The Game [N]

On March 16 2013 16:09 sciberbia wrote:
Roughly how many blues and scum would you guys expect to be in a game of this size?

5-6 scum, ~5 blues?

I've never played a game this big before.

There are many players in this game. Not all will be present, unfortunately, but many will. Take from this what you will. If you are not on this list, turn back now.

I - The Snake
II - The Devil
III - The Sword <---- Possibly RBer or Vigilante
IV - The Priest <-- Medic?
V - The Eye <-- Detective?
VI - The Oracle <--- I'd imagine a Watcher type role?
VII - The Hero <--- More likely Vigilante candidate
VIII - The Minotaur
IX - The Nightmare
X - The Mirror
XI - The Fool
XII - The Coward
XIII - The Messiah
XIV - The Messenger
XV - The Dreamer
XVI - The Tower
XVII - The Key

On March 16 2013 16:20 Wade Fell wrote:
Peashooter are you fucking serious

On March 16 2013 16:23 Wade Fell wrote:


Not one I can't solve in 48 hours.

##vote thepeashooter

On March 16 2013 16:46 Coagulation wrote:
im town thank god

On March 16 2013 17:07 Coagulation wrote:
shucks

On March 17 2013 09:27 Wade Fell wrote:


There is a possibility he's a smurf of a younger player who hasn't heard of coag, or he literally made his account just before this game started, just to sign up for the last spot. I consider both of these possibilities somewhat unlikely. And, even considering the apparent vacuousness of his vote on coag, he hasn't taken a stance on GK or Geript or really anyone or anything, ignoring all other discussion in town to tunnel his target. This is an easy way for scum to avoid meaningful interaction with town and giving out reads. We don't know anything about his thought-process, so of course it seems WIFOM-ey-- but his play absolutely prevents us from clearing the wine from in front of us.

I'm not saying he's a bad scum player-- this is a clever ruse. But he is scum. Town would have an opinion on GK, ESPECIALLY town pushing another lynch. Can this guy really be considered to be "pushing" coag given that he hasn't tried to stop the GK lynch at all?

He's putting forth a simulacrum of what a townie does. Clever, but not enough.

On March 17 2013 11:06 Wade Fell wrote:


He stopped posting 2 hours before the first vote on GK went down, but it's been like 18 hours since then. Where is he? He still hasn't weighed in on Geript either, and Geript was under pressure while he was posting in thread.

If he comes back, says he's been gone for 18 hours like grooming a chicken or whatever and he has serious thoughts to give, then I may rethink things. But as it stands, simply straight-up lurking and not posting is NOT a defense for his actions.

On March 17 2013 02:26 Coagulation wrote:
I got my role pm at like midnight about 5 minutes before I went to bed. And I finally get up and sit down to read thread when I wake up in morning and what do I find but peashooter pissing and moaning that I havnt been POSTING IN MY SLEEP. real fucking solid work there. "THIS GUY ISNT POSTING WHILE HE SLEEPS HE MUST BE SCUM"

GJ

On March 17 2013 02:29 Coagulation wrote:
hey guys unless your reading or posting in thread 23 hours a day your scum according to peashooter. Im sorry we are all not hardcore like peashooter and strap diapers to our asses and drool in front of a keyboard all day like peashooter. or hey maybe hes a shit scum going for the easy target and fabricating bullshit so he doesnt have to contribute.

On March 17 2013 04:50 Coagulation wrote:
peashooter would be my best bet for a scum lynch at this point. I hardly ever have good reads day 1.

On March 17 2013 09:59 Coagulation wrote:
im going out. I will continue to read over thread on phone.

On March 17 2013 14:56 Mr. Wiggles wrote:

I actually find this a little tough to respond to, because most of my stance towards Coag is based on gut feeling, so that makes it harder to put it into words and explain adequately.

Basically, Coag makes short posts a lot of the time, and spams sometimes. He will also post emotionally sometimes. It depends a bit on context though. If he's been playing here recently and he got called out for spamming or not being present in the thread 24 hours a day, I could see him making those posts towards you. If he's scum though, he's smart enough to post like that in order to leverage it to his advantage somehow.

In my experience, he isn't the most useful player on Day 1, and starts to have better reads and to share those reads and go after players on later days. That's why I'd be hesitant to lynch him right now. I'd rather wait and just see how he plays. If he doesn't do anything, we can lynch/vig him, otherwise, he'll start to pull his weight. He doesn't play the same as a lot of other people, and I guess it's a little similar to Kenpachi or something. Games I've seen sometimes recently have people wanting to kill Kenpachi because he posts a lot of one-liners and some spammy throw-away posts. But, that's just the way he plays, and people aren't used to it. Coag is kind've similar, unless he's changed since I've played with him.

So, I can't contradict that his posts haven't had a ton of bearing on the game so far, or that his response to you was a bit disproportionate, but I can't say I want to lynch him for it, since lynching him would basically be a coin-flip at this stage of the game, as I don't think the way he's been playing is really indicative of his alignment. You can try to policy lynch him, but it won't do anything. You'll just do it for a few games in a row, and he'll just stop playing here for a while. I don't see him changing his play-style just because some people don't like it.

tl;dr: Wait and see? I can't make a judgement call one way or the other as far as his alignment (i.e. he's null to me), so I think a different lynch is a better bet to hit red.

On March 17 2013 15:58 DoYouHas wrote:


You are just going to have to get over it. We are at a point where we can actively discuss the merits of cases and wagons instead of just hoping that a brilliantly written case will gather enough sheep to lynch scum. It's a good thing.

On March 19 2013 01:31 Wade Fell wrote:
quoted for filter

On March 19 2013 01:40 Vivax wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Can you find an example please? I remember lots of people thinking you were scum "on your own", but didn't see anyone make the connection like I did.

Also it's fine if I die N1. Just shows how well I played lol.

On March 18 2013 00:06 kitaman27 wrote:


...is this a scum slip? As far as I know, ThePeashooter's identity as Yamato is not public knowledge. Was it revealed at any point in the thread?

On March 18 2013 01:29 WaveofShadow wrote:

Ohai guise.
Geript no offense, but your meta reads are shit. I'll agree with you that something appears...off about zare this game, but glurio does make a point and zare's activity does go way down on weekends. I'm willing to keep an eye on him for now but I don't think he'd be my D1 lynch candidate.
I have to look into this Vivax/TPS thing right now because so far it seems the most compelling thing to me.
I was going to comment on Coag's bullshit at some point but I figure I have to trust the vets on his meta once again since they ended up being right about Grush last game.....sigh.

On March 18 2013 02:19 Coagulation wrote:
I may not be on VEs little circle jerk squad but i can still sheep them.
im gonna vote ThePeashooter.

did anyone ever figure anything out about the yamato slip? was it actually a scum slip? and whats with greymist defending sandroba so hard.

On March 18 2013 02:23 layabout wrote:

vivax thinks TPS is yamato and started calling him yamato. So either they are both scum, masons or vivax did something "silly".

On March 18 2013 02:41 kitaman27 wrote:


I'm not really buying this explanation. When you addressed to him, you made it sound like a fact as if you knew he was yamato. If you were taking a guess, you could have said something like "hey, are you yamato?" or "This is yamato, isn't it?".

Furthermore, TPS posts after you address him as yamato and he thinks nothing of it. If I'm playing a game and someone calls me someone I'm not, I'm going to be awful confused. Even though that happened 10 pages ago, you never brought it up again. TPS had ignored your "guess", yet you never followed up on it. If you were truly curious, why not mention it?

You say that you "tried to guess TPS's alignment" and that you thought he was town, yet the previous post indicated that he was your number one scum read. Finally, how can you possibly come to a conclusion on a smurfs identity like that? When I see TPS's posts, I see some random player. I couldn't possibly guess who it was by the sample size you were given.

##Vote: Vivax

On March 18 2013 02:54 VisceraEyes wrote:
Ugh I like Vivax lynch too. Nothing he's said has made me feel townie on him. I'ma go filter him again.

Kita why you hatin on GM? I think he's fine for now, and I certainly don't like him for lynch today.

Where's the beef?

On March 18 2013 03:01 GreYMisT wrote:
Kita I think its possible that vivax slipped up. I can definitely see that scenario happening in this game. I am not sure I am confident enough in the risk of lynching him based off only that though. Let me look over him for anything else.

On March 18 2013 03:05 Coagulation wrote:
Vivax lynch plz.

On March 19 2013 02:19 Vivax wrote:
Does anyone else find suspicious how 3 of the guys I have in my case pop in to talk about a lot of other stuff, one says I'm likely to get NKd and then just disappear and ignore my relevant question?

On March 19 2013 02:16 Coagulation wrote:
im not suprised gm flips town. there were a good 4 or 5 lynch candidates yesterday and scum probably had no time pickin the one they wanted. We need to consolidate our votes/pressure day 2 or we gonna be in the same spot again.

On March 18 2013 09:03 zarepath wrote:
Okay, I just poked in to catch up as much as I can -- sorry that I am looking scummy; I will be able to participate much more during the week (as opposed to the weekend) and will hopefully be able to prove my alignment in a better fashion than I have thus far.

Darth Punk was one of something like 8 different people I suspected yesterday, and from the last couple of pages it seems as though his defense of other people's pressure hasn't been stellar. Mainly, all of his reads have been people who have been pressuring him, and much of his text is defending the first day of his game, not actively trying to find out who is scum.

The people he lists as scum suspects are not people he's trying to get others to lynch; it's entirely responsive.

I don't know if anybody else has mentioned this, but his first post seemed almost suspiciously over the top (I'm so excited for this game!), and that's another reason I feel okay about lynching him.

I wish I'd had time to look over some more candidates, but at this moment (and time is running short) I don't feel too bad about throwing my vote onto DarthPunk.

##Vote: DarthPunk

On March 19 2013 02:42 Vivax wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

Good, did you feel the arguments in my case were not enough to convince you or is there a particular reason you brought your own reasons?
How do you feel about my other reads?

On March 19 2013 02:50 Ace wrote:
yo

On March 19 2013 02:52 Vivax wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

I don't understand, you claim to not have read my case but speak of 5 people I named as scum. How does that make sense if you didn't read it?

Don't be shy, what do you think of GK, cosmic and glurio?

On March 19 2013 02:50 zarepath wrote:
Are you Yamato or what? The longer you don't respond to this scumslip narrative the more you're allowing us to mislynch Vivax should he be town.

On March 19 2013 03:17 Vivax wrote:
Oh didn't realize it was sarcasm apparently. People shouldn't use that it causes trouble in forums.
Don't understand why he's so hostile towards me though.

Anyway, I'm off to training for 2-3 hours so you have plenty of time to give some other reads.

On March 19 2013 07:08 Kenpachi wrote:
I'm personally not very comfortable not getting any limelight, good or bad lol
ill bear with it though, I'd like to claim a medic protect on me, just cause. I have a feeling mafia will gun me down first night.
GreYMisT not being scum is disappointing but it is honestly not surprising, though im having a hard time piecing information on his wagon together. Its safe to assume we will find majority of mafia, maybe even all of them, in the bunch that voted him because 1. easy as hell to sheep, 2. he is a forum veteran. 12 people voted for him, including me

RyuSuzaku, goodkarma, Vivax, geript, ThePeashooter, cosmicomics, Wade Fell, Mr. Wiggles, Kenpachi, zarepath, kitaman27, TestSubject893, WaveofShadow
Honestly, a hard group to figure out.
I'd like to assume that me and Ryu are not mafia lol.

kitaman is just not contributing as much as we'd like to did we not realize? He's as invisible as I am.

On March 19 2013 07:20 Vivax wrote:
Also my scumreads still didn't provide reads on Zarepath they seem to not want to play transparently for town.

TPS didn't comment on the other reads I asked him for and he treated me aggressively.

I sense people being uncooperative or unmotivated to help town (which doesn't surprise me since I think they scum d'oh), I didn't ask them to do something hard.

On March 19 2013 21:39 kitaman27 wrote:


To be clear, are you inferring that you believe VE isn't town because a town VE would have no reason to claim vet or are you lecturing VE for a poor decision?

Unless someone else claims a hit, I see no reason to doubt the hit with only one flip. Keirathi could have been a doublestack, but its pretty unlikely. Unless VE is still around 5 cycles from now I imagine the claim will take care of itself.



I'll get back to you after I get a chance to read through the logs. If I don't, remind me.

I'm having trouble looking for a post if someone recalls it. There was a player who posted a bunch of links to a past game, without commenting on the content. I looked 3 times through the thread and couldn't find it, so I might just be crazy, but I was hoping to see if they ever followed up with it.

@TPS. If you can confirm/deny your identity as yamato, I believe it will give me a clue to your alignment based on one of your earlier posts and it is something not related to the Vivax guess. If you are town, you would surely be willing to reveal this small piece of information.

I'll come up with a much larger post tonight when I actually have more time, without getting interrupted every 3 minutes.

On March 19 2013 15:57 Wade Fell wrote:


I hate setup speculation, but yes, this is an entirely reasonable point in the context of speculating about the setup. I can understand VE's reasoning for outing me, especially given that this is the case. I don't really have an answer for this other than that I am a town-aligned mason role, and although it's weird it's not unthinkable, and DrH is a wiley fellow.

---

Okay so lists posts are crap right so I'm gonna keep it short and simple, here are my two scumreads I want to lynch today, and why we should lynch them. I'm leaving wiggles, testsubj, geript wos ryu dp etc unmentioned because they are not my top 2 scumreads and I want to stay focused. Each of them individually has things I dislike about them but barring a something weird happenign with the daypost I won't be pushing them.If that changes and I am still alive, I will let you know.

1) thepeashooter: I've talked a lot about TPS in thread already but mainly I'm concerned about his attempts to _look_ like he's contributing without actually doing it. I'm like 90% sure his "anger" at my spamming is faked given that you had the same filter length as me at the time and his response to it was to just quote a bunch of my posts.

He's done a pretty slick job of not contributing to the game and looking like an "emotional townie". Why would he quote all my posts and complain about my filter length when at the time Ve has the same level of spam? (link) this doesn't read "angry town" to me, it reads "fake anger".

His weird opt-out of the town discourse D1 (link) is scummy, as well as the fact he had to be forcefully prodded into contributing.

I don't buy his theory that he wanted to "let it play out" with GM rather than (link) actively interacting with the case. Imagine you are a townie in this situation. Do you engage and try to get an understanding of what's going on and push your own reads, or even ask questions to refine them? Or do you hang back and "let it play out"? Even if you hang back, you at least ask questions and try to learn more. This is not what town does, this think that TPS has done. A lot of his other posts aren't analysis but are just dismissals (link)(link)(link) in which he doesn't push his own ideas but just naysays what other people have to say.

I will be voting for TPS when the daypost goes up based on this.

On March 20 2013 00:45 layabout wrote:
For starters it would make BH, VE and GK all scum since they are all telling us the logs are genuine.

On March 20 2013 04:16 Coagulation wrote:
hey guys reading up on thread now. Feel free to ask me any questions.

peashooter spent a good amount of energy effort trying to rally a lynch on me. Im pretty much the easy lynch in every game so its not uncommon for scum to try and push town into lynching me. Its strange to me that there are so many people who have put me in as a town read already. I dont think I should be a town read for anyone just yet. but its a good thing at any rate cause im town.

I wouldnt mind having peashooter lynched just on the basis that he was willing to let town run in circles over his identity while saying nothing. that seems fairly anti town. like hes trying to milk the speculation for all the chaos it can possibly generate.

On March 20 2013 04:10 goodkarma wrote:
Regarding Thepeashooter:

One thing I understand that thepeashooter has said is that he was fed up with being harassed by BH, and his anger was genuine. I believe him here. BH's casepoint that he's faked anger is pretty bad.

But when it comes to contributing meaningfully to scumhunting, I agree with BH's case that he's come up rather empty. Even now, thepeashooter seems more concerned with defending himself than with giving out reads. His recent case against Wade is pretty much an OMGUS. And if you were to look at his filter, he spends a lot of time talking about rather meaningless shit, like that Vivax and Kenpachi have no chance of getting shot... This is NOT proactive scumhunting.

That being said there are a few people like thepeashooter right now (semi-active, but absolutely useless). While what he's done to date is definitely scummy, I'm not in favor of lynching him today. I believe that by looking at players with better-established meta, we can have a more certain scum lynch.

On March 20 2013 08:20 VisceraEyes wrote:
Your "slip" on him is ridiculous, he literally said "IF we have townies like you, who needs scum" It in no way implies that he thinks Coag is town. It implies that he thinks that IF Coag is town, then scum don't need to be in the equation for town to lose - at least that's how I interpreted it. You're grasping BH. Really really hard.

On March 20 2013 06:12 Wade Fell wrote:

I strongly disagree. The half-assed setup speculative post is EXACTLY the kind of post you can make as scum without meeting up with your buddies, without having to worry about giving anything away or accidentally being helpful.



He DID go on a tirade, and he admits, publically, that he pressured the hosts to modkill me. If this isn't a tirade I will literally eat my hat IRL. Can VE and I get annoying? Sure, yeah, and sometimes I post a bit too many one-liners, but why no pressure on VE? Why the odd single-minded attack on me? He wasn't attacking "spam", he was attacking "wade fell" and the fact that he unleashed a mountain of quotes when he wanted to make the thread shorter, and he proceeded to not-contribute because he was too busy being "mad", is not something we can simply discount like that.

On March 20 2013 09:40 Wade Fell wrote:
ugh sorry quoted for filter

On March 20 2013 08:54 kitaman27 wrote:
Finally have some spare time. I'll respond to a couple relavent issues, but first I wanted to get out a post on one of my strongest scum reads. I may have a second post about another player I'm suspicious of, depending on how much time I have.

WaveofShadow

The first player I'd like to bring up is WaveofShadow. Whenever I try to look at a player, the most important thing to look at in my opinion is motive. During the first few cycles of a game, it can be quite difficult to differentiate a townie post and a mafia post. The easiest way to tell the difference is to ask yourself, what is a player trying to accomplish with these posts and what does this player care most about. When I read through the filter of Wave, I can't help but notice that he is much more willing to play through others, than to put himself out there. On numerous occasions, we can see him prodding other players with questions, but there has been very little follow through. He questions other players reads, but fails to come to significant conclusions.

Wave has approached the first two cycles in a way that shows me that he has little interest in being the guy that gets a player lynched. He is more interested in selecting a bandwagon based on the arguments of other players. In his support for the day one lynch, he posts the following:



This is the first time in the game he actually mentions Darthpunk. He states in a single line that he supports VE's case, yet provides no reasoning for why he agrees. Notice how defensive he gets with his vote. In reference to his disapproval of VE's circle he states "Call that scummy if you wish." At a point where he has selected his preferred lynch candidate, he is still spending more time discussing VE's completely irrelevant circle. For the sake of keeping this post legible, I've edited out the previous part of this quote, but he spends a whole paragraph discussing the deal with yamato. Why is it that he is spending more time discussing events not relevant to his scumread, than the actual vote itself?

It would be one thing if VE's case was so convincing that he had nothing to add. However, when I ask myself, does he care about this lynch, I come to the conclusion that he does not.



DarthPunk is his preferred lynch candidate, but at this point he has put absolutely no effort in pushing his selection. He is more than willing to comment on unrelated issues, but when it comes to the part of the game that should be most relevant, he shows little interest. This post shows me that his scum read is influenced by whether or not he believes the town views it as a viable lynch. When a mafia player selects a bandwagon, they often due it based on where the town's sentiment lies. Once he realizes that DarthPunk isn't going to get lynched, he backs off, simply stating that he has responded well to pressure.









Back to my point about his "defensive" phrasing of his vote, he has been acting quite defensive during the first two cycles. While a town player plays with confidence, Wave seems quite careful with his actions and is quite concerned with other's view of himself. Look how important it is to him for others to realize his meta based scum-hunting skills are sub-par. On four different occasions he makes this statement.



In response to suspicion, he reacts quite strangely. Look how worked up he gets when GM names him as a scum read. There is essentially no pressure or votes on him at this point, yet he is responding as if he is about to be hammered.





These are more examples of how important it is to him that he is seen in good light. Note how he has spent more time talking about his annoyance of getting suspected, than he does about DarthPunk earlier. His vote of GreYMisT also occurred at a time where GreYMisT was suspicious of him.



Finally, I come to this post which is what caused me to look at him further. Look how squirmish he is in his response. This is at a point where he accidentally mentioned to a lynch, rather than a night kill. It was a 100% typo and a non-issue. Yet here is his talking about how his has to be more careful about not making mistakes and coming up with more excuses.

Wave has show that he cares more about himself, than town. He is willing to share opinions on less important issues, while skimping in pushing town objectives when it comes to the lynch. He responds in a mafia manner to suspicion and posts with an attitude that lacks the look of a town player. I think he would make an excellent lynch today.

On March 20 2013 09:19 Vivax wrote:
Well I read it right now but frankly I developed the feeling he is town, I find others way scummier than him and WoS is a newbie so I understand him being defensive, dunno why he rides so much on not knowing how to metaread though.
+ Show Spoiler +

It's a guy who says these things to a guy who asks questions to a claimed veteran.

Kita don't you feel my Zarepath, GK and cosmicomics cases are good? I feel they are the strongest ones and I will likely not let go of those reads. I still have 2 wildcards currently occupied by Layabout and BH but TPS and glurio would fit in there too.

On March 20 2013 23:44 WaveofShadow wrote:

Apparently so? There is a circumstance where I think this may not be true since again, my PM says nothing about alignment, but my rolecheck result surprised me.

It is possible that your win condition will change at some point during the game. If this event would infuriate you, do not sign up. Measures have been taken to make sure that if this happens, your play should not have to change very much. Try to see it as a new challenge. It would be in your best interest to PM me questions whenever you have them, no matter how trivial they may seem.

On March 21 2013 00:27 Ace wrote:
zarepath I think this is a scenario of someone playing badly as Town rather than a Scum screwing up the claim. Unless Wos is running some kind of gamble here, he just looks like someone silly /newbie enough to put his own survival over winning as a part of the Town.

I feel like from the last few pages we have mostly pro-Town players arguing over trivial stuff. We should start looking at the people on WoS's wagon, especially if you believe he is innocent. I would cross-check that with anyone who tried to push keirathi before his/her death at night and the GreyMist lynch. that being said was GreyMist town? the way it's written is ambiguous.

On March 21 2013 01:38 Ace wrote:
your right, it's not like a claimed Vet is a confirmed Town sure to get shot because he is running around popping Scum and didn't just say he accepted an invite from 3rd party.

Stop being ridiculous.

On March 21 2013 01:42 Ace wrote:
I dont have one, and I don't think it's important right now.Lynch VE.

On March 21 2013 01:47 Ace wrote:
Who CARES if he is a Vet? He just posted logs of him joining a 3rd party and even said fuck the Town. This isn't hard.

On March 21 2013 01:52 Ace wrote:
Stop talking about other people and stay focused on one person at a time. Jesus I don't want to have to teach people how to play my first game back in months.

Just dealwith VE now. Re-read the log: He accepted to join a 3rd party that clearly doesn't have interest in helping the Town. Whether VE is still Townis irrelevant: whatever powers he gets or grants to the 3rd party isn't going to help us. Lynch him now. Treat him like a self aware Miller and just solve the problem immediately.

On March 21 2013 02:02 Ace wrote:
We aren't going to stop scumhunting: that would be dumb.

But leaving a claimed 3rd party player alive, when it empowers a player we have no idea about is just as dumb. I don't see how this is a difficult concept to understand.

I guess you guys think leaving claimed Serial Killers alive is a good idea as long as they help the town. lulz.

On March 21 2013 08:17 Ace wrote:
VE look at this from our perspective: You botched your Vet claim as no one is going to claim Veteran under 0 pressure intstead of just saying they took a hit. Even if it's your "meta" - you are aware of it, and know some people here are also. So it would be bad news to claim that.

Second, the 3p thing. You said you lied about accepting his invitation...and posted it in the thread thereby nullfying the purpose of lying. I mean, are you thinking about what we see here? Based on your logs the 3p is going to get stronger once you're in. We really have to lynch you at this point. Doesn't matter that 3p may not be strong now. An anti-town player that can become stronger down the line needs to be dealt with.

So for the last time THINK about this from our perspective and see why you have to be lynched. Those 2 stunts you pulled just don't paint you as town. I also hope you step your game up in the future and stop doing silly shit like roleclaiming just because. This is a damn near policy lynch because of your past behavior.

On March 21 2013 15:10 WaveofShadow wrote:
Huh.
TPS's post strikes a chord with me much more than Wriggle's does (not to mention confirmed townie doesn't hurt) as I never seem to remember to think of things from a scum perspective, though admittedly that would be hard for me because in games now I haven't rolled scum.
What Wriggles did and now TPS makes me wonder about the spammy meta that seems to be present in every mafia game I've played. Were posting in the manner that TPS and Wriggle did the norm at on point in time? Huge, overall well put-together, consolidated cases? TPS can we expect more of this from you (if you survive the night, sorry!)?

I know we actually have a shot at getting GK lynched now but damn, TPS.

On March 20 2013 23:44 WaveofShadow wrote:

Apparently so? There is a circumstance where I think this may not be true since again, my PM says nothing about alignment, but my rolecheck result surprised me.

On March 18 2013 02:23 layabout wrote:

vivax thinks TPS is yamato and started calling him yamato. So either they are both scum, masons or vivax did something "silly".

On March 20 2013 01:44 layabout wrote:

Since then Keir flipped and DarthPunk made the point that we were probably on the wrong track. Keir thought zare was town and i am willing to give hm the benefit of the doubt.

It's also worth realising that mason roles ARE ptobably balanced between town and mafia but maybe with more on town's side, since grey is probably not the only town mason since he could only mason 1 person then kill them.

I am not defending BH, your push on him based on qt's (unlike most of what you have done so far) was borderline retarded. Can't say much more.

On March 27 2013 13:41 WaveofShadow wrote:
Wow, so TPS just voted Layabout without even posting in here.
I'm so sorry I checked him guys, I wish we had mislynched him instead of someone actually useful.

On March 27 2013 13:57 WaveofShadow wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

TPS can you give us a little more to go on before you disappear? Any other scumreads and why?

On March 18 2013 10:43 Wade Fell wrote:


I don't like how Zarepath has been posting recently. His initial fearless posting (link)(link), however ill-advised it may have been, seemed to me to be townie. That plus my personal history with geript has led me to go soft on the two of them. I don't like that zarepath has become apologetic (link) and reserved (link), and his posting has gone down so much as the pressure has ramped up. That being said, his initial townlike recklessness and unthinkingness in posting resonates with me. His posting pattern tells me "town player who has no clue what he's doing" because of his initial earnestness. I will give him a second chance.

GreYMisT, on the other hand, does not deserve another chance. GK already went over the initial scumminess in GreYMisT's entry into the game; the active lurking (link), the "trap" that (link) even viewed in the best possible light, is a noncase and a vote-threat that doesn't directly mean anything. "I was a potential mislynch, so the guy who pushed me is scum" is not a reasonable case, and if GreYMisT were like Grush or something I'd be like "wow Grush is Grush" but GM is in fact GM and not Grush. He opposed my meta read on GK (link) saying "that's just how GK thinks" without actually referencing a game of GK playing scum and acting like this. He made a meta read not based on GK's scum meta, but on... well, his word. I've exetensively provided reasoning for why GK is playing to his town and not scum meta, and everyone who's actually clicked through on my links has at least in part agreed with me.

So what's with GreYMisT? He acts like he has a meta read on GK of "GK always posts like this as town or scum" but has NO EVIDENCE. He admits GK's actions could be town or scum (link) and after asserting that GK's actions are null, says he still wants to lynch GK (link) (link) only later supplementing his so-called "case" on GK with a one-liner (link) that actually literally refuses to engage with GK's defense. GreYMisT has slipped up badly-- he's accidentally let us peek behind the curtain at the man who doesn't think GK is scum but wants to lynch him anyways, the man who claims to have a meta read on GK but won't share details and has opted out of the town discourse as a result of his fixation on GK.

If GreYMisT were really after GK, and REALLY had something to say about my meta defense of GK, He'd say it. He'd have said it. He'd have shouted it to the heavens, linked and quoted the evidence, and bitch-slapped me like the young punk I am. GreYMisT has blinked, multiple times, because his town play is interfering with his ability push a mislynch as scum.

He is scum, and GK is town. We all know this to be true.

##unvote
##vote GreYMisT

On March 30 2013 01:42 Kenpachi wrote:

nice. you isolated the piece of art for me. I really do like that you tunneled the shit out of all my posts to make them look scummy. Also, you seriously just spearheaded into all my post with no context whatsoever.
im done.

On March 30 2013 03:03 Kenpachi wrote:
lol I'm not surprised because this town is literally in the shitters. I'm fairly confident you and Zarepath aren't mafia but I have no idea how you're certain about anyone else at this point.

On March 30 2013 03:04 Kenpachi wrote:
Also if I'm not on the town list, then I'm inclined to believe you're full of shit and need to review your work again

On March 30 2013 10:40 kitaman27 wrote:


I don't recall. I probably just missed the request since its not like I would purposely ignore something if asked.

Day two I was mostly focused on WoS with my big case and then Wiggles after the dt claim. Generally I let early blue claims fix themselves with the night hits and take another look if they're still around latter. BH hadn't really caught my attention while I was looking elsewhere.

The one thing that is bugging me is that how few people are willing to defend glurio, yet there are only a couple votes on him.

On March 30 2013 11:47 layabout wrote:

As i already said, i was converted on day. I was masoned during day1 and at the start of day2 the qt died and i got converted.

Guys if we do not consolidate then WE WILL LOSE

Toadya we should be lynching kitaman27.

Why is that you may ask? Well if you were reading the the thread you would not need to ask this.
Case UNO:
Mr. Wiggles dying words:
+ Show Spoiler +

Case two:
Hold on cosmic was 3p how can we trust him?
Well my skeptic read, cosmic may have wanted to save his own skin but that does not change the fact that he didn't know the scumteam and his case on kitaman carries considerable merit:
+ Show Spoiler +

Yesterday kitaman27 was pushing for a cosmic lynch and pre-claim he may have been justified in doing so. However post-claim kitaman deliberately ignores the consequences of the claim, which there was plenty of evidence to support and very few reasons to doubt. Yesterday mafia benefitted the most from the lynch and kitman27 was aware of this but chose to push their agenda.

Why? Well he is mafia

##vote kitaman27

On March 30 2013 17:17 RyuSuzaku wrote:


it's not an illegitimate strategy at all. He was scum, his interest is in getting town disorganised.

Posting a lot accomplishes this and nothing he did broke any rules. If you don't like players who do that, make a policy to lynch or pressure them when they do it, and punish them for it.

Trust me when I say you will probably discourage townies from contributing, and it'll probably backfire. You have to be good enough to realize when a player needs to be ignored/lynched for posting too much.

On March 30 2013 17:25 geript wrote:
Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is. Personally, I don't see why he even has a smurf account considering how bad he is at using it and it's not like his smurf is a secret.

Either way, I would love to have some constructive criticism on my play.

On March 30 2013 17:27 WaveofShadow wrote:
WBG was smurfing this game? Who was he?
Any specific critiques of my terrible play anyone has?
I couldn't make a read this game to save my life and I apparently have no idea how to even go about doing it.....

On March 30 2013 17:26 Blazinghand wrote:


Also, and I'm gonna be 100% clear here, I DO access Wade Fell from chrome and Blazinghand from Firefox, and I have done this for all my smurfs. I'm actually dumb enough that I forget what browser I'm using. I can't go saying this in the thread during the game though because nobody will believe me.

EDIT: And if you don't believe in my good faith, I am sorry for having ruined my reputation in your eyes. There's nothing then that I can say at this point-- you don't believe I'll try, and don't trust my word, even outside the game. I'm sorry you feel that way, and perhaps in time my play in future games will convince you otherwise. There is nothing more I can say.

On March 30 2013 17:47 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
thepeashooter = RoL
RyuSuzaku = WBG
cosmicomics = slo0sh

On March 30 2013 18:04 Ace wrote:
smh that meta shit made re-reading this a fucking pain. half the finger pointing was "yo you aint playin to your meta - SCUM!".

On March 30 2013 22:53 Mocsta wrote:

Im catching up and had to stop here.

I assume its already been questioned but whatever, I complete abhor and detest this type of mentality.


Let me remind you of your reaction to the Ace mislynch.
I don't see a single point in that read where you show any remorse for securing a mislynch.
All i see is a person who cares about having spent 1.5hours writing a bogus case.

Get off your high horse.

You did not lead a lynch on a single scum candidate.

Your play this game was woeful and rarely achieved any of the detailed analysis you berated others for not distributing..
you are one of the last people I am going to listen to in regards to what can be considered "optimal play."

On March 31 2013 09:41 Ace wrote:
Do I need to explain the VE case again? Because I think some of you are overthinking the situation when it's really simple. Stop being results oriented and be process oriented. There is no difference between 3rd party recruiter and Scum: they are both Anti-Town factions.

On March 31 2013 10:52 Ace wrote:
Then there's a problem with the game if that is allowed. Players don't get to turn down recruitment. VE "being" Town after being talked to/recruited by 3rd party recruiter should be impossible.

On March 31 2013 12:37 Blazinghand wrote:
I remember there was once an 80-person game (that I was only in briefly before it fell apart) and there were several roles called "lurker vigis" which could fire a bullet to shoot a lurker. It worked pretty poorly, but it was a fine idea.

I don't think posting restrictions are the best of ideas, just because it changes the way the game works. That being said, I think the real way to stop spam is the same as the real way to stop lurking: consider it a scumtell and lynch people who do it. Obviously it's not possible for a single person to enforce this, but if enough people believe it, it will become true. And FWIW a certain level of spam probably IS a scumtell. It is anti-town to get into long arguments with everyone for no reason and derail all the useful lynches. Calling players out for this and threatening to lynch them will 1) discourage scum from doing it and 2) discourage town from doing it which could be good.

On March 31 2013 12:39 RyuSuzaku wrote:
I'm gonna call out RoL on the spamming = illegitimate strategy bullshit because his go-to strategy as scum is to lurk and not post until absolutely necessary to avoid a modkill.

If anything, THAT is an illegitimate strategy, given that you purposely only post to avoid a modkill. I myself would strongly consider replacing or modkilling you for that type of strategy in one of my games, because my rules explicitly state that trying to skirt an inactivity modkill will result in one.

Clearly the host this game did not have a problem with spam, otherwise people would have been warned for it. (and if they were, I am not aware of it). Calling it an illegitimate strategy is honestly self-deceptive, almost like a cop-out for not playing well.

On March 31 2013 14:39 Keirathi wrote:

Someone asked and DrH told them that town had to eliminate all non-town.