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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:00 VisceraEyes wrote: Then kill me bbygrl. I wouldn't mind being spared of reading this mess  Why are you playing like this? Where's your ... va-va-voom this game, sweetheart? You don't suit the woe-betide me. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:00 WaveofShadow wrote: As for as towns devouring themselves in recent games...it's basically EVERY game. I have no faith in TL towns any more and having not played town for an extended period of time in a game for a while, I am attempting to do my part in making up for it. The thing is, though, TL towns haven't been only devouring themselves due to terrible townplay (those it is a primary factor). I don't think I've seen a scumteam in the recent string of wins who hasn't deserved to win in any degree, and that to me would be what you are suggesting with your list. No it's not? In what way? I'm not saying it's through concerted effort or by design that they're probably lurking - only that they don't have to. If they don't have to play, why would they? | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Some of the names on there are haphazard, or some names I'm not entirely sure town-VE would have them on the list. My brow is furrowed | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:01 marvellosity wrote: Why are you playing like this? Where's your ... va-va-voom this game, sweetheart? You don't suit the woe-betide me. If we're being completely, brutally honest here, I'm in a slump in general with regard to Mafia. My confidence in myself and my reads is shot and I'm not the town-leading role-claiming madman I once was. But yeah, I'd say that regardless of alignment in this spot, so I'm not sure what you're asking me that question for. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:03 VisceraEyes wrote: If we're being completely, brutally honest here, I'm in a slump in general with regard to Mafia. My confidence in myself and my reads is shot and I'm not the town-leading role-claiming madman I once was. But yeah, I'd say that regardless of alignment in this spot, so I'm not sure what you're asking me that question for. So I can judge for myself, is why. | ||
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
So this whole thing starts with yamato calling me scum and then sending out this: On September 23 2013 21:47 yamato77 wrote: RE: Sentinel His read on Ray goes from this: To this, 2 hours later: To this, yet one more hour later: With basically nothing in between except filler posts. Like I said, he is mafia. So what happened in those two hours was a realization - during my 07:27 post, I was going off of solely Chairman's current filter in the game, a constricted play that mirrors the attitude I had during my own first game, Hammer Mini. My mentality was this: He wanted to do something without attracting attention. Yes that's a scum tell under normal conditions, but as someone in his You can argue that I'm biased towards townie while yamato is biased towards scum, so we just saw both sides of a different coin. This is also why I voted for him, because I believed that tunneling someone who I believed (correctly, as we later saw) to be town, while having posted several other good reads, is scumworthy - yamato, being biased towards scumreads, was pushing town players and twisting their cases to look scummy. Then marv comes along and posts this three minutes later: On September 23 2013 07:30 marvellosity wrote: Good grief, Ray's posts looked constructed in his newbie game. That's kinda disappointing. Now this was the point where I started to question my position on Chairman. I actually ended up discarding my read on Coagulation once I became aware of his meta (I believe marv pointed that one out too), and so I checked out Ray's filter from his other game, Newbie Mafia XLVII. Much more relaxed and intelligent posting. He pushes a case on LordVelocity which was only stopped by his mislynch. From what I'm able to gather, since I've only read his filter and not the rest of the game, Ray seems to be stirring up discussion, poking at what he believes to be a scumslip and also participating in a discussion pertaining to Umasi, something unrelated to his defense or his immediate target. His play contracted in style and in Newbie he showed to be capable of doing things (to some extent) that a good townie should - discussing, clarifying, and bringing out things he finds scummy so that others defended them. I actually skimmed Ver's analysis of XXX and remember something in the back of my mind about new blues being very secretive so they don't accidentally get shot or mislynched. I didn't remember it well enough to consider it, but did once I saw Ray flip blue. But at this point I was unaware, so I was beginning to agree with yamato - this guy might have been red after all. Koshi you never answered my question about the 1/5 lurkers So here's my mentality at this point, right? On September 23 2013 09:39 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: After reviewing Chairman's filter, I have to agree that something is up here. Maybe a little south of neutral in my eyes. Might it be a product of coaching in the newbie game and nothing in this one? At this point I was also slated to die, but with 3 hours plus I would have some time to contribute to the scumhunt and either push my reads or prolong my own. I was off of yamato, so if I wanted to push, I'd need some time. Then this happened: And this is where I shifted into panic mode. I didn't have 3 hours, I had 30 minutes, and the votecount said I was going to die. I'd rather find a red player to lynch than get mislynched myself. So what do I do? I can't construct a persuasive case in 30 minutes, so might as well sheep someone who I think is scum. Cue me convincing myself through rereads of Chairman's filter that he's playing unusually restrictive, and with my previous defense of him ruled out with the Newbie filter, he must be red. (##Vote Chairman Ray) Then he flips blue, I remember Ver's post, and the rest is history. On September 23 2013 21:51 marvellosity wrote: And also, Sentinel has been added to the shitlist. It's not so much that he changed his mind, but the manner is just awful. The same content goes from "nothing looks scummy" to "he is the best chance to flip mafia today" with nothing in between. There's nothing to indicate why the massive change. Ironic, your post inspired me to do it | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:01 VisceraEyes wrote: No it's not? In what way? I'm not saying it's through concerted effort or by design that they're probably lurking - only that they don't have to. If they don't have to play, why would they? They do have to, because a great number of those on your list have been under suspicion at one point or another. It hasn't changed what they've been doing in thread, however. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:06 VisceraEyes wrote: Well rayn had questions and we had a dialogue about one of the names I included, yet you have asked no questions and mentioned no names you dislike Marv. Yet problems you have apparently. Let's hear them. I will sit back and observe this conversation. And by that I mean I'm gone for 2-3h and will read it when I come back. Play nice, kids! | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:06 VisceraEyes wrote: Well rayn had questions and we had a dialogue about one of the names I included, yet you have asked no questions and mentioned no names you dislike Marv. Yet problems you have apparently. Let's hear them. gumshoe has already mentioned, and no amount of 'splainin is gonna make that one look ok. I also find your coag read unlikely I guess? He actually made some posts. I dunno, maybe it's not so bad. Just... it's hard to explain, and I'm not going to damn you for your list. Or, if at a later time I am trying to lynch you, I'll provide a better explanation. Maybe it's fine. I'm just sad that you're sad, and I'm even more sad that it makes reading you much more difficult. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Instead of a collection of tidbits. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
If I were scum, I'd be loudly arguing with anyone calling me scum in an attempt to look emotionally invested for your benefit (if you're town, which I think you are). Whether you like that I point this out now or not, you know the truth in that statement. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
You know you're good at emotional twisty-twisty. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On September 24 2013 04:26 VisceraEyes wrote: OO just isn't as engaged as I expect him to be at this stage in the game. A lot of stuff has happened, a lot of people have said things they can be held to, and OO isn't prodding/poking people the way I've come to expect him to as town. Most of his posts have stank of "Hi guys, I'm here and reading and am townie just like you!" Coag is mostly a gut feeling. I feel like I'd be further up on his scum list if he were town - I haven't done a whole lot this game and it's raising a lot of peoples' hackles, but not Coag's. gumshoe is the lurkiest lurker. I feel like scum are lurking, and no one is drawing attention to gumshoe like at all. This is suspicious to me, but it's also not conclusive. Again, mostly feels. I also strongly disagree with you on OO. Usually in games i could flip a coin and that would tell me OO's alignment more accurately than me trying to read his posts and figure out his alignment. I don't think i have ever been right on him when i have been town, every time i call him town he ends up being scum and vice versa. Me even being able to have a townread on him (and having confidence in it) is why for me he is town. When he has been talking he has been talking about stuff he has imo been talking about important stuff and mirroresd my thoughts pretty well. I don't understand where you get this "Hi guys, I'm here and reading and am townie just like you!" thing. Could you elaborate more on that? I can't say anything about Coag, because my read on him is also a gut feel. I was interested in knowing more about it if you had some new information to offer. Apparently you don't. On the lurkers/gumshoe thingy: On September 24 2013 04:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: Okay well, the thing is i do not think anyone of those people have been mentioned by anyone besides "has not posted" lists. I really don't understand where you get this "feeling" you have seen them being mentioned (other than gumshoe).. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
You gonna be doin' some lynch-pushing tomorrow instead of abdicating responsibility like yesterday, dear? | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
 Anyway, enough about my meta. Talk to me about who's scum. Like, what do you think about Mattchew? Mocsta seems to have no problem with his weak +1 to my suspicion. What about you? | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:12 VisceraEyes wrote: Here I'll give you a useless bit of self meta to chew on. If I were scum, I'd be loudly arguing with anyone calling me scum in an attempt to look emotionally invested for your benefit (if you're town, which I think you are). Whether you like that I point this out now or not, you know the truth in that statement. Not raging against attacks (I still rage against what I view as stupidity, but recent games have shown that I am equally capable of being just as stupid as the people I rage against) is not an indicator of alignment. Using meta on yourself doesn't work. Other people are supposed to use meta to argue against/for you. If you're aware of your meta, then you can change your actions at will. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
We both have some extensive experience with OO. I think he be town. I think he had like 4 pages of filter in however many cycles he was alive in his last mafia game? He has 5 here already. I'm not sure I agree with you on your "involved" thing. He's seemed more involved than I actually expected. | ||
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