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...
Okay. First off, @ WW...hopefully someone on the outside has already said this to you, but the soft claim was absolutely the best play as vet. You did a good job in the end, assuming that your excuses were true. Sorry you got lynched, man.
Secondly, I apologize for the train I started with a pressure vote...even if I did have reason to at the time.
Thirdly, I don't understand why we're lynching a blue claim on Day 1 ^^; It makes sense later in the game especially in a lynch or lose situation with one or two scum left maybe, but these claims resolve themselves ^^;. That said...I don't know that scum pushed the lynch forward or town just didn't recognize that a blue claim should be left alone on Day 1.
Eh, I need to go back and look at the posting leading up and stuff, but I have skimmed, and Shining, yeah, I do think ExO is capable of bamboozling everyone (just as my brother apparently thinks of me) however scumreading him for being a decent liar is not gonna sell. Maybe you had other scumtells on him. I'll have to read things closer.
Meh -_-.
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For those who don't understand why hardclaiming as vet is not a good move:
The vet is there to absorb a mafia NK. If he hardclaims he loses his value. Softclaiming has the double benefit of (hopefully) stopping the lynch and (probably) drawing a shot.
Anyway...Silverarte and I were not in the thread at the time. Tubesock and LS were. Shining was voting for a counterwagon, not scummy in and of itself. Shining...can you please explain your reasoning for voting WW over LS with a soft blue claim?
Celestial and Gumdrop both had useless votes, which bothers me more from Celestial than Gumdrop simply because he was actually here to do something about it. Can you explain your vote, Celestial?
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On January 07 2015 10:05 LightningStrike wrote:
Honestly I didn't believe his blue claim tbh because he didn't say what role he was but I do agree yes maybe soft claiming was the best option for vet but when people are voting you for a lynching? You must claim that how I feel about blue roles when being lynched.
Sorry, dude. I know it's easy to claim post-lynch when I wasn't here at EoD...but those who have played with me before on the other site (don't think it's happened here) can attest that I always switch my vote when someone soft (or hard) claims a role.
The reason is simple: if they're really that role they probably will be NKd by mafia that night. Not 100% of the time of course, but probably, and especially this early in the game, where there is plenty of time to determine if he's lying or not...
Eh. I am inclined to believe that this didn't occur to players in a newbie game, but still...
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This does line up with the posts you made, Celestial. Meh, knowing that you're new makes it harder, cause most people I would be saying BS to right now.
On January 07 2015 07:34 -Celestial- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 07:25 TheWarWaffle wrote:
No computer, 12% battery on IPhone. 2 hours until I am most likely lynched... Time for a desperate measure. I am town and possess a power role. I appear to have made a fool of myself through my and am unable to defend myself adequately at this time. All I can say is I'm not mafia and that there are better people to lynch. Softclaiming a power role about an hour and a half before...I think most of the rest of us playing this game are going to need a bit more than that to be honest. I'm open to be convinced to get onto one of the main bandwagons. I remain skeptical of LS and find jarjar to be very scummy but jarjar doesn't look like he'll get the votes and I'm not totally convinced that LS is a good day 1 lynch even if I do find his posts suspicious. So I'm open to being convinced to my vote to help swing things, but I'm not going to do it unless people have convincing arguments one way or another. And I don't see a convincing argument to help try to get the lynch off you.
It's clear here that you knew that WW claimed. So normally my BS meter would be going off, because you clearly stated here that you are also suspicious of LS, and a blue claim should be enough on Day 1 to convince people not to lynch WW.
You also clearly knew that WW was going to be the lynch.
I didn't personally like LS as a Day 1 lynch...although I think that of the players here he should be quicker to move his vote than anyone on that train and that does not sit well with me, considering I know that he was lynched as a blue role in his first game and was especially concerned about that the last several games, but apparently not this one...
Yet there was still shining.
Are you townreading Shining? If you're calling him a Day 2 lynch...I don't get it. Suspicious of LS and suspicious enough of Shining to consider lynching him, but you decided to park your vote instead?
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LS...dude...
You've been lynched before as a claimed cop who was not believed...on Day 1 no less...
WTF were you thinking? I mean, I just now got started thinking about it while looking at the votes, and this does not make sense to me. You always talk about being afraid to lynch power roles. Always. You used that as your excuse in your scum game and I almost bought it.
Why are all your reads inactives? You don't think anyone actively playing is scum?
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Eh, you called it the wrong name. Detective. People thought you were lying because of that (or so it seemed to me).
...Dude, don't make me go filter-diving your past games. I know you've mentioned it again in a game since the one I lynched you as scum (and said that about the odds), that you were concerned about lynching blue roles.
What's your read on shining?
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On January 07 2015 10:53 -Celestial- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 10:32 rsoultin wrote:
It's clear here that you knew that WW claimed. So normally my BS meter would be going off, because you clearly stated here that you are also suspicious of LS, and a blue claim should be enough on Day 1 to convince people not to lynch WW.
You also clearly knew that WW was going to be the lynch.
I didn't personally like LS as a Day 1 lynch...although I think that of the players here he should be quicker to move his vote than anyone on that train and that does not sit well with me, considering I know that he was lynched as a blue role in his first game and was especially concerned about that the last several games, but apparently not this one...
Yet there was still shining.
Are you townreading Shining? If you're calling him a Day 2 lynch...I don't get it. Suspicious of LS and suspicious enough of Shining to consider lynching him, but you decided to park your vote instead? I think I've already explained all of this really across my posts before the vote but alright. WW's claim was a random, single post, drive-by claim. It was extremely unconvincing, at least I wasn't convinced. Should I just take that on faith more? In any case I wasn't particularly happy about the way it was going but by that time it was far too late to do anything other than vote WW, vote LS or vote Shining to have an impact. I was scumreading LS until he provided evidence against it. I still am suspicious of LS but he convinced me to change my vote away earlier on the basis that it was a bad D1 decision and there was not enough evidence to justify to myself to change it back. Shining I said quote "Could definitely be convinced for a D2 lynch here" after you started my mind thinking about him being scum, you can check my major read post from today for proof. I wasn't saying he was a lock-in for a D2 lynch, I was saying he was a possible good candidate to look at because at that point it looked like LS was taking a lot of the heat for D1. Basically the reason why not D1 is because my impression at that time was that nobody had enough of a feeling to commit to that lynch and personally I wanted to see more evidence before I decided or started trying to convince people to get on that wagon anyway. Nothing I saw since then convinced me that Shining was scum, so I couldn't in good faith vote there. If you or anyone else had seen something more convincing from Shining then I might well have changed my vote there, but the follow-up on the accusations wasn't enough and as it was everyone got rolling on the WW train in the end. I felt it best to be consistent to my reads rather than go with something I didn't feel was honest. Perhaps that's not the best way to play but I feel happier about making my own decision there than simply bandwagoning what was potentially one bad call over another bad call.
Absolute BS -_-
Shining had 3 votes to WW's 5, and I've already explained why WW should have been given the benefit of the doubt. I can understand not realizing it then...
But you would have made 4 on Shining. 3 had already voted him. Tube was scumreading him. I was scumreading him. There was plenty enough interest to change votes. BS. You and one on WWs wagon shifting from Shining would have been enough.
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EBWOP:
Shifting from WW to Shining.
I'm not flat-out scumreading you cause I can see this to be a newbie mistake, but you're definitely back at null for me and if you continue with the BS I'm going to have a hard time climbing back out of that hole. I can be really bad about confirmation bias, which I readily admit.
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On January 07 2015 11:05 LightningStrike wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 10:53 rsoultin wrote:
Eh, you called it the wrong name. Detective. People thought you were lying because of that (or so it seemed to me).
...Dude, don't make me go filter-diving your past games. I know you've mentioned it again in a game since the one I lynched you as scum (and said that about the odds), that you were concerned about lynching blue roles.
What's your read on shining? Well what else I was suppose to do when my role pm was Detective and my coach in that game clarified it was Cop at the time but I couldn't really say it was my coach who told me it was Cop and in the thread I did ask for BH the host of the game to clarified to me if Detective was Cop in the thread and told them what BH told me but they simply didn't believe me because of the counter claim by KSC that's all. Also my read on Shining is Null leaning scum as I didn't like his case on ExO and some people already told him that ExO wasn't going to get lynched Day 1 but he did switch TheWarWaffle too after that. Also his post about ExO was kind of odd that he did sheep a read on him yet scum read him and seemed like he was talking nonsense on it.
...dude. Seriously?
You have a blue claim and the other train is someone you think is scummy?
I just...I can't tell if you're friggin protecting a scum mate or just not thinking at all. I will say this, though. If Shining flips scum and you're still alive, you better be oozing town from every pore cause I'll be gunning for you, LS. You are not as new as some of these others, and I have a much harder time believing you don't understand the basic mechanics of a blue claim than with someone like Celestial.
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On January 07 2015 11:16 LightningStrike wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 11:11 rsoultin wrote:On January 07 2015 11:05 LightningStrike wrote:On January 07 2015 10:53 rsoultin wrote:
Eh, you called it the wrong name. Detective. People thought you were lying because of that (or so it seemed to me).
...Dude, don't make me go filter-diving your past games. I know you've mentioned it again in a game since the one I lynched you as scum (and said that about the odds), that you were concerned about lynching blue roles.
What's your read on shining? Well what else I was suppose to do when my role pm was Detective and my coach in that game clarified it was Cop at the time but I couldn't really say it was my coach who told me it was Cop and in the thread I did ask for BH the host of the game to clarified to me if Detective was Cop in the thread and told them what BH told me but they simply didn't believe me because of the counter claim by KSC that's all. Also my read on Shining is Null leaning scum as I didn't like his case on ExO and some people already told him that ExO wasn't going to get lynched Day 1 but he did switch TheWarWaffle too after that. Also his post about ExO was kind of odd that he did sheep a read on him yet scum read him and seemed like he was talking nonsense on it. ...dude. Seriously? You have a blue claim and the other train is someone you think is scummy? I just...I can't tell if you're friggin protecting a scum mate or just not thinking at all. I will say this, though. If Shining flips scum and you're still alive, you better be oozing town from every pore cause I'll be gunning for you, LS. You are not as new as some of these others, and I have a much harder time believing you don't understand the basic mechanics of a blue claim than with someone like Celestial. I thought that Shining didn't have a lot votes at the time and I tunneled to hard on TWW I'm sorry  I will do better on Day 2 and Day 3 if I'm alive at that part of the I promise!
Tchhhh. Don't know if I believe this. But whatevs. Nothing I can do about it right now, anyway. I've already established that I think an attempt should at least have been made to lynch someone other than the guy who softed blue.
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On January 07 2015 11:37 -Celestial- wrote:He should have been given the benefit of the doubt on a three line post saying he's blue? Off the back of a bunch of suspicious posts? I'm really not sure what I can say here to be honest except that's just not how I felt when I saw it. Yes, I threw my vote away. I own up to that and I'm sorry to WW for my part, small as it was, in the mislynch. I can't say I'm particularly happy about it but there it is and I'm really not sure what the you want from me here. I've already explained my reasoning, such as it is. I don't have much more I can really say. And with all due respect you're the person who started the train on WW in the first place. So if we're asking questions here about voting motivations then please explain these posts of yours: You actively stated you preferred the Shining lynch over the WW one and your vote on WW was initially just pure pressure. But still remained on WW saying that you wouldn't be around at EoD to change it. Why? Why not go for the Shining vote that you were so convinced of? There were people who actually voted for WW around between his claim and the EoD that didn't change their votes. What of them? In essence why are you trying to throw blame around so much on a lynch you actively participated in, despite claiming that someone else was more desirable as a lynch for you? I can't say I'm proud of myself for letting a blue get killed, but you deliberately voted for the poor guy, despite explicitly saying someone else was a better target.
You're right. I did. At the time LS and WW were the only lynch wagons, with just HTS voting Shining, and I have only now become suspicious of LS. I did make an effort to convince people on Shining from my mobile during my lunch break, but Trfel and JarJar didn't vote until afterwards. Trfel himself was initially very reluctant to vote Shining and was the main one I was trying to convince, because I knew he had the best chance of pushing the lynch if I couldn't.
It probably would have been better if I had just switched my vote. The reads on demand right before the lynch didn't impress me that much, but had I gotten any support, I definitely would have switched. You clearly made the effort to look through my filter. Can you honestly say that it reads any differently?
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To be frank, Celestial, your idea that being aggressive, asking questions and scumreading people is scum behavior is very odd, even for a new player.
There are scum in this game.
They did play a role in this lynch somehow. Actively or passively it's hard to say with only WW flipped.
How do you expect to figure out and lynch scum without questioning people? Just sit there and it'll magically come to you as no one talks?
I would expect more people to be trying to figure this out and questioning odd behavior, rather than complaining about people "blaming" others. I did not go hard after you. I all but said I'm inclined to chalk it up to this being a newbie game. LS I went after because he honestly should know better...and he has in the past been very leery about lynching blue roles. This does not fit with his past behavior, or my expectations of him in his fourth game here.
Bah...I'll look at Shining again in the morning, because I still have strong suspicions about him. His last second vote switch to WW after the guy had claimed is icky and looks more like trying to save his own skin in case anyone changed their vote. (Although town can want to save their own skin, too, I do realize that.) But I want to bring new eyes to this. Bedtime for me.
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On January 07 2015 11:54 Trfel wrote:
Yeah, I'm sorry about the lynch. My bad.
We were pretty unlucky that I finished my vote-switch post and posted it three minutes after rsoultin left. And I really lack experience, so I didn't try to get people to switch after the roleclaim. Sorry.
Mrt, it's okay Trfel. For all we know all three could have been town which is why I'm not screaming to lynch LS right this second ><. And honestly if I'd waited just those three minutes I could have switched my vote which definitely would have helped.
Mind getting your case-building juju raring? If you're town this game, your play can be amazing, and you see things I don't/differently.
I know there's not a ton to work with right now.
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On January 07 2015 12:07 LightningStrike wrote:
Rsoultin I up for a Shining lynch tomorrow and hopefully I can deal with my IRL drama with my Mom having to go to the ER for overnight and me staying home because someone needed to take care of the house. I guess this what happens when I emotionally drained.
Dude :/ I'm sorry. That's terrible. Take care of yourself (and your Mom) okay? <3
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Okay, going to bed for realz. Will read what anyone cares to post here in the morning.
Still want to know your train of thought, Shining. Please explain your votes.
Gumdrop, too. Please. (I did read your filter, but I want to hear why you chose to vote outside the main lynches.)
And anyone's post-flip impressions would be appreciated as well. Definitely want to hear Silver explain the progression of her reads and JarJar, time to kick in, bro. I gave you the benefit of the doubt and your later posting is better, but now that we have solid evidence I expect you to step up.
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On January 07 2015 12:32 -Celestial- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 11:46 rsoultin wrote:On January 07 2015 11:37 -Celestial- wrote:He should have been given the benefit of the doubt on a three line post saying he's blue? Off the back of a bunch of suspicious posts? I'm really not sure what I can say here to be honest except that's just not how I felt when I saw it. Yes, I threw my vote away. I own up to that and I'm sorry to WW for my part, small as it was, in the mislynch. I can't say I'm particularly happy about it but there it is and I'm really not sure what the you want from me here. I've already explained my reasoning, such as it is. I don't have much more I can really say. And with all due respect you're the person who started the train on WW in the first place. So if we're asking questions here about voting motivations then please explain these posts of yours: i want to lynch shining. i will settle for ww. my initial vote on WW was pure pressure You actively stated you preferred the Shining lynch over the WW one and your vote on WW was initially just pure pressure. But still remained on WW saying that you wouldn't be around at EoD to change it. Why? Why not go for the Shining vote that you were so convinced of? There were people who actually voted for WW around between his claim and the EoD that didn't change their votes. What of them? In essence why are you trying to throw blame around so much on a lynch you actively participated in, despite claiming that someone else was more desirable as a lynch for you? I can't say I'm proud of myself for letting a blue get killed, but you deliberately voted for the poor guy, despite explicitly saying someone else was a better target. You're right. I did. At the time LS and WW were the only lynch wagons, with just HTS voting Shining, and I have only now become suspicious of LS. I did make an effort to convince people on Shining from my mobile during my lunch break, but Trfel and JarJar didn't vote until afterwards. Trfel himself was initially very reluctant to vote Shining and was the main one I was trying to convince, because I knew he had the best chance of pushing the lynch if I couldn't. It probably would have been better if I had just switched my vote. The reads on demand right before the lynch didn't impress me that much, but had I gotten any support, I definitely would have switched. You clearly made the effort to look through my filter. Can you honestly say that it reads any differently? Posting from bed on phone so please excuse spelling: Except...you know...its not exactly convincing when you're staying on WW like that. So no, I can't say I read it that way at all. Frankly because of your lack of switch meant my read of your case was "this guy looks really suspicious but I still think WW is the best lynch". You apparently couldn't even convince yourself enough to switch to Shining. If you'd actually switched I might have switched because I'd have taken your case more seriously. You want to lynch Shining tomorrow? Alright, we can look at doing that, just lay out your case in summary. I was never a big fan of Shining's posts here anyway, feels scummy; and a lot of your comments earlier were actually decent and on-point and reasonably convincing, especially looking back now. The problem for me is that they came across as very insincere at the time because you flat out were not backing them up with action by changing your vote.
You and I are playing the game differently. I will try to vote for the most scummy train. If I can't convince people to go for my top scumread, I go for one of my other scumreads people are voting for. With no scumreads up for vote, I go with a null read. If all up for vote are townreads I try to convince people to consolidate on an alternative lynch starting at my scumreads and settling on null if I have to, cause it's better than voting a townread. I do it this way because you can be 100% right but if you're the only one voting someone they will never be lynched. So yay you can say "I told you so" at the end, but your vote was meaningless and town still lost. Does this make sense?
On January 07 2015 12:35 -Celestial- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 12:02 rsoultin wrote:
To be frank, Celestial, your idea that being aggressive, asking questions and scumreading people is scum behavior is very odd, even for a new player.
There are scum in this game.
They did play a role in this lynch somehow. Actively or passively it's hard to say with only WW flipped.
How do you expect to figure out and lynch scum without questioning people? Just sit there and it'll magically come to you as no one talks?
I would expect more people to be trying to figure this out and questioning odd behavior, rather than complaining about people "blaming" others. I did not go hard after you. I all but said I'm inclined to chalk it up to this being a newbie game. LS I went after because he honestly should know better...and he has in the past been very leery about lynching blue roles. This does not fit with his past behavior, or my expectations of him in his fourth game here.
Bah...I'll look at Shining again in the morning, because I still have strong suspicions about him. His last second vote switch to WW after the guy had claimed is icky and looks more like trying to save his own skin in case anyone changed their vote. (Although town can want to save their own skin, too, I do realize that.) But I want to bring new eyes to this. Bedtime for me. ...I'm not even saying that. Where am I saying that? Or giving the impression I'm saying that? I'm actually genuinely confused here. I have NO idea where you're getting that one from aside from my very, very early post about your very first entry to the game.
Make that very, very early read reiterated over multiple posts throughout Day 1. I was reacting to this, though:
On January 07 2015 11:37 -Celestial- wrote:He should have been given the benefit of the doubt on a three line post saying he's blue? Off the back of a bunch of suspicious posts? I'm really not sure what I can say here to be honest except that's just not how I felt when I saw it. Yes, I threw my vote away. I own up to that and I'm sorry to WW for my part, small as it was, in the mislynch. I can't say I'm particularly happy about it but there it is and I'm really not sure what the you want from me here. I've already explained my reasoning, such as it is. I don't have much more I can really say. And with all due respect you're the person who started the train on WW in the first place. So if we're asking questions here about voting motivations then please explain these posts of yours: You actively stated you preferred the Shining lynch over the WW one and your vote on WW was initially just pure pressure. But still remained on WW saying that you wouldn't be around at EoD to change it. Why? Why not go for the Shining vote that you were so convinced of? There were people who actually voted for WW around between his claim and the EoD that didn't change their votes. What of them?
In essence why are you trying to throw blame around so much on a lynch you actively participated in, despite claiming that someone else was more desirable as a lynch for you? I can't say I'm proud of myself for letting a blue get killed, but you deliberately voted for the poor guy, despite explicitly saying someone else was a better target.
It's frustrating that you see questions as blame and accuse me of not looking into people voting WW between the claim and EoD and accuse me of blaming others in practically the same breath. What do you think I was doing all night? Is it just that you don't think I should be questioning people who were not voting WW or what gives?
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On January 07 2015 16:02 jarjarbinks wrote:
I think some people have some questions to answer for:
I will focus on the 5 who voted for Warwaffle, because you know, they like decided to kill a power role towny AFTER he claimed power role. On a side note revealing the size of my brain, I originally was 80% sure you shouldn’t kill someone who claims a power role and wait at least 1 day, but I wasn’t 100% sure. All this claiming stuff is somehow going over my head.
Rsoultin- The mastermind behind the plot! What a surprise! I feel like you literally kill all town in every game lol You have like the worst track record! There should be a new role specifically created for you, much like the vigilante except you just convince everyone to kill town every day. And your role never wins. I will get off that pointless rant and start accusing. I’m just putting you as mafia in my accusations for now, since you have killed more town than mafia has at this point. IF you were playing mafia, in the morning of the death (no I will not grab quotes, feel free to ask me why if you want some excuses. I also didn’t edit, same story), you pick a towny that you know is an easy target. Everyone hates the inactives on this thread, and warwaffle hasn’t posted much of value despite claiming to know things. There were other logical reasons? I don’t remember. Anyways, sounds like an easy enough target. Probably the desperate townies who are being harassed will cling to a logical argument. You check back later and post some more things about shining, but keep your vote on warwaffle. This is smart so are perceived as the main driver on a towny death (day 1 or no this is not the best). You mention not being around at EOD which is also smart. You previously mentioned you were going to be very close to missing EOD before, this will affirm. Maybe you can get “lucky” and change your vote if you see a better target later. You DO get to see the votes before EOD. The waffle train struck gold for you and you have a great excuse! People will treat you like silverarte when vote analyzing. You casually wait a decent amount of time, 40 ish minutes sounds perfect! You rant and rage, show as much indignation as possible. You go off on LS and celestial mostly. Celestial is a fantastic target because he wasted his vote. LS already looks suspicious and voted for waffle. Plus LS looks bad for the last game you guys played together. Did you rant on tube? You should definitely rant on tube if you didn’t, I want to. You will look tomorrow to find a dumb towny who did make a decent vote and go on them (there was a lot of us. I honestly hate my own vote and I didn’t even vote waffle), which will divert attention from you as you look for a good nightkill.
Questions for you:
1. What were you doing around 6 central time? Eating Dinner? Working? I know you work strange hours sometimes. Your phone is better than mine so unless you were working I’m not sure what you were doing.
2. Why didn’t you switch your vote to shining at 4 your time? You like diversifying the votes so you can switch later. You would risk vote wasting, but you know if you put your mind to it you could have convinced some of us to follow suit.
3. You mentioned anger at TS, Celestial, and Shining for voting waffle. No tube? Silver has a good excuse, so I can see less indignation there.
4. If you had to pick 2 people on the waffle train that were mafia, who would they be? Let’s say you have to lynch one right now. Who is that?
Ok that was long… I’ll do the other ones tomorrow, its past my bedtime and I don’t want to be sick! O crap, more excuses. Sorry guys.
Cool story bro. I've taken the liberty of highlighting the only facts in your long narrative, as everything else is paranoid conjecture. Was tempted to ignore you entirely cause you're clearly already decided on scumreading me, but for everyone else interested in your questions:
1. Work hours are 9-6pm then I drive home in San Antonio rush hour traffic. No access to net at work nor my mobile while on the job. (You know all this JarJar, so coming from you that question just looks like a smear campaign. Bad form.)
2. I do not like vote wasting. 1 other vote on Shining while the people I was trying to convince were resistant...I kept my vote on the scummiest read (to me) actually being pushed at the time.
3. Okay? And? Tube wasn't in the thread like LS and Celeste were to question. He was super tunneled. What do you expect him to answer?
4. I'm not actually convinced that mafia was on the waffle train. Since he's town mafia wouldn't have to be unless they were pushing him instead of a mafia lynch. If Shining is mafia, I already said LS looks super scummy, because his switch could have gotten Shining lynched (only one other vote necessary). And he has in the past been very concerned about lynching blues, so I would think that a blue claim would carry more weight with him.
Also, a word to he wise...there are probably not 5 scum in this game. If you are going to scumread every player on a town lynch, especially not knowing the alignments of the other trains, you'll probably run out of townreads very quickly. (Not everyone on that train "decided to vote a power role towny AFTER he claimed power role". Please keep you facts straight when making cases.)
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I was writing out my Shining case and as I did so I could see most everything that makes me twitch about him coming from town. The problem is...I'm not seeing more scummy individuals than him. Not gonna go deep into points I've already made, but I'll explain anything new:
- First post analysis without substance.
- Second seemed to hide reads in meandering text (bad if intentional) and use Celestial to explain his comment (seemed contrived then but especially now when he claims to have changed his mind based on what Silver answered and not my intentions (what?) and I can't find where she answered, nor can she given she says she forgot what she was talking about.)
- Strong scumreads HTS and ExO, scumread him first. His only stated strong scumreads. Case against ExO misrepresents the facts.
-Bouts of inactivity followed by defensive posts...meh. He also failed to address any of the points/questions I brought up about him and instead focused on the question regarding his HTS read. (He mentions my read on him laster as "meta-based" along with JarJar's when mine clearly wasn't (thus indicating that he did in fact read my post, or at least implying it, but ignored it). The only "meta" involved in my case was stating that he is new to the site and not to the mafia game. Which isn't really meta. Just simple fact.)
-No follow-up after the flip even though he was in the thread for it.
I can see the read progression on his vote though. People were calling for him to consolidate, he had a scumread on ExO...that apart from aggression seemed to again be simple paranoia that ExO is capable of leading town as mafia...didn't like the WW train and was "convinced" by the LS meta, and perhaps moreso by scum!ExOs push on LS. Settled on WW last-minute.
^Problem here is he doesn't need an excuse to vote WW beyond he thinks LS is town, so the last-minute (literally) scumread seems contrived. That said, the fact that it was last-minute and WW is town, which scum should surely know, means that vote is bound to look scummy post-flip and has me questioning if scum would really do that when it seems that the WW lynch is going through...I don't know with a vote that close.
Overall my general impression is he's not very concerned with hunting scum and is going out of his way not to have many strong reads. Unfortunately, I absolutely can see a town doing all this...he's just the player I find to be most scummy of the bunch.
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On January 07 2015 22:56 LightningStrike wrote:
I just woke up and my Mom was already home and it turns out Diabetes is a bitch sometimes so at least she is going to be fine just need her to take the meds the ER gave her. I not as drained anymore and I ready to lynch Shining at the start of the day.
Glad to hear your mother's doing alright LS.
If you couldn't vote for Shining who would you vote for and why?
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I'll try to make this short Celestial.
A veteran town team is unlikely to lynch a blue claim day 1. That this town did not react that way means that at least some new town players didnt recognize that the lynch should have been moved. So I threw out that bad call initially cause o cant scumread everyone for it. Tube as town or mafia will say that he believed WW was scim and didnt believe his claim. No reason to question him on that. I originally put LS in the same boat.
Wasted votes can hide scum if both wagons are town, something more likely from those wasting votes who are aware of the lynch. Why? Because most town players will be trying to lynch scum. keeping a vote on an impossible lynch without puahing for vote switches suggests that you dont actually care who is lynched. that is why i questioned you.
Shining, his last minute vote with last minute scumread, was unnecessary. The scumread especially. his vote isnt alignment indicative in and of itself on a counterwagon, but i can possibly get info to indicate his alignment from his explanation.
i returned to ls cause i realized that he has 2 more games under his belt than tube and has proven to be wary of lynching blue roles in the past. that made his decison more questionable.
questioning ppl is not my way of scumreading or casting blame, at least not by itself. if i was certain that an action made someone scum i wouldnt bother to ask, just say that it is scummy. it goes without saying that if there was race between a town and a mafia that at least some of the votes on the town wagon are probably scum. but until we know shining's alignment there isnt much to question that isnt clear in their filters.
i dont know if this post was clear or not.
regardless, my scum reads are shining right now (though he could convince me otherwise with good townplay and explanations) and im trying not to omgus jarjar but his post was so heavily biased that i question his motives. if shining flips mafia i think town should definitely take a closer look at tube and ls, but especially ls.
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EPT
