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I can't see us having more than two power roles, and (probably) not less than two either. If they all claim, and we ended up with three including Oats that would be an effective counterclaim. Having all the PRs claim seems pretty ridiculous though, and I don't think it's worth it.
I can't distinguish anything Oats has done since my vote between "oh crap, I'm doctor about to be lynched" and "oh crap, I'm scum about to be lynched". I reckon his posting quality has improved maybe a little, but that doesn't tell me anything. And claiming doctor and a protect on SDM is about as obvious and easy a fake-claim as claiming VT, esp. without a crumb.
Dammit! If you're a doctor, I'm really sorry, but I just. can't. tell. And I still have no better reads, and I still think this read won't improve.
Vote sticks. I have 5 minutes before I have to leave, and I won't be back before lynch. In the event of a massclaim, which I do not endorse, it may be possible for me to leave a message with someone and have them post it.
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11589 Posts
On November 30 2012 06:12 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 06:00 yamato77 wrote:
Alright last post before I head to work.
I suggest to the rest of my townie buddies that you look for someone else today. My time is going to be limited Friday and Saturday due to previous commitments. Tonight I will come back and do some real hard reads on people's filters to try to make more sense of this game.
I think my criteria of town being unsure of itself this game is one to REALLY consider. Mafia has done a good job sowing extra layers of doubt in people's heads about allegiances. This is a vague criteria to look for but something to consider when reading people for tone. So scum is pretending to be confident in their reads in order to sow confusion? I feel like I've been one of the most confused AND confusing players in this game. The only thing I seem to have been able to establish is my own townieness. Don't get me wrong, players who seems to deliberately sow confusion is scummy. Sometimes being confused yourself will sow confusion. Jesus Christ, this post is confusing.
Dude I am going to say the same thing I said to Jacob because you have posted like him since halfway through D1. I know this game is difficult and all but using the thread as your personal idea checker isn't helping anyone. Figure out what you think scum's plan was this game. Look for people who have acted like you think scum would act.
All these self-esteem issues you're having with your reads is beginning to make me think you might not be so townie after all. You haven't pushed a single case all game. You dropped your (bad) case on CC the INSTANT he responded to it. Since then you have done little else but basically sheep yourself on other people's cases and post every little minute thought about the game you've had in the thread. Shape up.
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On November 30 2012 06:13 Aquanim wrote:
I can't see us having more than two power roles, and (probably) not less than two either. If they all claim, and we ended up with three including Oats that would be an effective counterclaim. Having all the PRs claim seems pretty ridiculous though, and I don't think it's worth it.
I can't distinguish anything Oats has done since my vote between "oh crap, I'm doctor about to be lynched" and "oh crap, I'm scum about to be lynched". I reckon his posting quality has improved maybe a little, but that doesn't tell me anything. And claiming doctor and a protect on SDM is about as obvious and easy a fake-claim as claiming VT, esp. without a crumb.
Dammit! If you're a doctor, I'm really sorry, but I just. can't. tell. And I still have no better reads, and I still think this read won't improve.
Vote sticks. I have 5 minutes before I have to leave, and I won't be back before lynch. In the event of a massclaim, which I do not endorse, it may be possible for me to leave a message with someone and have them post it.
Now this is a weird post. Not only is it a silly idea, which you seem to understand, but it ends with the implication that you may be blue. Why even bring this up since you know it's a silly idea?
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Why would you point that out to the whole thread?
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On November 29 2012 15:48 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:About the case on Jacob I can see where it's coming from and I've shared those feelings. I think they partly came from paranoia and me not being sure of anything though. I've become a bit more calm and I'm not throwing around suspicions towards everyone anymore is because I feel pretty damn good about a Oats lynch. Now, to me, it looks like Oats is trying desperately to save his ass by sheeping a case he knows at least one other player share. As far as the arguments go, I agree Jacob is throwing out a lot of ideas without reaching conclusions and I think this can be a scum trait. However, Jacob also did this in his town game, so for him it's not necessarily a scum trait. I would also say that if you look at his posts as a whole, a lot of his comments and questions seems to be motivated by curiosity. If you're making a lot of posts some are bound to look wishy-washy and like bad contributions and those are the ones Helo points out. Again, in XXVI Jacob had a tendency to comment on whatever came to mind and some of his comments (probably more of them than in this game) were really not very helpful. As for his actions around deadline, I was thinking your same things about his reasonings for voting Munk-E. It was one of these "I'm almost going to go after him now" kind of moments. BUT I don't think this necessarily signifies a scum mindset either, it could just be the result of confusion. It's quite similar to CC and myself. I know I'm town, I think CC is town, so I don't see why I should accuse Jacob of something similar. There's also the same wifom argument I made in defense of CC. If Jacob is scum, why even bother to switch to Munk-E? While wifom, it's enough to render his vote switching as kind of a null tell to me. That being said, if Oats flip town, I'm afraid my world will come crashing down again  I haven't read jacob's response to the case btw.
Looking at XXVI, I do see a lot of this "wishy-washy" style of posting that he was doing and a lot of conclusion-less posts. It feels scummy to me, but I guess it's just something that he does. What game was he scum in? I need to see if he does this as scum too.
As for the voting, Jacob didn't say that he felt confused, he said that he "had doubts about my yamato case". I don't see it as similar to what Cheesecake claims (and your vote was the result of confusion). The votes were pretty close between Munk, yamato, and Kickstart when Jacob switched, so I can see scum motivation in that.
Anyway, this is rather irrelevant for now since I'm not considering Jacob as a lynch possibility today anymore. I will keep an eye on him for later though.
On Oats, I... am still skeptical of the lynch. There's still a chance he'll flip blue and put us in a really bad position. I doubt that anything will stop the lynch at this point, but I want to look at yamato closely before I vote.
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11589 Posts
Actually I take back what I said about scum pushing their reads hard this game. That makes no sense. I have just been focusing on CC and kick for their suspicion of me. confirmation bias ftl.
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On November 30 2012 06:25 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 06:12 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:On November 30 2012 06:00 yamato77 wrote:
Alright last post before I head to work.
I suggest to the rest of my townie buddies that you look for someone else today. My time is going to be limited Friday and Saturday due to previous commitments. Tonight I will come back and do some real hard reads on people's filters to try to make more sense of this game.
I think my criteria of town being unsure of itself this game is one to REALLY consider. Mafia has done a good job sowing extra layers of doubt in people's heads about allegiances. This is a vague criteria to look for but something to consider when reading people for tone. So scum is pretending to be confident in their reads in order to sow confusion? I feel like I've been one of the most confused AND confusing players in this game. The only thing I seem to have been able to establish is my own townieness. Don't get me wrong, players who seems to deliberately sow confusion is scummy. Sometimes being confused yourself will sow confusion. Jesus Christ, this post is confusing. Dude I am going to say the same thing I said to Jacob because you have posted like him since halfway through D1. I know this game is difficult and all but using the thread as your personal idea checker isn't helping anyone. Figure out what you think scum's plan was this game. Look for people who have acted like you think scum would act. All these self-esteem issues you're having with your reads is beginning to make me think you might not be so townie after all. You haven't pushed a single case all game. You dropped your (bad) case on CC the INSTANT he responded to it. Since then you have done little else but basically sheep yourself on other people's cases and post every little minute thought about the game you've had in the thread. Shape up.
Not entirely true but a fair message. I need to keep my posts shorter and put in more work again. I've been lazy D2 because I totally convinced myself that Oats is scum. D2 for me became a wait for his flip.
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On November 30 2012 06:28 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 06:13 Aquanim wrote:
I can't see us having more than two power roles, and (probably) not less than two either. If they all claim, and we ended up with three including Oats that would be an effective counterclaim. Having all the PRs claim seems pretty ridiculous though, and I don't think it's worth it.
I can't distinguish anything Oats has done since my vote between "oh crap, I'm doctor about to be lynched" and "oh crap, I'm scum about to be lynched". I reckon his posting quality has improved maybe a little, but that doesn't tell me anything. And claiming doctor and a protect on SDM is about as obvious and easy a fake-claim as claiming VT, esp. without a crumb.
Dammit! If you're a doctor, I'm really sorry, but I just. can't. tell. And I still have no better reads, and I still think this read won't improve.
Vote sticks. I have 5 minutes before I have to leave, and I won't be back before lynch. In the event of a massclaim, which I do not endorse, it may be possible for me to leave a message with someone and have them post it. Now this is a weird post. Not only is it a silly idea, which you seem to understand, but it ends with the implication that you may be blue. Why even bring this up since you know it's a silly idea?
Me? Because it seemed like a deliberate message that no one could miss.
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11589 Posts
ok seriously last post from my phone before I clock in at work. Someone should look at SDM. A lot of us have read him as town and why? He has posted a LOT this game but I can't really recall much in the way of pushing reads or making real cases.
FoS: Sonic Death Monkey
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On November 30 2012 06:51 yamato77 wrote:
ok seriously last post from my phone before I clock in at work. Someone should look at SDM. A lot of us have read him as town and why? He has posted a LOT this game but I can't really recall much in the way of pushing reads or making real cases.
FoS: Sonic Death Monkey
On the topic of sowing confusion.
Seriously, "someone should" look at SDM"? How about you do it?
You just made a post where you said people should look into people sowing confusion?
The only case you've made is against CC. When I asked why you dropped it, that case too was just not because he was a top scum read, but you "posted the case more to point out that his actions were suspicious and needed reading into".
You just throw out random suspicion but don't follow up on them AT ALL. I think someone should look into that and that someone will be me.
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By God did the thread bloat up in my absence. Catching up y'all.
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Oh God a blueclaim from Oats wtf
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Hmm I'm reading Yamato's filter while watching IPL. He was one of the players I would look into tomorrow anyway (who I'll look into depends a bit on the Oats flip though). I will summarize my thoughts, hopefully later tonight. One thing that struck me as a bit weird wrt my last post on him:
I definitely wouldn't outsource making reads on my top suspicions to other players in this game. If you're legitimately confused as to who's town and scum, which he supposedly is, why would you say something like that? Especially this was true for me when I was in paranoia mode, which I've kind of gotten back into after Oats claim.
Seriously, that's the last thought on my mind and it comes off as scummy to me. I and many others have pressured other players to make cases on their top scum reads, Yamato on the other hand is pressuring (or at least suggesting) that others should make cases on his supposed top suspicions. I can't recall anyone else acting like this in the thread. Yamato himself basically hasn't made one single case.
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No breadcrumb? Wtf? How the hell am I supposed to believe that... breadcrumbs are super easy to make. I really don't see us lynching anyone else at this point, either. Shit. If he's not scum then this game makes no sense anymore. I was pretty convinced he was scum after my longass post on him. . . He just fits so many categories of scumminess that I can't discount it. If he is really blue, I'm going to be mindfuck'd because I don't see a blue attracting so much suspicion (on purpose?) D1. He could have been easily up for lynch D1 and been forced to claim then because of his actions.
##Vote: Oatsmaster
(wifom) Also, the Doc might not want to claim because they know Oats is going to get lynched anyway.
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I guess this is why this is a newbie game, where you lynch an uncontested blue claim FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN THERE IS NO ONE ELSE.
The reason why I claimed so early was to give you guys time to scumhunt instead of speculating.
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On November 30 2012 08:12 Oatsmaster wrote:
I guess this is why this is a newbie game, where you lynch an uncontested blue claim FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN THERE IS NO ONE ELSE.
The reason why I claimed so early was to give you guys time to scumhunt instead of speculating.
I'm sorry man, if you're really doc there's is no way for us to find out. The fact that there isn't a counterclaim doesn't matter much. Since JK RBs doesn't get notified, even if we have no counterclaim (so far we haven't even asked[ for one) there could just as well have been a JK who blocked the NK. This has been explained.
Also, you need to look at your own play. Are we supposed to believe you didn't leave a breadcrumb because it was too difficult? That ridiculous. And playing with your reckless style in general isn't something I would expect from a blue, that's silly.
The fact that you're lashing out on us now makes me feel your claim is fake. How could you possibly not see that if you're doc you have put us in a shitty situation?
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11589 Posts
posting from work because this game is distracting me. I'm not saying you are evil necessarily, but again I feel like my actions thus far have gone nowhere so I'm beginning to change my entire perspective on this game. I am definitely not calling you scum, I'm just announcing my intent to dig into your play because I feel like I'be given you a pass th home game for no good reason.
I say I can't remember you making your own cases but that doesn't mean that you haven't at all. I ask others to look because I don't have the time on my phone at work to do so.
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So I shouldve just let you guys mislynch me?
I breadcrumb like, I healing SDM?
I really couldnt think of 1.
Isnt that why its good play as blue? so that scum are totally not suspicious of me.
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I just fail to see, upon reading your role PM, how it would have been a good idea to bring suspicion upon yourself so early.
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On November 30 2012 08:21 yamato77 wrote:
posting from work because this game is distracting me. I'm not saying you are evil necessarily, but again I feel like my actions thus far have gone nowhere so I'm beginning to change my entire perspective on this game. I am definitely not calling you scum, I'm just announcing my intent to dig into your play because I feel like I'be given you a pass th home game for no good reason.
I say I can't remember you making your own cases but that doesn't mean that you haven't at all. I ask others to look because I don't have the time on my phone at work to do so.
Well, I was the one putting forward the arguments for your wagon D1, you if anyone ought to know that. Doesn't really matter though, you've motivated me to start putting in more work which is a good thing.
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EPT
