|
On June 27 2014 07:49 Tehpoofter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 07:46 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:38 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:00 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 06:54 mtamburini wrote:On June 27 2014 06:43 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:58 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:49 mtamburini wrote: Do you think there was a better chance of jabber getting lynched over your original target meatpudd? Yes. You can see that Nydus was lynched with 3 votes. Jabb got 2. I think the the only reason why jabb wasn't killed was because of this feeling that he would be modkilled anyway, so nobody would change their votes. As my second target would be Nydus, it was ok to me. But I thought on the possibility that he could come and vote on the last moment. He wasn't modkilled after all... I have no problem answering again, I'm just stating that I've already answered somewhere But the vote was so close why not ensure his lynch? Anyone who voted for him could've flipped to someone else with 2 votes and neither of the people on your scum list would've died. I guess you have a point here. It never crossed my mind. But a lynch on Epishade wouldn't bother me, I have a slight scumread on him. I'm actually going to pressure epi and meat d3. Why not pressure them now? Not useful while at night, gotta use some voting. More than that, I'm waiting night consequences to gather enough information to start pressuring. I'd better try to understand the reasons behind the mislynch and filter dive people first and I'm using night for that Fair enough night can be a good time to talk though about things. I am still down to talk. Do you think there was a mafia on the vote for Nydus? If so Whom?
Now that you've asked and I had to put thought on this particular question, I find my reads are weak.
If I stay consistent on my reads, meatpudding and Epishade went on a mafia vote on Teemu, and considering there are 4 mafia, two of Nydus voters are scum.
If I consider that there are 4 mafia in the game and that you may be town, mtamburini and thekingofcolombia are scum.
What do you think of this?
|
On June 27 2014 08:17 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 07:49 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:46 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:38 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:00 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 06:54 mtamburini wrote:On June 27 2014 06:43 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:58 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:49 mtamburini wrote: Do you think there was a better chance of jabber getting lynched over your original target meatpudd? Yes. You can see that Nydus was lynched with 3 votes. Jabb got 2. I think the the only reason why jabb wasn't killed was because of this feeling that he would be modkilled anyway, so nobody would change their votes. As my second target would be Nydus, it was ok to me. But I thought on the possibility that he could come and vote on the last moment. He wasn't modkilled after all... I have no problem answering again, I'm just stating that I've already answered somewhere But the vote was so close why not ensure his lynch? Anyone who voted for him could've flipped to someone else with 2 votes and neither of the people on your scum list would've died. I guess you have a point here. It never crossed my mind. But a lynch on Epishade wouldn't bother me, I have a slight scumread on him. I'm actually going to pressure epi and meat d3. Why not pressure them now? Not useful while at night, gotta use some voting. More than that, I'm waiting night consequences to gather enough information to start pressuring. I'd better try to understand the reasons behind the mislynch and filter dive people first and I'm using night for that Fair enough night can be a good time to talk though about things. I am still down to talk. Do you think there was a mafia on the vote for Nydus? If so Whom? Now that you've asked and I had to put thought on this particular question, I find my reads are weak. If I stay consistent on my reads, meatpudding and Epishade went on a mafia vote on Teemu, and considering there are 4 mafia, two of Nydus voters are scum. If I consider that there are 4 mafia in the game and that you may be town, mtamburini and thekingofcolombia are scum. What do you think of this?
UNLESS jabb is scum. Then there will be only one scum voter on Nydus. Which actually looks more plausible to me.
Townies, participating is crucial to win by now. If mafia get a kill now, there will be only 6 of us and probably 4 mafia. Easy prey to mafia. So we need to discuss A LOT to get the next lynch right
|
On June 27 2014 08:28 Tehpoofter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 08:17 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:49 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:46 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:38 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:00 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 06:54 mtamburini wrote:On June 27 2014 06:43 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:58 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:49 mtamburini wrote: Do you think there was a better chance of jabber getting lynched over your original target meatpudd? Yes. You can see that Nydus was lynched with 3 votes. Jabb got 2. I think the the only reason why jabb wasn't killed was because of this feeling that he would be modkilled anyway, so nobody would change their votes. As my second target would be Nydus, it was ok to me. But I thought on the possibility that he could come and vote on the last moment. He wasn't modkilled after all... I have no problem answering again, I'm just stating that I've already answered somewhere But the vote was so close why not ensure his lynch? Anyone who voted for him could've flipped to someone else with 2 votes and neither of the people on your scum list would've died. I guess you have a point here. It never crossed my mind. But a lynch on Epishade wouldn't bother me, I have a slight scumread on him. I'm actually going to pressure epi and meat d3. Why not pressure them now? Not useful while at night, gotta use some voting. More than that, I'm waiting night consequences to gather enough information to start pressuring. I'd better try to understand the reasons behind the mislynch and filter dive people first and I'm using night for that Fair enough night can be a good time to talk though about things. I am still down to talk. Do you think there was a mafia on the vote for Nydus? If so Whom? Now that you've asked and I had to put thought on this particular question, I find my reads are weak. If I stay consistent on my reads, meatpudding and Epishade went on a mafia vote on Teemu, and considering there are 4 mafia, two of Nydus voters are scum. If I consider that there are 4 mafia in the game and that you may be town, mtamburini and thekingofcolombia are scum. What do you think of this? There is 4 mafia?
I'm assuming there are 4 mafia for the roles on the OP
|
On June 27 2014 08:31 Tehpoofter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 08:17 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:49 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:46 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 07:38 Tehpoofter wrote:On June 27 2014 07:00 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 06:54 mtamburini wrote:On June 27 2014 06:43 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:58 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 05:49 mtamburini wrote: Do you think there was a better chance of jabber getting lynched over your original target meatpudd? Yes. You can see that Nydus was lynched with 3 votes. Jabb got 2. I think the the only reason why jabb wasn't killed was because of this feeling that he would be modkilled anyway, so nobody would change their votes. As my second target would be Nydus, it was ok to me. But I thought on the possibility that he could come and vote on the last moment. He wasn't modkilled after all... I have no problem answering again, I'm just stating that I've already answered somewhere But the vote was so close why not ensure his lynch? Anyone who voted for him could've flipped to someone else with 2 votes and neither of the people on your scum list would've died. I guess you have a point here. It never crossed my mind. But a lynch on Epishade wouldn't bother me, I have a slight scumread on him. I'm actually going to pressure epi and meat d3. Why not pressure them now? Not useful while at night, gotta use some voting. More than that, I'm waiting night consequences to gather enough information to start pressuring. I'd better try to understand the reasons behind the mislynch and filter dive people first and I'm using night for that Fair enough night can be a good time to talk though about things. I am still down to talk. Do you think there was a mafia on the vote for Nydus? If so Whom? Now that you've asked and I had to put thought on this particular question, I find my reads are weak. If I stay consistent on my reads, meatpudding and Epishade went on a mafia vote on Teemu, and considering there are 4 mafia, two of Nydus voters are scum. If I consider that there are 4 mafia in the game and that you may be town, mtamburini and thekingofcolombia are scum. What do you think of this? I think that the likelyhood of all the mafia being on 2 seperate votes to be unlikely. I imagine if they know mislynches are a bout they spread. I need to read EoD though stupid work is busy so I'm not able to just chill out and read for like an hour or 2 I need.
This would mean some town reads of mine would be scums. Could you filter dive Hobbitus when you've got the time? I like your opinions.
|
On June 27 2014 10:38 The_Templar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 10:28 Hobbitus wrote: Well something he did during the MM/mp lynch fight struck me as scummy but I put it in the back of my mind bc I was reading him as super town at the time. Let me find the posts.
But not only that, after everyone initially townread him, he got really quiet for a while. His number of posts is decent, but... he really doesn't say too much that isn't either an obvious defense (like defending me when I clearly said one thing and Haru was pushing as another) or posts to appease anyone who says anything negative about him. Now obviously town doesn't want to be seen as scum but the WAY he does it shouts "I want no confrontation." Most of my style is "I want no confrontation". I'm terrible at arguing in general, so I try to push people without getting into a huge argument so that I can actually keep my head in the game. I don't see why this is a huge problem.
Admitting this makes me worried. There's a huge problem in this. That's what I wanted to know about Hobbitus when I asked poof filtering him, but it turns out that it came out as a read on you. Gonna filter dive you after dinner.
|
Can you please update your list you've sent to tehpoofter? Or only post your top town and top scum reads ATM.
Teemursu meatpudding
I'm filter diving a lot and it is exhausting. Jesus.
|
On June 27 2014 11:43 GlowingBear wrote: Can you please update your list you've sent to tehpoofter? Or only post your top town and top scum reads ATM.
Teemursu meatpudding
I'm filter diving a lot and it is exhausting. Jesus.
Please do as I say before night ends, please
|
I'm having a feeling that I'm dying this night. So, I would like to share thoughts in case I don't live.
I've being filter diving a lot this night and was waiting for the night results. While filter diving, an idea crossed my mind. We've been discussing how contradictory some players were looking and we were judging their alignment solely on that. What happened? 4 townies died. Of course, 1 modkill and 1 nightkill. But still, ALL OF THEM were contradictory. Which means that being contradictory isn't necessary a scum signal. It may help identify one, but it's secondary. If we've lost so many by attacking their contradictory posts, what do we have here? A very consistent Mafia, that is. A Mafia who is well connected and using the information they have to lead the mislynches. To find the Mafia in this game we must not search for people being inconsistent in their posts. We have to search for people that are not compromising themselves in their votes, in their analysis. People that are not raising flags but following town misreads so they will win a mislynch. They contribute for the mislynch but they do not compromise themselves by doing so.
There are some who are doing this. In order of my suspicions, The_Templar, Epishade, Hobbitus, Teemu, Haru. (Have in my this takes off my scumread on meatpudding). I think The_Templar is the one shines the most here, IMO. If you filter dive through his filters, he is not starting pushes to force town agenda. He is actually following these misleads. It started with meatpudding, then he found a better vote on MysteryMeat1. Next, he went to jabber when he completely acted contradictory (easy vote, everybody was voting on contradictory people). If you are not sure what I am talking about, dive through his filters. You will see his passivity (is this a word?) then his easy votes. Have in mind that this interpretation implies that Mafia really did split their votes on Day2 so Nydus would be an easy kill. One last thing: dive through scott's short filter and compare to mtamburini's. I haven't done this but I think this is important, it might give some clues on his alignment. I hope this help townies on D3! I probably had more to say but it's getting close to the deadline and I don't think I have more time to "evolve" my logic. PS: I've asked a list on top scum and top town so it might give me an insight on who are the Mason Couple, but I have failed to do so =/ PS: I'm not sure if this is obvious or not, but this is my first Mafia game ever, so this insight came to me... PS3: FORGOT TO CHECK KOTC FILTERS PLEASE DO SO.
|
|
##Vote: The_Templar
I'm so going after you, man.
|
On June 27 2014 21:56 The_Templar wrote: Beginning wake-up processes… Nice wagon between you two btw, reading the rest of the posts
I'm not starting a wagon, in starting a crusade.
I and Hobbitus had similar behaviours. It means nothing, only a slight suggestion we have the same alignment. I invite everyone to read through my last night post and judge if I don't have fair reasoning.
|
On June 27 2014 22:38 The_Templar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 22:29 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 21:56 The_Templar wrote: Beginning wake-up processes… Nice wagon between you two btw, reading the rest of the posts I'm not starting a wagon, in starting a crusade. I and Hobbitus had similar behaviours. It means nothing, only a slight suggestion we have the same alignment. I invite everyone to read through my last night post and judge if I don't have fair reasoning. "Crusade"? Seriously…?
Pun wasn't intended :/
|
On June 27 2014 23:00 HaruRH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 12:59 GlowingBear wrote: I'm having a feeling that I'm dying this night. So, I would like to share thoughts in case I don't live.
I've being filter diving a lot this night and was waiting for the night results. While filter diving, an idea crossed my mind. We've been discussing how contradictory some players were looking and we were judging their alignment solely on that. What happened? 4 townies died. Of course, 1 modkill and 1 nightkill. But still, ALL OF THEM were contradictory. Which means that being contradictory isn't necessary a scum signal. It may help identify one, but it's secondary. If we've lost so many by attacking their contradictory posts, what do we have here? A very consistent Mafia, that is. A Mafia who is well connected and using the information they have to lead the mislynches. To find the Mafia in this game we must not search for people being inconsistent in their posts. We have to search for people that are not compromising themselves in their votes, in their analysis. People that are not raising flags but following town misreads so they will win a mislynch. They contribute for the mislynch but they do not compromise themselves by doing so.
There are some who are doing this. In order of my suspicions, The_Templar, Epishade, Hobbitus, Teemu, Haru. (Have in my this takes off my scumread on meatpudding). I think The_Templar is the one shines the most here, IMO. If you filter dive through his filters, he is not starting pushes to force town agenda. He is actually following these misleads. It started with meatpudding, then he found a better vote on MysteryMeat1. Next, he went to jabber when he completely acted contradictory (easy vote, everybody was voting on contradictory people). If you are not sure what I am talking about, dive through his filters. You will see his passivity (is this a word?) then his easy votes. Have in mind that this interpretation implies that Mafia really did split their votes on Day2 so Nydus would be an easy kill. One last thing: dive through scott's short filter and compare to mtamburini's. I haven't done this but I think this is important, it might give some clues on his alignment. I hope this help townies on D3! I probably had more to say but it's getting close to the deadline and I don't think I have more time to "evolve" my logic. PS: I've asked a list on top scum and top town so it might give me an insight on who are the Mason Couple, but I have failed to do so =/ PS: I'm not sure if this is obvious or not, but this is my first Mafia game ever, so this insight came to me... PS3: FORGOT TO CHECK KOTC FILTERS PLEASE DO SO.
I lost you there. So mafias are consistent? Towns are inconsistent? You're flipping all the knowledge I ever had of mafia. Also, passivity is not a good case for scum. much like I can call you out for being inconsistent with your reads. 'he is not starting pushes to force town agenda. He is actually following these misleads'. you're doing the same till d3. So can I lynch you based on that?
Mafia does not want do draw attention. They will try to look productive but actually they are just trying to not be compromised. What I'm trying to say in the bolded part is that townies are so lost in this game here that they start being inconsistent in their reads. Townies are looking at a poor reasoning and assuming that it's a mafia thing, which may be, but it's secondary. It came to me that it is not the best way to catch mafia, as we can see by the results. The key to catch mafia is understanding their behaviour on not wanting to get lynch more than trying to find scum. And I found this pattern while interpreting Templar's post.
That night post my have came poorly worded because I wrote it on rush in case I was the victim.
And I don't believe I've being doing the same. I've being reasoning my votes ever since the beginning, not simply following. Filter dive me and compare it to templar's.
If you still believe that I'm behaving just as templar's, then stick your vote on whichever you find most likely. Just have in mind that looking for contradictions on people's posts led us to 2 mislynches.
|
On June 27 2014 23:14 HaruRH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 22:29 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 21:56 The_Templar wrote: Beginning wake-up processes… Nice wagon between you two btw, reading the rest of the posts I'm not starting a wagon, in starting a crusade. I and Hobbitus had similar behaviours. It means nothing, only a slight suggestion we have the same alignment. I invite everyone to read through my last night post and judge if I don't have fair reasoning. so Templar's 'no confrontation' behaviour was scummy, but your 'push Templar with different reasons but tried to link them' behaviour isn't scummy?
Didn't understand your question. Are your asking if my push on him is scummy?
|
On June 27 2014 23:09 HaruRH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2014 10:56 GlowingBear wrote:On June 26 2014 10:44 TheKingOfTheCats wrote:On June 26 2014 10:09 TheKingOfTheCats wrote:On June 26 2014 09:33 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 26 2014 09:18 The_Templar wrote:K, wrote a case in about 7 minutes on jabberzerg. Looking at his very thin filter, I now have a very scummy read on him. On June 23 2014 04:01 jabberwockzerg wrote: Hey guys, I'm out for most of the day, but I'll try to keep up on my phone, and I'll be home for the last three hours or so to read through all the filters and make my final vote. I just want to make a quick vote now in case something happens I won't get modkilled. ##Vote: meatpudding This isn't particularly scummy. Not all of us have hours upon hours to post in this thread and he could have been later, and votes aren't permanent. I think his vote on meatpudding was a bit questionable since he seems to have had a town read on him but he was probably following the general trend of the town (I think there were 4 votes at that point, but it could be 3) due to lack of time. That could be a newbie fear of wanting to not look suspicious after being gone for ~6 hours and following town. But, is he really going to play an entire game of mafia without having any time? Please. In the battle of the meats, he takes a neutral stance immediately: On June 23 2014 10:53 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 23 2014 10:48 meatpudding wrote: Back. I'e reading the thread now. If you're voting Mystery or me, then I don't really have a choice anyway. But I'll flesh out my reads anyway. I'm very interested in what you have to say, I'm undecided about which meat to vote for, and you posting at all is a good sign And then when I make a point about MM not posting, he jumps on it and says he's suspecting him more. On June 23 2014 11:10 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 23 2014 10:57 The_Templar wrote: Wow, is MysteryMeat not defending himself at all right now? Wtf? He even told Scott to fight to the end if he was town... Wow interesting. I'd really love to hear a lot from both the meats, but right now the strongest case is MM And then: On June 23 2014 11:58 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 23 2014 11:56 MysteryMeat1 wrote: im not going to share my thought process on one person. deal with it... You might not like how I'm gonna deal with it ##Vote: MysteryMeat1 HAHA so cliche Day 2: On June 25 2014 12:41 jabberwockzerg wrote: I am not a girl Really? The day is half over and you feel the need to make that your first post of the day? He continues to be as neutral as possible until he can latch onto an opinion. On June 25 2014 13:00 jabberwockzerg wrote: I think Nydus's GB vote is interesting. For me it just boils down to whether or not we believe his pressure explanation. I'm not sure I do, but maybe some video mafia players can explain if that sort of play is common over there. "I don't know, but someone who does stuff that I've never done will figure it out for me". On June 25 2014 13:48 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 25 2014 13:37 TheKingOfTheCats wrote: Teemursu, could you lay out your case against meatpudding in full without quoting posts where you've already explained why you're voting for him? As far as i can tell your case against him is mostly based around you not liking his OMGUS of you (although the point you raised about him townreading me and scumreading Haru for basically doing the same thing is interesting) and i really need to hear the case put forward in a different way so i can better understand it. I'd love to see this as well On June 26 2014 08:30 jabberwockzerg wrote:I'm liking this Nydus vote. His random pressure vote just seems a little off to me Not that pressure votes are scummy, but it's better to be clear with the town that that is what your doing, and On June 25 2014 11:28 NydusHerMain wrote: ##Vote: GlowingBear
towny feel isn't good enough for me, clearly mafia "isn't good enough for me, clearly mafia" Basically he's just agreeing with people without offering an opinion at this point. On June 26 2014 09:09 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 26 2014 09:06 Epishade wrote:@Cats, My recent interactions with him, and his replies to me where he dismisses everything I say as wifom is one thing. I replied back here. On June 26 2014 06:48 Epishade wrote:On June 26 2014 06:23 Teemursu wrote: [quote] [quote]
[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
[quote]
All of this is irrelevant non-content WIFOM.
Are you serious? You actually think all of the townreading that Nydus has been doing to me is irrelevant and wifom? Why even bother thinking about anything in this game then, since surely if thinking about how logical plays work and how you would expect others to act is wifom, then everything else is then, right? We should just not even bother trying to read people, since everything everyone says and does is wifom, right? On June 26 2014 06:23 Teemursu wrote: I am not accusing both of you as mafia in association nor have my suspicions been conditional on either one of your alignments.
On June 25 2014 20:08 Teemursu wrote:I actually rescind about making a case on MeatPudding. I feel like I've gone against him the strongest, and I've had multiple posts where I've discussed with him/haven't voted on him. If people aren't convinced by my push on him, then I'm going to divert my attention to someone else. We obviously haven't hit on mafia yet and there still are others alive who town would rather lynch. I think Nydus actually might be mafia. His read on Epishade is very weak. I asked him to provide examples on Epishade and give reasoning on those examples (yes, in plural). So far the reason Nydus has called him top town is that he's been "objective" and that Epishade posts a wishy washy list of conditional scum/flip logic that doesn't really mean anything. Only because people have pushed on someone, and that person flips as either alignment, doesn't clear or put people who actively pushed that person under suspicion. I just played a video mafia game where a VT pushed a ML on Day 1 and I caught two of the three mafia by looking at how they supported the person who was the most active pusher. Nydus should be a way better player and recognise to that Epishade's contribution today does in fact NOT put him as "top town" for his "objectiveness". This takes me to a second possible mafia, Epishade.[quote] [quote] Firstly, he wants to vote between two people who have gone the hardest against each other (ignoring MM1 vs. Tolkien and Cats). He says he doesn't have a clear preference, then he says he wants to vote on me. He seems to understand I post a lot, he doesn't refer to anything specific that I've posted about. I took this to mean you were connecting me as potential mafia scum with Nydus, as you said this takes me, referring to your previous argument about Nydus and his views about me. I thought you were drawing a connection between us two as scum by doing that, which is why I assumed you thought we both were scum. Teemursu was on Token's scumlist, which is my personal opinion as a contributing factor to why Token died. I think Teemursu's being incredibly nitpicky against meatpudding too, trying to scumread him for trivial details in meatpudding's posts. That to me is a little scummy. On June 23 2014 22:02 Teemursu wrote:On June 23 2014 21:56 meatpudding wrote:
I was going through KotC's posts when the lynch was taking place. I kind of couldn't make up my mind, even after MM flipped.
I was not happy to vote for MM, because the case against him didn't convince me completely. His own reactions caused a lot of suspicion. though.I can't call Cats or Tolkien scum based on that alone.
Right now my thoughts are Teemu - potential scum Tolkien - potential scum Cats - fence Templar - town
Odd. It feels like you're hiding something and not wanting to make up your mind about someone.
You say you can't call Tolkien scum based on that, but you agree with me on Tolkien being scum, and you put him into your potential scum list? Just what is this supposed to mean, anyways? You think him not finding something alignment indicative (him saying he can't find Cats or Token scum based on something) means he's hiding something? It's not just against meatpudding though. Here Teemursu agrees with Poof that because I didn't have hard reads on people and labeled them as "townlean" instead of town that that somehow makes me scummy... On June 25 2014 07:28 Teemursu wrote:On June 25 2014 07:21 Tehpoofter wrote: [quote]
"Scum lean" "Town lean" sounds so passive. If someone wants some homework go look at this guys previous newbie game he was town in. I feel like if you're going to call someone mafia you should say scum. The whole "lean" thing sounds like you don't want to make enemies or leaving your options open.
(Just to clarify I didn't read your spoilers yet as I'm not caught up so the content might change how I feel but first impression gets a big scummy MEH) This is one of the reasons why I have been reading him as "trying hard to sound towny". IMHO, He's continued the same kind of way of talking by switching on the MM1 bandwagon by calling MeatPudding a misguided townie, while MeatPudding has in my opinion had even more bad & inconsistent logic. It's Teemursu's incredible nitpickyness that I find to be a trait of scum. I will say that my early read on Teemursu was based on some of his word choice, too though. So call me a hypocrite if you must or feel free to point out the contradiction. That's just how I feel. Ok, you know what. I'm just sick of writing so much and reading through filters. I have no idea how accurate my reads are and it sucks to know that all this could very likely end up untrue, which I'm sure it might be. Fuck it, I'm voting for JabberZerg. I can't tell who to vote for anymore and she's been flying under the radar for too long now. ##Vote: JabberZergBuahahahahaha!!!! sdea fgsdafn jd still not a girl Is that really important? How about you focus on the issue? ##Unvote ##Vote: jabberwockzergOut of time but after this next WCS series I'll write something up on Epishade, who's acting sort of strangely, and Nydus, who is… improving a bit maybe? Not sure… I've been noncommittal and shitty and lurky Can't seem to focus on this game as much as I should be. wouldn't fault anyone for voting me BUT there is so little information to be gained from my flip that it will be more useful to leave me kicking around for at least another day and see what happens from there I'll try harder, stop daydrinking, etc. If you're scum i don't care how little information we get from lynching you. Convince us not to vote for you now, don't just say "Yeah guys i'll start doing stuff after flip...promise" You can start by posting what info, according to you, we would get from your flip and then you can answer this: On June 26 2014 09:01 TheKingOfTheCats wrote:On June 26 2014 08:55 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 26 2014 08:49 TheKingOfTheCats wrote:On June 22 2014 16:20 jabberwockzerg wrote: yeah, pudding's a townlean I'd be most comfortable with a tolkien vote, but I want him to read my post about scott and react to it, defend his wagon. I'll agree with a fence on KittyCats, he's asking questions, but I'm noticing a lack of content. On June 23 2014 10:53 jabberwockzerg wrote:On June 23 2014 10:48 meatpudding wrote: Back. I'e reading the thread now. If you're voting Mystery or me, then I don't really have a choice anyway. But I'll flesh out my reads anyway. I'm very interested in what you have to say, I'm undecided about which meat to vote for, and you posting at all is a good sign Why was pudding a townlean for you at the time and what led you to change your mind and think that he might be a good lynch at the end of the day? It was his silence after coming under heavy suspicion So him possibly being away from his computer and not being able to respond to the things being said against him immediately was what led you to disregard your townread of him and seriously consider his lynch? Was there anything else he did at the time that struck you as scummy? Also: On June 26 2014 08:43 TheKingOfTheCats wrote:On June 26 2014 08:30 jabberwockzerg wrote:I'm liking this Nydus vote. His random pressure vote just seems a little off to me Not that pressure votes are scummy, but it's better to be clear with the town that that is what your doing, and On June 25 2014 11:28 NydusHerMain wrote: ##Vote: GlowingBear
towny feel isn't good enough for me, clearly mafia "isn't good enough for me, clearly mafia" I want you to give a more detailed reason than that to jump on the Nydus wagon. Saying what he's doing isn't necessarily scummy but voting for him because it seemed "off" isn't good enough. Jabber your silence after coming under heavy suspicion is incredibly scummy, in fact i think it's enough to sway my vote. ##Vote: Jabberwockzerg Phew. Too much confusion. Now that I believe we could be in a town VS town scenario, and after jabb tried to "hide" on my argument that flips are really important... I'm definitive now. ##Unvote ##Vote: Jabberwockzerg Also, I don't see why you scumread Templar when you did the exact same thing. You did not change wagons even after you saw the arguments for a nydus lynch and a epi lynch. Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 12:59 GlowingBear wrote: 4 townies died. Of course, 1 modkill and 1 nightkill. But still, ALL OF THEM were contradictory. Which means that being contradictory isn't necessary a scum signal. It may help identify one, but it's secondary. If we've lost so many by attacking their contradictory posts, what do we have here? A very consistent Mafia, that is. A Mafia who is well connected and using the information they have to lead the mislynches. To find the Mafia in this game we must not search for people being inconsistent in their posts. We have to search for people that are not compromising themselves in their votes, in their analysis. People that are not raising flags but following town misreads so they will win a mislynch. They contribute for the mislynch but they do not compromise themselves by doing so.
Nope. Was kotc contradictory? Was nydus contradictory? (If yes, in what sense?) The only contradictory lynch that could have happened d2 was epi's lynch. but it did not follow through. So you can identify that mafia was the people who started and led the mislynches. Give me a list of people who started the mislynches.
I've said they don't compromise themselves, they follow the mislynches. I'm not saying that mafia is starting those mislynches, I'm saying the mafia is identifying these mislynches and are following them.
I'll expand what I wrote at the end of N1 as soon as I get to my pc so I can clarify it better
|
On June 27 2014 23:29 HaruRH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 23:26 GlowingBear wrote:On June 27 2014 23:00 HaruRH wrote:On June 27 2014 12:59 GlowingBear wrote: I'm having a feeling that I'm dying this night. So, I would like to share thoughts in case I don't live.
I've being filter diving a lot this night and was waiting for the night results. While filter diving, an idea crossed my mind. We've been discussing how contradictory some players were looking and we were judging their alignment solely on that. What happened? 4 townies died. Of course, 1 modkill and 1 nightkill. But still, ALL OF THEM were contradictory. Which means that being contradictory isn't necessary a scum signal. It may help identify one, but it's secondary. If we've lost so many by attacking their contradictory posts, what do we have here? A very consistent Mafia, that is. A Mafia who is well connected and using the information they have to lead the mislynches. To find the Mafia in this game we must not search for people being inconsistent in their posts. We have to search for people that are not compromising themselves in their votes, in their analysis. People that are not raising flags but following town misreads so they will win a mislynch. They contribute for the mislynch but they do not compromise themselves by doing so.
There are some who are doing this. In order of my suspicions, The_Templar, Epishade, Hobbitus, Teemu, Haru. (Have in my this takes off my scumread on meatpudding). I think The_Templar is the one shines the most here, IMO. If you filter dive through his filters, he is not starting pushes to force town agenda. He is actually following these misleads. It started with meatpudding, then he found a better vote on MysteryMeat1. Next, he went to jabber when he completely acted contradictory (easy vote, everybody was voting on contradictory people). If you are not sure what I am talking about, dive through his filters. You will see his passivity (is this a word?) then his easy votes. Have in mind that this interpretation implies that Mafia really did split their votes on Day2 so Nydus would be an easy kill. One last thing: dive through scott's short filter and compare to mtamburini's. I haven't done this but I think this is important, it might give some clues on his alignment. I hope this help townies on D3! I probably had more to say but it's getting close to the deadline and I don't think I have more time to "evolve" my logic. PS: I've asked a list on top scum and top town so it might give me an insight on who are the Mason Couple, but I have failed to do so =/ PS: I'm not sure if this is obvious or not, but this is my first Mafia game ever, so this insight came to me... PS3: FORGOT TO CHECK KOTC FILTERS PLEASE DO SO.
I lost you there. So mafias are consistent? Towns are inconsistent? You're flipping all the knowledge I ever had of mafia. Also, passivity is not a good case for scum. much like I can call you out for being inconsistent with your reads. 'he is not starting pushes to force town agenda. He is actually following these misleads'. you're doing the same till d3. So can I lynch you based on that? Mafia does not want do draw attention. They will try to look productive but actually they are just trying to not be compromised. What I'm trying to say in the bolded part is that townies are so lost in this game here that they start being inconsistent in their reads. Townies are looking at a poor reasoning and assuming that it's a mafia thing, which may be, but it's secondary. It came to me that it is not the best way to catch mafia, as we can see by the results. The key to catch mafia is understanding their behaviour on not wanting to get lynch more than trying to find scum. And I found this pattern while interpreting Templar's post. That night post my have came poorly worded because I wrote it on rush in case I was the victim. And I don't believe I've being doing the same. I've being reasoning my votes ever since the beginning, not simply following. Filter dive me and compare it to templar's. If you still believe that I'm behaving just as templar's, then stick your vote on whichever you find most likely. Just have in mind that looking for contradictions on people's posts led us to 2 mislynches. Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 23:09 HaruRH wrote: Nope. Was kotc contradictory? Was nydus contradictory? (If yes, in what sense?) The only contradictory lynch that could have happened d2 was epi's lynch. but it did not follow through. Why are you trying to persuade me that ML is due to contradictions in posts? Are you opening some sort of way for scum to post contradictions and not get called out for bad logic? 1 bad lynch only, MM, which at most clears meatpudding since both of them makes bucketloads of contradictions.
You are focusing the wrong part of my post, intentionally or not. I've said that contradictions are secondary. We first have to find people who are just trying too hard to not compromise themselves so they won't be a lynch focus by town. That is the objective of mafia at day time after all, isn't it? I'm not admitting that contradictions aren't scummy. I'm admitting that contradictions are not the best signals to better identify a mafia.
Nydus was contradictory, I had a contradictory idea on kotc. Again, once I get to my pc, I'll Filter dive them and give you a better answer
|
I've made my reasonings throughout my posts, I've got only the conclusions on the posts I wrote. Anyway, even if my posts are looking like Templar's, I still believe this is a better method of catching scum than just looking after contradictions solely.
I'm going home and make a extended post about what I'm talking about, with quotes. It will take several hours...
|
EBWOP: I've got only the conclusions on the posts I vote.
|
I find weird that Teemu and Epishade completely ignored Hobbitus/Haru/my posts.
I'll be writing my night post extension. Got sick yesterday and now I was just watching Brazil Vs Chile.
|
Wow, I'm impressed at how my nightpost was misinterpreted, intentionally or not. This is probably my main post so, please, take a while to read it. I'm formatting it like Haru's because it makes easier to read
1) MAFIA'S MINDSET It sounded obvious on my night post, even Templar said so. It's so obvious that people forget to think about it. What I tried to show is that there is a basic scum mindset. They are thinking "I can not be lynched" [/b]. Town's mindset, on the other hand, is "I have to lynch mafia" Yeah, it's obvious, but it is the starting point while hunting scums. Who is acting like they are trying not to be caught and who is acting like they are trying to catch someone? This is the first point you have to have in mind.
What is a common consequence of the mindset of "I don't want to be caught"? (i) Passivity: because being aggressive draws attention and drawing attention isn't a good thing for someone who does not want to be caught (ii) Contradictions: trying to manipulate town will make scum disregard readings and just try to make people jump on a wagon heading to a mislynch.
By playing this first game of mine, I've been realising that we are focusing on the consequences and not on the foundations of the mindset, who could give us a better clue on who Mafia is. Moreover, we are focusing on a secondary consequence, which are the contradictions. Next item will cover it.
2) MAFIA'S INFORMATION ADVANTAGE (AND WHY CONTRADICTIONS ARE SECONDARY) Against townies, mafia have an information advantage of knowing who is town and who is Mafia. "Oh, this is obvious". Of course it is. But what is the consequence of this? The consequence is that controlling contradictions is MUCH EASIER when you have this kind of information advantage. When you're town, you have no idea who Mafia is. You may have a clue on who is Mafia on day1, and this opinion may change completely on day 2, because you don't have this information advantage, you just have posts to analyse.
Mafia does have this advantage and it's easier for them to stick voting on a mislynch since the beginning. They know who they are and they know who are green. Being consistent as mafia is MUCH EASIER than being consistent as town for that sole reason.
That's why focusing contradictions while scumhunting is NOT THE BEST CHOICE and the mislynches we had just proves this. We have to find a different method and I sugget another, which is having the obvious mafia mindset in min while analysing posts.
3) ON ME AND HOBBITUS HAVING THE SAME INSIGHT If you check the timing, we have posted almost exactly at the same time. There wasn't one guy starting a trend and one following it. We came to the same conclusion and posted before night ended. As I am town, I also read him as town since we had the same insight and were afraid of not being possible to share it in case of a nightkill. As we've posted almost at the same time, it's impossible that we have a mafia AND a scum who is trying to follow someone's wrong theory. So the only possible interpretations are we are 2 mafia trying to deceive or we are two townies that had the same insight.
4) ON MAFIA'S NIGHTKILLS (with a little bit of WIFOM) We may have to consider now that we have no vigilantes. Therefore, those two nightkills were Mafia's. Now, have in mind this: if you were Mafia, who would you kill? I have in mind that, with only that information, people with most townie reads and that has being useful to townie. But, if you were Mafia and would've being townread the entire game, who would you kill? I have the idea that I would kill people on the fence so I could stay being townread and interact with other townies, blending with them.
I AM NOT SAYING THAT IT IS THE CASE IN THIS GAME. I'm saying that we may have to consider that our top townies MAY BE SCUMS.
OBS: MY CASE ON TEMPLAR I chose templar because of the above mentioned. I was filter diving everybody and his posts looked very passive, not to mention his strange votes. I was pretty sure after I survived N2. But now, after diving through his filter again, and after his answers to my strong pressure, I'm am not so sure, although it's my best guess atm. My second person in the list is Epishade. I'll filter dive people again and interpret their posts after I answer questions addressed to me. Then I'll do a hard push again.
|
|
|
|