EPTWave, I shouldn't be participating either. Your boards totally won't suffer
[I] TLLOLOTGDTM
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jcarlsoniv
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Wave, I shouldn't be participating either. Your boards totally won't suffer | ||
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jcarlsoniv
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On October 09 2014 02:53 WaveofShadow wrote: If I'm the one hiding back the game from starting earlier then we can start, but I figure my activity will be nowhere near what it would be if we started after. That'll probably balance it out for us bads then =P | ||
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we're not full owb | ||
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On October 09 2014 10:05 Alaric wrote: What did it take to make you bend, MB? "Moonbear, you know you want to play mafia." ![[image loading]](http://www.brendazguiberson.com/images/books/moonbear-b.jpg) | ||
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On October 09 2014 12:20 AsmodeusXI wrote: I'm in Gold. SIR. Edit: And my superiority will be hilarious when I'M THE FIRST TO DIE. Well, you did already break the edit rule ##lynch asmonoob | ||
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On October 09 2014 23:08 onlywonderboy wrote: How many people here even have mafia experience? I mean there's no way this is actually going to be a "good" game of mafia lol. Oh, not at all. I think it's just you, me, swaglord and wave. I don't anticipate it being a good game, but I hope it serves as a good enough learning opporunity for the people interested so that we could potentially do more, better ones in the future. | ||
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last time I had that in wave's league game, I jailed VE and cause a shitstorm T_T | ||
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I've always personally been a fan of Estranged Lovers on separate teams, although I don't think I've played a game with them, and it's probably a nightmare to balance. | ||
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On October 10 2014 00:58 AsmodeusXI wrote: Dandel rules with an iron fist. I love it. That's how setups normally are done. Not randomizing it is incredibly rare. | ||
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On October 10 2014 01:30 onlywonderboy wrote: I mean basically whatever team gets Wave wins, hue. If that's how you feel about 'meta' reads I'm fine with questions not being asked in this thread. I mean, Wave is a high priority target for either team, so I don't think it would be auto win for his team. Also, I played mafia for a good ~year before wave started playing, so don't count me out =P Although I'm fairly certain wave was better than I was in our respective "primes". | ||
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On October 10 2014 03:20 mordek wrote: Do it or I'll infer something wild and inaccurate about your behavior! you're a natural already | ||
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On October 10 2014 04:26 Lord Tolkien wrote: No masons? For shame. I love masons, but they're probably a bit much for a newbie oriented game. | ||
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Also, for serious, thanks for hosting. I was half joking when I said it in OT, and I definitely appreciate your acceptance. | ||
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jeffery, what's up and why are you scum | ||
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On October 11 2014 09:24 Alaric wrote: I thought we agreed on lynching Wave? Actually that might be a decent idea. A learning experience of sorts: either he doesn't get lynched, and I'll know what to emulate if I want to live if I ever get accused, or he gets lynched, and we know what not to say if he flips scum, or how not to defend oneself if he flips town. I'd have said "how to recognise town" but noob scum could copy his defense too in that case, which would be misleading. More seriously, though, how do these games actually start, apart from meta stuff? There's usually hints like noise or facial expression to pick up in IRL variants. And seeing how well the whole "mass claim" strat worked out in the LoL Mafia Wave hosted and made us host, I wouldn't want to start by imitating that. Do we just accuse somebody at random and try to read how he defends himself/people talk about him? People have different styles and preferences. Early D1 is awkward to start, so it's always just general bullshit. Some people like to participate, others like to let it settle and join in on real discussion afterwards. The whole time you should be trying to look for anything that might be shady (and it's a learning experience to figure out what that actually means), and see what you can do to further your assumptions, speculations, knowledge, etc. | ||
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On October 11 2014 09:46 ketchup wrote: Pretty sure Alaric is just playing you. He talked about how much he plays mafia in real life, and he probably knows how day 1 works fairly well. I vote for him to by lynch target #1! Even real life games have fairly random accusations, but I do agree it might be easier with body language tells for people who seem overly nervous Well, real life vs forum is really a hugely different vibe. In RL mafia, you don't have time to think about what you're gonna say, body language as you said, etc. Granted, I'm not sure how much of it translates to forum, And you should know that I never listen to Alaric by now. | ||
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I'm curious who's around tonight | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:08 WaveofShadow wrote: What, you're going to let me do all the work? I doubt we'll be lynching scum if I'm the only one voting...care to join me, frand? Oh, no no no, of course I wouldn't let you do all the work. But I'm sorry to disappoint, I tend to be a vote prude in the early days. It doesn't mean a whole lot right now, and unless I really want to pressure someone in particular (and think my vote will actually do that), I keep my vote in my pocket for a bit. | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:25 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Not to mention he's totally lying about his role. Well that's the thing, everyone is lying until you know for certain what they say is true. | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:25 Alzadar wrote: I would assume Wave is a high priority target for mafia if he's not scum, so no reason to lynch him Day 1, his alignment is basically revealed Day 2 if he's still alive. Not entirely true. It depends what happens D1. If wave pushes a lynch on a townie, and his other reads are nowhere near the mark, they could leave him bumbling around for a while. Just like any other game, when you're playing with bads, it's hard to predict what the hell they'll do. | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:45 WaveofShadow wrote: Elaborate on this, please. You seem to think that 'trying' is inherently scummy and I'm not following. As for your expectations and my intentions, how would you have any idea of either when you haven't played with me before? This is boring so far. I'm bored. Why aren't people voting for scum? And what scum are these? Jeff? It's going to take more than a sweeping declarative first post saying "vote jeff" to make me want to vote anyone right now. | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:56 ketchup wrote: What makes you think I have no real stance? I am just testing the waters, and seeing who responds in what way. I find that much more interesting than pretending that color coding anything helps anyone in game  ^ this basically would have been my response to wave Idk about you wave, but back in my day, we didn't just know who scum were right off the bat. We had to work at it, poke around, dig through trash to figure it out. In all seriousness though, I'm with ketchup on Alzadar's posting. Going so far as to let a league game decide his side? Jeff - why is Wave scum? Wave - why is Jeff scum? ketchup - do you think Wave's color coding is actually scummy? Or are you just calling it distracting to nitpick? | ||
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On October 11 2014 11:01 Alzadar wrote: So ketchup's strat is clearly to accuse everyone else of making useless posts while making no useful posts. I assume there's a bunch of euros we won't hear from for awhile, who is there other than frenchie? And your strat is continuing to post useless crap and ask questions that you can certainly figure out on your own. | ||
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On October 11 2014 11:12 ketchup wrote: I don't think it's nitpicking. I think it was not something I imagined Wave doing as the first post after game started so I naturally am cautious around it. I admit I have not played with Wave, but I feel that post is 100% questionable, and should be pointed out. This is especially compounded by the fact that it was also a really quick vote on someone. So, I called him out on it. Don't let the fact that he did something unexpected color your judgement - posting in a mafia game is completely different. Let what he says color your opinion. @Cixah - trying to decide if wave is just being aggressive townie or taking advantage of the lesser experienced crowd to make a bold play. I'm feeling the former is probably correct - he can be a bloodhound when he wants to. | ||
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On October 11 2014 11:44 Alzadar wrote: I mean, part of the reason I mentioned games played is we can actually look at them. Apparently you guys are particularly suspicious of me when I tryhard and get information, but we can just look at past game threads and see how Wave posts when he's mafia vs town. But you're not getting useful information, you're just doing things that are seemingly helpful. Who are your scum reads? | ||
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On October 11 2014 12:07 MoonBear wrote: Hm if we don't vote to lynch someone Day 1 we end up in Day 2 where the Scum get a free kill in exchange for information that the cop people can get. However, how do the cop people communicate their findings to us? And how would we tell if the cop is a real cop or just someone pretending to be them? It's kinda up to the cop(s?) to figure out how/when to convey that information to us. Then it's up to us to figure out whether or not to trust that information. These are things that shouldn't be worried about right now, cop(s) will only have information by Day 2 at the earliest. | ||
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On October 11 2014 12:14 WaveofShadow wrote: Alzadar why does Jeff's posting make him scum? (because he's not here to defend himself) | ||
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On October 11 2014 22:20 WaveofShadow wrote: I have to read the second half of your post but Alaric you are now officially my number one town read. ^ Alaric, I love your skepticism, don't lose it. Keep in mind, even if Jeff does flip red (assuming he ends up being the lynch target), that does not at all prove Wave's towniness on its own merit - bussing a teammate is a common strategy, and a scum Wave would know how to do it. Wave's claiming protection was probably the sketchiest thing he's done thus far, but it's at least got viability behind it - if he comes out the gates as a super aggressive townie, pinpoints a scum and goes right for him, you bet your ass Wave will be a top priority scum target. That said, Wave, we are still waiting for you to tell us why Jeff is scum. His posting is standard Jeff, which is unfortunate. I hope he starts taking the game seriously. ____________________ @Cixah: Swaglord is on your scummy list - ok, I agree. He has had bullshit, contentless posts thus far. But so has Jeff. There's not a whole lot to go on either of them, but Jeff is relatively fine in your eyes? Wave being your top read for the one reason you've given is honestly a bit silly. Also - We will not know KP for sure until end of N1, and even then, all we'll know is how many people died. It won't tell us whether they're scum KP, town KP, etc. So we can get a rough idea once there's evidence, but speculating about numbers now, especially this early, isn't that useful. That's all the "hard" thinking I can do until I get some coffee in me. | ||
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On October 11 2014 22:52 Requizen wrote: I'm ready for it to get a bit morw aggro, but right now it's just Ghandhi and Wave fighting. I vote we kill them both and be done with it. Are Jeff and Wave your scumreads? What do you think of Alzadar and Swaglord? | ||
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On October 11 2014 23:45 WaveofShadow wrote: You mean here you are still talking about it. Nobody else really did much. lolwut Show me where we've been fighting. At least you're playing a little now. Alright good posts in the last little while. I'll come clean a little---it was obvious to some of you but to others not so much---I don't have anything concrete on Jeff. Wanted to see if I could make him play the game a little essentially and see how he'd react. It might be a little early to give that up right now but I grow bored of it and would like to focus people's attention elsewhere. My vote on him stays though until he does play the game---as people have said he has done nothing but troll and be typical Jeff at this point. If he's scum and is not help[ing town then great. If he's town and is being useless, I don't have a massive problem ridding the town of chaff D1 (though it would probably be better served as a vig shot if his play is still egregious). Soniv some questions for you, good buddy. You had no problem with my attack on Jeff at the start, but as time goes on you seem to take more and more issue with it? Why the change in opinion exactly? As far as people's opinions on my claiming protection---plz. Maybe 6ah can be excused a little bit for attacking me on it here (and whoever else did? I forget) but you Soniv....I dunno man. Of course it doesn't make any sense at all to ask for protection from a realistic POV at the start of the game before anything has happened. But it serves two purposes: first, early WIFOM against the scumteam if our protection does (and probably should imo) at least consider it. Second, a show of confidence and bravado seems to be exactly what town needed to stir things up just a little bit. The best reaction to my opening post however goes to Alaric who saw through everything basically immediately---on it's own that doesn't necessarily prove him town or scum, just an insightful player, but in combination with the fact that he came up with the exact same points in his posts that Soniv and I came up with in pregame on TS about Req and others exhibits a townie mindset, and good critical thinking that I think almost everyone else in the game lacks so far. People need to stop simply focusing on what I (and others) are posting but why? What is the motivation behind it? Is it scum or town, and why? Because as time went on, you never provided a reason. I'm as up for a good Jeff-lynching as the next guy, but the longer someone goes without actually giving a reason, the more it falls apart. You asked me to vote for someone, I said "no, give me a reason". You still didn't provide a reason, and as you've now admitted, your vote was for the exact reasons I knew it was, and it gained exactly as much traction as I said it would. + Show Spoiler + On October 11 2014 10:18 jcarlsoniv wrote: I've really only played 13 games? wow Oh, no no no, of course I wouldn't let you do all the work. But I'm sorry to disappoint, I tend to be a vote prude in the early days. It doesn't mean a whole lot right now, and unless I really want to pressure someone in particular (and think my vote will actually do that), I keep my vote in my pocket for a bit. He has no fear of actually being lynched, even if several people jumped on it because D1 is almost never as clean cut as that. Now that we're starting to move towards the halfway point, votes and cases will actually hold some clout. I'm reserving my thoughts on Asmo until he makes more than 1 shitty post. Actually that goes for most of y'all, make some [less shitty] posts. | ||
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On October 12 2014 00:12 WaveofShadow wrote: I've caught scum on single posts before. It's completely doable. I still think Jeff has a reasonable chance of flipping scum, but Asmo's right now is higher. The problem I have with you is you do a lot of sitting back and watching/waiting and you are very reserved in terms of your stance taking. You take your time to answer a lot of other people's questions, and ask some of your own, great. But where is your direction? You have none that I can see, and I don't like it. You're aimlessly floating wherever the thread goes. I think I had a townread on you earlier but that has pretty much dissipated. + Show Spoiler + Meta says this is perhaps how you play, but it doesn't look great and meta is shit anyway. lol your spoiler was my answer I agree that you can absolutely catch someone off of one post. But there's one thing you have to remember - we're in a game with people who have never played mafia before. I totally remember my first game and having no idea what to post. That said, I did post, and while you really want to pressure people, I'm trying to get the lay of the land. In the last two games I've played, I tried to be super aggressive and confident about my reads. They were almost all awful - see your league game and whatever game we played in together before that. On top of that, I've always been reserved D1, so I'm sorry if that offends your oppa gungho style, but that's the way it's going to be for now. My direction - Alzadar is scummiest. If he continues to not give real posts in the face of me continually telling him to contribute, then I will happily lynch his face away. Swaglord and Jeff are equally scummy in my eyes, if not a bit more on swaglord because I expected more from him, but I don't remember if I've actually played with him. Alaric is the towniest townie that ever did town. | ||
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On October 12 2014 00:31 WaveofShadow wrote: Content is better than crappy posts. Meta says Tolkien is trolly but I've only seen one game of his so again, not going off of that. I truly don't have a problem with Tolkien right now and don't find him scummy---I imagine he'll return to actually post something of substance soon. I don't remember you being aggressive or confident in either of the games you listed, and it's weird that you would defend yourself with meta by saying that you're playing differently from your town games. As for your direction the post on Alzadar is all well and good, but telling somebody to contribute, and on top of that issuing an ultimatum for all to see with no balls behind the post, and giving him plenty of wiggle room by describing exactly how he must appease you---what does that accomplish exactly? I issued an ultimatum? I wouldn't call it that, but ok, why is that entirely a bad thing. You're asking me to take a stance, and then when I do, you yell at me for taking too hard of a stance? How am I describing exactly how to appease me? By telling him he has to make real posts? Well yeah, I'd love to see some real posts so I can figure out his mindset, his motivations, his reads. And if he doesn't do anything to alter the opinion I have of him already, then yes, I will be happy to lynch him. I don't see why that's odd. And as far as I see it, you dicked around with a fake read that went nowhere, while I actually did have a scumread. Your Asmo scumread only comes recently (although I'll admit you have a fair chance right now of being right on that one). Hey BoonMear, what's on your mind? Your only contribution was a question about how cops should communicate their findings. Why is your interest only in the po-pos? What do you think about wave? About me? | ||
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On October 12 2014 00:39 Alzadar wrote: Wave is 70% Town. At this point he's really driving the discussion, I don't think he would such a central role if he was scum. I'd like to mention that MoonBear and ComaDose have made only the same kind of "observation with no conclusion" style posts that you all seem suspicious of me for. Which leads me to say - I feel like there must be some scum among those who are suspicious of me: after Wave and Soniv declared their suspicion I became an easy target for people to say "oh I'm suspicious of Alz" without actually contributing anything new. ketchup in particular has focused entirely on Wave and myself (both of us already being under suspicion when he did), and has basically only repeated arguments other people had already said. Ok, so who among your accusers (there really only have been a few) do you believe to be scum? Ketchup was actually fairly early on in the Alzadar and Wave suspicions. Do you think ketchup is scum? If not, who? | ||
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Cixah, not sure why you claimed that early... I don't think you're in any real danger of being lynched. Ugh, now I'm incredibly torn. MoonBear, while your post was glorious and fun to read, it was utterly useless. You can't take 80% of your post talking about wave and his behavior, not come to a conclusion, and then go off on some other non-conclusion bearing tangent. It's a huge "look at me I'm contributing" post, but there is 0 substance. Req is scummy as fuck because of newbie claiming. T_T The longer jeff goes without contributing, the scummier he looks. Swaglord is looking likely town for me. Jesus fucking christ the claims lol. If everyone's VT, then nobody is! On October 12 2014 05:31 AsmodeusXI wrote: Sorry, starting to realize how dumb this is. Staph blaming... super noob here. god and the noob claims can we just lynch everyone? | ||
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##vote: MoonBear You can, in fact, continue on the "he said, she said", that's how this game works. And y'know what you've said? Nothing. But you, more than any of the others who've done the same, come off as faux-contribution. Moreso than Alzadar. Asking about cops, trying to discern the setup, having 0 conclusions. THE BEAR'S BLOOD WILL DRAIN RED + Show Spoiler + | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:40 Cixah wrote: It's my first game, sorry  . I've watch enough voice mafia to have my head say 'You probably shouldn't do this.' but I didn't feel safe with how hard and fast that bandwagon came at me. It still doesn't sit right with me how fast those 3 votes came out of the gate against me. Curious though, What made You (Soniv) and Wave think I wasn't getting lynch D1? Because I have no reason right now to believe you're scum. There are definitely more proper targets than you right now. Bandwagons happen, votes shift a lot. There's still an entire second half of the day phase to get through. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:44 WaveofShadow wrote: I hate that I like this post so much because I don't fully trust you yet I asked you a couple things in my filter, care to answer them? (I forget where or what they are lulz) About Req? I'm seeing exactly what I expected, and I'm still trying to decide if he's being normal Req or if he's playing us. Either way I think there are probably better targets for D1? I understand the difficulty of D1 analysis, it's tough to figure out, so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt there for now. What I don't like is the continual complaining instead of attempting to emulate others and figure it out. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:54 WaveofShadow wrote: Alright well assuming you aren't playing ME, you have my axe if you so desire. I think my one reservation here is the open bluefishing (regarding both Req/MB), unless we are to believe that scum Req/MB are newbie enough to not realize that's a no-no. They also truly seem to believe what he posted about the D1 being useless thing. Actually just realizing now how similar in attitude both MB and req have been. That's interesting. yup On October 12 2014 05:52 AsmodeusXI wrote: Soniv, why MB instead of Alz? Alz is still the better read for me, especially since he's been mia since we turned against him. Because Alz started posting contentless stuff, but has contributed at least a bit (even if I don't agree with what he's saying). MB has gone above and beyond to say less than nothing. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:55 jcarlsoniv wrote: yup Because Alz started posting contentless stuff, but has contributed at least a bit (even if I don't agree with what he's saying). MB has gone above and beyond to say less than nothing. also Alz's posting can easily be misconstrued as bad townie | ||
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ok lovely, then I'll know not to take you seriously | ||
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That post only has slightly more useful information than MoonBear's. Lots of "suspicious" isn't really worth mentioning, you should be suspicious of everyone. Even "very suspicious" is pretty noncommittal for someone who's top on your scum list. | ||
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On October 12 2014 07:27 WaveofShadow wrote: Wat---this is WAY more useful than MB---and considering you're voting for MB at the moment I'm not sure how you can only offer a bare distinction. If you're getting at semantics then forget the fact that he says suspicious a lot and look at who he specifically names as scum reads and in which order. Oh , the fact that Alaric actually came to conclusions is wonderful. I suppose it's more useful than I let on, but still, at it's core it's a big list post, which I tend to dislike. | ||
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Swaglord, what do you think of MB | ||
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On October 12 2014 10:04 Lord Tolkien wrote: I'd much prefer it if we didn't policy lynch, but it's usually a necessity in newbie games. Do you have an actual scumread then, or are you just gonna continue saying "I hate policy lynches, but we probably should do one" over and over? | ||
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But listen guys - a quiet atmosphere is a scum atmosphere. The less discussion that occurs, the easier it is for scum to just walk around and do whatever they want. Mordek/Alzadar - do you still think 6ah is a worthy vote? Why? Would you want him dead over MoonBear? Do you have a scum read/reason for someone other than MoonBear? Same questions go for those voting Alzadar (6ah/Asmo) | ||
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On October 12 2014 22:57 WaveofShadow wrote: I would also like to note I may simply fallback to a Jeff lynch today. If he doesn't want to play he leaves my game. I still have no reason to believe he's scum. I understand policy lynches, but we learn nothing from lynching jeff today. If he flips green, then we killed an apathetic town, sure, we get rid of a useless appendage. If he flips red, then woohoo, but I've got a feeling that won't happen. You accused him, you "pressured" him, and he reacted pretty much the way I (and probably you) thought he would. He's disinterested in the game, which sucks, but I don't see red in his motives, just an angsty teen. | ||
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On October 12 2014 23:45 WaveofShadow wrote: It's not on the principle that he's Jeff. Read what I wrote. If he is not actively helping solve the game, there are two possibilities (I am not considering 3P for now): a) he is town, and by not helping us actively solve the game he is a massive question mark looming over our heads all game---we won't know what alignment he is and it makes it real easy for scum to keep him alive forever because there will be the possibility of him being mislynched/fucking us over at LYLO (look up what LYLO means) b) He is scum and by not contributing he is scum. Either way, not playing the game does not do us any good, and by removing him we remove a massive question mark that may affect us negatively down the road. I don't think I said anywhere that I'm going to lynch him today, only that I see it is a possibility. What I don't like is how so many people are just willing to let his behaviour slide. I'm with you on the possibility. I misunderstood and thought you were leaning towards a Jeff vote. But talk to me. You said you liked my post on MoonBear (and hated that you liked it). Any reason you're not more interested in looking to him for your vote? | ||
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I'm trying to look at the voting patterns. I don't think Swaglord is scum. He comes back with a big list post, but as far as list posts go, there was more than 0 content. Req makes an ok analysis and puts his vote on LT. Alright, cool, I'm glad Req started playing. A few hours later, a bandwagon has started and I'm not entirely sure why. LT, I'm not really convinced on mordek either. He looks as bandwagony as Jeff (albeit with a bit more post content), just on different vote targets. MoonBear's "defense" has left me very unsatisfied. | ||
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On October 13 2014 05:38 WaveofShadow wrote: Or ever. Plz LT. My reasoning is fucking ironclad but you did something recently to give me pause. On October 13 2014 04:36 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm having trouble with it honestly. My top 3 are between MB/Tolkien for first right now, then Asmo in 3rd. Asmo's posting has improved since the first one that made me call him out, but I've caught people on first/single posts before (and have also been wrong before as well) and I'd be super annoyed if I let that go and turned out to be right on him. Tolkien I could see getting lynched as town and not giving too many fucks as it is now, and MB's attitude is just....weird. Like I can't tell if he truly believes that the way he's been playing is satisfactory and is pretty content just to consistently shit on me/townplay without being helpful to the town itself---at the very least I think Req sort of realized some of the issues with his play (whether that in itself is towny or scummy is probably discussion for another day) I don't feel a strong pull to one over another right now, certainly not strong enough to try to push the town towards one or the other. Hmm actually I just thought of something. Think it'll be Tolkien for me right now. ##Vote: Lord Tolkien Yeah, you sound super confident in that vote. | ||
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On October 13 2014 05:41 WaveofShadow wrote: No, I expect you to do more. If you think that latest post was a buddying attempt you're sorely mistaken. The bolded is exactly why I don't think he's scum either, but pre-flip association IS a bit dangerous so I can't discount it completely. Essentially my reasoning on LT is the fact that the wagons at the time were him and MB...LT then unvotes MB...as scum there is absolutely ZERO reason to do that if MB is town and you can pull off a mislynch. MB could still be scum but I have other reasons to believe he may not be and I'm not sure I want to force the issue. What do you mean you don't want to force the issue?? YOU DON'T HAVE YOUR VOTE PLACED. You have no idea who you want to lynch, you're completely undecided and clearly having issues figuring it out (I know, this D1 is especially hard). You tell me to do more? No, you push the issue. I'm content with my vote on MoonBear. And I wasn't talking about you last post being buddy buddy. It's a general trend in your posting this game. | ||
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I was fairly certain I was on the right track, especially when the Swaglord bandwagon got some steam. But now the dust is settling and MB has a bunch of votes. I'm not as certain as I was before. | ||
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On October 13 2014 07:23 WaveofShadow wrote: Starting to see things my way, hmm? Ketchup has a point in that if we think MB is town, AND we don't think we can lynch scum today we should dump votes on a modkill because losing two towns would be terrible. it's not that I'm seeing it your way, I thought I was correct at the time and it's not that I don't think he's scum, but if he's gonna get modkilled anyway i'd rather not waste the lynch if he hasn't shown up by the time this league game is done I'll switch off him | ||
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##unvote | ||
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MB still hasn't provided anything that makes me think he's not scum, and now he's avoiding modkill soooooo DIE BEAR DIE ##vote MoonBear @Jeff - You may have been serious about wanting to lynch wave at the beginning, but you made no real effort to get it done, so excuse me if I don't quite believe that. | ||
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There was a wagon on LT, given momentum by you. There was a subsequent re-wagon on Jeff. Wanna know who gave that one momentum? You. *gasp* If the Bear bleeds like I think he will, I'm comin' for ya buddy | ||
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On October 13 2014 08:49 ketchup wrote: Still a vote on moonbear is better than removing votes from him this late into the day. I think removing votes from anyone this late helps scum more than it helps town. precisely could I have posted more today? sure. But I thought my read was correct, and watched the LT wagon pile up. It looked like something scum would do, I expressed my opinions on LT. Wave swinging his weight arround to get votes to go all over the place is not in town's favor right now. I know what you were hinting at Wave. I would think MB wiser than to ask openly about how to convey his powers to people. I saw it, and still do see it, to be more about bluefishing. If I'm wrong, then sure, it's on me. But I'm sticking with my gut on this one. | ||
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On October 13 2014 08:55 WaveofShadow wrote: Or he has no idea you're supposed to claim. If he is that detached from the game, then at worst it's as bad as shooting into lurkers. | ||
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On October 13 2014 08:57 WaveofShadow wrote: Alright as I said I sincerely hope you guys are right. I'll gladly eat the attacks I'm likely to face in the case of my being wrong because I know I won't get lynched because of it and we can move on and win. wave pls | ||
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On October 13 2014 09:32 WaveofShadow wrote: It doesn't have to, I was talking to soniv who seemed to think I was making excuses same as him. Obviously that doesn't completely clear me, but at least I get that warm fuzzy feeling knowing I didn't contribute to the delinquency. You did though. You buffered your opinion with "man I hope you guys are right". How is that any different? | ||
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On October 13 2014 13:59 Alzadar wrote: Hardly well-trod and not really resolved. People moved on because that was the point but now it's night and we've got time to kill. If you want to hear a new line of thought Soniv could you explain what you meant here: Explain what? I thought moonbear would flip red ("bleed red"), and that if he did, there was a strong possibility of Wave being scum as well. Day 1, Wave swung his weight around, and he did give momentum to bandwagons when he did vote. Both bandwagons seemed determined to get the lynch away from MB, so I thought I was right. I was not. | ||
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On October 13 2014 23:46 Alzadar wrote: But when you made that post Wave still had his vote on MoonBear. Wave unvotes and calls for votes off MoonBear after you made that post (the post immediately after, so maybe it was simultaneous, but you can't have been reacting to him). And? I'm not talking about Wave's vote on MB at all. I'm talking about him giving any semblance of momentum to anything other than MB (in this case, LT and Jeff) - just look at the voting patterns late D1. But it's a bit of a moot point right now since the bear bled green. I don't like last minute vote switches. I made a gut call and I was incorrect, but I'm much happier to do that than to comply with Wave causing chaos at the last minute. | ||
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On October 14 2014 00:08 Cixah wrote: Wave early in his posting, mentions his "Pre Game" strategy with Soniv in TS. I may be completely in the wrong for thinking this, but that phrase doesn't sit right with me in game with so much information being gleamed from every word. I Part of me thinks this was just the decided code on how they can mention the quickthread, but that's really loose reasoning. Most likely Paranoid, but it felt like something worth bringing up on N1. Before the game started, we had a short discussion about how we thought certain people would play (mostly regarding the first timers). We were right about some, not so right about others. | ||
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On October 14 2014 01:00 WaveofShadow wrote: And does any of the above make me scum, good sir? Time to school you as well, I think. Can you show how it's more likely that a scum Wave decided not to vote midday because he didn't want to get caught voting in a bad place rather than me having difficulty deciding? Can you show how being indecisive emulates a scum mindset? Can you show me how it's more likely that I was trying to enact last minute shenannies to somehow further scum ends rather than simply trying to get you guys off a likely town member? I'm not saying it makes you scum. I'm saying that you shouldn't be surprised that everyone isn't just blindly following you. But maybe I'm putting too much stock in how I think a scum wave would know how to play. Also I'd like you to show me where I criticized you for not voting....cause I can't seem to find it. Maybe you can point it out to me though. You're right, I misremembered the below post. In my head I remembered you pushing harder to get me to vote. My mistake. + Show Spoiler + On October 11 2014 10:08 WaveofShadow wrote: What, you're going to let me do all the work? I doubt we'll be lynching scum if I'm the only one voting...care to join me, frand? Oh and Jeffy's recent question reminds me of a setup detail I feel like I should mention even though it's completely unrelated to anything. Actually now that I think about it I think I was going to include it in my intro post as a reason for people to protect the hell out of me tonight but oh well. + Show Spoiler + In almost every 14-player game I have been a part of on this site, especially those with the possibility of 3P, there were 2 non-town KP on the first night. Since there is no SK this likely means scum will have a vig, 2KP/night (unlikely but possible), or there will be some sort of poisoner. I have been scum in such scenarios and I have actively misled the town before by only allowing them to consider the setup options that were wrong. Just something to consider when N1 happens. Of course it is also entirely possible I am completely wrong about the above :D Personally it looks to me like you're trying to throw tired old arguments at me---mafia buzzwords if you will----without thinking about them at all and assuming people will see 'Oh Wave was hypocritical about voting must be scum' and 'wave is being defensive/throwing his weight around' (I want to see how many times that phrase has come up now and who started using it actually) and look badly upon me. This is classically known as 'shit-flinging' and it serves two scum purposes: starts fights and serves to create discord and messes with town atmosphere (with the bonus of possibly demoralizing your target---and I'm ashamed to admit it's kind of worked because of the town members who have fallen under its spell), and it possibly sets up said player for a mislynch if people are not willing to look more deeply into the accusations. What is possible town motivation for 'shit-flinging?' Honestly, can;t think of any. A good town player would sit back and actually consider my actions from both perspectives rather than tossing open-ended suspicion at me, which is what you've been doing all game. [/QUOTE] I mean, you can call it shit-flinging if you want, but I'm not the only one who's been suspicious of your play thus far, obviously. | ||
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On October 14 2014 01:15 jcarlsoniv wrote: I'm not saying it makes you scum. I'm saying that you shouldn't be surprised that everyone isn't just blindly following you. But maybe I'm putting too much stock in how I think a scum wave would know how to play. You're right, I misremembered the below post. In my head I remembered you pushing harder to get me to vote. My mistake. + Show Spoiler + On October 11 2014 10:08 WaveofShadow wrote: What, you're going to let me do all the work? I doubt we'll be lynching scum if I'm the only one voting...care to join me, frand? Oh and Jeffy's recent question reminds me of a setup detail I feel like I should mention even though it's completely unrelated to anything. Actually now that I think about it I think I was going to include it in my intro post as a reason for people to protect the hell out of me tonight but oh well. + Show Spoiler + In almost every 14-player game I have been a part of on this site, especially those with the possibility of 3P, there were 2 non-town KP on the first night. Since there is no SK this likely means scum will have a vig, 2KP/night (unlikely but possible), or there will be some sort of poisoner. I have been scum in such scenarios and I have actively misled the town before by only allowing them to consider the setup options that were wrong. Just something to consider when N1 happens. Of course it is also entirely possible I am completely wrong about the above :D I mean, you can call it shit-flinging if you want, but I'm not the only one who's been suspicious of your play thus far, obviously. | ||
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Wave - I'm struggling to commit to a read on you because there's a conflict between what I'm observing and what makes sense. Your play would have been very indicative of scum had MB flipped red, but he did not, and I'm trying to figure out where I should be looking now. I've decided that I'm going to table my concerns on you for a little while because looking back, hindsight suggests that you truly were trying to protect someone you thought was blue. I'm not sure how much posting I'll get done before the end of the work day, but I'll be periodically rereading things from D1 and I'll hopefully have a more solid position before the day post. Coma's lack of presence is getting more concerning as time goes on. | ||
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On October 14 2014 02:14 ketchup wrote: 14 player game is 4 scum??? Is that real? Can you explain please. This is a legit inquiry because I assumed 3 scum + 1 3P(with possible KP). This is also what I've been thinking, but I don't think I've ever played in a 14 players game? And I know admittedly little about game balancing. @Wave - right now leaning back towards Alzadar and my brain is telling me to take another look at mordek. This is before going back to reread stuff. I'm null on owb probably for the same reason as you are. | ||
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On October 14 2014 02:20 Requizen wrote: Filter check: Alaric Feeling: Unknown/possible scum Posting Habits: Observation A good portion of Frenchie's posting is trying to encourage discussion, a lot of asking "name - what do you think of so-and-so?" This is not a bad thing, as encouraging discussion is good for the Town. However, there were relatively few posts with his own opinions. Perhaps he was just waiting for someone to ask him for them as he asks others, but it is worth noting. I give possible scum, since pointedly asking people to post/critique one another is a very simple and easy way to stir up trouble. Not a particularly clever way to cause town disruption, but one that is effective if left unchecked. Low scum reading, but not 0 at the moment. Asking people to talk about others' posts is actually pretty important - it's how you get how people are thinking and reading other people, and it's how you get content out there, which is especially important D1. I still maintain my earlier sentiments of Alaric being pretty townie. | ||
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On October 14 2014 03:19 Requizen wrote: As I said before, I'd rather have all cards on the table from everyone. If someone gets shot/poisoned tonight and their correct read goes unposted, then that hurts the town. For example, I said that I think mordek is town. If I die tonight, but am right that he's not scum, I hope that my posts can help narrow down who is. You're correct in that the converse is more focused and just as important - if someone dies, that means their scumreads may be accurate and will cause an investigation. But the opposite is just as important. That said, scum can also just choose to kill someone who thinks that they are town, to draw suspicion away. That's why giving reasoning why you don't think someone is scum is just as important - so someone who disagrees with you can still investigate. Vomiting all your reads, especially as you are doing, really isn't helpful though. Sure, it's important to know where peoples' reads lie. But something like what you're doing would be more important for someone who had concern of being shot tonight, and had some really important read/case to get out there before he thinks he's going to die. I'm glad you're putting time in to formulate reads, but I wish it had a bit more direction. I'd love to know your #1 scum read. You've given several reads so far, but most of them are pretty null. The only one you're really leaning scum on is Alaric, which is someone who's fairly widely considered townie. | ||
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On October 14 2014 03:43 WaveofShadow wrote: You're not reading, are you soniv? Tsk tsk. I know who his scum reads are. On October 14 2014 03:44 Lord Tolkien wrote: His #1scumread is me lel oh right, that's why I disregarded it | ||
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On October 14 2014 03:48 WaveofShadow wrote: And me. Are you disregarding that? There has also been a fair amount of discussion on both me and Tolkien stemming from Req's posts, so you're not reading the thread. Good to know. I disregarded it because I didn't and don't think LT is scum. I did a quick skim of his filter summation posts tonight and he hasn't done one for LT, so it had slipped my mind. As for his suspicions of you, he said he thinks he's placed too much focus on you, and I already said I'm tabling my concerns of you as well for now. On October 14 2014 03:57 Requizen wrote: Alzadar's filter is odd. Lots of fluff posts early, then some decent ideas, but something seems off about him. Can't put my finger on it. The thing that's setting me off about him is that ever since we chastised his early posts, he seems to be saying things that he thinks the town wants to hear, rather than what he's actually thinking? Idk, hard to put it in words. I'll really dig into it more in a few hours. | ||
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I did a quick skim of these posts: On October 14 2014 01:56 Requizen wrote: Filter check: OWB Feeling: Not scum Posting Habits: Lurking OWB was away for most of the game and has a very small filter. His vote for no-lynch makes me think town. Scum coming in late, catchup or not, could always fake reading by following their fellow scum's voting patterns. No-lynch makes me think not-scum who was, in fact, distracted. Our reads are different but line up in a couple places. Read logic is pretty good. Filter check: Ghandi Feeling: Not scum/who knows Posting Habits: Shitposting I don't know if GEagle is actually going to play the game at all right now. There are a couple decent posts in his filter, but a lot of clogging posts about how misunderstood he is (ironic I know given my first few D1 posts) and his normal/shitty one liners. On October 14 2014 02:20 Requizen wrote: Filter check: Alaric Feeling: Unknown/possible scum Posting Habits: Observation A good portion of Frenchie's posting is trying to encourage discussion, a lot of asking "name - what do you think of so-and-so?" This is not a bad thing, as encouraging discussion is good for the Town. However, there were relatively few posts with his own opinions. Perhaps he was just waiting for someone to ask him for them as he asks others, but it is worth noting. I give possible scum, since pointedly asking people to post/critique one another is a very simple and easy way to stir up trouble. Not a particularly clever way to cause town disruption, but one that is effective if left unchecked. Low scum reading, but not 0 at the moment. On October 14 2014 02:33 Requizen wrote: Filter check: mordek Feeling: Unknown/low scum likelyhood Posting Habits: Normal? I like mordek's posts so far. He posts his feelings without pushing too hard on people, and has been helpful for new players. This could be a play on scum!mordek's part to get on people's good side, or he could just be a good sport. Or he could be town and just doing his thing. I liked his reads and he didn't sow much or any discord in his D1. He's low on the watchlist. On October 14 2014 03:04 Requizen wrote: Filter check: AsmodeusXI Feeling: Town Posting Habits: Reasonable Asmo's posts give me a green vibe. I'm not trusting him yet, but I in no way have a bad feeling from him. Yes, he voted for MB, but he made that call very early and gave reasoning for it before the train began running. I have not agreed with every call he's made (for example, his aggression towards AFKers and his tirade against Jeff), but I think he's more town and anything. The only thing that stands out to me is his post after MB flipped green - the anger and regretfulness is in line with his normal posting style, but it only feels a little too forward, as if Mafia!Asmo is trying to force sounding regretful about his decision. But then, I've started to feel a bit mistrustful of any post that isn't strictly productive towards saving the town. "A quick skim of his filter summations". When I said "you've given several reads so far", these posts are what I was talking about. Look at all of his "feeling" lines - they're all just meh. | ||
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On October 14 2014 04:19 WaveofShadow wrote: Why does nobody else want to talk about soniv? Is this just pushback because of the way my in-game personality doesn't seem to fit in this particular game? Because I'm not sure how to make people consider my posts any other way. I don't know why everyone seems to be ignoring me, but I would love for people not to ignore me just because you're the one pushing me. I'd rather people talk about it and figure it out than let you run around in little circles. If you are, in fact, town, I hope you can get past this vendetta on me and do some real scumhunting. But if you're scum, then feel free to continue yelling at the wall | ||
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On October 14 2014 04:45 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm pretty content to continue yelling against the wall for a little while. Reading through his filter you really get a sense of him trying to avoid taking stances all over the place and letting others do his work for him. Obviously the boave is likely a joke, related to my trolly early vote of Jeff but then look below: Scumtactics 101, start shit, don't get hit. A whole bunch of questions, NONE of them actually go anywhere in terms of trying to get information for himself. This was one of the early posts I made, and I was asking because on the first page of the game, you and jeff voted each other. How dare I ask for some reasoning for either votes? You can say I was starting shit, or you could look at it for what it was - very early D1. Let's play 'count the number of times soniv doesn't take a stance on me: Ok, you quote two posts in which I don't take a stance on you. First quote - I say that I think you're more likely town. Again, this post was very early on in the game (in response to the general concern about your aggressiveness early on), so no one has a clear read on anyone. Second quote (bolded) - I'm still trying to figure out why you quote this. I'm saying that your claim for protection in your assertive first post has viability behind it. If you play really well day 1, find scum, and are really aggressively hunting reds, then scum would obviously want to take you out at night to remove the strongest link in the town. Protection would make sense in that case. Keep in mind, again, that this is early in the game when I have a town read on you. Just a little sidenote here. This post comes almost directly after he says Alzadar is his top scumread: Does this look like he's truly trying to learn about Alz's alignment? Also pretty damning is HE COMPLETELY DROPS ALZADAR FOR THE REAMINDER OF HIS FILTER. Where did that suspicion on him go exactly? The majority of D1, I was working under the assumption that I had correctly pegged MB as red. Alzadar was my first read, and after most of the thread chastised him, his posting shaped up a bit. I was halfway satisfied with his activity, and was curious to see what his play turned into, so I kept off of him. You're right, I didn't keep on him as I probably should have, but I'm curious about him again, and his filter is my next stop. Like...do I even need to keep going? Soniv says what he needs to at the time to appease people. Look at his early responses to my grilling him---tosses out a scumread that means absolutely nothing and then drops it. Questions people without any direction whatsoever. I've already spoken about what I think of his vote/push on MB. He didn't even do the majority of the work on it, he just sat on it. Soniv is absolute primary lynch tomorrow. Look, I understand why you think I'm scum, and I know you're really excited because you think you got one with his hand on his dick. But you're just not correct. | ||
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On October 12 2014 04:46 Alzadar wrote: Bandwagon? I was the first to suspect Cixah, decided to actually vote cause Wave seems antsy to have us vote, and I trust him as our fearless Townie leader. Strategic talk: if you hold the oldest vote on someone (as Ghandhi did), you shouldn't change it arbitrarily, you're giving up tiebreak power. First time around, the first part of the post seemed odd and sheepish to me - reflecting what I said earlier about him saying things to satisfy the thread. But before this post, he put Wave at probably town, and so this reads more as someone who is collaborating with someone he kinda sorta might trust a little bit. Also, the second part exemplifies another quality of his general posting. He's been talking about setup stuff here and there (a fair amount of it earlier on), and usually it's not very productive or helpful and often distracts town. But rereading, he asks coherent questions that apply to the game flow, they show that he's invested in the goings on and is paying attention (despite backwards canadiansgiving). His filter comes off with more of a town vibe than I expected it to. It did remind me of two things as well. 1. The IC claim was at a really weird time. That's right, I'm lookin' at you 6ah. I really hope that confirmation comes through or D2 is going to be very boring lol. 2. I want to take a look at Ket Chup. He's someone who I haven't really noticed even though I know he's been posting quite a bit. He will probably be my next focus. On October 14 2014 07:39 Lord Tolkien wrote: If wav and sonib are mommy and daddy, what does that make me? The young twink that daddy's having an affair with? the mistress | ||
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On October 14 2014 04:45 WaveofShadow wrote: Soniv is absolute primary lynch tomorrow. On October 14 2014 09:07 WaveofShadow wrote: Hey cool, Wave is right about a whole bunch of stuff. ##vote: GhandiEAGLE Get out my game jeff. lol 'ey papi, you so fickle I actually think LT was a pretty smart scum target. Most of the thread has been caught up in Soniv v Wave - Battle of the Golems, but LT was the only one sitting on the outside saying "lynching either of them tomorrow is stupid". Getting rid of him assists in stirring the pot. He also was heavy on Jeff, and it's suuuuuuuuuuper easy to say "would I kill the guy accusing me?" (I've done it before). I'm willing to put our differences on hold for now, in our mistress's honor. ##vote: Jeff | ||
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On October 14 2014 10:07 GhandiEAGLE wrote: I dont think LT was that heavy on me beyond the fact that I was lurking. He seemed to have cooled off once I was finally able to post. That would be a fucking stupid murder from me. On October 14 2014 08:14 Lord Tolkien wrote: At work still so this EoN post will be much shorter than what i normally spew out. 1) fking jeff. Im extremely unhappy he's still afk lurking. This isnt making you seem more town you know, and now im really getting serious about tunneling you. If Req can put in effort so can you. yeah, cooled off | ||
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On October 14 2014 10:09 WaveofShadow wrote: Which would fit with the rest of your play. lol soniv and of course you're willing to bury the hatchet, 'cause it's my hatchet and it would be aimed at your head if not for dis gai over here The fun part is if Jeff flips scum you look eeeeeeven worse (though I suppose I do too for dropping the wagon initially lolol) Eh, if you were really aiming it at my head, you'd be aiming it at my head. You dropped that case quick, and you were so unbelievably excited. Meh, I don't mind looking bad if Jeff dies. We get to kill Jeff and mafiascum. | ||
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On October 14 2014 10:13 GhandiEAGLE wrote: That was before I came out of lurking. I believe his next thing was Good filtering tho ...what? I don't understand how that proves he's at all stopped thinking about tunneling you. And just because you're posting now doesn't mean your not still considered a lurker. You're still in fairly lurky territory when your filter is 3 pages long. Of not a whole lot. | ||
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On October 12 2014 07:32 GhandiEAGLE wrote: TBH the reason I'm avoiding actually saying anything substantial is because I suck at the game and want to play my cards close to my chest until I legitimately learn what good ideas even are in this game. But nobody else is able to throw around anything but baseless conjecture anyways so I don't think that I'm really that far behind in terms of actual tangible contribution. I was trying intentionally to aggravate Wave to bait him into telling me more about the game without me actually asking, in order for me to get better. Wave gets mad in this game really easily though so tbh there was a lot of entertainment value there. One thing I have noticed, is that Coma hasn't been speaking. Is there a precedent for lurkers being scum? This is a really shitty post. Keeping your cards close to your chest is ok, but you had done literally nothing up til that point. Even Req got his reads out there, albeit poorly - you hadn't contributed anything. That said, I'm not so convinced on you after rereading the filter. So for now ##unvote ##vote ComaDose | ||
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On October 14 2014 11:08 Requizen wrote: There are 11 of you left. There are at least 3, possibly 4 of you trying to kill me. And I have no idea which ones. that's the fun of the game! | ||
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Ket Chup, I like your post - The portion about me pocketing people is interesting. It's not at all what I'm doing, but it's interesting. I do think Alzadar is town at this point. I clearly didn't pocket wave - I don't think that's a thing I could do in this game even if I wanted to. Me "pocketing" you really isn't indicative of anything and only looks that way when you frame it with the assumption that I'm trying to pocket people. My interaction with Req that you quoted was legitimately just a "that's the fun of mafia" post. I didn't get around to going through your filter last night, but your case on me is an affirmation for me that you're probably town. You're looking for the right things, just at the wrong person. Now, let me state again, LT was really the only person in thread saying "soniv isn't scum". If you're so interested in looking at his reads, take note of the fact that he didn't think wave or I were really scum. At this point, seeing LT flip green, I think the general thoughts of "one of LT/wave/soniv are scum" are probably off base. Wave isn't scum. Ketchup could be right and wave could be 3p, but I find it unlikely given his post volume. It's going to end up being something stupid like this: On October 14 2014 14:17 WaveofShadow wrote: Also I'm gonna be pissed if scumteam is something I wouldn't consider like lurk city owb/coma/jeff LT's last mention of myself was that he would be ok with lynching either me or wave if town is unsure for a d2 lynch. Fine, whatever, if end of day comes and it's still completely up in the air, then go ahead and do that. Unfortunately, his top read was still Jeff, and that's a viewpoint I'm not in line with right now. That said: On October 14 2014 13:33 GhandiEAGLE wrote: I'll hold my tongue on this for a few minutes, I think. On October 14 2014 14:05 GhandiEAGLE wrote: AKA I want to vote Soniv right now, but something is holding me back. If you think I'm scummy, then vote for me. If you don't, then post a reason why. LT was the one putting the most focus (I think) on you while he was alive - don't think that you can just sneak away now that he's dead. Now, a couple things have stood out to me since this the pressure has been put onto me: 1. Coma - His only post since ketchup/wave started pushing me: On October 14 2014 13:41 ComaDose wrote: could be interesting to note that soniv and asmo seemed to be leaning on alz and moonbear most This is a classic "scum poking the fire" tactic. He just chirps in to stir things up, but hasn't pushed a vote on me. It did remind me that Asmo parroted a lot of my viewpoints D1, and I was going to call Asmo out for it until his last post on me. The timing of Asmo's post was poor, but I think his motives are in the right place. Coma's are not. He's hardcore lurked and been pretty anti-town in general. 2. Requizen - he hasn't taken a stance on my case one way or the other. Instead, he attacks ketchup... and I'm not really sure why. Because ketchup was trying to get more out of him? Because Req was called out on bandwagoning Coma, and so he's jumping ship? Req, I would love to hear your opinions on the case about me. Gotta run to a meeting, so any questions directed to me won't be addressed for a little. | ||
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On October 14 2014 23:58 Requizen wrote: I have no opinions on Soniv. Well that's really not that acceptable. There have been some good arguments in favor of my lynch, surely you can come up with something. Please take the time to formulate a read of some sort. | ||
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On October 15 2014 01:55 onlywonderboy wrote: Ah okay, sorry about the misquote. I think you're misreading Wave's attempts to lead the town as being manipulative. I think is a direct result of him trying to guide the newbs which actually backfired on him. It also sounds like you're getting really down on yourself because the game isn't going as you hope. That's kinda how I felt during my newbie games. I'm leaning towards Req just being discourage town rather than scum. Really? I see it more as Req continuing to try to convince us that his reads are really just him spouting off stuff that should just be disregarded. On October 15 2014 01:08 Requizen wrote: Sure. My personal opinion is that there are other people who are more likely to be Mafia, but I've been wrong before. On October 15 2014 01:03 Requizen wrote: People can push on him all they want. I'm neutral because none of his posts make me think he's scum, but none of his posts jump out to me as someone who's helping town win. I can be neutral or leaning on anyone I want. You don't have to agree with it. On October 14 2014 09:25 Requizen wrote: I am bad at reads. These, along with all of his D1 "but I'm a newwwwwwwbie" whine, paints a situation where he can say whatever the hell he wants - why should anyone listen to it, he's just a bad with bad reads. On October 15 2014 00:25 ComaDose wrote: heh i do tend to post mostly at work... ghandi the safest thing would have been to get on the soniv bandwagon becuase it would have kept me out of the lynching chair. also im pretty sure im the only one that brought up our two dead people voted for you with me. about req im not sure. he seemed so townie to me day one but he has grown a spine. I think he is giving good different views. also he voted for wave day 1 which doesn't seem scummy really cause its kinda a waste. since then he has acted like wave if someone questions him (i.e. spazing a bit or as cixah called it barking at the wind) its a bit hypocritical but maybe he's just grumpy? I cant really see anything hes doing being good for scum. The fact that Req's vote was wasted on Wave is, in fact, in scum's favor. When townies don't consolidate and coordinate, it gives scum a huge advantage because they are coordinated in their own scum QuickTopic thread. It's the same reason I was not on board with Wave's attempt at EoD1 shenannies - it can work, but people have to be very coordinated or it can go poorly for town. Looking through Req's filter, two posts jump out at me: On October 14 2014 03:57 Requizen wrote: Alzadar's filter is odd. Lots of fluff posts early, then some decent ideas, but something seems off about him. Can't put my finger on it. I'll look into Soniv next, Wave. I can say my focus hasn't been on him much. This was ~midday yesterday (RL time), a few hours before D2 post. On October 14 2014 04:54 Requizen wrote: Decent reasoning. I could get behind a Soniv investigation, even if my scum klaxons aren't blaring around him. Also worth noting: ketchup. Again, largely ignored, no large stances taken. Many, many posts of "Why do you think x is scum" "who are your scumreads". Possibly starting fights, possibly starting conversation, but his volume of posting with little commitment is offputting. This was an hour later. He says he'll look into me, and then states he can get behind an investigation on me. But today, some ~16 hours later, he still doesn't have any semblance of a read on me? Or at least refuses to give it. Req, what's the deal. | ||
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still - 10 hours later and the most he can say is "I think there are other people more likely to be mafia" - of course with the caveat of "although I've been wrong before" | ||
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On October 15 2014 02:48 Requizen wrote: @Soniv Did you purposefully ignore the post I made about you 5 posts after that? Like ketchup, you are "reading my filter" but ignoring the posts that make you look incorrect. My reads at this point should be disregarded. My vote D1 was not wasted, because it would not have affected the end result of MB's lynch one way or another. Is there a particular reason you and ketchup are both taking the same steps to paint me in a bad light? Because we're noticing the same things? I didn't ignore that post, it only reinforces my point - you aren't giving a read on me. "his posts aren't scummy, but they don't feel squeaky clean" "this doesn't scream scum to me". These are very non-committal opinions. You want my opinion? You look scummy as fuck. Moreso than Coma. ##unvote ##vote Requizen | ||
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On October 15 2014 02:56 Cixah wrote: Dandel if you get a chance can we get an updated vote soon? Soniv is pushing heavy to get everything off him, which is good. However everything said by him does nothing but deflect attention for me. If Req is really your scum read soniv, What Committal opinon do you have on Req? Req isn't helping matters but I still have no reason to distrust him yet. I Like his position less and less especially over the last 4 hours but he's still town to me. Req, you need to find something to you can stand on, and soon otherwise I think you swing soon. I don't quite know what you're asking here. Could you clarify? | ||
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On October 15 2014 02:59 Requizen wrote: You blatantly left it out of your "in depth investigation" to make me look like worse. I haven't changed that stance. I don't have a good read on you. My instincts don't scream mafia but you haven't posted enough helpful things to be confirmed town. You are 20%~30% scum, which doesn't mean anything. If the votes go towards you, I have no problem letting them go through because I don't think you're confirmed town like some other people. If they don't, that's fine too, I think Wave is a bigger threat (for reasons listed multiple times). I am not flipping on things. My opinions have formed slowly and changed slowly, and I have been outspoken and honest about it every step of the way. Ignoring that and trying to utilize misinformation makes you look bad, and I'd rather not have to pursue you. As an aside, I'm removing my vote from ketchup since, as I said before, I don't think he's scum and I just jumped on him because he was on my case. I hope this reasoning is clear enough that it can be referenced in the future without someone twisting my actions to try and draw attention off of themselves. ##unvote That last paragraph is what's called an OMGUS vote, and it is a huge scumtell. On October 15 2014 03:00 Cixah wrote: You keep stating that he's deflecting the question that has him pinned on Scum. Which question are you refering to and How does NOT answering it or giving a STRAIGHT answer make him scum? I'm sorry, I'm still not really following. Everyone seems to have an opinion on me except Req. When asked directly, sure he has stuck with his "I have no real read on him" position - but I find that unacceptable when everyone else seems to want me dead. He's actively avoiding a bandwagon without coming out and saying that I'm town. | ||
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On October 15 2014 03:16 Requizen wrote: By the by, you voting for me is also pretty well a OMGUS vote, since you just voted for me because you are upset that I didn't answer you the way you wanted to be answered. And, in your own words, Yeah...that's not how OMGUS works. You voted ketchup because he started pressing you and asking questions. In your words "he was on your case". I'm voting you because in the face of several cases on me, and despite saying you'd dive into my filter, you're still null on me. What you did is OMGUS, what I did is vote someone that I think is scum. You literally have just admitted that you avoided saying I'm scum because you didn't want to be accused of bandwagoning. + Show Spoiler + On October 15 2014 03:15 Requizen wrote: I didn't even know that was a thing. Ok, I guess it's a scummy move for someone who's played mafia for however many games, but you can clearly read the exchange between us (which was taking place at 1 in the morning) and realize my frustration. If not, then you can continue to ignore the evidence that is literally written down. If I said you were town, it doesn't matter because it likely wouldn't dissuade people from riding your case given my bad reads and lack of conviction compared to theirs. If I said you were scum, people would accuse me of just jumping on the bandwagon given that I did not have that read on you previously. So I stuck to my guns and gave an honest opinion - that is, I don't know if you are either right now and I don't think I need to be forced to say. My game does not revolve around you. You're just one out of eleven. Trying to force suspicion onto me is not going to get the votes off of you. This is scum mentality. You're concerned about looking guilty - townies should never be worried about looking guilty, they're there to find the reds. They're there to stick their necks out and see what's up. You're working hard to not stick your neck out. Your game might not revolve around me, but right now, the thread is revolving around the case on me. So many people want me dead. Overwhelmingly so that people, Wave especially, should be able to tell that no one is in my corner. Once again, I state - this is why LT is dead. He was the only one who realized that I was town. Someone mentioned to look at his last post, and it says "if unsure, a Wave or Soniv vote works D2". However, I am where everyone's focus went immediately, and what's happening right now is a bandwagon through and through. And you can bet your ass that scum are happy it's happening. | ||
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On October 15 2014 03:47 Alzadar wrote: I'll grant you that LT wasn't outright calling for your lynch, but he definitely didn't "realize you were town", he was pretty suspicious of you. On October 14 2014 01:53 Lord Tolkien wrote: Ahahaha. Req thinks I'm scum. I wouldnt have a problem with it if the reasoning wasn't so bad. Your picking up on traits which are the EXACT OPPOSITE of what scum wants to do. lol Town can't change their minds? Pls. And really, how are we to read your day one when you spent the entire time moaning then playing the newb card? I applaud the effort, though the reasoning is poor at best. After analyzing the votecount and general player atmosphere, i figured i needed to steer town off of what was most likely town. And not waste a d1 lynch COUGH COUGH. Still wouldnt lynch wave or soniv tomorrow. Also, i take it back. Vigi should shoot today. On October 14 2014 02:18 Lord Tolkien wrote: Also Coma. Pls. Soniv is cleared for his push onto MB. On October 14 2014 03:58 Lord Tolkien wrote: Soniv pushed the MB train hard. Scum usually don't want the attention early for pushing a town mislynch D1. Much better to look at the people following the train and sheeping. @Alaric - I'm not sure how you would expect/want me to defend myself (other than defending my actions - though I've already explained that I was playing D1 under the impression that MB would flip red), but the best way I know how is to find scum myself, because clearly you guys aren't going to do it. (I know you gave your speculation of 3 options, but I'm running off to another meeting). | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:03 ketchup wrote: Err just to make it bold: ##Unvote: Soniv ##Vote: Req at least someone is coming to their senses On October 15 2014 04:15 WaveofShadow wrote: Soniv the best thing you can do right now if you're town is do what you haven't done in like fucking ages. Provide some reads. HELP OUT THE TOWN in some way. If you die and flip green this way we'll have a whole bunch to work with Your vote/case on Req doesn't help you much in my eyes. There are a lot of people in this game still, and I have no idea what you think about most of them. When I think someone is town, I say that they're town. When I think someone is scum, I say that they're scum. There's no use in me stating that I have null reads on all of these scummy as fuck lurkers, just as you do. I have already said that my town reads are you, ketchup, 6ah (obviously), Alaric, and probably Alz. You know my biggest current scum read right now is Req, and somewhat lesser than that is Coma. I thought you were on to something with Asmo until he made his case on me; now I'm not so sure. The rest are a bunch of god damn lurkers that I don't know how to get a read on. I'll probably put my eye to one tonight to try and glean any semblance of usefulness. This whole thread feels like town yelling at each other for the most part while a bunch of people are watching. There's my stupid fucking list post, all of my reads can be found in the thread, as I know for a fact that I've said them all. Speaking of scummy as fuck lurkers...Jeff, where the fuck are you | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:11 Alaric wrote: Ketchup it wasn't a case. When I say I'm just curious and asking questions, I mean it. Soniv acted differently from most so far, including other vets (even Tolkien addressed accusations against him, although he did it by trashtalking their authors), and that made me curious since he's experience. I thought there was maybe something to glean about how the game is played here. Eh, a lot of the suspicion on me is for my general play and how wave thinks I should be playing. I have addressed posts as they've come, surely. You were curious why I wasn't defending myself as you thought I would defend myself. And I was totally fine with the questions you asked. And I explained my play as best I could, and am looking to kill scum. I am no stranger to being the target of a bandwagon, and experience has told me that helping find scum is better than being concerned about dying. | ||
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It's the same mistake I made D1. I thought I was being a bit cheeky and could because I've got at least some experience at the game. But as a new player, I'd say it's highly unrecommended. | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:34 ketchup wrote: Again, I want to ask How is this a good post from a town perspective? Am I missing something on Req here? What are people seeing that makes him townie? He has neutral feelings towards soniv, but still votes him? He seems to not have a solid read on ANYONE. He voted me, and then said it wasn't because he actually thought I was scum? It's not a town perspective. Req's entire line of play has been incredibly self serving. | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:59 Requizen wrote: I've posted and responded and tried to help town, and repeatedly was told I was doing it wrong and that my posts were incorrect and stupid. So I'm trying something different. As it turns out, pretty much everything I do elicits a similar response. Both you and Soniv started tirades against me based on very shaky ideas and both tried to use misinformation and half truths to make me look as bad as possible. And then when that failed, you fell on "well he's different from day 1" as an excuse to keep going. Of course I am. Give me a fracking break. I'm voting Soniv because his pressure made no sense, as I noted here: + Show Spoiler + Just because I don't have a strong opinion on you, I'm scum. That is the entirety of your whole argument. That the shittiest reasoning I've seen in a long time, and I used to read GD. If you really are town and want to get the votes off of you, you should explain your own actions rather than make me repeat myself for the, what, fifth time? All you're doing is making me think you're more scum. This isn't bandwagoning (as you can clearly see from this entire exchange, I've remained very neutral up until this point), this is me looking at your actions (blame shifting, misinformation, fearmongering) and seeing you turn red. Whether that's just a townie screaming at nothing until his face turns purple or a desperate mafia, I don't know. As you can read (and I even copied it for you so you don't have to go into my filter and miss it again), his constant poking at non-points and failing to use simple logic makes me think he's trying way too hard to get people against me. It moves him up on my scum list. And since I'd rather vote on someone who I think may go through (Soniv) rather than someone who I know no one else but Jeff will vote on (Wave), I put my vote there. I could break it down further for you, but sometimes I'm optimistic and like to think that you're not that soft in the head. But then, maybe you're right. Maybe I'm terrible at this, just as terrible as I am at every game I play. Except 40k. Where I'll go now. Be back in a few hours or so. Req, you posted stuff that you were clearly having opinions on, but your reasons for arriving at them was poor. You continually made and still make "I'm new/I'm bad at this" posts (this post is a case in point) and you're a huge martyr. You have been erratic and generally anti-town. You wasted your D1 vote. You have OMGUS'd not once, but twice. @Wave - I acknowledge what you're thinking. And I agree, it doesn't make much sense for scum to do that. And that is the line of thinking that a somewhat experienced player would have. But this is a game full of noobs and Req has made damn sure that we know he's one of them. There's a reason that the things I have listed above are tried and true scumtells. FUCKING JEFF WHERE ARE YOU | ||
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On October 15 2014 08:13 WaveofShadow wrote: Ok I just read you're leaning coma and probably Jeff. no shit maybe once you take off those blinders because YOU WANT TO KILL ME OH SO BAD, you'll actually read my posts today. | ||
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On October 15 2014 08:10 WaveofShadow wrote: Yeah and MB did the same thing. So did Asmo. So did coma (I think?) Are they all scum? I'm drawing the line where I think it needs to be drawn. I'm also done discussing this as it's not productive in my opinion. What I would like to know is who else is scum Soniv? Req stepped way whatever line you're drawing. MB did do the same thing, you're right. And you agreed with me when he did it. Several others have done it as well here and there. It has been the entire theme of Req's posting history. | ||
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On October 15 2014 08:39 GhandiEAGLE wrote: I was following the Wave-Soniv thing with a lot of interest, and Soniv is still my #1 most wanted. Right now, he's the only lynch other than me (but I'm innocent, I'm afraid) that tells us a lot. What does it tell us Jeff? I want to hear it in your words, I don't want anyone else answering this question. Soniv, on the other hand, has had a few important relationships with a lot of people, and I don't need to go into it since Ketchup described my feelings in a post yesterday ('bout those yung pockets). It confirms what I believe in that Wave and Ketchup are both town (Req that ketchup vote was just straight stupid). I have already addressed the concerns about me "pocketing" people. They were all examples of me changing my reads on people, something wave has said I haven't done. The 3 examples were Alzadar, ketchup and wave, all three of which I have changed my reads on. I still think Soniv right now as #1 scum, or at least best possible lynch at the moment. He says a lot, but in reality he never really does much when he points fingers. He tends to separate those posts. Also, he's doing the pretend rage thing that I called him out for earlier. That's scummy. Or, at the very least, it's fishy. So I'm your #1 scum read for "pocketing" people. And to everyone claiming that I'm faking rage (wave, you're continually smearing your bullshit) - I am not mad, I am frustrated at how thick headed wave is playing. I am trying very hard to remain level headed because having two people yelling at each other over and over is not a good town atmosphere, and wave is trying to bait me really hard. [/QUOTE] | ||
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On October 15 2014 10:40 AsmodeusXI wrote: Okay. Back and ready to fight on. After my post, Soniv's made decent plays as both scum and town (WIFOM, I know, just bear with me). He's marginally addressed my post: not drawing too much attention to it, but also no hard denial/OMGUS. That's a town reaction, especially so far from deadline. He's also found someone to go after, which is the town's good work should Req bleed red. That's another seemingly town interaction. However, the manipulation factor is still relevant. At this point, we all kinda know how Req plays: volatile states, prone to lashing out. It's emotional play because Req's a sensitive dude (and this is not meant to offend sir), and it's easily manipulatable (even ketchup got his goat, and that was probably unintentional). If Soniv wants to cover his tracks well, the best way to do it is to set off Req since it's unlikely he'll be able to get a rise out of Wave at this point, and no one else has proven to be so easy to control (again, don't mean to offend buddy). That also fits in with the "fake anger" that Alaric pointed out: play an emotional game, get easy emotional feedback. I think the intent of this is to get the focus away from Soniv and onto Req, and I think it's working. Which is dangerous (Wave sees that). The meat of this paragraph is coming from the assumption that I am manipulating people, specifically Requizen. This is so ridiculously off base. I saw the intereactions between ketchup and Requizen. I then began pressing him as well. He shut down and became erratic under any hint of pressure. Everyone is excusing it because it's Requizen, and I'm calling bullshit. And once again, you're parroting this "fake anger" thing. And I will repeat - Wave's play is frustrating me, and I'm trying to maintain a level headedness. You are taking Wave's misguided crosshairs as gospel and using that to justify something that is simply untrue. Furthermore, Soniv's other reads are still lurkers like Coma and Ghandi. I genuinely don't believe that lynching a lurker does the town that much good atm. I think the scummers are at least more active than Coma, especially since they had a pretty great first cycle. When you're winning, you stay more invested. I believe any given lurker is most likely to be town, including Coma, despite his lack of good content (which pisses me off a lot, but doesn't necessarily make him scum). Lynching a lurker D1 and lynching a lurker D2 are two wildly different things. The way things are going, I still maintain that the majority of this thread is town yelling at each other while the scum just sit quietly and get by with minimal posting. Unfortunately for those of us on Soniv's trail, Jeff is another story. Jeff's posting looks fishy as fuck, fishy enough that most people smell stink coming from his direction, real or not. What's interesting to me about Soniv's perspectives is that there have been indications that (after Req) Soniv's next target is Coma, and not the more egregiously suspicious Jeff. For posterity (and I acknowledge this may have changed): To me, this says that Jeff is sacrificial scum: the scum (read: Soniv) know he's going down eventually, but they're going to try and put off a lynch on him until they get as many lurky town-peeps as possible. Definitely Coma, but I don't know if it ends there. Maybe Soniv rounds back on Alz (but here my reasoning gets less event-based, so let's avoid mere ideas). I lumped Jeff in with the "scummy as fuck lurkers" because, as said above, there is a larger than I'm comfortable with number of scummers hiding in the lurkers. Because let's face it, half of the players in this game are not posting enough. Earlier on, I believe I said something to the effect of "just because LT is dead doesn't mean you can get off scot free and not post anymore" to him, and so I'm trying to keep him honest. There are lots of lurkers, and I wish other people would be addressing them directly as well. That bolded part at the end serves absolutely no purpose other than to shed me in a negative light. It's pure conjecture with no basis. @Cixah - I think you can gather from my thoughts that I think Req is misguided town. If he's scum, it's a damn masterful job. I don't understand why you'd be praising his scum play. He's playing so scummy that there's no way he's scum? And therefore it's masterful? Not a chance. As far as participation goes, I have some thoughts to share post-game. However, now they'll just come off as noob whine or some other cancer, so it's not really the time nor place. And you finish it off with a quick, harmless noob claim. TL;DR - I'm still feeling good about my scum read on Soniv, so that's where I'll stay. LT wouldn't be the first person he's convinced he's town (that honor is mine), so I'm not letting up until this ugly feeling is gone, hopefully in the form of some red blood. I didn't convince LT of shit, I haven't had to defend myself until today, after he was dead. He made that read based on what he saw of me in game, I don't really think I had many 1 on 1 interactions with him. Welcome to my scum list Asmo. Your first case post was good. This one reeks of scum trying to keep the momentum on this bandwagon because wave is stirring up enough trouble to keep it viable. | ||
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On October 15 2014 08:54 jcarlsoniv wrote: What does it tell us Jeff? I want to hear it in your words, I don't want anyone else answering this question. | ||
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On October 15 2014 11:22 WaveofShadow wrote: You and I need to talk some more I think. And other people had better pay attention to the conversation we have. As far as lurkers stealing away the game goes---I don't think that's fair any more as I mentioned above. There are people with less content volume and less quality, sure, but there's more than enough to go on by now, and even those with the smallest filters have posted a decent enough amount today. Oh surely. Today's activity has been much better, but the majority of the posts made today have still been within a core group of people. I don't really expect anyone to come even close to what I'm capable of churning out. If you want to eliminate 'lurkers,' the ABSOLUTE first one on your list should be Jeff, because he continually lurks until the pressure on him rises (with a small exception being he put forth some stuff today---though that is neither here nor there because it's entirely possible he just caught on that we caught on). And look, I'm still trying to put pressure on him. I would love to get an answer from him to the question I've directed to him twice. But I also think that there is red blood in Req. There may be something to the fact that there are those sitting by while I stir up shit, but then you have to tell me exactly where that's occurring. What's the context? How can you prove to me those people are scum? Because as I see it, if you escape the noose today it means it's Jeff's head and then it may just come back to you D3. Either way, I think I get what I want today. If you've been paying any semblance of attention at all today, then you already know the context. The first half of D2 has been spent with a bunch of people pushing me, myself and ketchup pushing Req, and some people pushing Jeff. The difference between them and me is that I'm really the only one at all fighting to keep me alive, and I'm the only one used really provided a halfway decent defense. Question for you - why are you so quick to write off Req's play just because it's Req? | ||
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you can be patient and let the quiet ones talk for a while. | ||
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On October 15 2014 12:42 GhandiEAGLE wrote: I'm saying this is what Soniv has been doing a lot, claiming that its "generating discussion." He reads things, says something about them, and moves on. This changes when he defends himself or when he went off against Req. His attack on Req actually is one of the few things tempting me to not vote Soniv. I certainly haven't seen a more convincing or useful lynch anywhere else though since everyone is staying so quiet and not making big connections with people. Jeff, these "prod posts" are how you try and get information. How else would you expect scumhunting to happen? How are they not legitimate discussion starters? What have you done comparatively instead that I should emulate, since you seem to know so much about scumhunting. And, again, I'm not sure how people expected my defense to be. But I'm done repeating myself. On October 15 2014 18:19 Cixah wrote: Wave, Soniv, and Ghandi. I want your reads on Alzadar. On October 15 2014 13:28 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Looking through Soniv's filter, he hasn't been nearly on top of you anymore. On day 1/night 1, he made remarks towards you relatively often. It's much less so recently, but that also loops around to the fact that you have had very little participation in moving guilt towards anyone yet. But at the same time, you haven't made many connections with people. So lynching you gets us nowhere again. Speak up more so we can tell if you're town or not. Maybe I've been off Alzadar's case because during N1 I said that I had changed my read on him to more of a green color? I have not paid too much attention to him during D2, but I've been a little preoccupied with defending myself and trying to actually find scum in Req and now you Jeff. + Show Spoiler + On October 14 2014 07:50 jcarlsoniv wrote: Y'know, I come out of Alzadar's filter actually thinking he's more townie. There were some posts I remember that I thought were surely scum leaning, that register to me differently this time around. Example: First time around, the first part of the post seemed odd and sheepish to me - reflecting what I said earlier about him saying things to satisfy the thread. But before this post, he put Wave at probably town, and so this reads more as someone who is collaborating with someone he kinda sorta might trust a little bit. Also, the second part exemplifies another quality of his general posting. He's been talking about setup stuff here and there (a fair amount of it earlier on), and usually it's not very productive or helpful and often distracts town. But rereading, he asks coherent questions that apply to the game flow, they show that he's invested in the goings on and is paying attention (despite backwards canadiansgiving). His filter comes off with more of a town vibe than I expected it to. It did remind me of two things as well. 1. The IC claim was at a really weird time. That's right, I'm lookin' at you 6ah. I really hope that confirmation comes through or D2 is going to be very boring lol. 2. I want to take a look at Ket Chup. He's someone who I haven't really noticed even though I know he's been posting quite a bit. He will probably be my next focus. the mistress I am honestly baffled at the number of people who don't think I'm defending myself properly, but also at the number of people who just seem to not be reading my posts. It is pretty clear at this point that you guys are going to let Req pass just because he's Req, and I really hope it's not our downfall. I think you're all being foolish. But between last night and this morning, I feel so much more on board with a Jeff lynch. The only real recent interest he's shown in lynch targets has been to say "that guy on the chopping block is scummier than me, lynch him instead". ##unvote ##vote Jeff | ||
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You seem very nonchalant about it, I'm confused. | ||
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My top 3 right now are Req, Jeff, and Asmo, in that order. Coma has fallen down that list a bit, but mostly because others have come up as more scummy. All three of the ones I've listed I have already explained. Pretending you have the key to anything is hilarious. | ||
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On October 15 2014 23:17 WaveofShadow wrote: Where's your stuff on Asmo and coma? I read your little vote business on Jeff but all it really comes down to is you think he's scummy because he votes the person who looks worse than him. Something you could arguably be doing right now. My stuff on Asmo is in the entire post I made addressing his second case post on me. Coma was a weak read on my part, and I haven't done any super in depth analysis on him since because there are others I find more scummy. The difference between me and Jeff is that I've been actually trying to find scum. I tried to push Req, no one else is having it. I'm accepting that town is just giving Req a free pass (although I vehemently disagree with it) and voting Jeff, who I have determined scummy. Jeff is sitting there going "uhh... no it's not me it's that other guy". He doesn't care who it is, as long as it's not him. He did it with MB D1, he's doing it with me now. I'm in meetings until this afternoon. I'm done with you being completely fixated on things despite me being very open this entire day and appeasing your ridiculous attitude. You have chastised me for tunneling MB so hard and not changing my read on him D1. You are doing the exact same thing to me now, even though I've been FAR more productive and open than MB ever was. | ||
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On October 16 2014 02:31 WaveofShadow wrote: Like what WAS with all the greenfont shit? And why does he feel the need to point out the extremely obvious, that there is a bus going on (unless both soniv/Jeff are town and the scum are in the rest of lurk city, or we've been massively fooled by, say, himself or ketchup). I think a lot of us have actually let Alaric skate by on early towncred without looking into him in a long time. Either that or the quiet is making me paranoid. I hate being in charge of lynches. Good practice though. I'm having the same misgivings about that post. I've had a super town read on him all game, but that one post is worrying. Also, could you explain what you meant by having the key to my survival? That also concerns me (rightfully so). Wave, could you explain this bolded part: On October 15 2014 23:08 WaveofShadow wrote: Oh hmm I just ignored all that green shit. Yeah at this point of you're claiming then out with it. If not, whatever. Soniv, still waiting on dem reads from yesterday. Time is ticking and very few people other than me have the key to your salvation. Why do you have a key (assuming you mean your vote) that only a few people have? What I would like to hear from everyone still voting me - after this entire D2, what is it that makes all of you think I'm scum? Because a lot of what I'm reading seems to be people starting with the assumption that I'm scum to make imaginary associations and assume that information will be gained about other scum because they've already assumed I'm scum. I could understand this viewpoint coming out of D1/N1, but I can't fathom how people can still see me as scum after this entire day. This was the answer that Jeff gave to the question I asked him: On October 15 2014 11:56 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Req has little to no connection with me, so lynching me has no impact on how he flips. You pursued him closely, but never really gained traction for it. Despite this lack of traction, you still made a push for it. If you flip red he's finally essentially proven townie and will sort out this whole mess with him. If you flip green, I think everyone would be ok with a Req lynch (or at least force his potential blue role). I think if you flip red Alzadar is also under a lot of consideration. When you flip red you'll also finally prove me innocent, something that nothing else but my own death will do (since Wave and Ketchup are pretty damn town). My point is that you have a connection with many more players than I do. Other than passing exchanges, right now I really only have significant connections with you, Wave, and Ketchup, and we know most about those people. You're the only real question mark tied with me, and maybe Coma is as well. So, the fact that I have made connections with people while Jeff has made very few actually makes me look more scummy because it potentially could create more information if I were to turn up red. This doesn't make any sense. I'd also like to point out that Req has still been completely absent since all of you have accepted his shitty play. | ||
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Yes Asmo, it means doing this is also a way for me to keep tabs on you. You've made a good case on Soniv which makes a red flip more likely, but if he flips green you'll have been at the foundation of two mislynches in a row, both started right after you got pressured. If Soniv flips red win for us, if he flips green I'll have my next target (and don't even think about switching your vote upon reading that). The fact that Asmo made two cases on me does not make me more likely to flip red. It just means that he's convinced you that there's somehow more information to be gained from my lynch. On October 16 2014 02:49 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Soniv, you're missing the point with the connections thing. It's not that it makes you look more scummy. You already look scummy and I didn't have to prove that. I was telling you how we learn the most out of anyone (by far!) by your death here. ...because I've been trying to be productive and talk and accuse and press people, while you've been sitting there doing shit all except pointing at whoever is on the chopping block other than you? You have made very few connections to other players (you even said it yourself), and so naturally there would be less to learn. People are trying to lynch me for information rather than lynching me because they actually think I'm scum, and that's real stupid. @Wave - Ok, I understand. And you probably could swing the vote back onto me if you really wanted to. But I'm really hoping that you're starting to see that lynching me is not the correct move. I also understand why you and everyone else is just letting Req do whatever the fuck he wants, but here's the thing - I know both you and I hate meta reads/cases, but that's exactly what you're doing. It's not a mafia meta, but it's a posting meta. And I have always maintained (and told you such) that if someone is aware enough of a player's meta, then that player would be able to take advantage of that. | ||
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On October 16 2014 03:34 Alaric wrote: Soniv: + Show Spoiler + About the key thing, this is how I view it (from reading today's filters only): - before Ghandi switched and I voted, it was 6-5 for you. A tie would be against Ghandi I think, haven't checked hard, but iirc owb has the oldest post, and he isn't likely to switch, so for you to die people needed to switch. ComaDose certainly won't because he seems convinced that killing Ghandi will somehow clear him (and I think however Ghandi flips there are strong arguments against him either way, part of why I don't think lynching Ghandi will produce much), Cixah and ketchup don't look like they would either (ketchup offered a hand but I dunno how firm he is). That means that Wave, because he tends to be listened to, and because he's one of the rare people not completely set yet, has the power to either force a tie or break it (even more so had he known I'd vote against you, that was 6-6 but Ghandi switched while I typed). As for lynching you, sure there's a risk you'll flip green. But not only do I think it's a tiny risk, we also stand to gain much more from your flipping (whether red or green, already said I'm coming for Asmo if you flip green myself) than Ghandi's. Both your posting has been a bit poor today, but I could easily attribute that to both of you being in a kinda deadlock for more of the day; and if given more liberty, I'm much more afraid of you leading us astray than I'd be of Ghandi. Even if he's scum he doesn't push us toward wrong lynches (that pretty much everyone ignores him doesn't help). As of now we can't know which one of you is red, or if you aren't even both red (I don't see it as likely but it's not impossible), but I'm pretty damn sure one of you has to be scum, and your flip will give us more stuff to catch the remaining 2-3. Add to that that I won't be around for the deadline in case of last minute shenanigans/twist (if you want to claim do it in the next 4 hours), and that I didn't think the situation could change (I'll admit I'm wrong, the new mordek wagon proved that with a perfect timing, uh), and I didn't see the point to fish for "maybe scum" instead of "very probably scum + info on the others". If you give me a better lynch? I'll bow, and I'll switch to that. But my reasoning was (and still is, unless twists like a mordek slip or something) that it's between Ghandi and you tonight, and that you are the "better" lynch. I'm so confused how you think my posting has been bad today. You had a town read on me D1, and my posting was so much worse D1, and I'm happy to be the first to admit that. Once again, I'm feeling like my entire play today has been largely ignored. I have tried to hand you guys a better lynch, and it was completely passed off as everyone giving Req a pass for being Req. I also now believe that Jeff is scum (something I did not think was true D1), and I've tried to push him as well. Is this going to be the theme of the game? Every day it's going to be Jeff vs. someone that ends up flipping town, only to continue it on the next day? You think you're going to get information from my flip, but all you'll find out is how god damn wrong you've been and how much time you've all wasted. On October 16 2014 03:31 mordek wrote: I like how Soniv dodged the claim or your getting lynched questions too. Admittedly he could be in meetings but let's not forget. ? What did I dodge? | ||
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On October 16 2014 03:57 mordek wrote: That was probably a dramatic way of putting it but Wave said you're going to need to claim or make a big play Are you talking about this? On October 16 2014 02:12 WaveofShadow wrote: If either you or soniv is 3P I suggest you claim. To which I did not respond because I'm not 3P. | ||
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On October 16 2014 04:42 ketchup wrote: I've repeatedly asked ghandi on how he sees himself helping town, but he has yet to respond. He's more interested in equivocating my posting to his, which is just categorically untrue. He has never been interested in working with a town agenda, only serving his self interest. | ||
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On October 16 2014 04:44 WaveofShadow wrote: That it would be good scumplay. If they're both scum they have had no choice basically all day. If we were both scum, don't you think there would be more people than just ketchup interested in pressuring Req? | ||
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There would be at least one other person in the thread interested in pushing it, right? Let's assume Req is town (because this is your viewpoint). And let's assume 3 scum (that seemed to be a reasonable conclusion that we arrived at +1 3p). That means that if both Jeff and I were scum, there would be one other person in the thread on our team. This day has been the Soniv and Jeff show from the start, so would it not follow that the scum team would want to be coordinated early on to get the votes somewhere else? Ketchup and I were really the only ones pushing Req, so does that mean you think ketchup is scum? | ||
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On October 16 2014 04:59 WaveofShadow wrote: What? If you're both scum then if I were the third scum the absolute last thing I would ever do is be caught trying to push somewhere else. That's terrible. At this point, yes, it would be awful. But when I had started pressuring Req, almost everyone, except for ketchup - who started pressuring Req first - wrote it off as Req being Req. Early in the day, it was not locked in that it would be me and Jeff, there was still plenty of time for things to go other ways, but your thickheadedness the entire day has kept it locked right in place. On October 16 2014 04:46 WaveofShadow wrote: You both need to stop posting defenses and attacks of each other at this point. Right now one of you is dead and we don't know which. If you're town then what you want to do is leave behind something that will help us win the game (because you can still win after you're dead). You have 4h. I absolutely disagree that I should stop defending myself. If I get lynched, when I flip town there is more than enough in my posting history for people to work off of. I will not stop defending myself (and it's hilarious that I have to say this because there have been posts of "soniv isn't defending himself enough"). I have read "if soniv flips scum, then jeff looks bad because soniv avoided him D1". And I have read "if soniv flips town, then jeff looks bad because of the bandwagon on soniv". So why isn't the lynch going on someone who actually has a better chance of flipping scum. On October 16 2014 05:03 WaveofShadow wrote: Soniv did you claim VT? I have claimed nothing. | ||
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On October 16 2014 05:15 WaveofShadow wrote: Do you think the Req wagon was scum trying to deflect and when it didn't gain traction they moved back accordingly? When you say this, are you saying "scum [soniv]" or "scum [team]". If you are saying the former, then disregard. If the latter, then you need to answer what I said before - do you think ketchup is scum then? | ||
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On October 16 2014 05:31 WaveofShadow wrote: It's the latter, and as of now I don't think so. ...what? You're saying the latter, that the scum team was trying to push onto Req, but you don't think ketchup (the only other person pushing with me) is scum. Which would mean you're actually saying the former? | ||
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On October 16 2014 05:35 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm not saying anything, it was a question. It's a question you wanted answers from the thread on, but your question is conflicting. ^ | ||
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On October 16 2014 05:38 WaveofShadow wrote: I know exactly what I asked and why I asked it. mmk... whatever, I'll drop it | ||
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On October 16 2014 06:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Noticed which part? that coma disappeared | ||
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"But Soniv, why didn't you claim earlier?!" I was hoping that I would be able to talk you guys into putting your pitchforks down, and I was still pretty confident I could up until recently. As the Parity Cop, it is imperative that I make it through N2 without being roleblocked or killed. The longer I go without claiming, the longer scum goes without knowing what I am, and I was really hoping I would not have to claim. But for a town that bitched and moaned that Wave was trying to take control at the start of the game, you sure have been happy to let him lead your crosshairs. I crumbed my N1 target, and earlier today I crumbed my intended target tonight. (both parts bolded in the below posts) On October 14 2014 07:50 jcarlsoniv wrote: Y'know, I come out of Alzadar's filter actually thinking he's more townie. There were some posts I remember that I thought were surely scum leaning, that register to me differently this time around. Example: First time around, the first part of the post seemed odd and sheepish to me - reflecting what I said earlier about him saying things to satisfy the thread. But before this post, he put Wave at probably town, and so this reads more as someone who is collaborating with someone he kinda sorta might trust a little bit. Also, the second part exemplifies another quality of his general posting. He's been talking about setup stuff here and there (a fair amount of it earlier on), and usually it's not very productive or helpful and often distracts town. But rereading, he asks coherent questions that apply to the game flow, they show that he's invested in the goings on and is paying attention (despite backwards canadiansgiving). His filter comes off with more of a town vibe than I expected it to. It did remind me of two things as well. 1. The IC claim was at a really weird time. That's right, I'm lookin' at you 6ah. I really hope that confirmation comes through or D2 is going to be very boring lol. 2. I want to take a look at Ket Chup. He's someone who I haven't really noticed even though I know he's been posting quite a bit. He will probably be my next focus. the mistress On October 15 2014 07:20 jcarlsoniv wrote: at least someone is coming to their senses When I think someone is town, I say that they're town. When I think someone is scum, I say that they're scum. There's no use in me stating that I have null reads on all of these scummy as fuck lurkers, just as you do. I have already said that my town reads are you, ketchup, 6ah (obviously), Alaric, and probably Alz. You know my biggest current scum read right now is Req, and somewhat lesser than that is Coma. I thought you were on to something with Asmo until he made his case on me; now I'm not so sure. The rest are a bunch of god damn lurkers that I don't know how to get a read on. I'll probably put my eye to one tonight to try and glean any semblance of usefulness. This whole thread feels like town yelling at each other for the most part while a bunch of people are watching. There's my stupid fucking list post, all of my reads can be found in the thread, as I know for a fact that I've said them all. Speaking of scummy as fuck lurkers...Jeff, where the fuck are you Now, Wave, instead of tunneling me as hard as you did, you probably should have actually read my posts instead of sticking your fingers in your ears and going "LA LA LA YOU'RE SCUM" - you might have noticed what I am. But at this point, you're either retarded or malicious, and I'm honestly leaning towards the former. Either way, you can suck my dick. There are two hours left. Now get your god damn fucking votes off me. | ||
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On October 16 2014 06:57 ketchup wrote: Soniv, I tried. I know you did, and I greatly appreciate it. | ||
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On October 16 2014 06:57 Cixah wrote: Why make your N1 check me then? No brainer. Parity returns "same" or "different". You claimed IC, so come D2, I would 100% know what your alignment was. You actually put me in a really good position. | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:02 Cixah wrote: The only problem I see with this situation is if Scum DO have a roleblocker and Ketchup's post from way back at the start of D2 is true that he got roleblocked. If you claim roleblocked you realize what will happen right? It doesn't fucking matter. I'll either die tonight or I'll be roleblocked. And if neither happens, then I get a check off. I'm now in a fairly helpless position because my hand was forced. | ||
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I would have been in a wonderfully strong spot if I could have convinced you guys not to lynch me. | ||
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no. stop | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:19 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm feeling particularly weak right now. You guys are free to yell at me really loudly for this, but anybody wanna switch to Coma? I was seriously tempted to suggest the same thing. But no. As pissed as I am, I will still not succumb to shanannies. Also, Jeff's casual dismissal and leaving 1.5 hours before deadline really just makes me think he's scum more - I've seen it too many times to ignore it. | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:43 WaveofShadow wrote: How do you figure? Other than you it's just Jeff (who HAS to vote Coma at this point no matter what alignment he is) and Alaric. Even if you don't feel good about Coma coming up last second, you should realize it's not primarily scum-led because ketchup/soniv/I all came up with it independently. There's a reason I decided not to suggest it - it is not a good idea. | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:47 Alzadar wrote: First impression I have to ask, do we just take Soniv's claim at face value? If you were going to fake a Blue claim, Parity Cop is the obvious choice. It's a weird role that's probably not even in the game, you have an excuse for having nothing to show from N1 and nobody else can even confirm it, unlike Medic/Jailkeep where you're told you were protected/roleblocked. lol fuck don't tempt me to shenannie you Alz | ||
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this isn't one | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:54 Alzadar wrote: Even if he is Blue, isn't he essentially demoted to VT now that he's outed? He'll never get another check off, presumably. And? You might not know it from this town, but VTs are still plenty good. Many people argue they are the most important role. | ||
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On October 16 2014 07:59 Alzadar wrote: Soniv was set to be lynched. Let's assume he's Scum. He claims Parity Cop. We believe him, and he saves himself. We don't believe him, and he gets lynched anyway. Nothing lost. The real Parity Cop comes forward, discrediting him. He still gets lynched but he sniffed out a Blue. Better than not claiming. As a scum, there's no reason for him not to claim Parity Cop. I see what people mean about the risk-reward shifting though. I've said my bit. ##Unvote At least now if Soniv spends the rest of eternity bragging about swindling us all with his Parity Cop claim I can say I was somewhat more suspicious than the rest. There are many fewer scum than there are town. Trading 1 for 1 is not in their interest. If someone wants to counter claim me, they are more than welcome to do so. + Show Spoiler + I also really like busdriver. | ||
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##unvote ##vote Alzadar | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:18 mordek wrote: ##Unvote ##Vote Alzadar I'm shaking my head, "I'm looking at you 6uh". Doh. I'm now a lot more aware of what needs to happen in this game. It was subtle. It was meant more to be a bread crumb because I figured there was a chance I would have to claim eventually. I wouldn't expect many people to notice because it was buried, but it was there in case someone did. | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:21 WaveofShadow wrote: 6ah didn't randomly call you scummy. I TAKE (some) CREDIT IF HE FLIPS RED I'm claiming your credit as restitution. | ||
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THE SCUM TOOK IT AND RAN WITH IT jesus wave, you won't even read his posts | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:29 ketchup wrote: Sure you can possibly say mordek and ghandi are leaning scummy, but that's no where near enough votes to secure a vote on you, alzadar. This is a town train yo. choo choo motherfucker | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:31 ketchup wrote: Alzadar, where did you disappear to? R-R-R-RAGE QUIT | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:35 GhandiEAGLE wrote: God Alaric's gonna wake up to a SHITFEST lol LOL sorry alaric | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:37 ketchup wrote: Slip or something else? This doesn't work for me. idk, I'm a bit confused as well but I think he's looking at the entire last couple hours as one event - me claiming, jeff pile up, train of madness | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:46 WaveofShadow wrote: LOL this is way 2 gud. ##unvote I actually think he might be telling the truth because he'd have to be faking believing that I got notification as well. I know ##unvote | ||
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I've already come this far... ##vote Coma | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:51 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Boy I still don't like the feeling of voting Coma I think this is too tunnelvisioned ##Vote: comadose I'm not a fan of it either, but it's reaaalllllllly hard to argue with a medic claim | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:54 mordek wrote: We would also keep the parity cop alive for another check. they can roleblock alz and just shoot me - chances are I'm not getting a check tonight. | ||
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In what way? | ||
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On October 16 2014 08:59 Cixah wrote: h##unvote ##Vote No-lynch ewww ewwwwwwwww 6ah ewwwwwwwwww | ||
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On October 16 2014 09:01 mordek wrote: The observers have to be in stitches right now. they're likely saying derisive comments cuz we're all utter trash | ||
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that was not expected | ||
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On October 16 2014 09:02 mordek wrote: I honestly noticed but decided not to mention it because he was town TT I didn't notice it, but rules is rules. Editing has to be enforced strictly. | ||
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oh fuck every faction could have poisoners?! I feel like there's gonna be a lot of death tonight | ||
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On October 16 2014 09:06 WaveofShadow wrote: So right now we're 7-3. After NKs we're probably 5-3 or 4-3 depending on if scum have KP. Means we must lynch scum tomorrow or we lose. could get lucky and hope Coma poisoned scum On October 16 2014 09:06 Requizen wrote: Hey Soniv, time to put on your Parity Cop pants if I'm reading these rules right. My role works just as any other - I tell dandelion what I'm doing tonight, and the power resolves at day post. If I am roleblocked (or killed, obviously), then I will not have a successful read. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
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On October 16 2014 09:10 Cixah wrote: This game is actually aids. Soniv and Wave pulled some mega shady shit at the end there. Especially with the confirm from lack of "protect" call on wave. I'll be reading but I'm going to take a break and just relax. We'll know in 24 hours what's going on. I, too, am going to be taking a break. Rest assured my zombie friend, I'm the Parity Cop Party Pants pontificating the peoples. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
I am interested in getting input for who people think I should try to Parity Cop Party Pants on the veeeeeeeeeeeeeeery small chance that I get one off. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
-There is an insanely high chance that Alzadar does not make it through this night. However, what Wave said is correct - there really is only one correct scum play right now. Use that to your advantage. -Last night's shanannies felt very town driven. Look at the trains and see if you notice any patterns. -6ah is still the only person that you can 100% trust. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
If 6ah had lied or was roleblocked, it would be safe to say that he would have been lynched D2. I would then see his alignment anyway and my next check would immediately reveal alignment of my 2nd target. If I checked two other targets, I would be able to make inferences based on my reads of either target, but I would not know with 100% certainty. Having 6ah be a control case put me in a really powerful spot moving forward, not that it matters much anymore. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 17 2014 00:33 GhandiEAGLE wrote: Wait, godfathers show up as town? I forgot about that rule x.x So Soniv's parity copping really doesn't show much of anything except a big likelihood of town :/ Correct. That's part of any detective role when they end up picking the GF. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
What I will say for now - the points Req raises are not as bad as you make them out to be Wave. For someone who seriously fucked up D2, you should not get a free pass to: On October 17 2014 01:04 WaveofShadow wrote: Req, flat out ignoring that post. Sorry buddeh. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 17 2014 02:11 Alzadar wrote: I guess he could have been? It's dangerous for me to assume Coma and potential scum Poisoner would think like myself, but why bother killing a vanilla? I think it would be totally feasible that Coma could have poisoned 6ah - 3p love chaos like that and killing the only confirmed townie would help further his own agenda? I'm not sure, but it's very difficult to speculate on potential poison targets. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 17 2014 02:19 GhandiEAGLE wrote: tbh it's a fucking miracle that I'm still alive ._. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://www.quickmeme.com/img/ad/ad9e1b6b98f9aa96d9528f928843fdbe5bbf3be99745a0e0eb8e5d0f6947dc7c.jpg) | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 17 2014 04:17 Alaric wrote: Uh, I'll try. Answer to you: I came to DotA 2 from LoL, I have a itsy-bits of mechanics but other than that wtf is going on in this game guys, it's not what I knew at all. Some sidetracking about a joke/anecdote I ended up not doing. An addition about how I still believe my gut call on Coma was right because in that setup serial poisoner's more dangerous than useful to town (asking confirmation from Soniv or you, but that's the impression I got), plus his play was def. suspicious. Correct. Any KP that is not town controlled is not in town's favor | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:09 Alaric wrote: Tbh I don't really care because of the likeliness of you getting killed/roleblocked tonight. Call me jaded. No, you're right. But I still have to try. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
Tonight is going to be interesting. I am excited. However, I am still unhappy because there is still so much unknown fuckery in this game. Requizen - I hear what you are saying, and you bring up a fair amount of good points about Wave. They're things that I've noticed myself. Let me see if I can explain my thought process about it. Wave was incredibly active and aggressive D1. He generally had a fairly pro-town attitude. He pressured people, he has been VERY present, and there is a lot of content in his filter. So much so, that it makes him unlikely to be scum - scum generally do not put themselves out there so much, it becomes very easy to slip up. However, every once in a while, there were...things that he did that I just could not understand from a town perspective, and you noticed a couple. Weird vote pattern/wasting his vote on Asmo. Tunneling the fuck out of me despite what I thought was actually a fairly good defense. Just dismissing arguments against him. His play really degraded in D2, and it made a disruptive atmosphere. But methinks there's one stipulation: Wave is scum if and only if Alzadar is also scum I know I said I thought Alzadar was town earlier, and I still probably do. But I've noticed weird things with Alz too. He's parroted and generally agreed with most everything Wave has. His tone comes off, idk, softer? more conversational? when he's talking to wave. And then there's the medic claim - this is why they would have to be tied together, and this is also what makes it less likely. It's really hard to contest a medic claim unless you're actually the medic. Scum would know my claim is true, and make a fairly educated guess that there may well not be a medic. It would be incredibly ballsy to fake claim a medic, but if it went badly and someone counter claims, then you found the town medic. If you're going to trade 1 for 1, you want to trade with the medic. And in a town as dysfunctional as ours, that's not the worst move for scum to make. And when the town train of motherfucking justice is barreling into your face, it's probably one of the better moves scum could make. Right after the claim, Wave was the first to remove his vote from Alz, and it was a completely reasonable thing to do, I was shortly after him. A Town!Wave (I like this format Req) would know that an uncontested medic claim is hard to accuse. A Scum!Wave would have pressed harder to kill Alz (assuming Town!Alz, which is why they'd come as a pair). It also feels...a bit too convenient that Wave also happened to be the one that Alz would have protected, and "assumed" that there would be a notification of being protected. Or, y'know, maybe Alzadar really is the medic and all of this is just paranoid babbling. It is still more likely that the scum are hiding in the quiet ones, lurking in the corner with the 3p. It is very rare for me to get a conspiracy theory like this, but the last time I did, I didn't say anything and I was right. If Alzadar lives tonight without some town intervention, then his guilt becomes more likely. If he is the medic, it is unlikely that we would also have a JailKeeper, so no other real means of saving him. We also have absolutely no idea what is going to happen with the poison, so we could be in a better or worse spot than we are now, it's kinda a toss up. There is an ok to fair chance that I won't be alive in the morning. What I have said above is a very real possibility, but it is also a less likely possibility. Occam's Razor and all that. I just wanted to make sure that if things go poorly, this random brain vomit is known. Oh, and Wave... + Show Spoiler [Now we're even.] + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/FKEya0c.jpg) | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
gg town, good luck + Show Spoiler + despite the frustration, I had a blast | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 18 2014 01:48 WaveofShadow wrote: His father is pretty juicy tbh.  | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 22 2014 09:11 Lord Tolkien wrote: Believing a medic claim when he doesn't die the night after claiming is stupid as balls, yes. ^ | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 22 2014 09:16 Alzadar wrote: Fuck the D2 crunch time was so exciting though. Best moment of the game for me at least. I came home and saw Soniv's claim, thought I'd try to see if I could salvage that lynch since I really wanted to get rid of Soniv; I bit off more than I could chew Cixah had a moment of clarity, then I bluffed all your pants off and got mad lucky there wasn't a real Medic. So fun. have to trust a non counter claimed medic, the fact you made it through N2 instead of me should have been huge red flag town, you're retarded | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
killing me instead ended up being the correct play because no one said anything about alz living | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
<3 | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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