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Oats, stop being daft. I've already said what I wanted to say, stop correlating post count with contribution. What you said could be applied to nearly every person playing this game.
On February 11 2013 16:35 Oatsmaster wrote:
Snarfs why are you not scum?
Also, why is Prp not scum then Snarfs?
The first question is loaded and stupid. You tell me us why Snarfs is scum.
Second question is already answered.
On February 11 2013 16:24 Snarfs wrote:
Oats: No reason for town to attempt to discredit prplhz like he did, whether prplhz is town or scum doesn't matter, Oats deliberately attempted to mislead us with his quotes.
Anyways, I think we should all be consolidating on VE now. Anyone who disagrees should speak up. He hasn't done crap all game, and I've shown multiple instances where he has misinterpreted / twisted what I have said. Nigh no one has honestly attempted to engage in my discussion about him.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
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On February 11 2013 15:18 slOosh wrote:
Mr. Cheesecake I want to talk about VE sans your scum reads going after him.
What do you think about the points that I bring up, and his objective play this game?
Bump.
I honestly think we are trying to decide between lynching multiple scum candidates, because the connections just don't make any sense unless there is some degree of bussing going on. For instance, I'm seeing a phagga-yamato bus for one. I still feel like VE is much more scummier than Snarfs, so I want to talk about him. Let's talk.
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Sloosh. Give me a minute. I'm going to filter dive and see what's up with VE.
Could you 'bump' your concerns with him?
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*Knocks on head* you there SlOosh?
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... You seriously ask me to bump when I have a 2 page filter? Really? You can't do this yourself?
On February 10 2013 06:37 slOosh wrote:Hey Palmar, I think we need to seriously discuss VE today, because I'm seeing some clear mafia agenda here, and little blips elsewhere. Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 02:19 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm going to do a full reread now and look forward to chatting with the nominees about tomorrow's lynch. Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 06:26 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm not sure I agree where phagga is concerned, but we'll deal with that tomorrow. Today I'd like more input from the lynch candidates and everyone's thoughts on who they want to lynch today. Says he wants to chat with nominees about tomorrow's lynch. Disagrees about phagga, but wants to talk about it tomorrow. Could you focus your attention on him when you can? He is one of the more slippery players and it would be great if we could consolidate / clarify our read on him.
On February 10 2013 08:23 slOosh wrote:
Ok VE. Say something scummy and then pass it off as a joke, and then call me scummy whilst doing so. That's cool.
I've already stated my case. You said you have problems with it but have provided 0 reasoning, 0 evidence and 0 thought process on why. And then you expect me to extract all relevant information out from you, after stating that you wanted to talk with me.
You're full of it and I'm gonna talk it over with Palmar. Now in the meantime why don't you actually do what you say you would do and talk about why you disagree about phagga.
On February 11 2013 06:49 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 22:32 Mocsta wrote:
SlOosh, may I ask who you are planning to lead with on day3? Not sure if I understand this question - if it is who do I lynch first, it's phagga, because it's the clearest and best chance flip. I like Palmar's list as it has good overlaps with mine. After phagga, I'd probably start convincing people that VE is scum, then maybe prplhz. A strong reason for this is that VE and prphlz are objectively experienced / good players and they are focusing on today's lynch and avoiding talking about anything else. Think about it from a townie perspective. If you conclude that the nomination candidates are all town, then why would you bother spending your time and energies choosing which one to lynch? As if making the correct townie lynch will win the game for us? No, if you conclude that all nomination candidates are town, you should be focusing on who you will lynch tomorrow. You should scumhunt. 4 out of 8, I repeat 4 out of 8 players are scum if there are three townies up for nomination. And you seriously spend time looking at the three townies? Total bull. I've been saying this the whole time, and maybe it's more evident now as you've seen how D2 has played out, but there are clearly people who don't want to talk about anything outside the current nomination pool. What's more is that some of these people clearly think that the candidates are all town, so why would they bother waiting for the lynch before they start contributing? If someone thinks we are town, then they must have some degree of respect for Palmar's / my play, or in the very least desire to dialogue with another townie about their scumreads etc. Why wait for one of us to die? Why wait?
On February 11 2013 09:05 slOosh wrote:
LOL. Ok, dismiss everything I said by calling it a meta case. Anyone objectively reading the case could see that there is only 1 point in which I draw a meta analysis, which serves to strengthen a point that is already there.
- in this game phagga writes timidly, fluffily and without conclusions
- town phagga is capable of decent analysis, or at least confidence and clarity in his posts
It doesn't matter if phagga is having an off game, because that is not the distinction I make. He scummy this game. You could argue about the use of meta but it's at best moot - take out meta and my case still stands just as strong, and it's incredibly scummy to dismiss the entire thing by strawman argument.
I'm not drawing any associations from my phagga scum read. This is the exact same thing with yamato. Regardless of phagga's actual alignment, townies should act a certain way given what they have said. VE said he wants to talk to me about tomorrow's nominations. I presented my phagga case. VE did nothing at all in lieu of participating / contributing to the discussion, but all he did was say that he disagreed with the case (and didn't say why until I called him out on it).
What VE did is scummy independent of phagga's alignment.
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I would prefer to lynch Prp first TBH.
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Yeah life kicked my ass this weekend guys. I'm reading, but I can assure you I won't be voting for myself.
Prplhz is still my preference. slOosh can you tell me why you prefer my lynch to prplhz? Is it just because you think I'm scum? Because that's horrible if so.
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On February 12 2013 02:27 slOosh wrote:... You seriously ask me to bump when I have a 2 page filter? Really? You can't do this yourself? Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 06:37 slOosh wrote:Hey Palmar, I think we need to seriously discuss VE today, because I'm seeing some clear mafia agenda here, and little blips elsewhere. On February 10 2013 02:19 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm going to do a full reread now and look forward to chatting with the nominees about tomorrow's lynch. On February 10 2013 06:26 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm not sure I agree where phagga is concerned, but we'll deal with that tomorrow. Today I'd like more input from the lynch candidates and everyone's thoughts on who they want to lynch today. Says he wants to chat with nominees about tomorrow's lynch. Disagrees about phagga, but wants to talk about it tomorrow. Could you focus your attention on him when you can? He is one of the more slippery players and it would be great if we could consolidate / clarify our read on him. Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 08:23 slOosh wrote:
Ok VE. Say something scummy and then pass it off as a joke, and then call me scummy whilst doing so. That's cool.
I've already stated my case. You said you have problems with it but have provided 0 reasoning, 0 evidence and 0 thought process on why. And then you expect me to extract all relevant information out from you, after stating that you wanted to talk with me.
You're full of it and I'm gonna talk it over with Palmar. Now in the meantime why don't you actually do what you say you would do and talk about why you disagree about phagga. Show nested quote +On February 11 2013 06:49 slOosh wrote:On February 10 2013 22:32 Mocsta wrote:
SlOosh, may I ask who you are planning to lead with on day3? Not sure if I understand this question - if it is who do I lynch first, it's phagga, because it's the clearest and best chance flip. I like Palmar's list as it has good overlaps with mine. After phagga, I'd probably start convincing people that VE is scum, then maybe prplhz. A strong reason for this is that VE and prphlz are objectively experienced / good players and they are focusing on today's lynch and avoiding talking about anything else. Think about it from a townie perspective. If you conclude that the nomination candidates are all town, then why would you bother spending your time and energies choosing which one to lynch? As if making the correct townie lynch will win the game for us? No, if you conclude that all nomination candidates are town, you should be focusing on who you will lynch tomorrow. You should scumhunt. 4 out of 8, I repeat 4 out of 8 players are scum if there are three townies up for nomination. And you seriously spend time looking at the three townies? Total bull. I've been saying this the whole time, and maybe it's more evident now as you've seen how D2 has played out, but there are clearly people who don't want to talk about anything outside the current nomination pool. What's more is that some of these people clearly think that the candidates are all town, so why would they bother waiting for the lynch before they start contributing? If someone thinks we are town, then they must have some degree of respect for Palmar's / my play, or in the very least desire to dialogue with another townie about their scumreads etc. Why wait for one of us to die? Why wait? Show nested quote +On February 11 2013 09:05 slOosh wrote:
LOL. Ok, dismiss everything I said by calling it a meta case. Anyone objectively reading the case could see that there is only 1 point in which I draw a meta analysis, which serves to strengthen a point that is already there.
- in this game phagga writes timidly, fluffily and without conclusions
- town phagga is capable of decent analysis, or at least confidence and clarity in his posts
It doesn't matter if phagga is having an off game, because that is not the distinction I make. He scummy this game. You could argue about the use of meta but it's at best moot - take out meta and my case still stands just as strong, and it's incredibly scummy to dismiss the entire thing by strawman argument.
I'm not drawing any associations from my phagga scum read. This is the exact same thing with yamato. Regardless of phagga's actual alignment, townies should act a certain way given what they have said. VE said he wants to talk to me about tomorrow's nominations. I presented my phagga case. VE did nothing at all in lieu of participating / contributing to the discussion, but all he did was say that he disagreed with the case (and didn't say why until I called him out on it).
What VE did is scummy independent of phagga's alignment.
Nope, lazy.
First quote: What's wrong with what VE did there? He expresses he wants to talk with nomination candidates about the lynch tomorrow (and today). Is that a mafia agenda? What is odd is that he disagrees with Phagga, but provides no reasoning. That actually brings up a good point. Why DOES he disagree... he has never explained it. I want to know this.
Second quote: The joke was a joke... indicative by the heart at the end. Ehh. Seemed pretty light-hearted to me. But that Phagga stuff again. Prove he's not lynch-worthy VE.
Third quote: You focus on VE being a good player, but he's not showing that here. I've never played with VE before, so I can't testify to his epicness. I've never even heard of him being that good. The only thing that redeems him is he did take a look at Prphlz who was not a lynch candidate. He did focus a lot on the nomination lynch...
Final quote: His job as town is to prove the innocence of Phagga if he thinks he is innocent. He doesn't do this. Good point.
VE seems really trolly / nonchalant overall. His filter lacks scumreads and is more joking around than anything. Pushing a mafia agenda? It's iffy. Mafia motivation comes in defending Phagga without reason. The little participation go either way. At least he did push Prphlz.
Stuff not related to you SlOosh:
VE said he was going to look into me but never did. Then, he just coped out and said 'oh no, im not interested in lynching you, you're good don't worry about it' <---- I fucking hate when people null me like that.
He doesn't seem to really care about what other people think about him. Kinda a townie trait to me; at least that's how I'm as town. He's not overly concerned with defending himself which I this is townie as well.
So VE:
Why do you disagree with a Phagga lynch? More specifically why did you WAIT until today to talk about it. Palmar was right there to discuss. In fact, why did you want to lynch the guy who was so anti-Phagga? Wouldn't you want to discuss it with him?
Overall: I'm a bit see-sawy on him. All flip-floppy and such. I like some things, but hate that he voted for SlOosh when he disagreed with his Phagga case without disputing it. We'll see with what he comes out with today.
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Boohoo VE, if you care about it why don't you prove yourself, do something and show me why I should be lynching prplhz instead of you.
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First quote is him saying "I want to talk to slOosh Palmar Mocsta about tomorrow's lynch (outside the nomination pool)". He does the exact opposite by saying he wants to focus on the nomination candidates, despite me talking about phagga.
Think about it from his perspective:
- "I want to talk to candidates about tomorrow's lynch"
- slOosh talks about phagga, who is a potential subject of tomorrow's lynch
- "I don't like phagga. I want to focus on today's candidates."
I'm not saying that he is a great player and not playing to my expectations of him. I'm saying that he is experienced enough to understand these things, i.e. he isn't someone you can dismiss as "oh he is a newbie, it's understandable he would make that mistake". Regardless, meta isn't my main point here.
VE isn't overly concerned about defending himself because there hasn't been an actual threat to lynch him yet. This isn't a town trait. For instance how many people defended themselves last cycle? Is the number 4? Nope. Scum don't bother defending themselves when there is no serious threat against them.
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On February 12 2013 03:07 slOosh wrote:
First quote is him saying "I want to talk to slOosh Palmar Mocsta about tomorrow's lynch (outside the nomination pool)". He does the exact opposite by saying he wants to focus on the nomination candidates, despite me talking about phagga.
Think about it from his perspective:
- "I want to talk to candidates about tomorrow's lynch"
- slOosh talks about phagga, who is a potential subject of tomorrow's lynch
- "I don't like phagga. I want to focus on today's candidates."
I'm not saying that he is a great player and not playing to my expectations of him. I'm saying that he is experienced enough to understand these things, i.e. he isn't someone you can dismiss as "oh he is a newbie, it's understandable he would make that mistake". Regardless, meta isn't my main point here.
VE isn't overly concerned about defending himself because there hasn't been an actual threat to lynch him yet. This isn't a town trait. For instance how many people defended themselves last cycle? Is the number 4? Nope. Scum don't bother defending themselves when there is no serious threat against them.
Well, you seem to be a serious threat to him sloosh. I'd expect scum to be careful and defendy around you. I'm super confused about his intentions of the last lynch. I keep forgetting that you were a nomination candidate, so I keep thinking he wasn't concerned with you, just the nomination candidates.
Yeah VE wtf u doin bruh with yesterday
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SlOosh I agree with your VE case as I noted last cycle. But I believe that Yamato should be the lynch of choice today. He deflected two cases on him with out giving anything of a response. He did the same thing in Normal Mini Mafia VI when i posted an accusation of him. He legit completely ignored it.
SlOosh you haven't given your thoughts on the Yamato case. What do you think about.
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Vote Count
Snarfs: Mr.Cheesecake, Yamato77
Yamato77: JayBrundage, Phagga
VisceraEyes: Snarfs, SlOosh
Have not voted: Djodref, Prplhz, Mocsta, Oatsmaster, VisceraEyes
Ok so I'm am going to start doing vote counts so we can have them as a reference point on how's leading for lynch.
But also cause if we have Vote Counts thru out the day. Then we can see scum voting patterns easier and see who's trying to create mislynches and get on easy bandwagons with our reasoning.
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Or you can do votecounts cause they make you look like you are participating.
Anything you see in the votecount Jay? Some votes were really fast
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On February 12 2013 03:50 Oatsmaster wrote:
Or you can do votecounts cause they make you look like you are participating.
Anything you see in the votecount Jay? Some votes were really fast
Yea cause making a giant case on Yamato isn't participating. Do you have anything else to say besides fling shit at me from a distance. How about you give your reads on Yamato and VE Or maybe even write up a case or at least some reasoning you have for your scum reads.
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And totally unrelated attack at me. I thought you were better than that Jay...
Do you deny that votecounts are an easy way to look involved?
Also, what do you see from the fast votes, slow votes so far? 1 of your scumreads have voted already, so what does that say about him?
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Oats, get off Jay. Seriously. Vote counts are extremely helpful and it's not like it's the only thing that Jay contributed.
Jay, I think we are just choosing which scum we want to lynch at this point. Many of the initial pool of suspects (including yamato) have ties with VE. By lynching VE it forces more content from the remaining scum as well as helps us get better reads of them if they happen to be town. That is why I prefer lynching VE and would appreciate if you join me. Yamato ain't going nowhere I assure you.
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Not sold on a VE lynch right yet. The evidence feels a little nitpicky on a mistake VE may have made, and he has yet to respond to Sloosh's or my points. Especially since if Snarfs is scum, I'm almost positive VE is green. Unless there is some weird elaborate bus thing going on where Snarfs pushes his scumbuddy D1 and the rest of the game, I'm certain they are opposite alignments.
And yeah Oats, get off Jay. He's looking scummy right now but I think a more sensible choice is between Yamato/Phagga/Snarfs today. VE if you're so inclined that way.
I want to hear Snarf's opinions right now. I still want to lynch the shit out of him, and have no problem doing so.
That said, I'm off for work.
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Yea okay.
I think we should lynch Mr. Cheesecake because I think he is scum. I read some of his earlier games and he seems to be posting a lot more impulsively in those games. He has a ton more one liners, even about important things.
British Empire Mafia
Witchcraft Mafia
Examples include:
On January 05 2013 12:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:37 yamato77 wrote:
Do people really think it was that difficult to understand what I said?
Anyway CC your case is bad and I think you're faking this read. I don't think Xatalos is that scummy, but he is an easy target.
CC is scummy.
##Vote: Mr Cheesecake Lol k
On January 04 2013 11:42 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 11:40 MrZentor wrote:
I feel that creating an arbitrary limit will only limit town, regardless of whether that limit is one that shortens or lengthens the day.
We should instead have guidelines.
48-72 hours ^ Agree with this sentiment
On January 05 2013 15:15 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 15:10 jaybrundage wrote:
You dont know DP alignment if your town. So I find it ironic that your thinking hes town. I made a comment on his post concerning his wishy washiness.
So much wrong with this post.
Some from Witchcraft Mini Mafia:
On December 23 2012 04:58 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On December 23 2012 04:57 Hapahauli wrote:I mean what more do we need to lynch this guy? On December 23 2012 04:30 Eywa- wrote:On December 23 2012 04:27 Hapahauli wrote:A list of Eywa's analysis and scumhunting today:
On December 23 2012 03:37 Eywa- wrote:
##unvote
##vote Djodref On December 23 2012 03:50 Eywa- wrote:On December 23 2012 03:40 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On December 23 2012 03:37 Eywa- wrote:
##unvote
##vote Djodref If this isn't clue enough to lynch Eywa, I don't know what is. His posture early game was hyper aggressive and face-smashing into people. Now he's just too timid and sheepy because he knows that I've got him pinned and he's guilty. Scum want to push this Djo lynch right now. I can make my posture be whatever I want it to... It's not difficult, you can't see my expression or read if I'm lying. If I tell you that I expect this game to end in scum victory and I tell you I think Hapahauli is scum and then I tell you I am only telling the truth in one... You can't tell which it is, you can't tell if the last statement is true either, there's no emotion put into any of these.
Otherwise, the entirety of D3 he's been floundering around helpless to identify rationale a single one of his reads. I haven't offered any scum reads this game... So D3 isn't special. "Yeah, ya know all those scumreads and stuff I was doing early the game? They were all lies, I never believed one of them and never had a scumread." This.
Here are some from his newbie mini games where he doesn't even bother to type anything, he doesn't even bother to explain himself, why would the other townies not intuitively see it from his point of view like he does?
On December 05 2012 11:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 11:51 Oatsmaster wrote:
CC, context for the Lol Im town,
Axle asked me what I would do pretending that I am town, after he asked me what I would do if I was scum.
the LOL I'm town wasn't necessary, could have just rolled with it. Seemed weird to me.
And about my way of playing? If that is scummy to you then ok, each to his own.
CC, how many times have you been like,
Ok he is not that suspicious, then when you read his filter, it has some scummy stuff and not much town stuff.
I did this for Clarity in XXX actually, I had a town read, I thought Djo was scum but when I read his filter, I was astounded at the slight scumtells.
Sometimes. But certainly not this early and when I was there for it.
If it is your opinion on why the kickstart case is bad then so be it, I cant change that.
On November 03 2012 10:35 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 10:33 Rad wrote:
@Obzy
We don't want lurkers. That's the reason for the policy lynch. Force people to not lurk. We want active conversation from EVERYONE as that's best for town. This ^
These examples are in no way exhaustive, you can check out the filters yourself. My point is that in those town games Mr. Cheesecake will sometimes read a post and then have a thought and then his fingers will just instantly type it out and press enter. No fear. There's none of that in this game. Very few one liners and mostly about some that has nothing to do with this game such as his work schedule or snow storm or whatever. Because he is scum he thinks more about his posts and that results in more consolidation than usual.
Also how he reacts in face of accusations. Here is a quote from this game where I prod him.
On February 08 2013 04:25 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On February 08 2013 04:06 prplhz wrote:On February 08 2013 04:04 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Fuck it, YOLO
##vote: jiexian
I dont see it going any other way. Everyone is yelling die scum die. This is some scummy shit. Indeed it is. We're lynching JX today with anyway with or without my vote . Who the heck are you gonna vote prphlz?
Here's very calm and collected here, first a little self deprecating, then he tries to downplay it and then he tries to redirect attention onto me.
Contract these posts (including one from above)
On January 05 2013 12:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:37 yamato77 wrote:
Do people really think it was that difficult to understand what I said?
Anyway CC your case is bad and I think you're faking this read. I don't think Xatalos is that scummy, but he is an easy target.
CC is scummy.
##Vote: Mr Cheesecake Lol k
He can't even take it seriously.
On January 06 2013 03:41 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 03:32 jaybrundage wrote:On January 05 2013 15:37 Hapahauli wrote:
So regarding Jay's stuff on DP... it doesn't look very good. It looks a lot like he's trying to shovel shit on DP.
After Hero Mini, my view on Jay is that he's lynch-bait, so I'm rather hesitant about lynching him. Right now, I'm unsure how likely his behavior is coming from a "town-Jay." His play on it's face is scummy, but I really need to hear more from him.
@ Jay
What do you make of my newly disclosed town-read on DP? Agree or disagree?
Secondly, your quote accusing DP of assuming I was town was very clearly mis-interpreting his actions (in which he very clearly qualified as only IF I was town). It doesn't look very good. Explain yourself. First off you said you have done this before how many times have you done this tunneling on DP and out of the times you have done it how many times have you been wrong. If you play with DP alot and you can read him consistently then I will reconsider my position. The reason I find him scummy as been said before. Is his flip flopping on Hapa from hes obv completly with out a doubt scum to i have no fucking idea. It seemed to me like scum backing off of a mislynch they were pushing gone wrong. I personally put alot less faith in reading people's reactions to when they are about to be or going to be lynched. The quote was me being frustrated with DP's flip flopping he has gone from scum to town to scum now giving someone townie cred for the possibility of one of his scum reads being town. So yes he did change his opinion on hapa again. I didnt say anything wrong. Also I dont like CC hes doing absolutely nothing this game. He has made some worthless comments about concentrating on finding scum. He was mentioning the DP-Hapa conversations early one with out giving his opinion on him hasn't commentated much on it when DP was doing some scummy stuff. On January 05 2013 11:22 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
So Xatalos is scummy yo
So now DarthPunk is possibly scum and he provides a quote with a bunch of dem bolded statements to back it up. But didn't Xatalos just say that DP was looking town? That he agreed with a lot of what he had to say? This is a huuuuuge 180 right here. He just felt very comfortable with DP being town. Now he feels uneasy.
Dat 180 on DP. Explain. He makes a case on Xalatos for making a 180 on DP and calls him scummy for it. However when DP does so many 180s on Hapa hes trying to pull off a 900. CC doesn't give it a second thought although DP is doing the samething as Xalatos CC ignores it. CC has played like he has more knowledge on other townies. He would of known if DP and Hapa were town or not so he played accordingly. Also his lack of anything in his filter is really disconcerting. He has said useless 1 liners. And made a case of 180s that were exactly what DP was doing. ##Unvote
##Vote Mr.CheeseCake I've done absolutely nothing? Watch your tongue, scumster, you've done nothing as well. Your vote is pretty lulzy considering I called you out on your attempted cheap shot at DP. Also, anything DP-Hapa related is completely independent of Xalatos. DP's 180s aren't the same as his by any means.
In face of accusations in British Empire Mini Mafia he pretty much just says "get the fuck out" but his tone is remarkably different in these posts than in the post from this game.
I really think that this guy is scum and I'd prefer if we lynched him today.
##Vote Mr. Cheesecake
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Understandable with the Snarfs relation, although I would heavily disagree that I am merely "nitpicking" on some mistake.
I think though we have to be careful with the alignment pairings of players. There are an unusually high number of scum, and it's not unreasonable that they would stage interactions with each other. Take each player objectively and use flips as supporting evidence. Given that none of these players have flipped, I think less credence should be given to alignment ties and more to standalone analysis of that player.
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EPT
