again. Also I didnt know that scum means mafia. I realized scum means mafia way way later. "Everybody has little scum inside them" Isn't that just like some IRC chat? like talking to friends? Nobody trying to be serious kind of answer. Why I voted somebody? Looks like you have to vote everyday or you get kicked out of the game. (again this is not sc2 mafia..). I just voted fearing maybe I forget or don't have time to vote and admins kick me out. Why fear of death some ask? Well, I want to play this game and not to die? "I hope our cop or vigi is good". Again, I was expecting cop to give some "evidence" to table and then people discuss is that person trustful and can his claims even be possible. But that's all wrong. Looks like you make your presumption based on chat. With feels quite weird to me now but I am noob playing this mafia for the first time and some here are experts. So I have to see how this works out. So I think I have time to rethink who to vote so, ##UNVOTE On April 10 2015 16:20 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: This is one read that he provides, he says that he liked prplhz the least by the time he voted for him.^^^And I voted for guy who I least liked so far^^^ On April 11 2015 20:12 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Back to the point. Call my blind but I just don't see anything really suspicious. I was going to vote for Ace but now he is gone. Soren is bit weird tho. He comes to thread with fireguns bangging and then goes silent for moment. But nothing special. Also Stutters is really quiet. On April 11 2015 23:45 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: TheBloodyDwarf also provides these two posts before End of Day, which actually provide sufficient explanation for his late vote on Stutters695.I dont find anybody really suspicious..  Stutters695. Checking his filter and I mostly see questions. Looks like he doesn't really have own opinion but is asking others what do they think. btw, I dont like you Tubesock, you have been chasing me from the beginning  There's really no reason to go either way on him. Since the post I first mentioned, his play has changed. I can see him as a new player who simply is having trouble finding suspicious things. However, outside of a possible toneread, I see no reason to townread him either, as he hasn't done anything amazing. I can easily see TheBloodyDwarf being either alignment, so I don't really want to lynch him today. The most suspicious thing about him is really his inactivity, he hasn't shared any reads at all since Day 1. But that isn't really alignment indicative. He might need to be policy lynched eventually, but I see more reason to lynch The Shining, at least (if not others as well). You won't policy him now? When is a good time for that? MYLO????? | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 15 2015 02:11 Half the Sky wrote: If I recall right, you're townreading Tube. Now focus on the bolded. Tube had discussed a theory where if a scum prp knew that Stutters was town and Stutters has the potential to be town given his conviction on prp, what is the likelihood of a scum prp wanting to counterwagon on Stutters to set up a possible mislynch? Now I'll admit I'm a little biased here because following this he tried to pin blame on me for switching off plotspot, but it was he who led that charge. If you think Stutters' case is valid (or at least the presentation is a town trait) do you think there's credence to the possibility that prp is doing what Tube thinks he's trying to do by counterwagoning? Does the bolded look at all opportunistic? That's what I'm driving at. If you think I've missed something, quote it. I'm rescinding my theory. First, I don't think you're mafia now. Secondly, though I'm having troubles with Prp leading the charge off because there really isn't a good enough risk/reward (Trfel's point). Same goes for you. It's too risky and for basically no reason. Prp can be scum but I don't think he can be scum for this anymore. | ||
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Tubesock
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On April 15 2015 02:38 Stutters695 wrote: + Show Spoiler [about Prplhz] + On April 15 2015 01:15 Trfel wrote: It's relative.... Someone like Holyflare is probably the most aggressive. He'll see one post and hard push that player with apparent 100% confidence. Prplhz isn't a player like that. From reading the thread, the impression that I got was that prplhz was leading and driving things along for most of Day 1. His exact tone and wording isn't always very forceful, but when you look at the ideas that he presents, you can see it. For example, here is the way he treated the vote switch to Stutters695 on Day 1. Most people consider this progression suspicious. Here is the first post he makes. I believe that he is the first player to suggest leaving the plotspot lynch (I'm not going to go back tons of pages to double check, but he is at least one of the first). At this point, the vote count was very heavily in favor of lynching plotspot (7 on plotspot, 0 on Stutters695). I know that the way he phrases it is a request, but this also makes some sense, since without the support of others he can't actually change the lynch. At this time, Half the Sky is the only person in the thread, and she refuses to switch, so prplhz drops it. Prplhz also posts his explanation for why he would prefer to lynch Stutters695 over plotspot, and the way he arrived at this read feels towny enough (though that's an issue for another day). At this point, I would be suspicious of prplhz. Asking one person to switch and then not doing anything when they don't switch isn't very impressive (still something town does all the time, but isn't a very good play). But then Tubesock comes back, and says that he doesn't want to lynch plotspot. Prplhz immediately jumps and asks him who he wants to lynch.Prplhz seems to be more interested in not lynching plotspot than lynching a specific player, and that's fine. Still, despite asking who Tubesock wanted to lynch (Tubesock initially said TheBloodyDwarf), prplhz still argues for a Stutters695 lynch. Then Tubesock shows desire to talk about plotspot and Stutters695, as well as a lack of confidence in lynching plotspot, so it can be assumed that he is willing to lynch Stutters695. And Half the Sky rereads Stutters695's filter, and said that she understands why he is scummy (implying willingness to lynch him). Prplhz immediately switches his vote, the first one to do so. Prplhz isn't posting huge walls of text or screaming with all caps, but he clearly made a decision and put effort into getting people's attention and making them listen to him. In some of his posts, his tone felt very wishy-washy, however if you look at the consistency of his play, and the context for when he said what he said, he's actually very solid in his decision. Despite the way he asked players to switch votes and seemed willing to follow them wherever, that isn't what he did, and it's obvious that prplhz was leading the thread through this period. Were plotspot scum, I could see an argument being made for prplhz being scum because of these actions. However, with a flipped plotspot, these actions aren't inherently scummy, and I feel that they are consistent with the rest of prplhz's play in this game. This is one example, but I feel that prplhz played a leading role throughout Day 1. I'm used to prplhz playing a more reserved role; while he always participates in the thread, this is the first time I have seen him consistently leading. And that's why he is a confident townread. While I understand where you're coming from, the part in green I absolutely disagree about. It can be fine, but again prpl didn't care about it being me getting lynched. He ignored my reasoning for voting plot, which was a direct response to his question. If you're going to try and honestly lynch scum, you'd think he'd respond to that in sone fashion. You'd also think he would try to stick around for the deadline but he wasn't really concerned with who got lynched. If plot dies, he's gets credit for the town read and switching before and if I die, it's a simple "well he posted so little I thought he was a good lynch" You don't start a counter wagon so close to the deadline then go afk if he really believed plot was town. He didn't really care about saving him, he didn't really care who got lynched d1 and he certainly doesn't care who gets lynched today. That's not town. I can see it both ways. That's pretty damning. But then I think about how I thought about Plotspot. He reminded me of my first game and how I acted before I was mlynched. My reasoning to leaving Plot was simply to get another day with him. He certainly wasn't being very towny. And I think town!Prplhz could have felt it wasn't going to be a big enough loss to justify more effort. My level of town protecting is directly proportionate to how towny I think that person is. Isn't yours? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 15 2015 03:57 Stutters695 wrote: Anyone? I don't like the Shining lynch as he comes off being overwhelmed by replacing in. What he has posted looks pretty solid to me and I think if we give him another day we'll be able to decide his alignment. Agreed. It's basically a policy lynch. If you're going to policy lynch, why not Dwarf??? He comes back and makes an excuse? I get homework/life gets in the way but... | ||
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