On February 18 2014 12:42 jaybrundage wrote:
there is some amazing stuff in here

PromethelaxPerson was signed in when posted
02-14-2014
03:07 AM ET (US)
I am your personal cheerleader.

Suki suki she's our (wo)man
If she can't do it no one can
Woooo
Wooo
[i did not sport well in school, I have no idea what cheerleaders actually say]

Hehe I love that he posted what I was saying in the obs thread to suki during that time

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 03:53 GMT

#1983

Jay it's been a week since I was totes JAY SCUM TUNNEL OF JUSTICE but let me think what sticks out to me the most...

Your over-eagerness to push a case on Koshi seemed out of character for you and you kept on exaggerating how scummy Koshi looked (and eventually pulled Balla in and called them a scum team). It was hard to believe that you seriously thought that this was true and felt too forced. So really at the beginning it was a total gut feeling thing.

Later on, there were several things that I noticed that just felt off to me...

1. You saying you would scum hunt at the beginning, post a giant case on koshi, and then for the rest of the day you barely pushed anyone.
2. You weren't pressuring people, asking them questions etc.
3. You seemed much more defensive. I'm wondering if being blue this game changed your outlook to care more about survival because I had this meta read on you that if you were town you wouldn't care about people's cases on you and would just counter-pressure.

Probably those were the biggest things. If it's any consolation to you, I'm actually really really good at pushing lynches against blue roles when I'm town -_-;

If you could comment on these points I'd really like to hear your thoughts because I want to improve and not push bad tunnels in the future.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 03:54 GMT

#1984

Well Jay actually thought he was blue last game too, so there's that.

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 03:56 GMT

#1985

Ah that's true.

Just a lot of the things that Jay was doing was different from last game, and when I asked myself 'Why is it different?' it was really hard to think that he had consciously made this change as an improvement to his town game. That's why I was so vehement on lynching him.

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 03:59 GMT

#1986

On February 18 2014 12:40 Balla24 wrote:

Show nested quote +

I think this explains it:

"Ah. My notes from my previous game say:

"If I roll town, be more decisive. Push harder. Try not to be so wishy washy and careless."

What that translates to for me is I will be tunneling people and really trying to push their buttons, even if my case isn't the best.

In my previous game I also played a bit too careless because I wasn't worried about getting killed (since I was just a VT). I need to tighten up my game a bit more. " -suki

Yes, this was what I had in mind.

However I did not mean that I was going to tunnel someone into the ground without justification. I really did feel like Jay (and LoneMeow on Day 3) were scum and so I was playing my hardest to convince town and justify and provide reads. I was really trying my best.

One of the big differences in this game compared to the others is that I actually did have scum reads and wasn't completely lost with seeing everyone as town. Having actual reads really contributed to my attitude and behaviour this game in comparison to our previous games.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:01 GMT

#1987

My biggest problem with your push on jay from what I remember was that you were pushing only based on the first few hours of the game. You disregarded my whole interaction with him where we fleshed out why we were misunderstanding each other and he started to rescind his scum read of me and Koshi.

On top of that you never really tried to see what it would be like from his perspective. Koshi and I both jumped on him over VERY little to garner a reaction, and koshi antagonized him A LOT. There was some serious emotional reactions within that time.

Beyond that, I thought your push on him was good. It sure pressured him a lot. You clearly thought he was scum. It was good. Dunno why people gave you so much shit for it haha.

gonzaw

Uruguay4911 Posts

February 18 2014 04:04 GMT

#1988

On February 18 2014 13:01 Balla24 wrote:
Beyond that, I thought your push on him was good. It sure pressured him a lot. You clearly thought he was scum. It was good. Dunno why people gave you so much shit for it haha.

Sorry, but you don't cross jayjay and live to tell it...

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:05 GMT

#1989

Yeah see I don't care about people's defenses. I think scum can easily WIFOM their way out of bad situations.

I was looking at jay's contributions to the thread and his attitude more than anything else.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:05 GMT

#1990

And to be honest: Jay was being unrealistic and somewhat scummy in regards to your push on him. He didn't really try to do anything that would dispel your scumread of him. For example, when you called him out for saying koshi was scum and then completely dropping it. He should have given reasoning there but he didn't. The OMGUS for "misrepresenting" what he was saying even though it wasnt really misrepresenting was really bad too.

Jay wasn't helping his case.

Honestly if I didn't have such a strong scumread on jonny I felt like hopping on at some points. The meta case was convincing etc and he was making me mad but jonny was pretty obv scum to me and there were even more scummy people above him like alakaslam.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:06 GMT

#1991

On February 18 2014 13:05 suki wrote:
Yeah see I don't care about people's defenses. I think scum can easily WIFOM their way out of bad situations.

I was looking at jay's contributions to the thread and his attitude more than anything else.

This is really untrue for you actually and really only true for this situation.

Look at NMM1 and the last iteration of this. You DID care about people's defenses. Hell you jumped around like a crazy person.

The difference here is jay never really DEFENDED himself against you, and never really provided a good scum read of his own for you to reason with.

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:08 GMT

#1992

Also I hated that blue claim and the follow up 'hypothetical' post on Day 3.

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:08 GMT

#1993

Hmmmmm..

I didn't care about his defenses against your guys pressure? But he didn't really do anything to address the points that I was bringing up myself.

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:10 GMT

#1994

I jumped around like a crazy person in NMM1 because they were refuting MY cases and MY pressure.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:10 GMT

#1995

Yep that was my point ^_^

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:11 GMT

#1996

but not everything revolves around your cases... how would you feel if you just got pressured like crazy 1 hr into game by 3/4 townies and 1 scum and then when you finally start to come into your own you start getting pressured by another townie.... that shit is draining

i'd see you pressuring me and be like NAHHHHHHHHH

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:12 GMT

#1997

Ah I guess.

I mean, I totally was ready to back off of Jay but he never gave me any reason to.

In Day 3 I jumped on Jay with what I thought was a slam dunk case and when he replied with such great reasoning I backed off instantly right? Day 1 I would have been the same if Jay had only responded the way I felt he would respond if he were town.

Obviously there's an element of ego and an element of 'this is the way the game should be played' but that's how this game is played :o

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:12 GMT

#1998

Would you be like NAHHHHHH I'm going to OMGUS that person and not provide any more reads and pretty much look like I don't care about the game?

that's the attitude I felt.

Balla24

2322 Posts

February 18 2014 04:13 GMT

#1999

oh when you posted your d3 case on jay's claim I was like OHHH SHIT SUKI JUST FUCKING CRUSHED THIS NERD

suki

Canada1159 Posts

February 18 2014 04:14 GMT

#2000

And hell, I HAVE been in a situation where literally everybody was on my case for the whole game so I DO know what it feels like