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Chrono Trigger Mafia - Page 160

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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risk.nuke
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden2825 Posts
November 25 2012 18:13 GMT
#3181
Dienosore, the reason is (and this is not the least biased by your actions in this game) is because you're a massive moron.

syllo, care to weigh on on what I think regarding HP and HSM?
Neo.G Soulkey, Best, firebathero. // http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
Dienosore
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
November 25 2012 18:15 GMT
#3182
On November 26 2012 03:12 Djodref wrote:
EBWOP: but I'm not voting Oats until I obtain some assurance that TC is not in the party


Oats and I agreed earlier on a team consisting of me/marv/clarity
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 25 2012 18:15 GMT
#3183
by the way, sand's bussing ability doesn't bus damage, only DT/tracker/watcher stuff.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
TheChronicler
Profile Joined October 2012
Macedonia260 Posts
November 25 2012 18:15 GMT
#3184
Hung over. Driving home (az from ca).
Let me tell you of the days of high adventure!
TheChronicler
Profile Joined October 2012
Macedonia260 Posts
November 25 2012 18:16 GMT
#3185
Lol who cares about dro's opinion.
Let me tell you of the days of high adventure!
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
November 25 2012 18:16 GMT
#3186
On November 26 2012 03:15 Dienosore wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 03:12 Djodref wrote:
EBWOP: but I'm not voting Oats until I obtain some assurance that TC is not in the party


Oats and I agreed earlier on a team consisting of me/marv/clarity


I would vote for that
I'm totally blaming marv if the event fails ^^
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 25 2012 18:19 GMT
#3187
On November 26 2012 03:16 Djodref wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 03:15 Dienosore wrote:
On November 26 2012 03:12 Djodref wrote:
EBWOP: but I'm not voting Oats until I obtain some assurance that TC is not in the party


Oats and I agreed earlier on a team consisting of me/marv/clarity


I would vote for that
I'm totally blaming marv if the event fails ^^


Me three, no joke
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 25 2012 18:21 GMT
#3188
##Unvote
##Oatsmaster
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
syllogism
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland5948 Posts
November 25 2012 18:21 GMT
#3189
I think those may potentially affect mission success, but in the end best and most likely design is based primarily on mafia being included in the team. I do not think a mission can fail if there is no mafia included; that kind of hidden mechanics are simply not fun. The only possible, and still unfun, exception I can see would be some kind of one-shot mafia ability, but I think they would have used that on n1.

In fact, I think the speculation revolving around whether we should include claimed characters or players with matching time period flavor is also misguided (dienosore and oats should be included because they were on a successful day 1 mission, although the roles do not hurt).

So, in short, ignore hp/roles, unless the claims themselves make someone more likely to be town.
Dienosore
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
November 25 2012 18:23 GMT
#3190
On November 26 2012 03:13 risk.nuke wrote:
Dienosore, the reason is (and this is not the least biased by your actions in this game) is because you're a massive moron.

syllo, care to weigh on on what I think regarding HP and HSM?


I make an argument against your post and your only response is to get sarcastic then call me a moron. How do you ever expect me to trust you?

Is it too much to let the results of the events, rather than distracting speculation, determine whether or not our plan of attack is correct? We haven't lost a challenge yet, so I see no reason to change our line of thought about how groups should be formed.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 25 2012 18:25 GMT
#3191
On November 26 2012 03:21 syllogism wrote:
I think those may potentially affect mission success, but in the end best and most likely design is based primarily on mafia being included in the team. I do not think a mission can fail if there is no mafia included; that kind of hidden mechanics are simply not fun. The only possible, and still unfun, exception I can see would be some kind of one-shot mafia ability, but I think they would have used that on n1.

In fact, I think the speculation revolving around whether we should include claimed characters or players with matching time period flavor is also misguided (dienosore and oats should be included because they were on a successful day 1 mission, although the roles do not hurt).

So, in short, ignore hp/roles, unless the claims themselves make someone more likely to be town.


Out of interest, any reason you advocate those 2 rather than yourself?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Keirathi
Profile Joined May 2012
United States4679 Posts
November 25 2012 18:25 GMT
#3192
On November 26 2012 03:21 syllogism wrote:
I think those may potentially affect mission success, but in the end best and most likely design is based primarily on mafia being included in the team. I do not think a mission can fail if there is no mafia included; that kind of hidden mechanics are simply not fun. The only possible, and still unfun, exception I can see would be some kind of one-shot mafia ability, but I think they would have used that on n1.

In fact, I think the speculation revolving around whether we should include claimed characters or players with matching time period flavor is also misguided (dienosore and oats should be included because they were on a successful day 1 mission, although the roles do not hurt).

So, in short, ignore hp/roles, unless the claims themselves make someone more likely to be town.

I'm not sure I totally agree with that part.

I am a 600 AD character, and therefore me being in the party night 1 granted me some useful bonuses. Dieno said he had a bonus night 1 that increased party chance of success (I believe?). The bonuses are generally pretty useful, I think.

I'm not necessarily saying that we should always have someone claim the time period so that we can put them intot he group, but I see no reason to not put someone that we have a town read on AND its their time period into the group, just for the bonuses.
My dear friend if I have gone pants on head, you have gone socks on ears!!! -ShiaoPi
risk.nuke
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden2825 Posts
November 25 2012 18:27 GMT
#3193
You made no argument, you simply rephrased what I said as an evil plot to exclude you from the party. We have no ideas how easy/hard it is to win a mission. Right now the general assumption is just that if one party member is mafia the party fails. But that doesn't make sense because then HMS would be useless.
Neo.G Soulkey, Best, firebathero. // http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
risk.nuke
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden2825 Posts
November 25 2012 18:27 GMT
#3194
*HSM*
Neo.G Soulkey, Best, firebathero. // http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
syllogism
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland5948 Posts
November 25 2012 18:29 GMT
#3195
On November 26 2012 03:25 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 03:21 syllogism wrote:
I think those may potentially affect mission success, but in the end best and most likely design is based primarily on mafia being included in the team. I do not think a mission can fail if there is no mafia included; that kind of hidden mechanics are simply not fun. The only possible, and still unfun, exception I can see would be some kind of one-shot mafia ability, but I think they would have used that on n1.

In fact, I think the speculation revolving around whether we should include claimed characters or players with matching time period flavor is also misguided (dienosore and oats should be included because they were on a successful day 1 mission, although the roles do not hurt).

So, in short, ignore hp/roles, unless the claims themselves make someone more likely to be town.


Out of interest, any reason you advocate those 2 rather than yourself?

No, including me is fine.
Keirathi
Profile Joined May 2012
United States4679 Posts
November 25 2012 18:30 GMT
#3196
On November 26 2012 03:27 risk.nuke wrote:
You made no argument, you simply rephrased what I said as an evil plot to exclude you from the party. We have no ideas how easy/hard it is to win a mission. Right now the general assumption is just that if one party member is mafia the party fails. But that doesn't make sense because then HMS would be useless.

No it's not useless.

For instance, I think the probable scenario is something like this:

Normal Townies: 100 HMS
High HMS Townies: 250 HMS
Low HMS Townies: 40 HMS
Normal Mafia: -300 HMS

When the mission starts, if the total HMS value of the group is > 0, the event is successful.

(These are obviously just made up numbers. Just an example for context.)
My dear friend if I have gone pants on head, you have gone socks on ears!!! -ShiaoPi
Dienosore
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
November 25 2012 18:31 GMT
#3197
On November 26 2012 03:27 risk.nuke wrote:
Right now the general assumption is just that if one party member is mafia the party fails. But that doesn't make sense because then HSM would be useless.


I thought the general assumption was that my hidden modifier was boosted due to matching my role with the correct time period, enough so that I could potentially carry even if scum was on the team.
Keirathi
Profile Joined May 2012
United States4679 Posts
November 25 2012 18:32 GMT
#3198
On November 26 2012 03:31 Dienosore wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 03:27 risk.nuke wrote:
Right now the general assumption is just that if one party member is mafia the party fails. But that doesn't make sense because then HSM would be useless.


I thought the general assumption was that my hidden modifier was boosted due to matching my role with the correct time period, enough so that I could potentially carry even if scum was on the team.

Does your role PM say anything about it being boosted if you're in the party during your era?

Mine doesn't, although I do get other bonuses when I'm in the party during my era.
My dear friend if I have gone pants on head, you have gone socks on ears!!! -ShiaoPi
syllogism
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland5948 Posts
November 25 2012 18:35 GMT
#3199
Again, the most likely function of hidden modifier mechanic is to prevent too many players to be confirmed as town and to leave room for some confusion. It is extremely unlikely that we are supposed to plan around these unknown factors as that is just bad design. Greymist hardly expected players to just claim their roles based on the current time line and then those people would get included. Perhaps having a lot of strong town roles on a mission could outweight a mafia being included on a mission, but that doesn't seem fun for mafia. Roles aren't supposed to be claimed, so who is on the mission should usually be completely random.
risk.nuke
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden2825 Posts
November 25 2012 18:36 GMT
#3200
On November 26 2012 03:30 Keirathi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 03:27 risk.nuke wrote:
You made no argument, you simply rephrased what I said as an evil plot to exclude you from the party. We have no ideas how easy/hard it is to win a mission. Right now the general assumption is just that if one party member is mafia the party fails. But that doesn't make sense because then HMS would be useless.

No it's not useless.

For instance, I think the probable scenario is something like this:

Normal Townies: 100 HMS
High HMS Townies: 250 HMS
Low HMS Townies: 40 HMS
Normal Mafia: -300 HMS

When the mission starts, if the total HMS value of the group is > 0, the event is successful.

(These are obviously just made up numbers. Just an example for context.)

Even if I believed a system like that likely the problem is those numbers are values. And values are not Modifiers. Thus we would had been told each player have a hidden/unknown success value.
Neo.G Soulkey, Best, firebathero. // http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
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