EPTCell Mini Mafia - Page 116
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
Im getting ahead of myself though, if steve is scum he is pushing for a highly volatile lynch that could backfire on him, for the sake of a townie whose up for lynch today (basically he is forfeiting this cell to make ours a coinflip, when hes already won it via a no lynch) so I am assuming inspite of holy and his crap that Rayn is scum / : which makes this in particular post quite interesting. Game cracking in fact. Okay guys i am soon off for most likely for the rest of the phase. My suggestion for group order: First three groups in whatever order: (my group, geripts group, slamdunk) Last 2 groups in whatever order: (HF/Plammer - i would suggest HF first) I know Palmar is not gonna like this most likely but i think we don't need to play after D3 anyways so... I'll be here for another hour and i am not sure if Koshi is gonna come back. I don't care who is mayor but that's my suggestion. Lemme know what you guys think. ~rayn (Take note of the bolded for later, it'll seem quite funny then). This was the order Rayn proposed before he left and came back to Koshi's order. It's actually quite fishy / :. Now seems like a good time to go over the 2 clashing town philosophies that have been at play this game regarding the cell order. 1: The fastest victory possible: This is achieved by putting the group with the clearest townies forward. This also has the advantage of leaving the hardest groups for last, so that the most information is at their disposal. 2: Keeping the best townies for last: The Notion that if you lynch the clearly townie groups first and your wrong, then those townies are gone and can no longer sway the game. Rayn comes to a sort of weird compromise of these ideas with his selection, He puts his group at the head, despite the fact that he is not really certain at this time whose scum between me and steve. there was something gumshoe said. he said "it's cheating if i am town but if i am scum it's not" - sounds scummy. a bit earlier he said this on Steve Just going to say this is really mafia-esque thinking. Whats more, Koshi was of two minds as well. Heres a fairly fresh mafia list of his. Koshi says: Steveling (only trying to win his group currently) alakaslam (trust rayn) geript (imo not good reads, cav shares them and I don't understand why) Coag (Other 2 town) Make HF his group last. On me. gumshoe. Why are you playing this lazy? So much happened. And because you (dis)agree with 1 read a guy flops town (scum) ? dafuq? There is so much turmoil in this group, it is the heart of this game and opinions could not be more divided on it. Yet...Rayn puts it first? Why? It fits neither town order mentality, in terms of 1) it is still a tossup and possible mislynch according to rayn and Koshi themselves and in terms of 2) it immediately removes Rayn and to a lesser degree steve and me, players who have all been active and fairly useful. Overall this group choice is just extremely confusing. The next two groups arent as much bad as they are odd. I dont think there was much consensus on what to do with Geript and Slam's groups. In fact the least amount of discussion has been spent on these two, question, how is Rayn not certain about his own group(the one hes supposed to read best), but has a perfect read on the two most obscure groups of the game? Especially when hes been iffy on Geript all game long -_- ( in fact he really seems to treat him as a dumb townie, not scum,) And speaking of reads geript. You have one scumread (me) and one townread (gumshoe). Both of the reads are based on bad reasoning. Apparently you have a scumread on prplhz (noone knows why). Do you really think it's fair for you to call prplhz out for not having any reads? Because to be honest you don't have many reads and the few you have are based on bad reasoning. Geript can you now finally tell us why you think prplhz is mafia? I'll go through everything with Koshi tomorrow. I think we have a lot of shit on the table already as we are only 24h into the game. geript i try to explain my read on prplhz for the last time and if you are town you gotta stop this shit and start paying attention. Until tomorrow i'm off. (fun fact, it seems Rayn's main issue with Geript is that he reads Prplz as scum, I get the sense that if Geript was willing to lynch Ceph... perhaps Rayn would be more than willing to follow through with that XD) As for Slam, I suggest we lynch Cell 4 first. Alakaslam is mafia. You can take this as a fact regardless of my & geript's alignment because we are clearly not both mafia, if one of us is mafia they are bussing because we know how the other one reads Slam and if we are both town the read is genuine either way. If there is one thing i agree with geript it's that Slam is scum. Take a good long look at this, this right here is the shittiest argument Rayn has made all game long. He is suggesting that because they cant both be mafia and they both find slam scum, Slam is therefore scum. Umm what if one of you is scum and the other is wrong on Slam? Heres are some other brilliant arguments on why Slam is scum. Not happy. Happy Slam is town, sad Slam is mafia. Slam is the easiest player on planet to read based on tone. Does his tone look like his town game? I find it REALLY HARD to believe you jsut gnore this juicy way of making reads here where it actually would matter. I have one nice thing i wanna try: Alakaslam, are you mafia? i promise you all geript is mafia. i promise you all slam is mafia. Stevelings and gentlemens, I present to you, Rayn's 100 percent scum reads... Now, as for the 4 and fifth slot! We have Holy and Palmers groups. Rayn confidently read Palmer and Holy as town. Palmar is quite obviously town. I am good at reading him. As scum he does not read the thread, he just doesn't give a fuck about properly reading the thread. He sticks to his policies (lynch lurkers, lynch liars, etc etc..) and makes weak cases. He does not think about motivation behind what people say. mderg. But we'll see him posting more. I have a townread on Holyflare and i am a bit unsure of poofer. I don't see anything particularly scummy from him but i don't know what Koshi is up to or we are not 100% on the same page with him on poofer. I tried to poke Koshi about it in our QT but he is at work so we'll talk more about it tonight. There is wide consensus that Holy and Palmar are town and that coag and Mdern are pretty scummy, making these two probably the easiest groups to pass, so why is it that Rayns order puts us in a position where we can lose before we hit the groups that are most clear? His slam and geript reads are very personal and not too well regarded, his own cell is in utter chaos and would benefit immensely from certain flips, yet he puts that one first? The clearest two last? What is going on here? He cant even claim to want them around till the end cause they're good, because hes trying to eliminate himself right away and his goal is to win in the first three days... The sad truth is, there is a third motivation at play. If scum were somehow able to gain control of the order, what would they want? Nothing less than what town does, to end the game in three days. In fact they would want it more, because that would reduce the amount of information town has for crucial lynches, which would happen sooner. So scum would likely try to make sure the groups that they are confident can win go first. Thats why Palmar and Holy were to go last, because they immediately turn their respective cells into an extremely risky proposition for scum. In other words if Rayn is scum he is trying to win the game without ever dealing with the two most town favoured cells. Palmers cell especially because Rayn wanted him to go last, (probably because Coag is scum and has good odds of bieng lynched, which is why we should stick to Coag today). Alot more info can be derived from purely this bit, but I feel I've covered the important stuff, so next up... I know what your all thinking "gumshoe! this is fine and all, actually scratch that, this is not fine at all, your full of shit! As per usual! Why are you giving us even more meta garbage? You've already provided more than enough of that! Dammit, why cant we just lynch you today T_T" Actually, I have proof : D Koshi, what did you piuck? Who is mayor? Holyflare did you do this? ~rayn KOSHI WHAT THE FUCK?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!"!"µl,öfedklögfdbhgfd f7ucking fuck you fuck,öfges fuck you koshi you fuck For the past day or so, we've all obsessed over wether or not his scum claim was for real, but we've been looking at the wrong portion of his explosion, why does Rayn detonate like this when he sees the new order? Lets compare the two shall we? Rayn Gum Steve Geript prplz cephiro slam balla lsb Holy mdern tehpoofter Palmar coag sentinel vs Palmar coag centinel Geript prplz cephiro Rayn gum steve Holy mdern tehpoofter Slam balla LSB Two notable changes standout here, the first, is that rayns group is now third, therefore it is more likely to get the info it needs to lynch effectively. I dont think Rayn would be THAT bothered about that though. The second more notable change, is that palmar and slam where swapped... remember what Rayns primary preference was? First three groups in whatever order: (my group, geripts group, slamdunk) Lets assume your scum Rayn, if your plan was to take out these three groups first and avoid holy and palmar all together, would that plot not be utterly ruined? If Palmar wins his group as scum seem to suspect he will, that guarantees that we go to Holys group... another cell town is likely to win! If your town Rayn, what are you mad about? All thats changed is you get to play longer and Slam is a bit out of reach, and you can still totally win on 3 or 4 provided you make the right read / : theres scum in every cell after all. The new order is clearly a marked improvement and manages to balance out the two town order sentiments rather well. Rayn and holy are around till day 3-4, so there wisdom remains for awhile, but at the same time you can count on their cells certainly coming up (as well as Palmers, who is first because thats when he claims hes at his best). On the other hand, the scum advantage is now utterly ruined, Palmar and as a result probally Holy's cells are likely to come up. Thereby ruining scums best shot at winning this game. TLDR Rayn made an order that could benefit scum (if hes scum) and is silly if hes town, when that order was changed to work better for town, but in exchange completely trashed that potential scum advantage, Rayn became livid and possibly launched a volley of crazy bullshit to throw us off the relevant portion of his anger. So what can we can take from this? Rayn was banking on his own cell, slams and geripts, to win the game. So those people are probally town / : and those we were likely to lynch in holy and Palmers cells are likely scum. So yeah, lets just kill Coag XD if hes actually scum this will come into play again later, but thats the first step for now. There is of course one issue with all this. Why did Koshi defy Rayn? Whose to say, maybe he felt itd be a bit to on the nose, fearing they might get immediately lynched / : maybe they werent communicating properly? Seemed like they missed eachother alot. Whatever Koshi's motive was, it doesn't change how scummy Rayns out burst was, not because he was mad , but because of what he was mad at. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
Reading now. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 06 2014 03:52 Steveling wrote: Woah, I thought you drowned in the fountain of knowledge. Good to know you are safe. Reading now. I did, Gum the shoe is dead, I am Gum the white! I have come back to you at the turning of the tides : D | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
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Coagulation
United States9633 Posts
On April 06 2014 03:11 Steveling wrote: Can you guys leave your last reads on other cells at least? Come on coag, help town. yeah sure ill leave reads. Hold on let me just read these 116 pages first. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 06 2014 04:02 prplhz wrote: gumshoe bullshitting at 120% Do you just sit there waiting for someone to call you out XD my god its uncanny. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
On April 06 2014 04:02 prplhz wrote: gumshoe bullshitting at 120% gotta admit, he at least gets a massive amount of style points. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 06 2014 04:07 Palmar wrote: Also did sentinel just check out when it started looking like a coag lynch? I think it's alot easier for him to just check out than say you / : because when the choice is between a try hard Palmar and Coag... glhf. But yeah wouldn't mind hearing some of his last will and testament. | ||
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
Because that thought about koshi messing with the cell order and then ryan being mad about it is actually legit. But... this is just your fantasy. This is what your argument boils down into On April 06 2014 03:50 gumshoe wrote: Lets assume your scum Rayn, if your plan was to take out these three groups first and avoid holy and palmar all together, would that plot not be utterly ruined? If it comes down to it, with the way you played this game, I'll take HF's and Palmar's word over yours. Because that's what you are saying, you are asking for a vote of confidence in your hypothesis. You haven't earned it, sorry. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On April 06 2014 04:38 Steveling wrote: Alright gum, I read it very carefully. Because that thought about koshi messing with the cell order and then ryan being mad about it is actually legit. But... this is just your fantasy. This is what your argument boils down into If it comes down to it, with the way you played this game, I'll take HF's and Palmar's word over yours. Because that's what you are saying, you are asking for a vote of confidence in your hypothesis. You haven't earned it, sorry. Judge the argument on its own merit, in that first game we played, It was only at the end that I figured things out / : and of course, by that point no one listened to me. Earned, townie, scummie, bad, sloppy, in the end there is only wrong or right. The winners and the losers. So Don't ignore a convincing argument on my behalf XD Also if we're both town, then my argument is effectively true ( because rayns scum and wanted this order and was mad to not get it) / : you know what you are, Ive stated my reasons for believing in you, so the question stands, would I go so far Steve? Would I spend hours writing this case? Would I swear on my life? Rayns not around anymore, this isn't a you or me Scenario we can work together ) :. Also what I say isn't neccecairely contradicting palmar, and I'm upset you value holys word over mine, considering he doesn't give a shit about this game ) : like, there's a 50 percent chance I'm town to you, which means there's a 50 percent shot I've been right about a lot and that theres has been an active effort to discredit me ( which is likely cause 33 percent of us are scum) why are you so reluctant to consider what's so obvious? | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
Or rather, I may sheep if I find their filters towny. HF is green for me and Palmar is the least scummier in his cell. That's according to my own opinion on them. You on the other hand are scummy. Raynkoshi as I said made sense except 2 instances, the oath and the modkill. I considered them as scum after that but your play is so scummy that you turned me over again, lol. I simply value their word more in this game. On April 06 2014 05:02 gumshoe wrote: Also if we're both town, then my argument is effectively true ( because rayns scum Again, this is not an argument, this is a guess. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
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