heavenz post was 'this is what I think and why' and then 'why' is really iffy, but at least he's willing to tell us what he thinks.
Infii, you didn't really address much current in your post, but I'll give you time.
Don’t you think the effect of a lynch threat will be reduced when you always have someone voted? If you want other players to know who you are targetting just write it in this thread for everyone to see.
I obviously do not, but I don't want to bother with this discussion.
I like killerdog for town for being very forthcoming with everything, and I'm waiting on Ray to tell us his reads.
Lonemeow is doing a lot of asking questions, (which I am a fan of), he addresses the lurker thing which I am 100% on board with, but you'll notice he hasn't given opinions on anyone but Holyflare/me and phar (who only posted a useless one liner).
gonna go full lonemeow style; Lonemeow, Why have you only commented on Holyflare and me? (and phar, with his one liner)
Holyflare, stop justifying your viewpoint. I've decided to drop the subject, I think it's ridiculous, I think it's pro-scum, but I'm not going to talk about it anymore for the sake of talking about it. We've moved on from talking about things for the sake of talking about things and into talking about things for the sake of finding scum. last I've heard, finding scum is not done through policy discussion. If it were done through policy discussion, the policy that was pro-scum is the scum poster, so that'd implicate you! Which is why it isn't done through policy, because it's possible you're just mistaken.
Ray, I messed up there :| as long as we hold holyflare to the expectation that he will give reads at a time other than the passing of seasons. However, I doubt anyone would intend to ignore the entire discussion,
reasonably speaking. You should be using what happened to build reads, compared to saying 'well they could have talked as town or scum so the entire thing is null' it's still a town trait to talk a lot early game. It's not necessarily TOWN, but it's a town trait. people are considering us as much as anybody else, no one is giving us a free pass, but it's like 'this was a pretty townie thing to do.' opinions can change :|
I want to respond to that, holyflare, but I'll specifically hold back, because talking to you about this more is just blatantly counterproductive. uMasi out.
I'm slightly town on bereft, because there isn't much reason to do what he's done as scum (or maybe that was the entire intention who knows) onto more important things
Umasi is actually being ridiculous right now, not sure how any of you are seeing his 'town' intentions.
explain that plz. not how I'm being ridiculous, but what you're trying to imply from me being ridiculous. I interpreted it as 'why do people read you as town?' and then you say 'town' in your fantastic apostrophes. are you trying to say my posting has been bad for town, or are you whining that people think I'm town?
vel, there is specifically no editing in the game thread literally ever. use the phrase ebwop.
this day one isn't that bad. it's feeling okay to me in terms of talking a lot and getting people out there. It's feeling bad because we have no votes up and 24 hours to go, although it's plurality so it's nbd.
the problem with not posting reads in the first twenty four hours is it gives less to talk about to town, and you can't post an insight if people haven't been TALKING. If I could insight into holyflares policy, quite easily done he's scum because he's advocating pro-scum policy. But it's not that black and white, obviously. His policy is stupid, and combined with his non-contributions, makes him scummy. His only contribution was starting conversation with me day one.
On September 05 2013 07:35 Lord Velocity wrote: Nvm. This post was irrelevant, let me fix my keyboard brb in a few hours
the crime: edits and then asks for a few hours
On September 05 2013 09:01 Lord Velocity wrote: I'm so so so so so Sorry people. I said that asking for reads wouldn't be scummy really unless you were trying to bandwagon on their reads, which could subsequently be scummy and realized how dumb I sounded and got embarassed, and the keyboard thing was because I dropped my laptop and had to fix my board itself because it has thin keys. And I was unaware of the no editing rule, I must have missed it. But voting for me(Killer and Chairman) is not the smartest thing. and seeing as you two hopped on it right away seeing an easy lynch but nobody else voted. And I don't even know what QT means, and I fled for an hour or so because I wanted to eat pizza with my sister who is moving out for college. I'm terribly sorry if it was suspicious and I myself have become suspicious of Killer and Chairman in the process.
The return, excuse, and fuck up. He returns, apologizes, and gives his reason.The issue? He said he'd brb in a FEW hours, and he was only gone for one and a HALF. SOMEONES IN DEEP SHIT NOW ##VOTE LORD VELOCITY
That was a joke btw, I'm not actually voting velocity. I think it was a normal fuckup that town or scum could make, he obviously legitimately forgot the rules, and him posting like that is not scum motivated, obviously not town motivated, so it shouldn't be why you vote him. That said, if you have a reason for voting him that is based on something other than him accidentally posting, feel free! But killer/ray, it felt like you both voted him only because of that.
Holyflare, thank fucking god you finally posted something. This makes you significantly less scummy. As is, I gut lean towards heavenz, but I think both infii and heavenz are reasonable lynch choices. The third person I am considering is Pharcyd, because he points out the obvious mistake heavenz made and then NOTHING ELSE, but he falls under the lurking category atm. He and heavenz aren't scum together, probably. I don't mind ray and vel being around since they're active, I want bereft and blurry to come back since they had a single stint of activity, but they're not who I'd like to lynch.
out of heavenz, infii, and phar, heavenz is the one I want cleared up first.
Also a point which i think is worth raising now. Given that we have to have voted for someone/sleep with 18 hours, and there is still a player who hasn't posted, (myrzeth,) If we lynch someone, say pharcyd3, and then myrzeth gets modkilled, what effect does that have on the game, and if we have a confirmed mod kill would it be better to sleep? I'm in a hurry to get to class so I don't have time to think about it properly right now, but I think we need to have a plan in place to account for the chance of there being a mod kill on myrzeth.
if myrzeth is going to be modkilled, we proceed exactly as normal and lynch the scummiest player. If we lynch pharcyd3, at least the lurkers are killed, although I'm against that and think there are better options.
aside from that since it's not super important I'd prefer we not lynch velocity today, since he's present and is actively engaging in discussion with people. Heavenz or infii, on the converse, obviously haven't been, and this makes me read them as scummier (heavenz scummiest).
Killerdog, I'm having trouble understanding what exactly you think, because you give a lot of summations of peoples posts, and your thoughts (which is good!) but you don't actually draw conclusions from it all. Instead of going X did A and Y did B which had a scummy result, be like 'this is why he is scummy/not scummy'. I can't tell what you're actually trying to communicate in your post =/
On September 05 2013 05:41 Umasi wrote: heavenz post was 'this is what I think and why' and then 'why' is really iffy, but at least he's willing to tell us what he thinks.
Infii, you didn't really address much current in your post, but I'll give you time.
Don’t you think the effect of a lynch threat will be reduced when you always have someone voted? If you want other players to know who you are targetting just write it in this thread for everyone to see.
I obviously do not, but I don't want to bother with this discussion.
I like killerdog for town for being very forthcoming with everything, and I'm waiting on Ray to tell us his reads.
Lonemeow is doing a lot of asking questions, (which I am a fan of), he addresses the lurker thing which I am 100% on board with, but you'll notice he hasn't given opinions on anyone but Holyflare/me and phar (who only posted a useless one liner).
gonna go full lonemeow style; Lonemeow, Why have you only commented on Holyflare and me? (and phar, with his one liner)
I see you don't read very carefully, as I did FoS Lord Velocity (in the same post, no less). And while on that topic, my current read on him is newbie town, I seriously doubt scum team would let him draw attention with newbie mistakes like that.
You, on the other hand, seem to have your reads jumping around quite a lot. You had a scum read on Chairman Ray earlier, has that changed and if so, why?
I'm not a fan of how hard he jumped on vel, but it's only slightly scum read due to activity.
heavenz, your entrance post was so unbelievably scummy, it makes me feel justified in keeping it on you. Who are you going to vote today?
Mod question, If myrzeth doesn't show up by midnight CET, does he just die, or does a replacement get put in. Browsing the thread, the only two replacements i noticed were koshi and someone else, but you said koshi had way too many games for a newbie mafia, and the other guy mentioned only doing it if apeture mafia didn't start, which it has.
If myrzeth does not post or vote until midnight CEST, he will be replaced if it is possible. I would prefer not to use Koshi's offer since he is quite experienced. If I can find no other replacement I will contact Koshi. Modkilling sucks, especially on Day 1 already...
Being quiet is usually the best choice, at least on the SC2 Mafia Arcade game. You re able to observe everything and judge on your own. Don t worry, i m active
wtf? you're a worse case of holyflare than holyflare. At least he comes around to talk about things :|
On September 05 2013 22:56 Lord Velocity wrote: Okay so I have to rush this a littlebit? I have to go to school and won'tbe here for the end of the night. So I would like to say that my read on Umasi I think was posted, but if not it's the same to Killers a little, they both provided major information leading us in the right direction on others, Holy still stands neutral as I said, I'm a little sketchy onBlurry andBereft because they come in, disregard everything said, and focus on everything that's happened like 5(or like 8) pages ago and don't bother trying to clear their names on some peoples list, as they have also got some sort of "Blurry said something, he's right." Or vice versa with bereft. But I won't be around to the end of the lynching phase so I'm sorry. I also do'nt think I'm a smart vote as I have 2 right now, so I think that might stay the same,but I will be voting for Bereft or Heavenz. Thank you, see you all later.
Why did you comment on being a little sketchy on blurry and bereft, and then voting between bereft and heavenz? (reply to this when you return)
Mod question, If myrzeth doesn't show up by midnight CET, does he just die, or does a replacement get put in. Browsing the thread, the only two replacements i noticed were koshi and someone else, but you said koshi had way too many games for a newbie mafia, and the other guy mentioned only doing it if apeture mafia didn't start, which it has.
If myrzeth does not post or vote until midnight CEST, he will be replaced if it is possible. I would prefer not to use Koshi's offer since he is quite experienced. If I can find no other replacement I will contact Koshi. Modkilling sucks, especially on Day 1 already...
Being quiet is usually the best choice, at least on the SC2 Mafia Arcade game. You re able to observe everything and judge on your own. Don t worry, i m active
Seriously, I am 100% going to vote you in the next few hours unless you post something with contribution... This is NOT the sc2 mafia game.
Of course it s not, but i m new to the TL mafia game, so i ll follow my own strategies in the game for now
Sure thing, do that.
##Vote myRZeth
I'm not sure I dig a RZ wagon, unless he doesn't speak up at all today with reasoning. I kind of hold him to this expectation now that he's shown he isn't lurking.
On September 06 2013 00:05 myRZeth wrote: voting holyflare, because he s voting me without any clues/analysis/whatever
you can t vote somebody because of his playstyle, especially not that early, think about that
simply a countervote
......oh, an omgus alrighty then.
regarding infii rather, the entire case The biggest thing that I'm in disagreement with holyflare about regarding day one talk is what it should be about. I don't think that there's anything to talk about if people aren't attacking each other. If he'd said 'I don't have any reads' I'd be like 'oh okay' but when he was like 'but YOU sure as shit won't be hearing them' it's an ~oh what the fuck moment.
On September 04 2013 07:53 Chairman Ray wrote: Has everyone got their QT yet? You should have received one by now.
missed this somehow earlier -- was posting from my phone. ray what do you mean by "everyone"? thought only mafia and masons get this privilege......
@holyflare - agreed that meta has its merits, especially in a newbie game. i think that newbies' meta could be easier to discern vs. vets because we aren't as self-aware in our game play. what i do find interesting is that per your comments, i went back to browse past games, and in the last game you were in, like the very first post i see you make right out of the gate advocates lynching all liars and lurkers. mind explaining the sudden change of heart? why initiate this topic of conversation? sure, you could argue about the "math" of not lynching, but while this ultimately comes down to a game about numbers (like survivor!) your speculation about the math of it all seems pointless to me, because how do you quantify something like the present value of future clues? the cost of inaction? etc etc.
i like blurry's idea. it's a bit early for me to have much of an opinion, but why not:
on the town-dar: umasi - a bit rude perhaps, but not afraid to tread on toes and call shit out. on the scum-dar: don't wanna seem like i'm just following you, but i gotta say lord velocity too. while my first instinct was also to be suspicious of holyflare for advocating no lynch, i think LV was a bit quick to FOS holyflare with a 1-liner just for that. because i could see several reasons why scum would prefer a lynch day 1. if anything they might even think they stand to gain more by lynching day 1 vs no lynch unless they're incredibly risk averse lol.
Nothing has changed, I will lynch the lurkiest player (unless obvious modkill) on the first night if I must. I was bringing up the situation of no lynches because this game had started with an even amount of players (normal mafia games are odd numbers of players) and so it is within our favour to at least no lynch once. Especially if our blue roles are favourable but even without. I've explained that in my previous post.
That being said I'm not telling you my scum reads or especially my town reads at this moment in time.
bolded
On September 06 2013 01:01 Blurry wrote: While I agree that he (myrzeth) isn't worth keeping around it may just be a waste of a vote to lynch him today. I'm assuming that the mafia has a QT which they can use during the day? If that is the case, if he really was just a lurking mafia his buddies would have given him stuff to say in order to save him.
I just don't think there is enough to go on piling on the easiest target because he is just a lurker, and it may very well be that a lot of the pressure on him is coming from mafia themselves. Be careful in voting for him because he is the easiest target for mafia to get a mislynch right now compared to anyone else.
qt speculation imo is not something worth caring about. judge them on their individual play (since, as stated before, I don't think a scum team is normally a hivemind) the second line though, the bolded one, is worth more consideration.
Of course cop checks and vigi shots count, but I was talking about the worst case scenario. I decided not to accoutn for Vigi randomly shooting a townie before we find any mafia because that would just be really dumb.
and also entirely possible :| ##UNVOTE HEAVENZ gonna reevaluate, I'll be around at around at deadline.
On September 06 2013 04:54 Holyflare wrote: Let me also tell you guys that I have played a lot of mafia and the first people in that game to get lynched are always the quiet people so when he says that I have no faith in his ability to play now or later.
that said, the biggest thing that makes me think he's scum is his ridiculous omgus on you. If he'd actually been reading, there are sure as shit better reasons and targets to vote on.
who knows, that's what town has to figure out with the shit vts we're dealt right? rather, we're all shit vts in thread, so it's more correct to say unmotivated shit vts. :| I'm not sure what to think of him, heavenz goes through spurts of improvement and then (presumably he sleeps) inactivity, lonemeow just questions shit for days as has been pointed out, infii is scummy d1 as per the usual,, gah.
On September 06 2013 04:54 Holyflare wrote: Let me also tell you guys that I have played a lot of mafia and the first people in that game to get lynched are always the quiet people so when he says that I have no faith in his ability to play now or later.
but is he SCUM?
(I'm back)
Given how little he's posted so far, I think any attempt to work out what role he is is just going to be speculation. Blurry has made the argument that he's not mafia because mafia would have defended themselves by now. I disagree strongly with supporting that view point because not only does it discourage him from posting, but reading a lack of contribution as townie is pretty just getting a bit WIFOM imo. (did I use it right? :p)
I also don't like that blurry brought that up so quickly, that's a valid point to make if we get to 30 minutes before the deadline and he still hasn't posted or something, but bringing it up so early before myrzeth has proven that he isn't going to defend himself further just complicates everything imo. No reason to provide someone under pressure with an out.
Personally I'm in no way convinced that he's scum. I think it comes down to a choice between lynching myrzeth because he's lurking/being useless or lynching someone else who we think reads scummy.
Personally I'm leaning towards lynching myrzeth, because from the way he responded to people challenging his silence, and the fact he still hasn't come in with a post bigger then a one liner, means I don't think he's going to suddenly be super contributive tomorrow. I'd rather not have to spend half a day arguing with someone about play styles again, or even worse have him just dissappear and then being in a situation day 2 where there might be a strong mafia read we want to lynch, but having to choose between lynching the afk lurker or the mafia read. And if he turns out to be mafia thats just a perk.
I guess that's the question. Personally, I'd prefer to lynch the highest chance scum, and there's still an hour and 45 minutes (correct?)
##VOTE RAY ray scumslips don't exist, and you've done a lot of hunting for scumslips this game, with your qt talk at the beginning, then your accusing LV with quick topic crap.. I'm not buying it. He might have known it was an abbreviation, or he did what you did at the beginning
On September 04 2013 07:53 Chairman Ray wrote: Has everyone got their QT yet? You should have received one by now.
and capitalized that. Why are you pressuring him hard on something as insignificant as THAT? sure, you 'could' be correct, and he's actually scum, and you caught a scum slip but..... not buying it. Had problems with this post a while ago,
On September 05 2013 03:43 LoneMeow wrote: While we're at it:
Chairman Ray, ignoring myRZeth who hasn't posted even once, who do you think is scum and why? And what do you think about the Umasi/HolyFlare argument?
I am currently working on my scum reads right now, and will post them in a sec.
As for Umasi/HolyFlare, one of the best scum tactics is to have two scum ragging on each other the first day. It monopolizes the discussion preventing productive town discourse, paints them both as very pro town, and in the case that one of them turns mafia, there's a strong argument for the other one being town. Because of this, I am not willing to read them both as town. Right now, there's a possibility of both being scum, both being town, or one being mafia, so lynching one will not give us ANY headway, I say keep them both alive on day 1. Based on who gets lynched and who gets killed by mafia, we may be able to eliminate one of the possibilities.
because it was like 'no guys they still could be scummy', which is correct, but not because of some kind of scum tactics, you just state every possible scenario which is totally pointless.
velocity has both good and bad things in his filter, but I think you're scummier than him. Heavenz and infii aren't really off, they're still -.-.-.-.--egh, but you're pretty out there.
EPT
