EPTI think you can establish yourself as town pretty clearly early on.
Its all about direction and conversing with people and pointing out things others agree with.
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
I think you can establish yourself as town pretty clearly early on. Its all about direction and conversing with people and pointing out things others agree with. | ||
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JarJarDrinks
United States1302 Posts
Being a dick to every one that won't listen to you is pretty terrible and can only hurt the town. EVEN IF YOU WERE CORRECT IN WHAT YOU WERE SAYING. But that fact that you were so completely wrong and still acted like such a douche is just ridiculous. The reason people weren't listing is because your case wasn't good. And faking a redcheck on a townie and then getting all pissed when the town lynches scum instead just puts you in another stratosphere of awfulness. To reiterate: You got pissed off that town lynched scum instead of your scumread WHO WAS TOWN!!! I think people would be hard-pressed to find a worse game played by a townie. I can't believe you're actually trying to defend your play by blaming other people. | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
@Onegu Before you call me a dick for the way I treated you this game, I yet again implore you to look at things through my eyes. You played super scummy the entire game. You put almost zero effort into the thread unless your were being attacked directly. You never tried to find scum outside of your terrible cases that were illogical and not very well reasoned. Why was I scum based only on things from D1? You basically brought all of the same arguments back and failed to look at anything else I had done this game. You went on and basically said all of the same things that I had said trying to get your lynch "Corazon is 100% scum" blah blah blah You even made a point against me where you tried to make 2 hours equal 11 hours. It was fucking pathetic and your failure to establish your townieness yet again was a major factor in the reason the town lost. Do you understand this? We spent 3 days talking about you because the town refused to lynch you but you never took any attempts to seriously scum hunt or establish your townieness. You just tunneled me and dicked around for 3 days. As someone who puts massive effort into their games, it annoys me when I see someone not care and ruin it for everyone else. And that is why I'm mad at you. This isn't the third grade. You don't get a medal just for participating. Your play is open to just as much criticism as mine. If you can't handle it, don't play this game. | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
I did not receive one single response to my case like this. So it wasn't a bad case then. Don't give me that hindsight bias bullshit JJD | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
Whilst I am happy that we both progressed from the newbies together: There will be nothing left of an already tarnished reputation if you continue to reply to this. Mafia is a game. Most of us probably don't know each other // let alone talk to each other outside this medium. I don't see what you are trying to achieve by asking others to look through your eyes. If you ever play another game of mafia: the goal is to lynch scum, not town. There is nothing you can say to justify your position on Onegu; and even if you were right about one thing - the game is still recorded as a loss on the TL database. As an aside: I am pretty sour about this affecting my W-L ratio, but watevz. Happens to everyone I suppose. | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
My case was good it's the fact that Onegu just happened to be really scummy as VT | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
The fact is, he was tunnelled and largely incorrect. This is not an unusual thing, and does not mean he "didn't care". | ||
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Bereft
United States1007 Posts
and lol mocsta policy lynching...if there's one thing I learn from this game it's that even if you are policy lynching NEVER ADMIT IT. because everyone winds up thinking you're scummy for it. better just to lie and say I 100% think he's scum than I 80% think he's scum and 20% want him gone. maybe it's just this game but by saying the latter, no one cared about that 80% and people ended up focusing too much on the 20%... | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 03 2013 23:43 cDgCorazon wrote: "Hey Cora, your case is wrong because this this and this" I did not receive one single response to my case like this. So it wasn't a bad case then. Don't give me that hindsight bias bullshit JJD I think it was specified by several people at the time that they thought the case held some merit; however, Onegu is a contentious read in general. Just because a case is deemed "good" doesn't make it right. Several agreed with my jampidampi case. Chezinu flipped town. I'm not crying about it. I find personally on TeamLiquid: Though some people have dislikes, in general: if you play good, people will praise you. If you play shit, people will call you out. You're not getting praise because you didn't play good. I even told you on the game, we only lynched HF because mafia bussed. They could have forced a no-lynch and the game would still be over simply because *YOU* refused to not vote Onegu. You ruined any chance we had of winning -- and i nailed the whole team when we could still win. I'm not asking for praise. Cop the loss on the chin and move on. - Preferably to another forum, because I meant it when I said i wont play with you again. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
On December 03 2013 23:52 cDgCorazon wrote: Onegu had 3 pages of filter before I called him scum. That tell is null Marv So the fuck what? Onegu tried all game long and you're ranting at him for not caring about shit. Guess what, his cases were wrong and he was tunnelled. Guess what, SO WAS YOURS. On December 03 2013 23:37 cDgCorazon wrote: You just tunneled me and dicked around for 3 days. As someone who puts massive effort into their games, it annoys me when I see someone not care and ruin it for everyone else. And that is why I'm mad at you. This isn't the third grade. You don't get a medal just for participating. Your play is open to just as much criticism as mine. If you can't handle it, don't play this game. This is just so disgusting for a post-game post. So unbelievably disgusting. Replace every "you" with "Cora" and you have an accurate representation of what happened this game. | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 03 2013 23:50 Bereft wrote: and lol mocsta policy lynching...if there's one thing I learn from this game it's that even if you are policy lynching NEVER ADMIT IT. because everyone winds up thinking you're scummy for it. better just to lie and say I 100% think he's scum than I 80% think he's scum and 20% want him gone. maybe it's just this game but by saying the latter, no one cared about that 80% and people ended up focusing too much on the 20%...  Yes, that is a big take-away. To be frank, in my 20 games that was the first policy lynch I had ever seen go through. Can I nominate Rayn for that? lol | ||
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iamperfection
United States9639 Posts
On December 03 2013 23:52 cDgCorazon wrote: Onegu had 3 pages of filter before I called him scum. That tell is null Marv you cant be serious On November 20 2013 20:28 Onegu wrote: Reans first post into the thread and it just fakes activity. He doesnt say what he agrees with and there are multiple things to agree with, does he agree with all or only some he, never actually says what points he agrees with. This is a very scummy first post. Also if mocsta didnt retract his post limit on himself I was going to call him scum, but he did and I am ok with it for now. I do want to point out he only takes it after cora points out his spam. But unlike cora I thought it was scummy, because it was a easy way to avoid conversation. The was one more post from mocsta I didnt like will find it in moment it was post 4or 5 where he gives 3 scum reads with no reason and then says half the thread hasnt posted so his reads can change. Coras case on Sciberia is terribad and scummy. Anyway rean is really scumm though. Sorry Im at the mall but when I am home I will catchup on both of my games and be up late playing. Ill be checking in periodicly while Im at the mall though. On November 21 2013 03:37 Onegu wrote: Aqua is thinking the same way I do. I like this. He is a lot more polite about his suspicions/prodding though. This resposne is really bad as once again it completely ignores the content I posted about those players. Maybe I'm wrong, but at this stage of the game it illicits a response regardless. Horse blinkers like these are not a good sign this early on. Personal heuristic but I find early game its only scum that use phrases like this. "I think we're actually doing quite well so far" How the heck does town have a guage on what is good/bad when only 50% of the players have participated. Bereft is either comfortable distancing team mates, or is town. - I am not familiar enough with his meta to make an opinion yet. I like that he picks up on this stuff to corazon that I already identified earlier. Still null. I dunno, this is just too haste from Corazon. Everyone knows he is "sensitive" and prone to OMGUS so it does dilute the read a touch, however, I can't keep getting over this is scum-to-scum interaction. "You're grasping at straws" + "you are looking pretty scummy" are strong words and stances, yet, does it really read like Corazon is *trying* to get Sciberbia lynched? I dont sense congruence here. Again, scum-to-scum interactions I think... - I like the way Aquanim is prodding Rean. This post is null to me. Corazon reads very emotional so its hard to understand motive. Bereft is starting to look better as is reading the actual content behind the queries. Rean does the same. - I entirely agreed with Thrawn vote at that time Excellent post from Aquanim. If hes scum, hes playing a great game because hes asking the questions that are in my head as Im reading it. That is very hard to do as scum. I think this is a scum-slip. Corazon is too assertive in his read and this goes beyond emotion. When I read this, I take it as someone who is speaking "matter of fact". This is enough for me to be 90% confident that both Sciberbia and Corazon are scum. There is no way that enough content has been delivered in this thread for a town person to jump to such a strong conclusion as this. Event hough I think Sciberbia is scummy, I do think he came in here with the intention to troll like this. I was just posting a theory. The question is fair, however, in context of thread events this is aterrible post. Corazon is slamming into Sciberbia, and this is what Sciberbia thinks is relevant to discuss? WTF? This post does not align with his strong opinion in the previous post. Im starting to sound tunneled because I am now so so so certain Corazon and Sciberbia are scum. I am not a fan of Aquanim for this interpretation however, I also know he is more calculated than I am so can accept a town Aquanim may play out the thread like this. Im going to go null but will be curious how Aquanim chooses to interpret this massive post and my conclusions. More generics from Corazon. Importantly, he just called Sciberbia scum last page and now is acting as if nothing happened. Deffo scum Again, he also dodges the shit-ball fight of Corazon. Some may argue that is towny to avoid this and not shit the thread. However, the key differentiator I find is that if town choose that approach they would also ACKNOWLEDGE the existence of the read. Sciberbia just dodges it and hopes no one brings it up further. Very bad. This guy is interesting. As scum I think I would phrase things similar to this guy because there is always an 'out'. I think in this instance, this is a townie with an opinion speaking naturally and as the thought comes to his mind. Can evaluate him more if the flips on Corazon/Sciberbia go awry - which I doubt. In short I am very comfortable to lynch Corazon and Sciberbia. I would lynch Corazon because him trying to wriggle out of it will be more fun/alignment-revealing in my opinion. ##Vote: cDgCorazon and to answer your question, I would shoot Sciberbia as he is the other half. Im going to go over your reads here and just ask you how you came to these because alot were null to me or the exact opposite of what you wrote so lets go. 1 hes trying to be clever there is nothing to be overdone and there is no way a troll post like this can be scummy, fuck the police was already taken... 2 why cant sciberia find the repeat and calling of you obv town scummy, but your troll post null as it was the first post in the thread? You getting that it is scum-scum interaction I dont understand how you get that read from this post. 3 how is this agressive, you put a pregame post restriction, then start the game numbering your posts, seems like you are going to keep your post restriction up. Calling you out for it isnt agressive its correct when all your first few posts are trolling. 4 this is fine 5 he made a troll response how is that overcompensated? Doesnt make sense and him not thinking the same as you is a scum read? 6 the first part of this is correct that post was null, the second part you can only get so much info from the first page and alot of page one was trolling. Telling someone to keep looking isnt scummy, its not damage control. 7 How is this a scumslip, 2 different people thought you were masons, I know you kinda think they are both scum at this point, but when you drop lines about being connected with thrawn people might think you are masoned, no way this is a scumslip. 8 again not a scumslip 9 reans first post is uber scummy. It fakes agreeing with coras null post, and then says nothing and there is no way he thinks he is saying something meaningful. 10 iirc you had already said you werent masons so he says the only other option how is that townie? 12 meh ok 12b also fine 13 you do the samething later on when you talking about haveing such a good town atmospher so how can you give him scum points for this? 14 syas nothing why you post this, I dont know his meta so this poat means nothing... 15 still dont know how you are seeing scum scum intreactions here. Maybe you are just tunneled at this point. Also at this point you say you like aqua calling out rean. 16 again why post a completely null post? 17 This is fine, but you are like he agrees with me that mean hes awesome town 18 this has been talked about already, why are you so tunneled on scum-scum here doesnt make since. 19 the post is good that means the timeing is fine also, even if I am argueing with someone and I see something that needs questioned I will question it reguardless of what else is going on 20 admit to being tunneled 21 this is fine 22 tunneled 23 meh no point in continueing on with cora, him moveing on is fine and how he did it was fine. 24 really wishywashy post but also slightly dinstanceing himself from rean while giveing him a town read at the same time. I think this is really scummy from you mocsta. Your thoughts on rean is just really odd. On November 22 2013 04:33 Onegu wrote: Ok here we go. My notes on everyone. Thrawn1221 + Show Spoiler + Null first troll post Cora vote was really wierd same with his unvote Dont like his trolly interaction with mocsta but its null Case on Aqua is better, he also follows it up later with questions. His response to JJD about cora I liked alot giving his thought process on the event Votes rean with no reason Points out coras lie isnt alignment indicative which I agree Points on LM and Jamp are good but in the case of LM thats how he always plays. Then changes LM thoughts saying it doesnt mean much and talks about him being replaced- town points Can understand his rayn vote, bjt think je is wrong Rean + Show Spoiler + First post comes into thread saying he agrees with cora but never actually says what he agrees with-very scummy Doesnt answer questions veey clearly Makes a terrible post on me being scum but not likeing my wagon Either evades questions or only responds exactly what was asked doesnt volenteer any info When responding to the wishy washy post he made being called out gives another wishy washy post saying Im very scummy but I could just be stupid, then says I am a distraction. Says if Aqua flips town Im a good lynch the next day. How are me and Aqua connected how am I not a good lynch reguardless of aquas flip Scummy JarJarDrinks + Show Spoiler + Agree with almost all of his thoughts, we think almost the same things Defends me to sciberia Calls out rayns bad case on aqua Tunnels onto rayn and is fairly open to why he is doing so CDgCorazon + Show Spoiler + Didnt like his thing on sciberia and the mason thing, sci could have just not refreshed Says rean is scummy and the points on him are valid but he shouldnt be voted-scum points Agrees that my posts dont care how they are precieved but still has a scumread on me Calls bereft out for calling out rayn for sleeping, but bereft doesnt call rayn scummy in that post just asks him a question. Doesnt read carefully thinking I made a case on him when it was a case on mocsta so obviously he didnt read all. Despite this I cannot shake the feeling he is town Bereft + Show Spoiler + Calls out mocsta for troll posts, first to do so. Rean vote is ok, reasons arent great, better reasons other people are voteing him but meh Makes a unreadable post with one of his scum reads then votes him after. Also doesnt read my post clearly thinking its a cora case, even though he claims to have read my filter. His reads are ok. thoughts on why rayn is scum but dont agree. Also rayn useing bullshit alot isnt alignment indicative for him Rayn + Show Spoiler + Calls out posts not needed to be called out like aqua not voteing his top scum read Rayn calling me scum but not looking at past mini games, his meta reads on me are so bad Doesnt look like he believes his case on aqua, harping the same point over and over when that point isnt scummy The post where rayn calls out aqua for his spicydinosaur post was really good Then he somewhat defemds me, but uses correct meta Calls out sciberia, I like this post as town, Calls out bereft also like but I disagree Disagree with almost all of his reads, but post where he calls out mocsta for my meta was good Post on if him and Jamp are both scum then lynch jamp first is actually townie for rayn, but not anyone else Calls out mocsta for the cora vote to consolidate as its townie post town points Unless is trying to do what I did in WC as scum which I dont see he really is town Rayn saying those are scumclaims, wrong, but from a town rayn Mocsta+ Show Spoiler + Puts a post restriction on himself then procedes to troll the first multiple posts. Gives three people scum reads on first page then says until other half of thread posts scummy Takes away post restriction after cora calls himoit, but why keep it going in the first place looks like he planned on really doing it otherwise number posts His thread recap his reads are the almost exact opposite of how I read the thread His meta analysis of me is best I have seen, he is aware that I adapt my scum games to change my meta to compensate dor how I habe been playing town His post on you should make a case then leve it alone was really scummy Randomly flips his read on me but its for a BS reason as the reason he gives I am perfectly capable of doing as scum Not sure how he thinks my atk on marv could be different if I was scum this game and atkd him His post calling out cora for not voteing is so scummy saying reans flip is so much better than anyome elses even if he is town Wild theroy post so baddddddd Dont like his atk on rayn. Aquanim+ Show Spoiler + Slightly scummy first post with bad follow up But calling out rean early and often to answer questions is nice His post on people that are voteing for him I like his thought process here alot. No problem with his voteing his second stromgest scumread and his explination is fine also Gives good responses to questions asked to him and volenteeres extra info LM\HF lurk replace out then no posts no reads or notes other than null for LM Sciberia+ Show Spoiler + Makes a case on me when everyone elae was calling me scummy but not doing anything about it \townie His defense of aquas spicydino post looks bad His tunnel on me still looks good though Calls out Reans wishy washy post on me being scummy but not likeing my wagon\ town poimts Continues to call me scum even though thread thoughts habe somewhat changed and everything going on around him\ townie His case on mocsta is ok but not greadt Jamp + Show Spoiler + Not much sticks out early to get a good read He questions rayn about him changeing his reads, but that is what rayn does until he finds a tunnel target Calls out aqua for failing at reading, and for aqua thinking about his image, and this is dumb because aqua announces it in thread about his image and that is how some townies play its not alignmemt indicative But his continued assult on aqua and not much else is slightly null. Then talks to rayn about voteing aqua. Want to see something other than aqua now Anyway mocsta is my biggest scumread now. Also Rayn is a terrible lynch today please change, ill try to be up for deadline but no promises. Anyway its 2:30am and typeing all that up on a tablet is difficult. ##VOTE:Mocsta @Rayn stop marytring and come back and push your reads. Those posts were all in his first two pages of filter. his effort was fine. In fact it he had some of the most effort put into the game | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
I would love to know in general why all the town thought it was scummy to have a post restriction and then remove it. Lol.. like its null .. but if you really wanted to stretch the alignment-boundaries, its definitely townier to remove it. Scum should be happy to use it as a fallback to lurking. | ||
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Aquanim
Australia2849 Posts
On December 04 2013 00:11 Mocsta wrote: Seeing that last post of Onegu again. I would love to know in general why all the town thought it was scummy to have a post restriction and then remove it. Lol.. like its null .. but if you really wanted to stretch the alignment-boundaries, its definitely townier to remove it. Scum should be happy to use it as a fallback to lurking. After your first couple of posts in quick succession it was an object of some amusement to me to guess how soon you were going to ditch the idea... but I basically ignored it in terms of your alignment. | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
On December 04 2013 00:11 Mocsta wrote: Seeing that last post of Onegu again. I would love to know in general why all the town thought it was scummy to have a post restriction and then remove it. Lol.. like its null .. but if you really wanted to stretch the alignment-boundaries, its definitely townier to remove it. Scum should be happy to use it as a fallback to lurking. that was one of the reasons I decided you were town... or at least why i didn't think you were scum. early on, I thought that "if mocsta keeps to his post restriction and it causes him to be unproductive at a critical time for town, then he's scum" | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Red Team's Prize Keirathi coached me in-game a bit. The major concept was that if I had a scum read, I should interact with them as much as possible to help confirm or deny my read. He didn't have to tell me to hold the conversation in a gentlemanly (friendly) way because I don't fancy myself a super rage-y player, but I think that might be a good take-away for some here. Contrast that with my more recent game, Witchcraft II where I just tossed out (incorrect) reads and shouted to people in general and you've figured out 1) that I'm getting worse at playing, not better and 2) that ego is the fall of town (ie I called Mocsta's hubris in Smurf his downfall and failed to learn from it myself) | ||
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